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Manta Oyamada
Nov 15, 2015, 10:40 AM
The Ship 2 is dying? I would like to read your opinions.

http://www.geocities.jp/ragnanika/image2015/1103_01.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb4eZ7Z5yk8 k

http://www.geocities.jp/ragnanika/#20151103

Mildora
Nov 15, 2015, 10:50 AM
It'll only get worse with January storage update.
Will probably move my 4 chars to ship4

HentaiLolicon
Nov 15, 2015, 10:58 AM
yep, it's dying, most japanese players already moved to other ship. Those who still remain because they are playing with their teammates.

P/S: any other good ship beside ship 4?

otakun
Nov 15, 2015, 11:06 AM
I have never seen ship2 congested ever, so donno why now it's suddenly dying. Plenty of blocks still fill up during the major EQs and there are still straggler parties for people who don't do them right away.

HentaiLolicon
Nov 15, 2015, 11:11 AM
If that picture was captured during elder/loser/double then it wasn't accurate, because people jump to other ships to farm stones. But it still not deny the fact that ship 2 is dying.

sparab
Nov 15, 2015, 11:14 AM
Most cross-ship players play scheduled eq on other ships

They only log in ship2 for PD, Eloser, random eq and daily

Ryziou
Nov 15, 2015, 11:22 AM
yep, it's dying, most japanese players already moved to other ship. Those who still remain because they are playing with their teammates.

P/S: any other good ship beside ship 4?

1.

5char

untrustful
Nov 15, 2015, 11:33 AM
ship 10 represent

Flaoc
Nov 15, 2015, 11:33 AM
id totally jump to ship 4 if it comes down to it

Azure Falcon
Nov 15, 2015, 11:34 AM
I haven't seen a congested message on Ship 2 since before the DDoS, doesn't stop every single XH block from filling to capacity during high demand EQs though. That said the population seems to be entirely on XH and (to a much lesser extent) SH, I don't know if that is exclusive to Ship 2 though.

Xelor
Nov 15, 2015, 12:05 PM
I haven't seen a congested message on Ship 2 since before the DDoS, doesn't stop every single XH block from filling to capacity during high demand EQs though. That said the population seems to be entirely on XH and (to a much lesser extent) SH, I don't know if that is exclusive to Ship 2 though.

Pretty much this, it seems fine to me. Seeing a "congested" message for Ship 2 or not isn't going to make me pay to switch.

What would make me switch is if my friends stop playing or if they are also willing to switch.

Neith
Nov 15, 2015, 01:10 PM
How do playershop prices compare to Ship 2? Prices for AC stuff seems to have gone absolutely stupid lately (40mil for Sit 4? :lol: ), is the same happening elsewhere?

I'd also love to know how Ship 2 can be so laggy during emergency quests if it's so underpopulated compared to other ships... :disapprove:

TheszNuts
Nov 15, 2015, 02:30 PM
Sit 2 is the same on 1,2 and 4. JPs had some opinions on it as well.

Also you have to consider that a mass move to another ship wont change anything, it will just make a b20 for the other ship.

KLMS1
Nov 15, 2015, 02:56 PM
I'd also love to know how Ship 2 can be so laggy during emergency quests if it's so underpopulated compared to other ships... :disapprove:

Connecting from half the world away, usually through some kind of proxy, might of be relevant.

LordKaiser
Nov 15, 2015, 02:58 PM
It's being that way since last year. Some never came back after the DDoS.

Neith
Nov 15, 2015, 03:10 PM
Connecting from half the world away, usually through some kind of proxy, might of be relevant.

Don't use a proxy, never had lag issues until recently (around the time of the Halloween update).

landman
Nov 15, 2015, 03:12 PM
You people don't see the congested message because you are already online in scheduled EQ to get a "good block". I don't play much, but I've seen the congested mesage twice in the past two weeks, at moments where Ship 1 and Ship 4 were Full and the rest congested. Is Ship 2 the last one to get congested? obviously, but it's not deserted.

KLMS1
Nov 15, 2015, 03:13 PM
Don't use a proxy, never had lag issues until recently (around the time of the Halloween update).

Good for you, I know Lagatsu-sempai has failed to notice me for considerably longer.

bhaal
Nov 15, 2015, 06:30 PM
Sit 2 is the same on 1,2 and 4. JPs had some opinions on it as well.

Also you have to consider that a mass move to another ship wont change anything, it will just make a b20 for the other ship.

Good to know that, at least for now, s3 is free of danger.

Kril
Nov 15, 2015, 07:04 PM
ship 02 was in "busy" status the other night during JP peak hours so ya

wefwq
Nov 15, 2015, 07:33 PM
It was half-dead during EP2 because of it's estabilished popularity as foreigner ship, making some fellow JP moving out and making the ship less populated, then SEGA dropped the nuke with announcing the storage change for EP4.

Achelousaurus
Nov 15, 2015, 08:32 PM
Now that you mentioned it, pretty sure one reason why some of the jps are still on ship is cause they got too many items in storage which won't be an issue anymore once character storage hits.

I doubt everyone will jump the sinking ship but a number will.
Which is really sad cause for 1-2 months now I've seen a lot of jps during Magatsu and thanks to that have gotten 3-4 runs consistently, leaning heavily towards 4.

If there are less jps to go around they will probably lock themselves up in premade mpas even more and it's gonna hard be hard to find a good free mpa.

TaigaUC
Nov 15, 2015, 10:31 PM
None of the JP friends I've recently played with have left, but many of them are busy until JP night time and are only online for a few hours.

I had a bunch of JP friends who seemed to quit out of boredom over the past few years.
Very few came back. Maybe two or three, sometimes briefly.
One of them said they want to play more but they're too busy to do so.
A lot of EN people who friended me for friend partners on all three accounts seemingly haven't been online for years.
I guess I see maybe 10-15 friends online at most each day.

That asshole who screwed me over may have transferred (good riddance).
I say that because the JP people from that organized group are still on my friends list and they don't seem to be doing organized runs together anymore.
One of them even invited me for other organized runs a few times.

My opinion on EN groups sucking: the suckage rate is a lot higher below 75.
PD has been pretty decent. Only had one or two runs that took 15-20 minutes.
But I have to wonder if that's because of the Arks Level system.
Also, sucking isn't limited to just gear. I've seen people with uber gear just playing terrible in general, or standing around doing nothing.

When I'm in a group with JP friends and there are a lot of EN players, we kinda just briefly acknowledge that there's a problem, but don't say much else.
Trusted source JP friend told me a while back that it's not just EN people who are sucking.
They said a lot of their JP friends have been complaining that the people around them are terrible with terrible gear.
Trusted source JP friend doesn't really care if groups suck, they don't mind wasting tickets or anything. They just enjoy the game as is.
But then, they also solo a lot, like me. I think we both skip most of the EQs nowadays.

Para
Nov 16, 2015, 12:21 AM
Personal experience so take it with a grain of salt: I keep looking for parties for ultimate lillipa but not much people playing sadly.

Kril
Nov 16, 2015, 12:24 AM
Personal experience so take it with a grain of salt: I keep looking for parties for ultimate lillipa but not much people playing sadly.
It's been well over dead since Nab UQ revamp so dont rely on this as experience (just telling you how it is since then). I have friends who need to do Compound Tech CO's and well you know, UQ dead and all

yoshiblue
Nov 16, 2015, 12:26 AM
As far as I know, so long as you keep it a 4 man party, the spawns should be a decent size and not a massive zerg rush from out of nowhere.

milranduil
Nov 16, 2015, 12:49 AM
2 man with 2 npc UQ is perfectly fine. Spawns are still pretty big.

TaigaUC
Nov 16, 2015, 01:24 AM
I got the impression not many people are doing UQ in general.
Dunno what it's like on other ships.

