Phantom Class Discussion

[Batty]

soo yeah, i believe we need one of these


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLcm8Gm5pyA

weapons are Rod/Rifle/Katana

Gameplay video

[SPOILER-BOX]
https://youtu.be/yvf2AyP8X_E[/SPOILER-BOX]

Phantom Native Action 1: Shift PA

PA behaviors change after tapping the weapon action.

Phantom Native Action 2: Phantom Marker

Applies a marker to the enemy hit by the attack.
When you long tap the weapon action, a follow-up attack can occur.
Technic Attack (Rods Only)

Activating a Technic causes an additional slash attack to occur.
This can also recover some PP.
Subclass Phantom

Phantoms do not support subclasses, however, you can set Phantom as a subclass for standard classes.

Phantom Notes from Attendees

[SPOILER-BOX]Visitors who attended the Arks X-Mas party got their first look at the Phantom class which is expected to release Spring 2019!

Phantom Class

Can use Katanas / Assault Rifles / Rods
They can also use Technics and Gunslashes.
Each weapon type has 4 PAs.
Each PA has its own [Phantom Shift] version.
Phantom can be used as a subclass.
Phantom Shift

The Phantom Shift activates when you use the [weapon action].
The behavior for each PA changes when you use the PA during Shift.
Phantom Shift Specifications

Uncharged: Has a period of Invincibility when activated.
Uncharged: Leads to Shift PAs.
Uncharged: Maintains the current combo stage?
Charged: Used for Marker Detonation
Charged: Does not lead to Shift PAs.
Charged: Maintains the current combo stage?
Charged / Uncharged Katana Phantom Shift Example

Uncharged: Attacks a short-distance ahead while evading.
Charged: Releases a short-distance high speed slash, and detonates the marker.
Charged / Uncharged Rifle Phantom Shift Example

Uncharged: Performs a shooting attack with bits while allowing you to move freely.
Charged: Releases a penetrating shot and makes it possible to detonate the marker on the hit enemy.
Charged / Uncharged Rod Phantom Shift Example

Uncharged: Fires a photon bullet from the rod.
Charged: Detonates all the markers within range. Strong against a group of enemies.
Phantom Marker

A skill you can learn.
Markers will accumulate as you continue to attack the enemy.
With a charged weapon action, a powerful follow-up? attack will occur.
In addition to dealing heavy damage, it’s also possible to greatly restore your PP.
Phantom Gear

Your Phantom Gear will rise as you’re fighting.
You can activate the skill [Phantom Time] from your sub-palette.
Phantom Time

An active skill that consumes 50% of Phantom Gear.
You’ll be invincible for 5 seconds from activation.
Extends the invincibility frames during step.
PP consumption reduced 20%.
Phantom Time Finish

If you activate Phantom Time again, you’ll perform a finisher based on each weapon type.
Evasive Action / Dodge Counter Shot

Dodge Counter Shot activates when you perform an attack after evading an enemy’s attack using [Step].
Attack Jellen

Provides a certain chance to apply Jellen to an enemy hit by an attack.
Phantom Time Jellen Plus

Provides a certain chance to apply Jellen when an attack hits during Phantom Time.
Stealth Tech Charge

For a certain time, from the start of charging a technic, you’ll become invincible and your movement speed will increase.
Dodge PP Regain

Recovers PP when you evade an enemy’s attack.
Marker Heal

Recovers HP when you accumulate the max amount of markers.
Sprint Tech Charge

Movement speed increases during charging technics.
Phantom PP Restorate

Increases the amount of PP automatically recovered.
Zero Range Mark Boost

Bonus is applied to the accumulated markers? when attacking enemies at close-range.
Long Range Mark Boost

Bonus is applied to the accumulated markers? when attacking enemies at long-range.
Photon Stream

Increases critical power, critical rate, and damage based on your max PP.
Mark PP Drain

Recovers PP when you accumulate the max amount of markers.
Full Drive

Increases gear accumulation
Quick Cut

While using a Katana, when you perform a weapon action at a specific time, the behavior will change.
Bullseye

While using Rifles, it accumulates markers through marker detonation.
Ambivalence

While using Rods, accumulates markers and gear by doing Technics.
Lord of Thorn

Decreases markers and increases marker detonation power.
Tech Short Charge

Reduces Technic charging time and PP consumption, but lowers the power.
Chase Mark Boost

A bonus is applied to the accumulated markers when attacking enemies suffering from Status Effects or Jellen.
Anyway, I’m not sure what “bonus” means exactly in regards to Markers, so we’ll have to wait for more info.

Each Weapon Type has 4 PAs and each PA has a Shift version.

Katana PA: Schmetterling

Normal: A PA that quickly approaches an enemy. A dependable PA since you don’t flinch as you approach.
Shift: Allows you to slip through the enemy’s attack. Due to it’s high performance in evasion, it’s great for escaping groups of enemies.
Katana PA: Volterzeit

Normal: A simple PA that does consecutive attacks. Has a long JA ring.
Shift: Becomes an ultra high-speed slash attack that might be a bit difficult to handle.
Rifle PA: Nacht Angriff

Normal: Fires a slow moving bit that can explode. You can adjust the distance of the explosion based on the timing you release the button.
Shift: Performs a dash while you’re holding the button and shoots when you let go.
Rifle PA: Verbrechen

Normal: Lines up the bits and shoots lasers. The direction is based on your input.
Shift: The deployed bits will automatically fire bullets.
[/SPOILER-BOX]

[aiMute]

Hope it won't be another Hero incident.

[SteveCZ]

I'm so freaking hyped. It looks great. The music is great. Hopefully follows with story back on track. Somehow some of the PAs ( or attacks) feel like partisan weapon mechanics, all of the weapons. The first PA shown reminds me of gunslash though :wacko:

[Kilich]

So, what are your ideas for the class?
Also, yes, make the class a sidegrade, not a straight upgrade over other classes. And especially don't make it a cookie cutter way to play, like 'Spam PA x, if you are hurt, press skill y, if you run out of PP, spam z'.

[SteveCZ]

From the look of it, though it's still early to speculate, the rifle and katana is pretty much single target, and the (wand?) is the only AoE there is. Unlike Hero that apparently the Sword can do pretty much everything from close range, long range, and even AoE, seems like we can really spread over between weapons equally with this one. We probably need some charging mechanics... maybe like partizan, for final blow or maybe damage boost or whatever, not sure. What I was hoping it could have some auto effects like JB can offer, but maybe next advanced class.

They're yet to reveal all others so for me it's really hard to judge right now. Whether this is going to be a single-target focus, no idea, but I am pretty much convinced this won't be an all-round class cause Hero has already take the spot. But if it is indeed single-target focus... then we're back to previous Hero problem again at least to folks like Gunner and Fighter.

[Loveless62]

It's kind of strange that the name of this class is the same as a class of monster (is this also true in japanese?). Maybe you will be able to change into a helicopter, a tyrannosaurus rex, or a train.

[rokkuman]

Love the female costume

[Batty]

From the look of it, though it's still early to speculate, the rifle and katana is pretty much single target, and the (wand?)

most logic idea would be that its wand, having in mind the melee capabilities of it, however its seems unlikely when you see the way it holds the weapon right before it fades to rifle, its holding it with one hand close to one of the ends and the other one closer to the center, both hands way separated from each other, doesnt seem likely to be wand (imaginate holding something like the Master Sword weapon camo like this)

so i think that its either Partizan (unlikely too since it allready has katana) or rod used as a melee weapon. (scythes are considered a type of rod )


It's kind of strange that the name of this class is the same as a class of monster (is this also true in japanese?). Maybe you will be able to change into a helicopter, a tyrannosaurus rex, or a train.

also noticed that the PA coloration effect is blue similar to Ether?

[Kilich]

I, for some reason, think that it might have a lot of photon blades, like the ones created by gunslash Ein Raketen 0. They stay in the air as a DoT until they are moved/transformed by the move's end, or other moves.

[ArcaneTechs]

Dang too slow to make the thread too hyped for this class

OP please keep first of this thread updated with fps combos and numbers etc, I know I got lazy with the Hero thread but at but at least the vids I posted are still relevant and a reference post

[XrosBlader821]

How to spot someone who never used a wand:
They'll suggest that obvious Katana might be a wand




seriously wtf

[Batty]

Dang too slow to make the thread too hyped for this class

OP please keep first of this thread updated with fps combos and numbers etc, I know I got lazy with the Hero thread but at but at least the vids I posted are still relevant and a reference post

Ill keep the initial post updated with any new info that is revealed, if you find something that is not here, you are free to send me a PM and ill update the op and credit you for the info

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Alright. I think it's been long enough.

Let's advocate for nerfs.

[Agastya]

Alright. I think it's been long enough.

Let's advocate for nerfs.

doesn't get to take advantage of eternal operation device, literally unplayable

[Batty]

Who knows, maybe what we think is a rod/wand/partizan might just actually be a new weapon category; Scythes, exclusively for phantom just like tac for summoner.

i dunno, think about it, the more likely would be partizan, but since allready has katana for a S weapon. Rod as a melee weapon too, but the holding posture is just too weird for most of the rod skins. and the particle effect its clearly a slashing motion.

also "phantom" "scythes", it would fit its theme perfectly

[Loveless62]

I'm sure we will figure out exactly how the class works here in this forum before Sega provides details for it.

[Touka]

Hope it won't be another Hero incident.Well considering that they apologized for what they did with hero and they're still balancing older classes.....I don't think Sega would be that stupid.....right?

[XrosBlader821]

I'm sure we will figure out exactly how the class works here in this forum before Sega provides details for it.

Wouldn't be the first time tho

[ArcaneTechs]

Ill keep the initial post updated with any new info that is revealed, if you find something that is not here, you are free to send me a PM and ill update the op and credit you for the info
definitely PM you about that kind of stuff, its a pain for the older class threads where the OPs kinda just dont show up anymore and I like for people to not have to dig through pages of posts to try and find what theyre looking for.


How to spot someone who never used a wand:
They'll suggest that obvious Katana might be a wand
seriously wtf

I dont understand why people think this would be a wand when its clearly a Katana theyre holding. Katana, Rifle and Rod or Partisan. We'll get more confirmation in December during the Xmas Stream

[Batty]

iI dont understand why people think this would be a wand when its clearly a Katana theyre holding. Katana, Rifle and Rod or Partisan. We'll get more confirmation in December during the Xmas Stream

I think they are refering to the first weapon, wich, if following the same hero rules of a s/t/r weapon, it has to be either Rod or Wand.

The way it holds the weapon makes me think though that it might be a new weapon type, Scythes maybe, because the way it holding it and the slashing particles, (besides the obvious class name) make me think that its not just fashion/coincidence that the weapon might be a scythe looking rod, but that they actually designed that one to definitely simulate a scythe movement

[ArcaneTechs]

I think they are refering to the first weapon, wich, if following the same hero rules of a s/t/r weapon, it has to be either Rod or Wand.

The way it holds the weapon makes me think though that it might be a new weapon type, Scythes maybe, because the way it holding it and the slashing particles, (besides the obvious class name) make me think that its not just fashion/coincidence that the weapon might be a scythe looking rod, but that they actually designed that one to definitely simulate a scythe movement
i want to go off the basis its a new weapon type, i really REALLY do but because Sega mentioned in the past about reusing older weapons into new formats, I just dont have that sort of hope clinged to the idea that they finally got off theyre lazy asses and did something good for once you know?

[Moffen]

It wouldnt benefit sega to make an entirely new weapon type,not to mention theres zero camo incentive for such a weapon. Its most likely a rod. Rod is dual stat,so im assuming the PA's and weapon itself scale off T-atk and the slashes that came off it scale off S-atk (Rod currently has 0 use for its S-atk stat) A lot of Hr centric weapon models dont fit hunter either and vice versa,so i wouldnt put it past it just being a rod. Either that or its just a really long wand.

I really hope this class doesnt go the Hr route of just being able to do everything with the Sword, the idea of finally having an actual shotgun(?) really makes me happy,along with a proper saber (Katana)

Also heck you batty,i almost made a thread for this myself earlier in the day but you beat me by like 5 mins LMAO, I trust you'll do a good job keeping things updated.

