Armada of Demise Discussion

[Tyreek]

Since there was no thread about this EQ, I decided to make one. Discuss.

I highly enjoyed fighting Demoire Dominus, and especially liked its boss theme. Nemes Ange is how I expected, pretty Zone of the Enders influenced. The rest of this EQ is alright. I like playing Sector 2 sections over Sector 1.

Also I totally can just get behind playing these sectors to SA2 music.

https://youtu.be/bZ7Keyb6ZN4?list=PLvNp0Boas721TSB-gLzJt6vOmTdRsX47x

Lets also put out there for people who haven't played yet: This is a Basilis farm house.

Edit: I ended up getting 6 at once from this EQ, so yeah, they're throwing them at you.

[ZerotakerZX]

It's alright

[XrosBlader821]

Bassilis Shower

[Dark Priest]

Bassilis Shower

Yeah, i assume it's because of the new affixes, they seem to only come on 13+ Stars, so we'll get showered with those, i mean i'm fine with it because outside of those they are just gold material fodder for me otherwise.

[silo1991]

Bassilis Shower

does it drops in XH , im asking because those weapons can help my friends break the lvl caps

[Dragwind]

Bassilis Shower

Definitely lots of Basilis drops.

[Agastya]

very fun eq. drop rates seem very generous so far. loving that the stage hazards are actually threatening.

it's extremely satisfying tearing through tons of these micro machines in one go.

[Masu]

I agree...just the AIS part(s) which kinda lacks dynamics. We're far from the swiftness and fluidity of a Z.O.E fight :v

[ralf542]

I was excited about the 15★ sword, but it's barely any stronger compared to the 14★ Ares Sword-NT if my calculations are correct.

[ArcaneTechs]

does it drops in XH , im asking because those weapons can help my friends break the lvl caps

Your friend can buy a 13☆ or 14☆ weapon out of the player shop for cheap and get the title done that way faster

[wefwq]

Sector 3 AIS fight felt quite lacking, like the fight supposed to have more than that but nope.
The EQ as whole is pretty good since it offer some variation, though I don't really like how 3 sectors just cramped together in 30 minutes timeslot.

[Dark Priest]

Sector 3 AIS fight felt quite lacking, like the fight supposed to have more than that but nope.
The EQ as whole is pretty good since it offer some variation, though I don't really like how 3 sectors just cramped together in 30 minutes timeslot.

I'd prefer that then the way they usually do them, 30 minutes for each sector and the final fight for another 30, making the whole thing take an hour or 2 (if we did 30 each that is actually 2 hours). i think they finally wised up and stopped doing that. or at least this looks like the start.

[Kondibon]

Fuck that, an hour of trying to get as many EQ runs in as you can sounds like it would get tiring really fast, it's already bad enough for 30 minute ones. I personally would have preferred if it was just one long EQ instead of 3 separate quests. I like the whole thing thematically, but it's just going to lead to people complaining about how slow pugs are down the line.

Another complaint, I don't like that the rail boss thing has weakpoints on the side of the arena, it makes it really hard to fight it while also seeing what it's doing.

Otherwise, Cool EQ, I actually had fun doing it.

[Meteor Weapon]

I personally would have preferred if it was just one long EQ instead of 3 separate quests.

630 says hi, and then you lose all your progress you raked up. I'm glad Sega did the way they did, but then again they could have built something that can have people rejoin the game in case of a disconnection instead of shoving 630 right into our faces.

[Kondibon]

EDIT: Oh yeah, what are the secondary effects on the new exquisite parfaits. The english patch doesn't have their descriptions translated yet, and the info isn't on the wiki yet either.


630 says hi, and then you lose all your progress you raked up. I'm glad Sega did the way they did, but then again they could have built something that can have people rejoin the game in case of a disconnection instead of shoving 630 right into our faces.

That's true, it's mainly the fact that you can repeat the stage 1 and 2 that concerns me. Like, I can see the benefits, but people are just going to complain when they can't get that extra run in because of a pug or something. I'm pretty sure 4 good players could do it faster than the pugs I've been in though.

[Great Pan]

Not impressed, especially with non-Expert MPA.

[Lumpen Thingy]

Not impressed, especially with non-Expert MPA.

Why would you run any EQ with expert turned off?

[GuardianGirth]

42116
Gonna be streaming thew new EQ here tonight. Come chat me up. https://www.youtube.com/c/GGVision/live

[Suirano]

Finally got to fight Nemes Anjule. His fight does feel a bit lacking but it is fun regardless. Demoire Dominus is definitely way more boss feeling overall. I personally like that fight more than the other. I have gotten 3 15*s from this EQ already ( Talis, Wired Lance, and Ultimate Chain ) which surprised me ( granted none were Dual Blades which is what I want ).

My gripes with it is the time frame, you basically only get 10 minutes to try to get into this EQ because I doubt you can start in Phase 2 if you didn't do Phase 1. So unlike every other EQ, you get 1/3 of the time and even the 30 minute window was a bit small for some of them. It is also kind of annoying being one shot by mess you don't even see but that is UH as a whole.

Overall, EQ is alright. I hope I can get those DBs as a drop but eh, if I get 100 medals, I get it either way and at least with medals, I don't have to grind it.

[Stormwalker]

It was fun, but I don't have any use for 15 billion Basilis weapons. I'm going to get tired of those real fast.

