31º PSO2 STATION! (From Phantasy Star Thanks Festa 2019 - Port Messe Nagoya / Nagoya) [Archive]

Maulcun

Mar 31, 2019, 01:17 AM

http://pso2.jp/players/news/image/sysupload/element/info/20160915/pso2station.jpg

https://twitter.com/sega_pso2/status/1112235014832316416

Date: April 21, 2019
Time: 13:00 ~ 18:30 JST

Automatic conversion time : https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=31%C2%BA+PSO2+STATION%21+%28Fro m+Phantasy+Star+Thanks+Festa+2019+-+Port+Messe+Nagoya+%2F+Nagoya%29&iso=20190421T13&p1=248&ah=5&am=30

Official Link Nico Nico: https://live2.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv318764879
Official Link PSCP TV:Coming soon
[*Official Link YouTube : Coming soon
Fan Link YouTube 1 : Coming soon
Fan Link YouTube 2 : Coming soon
Fan Link Twitch 1 : https://go.twitch.tv/silentsakia/
Fan Link Twitch 2 : https://www.twitch.tv/arekore510
Official Link Twitch : Coming soon
Fan Link Mixer 1: Coming soon
Fan Link Nico Nico 1: Coming soon
Fan Link Nico Nico 2 : Coming soon
Fan Link Facebook : Coming soon

Important Topics

PSO2 Cosplay Show - Nagoya
Information about EPISODE 6 April Update.
Information about May updates.
Information about PSO2es updates.
Information about Idola Phantasy Star Saga updates.
Mini ARKS PSO2 Live
Amano Nayuki and Mitsuhiro Ichiki will appear as special MCs.
Arks Battle Tournament 2019 Nagoya Qualifier.
A Mini Live stage (Finishing the Event).

ArcaneTechs

Mar 31, 2019, 01:21 AM

hopefully they talk about the balancing during this stream

Flaoc

Mar 31, 2019, 01:23 AM

when is the next arks live since that may talk about the balancing as well

エリュシオン

Apr 20, 2019, 08:33 PM

I hope they show how UH is going to be structured, will it just be difficulty selection added to each of the Lilipa free fields?

I feel it would be kinda dumb to give each free field on Lilipa UH because that would mean you would split the players up. If they do this I also feel they may split up where certain weapons drop just like how AQs, not every revolucio dropped in each field. Although I would like to see Free field guruguru be the case, I also feel it could be a TA format like quest where you travel through each area of Lilipa to get to the end.
If that's the case then I probably would get tired of it seeing as that's what made UQ Amd boring and each run was just hoping you'd get a fast cycle just to clear faster.

They also talked about Orbit weapons in UH which I think that's just those recolored Orbit that have been in the game files since Ep3. I wonder if it will still just be a PP battery. With Spirited Response 1 and 2, I see it just kinda being redundant. I guess if you can put SR1&2 on it, it would literally be instant PP recovery. Hope they do something interesting with the potential though.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 20, 2019, 09:14 PM

I hope they show how UH is going to be structured, will it just be difficulty selection added to each of the Lilipa free fields?

I feel it would be kinda dumb to give each free field on Lilipa UH because that would mean you would split the players up. If they do this I also feel they may split up where certain weapons drop just like how AQs, not every revolucio dropped in each field. Although I would like to see Free field guruguru be the case, I also feel it could be a TA format like quest where you travel through each area of Lilipa to get to the end.
If that's the case then I probably would get tired of it seeing as that's what made UQ Amd boring and each run was just hoping you'd get a fast cycle just to clear faster.

They only have so many formats to run new content that you haven't already seen, what do you exactly want? I mean if you want the format we had for the what was it Revelry? (random 4x areas) then I guess it works??

They also talked about Orbit weapons in UH which I think that's just those recolored Orbit that have been in the game files since Ep3. I wonder if it will still just be a PP battery. With Spirited Response 1 and 2, I see it just kinda being redundant. I guess if you can put SR1&2 on it, it would literally be instant PP recovery. Hope they do something interesting with the potential though.

but thats literally what its going to be but with SSA support and higher stats and they'll do the exact same thing with Basilis

Tyreek

Apr 20, 2019, 09:56 PM

With photon recolor to boot I hope. Also where can I find those? Are they available in the icon dump?

エリュシオン

Apr 20, 2019, 10:01 PM

They only have so many formats to run new content that you haven't already seen, what do you exactly want? I mean if you want the format we had for the what was it Revelry? (random 4x areas) then I guess it works??

Ah I apologize for structuring the paragraph poorly. I am in favor of it being running around the quest field like a free exploration. Players can hop in and hop out of a group without ruining the flow of your MPA and with random E-trials popping up, It doesn't feel as repetitive as knowing exactly what to do once you've reached the teleporter.

I see they are showing all 3 Lilipa fields so I feel if each gets UH, you would be splitting up people by where they want to be unless, like XH fields, they release them 1 week apart from each other and people go to the newest one released (I do not see this being the case).
TA format is the last option, where I believe is the most likely one to be done. You go through 3 Areas and reach the end, everything is scripted and you run it like Revelry and EQs. Although it is the one I think is most likely to be done, it is not the one I exactly am in favor of.

Any one that is chosen is fine. I'm not expecting them to go too crazy on how it is structured, I am just interested by the options that they can make.

but thats literally what its going to be but with SSA support and higher stats and they'll do the exact same thing with Basilis
I guess I shouldn't really expect too much alteration from the original weapon. I guess an almost instant PP Recovery battery would be very useful.

エリュシオン

Apr 20, 2019, 10:04 PM

With photon recolor to boot I hope. Also where can I find those? Are they available in the icon dump?

Ah it's been a couple of years since I last saw them, I remember saving the file but, I've seem to have lost it. I do remember White and Red being a color variation and another that was White and Light blue. My memory may be wrong, I apologize.

the_importer_

Apr 21, 2019, 12:54 AM

Anduril

Apr 21, 2019, 01:09 AM

Pusoni Anime Blu-ray / DVD

Pusoni Anime will be compiled into a Blu-Ray / DVD.
Festa Sales Date: July 14th at Kobe’s PS Fan Festa
General Sales Date: To Be Announced
Price: Blu-Ray: 5000 Yen / DVD: 4000 Yen
Item Codes are also included.

Called it! Let's hope we get a localized version like we did for the first Anime.

That's about 12 weeks out, and we are on episode 15, so looks like it might end in the 24~26 episode range, unless the Blu-Ray will be a special early-bird treat for those who buy it at the Festa with the yet to be aired at the time episodes.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 01:20 AM

quickasker

Apr 21, 2019, 01:54 AM

What i don't get it is why sega didn't limit the expert requirement per char+class, skipping sphaget code aside:
example:
- It's too easy to clear Mother/Deus trigger on S-rank with Fo
Meanwhile, Hu/Fi with sword will have slight difficulty differences during deus stage (compared to Fo-- hurrr muh ranged!)

the problem is just going to repeated all over again. You unlock title with easiest combination as possible, then switch to half-assed build for leveling purpose with expert mode ticked. there you go, expert mode crying all over because 20min black maggy. your own fault for running in pug but ok.

--
make expert mode available if certain character with class combination already passed both requirement, if on same char but with different class combination, the expert mode will forfeit unless you go back and finish the same requirement.

Shinamori

Apr 21, 2019, 02:02 AM

I'm not gonna touch that requirements.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 02:15 AM

I'm not gonna touch that requirements.

the new ones? theyre not remotely hard to do

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 02:26 AM

NEW EXPERT REQ, EZ MODE ADDITION:

-S Rank Mother/Deus Trigger
-Clear the solo version of the last XQ that was added (the one with Elder Omega at the end)

I look forward to casuals crying the first week about not being able to get past Deus followed by cheese tactics. They really should have made it harder, terrible

Here we go again lol. Its too hard someone makes noise. Its too easy makes noise. Are they ever gonna go middle ground zzz.

Clear the solo version of the last XQ that was added (the one with Elder Omega at the end) -> let the complaining begin

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 02:28 AM

the new Requirements are a joke especially if Sega finally releases these S1~3 SSA that have been sitting in the database for almost a year:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/530252263415873546/569419090289229834/unknown.png

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 02:28 AM

Here we go again lol. Its too hard someone makes noise. Its too easy makes noise. Are they ever gonna go middle ground zzz.

Clear the solo version of the last XQ that was added (the one with Elder Omega at the end) -> let the complaining begin

there will never be a middle ground in an MMO and if there is, someone is bound to complain
except this isn't a middle ground despite me complaining

the new Requirements are a joke especially if Sega finally releases these S1~3 SSA that have been sitting in the database for almost a year:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/530252263415873546/569419090289229834/unknown.png

if I can sell these then the better

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 02:34 AM

there will never be a middle ground in an MMO and if there is, someone is bound to complain
except this isn't a middle ground despite me complaining

if I can sell these then the better

As usual make everyone clear the hard one with the current classes. Then when a new class releases , that new class down the road somehow overpowers this once hard quest just in time for them to make another tough quest

KaizoKage

Apr 21, 2019, 02:52 AM

so.... anyone got the video for Ph PAs? I only saw a bit on rifle's PA and missed the rest

Shinamori

Apr 21, 2019, 02:55 AM

the new ones? theyre not remotely hard to do

It took me 11 mins to just beat mother. I don't really don't see who these are "easy".

Tyreek

Apr 21, 2019, 02:56 AM

Looks like the new Orbit series was just shown off in EP6 part 2 update. Sounds like they're saying Mirage series.

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 03:02 AM

apparently only 12% of all players currently meet the requirements of new Expert matching.

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 03:09 AM

apparently only 12% of all players currently meet the requirements of new Expert matching.

Only 12%. Well in any case I am passing on this new expert requirements though. Will be here for phatom and EP6 though

anyone else passing up on these requirements ??

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 03:19 AM

Only 12%. Well in any case I am passing on this new expert requirements though. Will be here for phatom and EP6 though

anyone else passing up on these requirements ??

I've got a few friends already whining about the new Req and using any info they find to justify this req being too hard, come the hell on this solo XQ isn't impossible like everyone is thinking.

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 03:21 AM

I've got a few friends already whining about the new Req and using any info they find to justify this req being too hard, come the hell on this solo XQ isn't impossible like everyone is thinking.

well in any case we know that this isn't going to go away any time soon so yeah. Maybe sometime down the road we might be able to clear it and by we I mean everyone. Besides expert or no expert people die in the EQ's everyone now and then lol.

edit: looking at the posts above and below me. Its clear that the war on hardcore vs causal's is going to start again lol. Like I said above. Give it time everyone will be able to clear it maybe not now but sometime soon

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 03:22 AM

I managed the Solo XQ on Hero, Su/Fi and Hu/Su. It's cheesable as f*ck. also my first ever attempt as Mama-Desu Trigger ended with a 17 min S-Rank clear on Te/Fi

Shit's not that hard ppl.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 03:35 AM

well in any case we know that this isn't going to go away any time soon so yeah. Maybe sometime down the road we might be able to clear it and by we I mean everyone. Besides expert or no expert people die in the EQ's everyone now and then lol.

edit: looking at the posts above and below me. Its clear that the war on hardcore vs causal's is going to start again lol. Like I said above. Give it time everyone will be able to clear it maybe not now but sometime soon

It's never going to go away, its time some people learn the game even a LITTLE bit more and clear this but i'm looking forward to a casual ranting and seething at me because "youre such an elitist scumbag, we all cant be as good as you! 24/7 this game, I GOT A LIFE" etc etc whatever man, enjoy non expert since everyone gets like this every new Expert Req update.

Interval 4 on Endless 1 should have been the minimum req honestly

I managed the Solo XQ on Hero, Su/Fi and Hu/Su. It's cheesable as f*ck. also my first ever attempt as Mama-Desu Trigger ended with a 17 min S-Rank clear on Te/Fi

Shit's not that hard ppl.