[aiMute]

Well considering that they apologized for what they did with hero and they're still balancing older classes.....I don't think Sega would be that stupid.....right?
Riiiight.


I think they are refering to the first weapon, wich, if following the same hero rules of a s/t/r weapon, it has to be either Rod or Wand.

The way it holds the weapon makes me think though that it might be a new weapon type, Scythes maybe, because the way it holding it and the slashing particles, (besides the obvious class name) make me think that its not just fashion/coincidence that the weapon might be a scythe looking rod, but that they actually designed that one to definitely simulate a scythe movement
Outside a few camos and weapons almost all of the wands are blunt and the moveset involves stabbing thus it won't be wand.
The other weapon can be rod only if they decide to give it techs but there are a few things against it:
- Hero is supposed to be good at everything because it's "Hero" thus it's okay for Hr to have techs, Phantom has nothing going for it.
- If "Phantom" has anything to do with earth phantom enemies it won't be using photon techniques.
- A few partizans already have scythe models, some have glaive models and some others that are fit for slashing attacks.
extra: They are letting bbow using Br stay broken to avoid drawing people away from the new s/r-atk class.

Sword-type weapon is obviously a katana because it has sheathe and I very much doubt shooting-type weapon will be a lawnchair because that quick one-handed moveset won't fit almost character size lawnchairs, thus raifuru.

[Shinamori]

Probably won't get anymore info on this class until Jan~Feb

[ArcaneTechs]

Probably won't get anymore info on this class until Jan~Feb
the end of the trailer said during the Xmas stream we'll get more info

[Batty]

Also heck you batty,i almost made a thread for this myself earlier in the day but you beat me by like 5 mins LMAO, I trust you'll do a good job keeping things updated.

xD second person to tell me that, like i said, ill try to keep it updated with the new info as its revealed, however if you discover anything new that its not posted here you are free to send me a PM and ill update the op with it and credit u

[SteveCZ]

most logic idea would be that its wand, having in mind the melee capabilities of it, however its seems unlikely when you see the way it holds the weapon right before it fades to rifle, its holding it with one hand close to one of the ends and the other one closer to the center, both hands way separated from each other, doesnt seem likely to be wand (imaginate holding something like the Master Sword weapon camo like this)

so i think that its either Partizan (unlikely too since it allready has katana) or rod used as a melee weapon. (scythes are considered a type of rod )

Yes, I'd also like to believe it's a wand. I mean like Hero, the way that class handles talis is a bit different than talis normally is. I'd go for a chance that it's a wand that is just handled differently. But... the animation is a bit of a stretch to make sure that it is, considering wand never have a PA for a very, long, time, until we finally got one. :wacko:

If it's a partizan, then this class probably hints that it won't have ability to use techs (assuming the weapons are just s-atk and r-atk types). But again sadly since Hero is the only advanced class available, and if by default advanced class should always be able to use tech, then it doesn't matter what the weapon types are. For this one, I'd rather stick with the idea of advanced class should always be all types (s-atk, r-atk, and t-atk), which leads back to it may be a wand, not partizan.

While it's fun to speculate but well we're beating the bushes here, so I'll wait for more info.

[final_attack]

Say, probably this Phantom-class can be a more specialized S/R/T for an adv class?

Considering Hr might be balanced from all S/R/T .... Phantom can be primary S (with assumption the scythe is s a Partizan), with secondary R .....

[aiMute]

Say, probably this Phantom-class can be a more specialized S/R/T for an adv class?

Considering Hr might be balanced from all S/R/T .... Phantom can be primary S (with assumption the scythe is s a Partizan), with secondary R .....
Hero's all sword though with other weapons as extras.

[Kilich]

To continue my above idea, maybe the weapon attacks will leave damaging trails? I mean, Ether is about twisting the already existing, not creating its own, so guren will leave a horizontal Ein Raketen 0 photon blade, satellite cannon leaves a spire that does continuous aoe as it collapses, techs are remade into creating photon blades with weapon action to launch them. Or maybe its going to be the debuff class.

[XrosBlader821]

I think they are refering to the first weapon, wich, if following the same hero rules of a s/t/r weapon, it has to be either Rod or Wand
Nono what I'm refering to are people who actually believe the Katana is a Wand, saying the lineup is Partizan, Rifle, Wand.

[Dugs]

Nono what I'm refering to are people who actually believe the Katana is a Wand, saying the lineup is Partizan, Rifle, Wand.

.... Why???????????

Exactly how does a curved sword that looks like a Katana, that is unsheathed and sheathed, much like how Braver does, match Wand?

[Ezodagrom]

Yes, I'd also like to believe it's a wand. I mean like Hero, the way that class handles talis is a bit different than talis normally is. I'd go for a chance that it's a wand that is just handled differently. But... the animation is a bit of a stretch to make sure that it is, considering wand never have a PA for a very, long, time, until we finally got one. :wacko:.
Some wands, like the 4~6* cane series or magical piece wouldn't work at all as scythes from a visual standpoint. The character just can't hold those from one side. Plus the scythe in the trailer is too long for it to be a wand.

[GHNeko]

oh boy cant wait for this class to be op on release and for everyone and their mom to run only this class for a week and failing all the EQs.

[SteveCZ]

Say, probably this Phantom-class can be a more specialized S/R/T for an adv class?

Considering Hr might be balanced from all S/R/T .... Phantom can be primary S (with assumption the scythe is s a Partizan), with secondary R .....

Personally I'd love that too as I'm mainly a melee user, and visually it's very convincing for it to be a partizan. But it's still worth to argue due to S/R/T nature of advanced class (or just hero, to be exact, lol). I hope this class would straighforwardly break that and say: no, advanced class isnt always SRT.


Some wands, like the 4~6* cane series or magical piece wouldn't work at all as scythes from a visual standpoint. The character just can't hold those from one side. Plus the scythe in the trailer is too long for it to be a wand.

Yes, true on that. It becomes arguable whether this is wand or partizan due to Hero being S/R/T, and the katana and rifle have (probably) taken spot for s-atk and r-atk. But visually again I agree with you.

[Poyonche]

I just really hope it is Rod and that its damage scales off T-atk because screw stupidly high S-atk affixes cost, I am a poor peasant.

Dataminers, please, save us !

[Agastya]

i actually wouldn't be surprised if it didn't have techs at all. the point of this class is that we're weaponizing aether instead of photons, forming weapons with aether is easy enough but no idea how quickly we'd manage techniques with it.

maybe it'll have a smaller list of techs but it won't be able to throw out megiverse or something.



or maybe they'll just give us zanverse again and let you be able to play support in the 12-person phantom MPAs we'll be seeing early on

[Tunga]

oh boy cant wait for this class to be op on release and for everyone and their mom to run only this class for a week and failing all the EQs.

More like everyone using this class and roflstomping eqs even harder. Then sega will buff everything else and the stomp will be even harder.

[Kilich]

I hope they wont have to buff everything again, because that'll break the game balance and progression even more.

[Kondibon]

oh boy cant wait for this class to be op on release and for everyone and their mom to run only this class for a week and failing all the EQs.


More like everyone using this class and roflstomping eqs even harder. Then sega will buff everything else and the stomp will be even harder.


I hope they wont have to buff everything again, because that'll break the game balance and progression even more.

I feel like everyone saying this doesn't actually understand why that happened. Hr, and by extension future "advanced classes", were SUPPOSED to be better than the base classes. The buffs happened because players didn't like that idea. So instead, they moved in the direction of trying to keep all the classes relatively even again, but because they were designing content around Hr, that meant buffing the other classes, not nerfing Hr.

While there's still a possibility Phantom might end up a bit overpowered, It's unlikely it's going to approach the same gap as Hr's initial release because Phantom was likely designed to be on par with Hr from the start, even if they never buffed the normal classes.

EDIT: It's still probably gonna be FOTM, but that'll happen anyway, just because it's the new shiny. I think Su is the only class that didn't have that happen on a large scale simply because a lot of people didn't like the concept. That might just be the english community though, I don't remember.

[Zephyrion]

I feel like everyone saying this doesn't actually understand why that happened. Hr, and by extension future "advanced classes", were SUPPOSED to be better than the base classes. The buffs happened because players didn't like that idea. So instead, they moved in the direction of trying to keep all the classes relatively even again, but because they were designing content around Hr, that meant buffing the other classes, not nerfing Hr.

While there's still a possibility Phantom might end up a bit overpowered, It's unlikely it's going to approach the same gap as Hr's initial release because Phantom was likely designed to be on par with Hr from the start, even if they never buffed the normal classes.

EDIT: It's still probably gonna be FOTM, but that'll happen anyway, just because it's the new shiny. I think Su is the only class that didn't have that happen on a large scale simply because a lot of people didn't like the concept. That might just be the english community though, I don't remember.

Yeah it's just very unlikely Phantom will be super broken. Also from people around me, a lot of people were mostly put off by the gearing effort SU used to take on top of the vastly RNG nature of egg/candy drops. Naturally, this got solved over time but it led a lot of people to just touch it and forget it. Of course the fact it plays and operates completely differently from other classes played a big part too (I personally think it was a welcome addition but opinions). Hopefully Phantom also brings new unique gimmicks to the table

[Anduril]

So instead, they moved in the direction of trying to keep all the classes relatively even again, but because they were designing content around Hr, that meant buffing the other classes, not nerfing Hr.

This was definitely what the issue was.
I feel that if they had released 3 Advanced classes at the same time (like they did with Master Types in PSU), there wouldn't have been that big of a backlash since it wouldn't feel like everyone had to play the same class to be able to play the newest content properly.

That said, I am hoping that there is less of a lean toward S-ATK on this class than there was on Hero, and that all the weapons are equally useful over extended periods of time.

[Agastya]

it was mostly just that hero was the perfect storm of bad ideas wrapped up neatly into one little bundle.

every class had damage on par with hero, but their problem was actually getting to do that damage - hero was able to get to everything first then wipe it out with powerful aoe attacks because they gave sword everything it needed to be a powerful single-target weapon as well as a powerful crowd control weapon.

the second fault lies on the fact that sword was so powerful; their most powerful weapon being a weapon that already existed and coming out after qliphad days meant that people very likely already had a qliphad sword prepared, and many power users had a 200+ attack affix on it. add on people already having striking units and every last piece of the puzzle fell together for the sheer stupidity we saw.

regardless of if their first displayed weapon is partisan, rod, or an entirely new one in scythe, as long as they don't do anything as utterly stupid as having vapor bullet and flash trick available on the same weapon it'll likely work out fine.

i still want it to be wands, though.

[vantpers]

This was definitely what the issue was.
I feel that if they had released 3 Advanced classes at the same time (like they did with Master Types in PSU), there wouldn't have been that big of a backlash since it wouldn't feel like everyone had to play the same class to be able to play the newest content properly.

That said, I am hoping that there is less of a lean toward S-ATK on this class than there was on Hero, and that all the weapons are equally useful over extended periods of time.

God no, do people really don't get what's wrong with advanced classes? Everyone used the average MPA composition just to show how ridiculous it has gotten.

Hero in itself was extreme streamlining the class, it was like going from good old Win7 to Win27 and seeing that the update setting is now day later/on option instead of having actual choice there. Enough people still enjoyed their tree where they had limited SP and couldn't take everything relevant, even if Sega often failed them on that. They enjoyed having a choice of subclass, even if Sega often failed them on that front too. They would be fine with there being a more streamlined class choice where it's just damage on/off on tree and the RPG part is completely projected onto no grind no dps and big grind big dps axis. But they couldn't take Sega trying to remove them from the game as an intermediate period of game's imperfection.

Advances classes can't exist as replacement of old classes. Old classes often have up to 11 PAs that are at times all useful, they often have depth accumulated over the period of alpha to release development. Hero has 4 PAs per weapon just to compare and you will be spending time mostly on Sword instead of doing the intended switching combos. People got used to their (completely different) playstyles and liked them, and no one can tell them that the class isn't fun because first you need to learn how to use it and it god forbids has some inertia in its movements or the PAs can miss their target.

All in all 3 advanced classes or 4 or 5, even skipping over the obvious balance problems in releasing them all at the same time ,wouldn't have made people feel less like they are being forcefully kicked out of their homes. I would also like to say that Sega should fuck off with their idea of player canonically having each class maxed and so forcing me to "play" (dump keys/tickets into) something I don't enjoy or I don't even get to try the advanced classes.

