Need help finishing this Skill Tree (Fi/Hu)

[NettoSaito]

Needless to say, I'm pretty new at this game, and I've been trying to follow other guides, but I'm getting a bit confused with things. Different people recommend different things, so I figured I'd stop myself now before I screw up (or screw up even worse if I already have), and ask the experts for help.

This is currently what I have:

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?10dBbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo 0jdodBIbl2dn0JkrKI20000006dBInfbndAIbfGXexJb000008 doib0000000fdo0000000Io00000007oIn00000000IbIo0000 000jdoIb0000000j

As for the weapons I mostly focus on (at the moment at least), they are twin dagger and the double saber. Of course this doesn't rule out me using others, but for the time being I'm mainly focusing on these two.

So with that being said, what's the best way to go from here?

Thanks,

[TehCubey]

Fighter tree:
Critical Strike makes crits actually something worth looking into. Only works if Fi is a main though.
This makes Brave Critical a good thing to grab. Take both.

Tech Arts JA Bonus is very useful if you use different PAs as opposed to spamming just one. Depending on what you do, pick this one or not. But I recommend it.

PP Slayer is generally very useful - max it out.

Limit Break is a high risk, high reward skill - you really need to know when to activate it and not get owned. Either because the enemy is immobilized or you are good at defense. That being said it's key to getting the most out of Fighter. No need to grab more than 5/10 - more SP put into it doesn't increase effectiveness, only duration. WHich is not always a good thing.

If you take Limit Break, Crazy Heart and Crazy Beat are worth looking into. Limit Break Photon Charge, too.

Twin Dagger Spin Move is very useful if you use TDs at all. D Saber Wind Parry - I actually called it useless but I was wrong. It has some use. Still it's a matter of taste, unlike Spin Move.

Rare Mastery Fighter doesn't hurt. Only a single SP though - more does hurt and is a waste.

Hunter tree:
Max out the fury branch. JA Bonus 1 and 2, Fury Stance, Fury Critical (this is good only for Fi with Critical Strike), Fury S Up 1 and S Up 2. Fury Combo Up... is useful too, but for many 5/10 is enough because it means you get the full bonus after 2 hits as opposed to 1. Whether you pick 5/10 or 10/10 depends on how many SPs you have to spare after buying other skills.

Many people invest in either Iron Will or Automate Halfline as a safety net of sorts. Iron Will is more useful during Limit Break, Automate Halfline otherwise. I advise picking either one or the other. Both might be overkill. If you pick Iron Will, one point in Never Give Up won't hurt.

[NettoSaito]

Ok, thanks for the help! I've updated the skill tree to this:
http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?10dBbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo 0jdodBIbl2dn0JkrKI20000006dBInfbndAIbfGKfHn000008d oib0000000fdo0000000Io00000007oIn00000000IbIo00000 00jdoIb0000000j

But I'm still a bit confused on how many points I should spend on some things... But from what I understand what I have checked now are a must?

[XrosBlader821]

I would go Limit Break + Line/Crazy skills next.
Crazy Beat is great SP value and Crazy Heart at level 1 boosts your PP regenration during Limit break like crazy. Just don't max Halfline. It's not worth it. Max out Deadline though.

Learning how to not get hit while being at 25% of your Max HP is key to fighter. The sooner you start teaching yourself the I-Frames and G-Frames the better.
Unless you play a more tankish version with lots of HP to survive a hit or two at 25% HP.
I prefer the "I don't get hit" route and level up Iron Will in case I screw up.

[NettoSaito]

Ok, updated the link again (in the first post). Is this looking more like what I need to have? Am I missing anything/should I change it? And again, thanks for all the help guys

[XrosBlader821]

Don't forget to learn Critical Strike on the Fighter side if you're going for Fury and Brave crits. Without it you're basically wasting SP.

[Rendezvous]

Try http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdodBdol2IbiNfqnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJ krsHsfdnqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioI n00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000jj (http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdodBdol2IbiNfqnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJ krsHsfdnqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioI n00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j).