BUT WE CANT BE AS GOOD AS YOU EVEN WITH CHEESE CLASSES REEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!

Agastya

Apr 21, 2019, 03:47 AM

I managed the Solo XQ on Hero, Su/Fi and Hu/Su.

what did you do for phaleg? i imagine her damage floor would eat most pets alive

EspeonageTieler

Apr 21, 2019, 03:49 AM

What's the big deal with expert and non-expert anyway? I pretty much only play solo but I never run into any problems during EQs or anything when I do join pugs.

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 03:50 AM

It's never going to go away, its time some people learn the game even a LITTLE bit more and clear this but i'm looking forward to a casual ranting and seething at me because "youre such an elitist scumbag, we all cant be as good as you! 24/7 this game, I GOT A LIFE" etc etc whatever man, enjoy non expert since everyone gets like this every new Expert Req update.

What's with expert req's anyways . Other than filtering causals from the hardcore bunch which is all I can get from expert req's. I mean people still die in EQ's anyways expert or no expert title

The only use for expert req's I can think of would be for designing future content based on the result of number of hardcore's to casual players

Poyonche

Apr 21, 2019, 04:05 AM

God no, the new requirement is absolutely awful I will never be able to--
Oh wait I already got the titles, thanks Su/Fi. :wacko:

NightlightPro

Apr 21, 2019, 04:06 AM

I know some1 who can't even beat phaleg on ep4 or Masquerade lv 1 but they have the current expert match req.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 04:14 AM

What's with expert req's anyways . Other than filtering causals from the hardcore bunch which is all I can get from expert req's. I mean people still die in EQ's anyways expert or no expert title

The only use for expert req's I can think of would be for designing future content based on the result of number of hardcore's to casual players

it's not about dying but clearing and farming content efficiently because as it is now a days people don't like farming but people wanna act like farming with casuals won't take twice as long or whatever. Example being Persona Raid, despite how RNG it is I would like to get 3-5 runs an EQ done (not anymore since I have my units) but running no expert meant a difference from 5-8min runs to 12-20min runs thus less runs total and less loot gained for the time spent doing this. Theres plenty of examples but I'm not going to list them all off, in fact another recent one was Ama UQ revival again where good mpa's consistently landed 5-6min runs and the bad crappy players who you know weren't trying forcing runs to turn into 8-10mins.

We all see this Expert Block differently while yes I see it as a filter but I also see it as a way to improve ones play skills at this game (unless they cheesed it then well they learned nothing)

It doesn't matter if you die in Expert matching, not dying isn't by any means a true test of strength, mobs, bosses and random projectiles etc can instant drop you, doesn't mean youre a bad player

I know some1 who can't even beat phaleg on ep4 or even Masquerade lv 1 but they have the current expert match req.

you'd be surprised at how many people are in this spot my man

God no, the new requirement is absolutely awful I will never be able to--
Oh wait I already got the titles, thanks Su/Fi. :wacko:

you got me laughing at this

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 04:23 AM

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 04:30 AM

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 04:33 AM

whats that smell? smells like casuals . You act as though being good at a game isn't fun or something.

lol PS PvP is like dead 90% of the time, I can't take it serious and its boring to watch when they stream it. The thing is PvP hasn't really been good in the past PS entries and while they're giving it more attention, its just benefiting those who are actually wanting to play it and compete for that sweet 15k AC. I mean go look at the PvP server population, tell me that isn't a sign that people don't care for it outside free SG placements

More runs, more chances at loot. Time factoring in the amount of runs you can do so you figure the rest out

You act as though being good at a game isn't fun or something.
Answer: Its ok to be good and have fun but at the end of the day a reality question below

Reality question: After putting all this hard work in and other having your fill of fun what else do you get in return ?? (remember this a non e-sports game)

Ransu

Apr 21, 2019, 04:37 AM

You act as though being good at a game isn't fun or something.
Answer: Its ok to be good and have fun but at the end of the day a reality question below

Reality question: After putting all this hard work in and other having your fill of fun what else do you get in return ?? (remember this a non e-sports game)

Satisfaction and a sense of achievement. People set their own goals for stuff and it feels good to complete them.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 04:40 AM

You act as though being good at a game isn't fun or something.
Answer: Its ok to be good and have fun but at the end of the day a reality question below

Reality question: After putting all this hard work in and other having your fill of fun what else do you get in return ?? (remember this a non e-sports game)
this guy below gets it

Satisfaction and a sense of achievement. People set their own goals for stuff and it feels good to complete them.

NightlightPro

Apr 21, 2019, 04:41 AM

Turns out most people have unaffixed gear and they can't do crap alone.

I got solo pd/deus s rank and solo XQ too

and my gear is 180 atk on units and 200 atk on weapons

yes Im casual

and I'm just trying to say because it's thanks to my good gear

???

I'm just saying because I couldn't get s rank until i affixed my gear propely

the same for the solo XQ clear

EspeonageTieler

Apr 21, 2019, 04:46 AM

You act as though being good at a game isn't fun or something.
Answer: Its ok to be good and have fun but at the end of the day a reality question below

Reality question: After putting all this hard work in and other having your fill of fun what else do you get in return ?? (remember this a non e-sports game)

Just because something isn't an esport doesn't mean you can't get a sense of satisfaction from beating something challenging. And often times anyway PVE games can be alot harder than PVP ones it's irrelevant not everyone needs to make money off of a hobby.

Zephyrion

Apr 21, 2019, 04:47 AM

From your post I read two things, SKILL and TIME to clear.

Really Skill ? LOL ??? I would like to have fun too but calling it skill for something that is nothing more than what is supposed to be fun and pass the time is just odd.
maybe that's just me.

The only real skill I see would be the pvp arena cause you get to fight e-sports style.
Again probably just me

As for faster timing on runs. Rng is still rng. is there really a confirmation that faster runs gets you better rng ??

Work hard play hard. Yeah true , but why play so hard when it is not e-sports to beign with.
PSO2 while challenging ( that's what makes it fun ) is not exactly an e-sports game to begin with.

What he meant is he multi-ships so he can do the EQ once per ship, say he has 4 characters, each on one different ship
5-8 minutes run mean he can do the EQ on all his characters, 10 minutes runs on only3 and 15+ runs means on only 2, so you obviously get less loot because less runs.

Also, the problem regarding expert lies more in the way the game works than anything, which SEGA has been constantly trying to address : Content is very easily available to everyone because it's needed for progression, but said content would require a proper build/gear/skill tree to even be able to run without feeling like it takes forever and a half, so said players need to "leech" off people who already met those requirements.. It's not really these players' fault since they are completely left to their own devices until they reach XH (a bit less so than before but it's still very much a thing)

To this day, I still wish they made legit super hard requirements, ironically not for those who can clear but for the non-expert matchmaking, first to make it less of a hellhole, and second, to get people to strive for something instead of it being handed to them and forgotten.

KaizoKage

Apr 21, 2019, 04:50 AM

Costume design contest in a nutshell:
Lewd = Win

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 04:51 AM

agree on this but is this all. There's nothing else you people look forward to besides this game ?
( not trolling but from the posts I read, yeah, I have to ask )

EspeonageTieler

Apr 21, 2019, 04:54 AM

agree on this but is this all. There's nothing else you people look forward to besides this game ?
( not trolling but from the posts I read, yeah, I have to ask )

??? You're commenting on a post about pso2 what does looking forward to anything else have to do with the topic?

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 04:58 AM

??? You're commenting on a post about pso2 what does looking forward to anything else have to do with the topic?

cause it sounded like if I do not clear " x quest " I am dead lol

[Ayumi]

Apr 21, 2019, 05:05 AM

I'm fine with not getting expert requirement.
Not going to really miss out on anything.

Zephyrion

Apr 21, 2019, 05:07 AM

cause it sounded like if I do not clear " x quest " I am dead lol

I just chimed in because it was the discussed subject, but I don't care much about the issue to be honest, I'm busy basking in the hype of faster wand melee while getting ready to semi-reluctantly doing Phantom stuff until we get UH fields and SPACE BATTLES !!!!

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 05:17 AM

I just chimed in because it was the discussed subject, but I don't care much about the issue to be honest, I'm busy basking in the hype of faster wand melee while getting ready to semi-reluctantly doing Phantom stuff until we get UH fields and SPACE BATTLES !!!!

SPACE battle. should play some robot anime music while in the space EQ ( gundam maybe ?? )

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 05:28 AM

agree on this but is this all. There's nothing else you people look forward to besides this game ?
( not trolling but from the posts I read, yeah, I have to ask )

why would I want to bring IRL stuff in this conversation? its bad enough with how games and this world runs that companies feel the need to shove shitty politics and agenda's into our games where we go to escape from reality but really we're just doing the same ol song and dance virtually. I'm not ranting about this and frankly it's got nothing to do with PSO2

What he meant is he multi-ships so he can do the EQ once per ship, say he has 4 characters, each on one different ship
5-8 minutes run mean he can do the EQ on all his characters, 10 minutes runs on only3 and 15+ runs means on only 2, so you obviously get less loot because less runs.

Also, the problem regarding expert lies more in the way the game works than anything, which SEGA has been constantly trying to address : Content is very easily available to everyone because it's needed for progression, but said content would require a proper build/gear/skill tree to even be able to run without feeling like it takes forever and a half, so said players need to "leech" off people who already met those requirements.. It's not really these players' fault since they are completely left to their own devices until they reach XH (a bit less so than before but it's still very much a thing)

To this day, I still wish they made legit super hard requirements, ironically not for those who can clear but for the non-expert matchmaking, first to make it less of a hellhole, and second, to get people to strive for something instead of it being handed to them and forgotten.
this guy gets it

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 05:34 AM

[QUOTE=Kril;3461992]why would I want to bring IRL stuff in this conversation? its bad enough with how games and this world runs that companies feel the need to shove shitty politics and agenda's into our games where we go to escape from reality but really we're just doing the same ol song and dance virtually. I'm not ranting about this and frankly it's got nothing to do with PSO2

I end my last reply with this. escape from reality.. got it!!!

Now topic change to something fun

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 06:12 AM

Guys the oppai accessory is resizeable and equipable by males and up to 4 times.

What has Sega done?

Sayara

Apr 21, 2019, 06:14 AM

What they did was make it not match any skin color ever. (Going by the bumped image)

also, the Solo MotherDeus trigger. Does it drop EXP/Loot? Should I turn off boosters for that one?

also solo exq quest thing is only hard because of all the added bullshit it tosses onyou, not because of the actual challenge.

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 06:15 AM

KaizoKage

Apr 21, 2019, 06:20 AM

Guys the oppai accessory is resizeable and equipable by males and up to 4 times.

What has Sega done?

WAIT! THAT was an accessory? Holy tits! I need that!

Azure Falcon

Apr 21, 2019, 06:28 AM

The whole problem with the expert mode requirement is that it's still tied to the rigid title system, which is completely unsuitable for measuring player skill and gear. What Sega should be doing is implementing a persistent checklist of tasks in the pause menu to complete to unlock expert matching, such as "Clear Spectre of Destruction on XH without dropping below 70% health and finish top 5 for total damage", "Defeat Lv81+ Omega Hunar solo" etc. along with proper gear and contribution restrictions when joining expert quests (i.e. no drops if you don't contribute enough, no using lobby actions, cannot equip a weapon below 12*). They're not though, they're just doing this as a lazy ass bandaid to cover for very fundamental design problems with the gameplay loop.

Kintama

Apr 21, 2019, 06:38 AM

I find it somewhat entertaining to see everyone in here lose their shit once they're tasked with clearing solo content for expert.

On an unrelated note, this new EQ is everything, same for UH explores.

SteveCZ

Apr 21, 2019, 06:47 AM

The special ability Crack I seems interesting.