It seems that Sega somehow understood the whole deal, so Phantom can most probably count on a much more peaceful release.

[Anduril]

~snip~
I feel I need to clarify what I meant. I didn't necessarily mean having Advanced Classes as we got with Hero which filled the niches for all three attack types, but rather as branching off from the specific attack types (which is also why I mentioned Master Types from PSU). It could have been something like streamlining the main aspects of the older classes that would be required to unlock them and adding some new gimmick; for example, the advanced Tech-based class could have skills that modified Tech behavior (like zero charge time) or added secondary effects based on the weapon type (like having support Techs automatically go off with certain actions when using Wand) while also adding things like PAs for Rod, Wand, and Talis, or adding a class-specific weapon.
Sure it might still make people feel like they are being pushed out of their comfort zone, but it could also feel like actual progression instead of the piecemeal skills that got added on with lv85, which in and of themselves still try to push people to a certain build (like how Braver Combination has no use from someone who mains Katana as a Braver).

But the point is moot, and I just hope that Phantom is fun to play.

[Kilich]

Yeah, I do hope that Sega learned their lesson, as unlikely as it is. At this point they should add a 'classic pso2' mode to shared ship lobby for players that enjoy low powerlevels and mobility for them and lower quantity, higher quality enemies. Because I do enjoy dueling with the occasional Flame Demon, or Ringada, its the 'here, have 10-15 mobs and a boss, or two, in every spawn' that annoys me.

[Loyd Azakuya]

(like how Braver Combination has no use from someone who mains Katana as a Braver).
I just want to point a little thing, Braver Combination does have an use for Katana, It gives you 100% crit rate (50% from Katana gear and 50% from Braver Combination) so you dont need to spend points on crits

[Anduril]

I just want to point a little thing, Braver Combination does have an use for Katana, It gives you 100% crit rate (50% from Katana gear and 50% from Braver Combination) so you dont need to spend points on crits

Based on the description:

カタナギア解放中にバレットボウに切り替えるとクリティカル率が上昇し、カタナギア解放状態を維持するこの スキルはメインクラスのみ適用される。

and this line from the swiki entry for it:

バレットボウに持ち替えた状態のとき、クリティカル率が上昇する。

the crit rate increase only applies when switching to Bow, but not back to Katana, unless there is something that I am missing where it just gives you a general +50% Crit Rate even after switching back from Bow.
The only benefit to Katana is that switching to a Bow keeps Katana Gear from decreasing.

[Loyd Azakuya]

Based on the description:

カタナギア解放中にバレットボウに切り替えるとクリティカル率が上昇し、カタナギア解放状態を維持するこの スキルはメインクラスのみ適用される。

and this line from the swiki entry for it:

バレットボウに持ち替えた状態のとき、クリティカル率が上昇する。

the crit rate increase only applies when switching to Bow, but not back to Katana, unless there is something that I am missing where it just gives you a general +50% Crit Rate even after switching back from Bow.
The only benefit to Katana is that switching to a Bow keeps Katana Gear from decreasing.



Yes, sorry, my bad, I thought that skill gave you 100% Crit because a friend told me that, and I never saw him give attacks without critics so I believed it, I guess he's just getting lucky and he thinks he has 100% crits

I reseted my build just to test this and yeah, Braver Combination gives 50% crit only to the bow
(I feel super stupid now because Im a braver main...)

[ArcaneTechs]

Yes, sorry, my bad, I thought that skill gave you 100% Crit because a friend told me that, and I never saw him give attacks without critics so I believed it, I guess he's just getting lucky and he thinks he has 100% crits

I reseted my build just to test this and yeah, Braver Combination gives 50% crit only to the bow
(I feel super stupid now because Im a braver main...)
Default 5%, Fury Crit 25%, C Ring 20% + Kat Gear Release 50%= 100% Crit

if you're not subbing HU then you're at a constant 75% crit rate, that skill you mentioned is just sharing the 50% Crit rate (and no Kat gauge reduct) with Bow, nothing more

[Moffen]

Upon further inspection im starting to believe its not a Rod but it IS a Partisan. Check out the idle resting pose before the screen fades to Rifle preview,its held like a sword.
Theres no reason for this class to carry on the S/R/T atk formula so i guess Partisan is the most likely bet.
Still,looking really forward to this, ive wanted a rifle class that isnt as janky as Ra for a while (I love you Ra but im a brainlet and you're an anti-brainlet class)

[Loveless62]

Wouldn't be the first time tho
After several pages, this forum is still struggling with whether the one weapon is a partizan, rod, or a new weapon type.

[Kilich]

To be fair, we might get blindsided about other weapons too. It could be Partizan, Shotgun and a t atk saber that reuses katana animations.

[XrosBlader821]

Check out the idle resting pose before the screen fades to Rifle preview,its held like a sword.

Daily reminder that this means literally nothing in the land of advanced classes. Sword is a 2H weapon and yet Hero holds it like a Gunslash.

[Moffen]

Daily reminder that this means literally nothing in the land of advanced classes. Sword is a 2H weapon and yet Hero holds it like a Gunslash.

It does if you count it in relation to th last important members featured at the end of Ep5
Maria: using Labrys (A Partisan)
Regius: using Tsukuriyo (Katana)
Lisa: using SuperHa***etBlaster5000 (A Rifle)
We saw no class trainer in the Phantom reveal's short trailer unlike the hero reveal (which was full of info), which makes me think its people we know and matches with those 3 too.

I'm okay with it if im wrong,but everything done with the scythe in the trailer fits any partisan much more than the rod. Its also about the Potentials mismatch, lots of rod potents wont work for a striking weapon like the scythe.

[XrosBlader821]

Its also about the Potentials mismatch, lots of rod potents wont work for a striking weapon like the scythe.

Daily reminder that Hero uses Talis and what you said applies to any weapon (Akatsuki & Quelle Windea say hello) and the vast majority of 13* and 14* weapons use generic, class unrelated damage boosts rather than the wild west that were Rarity 7~12* weapons boosting only 1 PA or 1 type of Technics (or not even boosting damage at all).

[Moffen]

Daily reminder that Hero uses Talis and what you said applies to any weapon (Akatsuki & Quelle Windea say hello) and the vast majority of 13* and 14* weapons use generic, class unrelated damage boosts rather than the wild west that were Rarity 7~12* weapons boosting only 1 PA or 1 type of Technics (or not even boosting damage at all).

You saying "Daily reminder" doesnt make you look right,it makes you look like an ass.
I'm sticking with what i think it is, its definitely a partisan.
We have 1 all attack class already, that was the point of Hr, Phantom need not follow that same formula.

[Ezodagrom]

Its also about the Potentials mismatch, lots of rod potents wont work for a striking weapon like the scythe.
If potentials were a reason for it to not be a rod, then that would have applied to Hero too, not just for talis but for all hero weapons, since some of them have potentials that only affect the original classes.

Many 13* rods have generic damage potentials that could be used by Phantom too, and when it comes to 14*s, I'm sure there'll be 14*s just for Phantom, like the demonia weapons for Hero.

Of course this doesn't rule out partisan, it's just that rod is also a solid possibility as well.

[SteveCZ]

After 6 long pages, I think it may be a good time to set a fun poll whether the first weapon is a partizan, rod, wand, or a scythe. :lol:

[Anduril]

After 6 long pages, I think it may be a good time to set a fun poll whether the first weapon is a partizan, rod, wand, or a scythe. :lol:

I throw my wild speculation in that it is a Double Saber! We already have so many camos that can make them look like swords and sabers, it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that the camo/14* in the video is doing the same thing!

[Batty]

well, i remember there was one time that Hero´s weapon was actually a single/shifting weapon because of the way all the 3 weapons shown were similar in appearance

I still believe that it must be Rod, since its an advanced class, not a normal one like summoner, and its supposed to have something from all 3 damage types.

it wouldnt be the first time something similar is done in a mmo; in GW2 before the first expansion came, staff weapons were used only by caster classes and were used as such, magic weapons, when Heart of Thorns came they gave the thief and revenant classes the ability to use staffs too, but as melee weapons

besides like it has allready been mentioned, unlike Talis, Rod does have both S and T attacks. it just look, well, extremely weird for some of the rods design to be used as melee weapon

[Dugs]

its supposed to have something from all 3 damage types.

Is it?

[XrosBlader821]

You saying "Daily reminder" doesnt make you look right,it makes you look like an ass.
I'm sticking with what i think it is, its definitely a partisan.
We have 1 all attack class already, that was the point of Hr, Phantom need not follow that same formula.

Me saying "daily reminder" is supposed to remind you of stuff you're not considering in your little theory, not to prove you wrong.

[Reilet]

I definitely do not want it to be rod for one simple reason, techs on hero was useless (aside from the occasional self heal and self buff, if those heroes even did that). They were literally just an after-thought on hero.

Also, the scythe has a brandish or a dance-like animation after it's two PAs that were shown. Something that a partizan also does.

[Poyonche]

I seriously hope they'll just give a tiny bit of information regarding this during the upcoming ARKS Live so that Scythe would stop destroying virtual friendships. :wacko:

[XrosBlader821]

I definitely do not want it to be rod for one simple reason, techs on hero was useless (aside from the occasional self heal and self buff, if those heroes even did that). They were literally just an after-thought on hero.

but... you don't use Talis as a Tech weapon on Hero...

[Kilich]

Aren't there more s weapons than others? Then some of them will have to use 2 s weapons.

[Anduril]

Aren't there more s weapons than others? Then some of them will have to use 2 s weapons.

There are 9 Striking weapons (including Gunslash), 4 Ranged Weapons, and 5 Tech Weapons (counting JBs and Takt here since their icons are yellow, though in function, JBs would fit more in the Striking group and Takt really should just be a category on its own). But you would think they would try to exhaust the pool of Ranged and Tech weapons before doubling up on Striking.

[XrosBlader821]

Also I doubt we will have more than 3 Adv. classes if the 10 year plan is any indication. EP6 & Phantom won't be out till Spring 2019, EP6 will likely be at least a year and few months long and then another few months break before EP7, which also be a year and a few months long. By the time EP7 ends it should be a few months till the 10 year plan is finished.

[Loyd Azakuya]

I throw my wild speculation in that it is a Double Saber! We already have so many camos that can make them look like swords and sabers, it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that the camo/14* in the video is doing the same thing!

It can not be a Double Saber for the same reason that it can not be a Wand, there is not enough space to grab the weapon
[SPOILER-BOX]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/475213600869449749/506832919088857095/unknown.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
How are you going to hold this for example?
[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.gyazo.com/498aafa7a17d7fe97e390a66cf3ce672.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

I think is a new weapon

[Anduril]

It can not be a Double Saber for the same reason that it can not be a Wand, there is not enough space to grab the weapon
[SPOILER-BOX]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/475213600869449749/506832919088857095/unknown.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
How are you going to hold this for example?
[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.gyazo.com/498aafa7a17d7fe97e390a66cf3ce672.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

I think is a new weapon
My exclamation points were there to indicate humor about the speculation and SteveCZ's suggestion that putting up a poll would be a "fun time;" it seems that I should have added a :wacko: to further show that.

That said, SEGA doesn't necessarily think too much about hand placement when it comes to non-default weapon models, as many Launchers and Rifles have demonstrated, so if it were a Double Saber (which I'm not saying I actually believe it is) it could just end up with a floaty hand, like so:
[spoiler-box]https://i.imgur.com/BGtFa7w.jpg[/spoiler-box]

[SteveCZ]

I throw my wild speculation in that it is a Double Saber! We already have so many camos that can make them look like swords and sabers, it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that the camo/14* in the video is doing the same thing!

ooohh kinda reminds me that blazblue camo for saber that looks like a scythe! :-o

[Moffen]

Aight lads its confirmed we are going to be doing slashing attacks with a rod, i hope you're happy.
We'll have Hr2.0 with its S-atk melee main and irrelevent tech and shoot weapon all over again
OMEGALUL wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

[Kilich]

At least its not 2 s weapons.

