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View Full Version : Balance Patch 4: Live Free or Balance Hard



Altiea
Feb 18, 2018, 05:55 PM
Techniques
-- Rafoie Charge Speed UP
-- Ilfoie Power/Charge Range UP
-- Safoie 0 Distance/Speed UP, Cancel Timing Added
-- Rabarta Range UP
-- Gizan Range UP
-- Ilzonde Distance/Speed UP, Cancel Timing Added
-- Grants Charge Speed UP
-- Ilgrants Charge Speed UP
-- Nagrants Power UP
-- Namegid Power UP
-- Samegid Charge Speed UP
-- Ilmegid Power UP
-- Compound Techs: Recast Time Separated

Pets
-- Pet Melee Normals: Range UP
-- Wanda/Jinga Slicer Power UP, PP Cost DOWN
-- Wanda/Jinga Shock Power UP
-- Wanda/Jinga Break Power UP
-- Wanda/Jinga Pulsar: Movement Distance now relative to distance from target
-- Cery/Popple Normal Attack Speed/Homing/Range UP
-- Cery/Popple Fall Power UP
-- Cery/Popple Curse Power UP
-- Torim/Aero Spiral: Now moves towards target
-- Viola Change:
--- Viola Slicer Power UP
--- Viola Stomp Power UP, Now moves towards target
-- Viola Assault Power UP
-- Maron Strike: Charge Stage 2/3 Range UP
-- Melon Break Power UP
-- Melon Strike Power UP
-- Redran Normal Attack Power/Homing/Range UP
-- Redran Mine Speed UP
-- Redran Gravity Speed UP
-- Rappy Melody Power UP
-- Rappy Cannon Power UP
-- Rappy Sonic: Now moves towards target

Misc.
-- Mirage Escape: Jump Cancel enabled, Compatible with L/Step Jump
-- L/Katana Gear Guard R: Gear Reduction Speed will not increase while Ring is equipped, Gear Gain UP
-- Air Pocket Swing PP Cost DOWN
-- Adapt Spin Movement Range UP
-- Grim Barrage Distance/Turning UP, PP Cost DOWN
-- Techer: Standing still for a brief period of time accelerates PP regen while standing still (presumably same activation as Standing Snipe)

ArcaneTechs
Feb 18, 2018, 06:14 PM
forgot all about this, keep buffing my main Class Sega, you do it every game

Selphea
Feb 18, 2018, 06:26 PM
...wait, Air Pocket Swing had PP cost problems in the first place?

Masu
Feb 18, 2018, 06:39 PM
I wonder when sega will realize that's not old class which need buff but Hero to be nerfed. Oh well it keep them busy instead of working on interesting content because "engine limitations". /salt mode OFF

Edit: They should not allow Hr class to participate to old eqs but ep5 and up in fact because they are definetely not made to sustain an Hero mpa in addition to killing fun of those who want to play old class (me at least).

Kintama
Feb 18, 2018, 06:52 PM
I'll care when the content that justifies these buffs gets revealed.

Xaelouse
Feb 18, 2018, 07:32 PM
Of course, the answer to everything is to add more power

Well whatever makes the stale content go by faster.

GHNeko
Feb 18, 2018, 07:38 PM
I wonder when sega will realize that's not old class which need buff but Hero to be nerfed. Oh well it keep them busy instead of working on interesting content because "engine limitations". /salt mode OFF

Edit: They should not allow Hr class to participate to old eqs but ep5 and up in fact because they are definetely not made to sustain an Hero mpa in addition to killing fun of those who want to play old class (me at least).

Hero doesn't need to be nerfed.

Older classes need to be buffed, and enemy difficulty needs to be buffed.

wahahaha
Feb 18, 2018, 07:43 PM
Hero doesn't need to be nerfed.

Older classes need to be buffed, and enemy difficulty needs to be buffed.

Hero needs one single nerf, Sword Action.

Selphea
Feb 18, 2018, 07:47 PM
Hero doesn't need to be nerfed.

Older classes need to be buffed, and enemy difficulty needs to be buffed.

That's one side of the equation but there's only so much you can make hitboxes move around before things get ridiculous. Yes you can buff gap closers but there's also projectile flight speed, close range PAs that have windup, movement speed while charging...