16 points leftover in HU to do whatever you want. You can max Automate/Critical or you can raise Iron Will/Never Give Up with one point left over for your preferred gear.

[NettoSaito]

Try http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdodBdol2IbiNfqnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJ krsHsfdnqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioI n00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000jj (http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdodBdol2IbiNfqnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJ krsHsfdnqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioI n00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j).

16 points leftover in HU to do whatever you want. You can max Automate/Critical or you can raise Iron Will/Never Give Up with one point left over for your preferred gear.

Hm, so this is mostly the same as what I have (except with the rest of the points added), but what about deadline slayer? Should I or shouldn't I max it?

[Perfect Chaos]

FYI, that skill simulator that you're using is out of date and will no longer be updated on that domain. Use THIS (http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php) one hosted at its new domain for the latest skill simulator. (If you noticed, Rendezvous used the new one.)

[Rendezvous]

Hm, so this is mostly the same as what I have (except with the rest of the points added), but what about deadline slayer? Should I or shouldn't I max it?

You maxed out Limit Break, which isn't bad, but it's entirely unnecessary. You can spend those points elsewhere.

You could max out Deadline, but I usually am never in a position where I'm under 25% unless I'm in LB. I find myself being under 50% PP more than I'm below 25% HP--that and the boost is slightly bigger. It depends on your playstyle, really.

[XrosBlader821]

For me 30 Seconds of LB ain't enough so I usually end up maxing it out.
But Lvl 5 Limit Break is a fully viable option since you have the full 1.2 boost and 30 seconds CD after LB ends.

[aiMute]

I love using 10/10 LB too but you really have to know ho to dodge, something that might not be that easy for a new player.

Try http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdodBdol2IbiNfqnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJ krsHsfdnqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioI n00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000jj (http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdodBdol2IbiNfqnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJ krsHsfdnqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioI n00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j).

16 points leftover in HU to do whatever you want. You can max Automate/Critical or you can raise Iron Will/Never Give Up with one point left over for your preferred gear.
Fi is good and more or less BnB build. Hu is shit tho, Massive Hunter is very nice but Fi should learn not to get hit to begin with, also you probably mixed up Fury Critical and Combo as you want max crit and 5 combo. For a new player it might be good to invest into Iron Will (if you aren't on proxy) - will save you quite often and it still shows "you should've died" visual effect. The rest of the points can go into s-atk, TDs benefit from that greatly.

[Rendezvous]

I love using 10/10 LB too but you really have to know ho to dodge, something that might not be that easy for a new player.

Fi is good and more or less BnB build. Hu is shit tho, Massive Hunter is very nice but Fi should learn not to get hit to begin with, also you probably mixed up Fury Critical and Combo as you want max crit and 5 combo. For a new player it might be good to invest into Iron Will (if you aren't on proxy) - will save you quite often and it still shows "you should've died" visual effect. The rest of the points can go into s-atk, TDs benefit from that greatly.

You pretty much lost all credibility when you downplayed Massive Hunter.

[ArcaneTechs]

You pretty much lost all credibility when you downplayed Massive Hunter.
If someone knows how to play FI well (dodging, reading etc) they don't need Massive Hunter at a loss for dmg or something more useful on the tree. Massive Hunter isn't exactly a staple either unless you want it really badly go for it. When classes hit 80 I suppose it's not a bad idea to go for it

[Saagonsa]

If someone knows how to play FI well (dodging, reading etc) they don't need Massive Hunter at a loss for dmg or something more useful on the tree. Massive Hunter isn't exactly a staple either unless you want it really badly go for it. When classes hit 80 I suppose it's not a bad idea to go for it

Massive hunter is basically required for doing chaos riser stuff, it is very far from unnesisary

[Dephinix]

If someone knows how to play FI well (dodging, reading etc) they don't need Massive Hunter at a loss for dmg or something more useful on the tree. Massive Hunter isn't exactly a staple either unless you want it really badly go for it. When classes hit 80 I suppose it's not a bad idea to go for it

Massive Hunter is used for MPAs like Magatsu to tank hits to continue attacking. Even if you were getting perfect guards/dodges during all that lag(I doubt it), then you would be losing dps on him. I used to be all for offense as well, but having insurance like Massive Hunter goes a long way. I leave my LB maxed on my TA trees only now.