[LancerFate]

8 pages of which weapon it's, saved by SEGA ^^

[XrosBlader821]

Aight lads its confirmed we are going to be doing slashing attacks with a rod, i hope you're happy.

I a world where S-ATK affixes are like twice as expensive as R and T-ATK ones I sure am~

[cheapgunner]

Does this mean that really cool rod from Beach 2018 eq with the striking shoot ability makes it the ideal rod for phantom now ( never got one feelsbad)?

[XrosBlader821]

Does this mean that really cool rod from Beach 2018 eq with the striking shoot ability makes it the ideal rod for phantom now ( never got one feelsbad)?

https://i.imgur.com/gLN2YN8.png

Expect "Ph not applicable" in the future.

[final_attack]

There's also Form Rod, wasn't it?
PA sends shockwaves, normal attacks also sends shockwaves? _(:3」

[SteveCZ]

hahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa :lol: thanks sega it was fun!

[Kiboune]

lol, new PAs with this rod gonna look weird
http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E3%83%95%E3%83%96%E3%82%AD%E3%82%A8%E3%83%8B %E3%82%B7&src=%E3%83%95%E3%83%96%E3%82%AD%E3%82%A8%E3%83%8B% E3%82%B701.jpg

[Ahri]

My phobos rod is happy and ready for Ph ~

[LancerFate]

My phobos rod is happy and ready for Ph ~

In ~4 months i think there will be some better options xD
Btw i wonder is it means Phantom is more T/R atk focused since all 14* katana stat requirement DEX

[final_attack]

Now I wonder how SpreadNeedle will fare .....
The attack animation shown (don't know it's PA or normal attack) seems faster than current Ra / Gu? o-o

[Loyd Azakuya]

A lot of rods are going to look very weird doing the Scythe animations

[Kilich]

Maybe they'll add animation camos?

[oratank]

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%EF%BC%8A%E3%82%B5%E3%83%9E%E3%83%BC%E3%83%BB %E3%82%B9%E3%82%A4%E3%83%A0%E3%83%9C%E3%83%BC%E3%8 3%89&src=%E3%82%B5%E3%83%9E%E3%83%BC%E3%83%BB%E3%82%B9% E3%82%A4%E3%83%A0%E3%83%9C%E3%83%BC%E3%83%89_%E8%A 3%8F%E8%A1%A8.jpg

to reduce the edge :D

[Zulastar]

Now I wonder how SpreadNeedle will fare .....
Same here. And Quelle Neigea too.

[Tymek]

lol, new PAs with this rod gonna look weird
http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E3%83%95%E3%83%96%E3%82%AD%E3%82%A8%E3%83%8B %E3%82%B7&src=%E3%83%95%E3%83%96%E3%82%AD%E3%82%A8%E3%83%8B% E3%82%B701.jpg

The worst weapon in the game. I felt so bamboozled when I tried it.

[Kondibon]

I guess I'll be bringing *Liberation (http://pso2.swiki.jp/index.php?%EF%BC%8ALiberation) out of the closet for this. Maximum edge. 8)

[Batty]

* Shionogi Yanpe and * Wilcsense going out of stock in 3, 2, 1 (both are weapon camos that cover rod, rifle and katana)

[ArcaneTechs]

Wandlets btfo high IQs knew it was rod the whole time 8-)

[SteveCZ]

* Shionogi Yanpe and * Wilcsense going out of stock in 3, 2, 1 (both are weapon camos that cover rod, rifle and katana)

What's the japanese name of these, I wanna look. o:

[final_attack]

What's the japanese name of these, I wanna look. o:

I believe it's the ones from Magatsu and Apprentice trigger (All weapon camo)
＊禍装シオイナルヤンペ
＊ヴィルクシェンテ

[SteveCZ]

I believe it's the ones from Magatsu and Apprentice trigger (All weapon camo)
＊禍装シオイナルヤンペ
＊ヴィルクシェンテ

alrite thanks... ＊禍装シオイナルヤンペ = 154m+ , ＊ヴィルクシェンテ = 79m+ ship 4 :wacko:
＊禍装シオイナルヤンペ looks dang cool. x(

[Agastya]

guess i'll just beat people with an EPD for laughs before making a new rod

[SteveCZ]

I'll use deelyra then. :lol:

[Great Pan]

Goddammit, now I have to find meself a decent rod to use.

[ArcaneTechs]

Goddammit, now I have to find meself a decent rod to use.
dont try and pretend like you even play this game still

[Great Pan]

dont try and pretend like you even play this game still

I shamelessly swallowed my own word now. MHW is boring, so I returned to this.

[ArcaneTechs]

I shamelessly swallowed my own word now. MHW is boring, so I returned to this.
and you wondered why I went off on you like i did in that other thread about MHW man, Im still waiting on G rank. or did you just come back to this game just because we're having a MH collab too? :wacko:

[Great Pan]

and you wondered why I went off on you like i did in that other thread about MHW man, Im still waiting on G rank. or did you just come back to this game just because we're having a MH collab too? :wacko:
The answer is simple, I want to play Phantom, end of story.

[ArcaneTechs]

The answer is simple, I want to play Phantom, end of story.
now i know youre lying

[Kilich]

Would people be content if they introduce new mechanics in PAs? What level of new? Surface level like replacing wind up with charge? Like Ein Raketen getting a slow photon blade that you launch with a shot, or parallel slider becoming hover shooting? Or a deeper level that needs both skill tree and subclass changes in addition to PA mechanics, like making your custom PAs out of pieces of main and sub PA/tech?

[Great Pan]

now i know youre lying
Fine, fine. I came back because of MH collab as you said. After this, I say goodbye to this fucking game.

All is the truth.

[ArcaneTechs]

Fine, fine. I came back because of MH collab as you said. After this, I say goodbye to this fucking game.

All is the truth.
thats the Great Pan I know :wacko:

[Anon_Fire]

Since the video on TC's post was removed, thought I'd re-post it here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLcm8Gm5pyA

[XeNoSLaSHeR]

phantom time(manual activation):
activate phantom time by activating skill, activate again to release finisher
(phantom time activation gives 5 sec invincibility and -20% pp consumption)

phantom time finisher:
allows the time of finisher attack



phantom time marker plus:
obtain bonuses as marker stack increases in phantom time (?)

phantom time jellen plus:
increases the rate of afflicting jellen when attacking

dodge counter shot:
releases a counter attack when dodging enemy attacks
(step counter stacks a chase arrow, attacking releases it?)

stealth tech charge:
gives invincibility for a certain time at the start when charging techs, also increase movement speed

sprint tech charge:
increases movemenet speed when charging techniques

attack jellen:
have a chance to inflict enemy with jellen on attack

dodge pp regain:
recover pp when dodging an enemy account

phantom pp restorate:
increase natural pp regeneration

photon stream:
increase damage, crit rate, crit damage based on maximum PP

phantom marker:
accumulates phantom markers when attacking enemies

mark heal:
recovers HP when marker stack is maxed

Zero Range Mark boost:
increases marker stack gain when attacking at close range

long range mark boost:
increases marker stack gain when attacking at long range

mark pp drain:
recovers PP when marker stack is maxed

lord of thorns:
when marker stack is decreased, increase detonation damage (assuming this means using fully charged weapon action)

Chase mark boost:
when enemy has status abnormality or jellen, increases marker stack gain

Full drive:
increase gear gain rate

Tech short charge:
reduce tech charge time and pp consumption, but decreases power(?)

Quick Cut:
when using a katana, using weapon action at specific timing will change behaviors

bullseye:
when using a rifle, activing marker detonation will immediately trigger phantom marker again(?)

ambivalence:
when using a rod, increase in the accumulation of gear and marker when using techniques(?)

41896

[final_attack]

Interesting ......
Some bit of support (with Jellen to keep mpa alive) .... I like this kind of support.

That 【 Photon Stram 】.... I wonder if maximum PP means % based or depends on how big your max PP is .....

Hmm ....
I wonder how rifle will fare .... since I basically only have good ranged based equipments. A tiny bit of S-Atk, almost none T-Atk.

[ArcaneTechs]

Replay of what was shown for Phantom last night, watch it while it last until Sega knocks it down and we have to look for another source to see it again:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvf2AyP8X_E

[Poyonche]

Replay of what was shown for Phantom last night, watch it while it last until Sega knocks it down and we have to look for another source to see it again:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvf2AyP8X_E

Damn, it looks much more fun than Hero.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Rifle looks cool, fluid, combo oriented, and ranged. Will this finally make me use something other than sharp, pointy sticks? We shall find out.

[GHNeko]

I'm playing FiPh if this game allows me to.

[Batty]

i updated the initial post with a link to the gameplay video and the info released on psublog

[Dugs]

Here's the video from the official pso2 youtube, so it's also in better quality. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aq07V5BwLD8)

[ArcaneTechs]

Here's the video from the official pso2 youtube, so it's also in better quality. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aq07V5BwLD8)
neat, you'd think by now Sega would stop doing the low quality streams but its never going to stop.

gameplay starts at 9:38 in that vid

[ShinMaruku]

This crap brought me back to the game.. I wonder if this can use combined techs as well?

[SteveCZ]

This crap brought me back to the game.. I wonder if this can use combined techs as well?

If you main Fo or Te with it, then yeah.

[ShinMaruku]

Oh yeah I never knew it was subable... Interesting.

[Ahri]

I need that sub Ph for my Su and say good bye sub Fi

[Batty]

speaking of sub, i wonder if using ph as a sub class will allow you to use its PAs, a fo/ph with phantom staff PAs would be the perfect sword mage, techer is just boring

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Bash me all you want for planning ahead, and the question may seem silly, but what would you people do? Lightstream rod, vampiric strike atra katana, or the other way around knowing what we know about phantom, and even possibly using the rod for Fo as well?

[LancerFate]

Bash me all you want for planning ahead, and the question may seem silly, but what would you people do? Lightstream rod, vampiric strike atra katana, or the other way around knowing what we know about phantom, and even possibly using the rod for Fo as well?

I going for sword for Hr and only after Phantom release decide which weapon type i need most, since its pure speculation to choose weapon type beforehand.

[ArcaneTechs]

Bash me all you want for planning ahead, and the question may seem silly, but what would you people do? Lightstream rod, vampiric strike atra katana, or the other way around knowing what we know about phantom, and even possibly using the rod for Fo as well?
im playing it smart and waiting to see which of the 3 is best or if somehow theyre all good for whatever reason i'll make what "feels" best to play the class with for me since we have absolutely nothing to go on to determine any of this yet. Its whats holding me back from making any Lightstream weapon atm

[final_attack]

Bash me all you want for planning ahead, and the question may seem silly, but what would you people do? Lightstream rod, vampiric strike atra katana, or the other way around knowing what we know about phantom, and even possibly using the rod for Fo as well?

Spread Needle, and see if it's viable as Gu's sub (and hoping I can apply Jellen with Tmg).
Probably will use Phantom as sub more if it's indeed viable. If it's not ..... then just as variation on gameplay (like Hr).

Equipment wise, I only have R-Atk based things, so, weapon choice kinda limited.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

im playing it smart and waiting to see which of the 3 is best or if somehow theyre all good for whatever reason i'll make what "feels" best to play the class with for me since we have absolutely nothing to go on to determine any of this yet. Its whats holding me back from making any Lightstream weapon atm

I'm not doing final affixes now, (not till phrase decay SAF weapons come back, and calming intent is actually affordable again). Still doing some affix prep, though I should 7s 2 more weapons now I think about it.

Speaking of calming intent, I'm not imagining those rifle normals being disgustingly strong, am I? Those looked like bodyshots to the skeletons for ~50k. Anyone caught what the rod normals did during the stream? I think I only caught an 82k step attack to a weak point.

[SteveCZ]

I have the weapons from mhz event on stand by and atra exes fodders in case I want this class further. I'm not turning it to any weapon yet to see how this goes.

I don't really guess much so this is as far as I can do for it.