Hero does need to be nerfed because it was built for an entirely different game where everything is responsive. But the problem is when everything is responsive the feeling of weight and windup is just gone. You can band-aid old classes but the more you do, the more they end up feeling like the same class as Hero.

Altiea
Feb 18, 2018, 07:58 PM
Meanwhile...

Pet buffs, yay!

Techer gets a buff specifically targeted towards running TE/RA, for some reason. SEGA is pushing full support, perhaps?

wahahaha
Feb 18, 2018, 08:08 PM
Meanwhile...

Pet buffs, yay!

Techer gets a buff specifically targeted towards running TE/RA, for some reason. SEGA is pushing full support, perhaps?

Kind of wish they doubled pet HP by now and give some kind of support for S class abilities. And more pet evolutions, of course.

Selphea
Feb 18, 2018, 08:14 PM
Kind of wish they doubled pet HP by now and give some kind of support for S class abilities. And more pet evolutions, of course.

Candies were the prototype SSA though. They were the first "weapons" that could be customized with small %s here and there

Dragwind
Feb 18, 2018, 08:20 PM
These looks like some pretty welcomed changes. Looking forward to trying out the tech changes.

Altiea
Feb 18, 2018, 08:30 PM
Kind of wish they doubled pet HP by now and give some kind of support for S class abilities. And more pet evolutions, of course.

They might do evolutions for the upcoming 14* Pets. Good luck getting them, though.

wahahaha
Feb 18, 2018, 08:34 PM
They might do evolutions for the upcoming 14* Pets. Good luck getting them, though.

Thats the thing, we would go back to EP4 if they added huge buffs to 14* pets. Remember how hard it was to find 13* eggs early?

Masu
Feb 18, 2018, 08:40 PM
Thats the thing, we would go back to EP4 if they added huge buffs to 14* pets. Remember how hard it was to find 13* eggs early?

No Atra for Su, so one can hope :rolleyes:

final_attack
Feb 19, 2018, 03:00 AM
Hmm ... I wonder if GrimBarrage's turn speed affect tps mode ._.

ArcaneTechs
Feb 19, 2018, 03:16 AM
I'll care when the content that justifies these buffs gets revealed.
can you imagine a big content drop that came along with these buffs? i cant lol

Maninbluejumpsuit
Feb 19, 2018, 05:41 AM
...wait, Air Pocket Swing had PP cost problems in the first place?

People use Air pocket swing in the first place?

cheapgunner
Feb 19, 2018, 07:52 AM
Yeah, hoping for level 90 enemies with weapon and/or element resists like Anga and worthwhile drops? xD

Moffen
Feb 19, 2018, 08:02 AM
"-- Grim Barrage Distance/Turning UP, PP Cost DOWN"


Edit2:Electric boogaloo (I should really learn to read)

Please be 5-10pp thx

FantasyHeaven
Feb 19, 2018, 10:29 AM
They're trying to make ilzonde a viable gapcloser but upon using it my wand becomes a worthless element
These people are fucking hopeless

Zephyrion
Feb 19, 2018, 11:16 AM
They're trying to make ilzonde a viable gapcloser but upon using it my wand becomes a worthless element
These people are fucking hopeless

yeaaah it's so much better for Ilzonde to be a shitty gap closer WHILE changing element amirite ? If you find it so annoying, use an asagiri Katana, they are literally cheap dirt and will allow you to get there while resetting wand ele anyway

FantasyHeaven
Feb 19, 2018, 11:46 AM
yeaaah it's so much better for Ilzonde to be a shitty gap closer WHILE changing element amirite ? If you find it so annoying, use an asagiri Katana, they are literally cheap dirt and will allow you to get there while resetting wand ele anyway
Are you mentally challenged?

otakun
Feb 19, 2018, 11:59 AM
Are you mentally challenged?

Insulting people for giving you a viable dash option for people afraid of element change doesn't help your point. Weapon swapping has been done for a long time in this game for dashing. Also, Nothing stops you from tap using techs, you know this, right?