[aiMute]

Massive hunter is basically required for doing chaos riser stuff, it is very far from unnesisary
Maybe, but I haven't used DS in quite a while and I remember Chaos Riser gathering trash a little above you so it was pretty safe, but dunno really even though I managed without it.

Massive Hunter is used for MPAs like Magatsu to tank hits to continue attacking. Even if you were getting perfect guards/dodges during all that lag(I doubt it), then you would be losing dps on him. I used to be all for offense as well, but having insurance like Massive Hunter goes a long way. I leave my LB maxed on my TA trees only now.
Playing Fi/Br showed that you need no massive hunter for cubegatsu if you justguard all the attacks (and there aren't much of them anyway - one that throws you from the platform and pilar from above that you have to dodge anyway). Whats bad about lag is that the platform goes away from under you and I don't think MH will help you there. And in the end you'll want LB up so MH will be useless there if you die from 1 hit, and even without LB you'll need heals means either friendly techer or wasting time on mates.

[nguuuquaaa]

Chaos Riser doesn't mean to be done on ground, but on air, so it can TAJA into Surprise Dunk. Well, even on ground, since you SHOULD use it in the middle of a shitload of mobs, knockback is bound to happen. That's why Massive Hunter is nice to have.

[vantpers]

I will never understand the purpose of taking 30 satk rare mastery over DS Wind Parrying and then arguing how you are gonna get hit and you need that Massive Hunter or else you don't know how to play.

[nguuuquaaa]

Because it's not necessary at all? You see, DS' shift action have respectable DPS (2933 at full 8 hits), so why should we waste it on guard?

[vantpers]

Yes, that guard skill obviously makes Kamaitachi deal no damage.

[aiMute]

Yes, that guard skill obviously makes Kamaitachi deal no damage.
Stop being snarky. The deal with guard is its almost never used because you either have no gear or dont want to spend it on "guard" when you can simply dodge the trash attack. Bosses attacks are huge and harder to dodge but you don't fight bosses with DS if you picked other weapons gear.

[vantpers]

I am sure being able to both activate a Kamaitachi and guard an attack is useless and you can either guard or use a Kamaitachi, not both. I am totally sure being able to deflect attack in your Chaos Riser bunch while you put up Kamaitachi for gear regeneration is useless. I am sure free guard possibility on every Chaos Sender is too worthless compared to the glory of 30 satk when wielding 10* and above weapons. Of course 30 satk is way more important than a skill that gives you unique defense possibilities.

[XrosBlader821]

Are you guys seriously arguing over a insignificant amount of S-ATK that doesn't add to your base stats (to equip better items) and doesn't even get boosted by Shifta?

[TehCubey]

>Return to a thread
>Suddenly 3 pages
>"Good players never get hit obviously"
>"Here let me argue about a skill I don't even use"

Typical pso-w.

[NettoSaito]

Wow this topic exploded since yesterday lol. Anyway, maybe I should have mentioned I'm a huge fan of hunting style games like Monster Hunter, God Eater, Toukiden, etc. In other words, I'm used to the whole "dodge, never get hit" concept. I know it'll take awhile to learn patterns, but so far what I'm used to has got me through the bosses with no issues (even when fighting them 10-15 levels below the recommended). But anyway....

So should I use that tree on the first page that was recommended to me? Or should I make changes to it? Only thing is with that tree itself I did have one point spent in something it didn't show -- the extended dodge step. Not sure if that'll hurt me much or not, but originally I heard it was good to have at least one in it.