[echofaith]

Same, I got the MHZ 14* as rifle as I didnt even plan to use that weapon, so is in standby for when I try phantom. The good thing is that both lightstream and atra can be exchanged, so if the class turns out to be super good, you can just exchange your existing weapons. I didnt watch the video fully and just skimmed through it, but they all seemed good as far as damage goes, so maybe using 2 will be the meta(one for bossing and the other mobbing).I think rod will get the short end of the stick, but again, I just skimmed through the video :p

[Moffen]

I already use Katana Br and Rifle on Ra so im pretty set for two weapons regardless, dunno what ill make for the rod though. Lightstream will likely go to whatever weapon feels the best and ill fill the empty slot with atra #3 for that supposed title reward stone we were supposed to get in the future.

Big shoutout to Batty for keeping the front page updated, hopefully we get a lil bit more info this stream.

[Terrence]

Since my (almost done) Atlas EX Rod will serve me as Fo/Te and Fo/Ph, I don't plan to farm/create anything else until PHantom is released and the Class is tested in detail. But the first thing I'll do myself for sure is to play as Te/Ph with EPD to see if PHantom could be the missing link for casting TEchter to be something else than a joke.

[Zephyrion]

Since my (almost done) Atlas EX Rod will serve me as Fo/Te and Fo/Ph, I don't plan to farm/create anything else until PHantom is released and the Class is tested in detail. But the first thing I'll do myself for sure is to play as Te/Ph with EPD to see if PHantom could be the missing link for casting TEchter to be something else than a joke.

casting TE isn't a joke though ? TE/FI is plenty strong and hybrid TE used to be the meta for a good while. The only reason it somehow fell out of grace (even though it's still an efficient way of playng TE mind you) is because Lavis is so blatantly OP at melee while being so bad at techs that it literally funneled TE into a melee-oriented playstyle. As far as melee goes, Lavis is still stronger than anything we have atm, even Lighstream soooooo.

I'm more interested in Phantom sub for its jellen skills tho. a TE that can debuff sounds super fun !

[Terrence]

casting TE isn't a joke though ? TE/FI is plenty strong and hybrid TE used to be the meta for a good while. The only reason it somehow fell out of grace (even though it's still an efficient way of playng TE mind you) is because Lavis is so blatantly OP at melee while being so bad at techs that it literally funneled TE into a melee-oriented playstyle. As far as melee goes, Lavis is still stronger than anything we have atm, even Lighstream soooooo.

I'm more interested in Phantom sub for its jellen skills tho. a TE that can debuff sounds super fun !
I understand, Zephyrion. And I'm happy to read that. Thanks for the information. My boyfriend wanted to play as a TEchter who would rely only on technics so I recommended him to try TEchter/FIghter (100% Wise Stance + Atlas Wand (EX) + S4:Cunning Strike) but I was not totally convinced myself seeing how mean people of this forum generally are towards those who want to play casting TEchters......

And if TEchters can apply Jellen as Te/Ph, this will be a lot of fun indeed (thankfully I kept some Phrase Decay SAF) ! ^^

[SteveCZ]

...I was not totally convinced myself seeing how mean people of this forum generally are towards those who want to play casting TEchters......

Yeah they're around, but don't belittle yourself over something you want to try or play with just because of a public forum. I hope this Ph can be your new fun playground for a while.

[cheapgunner]

Was wonderign this but never thought about bringing it up. Suppose you run Braver-Phantom, are you locked into only Braver katana PAs or can you access Phantom PAs as well (I assume only Braver ones but this would be kinda cool to have both sets if SEGA coded Braver for both).

[ArcaneTechs]

Was wonderign this but never thought about bringing it up. Suppose you run Braver-Phantom, are you locked into only Braver katana PAs or can you access Phantom PAs as well (I assume only Braver ones but this would be kinda cool to have both sets if SEGA coded Braver for both).

None of us have or know this info yet, it was brought up before with the other weps which sega hasnt mentioned anything on this yet

[cheapgunner]

None of us have or know this info yet, it was brought up before with the other weps which sega hasnt mentioned anything on this yet

Good to know someone already brought this up and it's still unknown. It's subclass potential for me hinges a bit on this bit of info.

[ShinMaruku]

I would think phantom would have a preference. Depending on the extra effects.

[ArcaneTechs]

Good to know someone already brought this up and it's still unknown. It's subclass potential for me hinges a bit on this bit of info.
it'll definitely make a impact on the hybrid classes thats for sure but its something ive been wanting to know for awhile too. I wouldnt mind going BR/FT and using the PA's from that (granted I'll lose my ability to use a Rifle though) but its up in the air until we see that stream at the end of the month unless they for some reason announce a bit of info on Arks Live but likely not

at this point though I dont see Ep6/Phantom hitting until mid Feb or Late/Early March/April which is a bummer

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

I'd assume phantom PAs are mainclass only til otherwise stated.

[final_attack]

Oh btw .... regarding info on Arks Live today ..... there's question(s?) regarding Phantom

- Photon Stream (5 SP, I think)
10% damage with 200 Max PP
With another bonus at 300 Max PP (I think a tweet only mention critical rate (https://twitter.com/_TUKA_/status/1086595918370025472)) .....
I dunno if the bonus is only given at stated Max PP, or scaled depends on max PP

The description on 1st page is Damage, Critical Rate, Critical Damage, right?

300 max PP to maximize a skill? @.@

[SteveCZ]

Oh btw .... regarding info on Arks Live today ..... there's question(s?) regarding Phantom

- Photon Stream (5 SP, I think)
10% damage with 200 Max PP
With another bonus at 300 Max PP (I think a tweet only mention critical rate (https://twitter.com/_TUKA_/status/1086595918370025472)) .....
I dunno if the bonus is only given at stated Max PP, or scaled depends on max PP

The description on 1st page is Damage, Critical Rate, Critical Damage, right?

300 max PP to maximize a skill? @.@

300 max PP to maximize power? A difficult to understand class (according to survey)? This is going to be real fun!

But...

"...In response to this, the Phantasy Star Fan Festival in March will allow attendees to try out the class..."

Oh well, I guess I'd just assume it'll take a little longer than March.

[Anduril]

300 max PP to maximize power? A difficult to understand class (according to survey)? This is going to be real fun!

But...

"...In response to this, the Phantasy Star Fan Festival in March will allow attendees to try out the class..."

Oh well, I guess I'd just assume it'll take a little longer than March.

Well, "Spring" (ie.Q2) starts in April and ends in June, so maybe we might get Ep.6 and Phantom around the Anniversary event.

[SteveCZ]

Ah, you're right. Oh well. At least PP and crit power are good enough hints to prepare while waiting.

[Reilet]

it’s okay my dude. You only need Astral soul, arks fever, grace stat, returner 5, stigma, ether factor, Spirits 5, stat ev pp on all three whitill units to reach 296 pp!

[Dark Mits]

it’s okay my dude. You only need Astral soul, arks fever, grace stat, returner 5, stigma, ether factor, Spirits 5, stat ev pp on all three whitill units to reach 296 pp!We haven't thought of the following though:
- It may be affected by current max PP, not lobby max PP. So PP Drink at campship can help.
- Similarly to the above, ARKS Buff (another +20PP) can help (only for PD and Persona so far)
- Weapons also can contribute to PP.
- The class will possibly have PP Up 1 (+10PP). Maybe even PP Up 2 ?
- We may be getting new units in EP6 with innate PP higher than that of Whitill.
- The class may have a skill/buff that temporarily increases max PP (similar to how TE's Deband increases max HP).
- (edit addition)We also have extra 10PP for reaching 75 on Fi/Gu/Te/Br/Bo I just noticed that you have included this

[final_attack]

Well, if using Phantom as sub .... Gu have ShowTimeStar (+50 PP) :lol:
Maybe we'll also get PP High Up or something (I think Su have HP High Up?) :lol:

[Zorak000]

the first fan festival this year will be on march 10th; but I think it's curious that they decided to move what I think will be the EXP/RDR boost period from the start of march to the end of march...

[ArcaneTechs]

I got so triggered by the march festival testing, more WAITING again man. Shit game time to uninstall


--They felt Rods were a bit stiff with their PAs and normal attacks, and that it was hard to combine that with Technics.

ya I still don't like Rod, maybe this will make me want to play it but im still not interested in it

--There’s going to be a Phantom Mag skill that converts DEX into S/R/T

Why? why wouldnt you carry the Hero Mag effect over to this? ez 300ac sales??? i mean obviously good for people who already invested into Dex aka BR's and BO's. really dumb idea

--Photon Stream is a skill that, according to the X-Mas Party pamphlet, increases the critical rate, critical power, and dealt damage based on your Max PP. At skill level 5, you can reach the cap of 10% Power with 200 PP. In addition, you can reach the critical rate cap (whatever that value is) with 300 PP.

Unless there are skills that perma boost (while you main the class) PP or something pertaining to main class only skills (hopefully not PP Up skill investments) then this is a big middle finger to a LOT of people people, New or Veteran players. No should have to reinvest into an entirely new Unit build while diminishing their attack to just to get to the maximum PP bonus and even if you manage to meet it, the bonuses don't make up for it. So unless theres more to the tree we don't know yet, Sega better consider lowering or altering the skill while they have the chance since theyre willing to do another play test and tweak the class before its release.

--Phantom will be officially abbreviated as [Ph]

well I guess they decided to not use the JP characters this time, odd (remember HE?)

--Similar to how Hero has the Demonia series, Phantom will also have its own set of weapons. They have not disclosed when these weapons will release.

these will end up like Demonia if they aren't supporting S1-3 or upgradeable to 15*s sometime down the line

--They might also do that invincible Rockbear, but it’s not set in stone right now.

fucks sake we all want a DPS test dummy, just add something we've been all wanting for years!

end rant...maybic

[Terrence]

When Phantom is used as a sub, you’ll be able to use skills that aren’t main class limited. Although we don’t have the full list of sub friendly skills, we do know that Photon Stream is one of them. Sprint Tech Charge and Full Drive are also available.http://nibelungen.orgfree.com/cum1.png FUCK YEAH http://nibelungen.orgfree.com/cum2.png

[mother clusterfck]

stealth tech charge - lets pray sega also adds this skill for Fo.

But yeah, wasn't Phantom supposed to be an advanced class like Hr? Or you can you really combine it with other classes?

[SteveCZ]

They already changed the term "advanced" to "successor" class. Yes, as long as Phantom is the subclass.

[Loyd Azakuya]

I think some people are misunderstanding Photon Stream (I could be wrong)
They said "At skill level 5, you can reach the cap of 10% Power with 200 PP", but who says the skill don't have 10 levels? meaning that at level 10, you gonna need only 100 PP or at least 150 PP, like with Fighter with Limit Break, at skill level 5, you can get the cap of 20% power, but at level 10 you can get more time up till 60 seconds

Looking something like this
https://i.gyazo.com/270813e78c3fb7d8743fa9eec934d08d.png

[ArcaneTechs]

I think some people are misunderstanding Photon Stream (I could be wrong)
They said "At skill level 5, you can reach the cap of 10% Power with 200 PP", but who says the skill don't have 10 levels? meaning that at level 10, you gonna need only 100 PP or at least 150 PP, like with Fighter with Limit Break, at skill level 5, you can get the cap of 20% power, but at level 10 you can get more time up till 60 seconds

Looking something like this
https://i.gyazo.com/270813e78c3fb7d8743fa9eec934d08d.png


i can get behind this as in maxing out the skill requiring less of a PP investment for the bonuses but the other way around, a big no from me

[Reilet]

It is very possible that lvl 5 is the max.

[TakemiShinnosuke]

so wait you can subclass phantom but not hero ??

successor and advanced..what is the difference ??

[SteveCZ]

so wait you can subclass phantom but not hero ??

No idea for Hero (yet).


successor and advanced..what is the difference ??

Just naming convention to make it more relevant as of today than what it was before (literally, luls).

[Anduril]

so wait you can subclass phantom but not hero ??

successor and advanced..what is the difference ??

Successor is just the new name for Advanced classes, and as such Hero will also be redesginated as a Successor class. It does also come with a change to the unlock conditions; instead of getting one striking, one ranged, and one tech class to lv75, you will just need to get any two classes to lv75. They haven't yet said if they will also allow Hero to be used as a subclass, but at this point it might be assumed that it will be because of the designation change.

[Tigy]

https://i.gyazo.com/971e068bdc3f17244797aa412198ea46.jpg

Good thing I have been always hated HP because I'm playing Br 24/7
Only need to complete weapon affix and replace izane leg to reach 200+.