Zorak000
Feb 19, 2018, 12:38 PM
the adapting spin change only effects forward spins, and I guess it's supposed to adapt itself to how far away the target is; the trailer shows that without any target, it will go twice as far as it currently is, so I supposed this means it will shorten itself if the enemy closer than that.

also, judging by the trailer, the ilzonde and safoie distance buffs seem to be aimed at using them uncharged. charging them might get a distance buff too, but I would imagine that it might not be as much as the uncharged forms will get. it would be neat if they made it so that the only reason to charge them is if you were intending to deal damage with them, I feel like they had long since given up on trying to make charged vs uncharged dynamics.

echofaith
Feb 19, 2018, 01:15 PM
Wish partizan got a good gap closer ;c. Rising Flag is too slow and damage is meh. Assault Buster damage pp ratio is terrible, but if it had the same range as say Guilty Break, then it would be awesome.

Aexorcet
Feb 19, 2018, 02:10 PM
Hero doesn't need to be nerfed.

Older classes need to be buffed, and enemy difficulty needs to be buffed.

On paper it makes no difference, but if you just keep applying buffs, you eventually break the game or end up creating a different game. I'd prefer nerfs for sure at this point. The buffs I wouldn't complain about would be undoing some older changes and things like the stance revamp.


also, judging by the trailer, the ilzonde and safoie distance buffs seem to be aimed at using them uncharged. charging them might get a distance buff too, but I would imagine that it might not be as much as the uncharged forms will get. it would be neat if they made it so that the only reason to charge them is if you were intending to deal damage with them, I feel like they had long since given up on trying to make charged vs uncharged dynamics.

Making the uncharged ones faster would be a decrease in utility since these techs would no longer benefit from PPC, ST, Ketos Prio, etc. At least you wouldn't need to craft Ilzonde anymore.

Dark Mits
Feb 19, 2018, 06:11 PM
I second whoever says that players need nerfs.

We have reached the point where players, especially the good ones, can achieve 100% evasion from bosses that spam hard crowd-control and near-OHKO abilities every 2 seconds. We have reached the point where the PP bar does not need to be managed because the player can restore it to full in less than 2 seconds regardless of what's going on. If a player for some reason loses hp, they restore back to full in less than 2 seconds. The only way players can see "improvement" is in bigger numbers, and faster movement (not gap closer, general movement).

You can't design content against that outside of giving bosses unfair abilities, like insanely moving hitboxes and immense self-healing (like those Resta golems in LQ XH which AoE restore 84k per tick).

Sega needs to bring in again that 80% healing debuff and make all evasive actions reduce damage instead of outright preventing it.

AnikaSteinberg
Feb 19, 2018, 06:26 PM
Problem with nerfs in general though, is that such negative balance decisions are almost always designed to discourage that specific nerfed meta (since its a nerf :P)
Nerf Hero, and you'll most likely just alienate the playerbase using it, with the risk of losing them (i.e. quit, hiatus) rather than actually making them decide to use other alternatives (going back to "normal classes")

With a buff, you encourage those who have been using those other alternatives ("normal classes"), or even make those already using Hero try out other classes (for variety, out of boredom, etc.) without kicking the ones already using the "OP" meta out

That being said, I do agree that PSO2 does gets way, way easier when you keep buffing classes over and over per update, since the changes are still balanced around (PVE) mobs/bosses and not amongst players (such as in a fighting game or TCG)

Also Hero was probably kind of essential in making PSO2 devs finally realize some of the most glaring issues other classes/weapon types had that they never would have otherwise noticed

Great Pan
Feb 19, 2018, 06:44 PM
Resistance is futile, just play Hero and we all can be happy. It's HERO TIME!

Kintama
Feb 19, 2018, 06:51 PM
Resistance is futile, just play Hero and we all can be happy. It's HERO TIME!

Sorry i'd rather have a fight before spinning the rare wheel

Flaoc
Feb 19, 2018, 07:25 PM
i cant agree with dodging only reducing damage.. good play deserves reward not a slap in the face. with that one out of the way yes go ahead and nerf how good healing is right now.. it really is too strong with resta and megiverse and automate.. granted i dont use automate infavor of more damage personally

Dark Mits
Feb 20, 2018, 02:26 AM
i cant agree with dodging only reducing damage.. good play deserves reward not a slap in the face. But the reward would be that: reduction in damage.

Right now we have some situations that are awkward to put it lightly from a pure gameplay perspective:

- Getting knockdown by enemy is beneficial because of Just Reversal you either restore more hp than you have taken in damage, or you restore PP, or you deal additional extra damage. Which means that for the enemy's knockdown to be something the player would want to avoid, the damage from it should be higher than the current max hp restoration possible, and the damage the player would have done if they avoided the knockdown should be higher than the extra damage from PP restoration / Just Reversal B.