I'd imagine most people just want a 13 star.
It was probably easier to get a Gal Gryphon one, which I think have better latents than the UQ ones?
It's even easier to get a Skull one, and the latents on those are great too.
Now you can just get Invade... so UQ must be even less popular now.

Then there's the fact that Ares will be exchangeable next month.
I bet a ton of people are just waiting for that.

Lumpen Thingy
Nov 16, 2015, 02:13 AM
Then there's the fact that Ares will be exchangeable next month.
I bet a ton of people are just waiting for that.

I know for a fact I'll be running ult a shit ton once that hits. Also lol at people thinking ship 2 is actually dying.

.Jack
Nov 16, 2015, 02:14 AM
I've been seeing people playing more on ES version lately so that might have something to do with less people being on more often recently.

emeraude
Nov 16, 2015, 02:50 AM
You haven't actually seen dying until you look at the SEA servers lol.

Nyansan
Nov 16, 2015, 03:05 AM
Fallout 4 just came out the other day, a few of my friends have been playing that while waiting for scheduled PD. Also today's EQ schedule is pretty lackluster

Halikus
Nov 16, 2015, 03:33 AM
Many of the skilled well geared folks I know are migrating to other ships as soon as the storage changes are applied. I'm betting TD4 and how bad random mpa will be at that will push even more people.

WEED420BLAZEIT
Nov 16, 2015, 03:50 AM
You haven't actually seen dying until you look at the SEA servers lol.

got screenshot? thx before

Konquer
Nov 16, 2015, 04:18 AM
got screenshot? thx before
i dont have a screenshot with me right now but i can say for the past week at least; there is only 1 block which ranges from 50%-100%+ full, while the rest of the remaining 9 blocks are pretty much empty. And that's on ship 1 which is the more populated block.

this is during non-eq period. during eq, maybe 2 populated blocks? (havent seen population during eq)

so really jp ship 2 is very far from dying compared to sea.

emeraude
Nov 16, 2015, 09:37 AM
got screenshot? thx before

http://i.imgur.com/eYoSvLc.jpg

:wacko:

aryayudhaprakasa2
Nov 16, 2015, 09:51 AM
Coz gaijin don't really care bout their gear, 7 ppl with sucks gear like Fire Resist I or even Ultimate Buster doing XH magatsu and just sitting for EXP and drop or AFK, so nihonjin sick of them and transfer ship. Nihonjin are very discipline and don't wanna be a burden to the whole MPA so they play seriously and build up their gear even when they just reach VH. Gaijin sucks and talks shit, they play the game for social aspects only not for fun aspect. I know not all gaijin is an asholle, but most of them only chit chat and blabbers like shit in B1 and B20, wasting 10M to make their shitty characters looks cool by buying shit tons of unimportant accesories (ironically they have bad sense of fashion) and turns out to be shit, and they just don't want to hear you if you give 'em advice. Fuck you leechers gaijins!

Flaoc
Nov 16, 2015, 09:52 AM
lol sea has a dedicated chat block and its the most populated. meanwhile on ship 2......

edit:


Coz gaijin don't really care bout their gear, 7 ppl with sucks gear like Fire Resist I or even Ultimate Buster doing XH magatsu and just sitting for EXP and drop or AFK. Nihonjin are very discipline and don't wanna be a burden to the whole MPA so they play seriously and build up their gear even when they just reach VH. Gaijin sucks and talks shit, they play the game for social aspects only not for fun aspect.I know not all gaijin is an asholle, but most of them only chit chat and blabbers like shit in B1 and B20 and they just don't want to hear you if you give 'em advice. Fuck you leechers gaijins!

im ganjin and make sure im geared.. hell when i make a new char i force myself to be able to equip my good gear asap

Renvalt
Nov 16, 2015, 10:06 AM
lol sea has a dedicated chat block and its the most populated. meanwhile on ship 2......

edit:


Coz gaijin don't really care bout their gear, 7 ppl with sucks gear like Fire Resist I or even Ultimate Buster doing XH magatsu and just sitting for EXP and drop or AFK, so nihonjin sick of them and transfer ship. Nihonjin are very discipline and don't wanna be a burden to the whole MPA so they play seriously and build up their gear even when they just reach VH. Gaijin sucks and talks shit, they play the game for social aspects only not for fun aspect.I know not all gaijin is an asholle, but most of them only chit chat and blabbers like shit in B1 and B20 and they just don't want to hear you if you give 'em advice. Fuck you leechers gaijins!

im ganjin and make sure im geared.. hell when i make a new char i force myself to be able to equip my good gear asap

When he says "gaijin", I'm pretty sure he doesn't mean those of us in the minority, who aren't playing Waifu Star Online 2, spamming Hentai SAs non-stop on B1 like we somehow own the place (and trying to look cool doing some manner of Shingeki BS during top-tier EQs - AKA TD3/Magatsu/Falzes).

I mean, granted, I'm quite sure the whole lot of you guys (I'd include myself, but I'd become a contradicting asshole if I did) play Waifu Star Online 2 as well, but you're not going to sacrifice efficiency in the name of trying to make your virtual doll of a character look fappable/badass.

Majority of the outsiders he was referring to are known to do everything you don't.

TaigaUC
Nov 16, 2015, 10:08 AM
Well, like I said before, most people don't know that they suck.
You can get away with crap gear until around VH or so, then there's a huge jump.
So most people don't realize they are pulling everyone else down.
The ones that do just play alone or at lower difficulties, and many strong people do private runs.

Then you got people with max gear walking everyone through EQs on lower levels.
So a lot of people never learn how to play the game properly.
PSO2 has "difficulty levels" but they don't really teach players what the "correct" way of doing things is.
You have to figure it out yourself. Most people won't even notice there's a problem.
Because they can just join a multi and the multi will clear the quest for them.

And there are a lot of people who get offended if you try and tell them they're not up to scratch.
They start yelling "I play for fun and have a job!" or some strange excuse.
Doesn't help that when most people point out someone's lacking, they do it abusively and publically.

When you're in battle, you can't really tell what anyone's doing.
You can't tell whether you're contributing effectively. SEGA should do something about this.
If those people could see how poorly they're contributing in terms of damage, then they'd realize there's a problem.
I know TD has a scoring system, but it's hardly representative of effective play.

mickbis
Nov 16, 2015, 12:15 PM
Hi I'm just register here and see this thread....

About the gear.. me and my friend has recently debate with one guy who process a very good gear ( Ideal unit and 13* weapon)
but still got really low damage on DF fight (it mean anyone who has knowledge of their class should outdamage him)
The reason he gave us is
"He is a fashion focus player and damage isn't matter if the mpa unity in good"
and after argument it become "High gear player hate low gear player they only think of themselves and that why they lack unity"

there is no hope for this type of guy that what I can concluded.... it might be hopeless to try to fix them

Qualia
Nov 16, 2015, 01:11 PM
me and my friend has recently debate with one guy who process a very good gear ( Ideal unit and 13* weapon)

Lol w8 is the weapon element less than 20? I always see people running around with low attribute ideal weapons+units that generally aren't even grinded, thinking they're properly geared. They aren't. The thing about this game is that there's always room for improvement, and this guy needs to realize that. If he refuses to pull his own weight in MPAs, he's probably a lost cause. Besides, the only unity in this game is dishing out enough damage to be worthwhile in the multiparty (and not dying, of course).

Raujinn
Nov 16, 2015, 02:05 PM
Ideal armor isn't horrible, but you could definitely do better. If they max their Ideal's element and get some decent affixes on it it's even passable, it's just I'd argue due to the specialised nature of Ideal weapons that you'd be better off investing in a Saiki set.