Ignore timed abilities, they're arks fleet.

[Dark Mits]

Regarding Photon Stream, I have understood that it will work in a different manner.
Skill will have 10 points most likely.

At 5 points, you have 10% buff to damage. Every other point beyond that will not increase that. So you will have 10% at 5 points, you will have 10% at 10 skill points. Basically it will work like this:
2% / 4% / 6% / 8% / 10% / 10% / 10% / 10% / 10% / 10%

However, your chance to score a critical hit will increase beyond 5 skill points until it hits 100%. So it could be something like this:
5% / 10% / 15% / 20% / 25% / 30% / 45% / 60% / 75% / 100%, with downscaling relative to your max PP. So if you have put 8/10 skill points and have max PP of 250, you would have % crit chance buff of 60% x (250/300) = 50%

Numbers above are for demonstration purposes.

Obviously, if you have other crit chance buffs, then maxxing this skill may not be optimal. Or conversely, maxxing this skill may allow you to hit the crit cap without reaching 300PP.
Post is without merit now :-P
Ceresa posts correct information 2 posts below

[Zorak000]

I think there was a crit damage buff associated with phantom stream, or elsewhere on phantom

[Ceresa]

http://pso2.jp/players/news/23186/

Photon Stream is max 5 points for damage boost, 200 pp for full benefits.

Critical Stream is a different skill for crit rate and crit damage, also max 5 points, 300 pp for full benefits.

[SteveCZ]

http://pso2.jp/players/news/23186/

Photon Stream is max 5 points for damage boost, 200 pp for full benefits.

Critical Stream is a different skill for crit rate and crit damage, also max 5 points, 300 pp for full benefits.

Well this settles it. :beer:

Edit: Whoops, psublog is quite thorough about it. "※The Critical Damage wasn’t clarified if it increases based on Max PP"

[final_attack]

Well this settles it. :beer:

Edit: Whoops, psublog is quite thorough about it. "※The Critical Damage wasn’t clarified if it increases based on Max PP"

Well, having 300 PP is super worrying if it's needed to get maximum damage potential of a skill :lol:

[SteveCZ]

Well, having 300 PP is super worrying if it's needed to get maximum damage potential of a skill :lol:

Indeed. My guess is, it is likely to need 300 PP to get maximum critical damage. :lol:

[quickasker]

oh well here it goes 300ac for dex mag. the 300PP are hard to do imo, my unit which has (115 all atk +12 pp) gives me 199pp with jerky and pp drink. mabe Ph will has pp expansion skill too like Gu's Show time :D

btw how many mini dex food do i need to level the mag from 1 straight to lv200? i ever saw someone posted the formula and how many photon spheres needed for exchange in shop, but it seems i couldn't find it atm (pardon my spaghet search keyword)
--
Edit: i find it, it need 335 Photon sphere from lv1 to lv 200

[Dark Mits]

Entirely random thought (someone may have already post it): Since we will be able to use Phantom as sub, we can get it to 55 before switching to it as main, if we do not intend to play as it.

[final_attack]

New Phantom Skills (saw on Twitter) (https://twitter.com/kajyapi/status/1104529012867493893)

Help with translation, please.
From previously available one, [AttackJellen] is Phantom main only (r.i.p my hope having Jellen as GuPh).

New Phantom-main only skills :
- Phantom Talis S Charge
- Jellen Redress(?) ジェルンリドレス
- Phantom Weapon Bonus 1 + 2 (165% in total, I think)
- ゲシュペンスト (Dunno the English .... something about HP lower than 50%, big damage, and recast)

New Main + Sub skills :
- Critical Stream (I think it's +60% crit rate cap, +5% crit damage cap ... dunno about required PP, I think they said 300 in previous stream?)
- PP High Up (10 levels, I think, and PP +20)
- All Attack Bonus Phantom (Melee : 145%, Pet / Tech : 135%, Ranged : 130%)

==========================

Additional %, I think, for known skills (main + sub one)
- Full Drive (Gear fill boost, I think, max Lv5, 150%)
- Phantom PP Restorate 130% (+30% from normal, maybe)
- Photon Stream (10% damage)

==========================

List for main + sub skills
- Full Drive
- Sprint Tech Charge
- Tech Short Charge
- Phantom PP Restorate
- Photon Stream
- Critical Stream
- PP High Up
- All Attack Bonus Phantom

===========================

I think I'll consider GuPh a bit less now (since 1 of my main reason is Jellen on attack).
For ranged, it's also lower than Hu-sub, I think.

[Anduril]

New Phantom Skills (saw on Twitter) (https://twitter.com/kajyapi/status/1104529012867493893)

Help with translation, please.
From previously available one, [AttackJellen] is Phantom main only (r.i.p my hope having Jellen as GuPh).

New Phantom-main only skills :
- Phantom Talis S Charge
- Jellen Redress(?) ジェルンリドレス
- Phantom Weapon Bonus 1 + 2 (165% in total, I think)
- ゲシュペンスト (Dunno the English .... something about HP lower than 50%, big damage, and recast)

New Main + Sub skills :
- Critical Stream (I think it's +60% crit rate cap, +5% crit damage cap ... dunno about required PP, I think they said 300 in previous stream?)
- PP High Up (10 levels, I think, and PP +20)
- All Attack Bonus Phantom (Melee : 145%, Pet / Tech : 135%, Ranged : 130%)

==========================

Additional %, I think, for known skills (main + sub one)
- Full Drive (Gear fill boost, I think, max Lv5, 150%)
- Phantom PP Restorate 130% (+30% from normal, maybe)
- Photon Stream (10% damage)

==========================

List for main + sub skills
- Full Drive
- Sprint Tech Charge
- Tech Short Charge
- Phantom PP Restorate
- Photon Stream
- Critical Stream
- PP High Up
- All Attack Bonus Phantom

===========================

I think I'll consider GuPh a bit less now (since 1 of my main reason is Jellen on attack).
For ranged, it's also lower than Hu-sub, I think.

Translations have been on bumped for a little while already:

Phantom Talis S Charge (NEW)



Reduces the charging time of the Technic that was activated from the thrown Talis of the PA: Eisen Flugel
(Eisen Flugel is a rod PA that shoots out a “Talis-like” bullet.)

Jellen Redress (NEW)


Strengthens Jellen when you attack an enemy afflicted by Jellen.

Ph Weapon Bonus 1 & 2 (NEW)



Increases power when using Phantom’s Weapon Types
Power: 165% Each

Gespenst (NEW)



When you receive an attack when your HP is 50% or below, it will nullify status effects and greatly reduce damage.
Recast Time will occur after activation.

Critical Stream (NEW)


Increases Critical Rate and Critical Damage based on the Max PP.
Critical Rate: Max 60%
Critical Power: Max 5%

PP High Up (New)


PP+20 at Max (LV.10)

All Attack Bonus (New)


Gain a Damage Bonus
Strike: 145%
Range: 130%
Tech: 135%
Pet: 135%

[final_attack]

Translations have been on bumped for a little while already:

And ..... my mind slipped again to check on Bumped ;w;

Sorry, and thanks.

[GHNeko]

300pp for max crit is insane.

that cant be the actual value

[Dark Mits]

If you have Crit Field from a Bouncer and Shifta from a Techer, you will hit the crit cap before 300PP.

[GHNeko]

If you have Crit Field from a Bouncer and Shifta from a Techer, you will hit the crit cap before 300PP.

Yeah but that doesnt detract from the fact that 300PP just for 60% crit when crit still is not good unless you focus on it

is still really bad lol

you want a class that has minor damage m ultis from crit like br and gu to be able to reliably get 100% crit.

even Fi gets 70% crit for no reason other than facing the right way and fi gets 15% for crits.

why does 60% and 5% damage require 300PP?

that's absurd lol

[final_attack]

What I remembered from stream way back then .... they said that critical rate will need 300 PP, and damage still need 200 PP .... so .....
I still extremely want they put Attack Jellen to be sub-able :<

[Reilet]

At least it’s only 5% coughheroboostcough. You still get 65% * 65% * 45/30/35% * 10% practically for free.

[Megaolix]

So I just saw the news about that class... I imagine those not spending for a new MAG for DEX get kinda screwed over then?

[XrosBlader821]

So I just saw the news about that class... I imagine those not spending for a new MAG for DEX get kinda screwed over then?

I guess this finally puts the nail in the coffin of the "Dex mag is useless lmao" argument. You have 3 classes using it now, 4~5 if you consider Te/Ph, Su/Ph.

[XrosBlader821]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/513439853606600718/565192700106899457/Phantlul.png

Sorry for the double post but someone uploaded this (which skills are MC only was added by me) which apparently shows the finalized Skill Tree of Phantom aka Subclasses don't have enough skills to use up all their SP.

[ArcaneTechs]

Was this something generalized from irl play tests since sega never showed the tree yet? Either way good work so at least i got an idea of what build i can do

I just noticed no SP cost per skill, a struggle but still a good visualization

[XrosBlader821]

I dunno if this is indeed a final version and not just a mockup then I'm kinda disappointed with the skill tree. I was hoping for at least Ph Will and All Attack Up as well as at least a extra 5%~10% Damage increasing skill to close the multiplier gap. Tech charge Addition and Step Roll Advance being here are nice I guess but there is still not enough skills to dump all 104 SP into.

[final_attack]

Looking at skills available as sub ..... makes me felt more disappointed that Attack Jellen (Redress can be main only) isn't available :<

[Dark Mits]

Doesn't SU suffer from the same situation? There are not enough non-Main Class skills to dump 104 skill points, so we end up taking skills like HP, Def and PP.

[Tymek]

Was this something generalized from irl play tests since sega never showed the tree yet? Either way good work so at least i got an idea of what build i can do

I just noticed no SP cost per skill, a struggle but still a good visualization

Famitsu.

[ArcaneTechs]

Famitsu.
oh I looked at a Dengeki scan, do you have a source for this?

[XrosBlader821]

Doesn't SU suffer from the same situation? There are not enough non-Main Class skills to dump 104 skill points, so we end up taking skills like HP, Def and PP.

They actually do have enough Skills but 15 more Level ups/SP and we're gonna run out

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/559792091903950849/565564756996653067/unknown.png

But PH doesn't even have enough for that unless every MC only skill is 1SP and subclass skills 10/5 max level


oh I looked at a Dengeki scan, do you have a source for this?

https://www.famitsu.com/images/000/174/515/5cac45d2a97f5.jpg

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Wondering if they'd give us scaling details on critical stream. I really want at least 50% crit for 200pp.

[XrosBlader821]

Wondering if they'd give us scaling details on critical stream. I really want at least 50% crit for 200pp.

I assume it'll be
100pp - 0%
200pp - 30%
300pp - 60%

But I'd love to be wrong about this.

[ShinMaruku]

I wonder what weapons I will need for this class....
The tree looks somewhat interesting.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

I wonder what weapons I will need for this class....

... ?

[ShinMaruku]

I have a lightstream weapon, and I can work towards another set but until I have more info I can't really decide on too much.
I also have a homura weapon as well with Katana and rod. I have no rifles so that's a question to me.

[ArcaneTechs]

I have a lightstream weapon, and I can work towards another set but until I have more info I can't really decide on too much.
I also have a homura weapon as well with Katana and rod. I have no rifles so that's a question to me.

2x Atra Ex, 1x Lightstream
3x Atra Ex
3x Austere NT's
3x Zara

there done ez

[ShinMaruku]

Ok I have a Lightstream, I can look into the others....

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Ok I have a Lightstream, I can look into the others....

Just atra ex x2 + lightstream like normal lizard people.

[quickasker]

soo with the recent 大型アップデート2019「Stars：EPISODE6」紹介ムービーPart1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRV6CmmRemA) , has anyone calculated how much point needed in main class stuff?

[Poyonche]

Does that mean we aren't going to wait 3 months for the Phantom camo ?

[SPOILER-BOX] https://i.imgur.com/E2BUvn3.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]


soo with the recent 大型アップデート2019「Stars：EPISODE6」紹介ムービーPart1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRV6CmmRemA) , has anyone calculated how much point needed in main class stuff?

Pretty sure someone on the Discord said it takes 94SP (Tech Charge JA included).