Even if I was Phantom main and had a use for Phrase Decay, I'd have gotten enough from one run of this to last me for the forseeable future. Also, the Silver Prize Medal shop is exceedingly underwhelming. Once I buy the lobby action (which won't take long!) I don't see anything compelling at all. I have more 100% tri-boosters than I can use already.

[nathanielzor]

It was fun, but I don't have any use for 15 billion Basilis weapons. I'm going to get tired of those real fast.

Even if I was Phantom main and had a use for Phrase Decay, I'd have gotten enough from one run of this to last me for the forseeable future. Also, the Silver Prize Medal shop is exceedingly underwhelming. Once I buy the lobby action (which won't take long!) I don't see anything compelling at all. I have more 100% tri-boosters than I can use already.

I know right? If only you could break down your weapons for materials that sell for meseta or something. :(

[modoru]

you'll want the meteorite crystals if you plan on making timed abilities for the EQ. otherwise, they're also good for affixing the new stuff.

[Great Pan]

Why would you run any EQ with expert turned off?

I didn't pass the new expert requirement, too fucking hard for me.

[ZerotakerZX]

I didn't pass the new expert requirement, too fucking hard for me.

Pretty solid reason

[ArcaneTechs]

can we just get a full AIS Vega EQ? because i mean that was like the best part of the new raid and well the fight sorta was too quick, like a 2nd phase would have been awesome addition to the Anges fight

[Flatflyer]

tbh it would be cool to have a combined version of something like the sector 2 part and the sector 3 AISV part, where half your party is in AIS Vega holding off mobs in space while the other half of your party is on the battleship trying to work on disabling a shield around the battleship's core.

[ZerotakerZX]

tbh it would be cool to have a combined version of something like the sector 2 part and the sector 3 AISV part, where half your party is in AIS Vega holding off mobs in space while the other half of your party is on the battleship trying to work on disabling a shield around the battleship's core.

That might require actual teamwork

[NightlightPro]

how many title rewards you can get from this EQ ???

[oratank]

tbh it would be cool to have a combined version of something like the sector 2 part and the sector 3 AISV part, where half your party is in AIS Vega holding off mobs in space while the other half of your party is on the battleship trying to work on disabling a shield around the battleship's core.

i need npc talk about their situation from other side of battle field through comm like ace combat. this eq look like a war after all

[XrosBlader821]

I mean the Drink doesn't expire after each sector so yeah this EQ might as well be one straight shot.
One thing that bothers me though are those 720p prerendered Videos they use for cutscenes. it just looks awful when it's not CGI.

[cheapgunner]

I want the music that plays during the Demoire Dominus boss fight. The song was pretty lit.

[the_importer_]

meh, Yamato 2.0 only with 2 non-AIS battles instead of just 1.

[wefwq]

I want the music that plays during the Demoire Dominus boss fight. The song was pretty lit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLU-ZjHXgkM

[Meteor Weapon]

I gotta say that unlike any other EQ, this one literally shits on people who came in 10 minutes late because IRL stuff or whatever. If you haven't done Sector 1 and 2, then you're pretty much getting the middle finger and not able to join. SEGA could have just give people the option to do Sector 1 who haven't done it instead of gating them out.

Good EQ, shitty gating system. This is like BQ all over again.

[Stormwalker]

I will say that the more time I spend fighting Luminmechs and shielded enemies, the more glad I am that I don't main Fighter anymore. All those enemies that can only be hurt from one side have to be a royal pain with Fighter stances.

Beyond that, people without access to expert match arevreally getting screwed over here. Non-expert MPA's don't finish the sectors fast enough to run them more than once, which means getting garbage drop rates in Sector 3.

[XrosBlader821]

yeah, definitely not the best EQ to launch new Expert requirements :wacko:

[Stormwalker]

meh, Yamato 2.0 only with 2 non-AIS battles instead of just 1.

On the bright side, I find the Vega much less clunky to fly than the original AIS. Wish they'd made the design a little more streamlined and less box-on-legs, though.

[ZerotakerZX]

On the bright side, I find the Vega much less clunky to fly than the original AIS. Wish they'd made the design a little more streamlined and less box-on-legs, though.

I think that's the point. ARKS have inferior technology compared to ultra versatile lumintech, but they still fight the good fight.

[Stormwalker]

I think that's the point. ARKS have inferior technology compared to ultra versatile lumintech, but they still fight the good fight.

Well my complaint is mostly with the design of the original AIS,; the Vega didn't really change the bsse design,just strapped on some new hardware. I was kind of hoping for a more refined design. It's a quibble, though... it flies much better, it's just kind of ugly.

[Dark Priest]

I will say that the more time I spend fighting Luminmechs and shielded enemies, the more glad I am that I don't main Fighter anymore. All those enemies that can only be hurt from one side have to be a royal pain with Fighter stances.

Beyond that, people without access to expert match arevreally getting screwed over here. Non-expert MPA's don't finish the sectors fast enough to run them more than once, which means getting garbage drop rates in Sector 3.

That might be why they did such a move, because previously, due to all the leechers, MPAs took longer then they needed to with expert. i'm guessing you also tried in on ultra, which is even more of a no no for none-expert runs because of the spongy enemies and the lack of gear people have in them to kill them reasonably fast.

[Ceresa]

I gotta say that unlike any other EQ, this one literally shits on people who came in 10 minutes late because IRL stuff or whatever. If you haven't done Sector 1 and 2, then you're pretty much getting the middle finger and not able to join. SEGA could have just give people the option to do Sector 1 who haven't done it instead of gating them out.