Your two options there are have premium and buy them, or farm rare Gunnegams should you have the resources and people to help you do that effectively. There's also Double units and a solid third unit as a great Saiki alternative but that's probably equally as miserable to obtain if you don't have premium. So I really can't fault freemium players grabbing an Ideal set as it seems attractive + easy to get.

I'm not saying there aren't better options, I'm just arguing that a freemium player's options for decent gear for XH are rough.

e: Anyway this is hugely off topic. OP just because we evidently have fewer people doesn't indicate the server is dying nor is it anywhere resembling deserted.

vantpers
Nov 16, 2015, 03:02 PM
When you're in battle, you can't really tell what anyone's doing.
You can't tell whether you're contributing effectively. SEGA should do something about this.
If those people could see how poorly they're contributing in terms of damage, then they'd realize there's a problem.
I know TD has a scoring system, but it's hardly representative of effective play.
I also can't wait for the dickwaving contests after we get an accurate and fast method to calculate your average damage. And I honestly can't wait because for me it would be fun to have that thing around to check all these legends about weapon type X and their actual real world averaged damage throughout the entire fight.

Jei182
Nov 16, 2015, 03:11 PM
Well, like I said before, most people don't know that they suck.
You can get away with crap gear until around VH or so, then there's a huge jump.
So most people don't realize they are pulling everyone else down.
The ones that do just play alone or at lower difficulties, and many strong people do private runs.

Then you got people with max gear walking everyone through EQs on lower levels.
So a lot of people never learn how to play the game properly.
PSO2 has "difficulty levels" but they don't really teach players what the "correct" way of doing things is.
You have to figure it out yourself. Most people won't even notice there's a problem.
Because they can just join a multi and the multi will clear the quest for them.

And there are a lot of people who get offended if you try and tell them they're not up to scratch.
They start yelling "I play for fun and have a job!" or some strange excuse.
Doesn't help that when most people point out someone's lacking, they do it abusively and publically.

When you're in battle, you can't really tell what anyone's doing.
You can't tell whether you're contributing effectively. SEGA should do something about this.
If those people could see how poorly they're contributing in terms of damage, then they'd realize there's a problem.
I know TD has a scoring system, but it's hardly representative of effective play.

I agree with this post a lot. A lot of those who are undergeared just don't realize that they are and it doesn't necessarily make them a crap player. I don't have a lot of time to play so I know I am probably not as geared as others are but I am trying. I think another issue is the lack of updated (or at least translated) guides so people will know what to do and what to aim for in their respected classes.

For example, other than discussion the ranger guide hasn't been updated in about a year so it's probably a certainty that there are better items out there. Realistically though i don't want to hold on to crap gear until I either do or don't get the ideal gear that I want because that would make things worse so I end up burning meseta and items to make what I have work in the meantime. As far as Ship 2 dying, It seems like there are a lot of people coming back or making new accounts from my experience. I think that instead of complaining that people suck, try and tell them reasonably what they could do to get better. If people actually helped others learn how to play the game then it would help a lot. I realize some can't be helped, but complaining that so and so sucks won't fix the problem. Someone in game gave me a few tips and I really appreciated it even though I told them that I was looking into ways to get better.

TaigaUC
Nov 16, 2015, 03:26 PM
Yeah, I thought about the dickwaving issues.
What they could do is show you your contribution rank and percentage privately.
For example, a comparison bar showing your personal effective percentage, the average effective percentage of the multi, and the lowest/highest effective percentages.
Then you'd be have a general idea of how decently you're contributing, without specifying who did what.
Because you'd only see your own info, people wouldn't be able to specifically abuse others or easily boast about themselves.
But we've probably already given this more thought and discussion than SEGA has.

Regarding Ideal units... I use them to get the full set bonus when paired with weapon, or when I feel that I might get hit a lot or die.
A little less damage is still better than dying repeatedly. Especially when I'm spamming Limit Break almost all the time.
The default Ideal unit affixes help reduce my chances of going splat if I do happen to get hit during Limit Break.
Note that I do have Saiki and Brisa sets as well, but all of my unit sets are all only at around +65-90 ATK per piece.

I'm guilty of using 20 element Ideal Rifle, but according to my damage calculations, it's still very effective against bosses.
The alternative is my extended Fire Arms, or that cool-looking 12 star rifle that dropped a lot in Trick or Treat 4.

Qualia
Nov 16, 2015, 04:00 PM
The alternative is my extended Fire Arms, or that cool-looking 12 star rifle that dropped a lot in Trick or Treat 4.

Do people still use Fire Arms over the Red Rifle? Honestly surprised people haven't realized extended red weapons are more than likely your best bet until you get a max element (or even >30) 13* weapon. Haven't done the damage calculations on a max red vs a 20 element ideal though.

Gankfest
Nov 16, 2015, 04:31 PM
I see people on ship 02 all the time... Obviously to many people play in the corner. -_-

Shinamori
Nov 16, 2015, 05:12 PM
I see a lot of good players starting to jump ship though. Well, some.

Kril
Nov 16, 2015, 06:36 PM
welp you guys reaped what you sowed over the years, nothing you can do. progressively got worse

sparab
Nov 16, 2015, 07:25 PM
Do people still use Fire Arms over the Red Rifle? Honestly surprised people haven't realized extended red weapons are more than likely your best bet until you get a max element (or even >30) 13* weapon. Haven't done the damage calculations on a max red vs a 20 element ideal though.

Many players prefer to use cool looking gears rather than strong but ugly ones

Although fire arms is definitely on the "ugly" side to me. You will probably get tripped over a room door carrying that cue stick

Qualia
Nov 16, 2015, 07:31 PM
Many players prefer to use cool looking gears rather than strong but ugly ones

Although fire arms is definitely on the "ugly" side to me. You will probably get tripped over a room door carrying that cue stick

weapon camos

Jei182
Nov 16, 2015, 07:43 PM
weapon camos
I've noticed (I am not defending choosing cosmetics over strength) that for certain weapons, let's face it the camos aren't much better looking, or the cool ones cost just as much as it would to just buy a stronger weapon no matter how it looks. Launchers suffer from this in my experience at least.

Vintasticvin
Nov 16, 2015, 07:52 PM
Phasion> Making my character so OP I go on a fan forum whining and complaining that the game is too easy and forget I'm asking Devs stuff on a fan forum while mercilessly fapping hard.

Ps Ship 2 is dying cause we all fap in our sleep specially the B1ers

Kril
Nov 16, 2015, 09:36 PM
Phasion> Making my character so OP I go on a fan forum whining and complaining that the game is too easy and forget I'm asking Devs stuff on a fan forum while mercilessly fapping hard.

Ps Ship 2 is dying cause we all fap in our sleep specially the B1ers
please be bait dawg

dekopong
Nov 16, 2015, 10:29 PM
Well, I was thinking of sending a character to ship2...

Is the quality of random mpa that terrible in ship2?
(Playing in ship10, since we don't have difficult quests(TD2 is still horrible though), it's relatively peaceful these days...)

And when comparing seeming population of ships, probably ship2 has a disadvantage( if the ratio of people from overseas are significant). People from all over the world = many time zones, people don't gather in a single golden time.

If ship2's population is really declining, SEGA would put out a welcome campaign like they did for ship7.

Talking of decent players going away, PSO2 isn't a flashy new online game anymore and players are spreading to other games. There are newcomers, but team recruiting is not as active as the past. It's not strange that there are so many wandering newbies... If there is an automatic self-training/testing program or something like that, it would be wonderful.

KLMS1
Nov 16, 2015, 10:37 PM
*shrug* Been a while since I've seen a pug MPA screw up an XH EQ, aside from Mining Bases.