[aiMute]

>Return to a thread
>Suddenly 3 pages
>"Good players never get hit obviously"
>"Here let me argue about a skill I don't even use"

Typical pso-w.
>I never felt like needing superarmor that means I know nothing about superarmor hurr durr

[nguuuquaaa]

Yes, that guard skill obviously makes Kamaitachi deal no damage.
You know anything/HU deal no damage non-JA right? :wacko:
Don't tell me you can timing JA Shift at incoming attacks? :wacko:

Well, on the second note, I'll just drop LB Photon Charge then. My build deals like no damage at all outside of LB, so I personally never use it.

[vantpers]

You know anything/HU deal no damage non-JA right? :wacko:
Don't tell me you can timing JA Shift at incoming attacks? :wacko:

Well, on the second note, I'll just drop LB Photon Charge then. My build deals like no damage at all outside of LB, so I personally never use it.
Oh yes I fucking can time JA Shift at incoming attacks. You don't even need to try. You just want explode your Hurricane Sender and suddenly there it is you blocked some random asshole mob preying for your ass.

[Lostbob117]

Wow this topic exploded since yesterday lol. Anyway, maybe I should have mentioned I'm a huge fan of hunting style games like Monster Hunter, God Eater, Toukiden, etc. In other words, I'm used to the whole "dodge, never get hit" concept. I know it'll take awhile to learn patterns, but so far what I'm used to has got me through the bosses with no issues (even when fighting them 10-15 levels below the recommended). But anyway....

So should I use that tree on the first page that was recommended to me? Or should I make changes to it? Only thing is with that tree itself I did have one point spent in something it didn't show -- the extended dodge step. Not sure if that'll hurt me much or not, but originally I heard it was good to have at least one in it.

I'd go something like this tbh: http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jebdBIbl2lNGAqnIdJksXI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJk cFJidAdB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioIn0 0000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j

I'm not as much as a FI player as others, but this should be a solid crit buildish.

Just take automate JUST INCASE you get hit, and massive hunter is good overall and there isn't much else to take once you invest into that side of the tree for automate anyways. It also helps make you feel tankier after you use limit break if you do get hit.

[NettoSaito]

Thanks, I'll go with that then. I do have one question though, what does the enhanced fist gear do? I need to remove one point somewhere because I have an extra added into step...

[vantpers]

Don't do it

At least use this http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jebdBIbl2lNGAqnIdJksXI20000006dodAI2bndAbofJk esHsfdAqB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io00000000ioIn 00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j

Since you are getting the same satk with 200% PP regen in LB and maxed TAJA save. Who the fuck maxes halfline before crazy anyway.

[XrosBlader821]

I would go with this one http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdBdBdoIbi2dBdoINGAqnIdJkrKI20000006dBdAI2bnd AeBfJkrxHofdAdB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io000000 00ioIn00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j

On Fi's side you might want to spend only 5 SP on LB and spend the rest somewhere alse if you want.
On Hu's side, like Lostbob117 already said, pick Automate if you get hit too often. If not Put it in Iron will/never give up or something else.

The reason why I would go with some Hu Mainclass only skills is that you probably don't have a second Hu skill tree and time will come for you to level up your Hu to 75 (and beyond). Hu/Fi isn't that optimal, which is why you would have to go Hu/Br for a while.


Who the fuck maxes halfline before crazy anyway.
Half crazy People.
Pun intented

[NettoSaito]

Hm, I may go with only 5 points on lb then, or at least save it till last and see if I feel I need them 5 points or not. As it stands though with 30 seconds it seems to be enough to go all out while a boss is still stunned/knocked out -- at least on the bosses I've fought so far. Of course I don't know all of the best times to use lb, but so far it's helped me during times it was safe to use. It typically ends a second after they get back up.

Also forgot to ask, which arts are best to have? I'm at work so I can't list what I'm currently using, but I feel I could be using better ones...