Good EQ, shitty gating system. This is like BQ all over again.

It's supposed to only require either Sector 1 or 2 complete once to join Sector 3, is it not working like that?


Yeah, the problem is that there are a whole lot of us who are NOT leechers--I come to EQ's with a 7-slot 15* +35 weapon with 3 SSA's, two 5-slot Lightstream units, and a 5-slot Tag Bode, I am sure as Hell not leeching--but can't pass the new expert requirements yet, and Sega has essentially just given us the middle finger with this.

Telling 60% of your player base that they can't have nice things because 10% of your player base are leeching jerks does not make for happy customers.

There's more to leeching than gear you know?

I've seen enough corpses in UH expert as is that I wouldn't trust anyone who can't handle solo Phanatics.

[Stormwalker]

So, I don't like the term "leech" being thrown around in this context either, but expert mode isn't a need or a "nice thing", that people are entitled to. That's the whole point, people don't want to have to carry as hard, and saying that it's not fair that there's even a basic requirement for expert mode is completely missing the point.

If you think you're good enough to play with expert players then you should be able to complete the requirements. Especially with gear like that.

EDIT: There's something to be said about how poorly expert mode actually does its job though, since there's nothing stopping someone from completing it and then using a class they're bad with or undergeared, or straight up actually leeching.

Which reminds me. Leeching isn't about not being good enough guys, it's about intentionally not helping. Someone doing their best isn't leeching, even if their best is only 50% of everyone else. _(:3

I don't disagree with anything you said. My issue with this EQ is the stacking bonus to drop rate awarded in Sector 3 for multiple runs, and the fact that it's unattainable for anyone not in expert. That's all.

[Kondibon]

I don't disagree with anything you said. My issue with this EQ is the stacking bonus to drop rate awarded in Sector 3 for multiple runs, and the fact that it's unattainable for anyone not in expert. That's all.That's the case for a lot of EQs, that's why I complained that it's even possible to do multiple runs of each sector in the first place. Like, this is EXACTLY the kind of response to it I expected.

[Tyreek]

So are the Sector 3 fights random or is there a factor that determines which boss you fight?

[Stormwalker]

That's the case for a lot of EQs, that's why I complained that it's even possible to do multiple runs of each sector in the first place. Like, this is EXACTLY the kind of response to it I expected.

See, I don't even mind that they can be run multiple times. I don't mind that players can get the rewards for those sectors multiple times. The only thing that bothers me is the bonus it grants to the Sector 3 rewards, and the fact thst the sectors tske just long enough that a non-expert group will never see that bonus.

Thst is my entire complaint.

[Kondibon]

See, I don't even mind that they can be run multiple times. I don't mind that players can get the rewards for those sectors multiple times. The only thing that bothers me is the bonus it grants to the Sector 3 rewards, and the fact thst the sectors tske just long enough that a non-expert group will never see that bonus.

Thst is my entire complaint.
That's a problem with the EQ reward balancing though, not the expert matching.

[Stormwalker]

That's a problem with the EQ reward balancing though, not the expert matching.

Yes! That is what I am saying from the beginning! My complaint is not with the expert matching, it is with the EQ design!

[ArcaneTechs]

B-but, equality, man! Can't casuals get some good stuffs too!? And 10+ minutes per sector isn't a good run in my book.

My pugs and i assume the norm for awhile is

Sector 1 x2 Sector 2 x1 Sector 3 X1

I assume tmpas are the same except Sector 2 can be ran twice if fast enough

[SteveCZ]

My pug has been like this:
2x sector 1, 2x sector 2, 1x sector 3
or
3x sector 1, 1x sector 2, 1x sector 3. Even this with 2nd sector 2 being late by a few seconds, if not, it could be 2x sector 2.

So I assume maybe tmpa should be way better than this (I'm assuming they could be earning 500K to 1M points in a single run).

I just don't like on how short the time available for sector 3 is. Not because I couldn't make it, but if you only got 5 - 7 minutes left on the boss and you got dc'd, you're done. Unlike, say persona eq, you got 30 minutes leeway if you get dc'd before you can just call it a day.

[Crevox]

New EQ is okay. I think both the bosses in Sector 3, while looking cool and having a nice theme, kinda just end abruptly. Neither of them have multiple phases once you get past the random mobs before them and both just mostly take hits until they die with minimal gimmicks.

The first and second sector are mostly just fighting those shield mobs, and it can be awkward to hit the very specific weak points on Summoner. Some of the enemies just feel bulky for the sake of being bulky and don't seem to do much else, so you're just sitting there and DPSing them down while they soak hits. Sometimes it feels like you're all just DPSing a wall instead of something that actually fights back just to elongate the amount of time you're in the EQ and to get less runs in. My pet also really loves flying into the laser fences.

Rewards feel even more generous than usual, spewing out even more 13 stars than Easter did, with 14 star eggs on top of that. Should be easy to get the S egg versions of Jinga and Aero with some time. Both my friends got the 12 star rear unit from one timeslot of the EQ, and with all the medals they give you, it shouldn't be hard to trade for whatever you do want.

Overall not a bad EQ, but feels a little unpolished gameplay wise.


I see a problem which you guys already stated that, good drops only available in sector 3, right? And with shit non-expert MPA, this is impossible.

I just got a 15 star before Sector 3, so there's definitely good drops in all parts of the EQ.