Kril
Nov 16, 2015, 11:09 PM
Well, I was thinking of sending a character to ship2...
Is the quality of random mpa that terrible in ship2?
It's basically a gamble, you may get good but most of the time you'll get bad (or average)


If ship2's population is really declining, SEGA would put out a welcome campaign like they did for ship7.
Oh man this was a knee slapper, imagine: "Come back to Ship 02! The home of Gaijin, the land of fashion! They miss you guys!"


Talking of decent players going away, PSO2 isn't a flashy new online game anymore and players are spreading to other games. There are newcomers, but team recruiting is not as active as the past. It's not strange that there are so many wandering newbies... If there is an automatic self-training/testing program or something like that, it would be wonderful.
Outside PD, there really isn't much to do right now, TD4 coming out so people will login and then back out once it's done just like PD

dekopong
Nov 16, 2015, 11:33 PM
Oh man this was a knee slapper, imagine: "Come back to Ship 02! The home of Gaijin, the land of fashion! They miss you guys!"


LOL Reminds me of ship8 being called "床ペロ鯖" (Floor Licking Server*).

*Being incapacitated is called "床ペロ" (floor licking) among Japanese players. Derived from it's motion.

**In Grand Prix Tournament, unfortunately, ship8's representatives were wiped out. Then ship8 got this title...

Kril
Nov 17, 2015, 12:19 AM
LOL Reminds me of ship8 being called "床ペロ鯖" (Floor Licking Server*).

*Being incapacitated is called "床ペロ" (floor licking) among Japanese players. Derived from it's motion.

**In Grand Prix Tournament, unfortunately, ship8's representatives were wiped out. Then ship8 got this title...
Never knew this, makes me wonder what other JP players think of each ship

sparab
Nov 17, 2015, 12:57 AM
Never knew this, makes me wonder what other JP players think of each ship

2015/11/11

1鯖:4鯖大好き
2鯖:外国
3鯖:虫
4鯖:1鯖の二分の一
5鯖:
6鯖:世捨て人
7鯖:オナニー
8鯖:虫
9鯖:世捨て人
10鯖:動物園

Qualia
Nov 17, 2015, 01:00 AM
7鯖:オナニー

lmao what

Kril
Nov 17, 2015, 01:02 AM
2015/11/11

1鯖:4鯖大好き
2鯖:外国
3鯖:虫
4鯖:1鯖の二分の一
5鯖:
6鯖:世捨て人
7鯖:オナニー
8鯖:虫
9鯖:世捨て人
10鯖:動物園
7 made me laugh, 1 & 4 have a taste for fish huh? 5 dead? and recluse people lol

Bellion
Nov 17, 2015, 01:09 AM
1: Loves Ship 4.
4: Ship 1's other half. (Think like significant other or along those lines)

鯖 = saba(mackerel) = slang for server and in pso2's case it would be ship = server.

dekopong
Nov 17, 2015, 01:10 AM
Never knew this, makes me wonder what other JP players think of each ship

Well, the information is a bit old, and please note that it's just a rumor kind of thing and may differ from the reality.

It goes like this:

Ship1 and Ship4: Congested servers. If you want to see "廃人" (no-lifers, or something like that, in most situations negative, but sometimes positive), go and check their gear. Ship4 is also said to be a lively, festival like server.

Ship2: Gaijin server. Sometimes called hacker's server( it's sad but some Japanese still believe in oversea player = hacker notion).

Ship3: Niconico* broadcasters server. Though it is said that many of them has gone away.

Ship5: Daytime workers server. It is said that it's a peaceful place.

Ship6: Depopulated server.

Ship7: "見抜き" (watch and fap, or something like that. It's actually a meme and has it's story, but I don't go further about this.)

Ship8: Average. Ichitaro(member of the PSO2 live broadcast) plays here.

Ship9: Rural server. Said to have "ムラ社会"( putting local rules, associating with only the inner group, closed for newcomers, deciding things according to their local rules( implying unfair treatment). It's a negative wording for rural areas.)

Ship10: Noobs server. One of the developers play in this server.

*Nicovideo: An internet service like youtube. You can live broadcast there. Many Japanese are afraid of being recorded**, and sometimes hatred towards broadcasters can be seen on the Internet.

**There is a custom called "晒し" (Putting a player's ID, character name on internet boards, and state what they've done in the game. Of course, the information might contain false facts, grudge etc.). Maybe because of this, Japanese players are extremely afraid of having their characters recorded/taken.

NOTE: Please don't take this seriously! It contains joke, slander, and gossip!

sparab
Nov 17, 2015, 01:11 AM
Ship5 is mostly made up by working classes who don't have the time to troll with neets from other shitp, or so I heard

Also ship6 population is definitely on the above average after the campaign, right behind 1 and 4

Vatallus
Nov 17, 2015, 02:31 AM
I agree with the statement about Ship 9.

Also have we figured out why Sit 4 is 40m yet or is this just more marketing hocus pocus?

Z-0
Nov 17, 2015, 02:33 AM
Merchanting.

I know a few people who are buying up all sub-40m Sit 4s and putting them up for 40m on other ships. It's the same on every ship, not just 2 as well.

(markets are pretty much the same on all ships because of this for any expensive item)

Nitro Vordex
Nov 17, 2015, 02:48 AM
Also have we figured out why Sit 4 is 40m yet or is this just more marketing hocus pocus?
I assumed because panty shots.

Xaelouse
Nov 17, 2015, 03:31 AM
Ship 5/6 are the only good ships
Also Ship 5 is FGC central fyi

Ce'Nedra
Nov 17, 2015, 05:38 AM
I agree with the statement about Ship 9.

Also have we figured out why Sit 4 is 40m yet or is this just more marketing hocus pocus?

Cause people who play the market smart and have billions of money have to ruin it by buying the cheaper versions to put them up for sale for more so they get even more money. That and lewdness purpose, those are always expensive as fuck. As much I want sit4 I'm not forking over 40 mil for it. I'll wait for a revival scratch next year and buy it for 10 or less.

Then again the price spike for LAs started back with EP3s change to the DCO rewards. I expect then the new TA comes out stuff gets more pricey once again.

aryayudhaprakasa2
Nov 17, 2015, 05:54 AM
I wish every EQ we could see percentage of ppl damage contributions and the 10-12th ranked ppl banlisted automatically by whole MPA.

KLMS1
Nov 17, 2015, 06:20 AM
I wish every EQ we could see percentage of ppl damage contributions and the 10-12th ranked ppl banlisted automatically by whole MPA.

Not sure if trolling or just fascist...

final_attack
Nov 17, 2015, 06:40 AM
FGC central

FGC Central ? o-o
What is that? o-o

Z-0
Nov 17, 2015, 06:41 AM
Fighting Game Community

final_attack
Nov 17, 2015, 06:44 AM
Fighting Game Community

Oh ... thank you :D

mickbis
Nov 17, 2015, 09:00 AM
Ship 4 is full of Japanese people
there're some foreigner too from various place
but we prefer speaking within our own team chat

Achelousaurus
Nov 17, 2015, 09:28 AM
Merchanting.

I know a few people who are buying up all sub-40m Sit 4s and putting them up for 40m on other ships. It's the same on every ship, not just 2 as well.

(markets are pretty much the same on all ships because of this for any expensive item)
lmao
That's hardcore.

TaigaUC
Nov 17, 2015, 09:54 AM
Yeah I also know some people who buy stuff and then sell it on other ships.

10-12 banishing would be kinda silly depending on how SEGA handles scoring.
More like, if you get a score of literally 0 for an entire EQ then you ought to be banished.

Vatallus
Nov 17, 2015, 11:21 AM
I can't really see the point of banishing people that get rank 10-12 in those kinds of EQs since there is always going to be someone in those slots no matter how good or bad the MPA is.