- Players with a point in TE's Super Treatment WANT to get afflicted by a status ailment to gain super PP restoration. This creates the awkward situation were you WANT to get afflicted by a status effect, and not only that, but you want to NOT have it removed unless it's from TE. This is like saying "Guys DO NOT remove debuffs, remain afflicted until the TE does it". This is bad design on Super Treatment, which exists as a "wrong bandaid" to one of TE's problems.

- Due to 100% of damage from everything being totally avoidable, the purpose of defensive stats is diminished. Not only that, but due to hard-to-avoid damage being extremely high in actual damage, outright avoiding instead of absorbing it and recovering is mandatory to not be forced to use a Moon. Content is not designed around "Achieve that much effective HP to be able to survive, then pour extra in damage", or to put it cynically, players should focus on defensive stats until they reach 1 HP and 0 in all defenses; everything above that is wasted stats. Is there any reason to take Deband buff from Team Tree? Deband potion from campship?

I can possibly come up with more gameplay designs like the above, but we have inspector coming to work in 20mins.

wefwq
Feb 20, 2018, 03:24 AM
>skilfully dodging stream of enemy attacks with only few HP left due to certain skill activation
>still dies anyway
Totally balanced and encourage everyone to get good at timing.
Maybe i should invest on that tank build with these gameplay design.

Loveless62
Feb 20, 2018, 10:18 AM
I, for one, welcome our bi-weekly, non-hero class buffs. atpRtsd

pika2525
Feb 20, 2018, 12:11 PM
make all evasive actions reduce damage instead of outright preventing it.

This is not how you do good game design.

Halaniwa
Feb 20, 2018, 12:25 PM
Where is the trailer to these updates? c:

Zephyrion
Feb 20, 2018, 12:26 PM
-snip.

While I agree with design flaws, damage reduction still wouldn't be the solution imo

- Reversal rings/skills. The issues come from the rings themselves more than anything. Air reversal letting you cancel your reversal immediately, + allowing recover immediately is just too much. PP/HP should be values that vary depending on damage received (like say you receive 300 damage, you regain 20% of that instead of total HP). Those tweaks would make Blast ok, since it's pretty harmless on its own, but can be kinda stupid when coupled with Air reversal

-I don't have any issues with super treatment. You willingly getting inflicted with SE while trusting your TE to use treatment is one of the few synergies left between players in PSO2. while I'd agree to tone down the PP recovery, I still think skills like that are actually welcome

- If anything that actually got corrected as episodes progressed. people used to run around with Saiki and getting away with it because it was relatively easy to just dodge everything. Then the game progressively added more and more spam, enemy combos and such, so much so than haviing stats other than PP and ATK end up mattering a lot more than it used to. DEF being useless is more tied with terrible game design, since achieving high DEF would be as useful, if not more than takin the HP, if only for the fact you need to get all 3 types of DEF for it to have an impact, when HP effectively improves your survivability against all types of attacks.
I'd apply the same reasoning. to current content to be honest, try to go LQ or Dragon rematch with a Saiki full PP craft, no deband buff and no deband tree, I'm pretty certain I'd die a lot/have to play too conservatively and let's be honest most players would, hence why high def high HP units like Izane have been trendy these days.

ralf542
Feb 20, 2018, 01:04 PM
- If anything that actually got corrected as episodes progressed. people used to run around with Saiki and getting away with it because it was relatively easy to just dodge everything. I'd apply the same reasoning. to current content to be honest, try to go LQ or Dragon rematch with a Saiki full PP craft, no deband buff and no deband tree, I'm pretty certain I'd die a lot/have to play too conservatively and let's be honest most players would, hence why high def high HP units like Izane have been trendy these days.

Back in the day people affixed Ability III(almost nobody does this these days) and Saiki had 351/323/323 def and 4%res in one type/unit. 12star unit def isn't really that high, https://pso2.arks-visiphone.com/wiki/Rear_Units_List. The problem was that HP was worthless and everyone was running around with sub 1k HP. You could still faceroll LQ with Charge Parrying+All Guard, add Guard Stance to it if you are capable to Guard/Parry every 40sec.