Mr3chi

Apr 21, 2019, 06:48 AM

old problem requires old solution! they should have done it for a while. not like i hate newbies/casuals or anything. currently im mostly running as a casual now. i barely go to swiki to read shit, barely watch proplays/tricks/tips anymore and pay most of my mst to collect random goals insteads of gearing and i'm proud of it. but at least somehow i still want to maintain my dps standing out in every pub parties i do. hmm pretty soundy but it's lowkey compared to the days i came back to the game, i think i was top 5 most of deus rmt i did since i was in a pretty retard team.

then whytf a casual like you don't like the carrying?
1. moral hazard problem: most of ppl who got carried will likely never improve because they don't need to. they won't even do the maps again because they know they will fail. they don't even do their eqs/quests in a good-enough manner because "hey me low dps, no me no problem". they never get decent gears because "it will be outdated in next 3 months". they are also ones who will whine alot when sega changing their expert requirements because they are having their hard time again.
2. some ppl takes advantage of the unfairness, bad people! i won't judge ppl who can't do the expert reqs but they are fine with it. if they feel good doing non-expert party with their friends, enjoy the casualty and spending their mst on other things. they enjoy themselves and have my respect. but there are guys who want to take all advantages without tradeoffs. the guys shouldn't be on expert. to me anyone who whines about expert requirements are in the type and they shouldn't have what they want. with the new requirements, guys who can't be expert now but want to it, can leave the bad guys behind later. it's good for the game, good for every-good-one.
3. i think new reqs are fine. they aren't here to tricky-trick most players. to me, 99% players are the same, 1% remaining can be youtubers. ppl just need to fail 2-3 more times to get to their sense!

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 07:51 AM

I mean I'm glad some people in here have the correct attitude. If they are not happy with the new expert requirements then they are going to pass on them and only play with people who are the same. They have no right to complain because all the content they are doing is the exact same shit, just with a different set of players. If your persona runs start taking 15 minutes, again it's not a big deal because obviously you aren't the one who is helping to reduce that time if you aren't willing to do expert.

Nothing unfair about this. I'm actually excited to return to the game a little bit for ep6 even if things are being staggered out between late april and late may for the most part.

Sayara

Apr 21, 2019, 08:11 AM

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 08:17 AM

The thing that urks me a bit about this is the EXQ requirement, not the trigger thing. Nothing in the game (so far anyway) is going to ask anyone to have to juggle around the kinda stuff that quest asks for. At least not solo. The Mamapapa trigger being a damage check, and like say masquerade being a gear check because hes actually alot easier if you spent the time grinding for a 15star wep. Or if you get on one of those Malice stages requires actually good defensive units to survive.

Or you know, actually do a gear check like some other MMOs do where if you don't reach a certain total you're barred from doing the content or something. I guess it doesn't really matter for me either way. I cant clear either thing with my current gear.

I'm going to have to disagree there. Gear checks are the absolute worst shit considering it's fun to run some content with no units/1 star weapon to challenge yourself which is part of the beauty of this game IMO. I really hate to say this, but solo XQ is just a matter of getting good enough. Seriously if you are subbing hunter, then its doubly easy with automate. Otherwise just practice practice practice. Gear is definitely not the main limiting factor of content in this game. Unlike some other games that have pure vertical progression and the actual gameplay part is simple as washing dishes (like FFXIV), this game is absolutely 90% skill and 10% gear. The gear only matters when you are good enough to actually make 3% extra damage mean something. Otherwise you just have to be willing to practice a little, or don't do expert. It doesn't change what the game allows you to do.

Sayara

Apr 21, 2019, 08:21 AM

I understand what you're saying. It just for a slow brain like myself, very overly complicated to do the many goals during each floor while trying not to die because for whatever reason everything hits harder.
(Did it always do that, i dont even remember)

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 08:38 AM

Dang guys I dunno what haappend. After that long argument with Kril lol I decided to give it a go

and bang . It is complete lol

Clear time

https://i.imgur.com/jpQdtRQ.jpg

I did get the title , not one but 3 !!!!

https://i.imgur.com/vhewapH.jpg

cheapgunner

Apr 21, 2019, 08:43 AM

Lol not gonna pass the new requirements. Skill isn't something in my vocabulary when it comes to end-game, GG bosses. xD

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 21, 2019, 08:51 AM

Lol not gonna pass the new requirements. Skill isn't something in my vocabulary when it comes to end-game, GG bosses. xD

I used no skill lol. I just cheesed it. Rising slash to get to the highest point of the map ( as IN UP and UP ) then press Q to lock onto the target and vapor bullet from the top.

As for Phlaeg , I just timed my hero's will.

There no skill needed

Dark Mits

Apr 21, 2019, 08:51 AM

it's not like being in non-Expert means that you don't get to complete content. If anything, it's a blessing to have the game automatically block the elitists from joining my group.

Zulastar

Apr 21, 2019, 09:05 AM

Well I tried Phanatical a long time ago when I still was lvl 85 with 14*, I think now on lvl 90 with full lightstream and 15* I can handle it.
And this trig: I think it's a time to try it out ... 'cause I never used it before lol. Deus is my favorite boss so I expect no troubles here too. And PSO2 day is really fine for this.

Masu

Apr 21, 2019, 09:28 AM

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 09:29 AM

a few small tidbits from the Q&A;
Armada EQ will use new Timed abilities, also new planetary crystal will be available for said new Abilities.
Evleda unit upgrade will require Claesis Boosters.
AIS Rings will also apply to AIS Vega
It's heavily implied that Leonitas Cerificate B (which you get from Arks Missions) will be used on Phobos Weapons
Zieg will still give weapons with +30 Grind cap, even after drop weapons are +35 cap.

Other things:
Apparently the 15* Dual Blades shown in the video had a really wide attack range.
14* Mirage weapon series (Orbit successor) is tradeable. Not only are they stronger than orbit by default the PP regen effect scales with max PP.
Gathering buffing food is getting buffed from 50% to 300%
Armada EQ has no CF but weapons will be obtainable via Medal exchange
Medals drop from EQ + Limited Arks Missions
some of the 15* weapons in that exchange shop change PA behaviour
example: Shift Period Bullets home in on the enemy instead of flying in all directions

Lyrise

Apr 21, 2019, 10:08 AM

I'm just glad that the new non-series 15* weapons have unique effects again (was a little bit worried that they were only going to stick to series-style 15* and forget about unique rares with distinct latent effects, like the TMG that gives Shift Period a homing emission effect.).

They're also sparing us some pain by making it possible to acquire some of these 15* weapons through the implementation of the prize medal system - complete side achievements to collect prize medals, trade in medals for various items, including 15* weapons. Not entirely a cakewalk since the items will be on a limited-time rotation.

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 10:17 AM

She looks like she is wearing the worlds tightest Push up bra to meet Gene's astronomical Breast size. Her Cos is on point tho.
[SPOILER-BOX]https://image.prntscr.com/image/JWw4buIuRIefZ2rPT3GTPg.png
https://image.prntscr.com/image/OXsHFFuwSSOMoIpN-PKctg.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/513439853606600718/569356993932951578/D4o-CdWUUAU2Eb7.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/513439853606600718/569354616077156362/D4o6gxFUYAA90cS.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

the_importer_

Apr 21, 2019, 10:34 AM

SteveCZ

Apr 21, 2019, 10:43 AM

NightlightPro

Apr 21, 2019, 10:44 AM

real or fake

that is the question

SteveCZ

Apr 21, 2019, 10:49 AM

real or fake

that is the question
tough question.
https://discordemoji.com/assets/emoji/BlobFearSweat.png

Zulastar

Apr 21, 2019, 10:58 AM

One problem with solo requirements can also be tied to potatoe web. In my case I suffer latencies which prevent me to want to keep trying harder (which mean improving my times for example) once cleared. No fun to attempt to because I know there always shit about to happen and that I CAN'T prevent it!

Xpert already granted anyway xP

Same here. Sometimes my dodges just DON'T WORK.

real or fake

that is the question

It's like situation with beard here. Like dwarf cosplay require a big false one, not tiny natural.

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 11:25 AM

Same here. Sometimes my dodges just DON'T WORK.

just out of curiosity. Are you playing hero and if not how many SP did you spend in step advance?

Masu

Apr 21, 2019, 11:39 AM

Same here. Sometimes my dodges just DON'T WORK.

Lol if it was only about dodges. Charged shifta/resta/deband with 0 tik, step jump which don't step so I stand jump, JA window which fail while I keep exact same pace, Synchro gekki which ask 2or3 more PA than usual before to proc, megiverse which don't heal tho I visually hit target...if it was only about dodges... <_<

Zulastar

Apr 21, 2019, 12:24 PM

just out of curiosity. Are you playing hero and if not how many SP did you spend in step advance?

Indeed I usually play TMG Hero on Persona EQs and during some of it's attacks with my same posituring I may have
(left-right arm swing on 3-rd form for example):

1 I dodge left arm swing and skip right arm with BnS counter invul.
2 Left arm don't hit me, and I dodge right arm with a counter.
3 Dodge don't work and I got both hits in a row.
4 Dodge don't work and I got right-hand hit.

This boss have a plenty of attacks which animation implies an incoming damage but go through with nothing and don't trigger a counter when next same attack do opposite. And many incoming damage from blank air.

On Apprentice phase when it rain AoE I can do a serie of 3-5 dodges, but avoid nothing and not trigger a counter when they completely don't work.

This situation really makes me sick: I can last well, dodging all incomings, but suddenly it's all fails 'cause another dodge just don't work. I see it incoming and press a button with no result. I really miss a katana-braver 'cause of that >_<

Lol if it was only about dodges. Charged shifta/resta/deband with 0 tik, step jump which don't step so I stand jump, JA window which fail while I keep exact same pace, Synchro gekki which ask 2or3 more PA than usual before to proc, megiverse which don't heal tho I visually hit target...if it was only about dodges... <_<

It's sounds like 600-800 ms ping, or a plenty of packet loss.

PS: I had a situation right now - pressed BnS button after triggering a counter and found myself with 1 HP lol.
PPS: Have that twice on dragon rematch. Died right before the end 'cause of this shit.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 01:33 PM

"I’m a little upset that they are changing expert requirements again. I had to work so hard to get it again and now it might be impossible for me to do. I understand they want to make sure its keeping the truly skilled players together so they can go hard with others on the same level. but I don’t like getting stuck with everyone else in general MPA. I’m not a beginner but getting forced to party with players who just coast on their level and a few decent pieces of gear makes EQs take longer and drag on. Sega needs to add something like a pro mode in between general and expert so intermediate players can group with people who are more competent than the average 13 year old."

HOLY SHIT, reading this posted elsewhere is essentially all the people whining about the new Req, not only is getting carried through a 4 man version not hardwork but they're also doing what they don't like that others are doing "coasting on their level". This has to be bait, this can't be real lol

I mean I'm glad some people in here have the correct attitude. If they are not happy with the new expert requirements then they are going to pass on them and only play with people who are the same. They have no right to complain because all the content they are doing is the exact same shit, just with a different set of players. If your persona runs start taking 15 minutes, again it's not a big deal because obviously you aren't the one who is helping to reduce that time if you aren't willing to do expert.

Nothing unfair about this. I'm actually excited to return to the game a little bit for ep6 even if things are being staggered out between late april and late may for the most part.
the hard part is acceptance for these people otherwise just clear the solo XQ

Dang guys I dunno what haappend. After that long argument with Kril lol I decided to give it a go

and bang . It is complete lol

BIG PICTURES

ya see you cheesed it (like I thought you would) but in general its not hard so you dont need to act like this solo XQ is like a test to determine future hard content because it never was

Crevox

Apr 21, 2019, 02:03 PM

Last time I played was whenever the old extreme quest was released, the one with anga. I cleared it back then.

I just came back to the game last week to prep for episode 6. I tried the solo extreme as soon as I could and failed at Phaleg. I leveled up, geared up, then did it first try, second try S ranked it, as Su/Fi. I understand this might be a bit easy to gear up with or maybe play? I also went and made the 15 star rod and am now blowing up everything on Fo/Te. Seems easy to gear up in the current game. Had only 10 mil saved up when I logged in and spent it all on rappy suits, so it's not like I had significant backing to accomplish this. No idea how difficult the solo mother/deus quest is, haven't tried it.