As for expert requirement complaints, my two friends and I came back to the game at level 75/80 within the last month and fulfilled the expert requirements, so it's definitely not a matter of gameplay time. I understand it's a difficult feat for some people, whether it be your gameplay skill or gear holding you back, but if you work at it, it's definitely possible. If you don't like being in "shit non-expert MPAs", then focus your efforts on clearing the expert requirements and it won't be an issue anymore.

If you can't do it, then... well, that's the entire point of the expert queue. People want to play and be matched with other players of a high skill/gear level in order to complete quests with efficiency. If you're one of those players, the expert requirements shouldn't be a worry and you'll clear them.

[Suirano]

My runs are always 2x Sector 1 1x Sector 2 and 1x Sector 3 with pugs. I didn't even know you could run Sector 2 twice.
I have gotten 3 15*s out of the EQ so far ( Only 1 being from Sector 3 ). RNG is RNG, you could probably get the most runs and get nothing or get only 1 run of each sector and walk out with a 15* per run.

[Lostbob117]

Demoire's boss fight needs to zoom the camera out more or something. Can't see anything with his big body.

[Klubbah]

My first 2 PUGs went 2 Sector 1s, 2 Sector 2s, Sector 3. I think I missed the first 3 times for the quest so some people knew a bit more about what to do, maybe the first few times would have been 2/1/1.

My recent one I still queued up solo but ran into some strong people, relevant single sample that doesn't mean too much but still:


RNG is RNG, you could probably get the most runs and get nothing or get only 1 run of each sector and walk out with a 15* per run.

Some 3-man premade dropped a party maker for me (the other 4 were in a group so it had to be), and I didn't ever check their equipment or classes but we ended up doing:

3 Sector 1s (4~ minutes each, the version where some robots fall down right in front of you early, not the one with lasers I think)

and 2 Sector 2s (6~ minutes each, I assume if Sector 1 is what it was, then 2 and 3 are the same, but i'll still specify that it wasn't the one that splits you up heavily)

+ Sector 3.

I had 250% RDR and 125% Tri and walked out with 4 Basilis weapons and of course whatever the 10* drops are, Dio?

Both my other runs had more Basilis weapons and while like I said the sample size is too insignificant I saw the recent post and felt like bringing up the drops alongside mentioning experiencing being able to get in 3/2/1 runs. I think I will be seeing a lot more 2/2/1 runs on average, maybe the occasional 2/1/1 even as a lot of the 2nd Sector 2s have cut it close.

---

slightly off topic: I have joined groups before hand but those people showed me some probably obvious things

- like being able to start the launch sequence/teleporter before 8 people are even in the room and it still filling up. I always thought it immediately locked the quest from new people joining (unless my game just didn't update the little counter for whatever reason), though I hesitate to start it ever anyways as I want to throw out Shifta/Deband/Resta on everyone at the start.

- and hitting retry quest after Sector 1 when Sector 2 started and it actually going to the Sector 2 quest. I just assumed you had to go to the quest terminal since it was a different quest (though for whatever reason they did go to the terminal to start Sector 3).

[wefwq]

Demoire's boss fight needs to zoom the camera out more or something. Can't see anything with his big body.
Yeah, it really is a mess especially when that thing start shooting stuff while moving around. And the lockon marker is huge...

[Loveless62]

For the record: during an Armada EQ block, I got a 15* WL on the first Sector 1 run I did.

[Flaoc]

amph stone at 7.2m

https://i.imgur.com/yN9RtvW.jpg

[SteveCZ]

7.2m well not bad. If the average run is 350k - 420k in pug, that'd be only 17 - 20 runs, compare to previous 50 runs on persona EQ.

[Akero]

Xiera needs to stop talking after clearing a sector and warp us back faster.

[SteveCZ]

Xiera needs to stop talking after clearing a sector and warp us back faster.

This.

[oratank]

people still don't learn to be a zondeel guy when nobody fucking use it really hate to see the other side group slow mpa down

[mother clusterfck]

Oddly enough, this eq is a lot of fun.
I love how they mix up the different quests with each sector having more than one quest you might get.

Gotta say I really dislike Nemes Ange though, it often flies so high or so low that the attacks are almost entirely off screen and you maybe 1-2 frames to dodge an attack than take out more than half your health.
And flying all over the place all the time is in general not great either as AIS Vega has no dash like AIS have during Yamato, so getting close to Nemes Ange again wasted some time and you can't simply attack when you get close either cause you need to be careful about the Attacks From Beyond the Screen.

That aside I'm really enjoying it, Dominus something something or what that final boss you fight normally is called is a pretty good fight, not trolling players by randomly blocking away the attackable parts of the boss and constantly cutting off burst damage but simply forcing you to attack while dodging yourself.

TBH running out of weapons I care about, just freed up two Atlas Ex and now a second LS I need to find a use for.
Not complaining though, lol.

[oratank]

it use step to dash and i don't feel i need to get close to him just stand stil shooting at him wait for barrier counter attack

[ArcaneTechs]

i feel like no ones pointed out the 240p quality cutscenes we get during this EQ still, whats the deal with this? I'm assuming they're fixing this during next maint

[XrosBlader821]

people still don't learn to be a zondeel guy when nobody fucking use it really hate to see the other side group slow mpa down

Zondeel doesn't work on most Photoner Darkers so far.


i feel like no ones pointed out the 240p quality cutscenes we get during this EQ still, whats the deal with this? I'm assuming they're fixing this during next maint

I pointed it out already and its not a bug. it's the intended quality. Some of EP5 cutscenes that were too graphically intensive (for the vita) were done is low bitrate 720p videos as well. It just looks awful.