[gabor100]

I would go with this one http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdBdBdoIbi2dBdoINGAqnIdJkrKI20000006dBdAI2bnd AeBfJkrxHofdAdB00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io000000 00ioIn00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j



That one point in Iron Will(while running Automate) will do more harm than good.

[Dephinix]

That one point in Iron Will(while running Automate) will do more harm than good.

How do you figure that?

[XrosBlader821]

That one point in Iron Will(while running Automate) will do more harm than good.

Sorry, should've put 1 SP into S-ATK up and get glorious 3 S-ATK. /s

Automate is pretty much useless during LB since you're always in 1-2Hit KO range. This is really just a fail-safe.

[gabor100]

How do you figure that?


If you have Iron Will on, then it's going to conflict with Automate.


https://www.reddit.com/r/PSO2/comments/440kmw/automate_halfline_is_proccing_correctly_again/czmiink

[vantpers]

How does a skill that activates only when you HP reaches zero conflict with a skill that can only activate when the attack hasn't killed you yet.

[FireswordRus]

Automate is pretty much useless during LB since you're always in 1-2Hit KO range. This is really just a fail-safe.

It is not useless, based on build.

[vantpers]

I don't think anyone but you has a gimmick build with 1200hp or something in LB.

[FireswordRus]

I don't think anyone but you has a gimmick build with 1200hp or something in LB.

yeas i am have it, realy enough 700-800 for it.
https://youtu.be/0_DVi_AYncM?t=4927

[Dephinix]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PSO2/comments/440kmw/automate_halfline_is_proccing_correctly_again/czmiink

Let's say you have 1000hp. You get smacked for 700. You have 300, but then monomate restores 300 or whatever the percentage was. You now have 600. You get smacked again for 700. Now I'm not sure how fast Automate actually is, but I'm pretty sure Iron Will would kick in to save you, and then Automate might heal you, or it won't heal at all. How does this conflict with each other? The only annoyances here are that there is lag on those skills, yes, this is true. That doesn't affect you having both and having a conflict between the two skills. The other annoyance would be using LB and having automate going off since any hit that you did survive from would eat a mate. Having Iron Will might proc this more, but then you must have some high faith in 30% proc. Are you best friends with Dudu? Most attacks are going to send you under 50% during LB, if not kill you. If you did survive, chances are it was with 1 hp, or more than a monomate could restore to put you back over 50% hp so it can even proc again. Having reassurance that Iron Will can proc immediately after being used is nice, for one point. That looks like the real argument here, some flawed data and one measly skill point.

[gabor100]

Let's say you have 1000hp. You get smacked for 700. You have 300, but then monomate restores 300 or whatever the percentage was. You now have 600. You get smacked again for 700. Not I'm not sure how fast Automate actually is, but I'm pretty sure Iron Will would kick in to save you, and then Automate might heal you, or it won't heal at all. How does this conflict with each other? The only annoyances here are that there is lag on those skills, yes, this is true. That doesn't affect you having both and having a conflict between the two skills. The other annoyance would be using LB and having automate going off since any hit that you did survive from would eat a mate. Having Iron Will might proc this more, but then you must have some high faith in 30% proc. Are you best friends with Dudu? Most attacks are going to send you under 50% during LB, if not kill you. If you did survive, chances are it was with 1 hp, or more than a monomate could restore to put you back over 50% hp so it can even proc again. Having reassurance that Iron Will can proc immediately after being used is nice, for one point. That looks like the real argument here, some flawed data and one measly skill point.

You don't really want to have monomates on you. Cuz when a monomate don't bring you over 50% then automate wont proc again until you heal yourself manually over 50%.

I asked about IW+automate combo a few times and got the same answer.
If you don't trust synthsy, you can always "waste" a reset pass to see it yourself.