Expert queue has been fairly pleasant for emergency quests. I wasn't aware that people were getting carried to get their expert status in the group version. If you aren't actually legitimately clearing the requirements, aren't you bothered that you're probably getting carried in those expert queues? It feels dishonest to cheat your way to it like that, get carried by everyone else all this time, then get angry that you have to earn it legitimately. I'm surprised there is a fuss over this at all. Either you earn expert and can queue with everyone else that has, or you don't. That's the entire purpose of expert, to be able to queue with other players that are playing seriously and have overcome the difficult trial to unlock it. If it's not difficult to unlock and can be cheesed, there's no point.

People are saying it's a gear check, and gear probably helps a ton, but that's also kind of the point too, isn't it? Expert queue will most likely, ideally, have people with high DPS or low death rates. By beating the solo trials to unlock expert, you prove you're one of those people and are keeping that queue alive and healthy. If you're not, then... yeah, I imagine you're probably getting carried.

I really don't want to sound elitist or rude, but... if there's a difficult trial to overcome, gear up, skill up, and overcome it. If you can't, then you can't, and sometimes you just have to accept that. However, I certainly don't think there's a significant grind or time investment behind doing the solo extreme, as with however the current game is, I did it in only a few days.

No issue with the new requirements, it's actually probably a good thing and healthy for the game. A new challenge to overcome (solo "M&D") is exciting, not a worry. When I actually finish leveling my Force and Techer (they are still behind in level since all these cap increases) I will certainly be going for and doing both expert requirements on that too, even if it's just for fun. It will teach and train me to be a better player.

Ceresa

Apr 21, 2019, 02:08 PM

echofaith

Apr 21, 2019, 02:36 PM

I never bothered to do mother trigger before because it gave nothing I wanted(plus I read that it was glitched when it was just released, so lol). I still had the 2 free triggers they gave us from said maints, and finally did the quest just to get the title. I assume many are in the same boat :p

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 02:37 PM

Crevox

Apr 21, 2019, 03:02 PM

i wouldnt mind Masquerade but the fact that I can only do 5 depths per day is the dumbest thing ever so it essentially its just time gating me from getting in for about 20 days just to hit Depth 100 which isn't really a matter of skill at that point

This is where I'm at. I only just unlocked it a few days ago, and even burnt 1 day doing it as Fighter main on depth 1 just to get Fi Excubes for the skill points. It's going to be quite some time before I make it to 100 just because of the days it takes, and there's a number of better things I could be doing instead of it even when it's not on cooldown.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 03:07 PM

To be honest? My ideal conditions would be Solo PD S rank, Solo momdeus S rank, Solo XQ3 S rank and 6 million on endless 1. But that is my personal standards and I have a bias because of the way I play and the people I play with. I've seen people who take nearly 30 minutes to do momdeus with 14* weapons and 12* units so for the so called 'elitists' its a true Poe's law. The expert requirement is coming to stay, just deal with it.

I did get some nice discussions in my stream as a result so I'm happy, and it's like the cherry on top of the release of ep6 and how promising everything sounds. Seriously, hearing entitled children cry that they can't have something that they 'deserve' because it simply exists is delicious. Everyone who reacted moderately by either admitting that they can't fulfill it or are trying to make headway (even the cheesers, at least they are making somewhat of an effort to get what they want) is completely fine. I'm not here to bash people who aren't as skilled as others. But the people losing their shit for not being able to get expert but they should be able to play with people who can is hilarious.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 03:15 PM

im sure some of you have seen this for quite some time but they'll finally throw this in once we get closer or on release of the new req if for some reason you STILL can't clear this XQ

http://puu.sh/DhPZA/9566fb3ee4.png

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 03:44 PM

zangechan

Apr 21, 2019, 03:45 PM

Millenials Complaining About Solo Content For An Expert Title Instead of Being Able To Party With Their High Geared Friends To Leech, a piece of Laura Lee

milranduil

Apr 21, 2019, 03:49 PM

It's a shame the new expert ignores Endless or Masquerade 100 since both of those actually require you to have some semblance of how a class works beyond 1 or 2 "best" PAs. The new conditions are still a drastic improvement over the current trash though. But seriously wtf at only 12% meeting it, I never imagined it would be so low. I want to believe people just haven't tried.

Like what are people doing (or not doing...) to not get S on earth trigger outside of just not pressing any buttons for minutes at a time. The damage they do is even super nerfed compared to the EM version, and it released after they rained 15s on us. And Extreme doesn't require you to clear stage orders so you can even heal on Phaleg if you just want to brute force through it (or just Atra lifesteal).

on paper, having endless/masq requirements seems like a good idea. here's the problems with them though
-endless rolls numerous random stages, and not every players experience will be equal both because of the different stages as well as class. many classes have a much easier time than others particularly in raid stages or magatsu. if you take say 6mil as the requirement, one player can just roll a bunch of mobbing or xq stages while another may land elder, luther, magatsu, shironia, etc.
-endless as techer is extremely unfair in certain stages (elder/luther) and expecting newer players to strategize there is imbalanced compared to other classes.
-masq has a 5/day limit, meaning 20 days minimum to get expert. again, too much of a commitment particularly for newer players

while solo XQ has potential cheesing strategies, i think it + guides trig is as fair as it can get without being too easy for people to faceroll blindly while also being tough enough from being a reasonable step up from getting carried through PT XQ.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 03:52 PM

Why even bother with Solo PD as a requirement in 2019.

As a progression system. If you are able to do that, they you aren't far from doing the rest. But that's my ideal. At the moment I'm 100% fine with what it is.

TehCubey

Apr 21, 2019, 03:53 PM

6 million on endless 1

That'd be terrible. Endless is too reliant on rote memorization (knowing how to cut most time on each stage) and on RNG (good stage orders). I'd sooner see Masq, just a lesser depth than 100: I'm of the belief that if you can clear depth 10, you can clear 100, it just takes practice.

But this is all pointless what-if scenarios. I'm not unhappy with the announced reqs, I think they'll do a good job at being something that even out of practice players with not the best gear can clear if they are willing to put in time and effort. And that effort is what matters most.

Anduril

Apr 21, 2019, 04:00 PM

Personally opinion, I think general Expert requirements need to be done away with completely.
As a replacement, I would like to see them expand the party settings system beyond just Level Range, Friend status, and Team Member status.
Let players set and save the combination of Titles (excluding certain Title categories like NPC Titles and Casino Titles) they want other players in their MPA to have; this will let players decide what qualifies as Expert or not since it will fall on them to determine what combination of Titles are needed rather than having it dictated by SEGA.
At first it may split the community, but over time I'm sure that players would come to a general consensus as to what the right Title requirements would be for what level of play they are looking for.
It could also serve to alleviate some of the issues currently plaguing non-Expert XH; people could agree on the minimum requirements that help weed out players who have just power leveled, like just beating Depth 1 Masquerade.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 04:06 PM

That'd be terrible. Endless is too reliant on rote memorization (knowing how to cut most time on each stage) and on RNG (good stage orders). I'd sooner see Masq, just a lesser depth than 100: I'm of the belief that if you can clear depth 10, you can clear 100, it just takes practice.

But this is all pointless what-if scenarios. I'm not unhappy with the announced reqs, I think they'll do a good job at being something that even out of practice players with not the best gear can clear if they are willing to put in time and effort. And that effort is what matters most.

Yeah it is RNG and it is based on learning the individual stages. But we are also easily 40% stronger than we were when it came out. And that is the point: proving you understand fundamental mechanics and being able to adapt to situations. Hence why I low balled it at 6 million, where you get the hunar wing C accessory.

TehCubey

Apr 21, 2019, 04:13 PM

Personally opinion, I think general Expert requirements need to be done away with completely.
As a replacement, I would like to see them expand the party settings system beyond just Level Range, Friend status, and Team Member status.
Let players set and save the combination of Titles (excluding certain Title categories like NPC Titles and Casino Titles) they want other players in their MPA to have; this will let players decide what qualifies as Expert or not since it will fall on them to determine what combination of Titles are needed rather than having it dictated by SEGA.
At first it may split the community, but over time I'm sure that players would come to a general consensus as to what the right Title requirements would be for what level of play they are looking for.

Extremely impractical (imagine the amount of coordination required to set up at least a single MPA) and rife with potential for abuse. MMO players are infamous for deciding, as a group, that certain classes/builds/playstyles/etc are not welcome and then enforcing that decision via peer pressure. Do we really want this kind of policing to become semi-officially sanctioned, as would be the requirement if a system like this was set up?

Ceresa

Apr 21, 2019, 04:18 PM

on paper, having endless/masq requirements seems like a good idea. here's the problems with them though
-endless rolls numerous random stages, and not every players experience will be equal both because of the different stages as well as class. many classes have a much easier time than others particularly in raid stages or magatsu. if you take say 6mil as the requirement, one player can just roll a bunch of mobbing or xq stages while another may land elder, luther, magatsu, shironia, etc.
-endless as techer is extremely unfair in certain stages (elder/luther) and expecting newer players to strategize there is imbalanced compared to other classes.
-masq has a 5/day limit, meaning 20 days minimum to get expert. again, too much of a commitment particularly for newer players

while solo XQ has potential cheesing strategies, i think it + guides trig is as fair as it can get without being too easy for people to faceroll blindly while also being tough enough from being a reasonable step up from getting carried through PT XQ.

For Endless, they can just run it more than once to get better rng stages, it shouldn't be a big deal if it takes a few tries, at least they'd see more of the stages and there's no cost to run it plus loot each time. But I also don't see that much difference between techer vs Guides and techer vs say Elder or stage 12 Anga.

For Masq, just remove the limit for runs that are a first clear under stage 100? They already showed they could let players run more than 5/day without cutting into the normal 5/day limit with the maintenance apology runs.

Zorak000

Apr 21, 2019, 04:22 PM

I just wanna know what 1v1ing a bunch of bosses in a row and having to start it all again from the top if you mess up even once has to do with 8-12 player content, where expert has any relevancy

s-ranking solo earth destroyers is alright though.

but yeah the thing is that expert mode is only really relevant for 8-12 player content, so what does phanatical phantoms have anything to do with what's expected of you in Beach Wars 2019

if anything, they'd need to make it per-class trials that make sure you know what you're supposed to be doing; like more advanced training quests

mom and deus is fine for being effectively a gear check though

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 04:26 PM

I just wanna know what 1v1ing a bunch of bosses in a row and having to start it all again from the top if you mess up even once has to do with 8-12 player content, where expert has any relevancy

s-ranking solo earth destroyers is alright though,

Because it really isn't difficult. Expert BARELY has any real relevancy in the first place and is not a restriction on what content you can and can't do. It only changes the pool of players you can do it with. If people are unable to fulfill the requirement, then they don't deserve to play with those that do. It's really that simple. I'd rather play with 3-11 people I KNOW has at least passed the same entrance exam as I did because I put the effort in the pass. Is it really that hard to understand? Otherwise if they do keep it as party content, then it better require the full input of at least 3 of the people (for instance, persona trigger in under 12 minutes) otherwise it can just be exploited.