[Coldco]

[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/0cmdl73.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[quickasker]

Does that mean we aren't going to wait 3 months for the Phantom camo ?

[SPOILER-BOX] https://i.imgur.com/E2BUvn3.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
if it's really in EP6 chapter 1, we'll get it from early new episode campaign i guess



Pretty sure someone on the Discord said it takes 94SP (Tech Charge JA included).

looks good, but i guess it'll take more time for skill simulator maintainer


[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/0cmdl73.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
here it is the full layout, looks great! :D

[XrosBlader821]

Yup, A subclass that only uses 46 SP :wacko:
I guess Sega wanted Mainclass Phantom to be Subclass Phantom

[Sriracha X]

I'm guessing Step Roll Advance adds iframes to Dive Roll for RA/GU? That's the only skill that doesn't seem so clear to me because I don't see any of Phantom's steps involve rolls in the animations

[ArcaneTechs]

I'm guessing Step Roll Advance adds iframes to Dive Roll for RA/GU? That's the only skill that doesn't seem so clear to me because I don't see any of Phantom's steps involve rolls in the animations

whatever one has the highest i-frame rate takes priority, they dont add up together

[XrosBlader821]

I assume step roll is just 0,2s iframes for free
Phantom step is just a skill that gives a specific animation for mainclass, like mirage step. Tl;drnothing to worry about

[mother clusterfck]

Judging by the gameplay vids and what we know about the skills Phantom looks like epic fun. So many options, so many strats.
I really hope casting with rod is strong enough to be viable, that would add a ton more options and strats and i-frames during charging sounds amazing.
I wonder how many Gundams we'll be having once Phantom is out considering it basically has Funnels.

Sega said they are looking into adding Type 0 craft pas as different pas from the original ones, I wonder if will try to do something like Phantom's shift pa system, though for some weapons tapping or even holding the weapon action button for an arbitrary time already has an important function.

[Anon_Fire]

How is Phantom gonna work on the traditional 2-button configuration?

[XrosBlader821]

It wont. There is no point in playing 2 button Layout

[ArcaneTechs]

How is Phantom gonna work on the traditional 2-button configuration?

its time to switch to the 3 button layout man, its gonna feel uncomfortable for a day or two but you'll get used to it. reason being is that you're going to be using Shift Actions a lot while playing Ph so having that Shift Action key usable at anytime is going to be very much needed. Swapping over to the 3 button layout isn't as horrible as you think and opens up for better flow of play. Definitely give it a go during this week before Ph is out and get a feel for it so its not as uncomfortable that day

[GHNeko]

Is Phantom (or hero for that matter) even playable with 2 button?

[XrosBlader821]

Is Phantom (or hero for that matter) even playable with 2 button?

I don't think any class is playable with 2 buttom layout nowaday. You'd always need to drop 1 PA off your Weapon Pallette and made an extra pallette when you wanna spam 1 specific PA. Even tech classes, who use a similar key modifier to 3 button layout, lose out on one Tech slot for no good reason.

[Dugs]

So I'm going to say yes it will, because saying no class is playable with 2 button makes me not take their word with much salt.

It'll be easier sure, no doubt about that. But until it comes out or Sega says it won't work... well, I'll believe that it'll still function.

[ArcaneTechs]

So I'm going to say yes it will, because saying no class is playable with 2 button makes me not take their word with much salt.

It'll be easier sure, no doubt about that. But until it comes out or Sega says it won't work... well, I'll believe that it'll still function.

Gimping yourself gotcha, that extra unneeded challenge bbb

[XrosBlader821]

So I'm going to say yes it will, because saying no class is playable with 2 button makes me not take their word with much salt.

It'll be easier sure, no doubt about that. But until it comes out or Sega says it won't work... well, I'll believe that it'll still function.

Classes are balanced with the 3-Button type in mind since Episode 4. The amount of PA a class gets is specifically balanced around the amount you can set up in 3-Button type. Using 2-Button type forces you to essentially cut of a limb of your metaphorical body. For Phantom its twice as much because each Pa doubles thanks to the Shift Action gimmick. If you think this system is so playable I'd gladly watch you clear solo XQ, Solo UQ or how you perform in Endless quests.

Also fyi the only reason Sega hasn't outright deleted 2-Button type is because Vita can't handle 3-Button type due to a lack of buttons (thanks Sony for giving us a shitty back touch-pad instead).

[GHNeko]

So I'm going to say yes it will, because saying no class is playable with 2 button makes me not take their word with much salt.

It'll be easier sure, no doubt about that. But until it comes out or Sega says it won't work... well, I'll believe that it'll still function.

It honestly sounds like you're trying to be contrarian for the sake of it. I'm not sure what is to be gained from this type of mindset with this topic matter.

[Dugs]

I dunno, calling bullshit on someone saying a class is unplayable doesn't seem contrarian.

Gee whiz, I can't move with this two button set up, my attacks don't work and nothing loads! Sure is unplayable!

OF COURSE I'M SAYING THAT'S NOT TRUE!

OF COURSE IT'S FUCKING PLAYABLE!

[TheFanaticViper]

I dunno, calling bullshit on someone saying a class is unplayable doesn't seem contrarian.

Gee whiz, I can't move with this two button set up, my attacks don't work and nothing loads! Sure is unplayable!

OF COURSE I'M SAYING THAT'S NOT TRUE!

OF COURSE IT'S FUCKING PLAYABLE!

ofc "not playable" is not the right word, but 3 buttons is just so much better. It took me times to switch to 3 buttons so i don't judge, but you should learn it with Phantom, it's easier with a class you never played before (it's what i did with Hero).

[XrosBlader821]

I dunno, calling bullshit on someone saying a class is unplayable doesn't seem contrarian.

Gee whiz, I can't move with this two button set up, my attacks don't work and nothing loads! Sure is unplayable!

OF COURSE I'M SAYING THAT'S NOT TRUE!

OF COURSE IT'S FUCKING PLAYABLE!

Ok so rather than igniring my point, pls switch to 2 button type and play any relevant endgame solo content and see how playable it is

This talking out of your ass is specifically why people assume youre a contrarian just fir the sake of it.

[Endler]

Obviously 14 and 15* weapons are going to be the best for Phantom, but is anyone else thinking how Vades Zapper will interact with Phantom's basic attacks?

https://pso2.arks-visiphone.com/wiki/Vades_Zapper

I can't find any youtube videos on the weapon, anyone actually have this thing? It's coming back for the Easter CO's and I'm planning on getting one for the Phantom level-cap release and S2 skill anyway.

[XrosBlader821]

Obviously 14 and 15* weapons are going to be the best for Phantom, but is anyone else thinking how Vades Zapper will interact with Phantom's basic attacks?

https://pso2.arks-visiphone.com/wiki/Vades_Zapper

I can't find any youtube videos on the weapon, anyone actually have this thing? It's coming back for the Easter CO's and I'm planning on getting one for the Phantom level-cap release and S2 skill anyway.

It probably would work but iirc Phantoms main gameplay mechanic of building up markers and detonating them requires the use of Techs and PA so it probably wont be anywhere near what's viable to be considered a niche.

[Endler]

It probably would work but iirc Phantoms main gameplay mechanic of building up markers and detonating them requires the use of Techs and PA so it probably wont be anywhere near what's viable to be considered a niche.

There's nothing preventing you from building markers via basic attacks. Building markers from PAs and Techs is in addition to normals, not the only way to build them.

I doubt that the waves shot from the potential will build markers themselves, but that's not really the point. Phantoms receive huge bonuses to ranged attacks from their tree that should all affect the waves. This could potentially lead to some pretty crazy damage. I found a video of a Te/Hu using a wand with the same potential, and it seemed to hit pretty hard even with the minimal multipliers to ranged attacks.

It's all speculation until the patch drops. There's always the chance that the rod remains FO only for some reason, but I hope it doesn't come to that.

[Dugs]

Ok so rather than igniring my point, pls switch to 2 button type and play any relevant endgame solo content and see how playable it is

This talking out of your ass is specifically why people assume youre a contrarian just fir the sake of it.

I mean, you're the one talking out of your ass saying it's unplayable.

But sure.

The answer is going to be perfectly fine btw.

[ArcaneTechs]

I mean, you're the one talking out of your ass saying it's unplayable.

But sure.

The answer is going to be perfectly fine btw.

its not unplayable but your overall DPS is going to be in the gutter because of how 2 button layout works and how Ph requires weapon actions to be constantly used.

By all means, prove is all wrong, clear the solo XQ with Phantom with 2 button layout and show us just how good you are (if your time is beyond 10mins, welp you showed us and the time consists from starting the first gate upon killing Elder, not the time that counts during each stage either). Have some grace time and post a vid or something a week after the class is out. I mean it's really the only way to prove us wrong with superior 2 button skills you have

[Ceresa]

its not unplayable but your overall DPS is going to be in the gutter because of how 2 button layout works and how Ph requires weapon actions to be constantly used.

By all means, prove is all wrong, clear the solo XQ with Phantom with 2 button layout and show us just how good you are (if your time is beyond 10mins, welp you showed us and the time consists from starting the first gate upon killing Elder, not the time that counts during each stage either). Have some grace time and post a vid or something a week after the class is out. I mean it's really the only way to prove us wrong with superior 2 button skills you have

Not that I endorse 2 button or anything but unless they drastically changed it in the 3 or so years since I used it, weapon action on 2 button was always available on the palette shift button (except for rod/talis/wand).

So phantom would have access to 6 of its 12 PAs on its 6 weapon slots, plus I guess you could put the other 6 on the subpalette once ep6 hits. Sounds miserable though.

[ArcaneTechs]

Not that I endorse 2 button or anything but unless they drastically changed it in the 3 or so years since I used it, weapon action on 2 button was always available on the palette shift button (except for rod/talis/wand).

So phantom would have access to 6 of its 12 PAs on its 6 weapon slots, plus I guess you could put the other 6 on the subpalette once ep6 hits. Sounds miserable though.

ah ya i forgot about the subpallete fix which will give him leeway in his playstyle soon which makes my challenge sorta pointless because the only alternative would be to NOT use the subpallete for those and stick to the old ways but I know he wont do it. poked a hole in my bubble lol

[XrosBlader821]

I mean, you're the one talking out of your ass saying it's unplayable.

But sure.

The answer is going to be perfectly fine btw.

Again, don't ignore my point. You're the one talking out of your ass because you bring nothing to the discussion but assumptions. I say how the system is too restrictive nowadays out of experience and how you basically can't use it in solo endgame content due to those limitations. Do you not understand this? Whenever I use the word unplayable or not viable is just semantics so stop obsessing over it.

[NightlightPro]

is Phrase Decay actually worth it?

[Ransu]

is Phrase Decay actually worth it?

Considering main class Phantom can apply Jellen, that SEGA confirmed Basilis will drop again in UH and that Phrase Decay is 5% more damage it probably is worth affixing if you have it.

[Dugs]

Again, don't ignore my point. You're the one talking out of your ass because you bring nothing to the discussion but assumptions. I say how the system is too restrictive nowadays out of experience and how you basically can't use it in solo endgame content due to those limitations. Do you not understand this? Whenever I use the word unplayable or not viable is just semantics so stop obsessing over it.



You did it again too.

"You can't use it in solo endgame."

Yes. You. Fucking. Can.

Are you so miserable at this game that you cannot manage to do that? Do you suck so much that you need free flowing PA's to even begin to play at a decent level?

Because all I see here are people whining and bitching about this horrendous 2 button system. Like it's the sole reason anyone could ever do horribly. Which is most certainly not the case, 2 or 3 button isn't going to change someone being bad at their core!

And you're getting so amazingly worked up about it, which is getting me worked up. Because you can't seem to handle someone using 2 button? WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH? Just going by what you say, 2 button is better off deleted and fuck anyone who likes it.

Also my system isn't the greatest, so that video ain't happening. I know what responses saying THAT will get, so no need to say anything.

[ArcaneTechs]

So don't be a hyperbolic piece of shit.

You did it again too.

"You can't use it in solo endgame."

Yes. You. Fucking. Can.

Are you so miserable at this game that you cannot manage to do that? Do you suck so much that you need free flowing PA's to even begin to play at a decent level?