[FireswordRus]

i am have 1 SP in iron will and Automate. Also i am use LB in any dangerouse situation.
I am dont saw problems. But sometimes incoming damage > mine HP in LB.
For example: TE buff gone and splash from magatsu hit me with 960. Many times in that situation IW save me.
30% proc rate not bad for rarely situatuon.
and yes, i am dont take monomates (only in soloXQ)

[XrosBlader821]

You don't really want to have monomates on you. Cuz when a monomate don't bring you over 50% then automate wont proc again until you heal yourself manually over 50%.

I asked about IW+automate combo a few times and got the same answer.
If you don't trust synthsy, you can always "waste" a reset pass to see it yourself.

Why should I trust him/her when he/she is the only search result on google talking about a unspecified conflict?

[Dephinix]

You don't really want to have monomates on you. Cuz when a monomate don't bring you over 50% then automate wont proc until you heal yourself manually over 50%.

I asked IW+automate combo a few times and i got the same answer.
If you don't trust synthsy, you can always "waste" a reset pass to see it yourself.

If you're only relying on Automate and never heal yourself, or are never in an mpa with someone using Resta, then sure, ditch the monomates. I don't have a problem healing myself though, and usually ditch automate anyways. To reiterate, the whole argument was:
That one point in Iron Will(while running Automate) will do more harm than good.

Then you go to post this Reddit link, which, of course, it's Reddit, you guys believe everything and anything: "If you have Iron Will on, then it's going to conflict with Automate. Also, during extreme lag, both client and server side, there will be a delay in automate proccing."

There is no statement why they conflict, just, "it conflicts, GG".

As far as wasting a reset pass, I'm sitting on 35 all skill resets and I started playing since Braver came out. Guess how many characters and skill trees I have made? :wacko: I've tried it back when Braver was new, though I prefered IW maxed with Just Recover on the Braver tree, automatically resets IW's use. I was using it recently until discussing Hu/Fi with vantpers, and still use it on my Fi/Hu since I can live without 50 s atk. You are more than welcome to prove synthsy correct, but I don't see how he came to the conclusion of them conflicting, other than you really shouldn't need both maxed, and of course lag being an issue.

[milranduil]

i am have 1 SP in iron will and Automate. Also i am use LB in any dangerouse situation.
I am dont saw problems. But sometimes incoming damage > mine HP in LB.
For example: TE buff gone and splash from magatsu hit me with 960. Many times in that situation IW save me.
30% proc rate not bad for rarely situatuon.
and yes, i am dont take monomates (only in soloXQ)

over a year and you still git hit by magatsu waves lol.....

[gabor100]

Then you go to post this Reddit link, which, of course, it's Reddit


Is PSO-W any better? Why should i trust you guys when you don't trust others?


You are more than welcome to prove synthsy correct

And you are more then welcome to prove synthsy wrong.

[FireswordRus]

over a year and you still git hit by magatsu waves lol.....

dont need worry about it and try to block or dodge, he a have very low chance to kill me, maybe 1 hit for 100 runs.

[XrosBlader821]

And you are more then welcome to prove synthsy wrong.

In case you missed it, we still don't know of what conflict he/she is talking about so it's kinda hard to prove it wrong.

Tell us what the conflict is then we'll prove you wrong.

[Dephinix]

Is PSO-W any better? Why should i trust you guys when you don't trust others?

I sort of broke down how both would work if you had both skills on your tree, when having both would be useful, and any complications down the way. What did synthys do? Tell you a statement, and bam, done deal. The difference is information is presented here, you can do whatever you want with it. You can take it at first glance, you can break it down yourself and do your own calculations, ultimately it's up to you. If I had a real GPU, I would gladly record for you, but this card is 6 years old and huffing dust, all I can do is tell you what should be, what I have experienced, and how you can go about finding the results for yourself.