[Kondibon]

i feel like no ones pointed out the 240p quality cutscenes we get during this EQ still, whats the deal with this? I'm assuming they're fixing this during next maint
It's probably a video at the end so they can have that explosion effect not look like actual garbage like in the apprentice fight.

[Suirano]

i feel like no ones pointed out the 240p quality cutscenes we get during this EQ still, whats the deal with this? I'm assuming they're fixing this during next maint

Definitely a pre-rendered video much like those cutscenes in the final chapter of Episode 5. They probably are never gonna change that since it doesn't seem to be something people have an issue with overall.

[oratank]

Zondeel doesn't work on most Photoner Darkers so far.
.

nope only 2 mon that you can't zondeel boss and the barrier one

[ArcaneTechs]

Zondeel doesn't work on most Photoner Darkers so far.



I pointed it out already and its not a bug. it's the intended quality. Some of EP5 cutscenes that were too graphically intensive (for the vita) were done is low bitrate 720p videos as well. It just looks awful.

Oh i must have passed up your post pointing that out, my bad. Really i dont see why we dont just have seperate resolutions for the scenes and id argue vita dying off and what not i guess its some leeway??? I dont understand Segas decision to just roll with this

[XrosBlader821]

nope only 2 mon that you can't zondeel boss and the barrier one

Is this another situation where I have to be airborne for Zondeel to work because it sure as hell didn't when I was on the ground.

[oratank]

everything work perfect on ground only missile ship that i have to use in the air to make their weak point still visible

[LancerFate]

Btw it's me or dark techs really underwhelming, i mean Gi Megid kinda not consistent it is not Grants after all, no decent aoe tech for mobs clearing.
I personally still use Gi Megid, idk if its good choice.

[Nyansan]

Btw it's me or dark techs really underwhelming, i mean Gi Megid kinda not consistent it is not Grants after all, no decent aoe tech for mobs clearing.
I personally still use Gi Megid, idk if its good choice.

Gi Megid is for a stationary weakpoint only so if the target is moving it's easy to miss.
Sa Megid is a pretty strong mid range option, other option for mobbing you can do Zondeel + Megid as the explosion from megid is an AOE

[Dark Mits]

Zondeel worked for some Luminmechs, with the exception of the heavy ones or those who like to move a lot.

Yep, cutscenes are prerendered in lower quality. I am not really in a position to estimate how much larger the file would be if it was rendered at 1920x1080 compared to 1280x720, but a quick estimate is about 2.25x larger, so if the cutscene is 100MB now, it'd be 225MB at the higher quality, with whatever implications that would have regarding streaming it in real time from a non-SATA drive for older PCs.

Is there a way to determine beforehand which sectors we'll be getting? I've done 2 different Phase 1, 2 different Phase 2 and 2 different Phase 3 so far.

[ArcaneTechs]

Zondeel worked for some Luminmechs, with the exception of the heavy ones or those who like to move a lot.

Yep, cutscenes are prerendered in lower quality. I am not really in a position to estimate how much larger the file would be if it was rendered at 1920x1080 compared to 1280x720, but a quick estimate is about 2.25x larger, so if the cutscene is 100MB now, it'd be 225MB at the higher quality, with whatever implications that would have regarding streaming it in real time from a non-SATA drive for older PCs.

Is there a way to determine beforehand which sectors we'll be getting? I've done 2 different Phase 1, 2 different Phase 2 and 2 different Phase 3 so far.

theres really no reason as why pc has to deal with Vita quality video when the majority that play are on pc anyways

[Dark Mits]

theres really no reason as why pc has to deal with Vita quality video when the majority that play are on pc anywaysImagine if Sega's metrics show that the majority of JP players have 1280x720 as their game resolution... the horror!

The other explanation could be that since 1280x720 is the lowest resolution the game supports (please inform me if I'm wrong), they chose it since they might have trouble downsampling higher resolution video in real time for those who play at 1280x720.

[ArcaneTechs]

Imagine if Sega's metrics show that the majority of JP players have 1280x720 as their game resolution... the horror!

The other explanation could be that since 1280x720 is the lowest resolution the game supports (please inform me if I'm wrong), they chose it since they might have trouble downsampling higher resolution video in real time for those who play at 1280x720.

dude the quality isnt even in 720p, its literally 240p tier

you tell me how this time around how its stopping them from putting out the higher quality vids than they have with past content like Persona, theres no way suddenly they gotta worry about the Vita version

[Dark Mits]

dude the quality isnt even in 720p, its literally 240p tier

you tell me how this time around how its stopping them from putting out the higher quality vids than they have with past content like Persona, theres no way suddenly they gotta worry about the Vita versionYeah, it seems like a rushed job now that I think about it. The intros for every episode have all been much clearer and crisp compared to these cutscenes, as well as the ones near the end of EP5. At best we can hope for someone in the official forums to ask about it and have a Sega dev explain the situation.

[Kondibon]

dude the quality isnt even in 720p, its literally 240p tier

you tell me how this time around how its stopping them from putting out the higher quality vids than they have with past content like Persona, theres no way suddenly they gotta worry about the Vita versionWhen is the last time you actually looked at a 240p video?

[Suirano]

So like, dunno where to put this atm, what ever happened to the Evleda unit upgrades. I was thinking it was gonna come around by this EQ but haven't heard any word about it. Is it just not a thing?