Zorak000

Apr 21, 2019, 04:29 PM

Because it really isn't difficult. Expert BARELY has any real relevancy in the first place and is not a restriction on what content you can and can't do. It only changes the pool of players you can do it with. If people are unable to fulfill the requirement, then they don't deserve to play with those that do. It's really that simple. I'd rather play with 3-11 people I KNOW has at least passed the same entrance exam as I did because I put the effort in the pass. Is it really that hard to understand? Otherwise if they do keep it as party content, then it better require the full input of at least 3 of the people (for instance, persona trigger in under 12 minutes) otherwise it can just be exploited.
yeah it's easy to understand that, however I feel that phanatical phantoms is inappropriate exam material for MPA content; the amount of familiarity with content that is asking is something I would expect from private groups, but not pickup groups

heck even with being familiar with their attack patterns I keep messing up and dying on any class other than summoner, where I already got the S rank. why should I have to deal with 1v1ing hunas on force when I'll have other people that can take aggro away from me

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 04:38 PM

yeah it's easy to understand that, however I feel that phanatical phantoms is inappropriate exam material for MPA content; the amount of familiarity with content that is asking is something I would expect from private groups, but not pickup groups

To be fair, some people were being a lot more unreasonable (endless loner lmao, idiots). But at least this gives you a goal to work towards. And besides, you could argue that now non expert is going to be much more rounded. Either way expert or not didn't mean a big deal to me anyways since I spend most of my time doing solo speed runs of bosses and content. And even then at most it added a few more minutes to the EQs I did. So I guess me personally it's not a big deal, but in principle it's nice to see people putting in effort being matched with others with a similar attitude (for the most part).

milranduil

Apr 21, 2019, 04:44 PM

For Endless, they can just run it more than once to get better rng stages, it shouldn't be a big deal if it takes a few tries, at least they'd see more of the stages and there's no cost to run it plus loot each time. But I also don't see that much difference between techer vs Guides and techer vs say Elder or stage 12 Anga.

For Masq, just remove the limit for runs that are a first clear under stage 100? They already showed they could let players run more than 5/day without cutting into the normal 5/day limit with the maintenance apology runs.

bottom line for endless is that every player's experience is not the same, which should be the point of expert. a static piece of content *everyone* has to clear to get it. i can't tell you how many times i played lap3 while soloing aiming for forever loner just to get sacked by elder, magatsu, amdu over and over again. as a newer player, i can only imagine the kind of taste that would put in their mouth knowing they have to keep rolling to pass it when they're still "newish" to the game. the point of expert is not to try and adapt to rng, but adapt to the *game* in an unchanging environment that is 100% in the player's control.

that's still an extreme amount of time to put in just for expert. someone who learns quick at the game could get expert in a couple days. 100 masq runs would take a while particularly when 15* campaign is about to be gone so no bonus for newer players.

Anduril

Apr 21, 2019, 04:46 PM

Extremely impractical (imagine the amount of coordination required to set up at least a single MPA) and rife with potential for abuse. MMO players are infamous for deciding, as a group, that certain classes/builds/playstyles/etc are not welcome and then enforcing that decision via peer pressure. Do we really want this kind of policing to become semi-officially sanctioned, as would be the requirement if a system like this was set up?
For the first part, that's why I mentioned being able to save those settings, so you can just enable or disable them as you please. Also, probably limiting it to setting just a certain number might be better (like 3 max with and/or modifiers).
I do see the potential issues in the idea, but to me, that policing mindset is exactly what I am hoping for; that way, those players who truly feel they are elite can play in their own sandbox without having to complain about leechers. As it is, the only thing that Expert really dictates is the speed at which an EQ can be completed, so it's not like those who don't meet the self-dictated elite requirements would be missing out on much since the content itself wouldn't be gated.
This could also serve at lower skill requirements to avoid things like the current issues with non-Expert XH where power levelers can drag down an MPA.
It's never going to happen, so meh.

otakun

Apr 21, 2019, 06:57 PM

XrosBlader821

Apr 21, 2019, 06:58 PM

otakun

Apr 21, 2019, 07:01 PM

risking your account getting banned vs owning up to the fact that one is simply not good enough for expert matching
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Yeah, cause people never risk their accounts to use hacks ...

Mega Ultra Chicken

Apr 21, 2019, 07:13 PM

risking your account getting banned vs owning up to the fact that one is simply not good enough for expert matching
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Well, this forum seems to think you must be leeching trash if you don't qualify. That doesn't help.

Classic PSOW. Moralizing skill at a game.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 07:34 PM

Well, this forum seems to think you must be leeching trash if you don't qualify. That doesn't help.

Classic PSOW. Moralizing skill at a game.

Well people are always going to read what they want to. From my perspective, more people are whining and implying that players that somewhat care about playing well are clearly elitists or tryhards that don't play games for fun.

otakun

Apr 21, 2019, 07:37 PM

Well people are always going to read what they want to. From my perspective, more people are whining and implying that players that somewhat care about playing well are clearly elitists or tryhards that don't play games for fun.

Well, when its too the point you encourage a system in the game to segregate the playerbase instead of forming your own groups for MPAs, how isn't that elitist?

Maninbluejumpsuit

Apr 21, 2019, 07:56 PM

The title for S rank solo XQ is in game already, right?
This it? 42038

Zorak000

Apr 21, 2019, 08:05 PM

it's ok to care and want to get the job done timely with like minded folk who are up to snuff, my only argument here is that I think s-rank phanatical phantoms will lock out people that would honestly be perfectly fine in your MPAs, but simply lack the execution on their own to pull it off; if the developers want to make pso2 a game where you play the class you want, I think it sends a mixed signal that some of the more fragile classes gotta be on point with their defensive play in order to get trhough this; that or they're sending the message of telling people to go play the classes that can handle this challenge with less skill required, which is a bit of a mixed message here.

having expert mode is ok, the s-rank solo earth destroyers requirement is fine as a combination gear+skill check; I just don't get what phanatical phantoms would be testing for from a practical standpoint when all of the problem bosses in it either die instantly when encountered in a multiparty quest, or somebody managed to survive the attack and has an atomizer lovers ring

is phanatical phantoms testing for if you know about Dear Master and Marron? Katana Counter Bonus? S1: Blue Ocean Flash? L/ JG Heavenly fall???

Anduril

Apr 21, 2019, 08:08 PM

Elitism in and of itself is not an problem becuase those are players who do truly care about being the best, and they deserve to be able to play with others at that same level and not be bogged down by players who want to play more casually, just like there is nothing wrong with being a casual because there are plenty of people who want to play the game, but just not to a level where it becomes a commitment to "git gud."
The main problem is for those players who fall in between, ie. those who understand the game mechanics and try to be well geared, but don't put in the time/effort to the point where they are able to calculate things down to the frame or make equipment that is always at the highest end; if they can get into the higher end groups, they can be viewed as leechers because they aren't quite up to that ideal standard, and on the flip side they can be viewed as try-hards in the lower end group becuase they want to be able to complete content in a more efficient time.

Zorak000

Apr 21, 2019, 08:11 PM

Anduril

Apr 21, 2019, 08:18 PM

yeah this is what I'm talking about, I assumed expert was moreso the middle ground here than anything; as the higher-end folk oughta be able to find their own groups, and at worst, allow the mid-tier people fill in extra MPA slots

Thinking about it, the use of the word "Expert" is one of the biggest issues. "Expert" implies the best of the best, but it does seem like SEGA wants it to be the standard rather than the exception with the various requirements they have had for it over the years.

エリュシオン

Apr 21, 2019, 08:19 PM

The title for S rank solo XQ is in game already, right?
This it? 42038
That one is the S rank for Hero specifically, If you have that then I think that means you got the other one. If I remember right, the general S rank should give a 45% Ability Success Rate as the reward.

Zorak000

Apr 21, 2019, 08:23 PM

Thinking about it, the use of the word "Expert" is one of the biggest issues. "Expert" implies the best of the best, but it does seem like SEGA wants it to be the standard rather than the exception with the various requirements they have had for it over the years.

to be honest I thought it was a clever misnomer; by calling it "expert" but effectively working as a sort of PSO2 literacy test, the people who couldn't do it could still feel better as long as they consider themselves a casual player anyway.

Mega Ultra Chicken

Apr 21, 2019, 08:24 PM

Thinking about it, the use of the word "Expert" is one of the biggest issues. "Expert" implies the best of the best, but it does seem like SEGA wants it to be the standard rather than the exception with the various requirements they have had for it over the years.

Exactly. People are still treating the new requirements like the standard rather than something special because that's what it's historically been, despite how much tougher they are now.

TehCubey

Apr 21, 2019, 08:25 PM

For the first part, that's why I mentioned being able to save those settings, so you can just enable or disable them as you please. Also, probably limiting it to setting just a certain number might be better (like 3 max with and/or modifiers).

Okay, let's get technical.

How would this system work? Let's say I decide I want to MPA with players who clear reqs A and B. Does it mean other players who have achievements A and B can join my MPA, or only those who have the achievements and also have them selected as their requirement? What about someone else who has reqs A, B and C? Will they be able to join my MPA? What if I don't have C? And that's just two players. Do note all of this has to be coordinated in real time, in a game that already had issues with normal multi block matching, with a single option of expert matching on or off.

I do see the potential issues in the idea, but to me, that policing mindset is exactly what I am hoping for; that way, those players who truly feel they are elite can play in their own sandbox without having to complain about leechers.

You know it wouldn't work that way. How it would most likely work is the playerbase at large getting some memetic idea of what constitutes a good player and what doesn't - for example, in FFXIV many parties ban samurai because samurai have a rep for being bad players. Now imagine the playerbase getting an idea that for example, you need to reach level 90 hunter/force/hero/your least favorite class here to be a "good player". YOu either play with that req on, or you get alienated from most of the playerbase.

No, it's better if there is one standard for everyone, set up by the devs.

The main problem is for those players who fall in between, ie. those who understand the game mechanics and try to be well geared, but don't put in the time/effort to the point where they are able to calculate things down to the frame or make equipment that is always at the highest end; if they can get into the higher end groups, they can be viewed as leechers because they aren't quite up to that ideal standard, and on the flip side they can be viewed as try-hards in the lower end group becuase they want to be able to complete content in a more efficient time.

These people are already better than 75% of the playerbase and nobody whose opinion is worth listening to would call them leechers.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 21, 2019, 08:26 PM

Well, the only thing I can really say to people who claim they want to be with people who can do content. This more likely will just get some people to use hacks and/or account sharing. Which if some of you believe account sharing is unlikely then I will have to inform I was already offered for someone to do it for me lol.
imagine being so shit at something you need someone else to do it for you, you really do embrace being casual trash, might as well just pay $50's for pre Lv90 Phantom day one while you're at it

Well, this forum seems to think you must be leeching trash if you don't qualify. That doesn't help.

Classic PSOW. Moralizing skill at a game.
Thats the thing buddy, with just how antsy and angry all the casual trash is being over a couple of easy quests to clear, you pretty much are casual filth wanting to be carried in every content there is. You will never learn to actually play a game and actually get good at it because if stuff doesn't just fall in your lap you throw a tantrum that nobody wants to see

Face it, anyone complaining about these easy Expert Block requirements are part of those groups who need a participation trophy just to feel good about themselves because boohoo you couldn't improve yourself to clear anything because you'd rather just sit there and expect 15* weapons to just fall in your hands and then just drop the game because theres "nothing to do"

You guys may as well be part of the Sekiro trash who wants easy mode added in, thats how pathetic gamers are these days, resort to whining, cheating, hacking because hey, I refuse to learn a game so that I can enjoy it way more than I already do.

end rant

TehCubey

Apr 21, 2019, 08:32 PM

@Kril where did the evil casuals hurt you? You can say, I won't tell others, promise.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 08:44 PM

Yeah I'm starting to lose sympathy from these posts I'm seeing. If you cannot clear solo XQ, you aren't as 'middle ground' as you think you are. Expert is NOT is misnomer, it is supposed to be what it is named; a matching system for players that can clear the skill level that the devs put it as. In fact, it is the playerbase in this case who got waaay too complacent because the quests for it before was pretty much an idiot test with how simple it was. They didn't even use HnH 6-10 or hell, solo PD which was just released. For the second set, they used the PARTY version when the solo version probably should have been the requirement from all the way back then.

as the higher-end folk oughta be able to find their own groups

I don't get what this means. So the onus isn't on the so called 'mid tier' players to improve a little or just run non expert but for the players who are 'too good' to run with organised parties? It doesn't work like that. Simply put: you have 1 month to catch the expert train as it departs and literally every second that the servers are up to catch the next train. I'm not sure who your metric of casual, mid tier and high end is based off but it's not even that big of a deal. At the end of the day nobody here is entitled to anything. In fact the question should be: why do you need expert?