[FireswordRus]

I sort of broke down how both would work if you had both skills on your tree, when having both would be useful, and any complications down the way. What did synthys do? Tell you a statement, and bam, done deal. The difference is information is presented here, you can do whatever you want with it. You can take it at first glance, you can break it down yourself and do your own calculations, ultimately it's up to you. If I had a real GPU, I would gladly record for you, but this card is 6 years old and huffing dust, all I can do is tell you what should be, what I have experienced, and how you can go about finding the results for yourself.

i am do it today, after servers up

[FireswordRus]

what need to test? automate and 1 sp in IW or automate and 10 sp in IW?
i am have 7 trees on hu and 6 on fi and 50+ reset pass. i am planning reset tree for Su and can do a lot of tests with IW

[Dephinix]

Either should work, but 10 sp in IW would probably make the test run faster. You would need to find something that could really hurt you to proc IW as well, or just have really low hp, no armor, and only dimates. That would proc both and reset IW so it can work again instantly. I don't think it's worth looking into though.

[FireswordRus]

Either should work, but 10 sp in IW would probably make the test run faster. You would need to find something that could really hurt you to proc IW as well, or just have really low hp, no armor, and only dimates. That would proc both and reset IW so it can work again instantly. I don't think it's worth looking into though.

liliUQ be enough

[FireswordRus]

start test it on my stream

[FireswordRus]

ok, if u got deadly hit, triggered only IW, automate dont triggered.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3oyDla0eYQ

u can skip to https://youtu.be/-3oyDla0eYQ?t=645

[FireswordRus]

need try to do from multiple enemy.
for ex. 1 hit take 90% 2nd hit with difference ~0.2 sec take 20% HP. I did not see, what it happened with me for 3 years

[TaigaUC]

Is PSO-W any better? Why should i trust you guys when you don't trust others?

That doesn't make sense to me.
With that logic, you could dismiss professionals/experts because they don't trust random people on the street to be as knowledgeable of their profession.
Of course random people aren't going to be as reliable as experts of any particular topic.

First of all, I think you need to consider that PSO-World and Reddit are just random groups of people.
It doesn't mean they all share the same opinion or agree on the same information. Don't generalize by group.
However... Reddit has a reputation for being a hugbox/echo chamber/circlejerk. I've heard they also silence anyone with unpopular opinions.
On the other hand, people here are at each other's throats all the time, arguing about what the facts are.
If I had to choose, I'd say the latter is more likely a reliable source of information.
Why? Because information needs to be discussed and verified, not simply believed and agreed upon without question.

You need to figure out exactly who knows what they're talking about, and who is full of crap.
Try to find someone who can prove they know what they're talking about.
If someone says something, you need to know why they have that opinion. Anyone could say anything for whatever reason.
For example, maybe they have crap gear. Maybe they just don't like the weapon. Maybe they're insane. Maybe they're trolling you.
Some people like to spread lies just to see how many people end up believing them.

If you can't figure out who's trustworthy, use a process of elimination. Test out each person's info, and then eliminate the ones that seem like BS.
Just be aware that even reliable people can make mistakes. Nobody knows everything.
You should generally take everything with a grain of salt and work up from there.

If a lot of people are saying the same thing, it doesn't mean it's necessarily correct.
Many people jump to conclusions. Lies can fool a lot of people. Humans tend to believe what they want to believe, not what's actual fact.
On the other hand, if many seemingly reliable people are saying the same thing, then there's a high probability of that information being good.
Always try to get opposing opinions, though. It'll help you understand things better in the bigger picture.


Anyway, I don't have time to read through the topic, but this is essentially what I'm using for my Fi/Hu characters:
http://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php?11dAbxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIobxIo bxIo0jdOdBIbIbi2dBeKINfdnIdJksSI20000006dodAI2bndA bofJkrxHoIndnkb00000fdoib0000000fdo0000000Io000000 00ioIn00000000IbIo0000000jdoIb0000000lo000000j

Feel free to move points around here and there.
Remove gears for weapons you'll never use.
If you don't use Massive Hunter, put more points into Fury Critical.
You can remove a few points from Iron Will, or invest into Automate Halfline instead.
Limit Break works fine with 5 points, if you want to use those points elsewhere.
Too lazy to explain why I picked what I picked. Most are just the best/most convenient damage options.
For survival, go with whatever your preference is.