When one person profits someone else has to suffer.

sparab
Nov 17, 2015, 12:19 PM
Instead of making a complex in quest blacklist/punish/kick system, sega could easily make a 12 player party to keep away hardcore leechers

But that contradicts the game's principle, which is meant to benefit the "causals"

KLMS1
Nov 17, 2015, 01:05 PM
I can't really see the point of banishing people that get rank 10-12 in those kinds of EQs since there is always going to be someone in those slots no matter how good or bad the MPA is.

When one person profits someone else has to suffer.

It should be readily obvious the gentleman behind the idea fails @ logic and thinking things through. The inevitable end result of such a system would pretty much amount to everybody automatically blacklisting everybody to the point where full MPAs become virtually impossible to achieve outside friendlists.

otakun
Nov 17, 2015, 01:05 PM
Instead of making a complex in quest blacklist/punish/kick system, sega could easily make a 12 player party to keep away hardcore leechers

But that contradicts the game's principle, which is meant to benefit the "causals"

You can already do this but most of the playerbase (atleast on ship2) would rather go random then spend the time setting up a 12 man party and do something organized.

Magicks
Nov 17, 2015, 04:07 PM
You can already do this but most of the playerbase (atleast on ship2) would rather go random then spend the time setting up a 12 man party and do something organized.

You mean SOCIALIZE and put up with "friends" that won't keep up with me with my l33t 500k per PA DPS output and wait for those guys that have afked fapping or getting it on with Brooklyn 99's Boyle? SAY IT AIN'T SO. *sarcasm

Also, gathering 12 people is hard unless you're in a (not-dead) team. : | I just play with a few friends and party with them in a 4-man whenever they're on. And it's just easier to drop in and play vs. sitting in lobby waiting to fill up the MPA.

Kinda brings back memories about my childhood waiting in parties for a healer GW1 because apparently they're hard to come by. (Godbless being a healer, but goddamn when you need 2 healers to ensure the survival of a party of 8.)

sparab
Nov 17, 2015, 05:04 PM
You can already do this but most of the playerbase (atleast on ship2) would rather go random then spend the time setting up a 12 man party and do something organized.

The point of a real 12 player party is people can join pre-set parties at counter, which usually fills up in minutes, instead of "LFG" in public chat

Even you cannot gather 12 people the rest can still be filled by other parties in MPA instead of making 3 parties and go to desolated blocks

Arredoval
Nov 17, 2015, 05:39 PM
More than punishing people who do poorly, we absolutely need something that punishes leechers. People who AFK the entire run.

That auto-kick that the shared ship has would be so lovely during EQ time. Wind it down to trigger at 2 minutes, give like 10 seconds to press the button. Set certain actions to count for "activity" such as dealing a minimum amount of damage every 30 seconds (that even a shmuck could dish out) or interacting with enough objects to keep people from just running into a wall, chatting, or giving a mob a smack every couple minutes.

On ship2's population, I think it's okay as it is, but when the game hits its super slow points, it's depressing. Like maybe 3 XH blocks full during good EQs. It's been a long time since it's been that low, though.

Come ep4, I think we will have to worry, though. Ship2 did see a huge decrease, and I've even lost a few non-Japanese friends to transferring to ship4 :/ Once the dust of ep4 launch settles, we might see a pretty big drop. I'd kind of look forward to a campaign for people making characters on ship2... ...but they'd probably just leave after the campaign was over. lol

Achelousaurus
Nov 17, 2015, 05:54 PM
Said it before and now gonna say it again, all Sega has to do is proper scaling.
Make the quest scale with the amount of people, or hell with the amount of parties.

So that you can perform a lot better with 4 good players than with 4 good and 8 bad ones.
So that if I got a handful friends to play with it's gonna be fine and we don't need 10+ people anymore.

Not just that instantly this means leechers aren't much of a problem anymore, it also fixes the giant clusterfuck problem, one the of the worst aspects of this game.
Cause with 4 people there is no clusterfuck and if, then only a small one.
Cause uncharged pas/techs from 3 other people aren't much fx pollution.

The only problem with this is that Sega won't ever think of it.
For mobbing eqs for example the point goal could be reduced to compensate for less people spawning e-trials and for TD for example the amount of enemies per wave could be reduced...ok TD is kind of a problem cause it requires covering a lot of ground which is gonna be an issue with less people but overall it would still be a huge advantage cause no one forces you to play in a locked 5 man mpa, you could always join the regular ones.

Gankfest
Nov 17, 2015, 05:57 PM
Well shit... Should I just put my controller down and play something else? I don't see the big deal compared to other ships. I play during the day, and the status of all the ships are low(Green) with the occasional Yellow here and there. I play by myself though, as I'm about to hit 50 and haven't had a need for other people. I feel like 50 is that point where I need to start grouping with other people. -_-

Vintasticvin
Nov 17, 2015, 06:34 PM
Well shit... Should I just put my controller down and play something else? I don't see the big deal compared to other ships. I play during the day, and the status of all the ships are low(Green) with the occasional Yellow here and there. I play by myself though, as I'm about to hit 50 and haven't had a need for other people. I feel like 50 is that point where I need to start grouping with other people. -_-
If you're having fun with the game at its current form I don't see any reason why you should "drop the mic"

Protip: run Extreme Quests and make sure to pop your XP and triboosts as well also why not bring a few acquaintances from your list? If they left or afk'd all the time then go make new ones :D

Gankfest
Nov 17, 2015, 08:30 PM
If you're having fun with the game at its current form I don't see any reason why you should "drop the mic"

Protip: run Extreme Quests and make sure to pop your XP and triboosts as well also why not bring a few acquaintances from your list? If they left or afk'd all the time then go make new ones :D

Been trying to join a team, but every team so far is pretty inactive. Like 3 people on tops...

WEED420BLAZEIT
Nov 17, 2015, 09:29 PM
Well, the information is a bit old, and please note that it's just a rumor kind of thing and may differ from the reality.

It goes like this:

Ship10: Noobs server. One of the developers play in this server.




555-COME-ON-NOW

aiMute
Nov 17, 2015, 11:49 PM
Make the quest scale with the amount of people, or hell with the amount of parties.

So that you can perform a lot better with 4 good players than with 4 good and 8 bad ones.
So that if I got a handful friends to play with it's gonna be fine and we don't need 10+ people anymore.
And remove Mass from MMO? MMO without social aspect is just a dumbed down multiplayer game. People cant 12 man mpa because they cant organize teams or runs with their friends? Too bad! Their problem. And its not like 4 people cant carry the whole mpa. If they cant, they arent as good as they think, just some izi modo lovers.

Gaijin cant play? Gaijin can, but they're too busy relying on others, both for blaming and carrying. The only real problem is communications between two halves of the ship.

Shady3011
Nov 17, 2015, 11:55 PM
This game is just dead in general. If an EQ isn't about to happen, no one is really on on any ship. Ship 7 is more of a ghost town than Ship 2 a lot of the time I log on to it.

Kril
Nov 18, 2015, 01:19 AM
This game is just dead in general. If an EQ isn't about to happen, no one is really on on any ship. Ship 7 is more of a ghost town than Ship 2 a lot of the time I log on to it.
not JP peak hours, even then its not AS busy but still more than Gaijin hours

Shady3011
Nov 18, 2015, 01:37 AM
Ship 2 itself has more traffic during peak JP hours even compared to its own prime time Westerner hours. Ship 2 isn't any more or less active than most other ships from my experience from hopping ships at various times of the day.

Z-0
Nov 18, 2015, 01:52 AM
And remove Mass from MMO? MMO without social aspect is just a dumbed down multiplayer game. People cant 12 man mpa because they cant organize teams or runs with their friends? Too bad! Their problem. And its not like 4 people cant carry the whole mpa. If they cant, they arent as good as they think, just some izi modo lovers.