GHNeko

Apr 21, 2019, 08:45 PM

@Kril where did the evil casuals hurt you? You can say, I won't tell others, promise.

i think the casuals hurt him in the form of wasting countless boosters and stealing away dozens upon dozens of runs over the years because he decided to pug up for whatever reason and rolled a shitty MPA.

happened to me and i hate it; nothing is less fun then having people's own personal methods of enjoying PSO2 impact mine. they can do what they want, but considering i can't directly prevent said people from finding their way into my MPAs; i'd rather have a method of filtering said people out to some degree.

no offense to casuals, but regardless of the nomenclature for "expert matching", the purpose is to seperate people with a subpar understanding and/or below average performance from people who give enough of shit to at least learn to cheese. it makes no sense that people who care to do well or get good results in the game should be subjected to people who think nothing of others around them and do as they please without consideration to people's boosters and efforts; especially when making private MPAs isnt always an option so to say "just find a private group" as a counterpoint to people wanting higher quality pugs via filtering is pretty messed up imo.

on top of that, expert match making needs to keep up with the power scaling of the game. as such it needs to keep going up in difficulty, while also not being gated behind good rng or bad rng as well as not being time gated via limited runs. Anyone should be able to attempt to become an expert at any time and as much as they want without limit, while also making sure that you can meet minimum requirements for performance and understanding of your class and the game.

seems good to me tbh

not like expert is required anyways. i dont see why people want to keep the barrier so low for something that isnt necessary. it's already fairly easy as it is.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 08:55 PM

Well it seems most of the issue is with the year old solo XQ part, so I will be a nice guy and compile the fastest runs of each class I can find.

Summoner (2:57): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LSSlzqIZPY
Hero (2:57.9): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6it8wwUiAg
Gunner (2:56): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=001ZE3UqpxE
Hunter (2:46): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIIv78oTqjM
Braver (3:26): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECKuZUhJm30
Fighter (3:30) (I don't believe this is the fastest but whatever I guess): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xgkyH4blKk
Force (2:32) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4ceCtlTEWo
Bouncer (4:46) (again, can't find faster but there must be): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRSjtfuNlFk
Ranger (5:02) (same deal): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ioNbUfe2s
Techer (7:46) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuKZxVMtabQ&

By the way some of these were done almost a year ago but this quest isn't that famous to time attack. Also one of these was done by me and I don't even play this game.

TehCubey

Apr 21, 2019, 08:56 PM

i think the casuals hurt him in the form of wasting countless boosters and stealing away dozens upon dozens of runs over the years because he decided to pug up for whatever reason and rolled a shitty MPA.

/post

I know all of that and I too get annoyed when I get a crap MPA with an average of 20k DPS, which is why I think it's a good idea that we are back to expert reqs you can't get carried to clear.

But my comment wasn't about all that, it's about Kril ranting about participation trophies, Sekiro and muh politics in video games. What does all of that shit have to do with PSO2? You want to rant about that, go to /v/ or something.

GHNeko

Apr 21, 2019, 08:58 PM

SteveCZ

Apr 21, 2019, 09:10 PM

If you guys want to throw opinions on what kind of quest is best for the expert requirement, that is completely fine. But if you start pointing at each other on who's elite and casual, I don't think you will find the answer here, ever. We have run into this discussion many times; expert block introduction, expert block req change, and random times when casual/elite topic is brought in, but we will always stuck on the same loop if we talk like this.

I always see most of pso-world people always try to make themselves to look like they are part of the 1% (if not, less than 1%) of the whole player base, judging on how you guys keep trying to get into the best meta you can find and ditch every other opinion that in fact probably contributes less than that, even by 5 - 10% difference of a single run. That is completely OK, since we are debating about being an expert by expert requirement here, and we always try to be the best and help others to be the best even though some don't really want to, but is that number of players is the right number to gate people as expert for the PSO2 team? I'm pretty sure we all don't know.

In my opinion, sega doesn't provide this "expert" gate as a mean to make players good individually, but rather to make each of you who is an expert or feel like an expert to easily find people who actually strive to be better; players with closely the same goal, while also at least keeping the blatant leechers at the bare minimum. This way, it's much easier for you to filter people who really want to play the best they can, to form the dream team/group you ever wanted.

So I believe sega is trying their best to keep expert requirement to gate probably 10% - 20% of the players whether we like it or not, leaving enough space for people who aren't satisfied with that to form their dream team from the people they found there. If they keep the expert threshold below 1 - 2%, then there really is no point.

It's always our job in the end to find a proper mpa, and if we say this expert block is the only ideal mean to do that, I think we're on the wrong track.

I think it might be good to assess the expert requirement by that view.

Mega Ultra Chicken

Apr 21, 2019, 09:13 PM

I know all of that and I too get annoyed when I get a crap MPA with an average of 20k DPS, which is why I think it's a good idea that we are back to expert reqs you can't get carried to clear.

But my comment wasn't about all that, it's about Kril ranting about participation trophies, Sekiro and muh politics in video games. What does all of that shit have to do with PSO2? You want to rant about that, go to /v/ or something.

Exactly. That's my real point. There's a gray area between leecher and expert, especially since being good at soloing and being good at party content isn't the exact same thing. Some people can be good at their class' toolkit but a.) get messed up by everything focusing them down all at once (especially when multiple bosses at once are involved) and/or b.) main a class that's sub-par at solo content (especially speed kills which are a new objective for this.)

My real frustration with PSOW is how fucking toxic it is to anyone that doesn't fit its definition of "skilled," not the existence of a new and improved Expert rank. The place acts like "wasting Triboosters" is the worst thing in existence.

azami

Apr 21, 2019, 09:15 PM

It took me 11 mins to just beat mother. I don't really don't see who these are "easy".

It took me 2 tries to S rank this quest on braver and I just started playing braver this week.

Can you record yourself doing an 11 minute mother?

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 09:20 PM

Exactly. That's my real point. There's a gray area between leecher and expert, especially since being good at soloing and being good at party content isn't the exact same thing. Some people can be good at their class' toolkit but a.) get messed up by everything focusing them down all at once (especially when multiple bosses at once are involved) and/or b.) main a class that's sub-par at solo content (especially speed kills which are a new objective for this.)

My real frustration with PSOW is how fucking toxic it is to anyone that doesn't fit its definition of "skilled," not the existence of a new and improved Expert rank. The place acts like "wasting Triboosters" is the worst thing in existence.

You say speed kills but neither of the S rank requirements are really tight. If they are, guess what, It looks like it's time to reassess how good you truly are vs how good you think you are. Honestly, and I'm not trying to call anyone out, but most of the time people who think they are 90% good at their class are closer to 50% Which is fine. However it stops being fine when you are trying to blame the game or the elitists for your inability to do something. Yes, some classes are much worse at solo than others. Yes, some people would rather sit and just press their offensive abilities without any of that inconvenient gameplay bullshit getting in their way. However as I had said before, this place seems to be more skewed to people calling out said elitists than actual elitists.

Mega Ultra Chicken

Apr 21, 2019, 09:28 PM

You say speed kills but neither of the S rank requirements are really tight. If they are, guess what, It looks like it's time to reassess how good you truly are vs how good you think you are. Honestly, and I'm not trying to call anyone out, but most of the time people who think they are 90% good at their class are closer to 50% Which is fine. However it stops being fine when you are trying to blame the game or the elitists for your inability to do something. Yes, some classes are much worse at solo than others. Yes, some people would rather sit and just press their offensive abilities without any of that inconvenient gameplay bullshit getting in their way. However as I had said before, this place seems to be more skewed to people calling out said elitists than actual elitists.

Except I was not blaming them for my inability to S-rank those quests. My issue comes from treating trying and failing as identical to not trying.

My issues with PSOW go way further back than this change. Then again, there was a different member base back then too.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 21, 2019, 09:37 PM

Except I was not blaming them for my inability to S-rank those quests. My issue comes from treating trying and failing as identical to not trying.

Actually no. From what I have seen, the attitude is the issue rather than the actual outcome. People will always sperg out because they have their e-peen fuckery. However, casual is more of a mindset than a playstyle and people often forget this. Good players can be casual and tryhards can be not so good. But people look at it as your skill level is based of how much you no life. Now, if you are trying and failing but you're not willing to give up until you can find some way to get it done that is fine, even admirable. If you are trying and failing and then in the end you decided to give up since its not for you and you end up accepting that you probably wont have expert for now, then that is also fine and fairly level headed.

But if you try and fail, then start to get upset at how the quest isn't fair, or isn't mpa related content so it has no effect on your ability to perform in mpa related content or basically have to make excuses for why you can't do it while trying to either shift the responsibility off of yourself OR blame the system itself for being wrong then that's where the issue arises. It's not an entitlement, it's a privilege that is earned.

GHNeko

Apr 21, 2019, 09:38 PM

My real frustration with PSOW is how fucking toxic it is to anyone that doesn't fit its definition of "skilled," not the existence of a new and improved Expert rank. The place acts like "wasting Triboosters" is the worst thing in existence.

i mean you're not wrong but like at the same time there have been people who come here with objectively wrong info and cause drama to happen when someone who is skilled and knowledge chimes in to correct them.

pso2 section on psow has issues on both spectrums. that being said i dont think it's fair to trivialize "wasting triboosters"

not even remotely. everyone has different priorities, so to some; having their boosters wasted is probably among the worst things in the game since that usually means their hard earned resources from their successful efforts are being wasted.

Mega Ultra Chicken

Apr 21, 2019, 09:42 PM

i mean you're not wrong but like at the same time there have been people who come here with objectively wrong info and cause drama to happen when someone who is skilled and knowledge chimes in to correct them.

pso2 section on psow has issues on both spectrums. that being said i dont think it's fair to trivialize "wasting triboosters"

not even remotely. everyone has different priorities, so to some; having their boosters wasted is probably among the worst things in the game since that usually means their hard earned resources from their successful efforts are being wasted.

True. That was a mistake on my end. Triboosters aren't quite as easy to get as, say, Rare Drop boosters.

Dark Mits

Apr 22, 2019, 01:00 AM

Suggestion about Expert requirementsSadly this wouldn't work as easily because:
(1) The players wouldn't come to a concensus on a "logical" timeframe; it would probably take more than 6 months
(2) It would widely segregate the playerbase during the initial stages, and many players who would set the bar too high would become disgruntled that they would have to "lower" their requirements. This would come at the cost of many EQ runs, since 5-10mins would pass easily before they found out that they have to remake the EQ room with the lower reqs.
(3) Due to the above, many players would set their requirements too low so that they avoid losing time while the mpa is being formed. But that would mean that players of lower performance would also join, which would again cause them to disgruntle.

The issue I have with the Expert status is that it requires something that is 100% solo for content that is 100% multiplayer. This doesn't sit well with me. I should prove that I can work well in a group to participate in multiplayer content, not that I can play well solo. I do acknowledge that this opens pandora's box with leeching and having others do the work for you. I also acknowledge that PSO2 EQ combat is heavily antimultiplyaer, meaning that you don't really have to coordinate with others to clear content; we are really just 1 player with 11 amazing-AI NPCs in all this content.

Maybe Sega should really implement pure multiplayer content; that is content that is impossible to solo not because it would take extremely long time even after heavily outgearing it, but because it would simply lead to 100% failure. For example:
- There's an NPC in the mpa that acts as the "tank". Every 2mins the boss uses a special attack aimed at the NPC's location that needs at least 6 people to absorb and avoid killing the NPC which would lead to instant fail and kick back to lobby.
- Plant a detonation bomb on a player. Everyone else who is within 10m of that player after 5 seconds receives unmitigatable 9999 damage that also bypasses Iron Will-esque effects and puts them all on cooldown.
- Plant a darker core on a player and a photoner core on another player. These deal heavy mpa-wide damage per second unless the two players come in contact to destroy the cores.
etc.
- Have 2/3/x switches that all need to be activated within 3 seconds of each other (sort of like the Extreme quests but with time limit)
- And of course my favourite suggestion that I have made in the past: Combination attacks.