[Poyonche]

So like, dunno where to put this atm, what ever happened to the Evleda unit upgrades. I was thinking it was gonna come around by this EQ but haven't heard any word about it. Is it just not a thing?

It's coming in July for the anniversary event

[Dark Priest]

Btw it's me or dark techs really underwhelming, i mean Gi Megid kinda not consistent it is not Grants after all, no decent aoe tech for mobs clearing.
I personally still use Gi Megid, idk if its good choice.

From someone who really likes dark techs (surprise) i would say megid is a beast if you have a it strongly customized, it not only travels fast (assuming you have speed +) but it hits multiple targets, enemies very often turn to me after a few of them on force and phantom. but other then gi megid, most of them are imo, underpowered. Gi megid is really good for applying poison as well as it has the highest proc rate. But good luck on mobile enemies.

The only one that kind of makes me mad is Na Megid, which on paper, it LOOKs strong. but how it works makes it just not worth bothering. it either needs a power up to be worth the cast time, or stop weaking it whenever you try to customize it.

[Kondibon]

Gi-megid is actually really good against the non-boss lumimechs because they tend to stay still for extended periods of time while attacking. Regular old megid can ruin most of the weaker ones though.

[ArcaneTechs]

When is the last time you actually looked at a 240p video?

How it feels to watch Armada cutscenes (make sure you full screen for maximum 240p since you're not playing PSO2 on a small window like its shown here):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-A4Wn0mauE

How my eyes feel after watching Armada cutscenes:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/szzaXlIPkDc/maxresdefault.jpg

[Kondibon]

How it feels to watch Armada cutscenes (make sure you full screen for maximum 240p since you're not playing PSO2 on a small window like its shown here):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-A4Wn0mauE

How my eyes feel after watching Armada cutscenes:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/szzaXlIPkDc/maxresdefault.jpgThe thing is, I play the game in 720p, and I'm pretty sure the videos are in that, or at worst 360p. The difference between say 1080p and 720p is REALLY noticeable, so if you play the game in a higher resolution you could just not be used to it.
Also, Resolution doesn't have a direct connection to artifacting cause by a low bitrate and video compression, so using youtube videos is actually a bad point of reference because they get the shit compressed out of them too, probably more than the videos in PSO2 did.

The only reason I can think of for why this particular video is at a relatively low resolution and compressed like that is so it can load quickly without breaking the transition, which means they probably aren't going to "fix" it.

[Nyansan]

"Why bother making a high res video at EQ end when people are most likely gonna skip it anyway to get to the loot crystal"
- Sega probably :wacko:

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

"Why bother making a high res video at EQ end when people are most likely gonna skip it anyway to get to the loot crystal"
- Sega probably :wacko:

Well they're not wrong...

Also, I second dark techs for the EQ. Megid is 200k+ explosions on weak points, and gimegid ignores obstacles to weak points. Just need to know when to use one or the other. That's all.

[quickasker]

how do you guys want a Te behave in this EQ (assuming in UH),i mostly skip using offensive tech

what i usually do is:
1. everyone is phantom - check
2. Generic Shfta + Deband before starting - check
3. always stand in melee range
4. cast zanverses, 5.5s field is enough to cast 2 zanverse in different location (one for melee, one for that dood who uses rifle all day)
5. gather mob using Ra zandia, zondeel is deprecated
6. back to zanverse cast routine again
7. if mob is something that bigger than trashmob (idk, like mini ship flying or that gundam minis), get to melee range and use zanverse
8. while point 7 occurs, use critical field (lv20). seriously, do you guys appreciate critical field?
9. get aggro from zanverse and get rekt, cast charged zanverse + uncharged megiverse shortly after == everyone's healing for ya
10. whenever i see your hp bar low, cast charged megiverse (yes i watched everyone's hp bar during quest)
11. back to shifta/deband routine, use anti if someone catch cancer
12. loop
13. yes no resta

for stage 3 which polygonized octopus elder, any spare time is used for wand smacking (after change ele to dark), dash using wand PA, and gimegid.
my usual run on ship 4 is 2+2+1 or 3+1+1 (rarely) so far. any advice appreciated

[ArcaneTechs]

I learned today that nothing triggered me more than someone who has to cosplay Megumeme(min) and just casting Il Foie on literally everything, EVERYTHING. here I thought this discord post about the guy had to be a joke but woah man, idk how this guy got the expert reqs done (mostly likely cheesed) but them dying constantly and 45k Il Foie's, full Stellar Wall unaffixed units and Resonance Rod did not help our runs at all

end rant

[Great Pan]

I learned today that nothing triggered me more than someone who has to cosplay Megumeme(min) and just casting Il Foie on literally everything, EVERYTHING. here I thought this discord post about the guy had to be a joke but woah man, idk how this guy got the expert reqs done (mostly likely cheesed) but them dying constantly and 45k Il Foie's, full Stellar Wall unaffixed units and Resonance Rod did not help our runs at all

end rant

Oof. Lucky you to see that Memegumin in action!

[SteveCZ]

Oof. Lucky you to see that Memegumin in action!

This is a literally good point of view, actually. :lol:

[Dark Priest]

I learned today that nothing triggered me more than someone who has to cosplay Megumeme(min) and just casting Il Foie on literally everything, EVERYTHING. here I thought this discord post about the guy had to be a joke but woah man, idk how this guy got the expert reqs done (mostly likely cheesed) but them dying constantly and 45k Il Foie's, full Stellar Wall unaffixed units and Resonance Rod did not help our runs at all

end rant

Well you have to remember that the expert tag is account based, so he probably got it on a "real" character (as that set up would make it impossible to beat either one quick enough) and is using that trash character to bog down runs. for the sake of i guess playing some role? i assume that's it.