Gaijin cant play? Gaijin can, but they're too busy relying on others, both for blaming and carrying. The only real problem is communications between two halves of the ship.
I agree, people who complain about the rest of the MPA in a 4 player group are dumb. It's not hard to carry as a 4 player group.

Naturally a 12 player group will do better, but go find one if that's such an issue instead of complaining about it.

Raujinn
Nov 18, 2015, 06:30 AM
I had a Loser run not too long back with someone who thought they could carry. They weakbullet'd the head after the arm broke, presumably trying to speed kill it via BrGu bullet bow. The run ended up taking longer because they were bad at it and no one else in the MPA had a good weakspot to attack...

Not helped that most of this MPA were melee, so their insistence on placing the WB on the head wasn't something more than 2 people could take advantage of. A 4-man group doing this could maybe speed up a Loser run, point is if you're gonna try to carry you better have more going for you than confidence or you're just going to make things worse potentially.

TaigaUC
Nov 18, 2015, 08:50 AM
Better than XH runs where people keep putting WB on the closed clock.
They keep putting WB on the shoulders before it opens, too.
A lot of people still don't know how XH Loser works.

I only organize runs for Magatsu, but honestly most of the time XH runs go decently enough that I don't really need to organize runs.
If the multi happens to suck everyone leaves immediately anyway.
SH is a different matter. I don't think anybody I know would care about organizing SH TD3 runs.

Achelousaurus
Nov 18, 2015, 09:20 AM
I agree, people who complain about the rest of the MPA in a 4 player group are dumb. It's not hard to carry as a 4 player group.

Naturally a 12 player group will do better, but go find one if that's such an issue instead of complaining about it.
But that's the point.
And no, I can't carry people as hard as you can. Never claimed I can and never claimed I'm near your level. But still a big difference to the pugs obviously.

Just think about TD 3 with 4 good and 8 bad players compared to an mpa of 12 good or at least decent players.

And the point is, PSO SHOULD NOT be an mmo. PSO1 had 4 and PSU had 6 players and that was one of their best parts.
Yes, that's similar to basic multiplayer and that is the fucking point.
We got the problems now simply cause with 12 people you are forced to play with idiots (on ship 2 as gaijin) and it's anonymous enough for leechers.
Not just that, people rarely ever communicate and might leave just cause you are trying to talk strategy with them.

12 people quests have no improved anything. They just made the game similar to most of the mmos out there where you along others, but not actually with them.

The more the merrier sounds nice but only works on paper, people just don't work that way unless they are all friends.

You know, at first I played with this mindset, people are nice and you can just play with them and everyone has fun.
I learned the hard way that this isn't the way PSO2 works.

sol_trigger
Nov 18, 2015, 09:25 AM
http://41.media.tumblr.com/5ce93dea5fc02c4f4b8d1128e40267a5/tumblr_n7g2m5cGyJ1tqp6txo1_500.jpg

rashoood
Nov 18, 2015, 09:42 AM
Am i the only one who rarely gets bad random 12 party groups during the JP times? I really hardly rarely get bad groups. IDK if you guys are over reacting or playing at different times than me

Not saying super fast elite randoms just saying random groups who get the job done in an average time

Naoya Kiriyama
Nov 18, 2015, 10:17 AM
But that's the point.
And no, I can't carry people as hard as you can. Never claimed I can and never claimed I'm near your level. But still a big difference to the pugs obviously.

Just think about TD 3 with 4 good and 8 bad players compared to an mpa of 12 good or at least decent players.

And the point is, PSO SHOULD NOT be an mmo. PSO1 had 4 and PSU had 6 players and that was one of their best parts.
Yes, that's similar to basic multiplayer and that is the fucking point.
We got the problems now simply cause with 12 people you are forced to play with idiots (on ship 2 as gaijin) and it's anonymous enough for leechers.
Not just that, people rarely ever communicate and might leave just cause you are trying to talk strategy with them.

12 people quests have no improved anything. They just made the game similar to most of the mmos out there where you along others, but not actually with them.

The more the merrier sounds nice but only works on paper, people just don't work that way unless they are all friends.

You know, at first I played with this mindset, people are nice and you can just play with them and everyone has fun.
I learned the hard way that this isn't the way PSO2 works.

Have you ever tried to play MOBAs? It's much worse despite being less people for it. Flame wars are so common there that makes this forum pretty peaceful compared to that. And yet, you're supposed to communicate, work with them and send them messages and advices.

PSO2 is way more lenient about pugs. They suck? allright, but I still give my best even if it's hopeless.

TaigaUC
Nov 18, 2015, 11:49 PM
@Megi
Yeah, my JP friend reminded me that PSO1 was limited to 4 people per battle.
The same limit would probably solve a lot of issues with PSO2.

When you add a ton of people, everything becomes a mess.
The value of each individual is lessened. Same thing happens in society in real life.
Reminds me of raids in WoW, when I literally saved the entire guild from wipes so many times, and nobody noticed or cared.
When you do it in a 4 man, people notice.

Sure, I want to be able to play with more friends at once.
But at the same time, when there are a lot of people together, I can't really tell what anyone's doing.
I guess you could say I end up feeling more "isolated" when there's more people.

@Naoya Kiriyama
I don't know about MOBAs. I know Left4Dead has a 4 person limit, and random people can be pretty nasty there.
Part of it is a game design issue. Simply limiting player limit isn't enough, the game needs to be designed well around that limit.
I get the impression that PSO2 isn't designed very well around 12 person.
I never played PSO1 online, so I don't know if it worked well with 4.

Vindictus works similarly to PSO2. 4-man in regular dungeons, and 12?-man raids for fancy bosses.
Those bosses normally took forever to kill. There are items and such to restrain bosses, but people tended not to use them, opting to just deal damage.
Vnidictus felt like there weren't many ways to influence other players despite being a multiplayer game. It was mostly you doing your own thing.
In 4-man (and probably 12-man too), you had to complete bonus objectives (eg. defeat a boss/enemy with a kick) for points to unlock the next mission.
This made things hell because most people didn't care about other people's bonus objectives.
You'd end up doing the same runs over and over and never advance in the game at all until you happened to get a group that cared.

Up until a certain point, you could solo stuff, but in the later game it was insanely difficult (and boring) even with two-man.
We couldn't find anyone doing any of the earlier missions, so we couldn't advance at all.
Then they made it so doing a mission once (successful or not) has a huge hit on durability that costs a fortune to repair. That's when we quit.
Thankfully, PSO2 doesn't have those stupid issues.

dekopong
Nov 19, 2015, 12:29 AM
Making a 4 man party in advance doesn't grant a disaster free EQ, but it surely reduces the risk, I think.

Hosted many organized EQs in the past, and I understand how much effort it takes. I don't recommend it if you feel gathering 12 players is a daunting task. Making a party is enough in most cases.

By the way, maybe it's just me but I feel it entertaining when I meet a lousy MPA( only if it's once in a while! Can't bear if all of the MPAs I participate in degenerate into chaos!).

Is it possible to bring victory to this MPA? How can I recover the situation? It's challenging (and sometimes irritating) but still fun. Also I can share how terrible the MPA was with my friends if it went extreme!( I try to be careful of not spamming complaints too much, though)

* I'm not against efficient strategic game play, nor do I defend leeching players. Just thinking of how to enjoy the "as it is" when you can't change the situation.

Talking about 12 player MPA, I've heard it is for the "feel" of playing with many players, while keeping the needed effort for communication minimum. PSO2 doesn't have an open world like many other RPGs and it is designed EQ centric, adding a kind of alienation to the game experience. Even without trying to communicate, you still get the feel of being a part of the player community. I'm not sure my English conveys the idea well... I personally think the game should be a little more communication oriented.