Exactly. That's my real point. There's a gray area between leecher and expert, especially since being good at soloing and being good at party content isn't the exact same thing.Also, it depends on the group at question. Let's suppose you deal 100k dps on Persona EQ. I believe the majority would agree that this player is pulling their weight / is an expert. Now if that person is dead last with just 3% damage contribution and with everyone else at 150k+ dps, doesn't that mean that the player in question was actually leeching?

XrosBlader821

Apr 22, 2019, 02:38 AM

i mean you're not wrong but like at the same time there have been people who come here with objectively wrong info and cause drama to happen when someone who is skilled and knowledge chimes in to correct them.

pso2 section on psow has issues on both spectrums. that being said i dont think it's fair to trivialize "wasting triboosters"

not even remotely. everyone has different priorities, so to some; having their boosters wasted is probably among the worst things in the game since that usually means their hard earned resources from their successful efforts are being wasted.

Which is why i think sega should stop doing timed boosters and instead make them based on charges. Instead of 30 min duration turn it into 3 charges, boosting 3 quests regardless of clear speed. There would still be a niche group of ppl who want fast kills due to multi-ship figts but in general most people who arent time attacking would stop care if they got a slower run

Zephyrion

Apr 22, 2019, 04:05 AM

To bring a tangential but important point, while SEGA does dumb decisions I think this one is warranted
After all, after years and years of buffing XH they actually bring a new difficulty, and they bring with it a new, much harder expert requirement. I put my ball on UH being actually at least decently hard, hard enough to need semi -competent parties and mpas, especially if they were to revive things such as death limits and time constraints. And we all know how Dragon and Deus tilted everyone to heavens with old requirements, So they're probably looking to up the expert floor level for that.

I'm very curious about UH, hopefully it ends up being an actual new difficulty setting !

Dark Mits

Apr 22, 2019, 06:42 AM

Which is why i think sega should stop doing timed boosters and instead make them based on charges. Instead of 30 min duration turn it into 3 charges, boosting 3 quests regardless of clear speed. There would still be a niche group of ppl who want fast kills due to multi-ship figts but in general most people who arent time attacking would stop care if they got a slower runWhile this sounds amazingly well, it would also need to take into account the fact that people would take advantage of it to afk in a Free Field or something when not playing. For example, when Enchanted Forest was a campaign, people would spend hours there. People would simply stay in campship to maintain their "charge" without having to reuse a boost, and risk losing all earned exp for Dark Blast / Rings and Collection File contribution if they got disconnected. Which would bring a new type of problem.

I like this charge idea, but if they decide to implement that, maybe they should go for a hybrid idea: Boost has 30mins and 5 charges. Boost consumes a charge in EQs and time in all other content. When a charge is consumed, 6mins are reduced from the timer. When time is consumed, the boost expires

I'm very curious about UH, hopefully it ends up being an actual new difficulty setting !Didn't we already have a discussion that XH Forest/Caves/Coast is too hard / long for current equipment when wanting to solo? If UH is another level upwards, those areas will become real dungeon crawls. Maybe even see an increase in Moon Atomizer usage. I can't say I would dislike that, in fact I genuinely look forward to that. XH Forest is currently my second favourite content next to Rank+50 Advance Quests.

Mega Ultra Chicken

Apr 22, 2019, 06:47 AM

Also, it depends on the group at question. Let's suppose you deal 100k dps on Persona EQ. I believe the majority would agree that this player is pulling their weight / is an expert. Now if that person is dead last with just 3% damage contribution and with everyone else at 150k+ dps, doesn't that mean that the player in question was actually leeching?

Not if they were actually trying. It's a matter of effort, not DPS. The person should improve but I'm not going to accuse them of malicious intent solely based on their numbers.

Dark Mits

Apr 22, 2019, 09:14 AM

Not if they were actually trying. It's a matter of effort, not DPS. The person should improve but I'm not going to accuse them of malicious intent solely based on their numbers.But how can you measure effort? What if the lowest dps in the group pulls double the effort of the top dps, but is limited by equipment, build and unlucky boss teleportations? We then have to add some gear requirements as well. What if you have 2 TEchers and one just uses Zanverse and afks to get 3rd spot, while the other TEcher uses 100+ keys/min just to come in 12th spot anyway with less than 30% of the first TEcher's contribution?

In the eyes of the "elitists", the result is that matters, not the effort. It's obvious when people say "it's easy, just cheese it" to unlock Expert.

TehCubey

Apr 22, 2019, 12:18 PM

Maybe Sega should really implement pure multiplayer content; that is content that is impossible to solo not because it would take extremely long time even after heavily outgearing it, but because it would simply lead to 100% failure. For example:
- There's an NPC in the mpa that acts as the "tank". Every 2mins the boss uses a special attack aimed at the NPC's location that needs at least 6 people to absorb and avoid killing the NPC which would lead to instant fail and kick back to lobby.
- Plant a detonation bomb on a player. Everyone else who is within 10m of that player after 5 seconds receives unmitigatable 9999 damage that also bypasses Iron Will-esque effects and puts them all on cooldown.
- Plant a darker core on a player and a photoner core on another player. These deal heavy mpa-wide damage per second unless the two players come in contact to destroy the cores.
etc.
- Have 2/3/x switches that all need to be activated within 3 seconds of each other (sort of like the Extreme quests but with time limit)

FFXIV style fight mechanics (and yes, I can tell all of your examples are inspired by FFXIV boss fights) belong in a tank/healer/dps style MMO, not an action MMO like PSO2.

Also, it depends on the group at question. Let's suppose you deal 100k dps on Persona EQ. I believe the majority would agree that this player is pulling their weight / is an expert. Now if that person is dead last with just 3% damage contribution and with everyone else at 150k+ dps, doesn't that mean that the player in question was actually leeching?

No.

In the eyes of the "elitists", the result is that matters, not the effort.

No. That's just your persecution complex speaking. There will still be loud assholes who act like you're a leech if you're not literally top 1% best players, but: 1. they are easy to identify and ignore, 2. they are a vast minority, just a loud one, and 3. often (not always but often) they're trolling and their own performance isn't even close to what they say is a standard for a passable player. Visit pso2g for examples of such.

It's obvious when people say "it's easy, just cheese it" to unlock Expert.

They're saying it to help you. If you can't clear XQ normally, you can cheese it. It will be significantly easier and nobody will judge you for clearing it that way. Would you rather if the playerbase played gatekeeper and went "you don't really deserve Expert unless you clear the solo XQ legit without cheese" instead?

Also, if only results matter then why are people attempting challenge clears, 1* ungrinded weapons, no units, etc? Surely the result is much worse than attempting a clear normally.

Dark Mits

Apr 22, 2019, 12:59 PM

FFXIV style fight mechanics (and yes, I can tell all of your examples are inspired by FFXIV boss fights) belong in a tank/healer/dps style MMO, not an action MMO like PSO2.I have never played FFXIV. In fact I have not even seen any gameplay outside of early trailers. The mechanics are inspired by other online MMOs I have played (mainly Dungeons and Dragons Online, which is also MMOARPG, but active evading isn't really usable there).

No. That's just your persecution complex speaking. There will still be loud assholes who act like you're a leech if you're not literally top 1% best players, but: 1. they are easy to identify and ignore, 2. they are a vast minority, just a loud one, and 3. often (not always but often) they're trolling and their own performance isn't even close to what they say is a standard for a passable player. Visit pso2g for examples of such.There is no persecution complex. I have been on both ends of the spectrum. I have been a no-lifer full-out-elitist before, and I am now on the casual end. I know how these people think because I have done it myself before. And yes, it's always the loud ones that make everyone else look bad.

They're saying it to help you. If you can't clear XQ normally, you can cheese it. It will be significantly easier and nobody will judge you for clearing it that way. Would you rather if the playerbase played gatekeeper and went "you don't really deserve Expert unless you clear the solo XQ legit without cheese" instead?Except this isn't really help. You can't on one hand tell people to cheese it, and then complain that you need new Expert requirements because many have cheesed and it shows. I would in fact prefer a gatekeeping situation as you describe it, but from Sega; preferably one that does not give advantage to a class. The idea of Advanced Training stages per class as someone else suggested is actually a great idea.

Also, if only results matter then why are people attempting challenge clears, 1* ungrinded weapons, no units, etc? Surely the result is much worse than attempting a clear normally.The videos where you see people do such challenges are in either solo-content, or in premade groups. If someone joined a Persona Trigger with 1* weapon or no-units without the consent of the rest of the group, I don't think the leader would accept to start it.

TehCubey

Apr 22, 2019, 01:21 PM

Except this isn't really help. You can't on one hand tell people to cheese it, and then complain that you need new Expert requirements because many have cheesed and it shows. I would in fact prefer a gatekeeping situation as you describe it, but from Sega; preferably one that does not give advantage to a class. The idea of Advanced Training stages per class as someone else suggested is actually a great idea.

People aren't complaining that too many players cheesed expert requirements. They are complaining that players got carried through them, letting others do the hard work for them. Surely you understand the difference.

The videos where you see people do such challenges are in either solo-content, or in premade groups. If someone joined a Persona Trigger with 1* weapon or no-units without the consent of the rest of the group, I don't think the leader would accept to start it.

That's because doing this solo is only for yourself but if you're playing in a group then you deliberately waste 11 other peoples' time in the name of... what, exactly? There's nothing elitist about not wasting other peoples' time and doing your best instead. Even Puso Ni had an episode about it.

Dark Mits

Apr 22, 2019, 01:37 PM

People aren't complaining that too many players cheesed expert requirements. They are complaining that players got carried through them, letting others do the hard work for them. Surely you understand the difference.The suggestion that "If you have trouble just find a group and do the 4man" was as frequent as "Cheese it" when it came to unlocking Expert. Of course I understand the difference, but the means and the end result are the same: Bypassing the intended requirements. I'm fairly certain that Sega didn't consider that 3manning the XQ would be so easy through power creep even during its early life.
That's because doing this solo is only for yourself but if you're playing in a group then you deliberately waste 11 other peoples' time in the name of... what, exactly? There's nothing elitist about not wasting other peoples' time and doing your best instead. Even Puso Ni had an episode about it.I think you misunderstood my point here, or I misunderstood yours.

- I mention that the majority of people do not care what you do, how much effort you invest, how well affixed your equipment is etc.; they only care that you deal enough dps so that the EQ is completed faster. This point of mine assumes that we are talking about pug multiplayer content, because complaints stem from the performance of other players.
- You counter-argue that people do not care about results, because they run 1* ungrinded challenges etc. Which is true but not relevant to the current discussion. Of course people create and attempt their own challenges (or challenges set forth by other players). But these challenges are always in either solo content (so there are no other players to hinder your effort) or in a premade group (so there is consensus on intentionally gimping one's maximum performance)
- I revert that these challenges are done exactly in the above cases (Solo or premade with party consensus)
- You revert that doing such a challenge in a non-consenting group is deliberately wasting others' time. And I 100% agree with this.

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 22, 2019, 03:22 PM

The videos where you see people do such challenges are in either solo-content, or in premade groups. If someone joined a Persona Trigger with 1* weapon or no-units without the consent of the rest of the group, I don't think the leader would accept to start it.

I joined a expert persona pug with no units today. Using my special abacus to calculate total damage done in the course of the fight at the same time as DPS I still topped. Current expert is no more than a 6th grade logic puzzle.

GHNeko

Apr 22, 2019, 04:32 PM

https://twitter.com/caldwell41pso2/status/1120339149548969984

RaTe managed to complete expert requirements.