Saffran
Feb 20, 2018, 03:05 PM
>This is not how you do good game design.
True, but being able to equip the same item in 6 different slots is also not good game design.
Having a fighting system that relies on combo and then allowing a weapon to be slotted with the same PA in all slots (NOT doing a combo) is also not good game design.
Allowing lobby action based PA cancelling to abuse the mobility of certain PAs then not taking steps to make sure the players don't abuse it is not good game design.
The answer to "my character doesn't move fast enough" should be "let's make them run faster" and not "let's make them equip a weapon that allows to break game mechanics like everybody else already does" because (repeat after me) it's not good game design.

Obviously they can't change such core components anymore, but at least revamp some maps for god's sakes. Allow for new paths in time attack. Add hidden rooms or hidden teleporter. Make some emergency codes relevant again. (I'm looking at you, Capture). Welcome to the bewitching woods, where it's impossible to lose your way and just works totally like anywhere else by going forward and killing shit. Welcome to boss revamps where it's just a new colouring and more attack but less HP and the exact same drops. Why do we not get medals for running BQ related content, only BW themselves? Do people even run BQ? I haven't seen a room in easily 8 weeks. Why are returner II units in the shop considered broken (requiring immediate shootdown via emergency maintenance) but invincible players running around at game breaking speeds dealing maxed out damage (also knows as Hero class players) are not?

I mean, let's be honest, I don't really care about the other players. Balance problems don't make me angry, they make me sad. PSO1 was pretty well balanced, all things considered. They know how to do it - yet they purposefully don't. That's what's really bugging me.
Maybe I'm just too old.

Rune_Orin
Feb 20, 2018, 04:07 PM
Since it's a balance patch, we'll get a tree reset pass right?

starwind75043
Feb 20, 2018, 04:58 PM
Since it's a balance patch, we'll get a tree reset pass right?

Yes we should

Arada
Feb 20, 2018, 06:51 PM
Yes we should

Only if skill trees are modified so, looking at the listn I'd say we won't.

Flaoc
Feb 20, 2018, 06:54 PM
unfortunately this is a serious post

well sounds like you should just go play a generic mmo with holy trinity instead of an action game

wahahaha
Feb 20, 2018, 07:07 PM
Wrong steps should have a damage penalty (Similar style to Souls series) As for super treatment, i believe its a good skill but the issue is that status effects are barely dangerous for players, for example burn could stop passive PP regen, poison lower defense etc.

pika2525
Feb 20, 2018, 07:43 PM
True, but being able to equip the same item in 6 different slots is also not good game design. [Not really]
Having a fighting system that relies on combo and then allowing a weapon to be slotted with the same PA in all slots (NOT doing a combo) is also not good game design. [The intention was never for any class except Fighter to specifically rely on combos]
Allowing lobby action based PA cancelling to abuse the mobility of certain PAs then not taking steps to make sure the players don't abuse it is not good game design. [Technically this could be seen as good game design, as it's hardly a game-breaking exploit, nor it is useful in normal gameplay. It's just a neat trick for TA-running tryhards.]
The answer to "my character doesn't move fast enough" should be "let's make them run faster" and not "let's make them equip a weapon that allows to break game mechanics like everybody else already does" because (repeat after me) it's not good game design. [Eh, I don't really care much either way. Each class has a decent-at-worst movement PA, and it's not exactly hard to buy a Vert Buccaneer or some shit. We should have a faster run speed, but still.]

Obviously they can't change such core components anymore, but at least revamp some maps for god's sakes. Allow for new paths in time attack. [The entire point of TAs is there's a single, optimal path to completion.] Add hidden rooms or hidden teleporter. [This would just annoy the people who play the game mainly for TA rankings (Yes, they exist, and they're probably some of the most dedicated players) by making their favourite aspect of the game a non-gameplay ordeal] Make some emergency codes relevant again. (I'm looking at you, Capture). [Was Capture ever relevant?] Welcome to the bewitching woods, where it's impossible to lose your way and just works totally like anywhere else by going forward and killing shit. [Welcome to most video games made, ever.] Welcome to boss revamps where it's just a new colouring and more attack but less HP [You mean more ATK and more HP, right? They haven't nerfed a boss' HP since the nerf to Deus.] and the exact same drops. [Except for the part where every re-worked/re-coloured/variant boss has different drops...] Why do we not get medals for running BQ related content, only BW themselves? Do people even run BQ? I haven't seen a room in easily 8 weeks. Why are returner II units in the shop considered broken (requiring immediate shootdown via emergency maintenance) [Because it was an unintentional addition.] but invincible players running around at game breaking speeds dealing maxed out damage (also knows as Hero class players) are not? [Hero isn't top DPS, and it's far from invincible.]