KLMS1
Nov 19, 2015, 06:18 PM
"Communication oriented" sounds like an euphemism for B1, just sayin'...

More practically given the language barrier separating most Nippons and Gaijins not needing to talk with the MPA is sort of obviously beneficial.

Arredoval
Nov 19, 2015, 06:32 PM
I never got to play on any servers besides localized ones, so I don't know if it's a ship2 thing, a general Japanese thing, or a recent Japanese thing, but they seem far less inclined to try and strategize with strangers. The only place I've ever seen them do it is challenge mode, and that seems reluctant most of the time, too. (No, のります doesn't count)
Meanwhile, foreigners are so noisy. Some times it's useless screaming general/bad instructions that don't help, but other times it's helped turn a bad run around.
That difference is one of the things that probably hurt the social experience, rather than there being too many people.

I think going back to 4-man parties is a bad idea, but I'd have no objections to 6. Just scale it back a tiny bit for smaller parties so they DO have to pick up the slack, but not to an unreasonable extent. 12 is way too much for how gameplay generally works here. Even though it makes sense for many people to be hacking away at things like Magatsu or TD3, it still doesn't WORK. The point of there being so many people is that that many are needed in MANY PLACES AT ONCE. We're not encouraged to do that, really. Everyone goes from one spot to another as a group. Numbers are supposed to overcome a titan like Magatsu, but instead it's 12 people biting at one shoulder at a time.

....What was the topic again?

Dord-san
Nov 20, 2015, 12:02 AM
In those Mine Defence EQs, I could sorta tell why the fail rate is so high especially in SH. Players often lack map awareness and usually focuses on boss types without caring about other mobs ironically. While its true that players feel that every player in the mpa has a collective responsibility, they often neglect themselves in that equation of collectivism.

Most of the time I just gave up protecting bases when I see almost every player on the map sprinting for the boss, especially being a burden by dying.

I guess this applies for CM as well, where you often see players that usually dies a lot in CMs are often foreign players regrettably. Half of them probably don't get what they're suppose to do or how CM even works. Another half are probably just incredibly bad at it to begin with, maybe noting the latency or their hardware.

While the language barrier does prove as an obstacle for foreign players to know the game, what strikes me is that lack of consciousness that this game is supposed to be localized for JP only and that foreign players still insist on carrying conversations or attempt to communicate with Japanese players with English. While I believe most foreign players take the stance of "following with the flow" whenever they encounter an objective they aren't certain of and hoping by following others they would gain an idea about it, another majority insisted they were "following the flow" but are incredibly aggressive or daring which usually fails the objective.

I agree with Arredoval regarding to organized parties in EQs such as TD or Magatsu may have to carry the burden of the mpa. The main argument is because out of all other individuals on the map, you probably have the best communication among your party members. While it may seem unreasonable due to the fact everyone has that collectivism responsibility when it comes to mpas, that ideology never exactly comes into practice. Reviving an incapacitated player back then did not reward you FUN points, so why did Sega decided to reward 20 FUN points when reviving a player? This just means that the player base of PSO2 are naturally self-centered but at least there are actions where Sega tries to improve the quality of mpas. Sadly it is not exactly an easy feat for a game developer to remedy this issue.

akitalevia
Nov 20, 2015, 11:33 PM
Have you ever tried to play MOBAs? It's much worse despite being less people for it. Flame wars are so common there that makes this forum pretty peaceful compared to that. And yet, you're supposed to communicate, work with them and send them messages and advices.

PSO2 is way more lenient about pugs. They suck? allright, but I still give my best even if it's hopeless.

MOBAs are toxic in general. It seems to bring out the worst in people. Played LoL since post beta and the general attitude's gotten worse as more people join even with the revised ban systems.

ark0
Nov 20, 2015, 11:49 PM
when you get people who you've concluded are less skilled than you, remind yourself you once weren't such a hot shit.

TaigaUC
Nov 21, 2015, 12:20 AM
I think there are a few easy things SEGA could do, that they haven't or aren't.
Developers for online games/applications always seem to be very inexperienced in dealing with human behavior.
Even veterans like Nintendo who have recently ventured onto the online playing field still seem oblivious to basic internet interactions.

I always get the impression that JP games tend to rely on JP players' good will and manners.
When foreigners join the mix, what would be considered the minority extremists amongst Japanese becomes a much larger problem.
There seems to be a lot more foreigners who are rude, stupid assholes.

SEGA probably doesn't care about going out of their way to address such behavior, especially if it's mostly confined to Ship 2.
I'm sure they realize that they profit from people transferring off Ship 2, as well as the foreigners buying AC.

And yes, a lot of Western people seem to have an extremely small sense of world, and expect everyone to be exactly the same as them:
Speak the same language, have the exact same mannerisms and etiquette, etc.
Those are usually the same people who, when faced with facts of reality, go into denial and start harping on about freedom and free speech.
As if those are somehow relevant, or justify ignorance, laziness and rudeness.
"So what!? It's a free world! I'm free to speak English!" etc.

mickbis
Nov 21, 2015, 12:57 AM
I want a 4 man pt mode as well
that way it should be much more challenging
many boss is too easy because it now become 12 OP player

Kril
Nov 21, 2015, 03:28 AM
when you get people who you've concluded are less skilled than you, remind yourself you once weren't such a hot shit.
the problem is that ya I can remind myself that back then I wasn't as good as I am now BUT I actually DID something about it and IMPROVED myself versus every other scrub out there who realizes they aren't "hot shit" and instead DO NOTHING about it

Dammy
Nov 21, 2015, 03:51 AM
"I play this game for fun, i have a life too, my 13* grinded +3 is okay" BabyRage

Z-0
Nov 21, 2015, 04:04 AM
You're not gonna get anywhere with that attitude though, Kril.

Kril
Nov 21, 2015, 04:16 AM
You're not gonna get anywhere with that attitude though, Kril.
just like how they aren't going to get anywhere with their Ex3 +5 Hiei Units and Ex2 9* weps (or freshly untekked 13* untouched for ages)

You know, I know I come off as an ass a lot to people when it comes to being under geared or willing to improve but man it's like I can't stop because I see all these guides and advice given out to people and they just seem to not give a shit and continue the trend as it gets worse

Z-0
Nov 21, 2015, 04:32 AM
Point proven.

You're not going to persuade anyone coming off as an ass.

Kril
Nov 21, 2015, 04:44 AM
Point proven.

You're not going to persuade anyone coming off as an ass.
so then as mentioned in the other thread (or this thread idk) like during TD when you want the run to go more smoothly and people leave when you try to give them advice on what to do? how the hell do you teach them? how do you teach people to play better when they would rather spend all their meseta on fashion versus getting actually good gear so even if they suck, they aren't sucking as bad without them feeling like you're telling them how to play the game? (especially when telling them how to improve their gameplay)

literally everything we've complained about already and where we try to help without others feeling like we're imposing on them at every corner, how do we reach these kids????

lunamaniac
Nov 21, 2015, 05:23 AM
the problem is that ya I can remind myself that back then I wasn't as good as I am now BUT I actually DID something about it and IMPROVED myself versus every other scrub out there who realizes they aren't "hot shit" and instead DO NOTHING about it

Just because they're bad now, what makes you think they'll do nothing about it? :(

All you can really do if you actually want to help is give advice where you can and be civil about it. If you offend someone when you're trying to give "advice" that will make them not want to do it. I think the reason some people are defensive of their non optimal play styles is because others are so horrible about it.

This is a game about cooperation and relying on people, to me that also means struggling bravely when you end up being stronger than your other MPA members.