XrosBlader821

Apr 22, 2019, 05:08 PM

https://twitter.com/caldwell41pso2/status/1120339149548969984

RaTe managed to complete expert requirements.

That Te/Bo player, Ray. managed it too and iirc they are running around with 12* DB, JB and 15* Wand.

Flaoc

Apr 22, 2019, 05:16 PM

br can do it with plenty of time to spare without a subclass (im a terrible br since barely played it the past few months)

[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/8nACCwg.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/zDwOkeT.png

https://i.imgur.com/Wcq6dPI.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

Titan

Apr 22, 2019, 06:01 PM

What is the clear time S rank solo for Earth Destroyers Trigger and the mission name translated into Japanese so I can watch some fast runs. I ran the trigger and completed it in 19 minutes so I must be doing something wrong to only get an A rank.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 22, 2019, 06:02 PM

niche class combos can clear but a Lv90 HR with LS+Atra Gear still struggling to do this for some reason

What is the clear time S rank solo for Earth Destroyers Trigger and the mission name translated into Japanese so I can watch some fast runs. I ran the trigger and completed it in 19 minutes so I must be doing something wrong to only get an A rank.

18mins for S rank

KaizoKage

Apr 22, 2019, 09:46 PM

4.8 GB update...... I guess I cant play after maintenance then. that's HUGE

Flatflyer

Apr 22, 2019, 09:54 PM

My only issue with the new expert requirements is that the XQ is just a slog to try to complete, since its generally just "mess up once and you have to start over" which makes doing five different fights in a row a bit tedious.

Like I can step dodge majority of the time pretty consistently, but its just losing because of those few times where I don't near the end is frustrating.

the solo deus/mother trigger req is completely fine by me since there is room for error though.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 22, 2019, 10:34 PM

My only issue with the new expert requirements is that the XQ is just a slog to try to complete, since its generally just "mess up once and you have to start over" which makes doing five different fights in a row a bit tedious.

current gear allows room for error, full Bode units included allows for more than just 1 hit dead mistakes.

and its good if you mess up that you have to start over now that this quest is a requirement, cant have you camp shipping everytime and basically getting expert title this easy can we? basically it would have made zero difference if they kept it the same way before.

final_attack

Apr 22, 2019, 10:44 PM

Oh right, just in case ....
The .... new requirement of Expert is :
- Solo XQ (That have Deus at start and Hunar at the end), right?
- Solo Trigger Mother + Deus from Weapon Badge?

Thanks ^^

ArcaneTechs

Apr 22, 2019, 11:34 PM

Oh right, just in case ....
The .... new requirement of Expert is :
- Solo XQ (That have Deus at start and Hunar at the end), right?
- Solo Trigger Mother + Deus from Weapon Badge?

Thanks ^^

yes, a 1yr+ old XQ and a relatively new (2months?) old trigger that are both easy to do

final_attack

Apr 22, 2019, 11:44 PM

yes, a 1yr+ old XQ and a relatively new (2months?) old trigger that are both easy to do

Ah, all right then.
Thank you very much.

Dark Mits

Apr 23, 2019, 01:05 AM

4.8 GB update...... I guess I cant play after maintenance then. that's HUGEAdd to that the fact that we will have to do a Quantum Check to avoid issues that somehow pile up over the months...

Are they ever going to fix the BGM playing during Vol Dragon? They broke it sometimes around EP4 I think.

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 23, 2019, 01:25 AM

yes, a 1yr+ old XQ and a relatively new (2months?) old trigger that are both easy to do

Well lucky I have both done. However , I do note the following in order in regards to the mother amd deus quest.

I had 3 triggers back then, yeah I did not echange for alot.

I did it twice I recall. Once before they took it down and once after they brought it back up.

I have the S3 item clear title. I remember on the second clear I did get the title required for the now mentioned expert quest but I cannot seem to find it.
As mentioned in a "quick questions response" I hope that really its because Its not implemented yet and thats why the title is not showing.

Its easy to do but I do not have any exchange tickets at the moment to get the trig should they say that past attempt does not count.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 23, 2019, 01:52 AM

Well lucky I have both done. However , I do note the following in order in regards to the mother amd deus quest.

I had 3 triggers back then, yeah I did not echange for alot.

I did it twice I recall. Once before they took it down and once after they brought it back up.

I have the S3 item clear title. I remember on the second clear I did get the title required for the now mentioned expert quest but I cannot seem to find it.
As mentioned in a "quick questions response" I hope that really its because Its not implemented yet and thats why the title is not showing.

Its easy to do but I do not have any exchange tickets at the moment to get the trig should they say that past attempt does not count.

you cheesed it, hollow victory, enjoy. i cant take you as serious still. cg on expert bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb

XrosBlader821

Apr 23, 2019, 02:03 AM

Whenever one cheeses it or not doesnt matter.
Some people arent skilled enough to deal with the scenarios the XQ thows at them but are still performing well in party content.

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 23, 2019, 02:16 AM

you cheesed it, hollow victory, enjoy. i cant take you as serious still. cg on expert bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb

how does my question and hopes have to do with cheesing lol

I have the S3 item clear title. I remember on the second clear I did get the title required for the now mentioned expert quest but I cannot seem to find it.
As mentioned in a "quick questions response" I hope that really its because Its not implemented yet and thats why the title is not showing.

Its easy to do but I do not have any exchange tickets at the moment to get the trig should they say that past attempt does not count.

Flatflyer

Apr 23, 2019, 03:07 AM

and its good if you mess up that you have to start over now that this quest is a requirement, cant have you camp shipping everytime and basically getting expert title this easy can we? basically it would have made zero difference if they kept it the same way before.

I mean, you'd still need to be able to do enough DPS to kill the enemies quick enough to qualify for s-rank, which realistically just having high enough DPS output is like 90% of the "endgame" to this game anyways.

also im wearing austere+lightsteam units and still getting one-shot so idk what you're talking about with just bode units surviving

ArcaneTechs

Apr 23, 2019, 03:55 AM

posto

the game already knows you cleared it, so the moment that expert requirement kicks in it'll auto complete once you go to the title counter and all you have to do is accept the titles and go about your day

I mean, you'd still need to be able to do enough DPS to kill the enemies quick enough to qualify for s-rank, which realistically just having high enough DPS output is like 90% of the "endgame" to this game anyways.

also im wearing austere+lightsteam units and still getting one-shot so idk what you're talking about with just bode units surviving

whats your affix build? would most likely explain why youre getting one shot

Flatflyer

Apr 23, 2019, 04:34 AM

whats your affix build? would most likely explain why youre getting one shot
its all s-atk focused, sure the answer is "just affix HP onto it" but thats stupid considering the fact I can clear literally every other piece of content available with what I have right now just fine.

If I have to make a special set/build of gear for this specific XQ, then that kinda signifies it doesn't represent what makes you capable of performing well in the rest of the game.

which goes back to my point as to why I think solo XQs are honestly just a terrible way to determine if a player is "expert" or not.

TakemiShinnosuke

Apr 23, 2019, 04:52 AM

quickasker

Apr 23, 2019, 08:04 AM

its all s-atk focused, sure the answer is "just affix HP onto it" but thats stupid considering the fact I can clear literally every other piece of content available with what I have right now just fine.

If I have to make a special set/build of gear for this specific XQ, then that kinda signifies it doesn't represent what makes you capable of performing well in the rest of the game.

which goes back to my point as to why I think solo XQs are honestly just a terrible way to determine if a player is "expert" or not.

if you feel need to put extra hp on you pure satk unit, you might be interested using timed ability. timed ability which used in extreme quest are boosting hp as sub bonus, while you could pick HpAutoRestore4/HealingItemEffectBonus4/Pervent Elemental debuff (mirage,burn,panic .etc) for main bonus

Each Extreme 1 timed ability typically boost +50HP, but you could look for +90HP on craft search.

TheFanaticViper

Apr 23, 2019, 09:30 AM

apparently only 12% of all players currently meet the requirements of new Expert matching.
What is your source for that? They said during the broadcast? I can't believe it's only 12% ...

XrosBlader821

Apr 23, 2019, 09:51 AM

What is your source for that? They said during the broadcast? I can't believe it's only 12% ...

Yeah they did during the Arks Live mini that was going on before the main PSO2 Station event.
It doesn't surprise me that its only 12% after all there was no reason of why you should do solo XQ beyond C-Crest (boy that reward is super relevant nowadays isn't it?) and there is no reason why you should run Solo Mama-Desu over Solo PD when it comes to Excubes. By the time they revise expert matching that number will probably rise significantly.

Meteor Weapon

Apr 23, 2019, 12:08 PM

Only other reason to do MamaDesu Solo is to increase 14* Collection File rate lol. PD does better for cubes tho.

ArcaneTechs

Apr 23, 2019, 12:13 PM

its all s-atk focused, sure the answer is "just affix HP onto it" but thats stupid considering the fact I can clear literally every other piece of content available with what I have right now just fine.

If I have to make a special set/build of gear for this specific XQ, then that kinda signifies it doesn't represent what makes you capable of performing well in the rest of the game.

which goes back to my point as to why I think solo XQs are honestly just a terrible way to determine if a player is "expert" or not.

Well your gear build does matter because when i ran bode, 2x quilph units i wasnt getting when shotted by anything on release of this XQ (maybe exception to one of hunars attacks) Todays gear standard you shouldnt either with austere rear upgrade and 2x LS units. Also your class combo?

dont_talk_to_me

Apr 23, 2019, 12:16 PM

Yeah they did during the Arks Live mini that was going on before the main PSO2 Station event.
It doesn't surprise me that its only 12% after all there was no reason of why you should do solo XQ beyond C-Crest (boy that reward is super relevant nowadays isn't it?) and there is no reason why you should run Solo Mama-Desu over Solo PD when it comes to Excubes. By the time they revise expert matching that number will probably rise significantly.

People run mom/deus for SSAs (70 mil is a nice carrot on a stick, even if the stick is 20 miles long). Solo XQ was by far the best place to get invades and still is actually (pretty much 1/3 chance with boosters, got 4 at once before). If you are good enough to solo it in under 7 minutes, it's better than doing party since the party invade rate is absolutely ass.

Flatflyer

Apr 23, 2019, 04:15 PM

Well your gear build does matter because when i ran bode, 2x quilph units i wasnt getting when shotted by anything on release of this XQ (maybe exception to one of hunars attacks) Todays gear standard you shouldnt either with austere rear upgrade and 2x LS units. Also your class combo?
im just running Hr for it right now, I did actually go and check again last night and I did see a few factors that could lead to why im getting one-shot (mainly I now realized my units are only +6 because I havent done anything that boosts unit upgrade success in a while and doing that without that effect sucks) so I guess I'll just have to try it again whenever I fix that, it just hasn't really been an issue for me in other content though was what I meant.

if you feel need to put extra hp on you pure satk unit, you might be interested using timed ability. timed ability which used in extreme quest are boosting hp as sub bonus, while you could pick HpAutoRestore4/HealingItemEffectBonus4/Pervent Elemental debuff (mirage,burn,panic .etc) for main bonus

Each Extreme 1 timed ability typically boost +50HP, but you could look for +90HP on craft search.
this'd actually be pretty helpful too, thanks for the tip!

ArcaneTechs

Apr 23, 2019, 05:46 PM

im just running Hr for it right now, I did actually go and check again last night and I did see a few factors that could lead to why im getting one-shot (mainly I now realized my units are only +6 because I havent done anything that boosts unit upgrade success in a while and doing that without that effect sucks) so I guess I'll just have to try it again whenever I fix that, it just hasn't really been an issue for me in other content though was what I meant.

this'd actually be pretty helpful too, thanks for the tip!

Unit upgrades are by far the easiest things to do, +10 them asap, you dont need a grind boost to do it (and we just had one before maint started). So ya +6 units would factor as to why thats happening. Just get +1 grind protectors since theyre dirt cheap or use the ones from your FUN scratches