If you want to know how reliable I am:
- I've written a ton of detailed guides on this forum.
- My Ideal Knuckles characters tend to top damage meters in multiparty boss fights. Haven't tried Daggers/Double Saber yet.
- I gather information from the JP swiki, many players on these forums, and JP friends in-game.
- I value facts, I don't like misinformation, and I don't mind admitting I've made mistakes. I revise and correct information as it comes.
- I set up several friends' characters the same way, and they're pretty pleased.

[Kondibon]

That doesn't make sense to me.
With that logic, you could dismiss professionals/experts because they don't trust random people on the street to be as knowledgeable of their profession.
Of course random people aren't going to be as reliable as experts of any particular topic.I think the logic is "What makes you experts and not them?" But then you went and explained your credentials so heh. = w=

[Rendezvous]

I think the logic is "What makes you experts and not them?" But then you went and explained your credentials so heh. = w=

It was a rhetorical statement.

[XrosBlader821]

So let me get this straight.
The so called "conflict" is that Automate wont trigger after Iron Will saves your butt.
However, without Iron Will, you'd be dead. Automate wouldn't trigger anyway.
The statement "that 1 SP on Iron Will is doing more harm than good" doesn't make sense then.
And here we have why trusting people who don't explain what they mean is a bad idea.

Thanks for the testing @FireswordRus

[FireswordRus]

We ar talking about need or dont need 1 sp in IW with automate halfline.
But Taiga said right.

That not for Taiga:
Fi only one class who are have a lot combinations of build and affixeces. U can choose any way.

[FireswordRus]

maybe time to stop rude in this tread?
i am show how it worked

[gabor100]

So let me get this straight.
The so called "conflict" is that Automate wont trigger after Iron Will saves your butt.
However, without Iron Will, you'd be dead. Automate wouldn't trigger anyway.
The statement "that 1 SP on Iron Will is doing more harm than good" doesn't make sense then.
And here we have why trusting people who don't explain what they mean is a bad idea.

Thanks for the testing @FireswordRus

Yes, the conflict is that the game checks IW before automate, so there will be a delay in automate. That delay with higher(and normal?) ping could kill you cuz you can get hit again before automate heals you(thanks to the delay).



Iron Will saves your butt.
However, without Iron Will, you'd be dead.

And remember that IW is not FFXIV holmgang, it's just 75% chance.

Dunno what FireswordRus tested but he should test how many millisecond does automate need to heal you with and without IW.

[TaigaUC]

I should have said I don't really expect much from Iron Will/Automate because of lag issues.
Sometimes I clearly see/hear Iron Will trigger, and die anyway, so I expect the same from Automate.
You're probably better off not relying on either.
I just like the invincibility and damage boost from when Iron Will does work.

I dunno if I'd call myself an expert, but my Fi/Hu stuff seems to work well.
OverParse is helping to dispel my concerns about my setup.

[XrosBlader821]

Yes, the conflict is that the game checks IW before automate, so there will be a delay in automate. That delay with higher(and normal?) ping could kill you cuz you can get hit again before automate heals you(thanks to the delay).
You miss the point.
Without Iron Will procing you would be dead. Automate wouldn't even have a chance to save you. And it seems you haven't seen Fireswords video because Automate didn't proc at all after Iron Will saved him from death. He healed himself by manually drinking a mate item.
The so called conflict of your's doesn't really exist.
Game checks goes as follows:
Would it dealt more than 50? - If yes
Would it kill you? - if yes
Use Iron Will
else
Use automate
else else
Do nothing

It's not a conflict. Your whole argument is based on a comment about a reddit post complaining about automate not procing (without Iron will learned I might add).
That comment meant that Iron will prevents Automate from triggering because someone at sega forgot to program Automate healing you after Iron Will. We're not talking about Lag here.