I mean, let's be honest, I don't really care about the other players. [I mean let's be honest, you don't seem to know what you're talking about.] Balance problems don't make me angry, they make me sad. [Well, either way you seem to be pretty salty.] PSO1 was pretty well balanced, all things considered. [From what I've heard, it never really was. You just weren't as aware of it back then.] They know how to do it - yet they purposefully don't. [Or maybe they don't, because it's an entirely different development team.] That's what's really bugging me.
Maybe I'm just too old.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Halaniwa
Feb 20, 2018, 07:46 PM
Cat water

Dark Mits
Feb 21, 2018, 01:39 AM
well sounds like you should just go play a generic mmo with holy trinity instead of an action gameWe may have a different standard for Action games. To me Action games are supposed to be fast paced games that require player action for everything, including movement, attacking, buffing, debuffing, healing, blocking, avoiding, interacting with players, interacting with environment etc.

Action games are supposed to require the player to have to face his mistakes and correct them. At least the action games I have played do. The fact that current PSO2 design tries to autocorrect your mistakes is what I'm trying to say that is bad design. If you drop to 10% hp, you have to perform restorative actions to take it back up, not have it restore automatically by pressing the attack button because "lifesteal on weapon". Not saying that lifesteal is a bad mechanic, but good lifesteal comes with drawback: If you want lifesteal, you have to sacrifice damage.

The purpose of all non-damage actions (commonly called support actions) is that you sacrifice immediate damage so that you can either deal more damage later, or so that you do not get the words Defeat on your screen. Casting Shifta means that you lose 2 seconds that you could be dealing damage, but your damage during the buff's duration will exceed the damage you missed for not dealing it those 2 seconds. If you cast it out of combat even better, but sometimes combat has to be continuous, like in EQs. Casting Deband should mean that you have to make less stops for restorative/avoidance actions, which lead to higher damage uptime during its duration, and not its current implementation where Deband from non-Te is outright waste.

Altiea
Feb 21, 2018, 07:07 AM
So some of these buffs... Holy mother of god.

-- Any Tech with "Charge Speed UP" listed in it: -0.2s Charge Time
-- Ilzonde (Uncharged)/Safoie 0 (Uncharged): Now move identical to Charged range, meaning there is no reason to use Charged except for damage. Also, you can now cancel it into itself, which means Tech classes basically have Asagiri Rendan.
-- PP Restorate: Standing still gives you a whopping +250% PP regen rate as long as you don't move. FO/TE never has to worry about PP management while wailing on stunned bosses ever again.
-- L/Katana Gear Guard R: Not only is Gear Drain removed completely from the Ring's effect, the Ring now buffs your Gear Gain while in Katana Gear at Lv. 10+, capping out at 110% Gear Gain.
-- Grim Barrage: Now costs a whole 10 PP.

Kondibon
Feb 21, 2018, 07:10 AM
-- PP Restorate: Standing still gives you a whopping +250% PP regen rate as long as you don't move. FO/TE never has to worry about PP management while wailing on stunned bosses ever again.Holy shit. >_> This is actually a buff to Te/Su too.

GHNeko
Feb 21, 2018, 07:21 AM
-- L/Katana Gear Guard R: Not only is Gear Drain removed completely from the Ring's effect, the Ring now buffs your Gear Gain while in Katana Gear at Lv. 10+, capping out at 110% Gear Gain.

https://i.imgur.com/rvtU8ur.jpg

Moffen
Feb 21, 2018, 07:24 AM
I wish they'd buzz off with the 999'999 damage cap because as far as i know,only gu with IF-0 100 chain can even hit that on most bosses now :T

Kondibon
Feb 21, 2018, 07:25 AM
I wish they'd buzz off with the 999'999 damage cap because as far as i know,only gu with IF-0 100 chain can even hit that on most bosses now :TSu can too.

final_attack
Feb 21, 2018, 07:33 AM
I wish they'd buzz off with the 999'999 damage cap because as far as i know,only gu with IF-0 100 chain can even hit that on most bosses now :T

Hr's with HT Tmg can too btw.