Because all I see here are people whining and bitching about this horrendous 2 button system. Like it's the sole reason anyone could ever do horribly. Which is most certainly not the case, 2 or 3 button isn't going to change someone being bad at their core!

And you're getting so amazingly worked up about it, which is getting me worked up. Because you can't seem to handle someone using 2 button? WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH? Just going by what you say, 2 button is better off deleted and fuck anyone who likes it.

Also my system isn't the greatest, so that video ain't happening. I know what responses saying THAT will get, so no need to say anything.

woah boy if this isn't bait then idk what is

>download OBS
>turn shaders off etc to record fine
>post on youtube
>done

[Sriracha X]

So don't be a hyperbolic piece of shit.

You did it again too.

"You can't use it in solo endgame."

Yes. You. Fucking. Can.

Are you so miserable at this game that you cannot manage to do that? Do you suck so much that you need free flowing PA's to even begin to play at a decent level?

Because all I see here are people whining and bitching about this horrendous 2 button system. Like it's the sole reason anyone could ever do horribly. Which is most certainly not the case, 2 or 3 button isn't going to change someone being bad at their core!

And you're getting so amazingly worked up about it, which is getting me worked up. Because you can't seem to handle someone using 2 button? WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH? Just going by what you say, 2 button is better off deleted and fuck anyone who likes it.

Also my system isn't the greatest, so that video ain't happening. I know what responses saying THAT will get, so no need to say anything.

Look man, 2-button really is shit. We're not talking out of our asses here. Like when they say using 2-button is unplayable doesn't mean that you literally can't do solo endgame content with it, but the DPS loss/flow restriction you have might as well make it unplayable. To attempt that stuff with 2-button is what I'd consider masochism or doing meme runs. Back then you pretty much had to have weapon palettes full of a single PA except for palettes designed for things like Vol Graptor/Banish combos or combos that take advantage of TAJA. Switching between palettes has a delay before you can use PAs/weapon actions after the swap, and you have to deal with latency if your palette swap also involves changing to a different weapon. That stuff straight up leads to a DPS loss (and exposes you to taking damage because you can't use weapon actions like Guard/S-Roll, etc. until you've fully swapped). Yes, we managed back in the day, but that was then.

Shoot, I remember my GU/HU setup back in the late EP2 days up to the update they did towards the end of EP3. It was something like

Palette 1: Satellite Aim x3 (main DPS)
Palette 2: Dead Approach x3 (short-distance approach)
Palette 3: Grim Barrage x3 (long-distance approach)
Palette 4: Elder Rebellion x3 (long-distance chain pops; after Infinite Fire nerf)
Palette 5: Aerial Shooting x3 (to gain air)
Palette 6: Shift Period x3 (mobbing)

After 3-button came out, I could condense most things like this (every palette has normal attack and weapon action on it):

Palette 1: Satellite Aim, Dead Approach, Infinite Fire Type-0, Aerial Shooting (main DPS)
Palette 2: Satellite Aim, Dead Approach, Reverse Tap, Shift Period (mobbing, until S-Roll Arts was a thing)
Palette 3: Satellite Aim, Grim Barrage, Infinite Fire Type-0, Aerial Shooting (long-distance chase)
Palette 4: Satellite Aim, Elder Rebellion, Infinite Fire Type-0, Aerial Shooting (long-distance chain pops)
Palette 5: Rifle swap
Palette 6: Shifta JB swap

Now I could keep my most-used PAs in a common spot but now I could use other PAs that I need to without bothering with the delay from swapping to another palette. Also, because of the palettes freed up, I have space to swap to a rifle for niche situations like shooting Deus when it's too far away for phase 2/3 and also use those JBs that have Shifta built-in.

So yeah, when people say they are using 2-button, I have to ask "why?". For the life of me I cannot think of a single reason why someone would stick with 2-button, outside of familiarity/refusal of change, when there are literally no advantages to sticking with an outdated system. For example, with Hero, Phantom, and the future successor class, why would you want to split up your PAs across palettes when you could fit all PAs for a weapon onto a single palette? For you to convince us that it is still viable (my definition of viable is clearing solo endgame content like XQ Phantoms, UQ Persona Depth 100+, Endless Quest, solo trigger Persona, etc. without cheesing, at a time consistent with other people using 3-button), you're gonna have to provide receipts. Looks like that's not gonna happen with you though, given that you said your system can't handle recording video.

[XrosBlader821]

So don't be a hyperbolic piece of shit.

You did it again too.

"You can't use it in solo endgame."

Yes. You. Fucking. Can.

Are you so miserable at this game that you cannot manage to do that? Do you suck so much that you need free flowing PA's to even begin to play at a decent level?

Because all I see here are people whining and bitching about this horrendous 2 button system. Like it's the sole reason anyone could ever do horribly. Which is most certainly not the case, 2 or 3 button isn't going to change someone being bad at their core!

And you're getting so amazingly worked up about it, which is getting me worked up. Because you can't seem to handle someone using 2 button? WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH? Just going by what you say, 2 button is better off deleted and fuck anyone who likes it.

Also my system isn't the greatest, so that video ain't happening. I know what responses saying THAT will get, so no need to say anything.

It's funny you assume i'm getting worked up about it when I'm just glad people who used that shit outdated control scheme, that was made with Vita limitations in mind, won't be able to be carried to expert matching anymore.

[Dugs]

This entire argument started with "2 button is unplayable" "no it isn't" "yes it is, prove otherwise"

I'm not going to go do 99 depths of Masquerade, I have other shit to do. It's not like his moveset is hard, I just don't want to bother doing all that.

[ArcaneTechs]

This entire argument started with "2 button is unplayable" "no it isn't" "yes it is, prove otherwise"

I'm not going to go do 99 depths of Masquerade, I have other shit to do. It's not like his moveset is hard, I just don't want to bother doing all that.

you like took the words "unplayable" too serious and exploded into all this anger, now show me solo XQ play

[Dark Mits]

Let's not forget that when we usually say "unplayable" we mean "10% or less performing than optimal".

The exact same problem exists with the word "unviable". If the optimal meta build deals, for example, 100000dps, then anything that deals 95000 or less is "unviable". This is simply a misuse of the word which has been established since at least the 90s (and possibly even earlier).

[SteveCZ]

Just in case somebody missed it, this video contains comprehensive list of Phantom moves. It starts at 36:55 if this doesn't load from there.


https://youtu.be/U1Wf_ifjUkM?t=2215

[KaizoKage]

Just in case somebody missed it, this video contains comprehensive list of Phantom moves. It starts at 36:55 if this doesn't load from there.


https://youtu.be/U1Wf_ifjUkM?t=2215

So basically Phantom shift + PA = Diff PA
Its like the opposite of Bouncer to me which is PA + weapon action = Diff PA

[SteveCZ]

So basically Phantom shift + PA = Diff PA
Its like the opposite of Bouncer to me which is PA + weapon action = Diff PA

Yes. PSUBlog has already summarized how some things work here (http://www.bumped.org/psublog/pso2-episode-6-marks-the-arrival-of-phantom/) for more info.

[Dark Mits]

This is not a question specific for Phantom, but it is somewhat tangent...

Will we have enough DEX as Main Class 90 / Ph 1 to equip Lightstream? Or will we have to use the inferior equipment that we placed on our support partners and forgot about? And at what level would we need to raise Phantom as sub to reach 545 / 550 DEX?

[XrosBlader821]

This is not a question specific for Phantom, but it is somewhat tangent...

Will we have enough DEX as Main Class 90 / Ph 1 to equip Lightstream? Or will we have to use the inferior equipment that we placed on our support partners and forgot about? And at what level would we need to raise Phantom as sub to reach 545 / 550 DEX?

Testing it on Te/Fi I need to be between 83~85 in order to equip Lightstream. With Dex mag we're looking at level 31 requirement. Wouldn't surprise me if the same applied to Ph however Hr gets Dex at a higher rate than Te/Fi so it might not be this critical.

[KaizoKage]

Skill simulator updated with Phantom tree
https://arks-layer.com/skillsim/skillcalc.php

Dang, we lack so much SP, I need another tree for the sole purpose of it being a sub tree

[XrosBlader821]

still no skill values. I need to know these Tech short Charge numbers

[final_attack]

Hmm ... looking at skill tree simulator .... depends on how much the increase is, might be able to fit both main and sub using 1 tree ..... hmm ...

[ShinMaruku]

Depending on the notations I might do fo/phantom maybe.
But the main stuff looks nice.

[GHNeko]

Depending on the notations I might do fo/phantom maybe.
But the main stuff looks nice.

FoPh is solid I think.

For Phantom Short Charge; PP cost reduction is -30%, and the charge time reduction is around 30-50%. Not too sure on that one since the demo footage was 30FPS and had a teammate count frames and shit. Power reduction I predict will be no more than 5% since I have the feeling that Sega doesnt want to kill tech damage on Ph while making it so that all 3 weapons can use techs aside from typical support shit. With the right setup, you can get some nutso performance out of FoPh even if the raw damage is below expectations.

[cheapgunner]

Should have bought a new mag for my Fo main to play Ph main but idunno atm. Gonna have some fun experimenting with this class.

[ArcaneTechs]

FoPh is solid I think.

For Phantom Short Charge; PP cost reduction is -30%, and the charge time reduction is around 30-50%. Not too sure on that one since the demo footage was 30FPS and had a teammate count frames and shit. Power reduction I predict will be no more than 5% since I have the feeling that Sega doesnt want to kill tech damage on Ph while making it so that all 3 weapons can use techs aside from typical support shit. With the right setup, you can get some nutso performance out of FoPh even if the raw damage is below expectations.

I'm actually willing to try out Fo/Ph but im going to miss what TE tree offers so idk for sure yet if I wanna suffer with 1min buffs as a FO. From what I'm aware not a lot of classes will be good with Ph sub but still niche which is more your territory and not mine. Te/Ph seems cool too but I want to keep that Hu bulk

[ShinMaruku]

I was also thinking Te/Ph as well too. As long as my combined techs can still cook :)

[GHNeko]

I'm actually willing to try out Fo/Ph but im going to miss what TE tree offers so idk for sure yet if I wanna suffer with 1min buffs as a FO. From what I'm aware not a lot of classes will be good with Ph sub but still niche which is more your territory and not mine. Te/Ph seems cool too but I want to keep that Hu bulk

The loadout I was gonna run on FoPh was gonna give me at least 161.59% PP Regen, which is a decent chunk over moving FoTe, but ofc doesn't hold a candle to standing FoTe. However, PP cost reduction was looking to be approx 42.145%, so in regards to PP management, shouldn't be an issue. 1 minute buffs are lame, but if you're willing you can grab a Support Extension Atlas if it matters that much to ya. :wacko:

Charge time reduction being around 30-50% means that recasting buffs shouldnt be that much of a hassle either so I think it'll work out. PPC on demand via Ring will help out a lot since with PFSC, charge time reduction should be around...72% ~ 80%.

Multi wise, it'll be weaker than FoTe, so hopefully the DPS from reductions makes up for it; at least enough to put them on even grounds or something close to it.

[Reilet]

Make a PP reduction atra :)

With red/white flash, skilled reduction/ nature’s reduction, caustic (the one that reduces for evey 300k dmg), multi-colored spectrum.

Sure, you lose 10% damage (7% if red flash and 15%? Natural pp recovery with white), but you get 49% pp reduction (44% with skilled and 62% if it procs) along with whatever else you might get from phantom sub

[ShinMaruku]

Hopefully we can test some things. Now to grind rods... >_>

[XrosBlader821]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/513439853606600718/570520941218627585/unknown.png

I need to make new DPS calculation later but this is a much higher damage nerf than expected.

[Kondibon]

https://i.imgur.com/7QuD1Ou.png

[SteveCZ]

So far for me this Phantom shift thing feels like playing Double Saber, really.


https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/513439853606600718/570520941218627585/unknown.png

I need to make new DPS calculation later but this is a much higher damage nerf than expected.

They don't want to Force you, man. :lol:

We'll find out.

[XrosBlader821]

Crit Stream
Damage caps slightly below 200pp
100pp= 20% crit rate
200pp= 40% crit rate
300pp= 60% crit rate