[Dark Mits]

Here's a rant from me as well...

Why did they decide on Automatic Revification? Why would they NOT want us to spend Moons and Halfdolls, when they keep piling up? Why do they remove the opportunity to use TE's perk of reviving with Shifta+Deband buffs? The chances of having over 40 deaths in a single section, and therefore run out of revification options, is already too close to 0 to dismiss it as practically impossible.

Other than that, gief 3rd section music without the singer plox.

[Suirano]

I keep getting the 15* Katana. I have 3 of them. I want the Dual Blades DX.

( Been giving the music of the EQ a listen, god that guitar is so good. )

[oratank]

i know the feel 3wl here

[Zephyrion]

Here's a rant from me as well...

Why did they decide on Automatic Revification? Why would they NOT want us to spend Moons and Halfdolls, when they keep piling up? Why do they remove the opportunity to use TE's perk of reviving with Shifta+Deband buffs? The chances of having over 40 deaths in a single section, and therefore run out of revification options, is already too close to 0 to dismiss it as practically impossible.

Other than that, gief 3rd section music without the singer plox.

Revive bonus + Atomizer lovers is still a gain of time (you don't spend extra time buffing and atomizer lovers moon animation is way faster than 5 seconds;, so are Halfdolls (again faster to just smash the revive button than to wait). It still rewards the mpa as a whole to rev them, And Halfdolling yourself is still faster as well. I also do not mind that given the quest format of RUSH FASTER!!!. I do think it would be out of place in a raid fight tho, but we'll see what SEGA does then. Given they introduced it in BQ but didn't put it in any other EQ, I wouldn't be surprised if it's an Armada exclusive thing

[Dark Mits]

Revive bonus + Atomizer lovers is still a gain of time (you don't spend extra time buffing and atomizer lovers moon animation is way faster than 5 seconds;, so are Halfdolls (again faster to just smash the revive button than to wait). It still rewards the mpa as a whole to rev them, And Halfdolling yourself is still faster as well. I also do not mind that given the quest format of RUSH FASTER!!!. I do think it would be out of place in a raid fight tho, but we'll see what SEGA does then. Given they introduced it in BQ but didn't put it in any other EQ, I wouldn't be surprised if it's an Armada exclusive thingIt still feels like a decision intended to prevent "catalytic" mistakes of players in the outcome of a run. 0 HP was supposed to be a punishment in the form of either slower clear time or outright quest failure. Yes, using Atomizer or Dolling is faster, but the reward is like... 3second faster clear time assuming everyone dies once. This isn't even a slap on the wrist. If the timer was 60seconds then I'd say that it's a good "lesson" since it'd basically prevent an extra run not only from whoever died, but also from whoever refused to help.

And to incite "war", it feels like a decision catered to "Experts" who only know how to dps and find it extremely taxing and un-fun to spend 2 seconds to help another member.

[Stormwalker]

I keep getting the 15* Katana. I have 3 of them. I want the Dual Blades DX.

( Been giving the music of the EQ a listen, god that guitar is so good. )

Unless I am missing something, the dual blades are garbage. The potential is actually detrimental because it breaks DB's damage rotation during PBF.

The comments on the JP Wiki seem to think it's garbage as well, so I don't think I'm missing anything here, but there may be niche uses for it.

[reaper527]

8. while point 7 occurs, use critical field (lv20). seriously, do you guys appreciate critical field?


is crit field useful? it seems like typically people are going to fall into one of two categories:

1. cares about crit, but already has 100% crit rate (so crit field doesn't help them) such as gu, fi, br,bo, ph etc.

2. doesn't care about crit, nor crit field (fo for example)

it seems like the crit field ring isn't going to provide much utility.

[Stormwalker]

is crit field useful? it seems like typically people are going to fall into one of two categories:

1. cares about crit, but already has 100% crit rate (so crit field doesn't help them) such as gu, fi, br,bo, ph etc.

2. doesn't care about crit, nor crit field (fo for example)

it seems like the crit field ring isn't going to provide much utility.

I don't think most Phantoms have 100% crit - Critical Stream tops out at 60% and that's at 300 PP. My Phantom is running ~69% striking crit, with 49% ranged and tech right now (due to R/Critical Strike Striking ring). I love Critical Field.

[Kondibon]

And to incite "war", it feels like a decision catered to "Experts" who only know how to dps and find it extremely taxing and un-fun to spend 2 seconds to help another member.
I actually see people revive others immediately more often in expert mode. Hell, I usually run atomizer lovers specifically for that.

[Stormwalker]

I actually see people revive others immediately more often in expert mode. Hell, I usually run atomizer lovers specifically for that.

Having run Armada both with and without lately, I can testify to this - I see more people get revived in expert runs (in spite of fewer people dying there).

I generally try to revive people when I can, but since I tend to play aerial melee types a lot (Twin Dagger Fighter, Gunner, Bouncer, Katana Phantom) someone else usually gets to people before I do..

[Suirano]

It's a mixed bag for me. Some runs people revive, some don't. I have noticed that it is really anyone with Atomizer ring that usually revives. I know I am one of the scrubs dying a lot as Bo/Ph usually because of being one shot by stuff I don't see.