GHNeko
Feb 21, 2018, 07:42 AM
I wish they'd buzz off with the 999'999 damage cap because as far as i know,only gu with IF-0 100 chain can even hit that on most bosses now :T

GSA Partisan Hu can too I think.

Maybe Bow Br and Katana Br under the right conditions.

Moffen
Feb 21, 2018, 07:47 AM
Well yeah,i guess theres like 3-4ish more,but they're all 1 shots.
Kinda crippling for the Hr tmg when its finish is locked to a damage cap yet the sword blows right fast it because smaller numbers but much higher output lmao.

I think we're past needing it though,nobody is hitting marron chains for 5mil per hit anymore,i dont think theres any insane damaging stuff like that left.

GHNeko
Feb 21, 2018, 08:07 AM
Well yeah,i guess theres like 3-4ish more,but they're all 1 shots.
Kinda crippling for the Hr tmg when its finish is locked to a damage cap yet the sword blows right fast it because smaller numbers but much higher output lmao.

I think we're past needing it though,nobody is hitting marron chains for 5mil per hit anymore,i dont think theres any insane damaging stuff like that left.

Yeah, but Sega has a vendetta against burst damage now. That's why they nerfed it across the board while normalizing multis and improving sustained dps.

So moving forward they're gonna remain really conservative in that regard so that players don't systematically shit on their EQs.

They're still (understandably) traumatized by XH Magatsu apparently :wacko:

Kondibon
Feb 21, 2018, 08:35 AM
Kinda crippling for the Hr tmg when its finish is locked to a damage cap yet the sword blows right fast it because smaller numbers but much higher output lmao.
TMG finish is for mobbing anyway.

Altiea
Feb 21, 2018, 04:01 PM
https://twitter.com/MIH_AIR/status/966226591385661441

GHNeko
Feb 21, 2018, 07:01 PM
https://twitter.com/MIH_AIR/status/966226591385661441

Asagiri is fastest, but Safoie seems to be most PP efficient.

Good to know.

Saffran
Feb 22, 2018, 10:09 AM
pika2525> for your pleasure:

[The intention was never for any class except Fighter to specifically rely on combos]
They specifically advertised the game as being the pinacle of action with a brand new original combo system. Fighter class didn't even exist...

Lobby action based PA cancelling shouldn't exist in the first place. If it were only for tryhards I could look over it, but you get flack when you don't take advantage of it so... yeah.

[The entire point of TAs is there's a single, optimal path to completion.]
No, the point of TA actually was 4 players coordination (that would lead to a faster competion time). An optimay 'way' of completion is there, but 'path' optimisation is secondary when one or two player(s) can be dedicated to actually going places and pushing buttons and whatnot.

The hidden rooms and teleporters idea is not linked to TA, it's just there to make use of the maps. There's litteraly no point to running any map.

[Was Capture ever relevant?]
A loooong time ago, it took more than 5 seconds to solo a wild Ragne (this was the most common random boss encounter). So when it turned out it was a code capture, you had a chance to get the boss loot within 2 minutes instead of having to fight it for a long time. (well, soloing took a solid 7 to 10 minutes)
Also,Change Over: Capture codes yield off Modulator fodders. But it's really difficult because bosses are now so weak you will accidentally kill them.

[You mean more ATK and more HP, right? They haven't nerfed a boss' HP since the nerf to Deus.]
Red Dragon has a lot more HP than the Black Dragon. I only considered this one - it's true that both Yamato seem pretty much the same. Deus I never really looked into.
As for the drop tables, I guess you're right, some drops are only activated in the rematch.

[Hero isn't top DPS, and it's far from invincible.]
As far as I can see you need to be an absolute tryhard to outperform Hero DPS.

[From what I've heard, it never really was. You just weren't as aware of it back then.]
I've played PSO to death. It was pretty much balanced.

[Or maybe they don't, because it's an entirely different development team.]
Sakai was in charge of PSO in the later years. He knows what needs to be adressed in PSO2. He could totally let the new directors try their stupid storylines and their fetch-me-some-stones quests out but be adamant on the gameplay. Yet all he seems to do is validate the new polygon renderings of the old Phantasy Star lore. It's just sad.