Hysteria1987
Nov 21, 2015, 05:34 AM
so then as mentioned in the other thread (or this thread idk) like during TD when you want the run to go more smoothly and people leave when you try to give them advice on what to do? how the hell do you teach them? how do you teach people to play better when they would rather spend all their meseta on fashion versus getting actually good gear so even if they suck, they aren't sucking as bad without them feeling like you're telling them how to play the game? (especially when telling them how to improve their gameplay)

literally everything we've complained about already and where we try to help without others feeling like we're imposing on them at every corner, how do we reach these kids????

Ultimately, I don't think reaching a good chunk of them is possible- people are going to play they want to. For those that want to learn, though, well that's a good question. I don't think people can 'reach' them either - better for them to find experienced people of their own accord. That's where the challenge is - people who want to teach are going to have to advertise that it's ok to seek help from them, and people are going to avoid them just for that due to the unwritten everyone-is-silent-under-threat-of-excommunication rules.

Frankly, the fact that most people feel that they have to be silent at all times because any talking whatsoever is rude or what have you is a real killer to personal growth in this game, but there you go.

It also doesn't help matters that those who try to offer unsolicited 'help' in game mostly end up being massive knobs about it. These people are the real problem, to be honest, because they end up causing this reputation that help is not a thing to be asked for, all the while putting out to the wider community that they're helping. But nobody's getting better from that- all that does is foster resentment.

Imma bold this next bit and make it nice and big- there's more to being good than having a good character. It always surprises me when people rate themselves from a purely self-centric view. If these people are surrounded by others who don't know how to play, and they foster this community attitude of being a raging bellend, then they're the reason why the game is not as good as it could be. To them, it's just a matter of they're good at this game and everyone else sucks- it's virtual masturbation.

I can't really think of a way to put this that isn't all dramatic doom and gloom, but I think the culture of this game's just too far gone, it's a bit of a lost cause now. Maybe it works better for the Japanese- it's a bit of a niche thing for us; they're bound to have more support and communities simply due to there being so much more of them than people from elsewhere.

Uhh, went off on a tangent a bit there :P To bring it back on the topic of your post, you're right- it's gonna be hard. Maybe we could start using the custom status to read something that suggests it's ok to ask you/me for help? Like I said, not likely to be many takers, more likely people dishing out scorn, but it's gotta be a start.

Z-0
Nov 21, 2015, 05:39 AM
I don't bother helping because people who want help will ask for it, it's as simple as that.

The issue is that unsolicited advice / help comes off as rude regardless of how "civil" or "nice" you are about it. It's like you're telling the person they suck and you're better than them.

sparab
Nov 21, 2015, 09:44 AM
Meanwhile on ship2, genius Ra(s) still shot WB at loser's upper arm before it turns red and at neck core during first arm break

Finished the run 12 minutes with clock barrier on.

IronKrone
Nov 21, 2015, 10:05 AM
Meanwhile on ship2, genius Ra(s) still shot WB at loser's upper arm before it turns red and at neck core during first arm break

Finished the run 12 minutes with clock barrier on.

This. This happened repeatedly on my last couple of Eluther runs. It's so frustrating because there's no way to cancel that WB out with your own. It almost wish you can somehow cancel the already existing WB ....till I realized that that'll probably make things more annoying.

sparab
Nov 21, 2015, 11:04 AM
This. This happened repeatedly on my last couple of Eluther runs. It's so frustrating because there's no way to cancel that WB out with your own. It almost wish you can somehow cancel the already existing WB ....till I realized that that'll probably make things more annoying.

I tried to WB elsewhere but they will quickly shot another, which can end up wasting all 8 WB sometimes. Also, the average pug mentality is just "oh there is a WB i have2 attack there with all i got"...

Unless you play on muti ships, it's better to avoid eloser in the first 8 minutes

TaigaUC
Nov 21, 2015, 02:26 PM
Z-0 is right in that people who ask for help will listen. Trying to give advice to others who don't want it won't work.

I don't agree with Z-0 or some other people here on various things, but I know that they're better than me in many aspects of PSO2, so I learn from them.
I don't mind if they tell me I may be doing something wrong, even if I'm not asking for help. As long as they're not rude as shit about it, but if they're right I will still take it into consideration.

People should just accept when someone's better than them, and learn from them, instead of getting "offended".

Yes, there's more to having a good character. You still have to play well too.
And I occasionally bump the Eluther guide, but people don't care enough to read it, so there's no point.
Either that or they're illiterate despite English being their first language, which seems to be an increasingly common problem.

Xaelouse
Nov 21, 2015, 02:52 PM
Honestly by Ep4 the WB nerf should be global

TaigaUC
Nov 21, 2015, 03:11 PM
Yes. They need to either remove WB or give everyone WB.
WB causes way too many problems.

I've said this before, but if you have a ton of people often leaving runs when a single class's unique ability isn't present, then your game has terrible balance and needs to be fixed.

Hysteria1987
Nov 21, 2015, 04:16 PM
Obviously this isn't likely to end up happening, but I've always sorta thought bringing back Zalure as a mild, radius-based effect, and then having that be able to be stacked with a (much-nerfed) WB would be a nice way to solve the extreme dependency on WB and to promote the need for a little more team synergy.

yoshiblue
Nov 21, 2015, 04:20 PM
What would happen if WB only enhanced normals and not PAs? Would it give Zalure a reason to exist then?

Hysteria1987
Nov 21, 2015, 11:25 PM
What would happen if WB only enhanced normals and not PAs? Would it give Zalure a reason to exist then?

I'd quite like to see regular attacks become more useful, and PAs being a special use thing, but that's just one of my weird opinions about this game- I'm not big on all the flash. But as an example of what I meant, let's say you're a FO or a TE and you're standing on a building, facing one of Magatsu's shoulders. You cast Zalure, which lowers Magatsu's def by a bit, and let's say for this example that its range is enough to cover both shoulders and its chest (and all them little skull bits he's got along the way).

This gives people a chance to attack any one of those parts without being hemmed into following the WB, while still being useful to the MPA's goal of bringing Magatsu down in a timely fashion. Of course, a RA could come along and hit, say, the left shoulder to stack the effect with Zalure, but in this hypothetical situation the WB and the Zalure both aren't so powerful that if people choose to attack elsewhere, they're completely wasting the WB.

I liek 2design :dead:

AmanoMai
Nov 21, 2015, 11:38 PM
Yes. They need to either remove WB or give everyone WB.
WB causes way too many problems.

I've said this before, but if you have a ton of people often leaving runs when a single class's unique ability isn't present, then your game has terrible balance and needs to be fixed.

in most classic style MMO
you know the usual tank/wiz/healer set up
people doesn't grind without all roles being present either

though i guess field grind is very different from EQ

sparab
Nov 22, 2015, 02:12 AM
in most classic style MMO
you know the usual tank/wiz/healer set up
people doesn't grind without all roles being present either

though i guess field grind is very different from EQ

PSO2 has two roles: damager with WB and damager without WB

HentaiLolicon
Nov 22, 2015, 02:46 AM
The idea of people follow WB is applied to noobs only. Recently, in magatsu/loser/elder, WBers HAVE to follow MPA, if WB is on a viable spot, they will attack it. If not, they will just ignore it and attack the right part. So, if you have such hatred toward WB, then just fucking ignore it and do your job.

TaigaUC
Nov 22, 2015, 03:09 AM
I don't think that's true. Bad WB runs always split the multi.
I also think it requires a little skill to pay attention to what other players and the WB are focusing on. Most people don't pay attention to either.
I'm sure there are also people who don't realize there's an order or don't understand what WB is, and just attack whatever's nearest to them.

Personally, I will often switch targets if WB is applied to another viable attack point.
When I'm WBing, I will switch targets if everyone is attacking a viable attack point.
If people are not attacking a viable attack point, then I won't switch.
It's all about knowing/estimating which would be most efficient, and making that decision.