[NightlightPro]

front/rear of the ship looks like a face with its tongue stretched out
https://i.imgur.com/Y5liKF5.jpg

[NightfallG]

The AIS section's music is amazing, cheesy as hell, has story implications and I just love all of it. I hope we get more AIS Vega sections in the future.

[NightlightPro]

https://i.redd.it/u9vbbxy2eg131.gif

nice animation

[Dark Priest]

https://i.redd.it/u9vbbxy2eg131.gif

nice animation

Yeah, phantoms usually laugh at those things though.

[ZerotakerZX]

front/rear of the ship looks like a face with its tongue stretched out
https://i.imgur.com/Y5liKF5.jpg

What a good boy

[Selphea]

The 5 second revive timer is probably because of all the oneshots that can happen in such a fast moving quest. By itself the quest is OK but at some points there can be too many lights and random flybys. I think it's to cover for that design flaw - if they didn't have that timer, non-expert runs would be unplayable. Sometimes I want to rez but if I rez someone I know I'll die to some light pillars or sweeping beams so it's tough.

[Dark Mits]

The 5 second revive timer is probably because of all the oneshots that can happen in such a fast moving quest. By itself the quest is OK but at some points there can be too many lights and random flybys. I think it's to cover for that design flaw - if they didn't have that timer, non-expert runs would be unplayable. Sometimes I want to rez but if I rez someone I know I'll die to some light pillars or sweeping beams so it's tough.I wholeheartidly disagree:

1) There are no random flybys. Everything is scripted. The flying enemies always sweep after a specific enemy has been killed. Moreover, they appear in the minimap as red triangles. Also, I am nearly certain that they pick their target based on proximity.

2) It's not a design flaw because it is one-shot only and only if both of the following conditions happen: (a) Player is a glass cannon (b) Player does not take evasive actions. I have intentionally stayed afk to see how much damage these flying enemies do when they all focus you, and I can assure you that at ~2300 DEF with 1750HP and HP Restore A from Mag, you will survive getting hit by all of them.

3) Non-expert runs are perfectly playable. At worst there would be a delay of about 15-30sec in clearing each sector.

4) Knowing when it is safe to use recovery or reviving options should be part of the strategy of the game, and not only how to press Evade and how to deal damage.

5) The game should punish numerous deaths more actively. I am not saying "Quest Failure" punishment, though I would be happy with that as well. I am saying that people should be using their Halfdolls and Moons, and finally get back to campship once they run out of those options as well. And they should start making use of the quest ranking system to determine rewards.

[SteveCZ]

Just something to add; a duo video (Gu and Ph) who got 2/2/1 run, that also intentionally destroy flybys for more points.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYbh6wxIljo

[Selphea]

How common are characters in non-expert runs with 2300 DEF and 1750 HP? Or 2600HP in that video? Even at 2.6k and Phantom's iframes they go down to a couple hundred or 1HP more than once. At around 10:00 they even got hit by a full volley of lasers for 1.9k damage, and these are good players with good gear.

Just saying that if you're already carrying in non-expert with the rez timer right now, without that timer you'll need to carry harder and deal with a lot more dead people.

[vantpers]

How common are characters in non-expert runs with 2300 DEF and 1750 HP? Or 2600HP in that video? Even at 2.6k and Phantom's iframes they go down to a couple hundred or 1HP more than once. At around 10:00 they even got hit by a full volley of lasers for 1.9k damage, and these are good players with good gear.

Just saying that if you're already carrying in non-expert with the rez timer right now, without that timer you'll need to carry harder and deal with a lot more dead people.
Yes, taking 3 seconds to throw fully invincible atomizer is horrible. We should streamline the game more so we can get twice the runs and get our rares twice as fast. It's unacceptable that people die in my MPAs and we don't reach the goals I want.

[Selphea]

Yes, taking 3 seconds to throw fully invincible atomizer is horrible. We should streamline the game more so we can get twice the runs and get our rares twice as fast. It's unacceptable that people die in my MPAs and we don't reach the goals I want.

What you're saying is unironically the intent they're designing for.

[vantpers]

What you're saying is unironically the intent they're designing for.
Kinda because dumbasses eat it up.

[Selphea]

Kinda because dumbasses eat it up.

They've been eating it up for a long time, but we're already long past the stage where failing and dying in EQs actually meant something. A lot of things that have been added over the course of 6 episodes need to change before dying and rezzing can be meaningful again.

[Kondibon]

I
2) It's not a design flaw because it is one-shot only and only if both of the following conditions happen: (a) Player is a glass cannon (b) Player does not take evasive actions. I have intentionally stayed afk to see how much damage these flying enemies do when they all focus you, and I can assure you that at ~2300 DEF with 1750HP and HP Restore A from Mag, you will survive getting hit by all of them.While I agree that it's not unreasonable for people to just avoid them, asking players to build 2.3k def and 1.7k hp to survive the flybys is a lot more than "not a glass cannon".



5) The game should punish numerous deaths more actively. I am not saying "Quest Failure" punishment, though I would be happy with that as well. I am saying that people should be using their Halfdolls and Moons, and finally get back to campship once they run out of those options as well. And they should start making use of the quest ranking system to determine rewards.The game doesn't need to punish deaths in normal content, especially content like this. The "punishment" is taking longer to complete the content, thus getting in less runs, thus getting less points.


A lot of things that have been added over the course of 6 episodes need to change before dying and rezzing can be meaningful again.
I brough it up a while ago, but outside of EQs that force failures for a certain number of deaths (which I'm fine with in the rematch eqs), death hasn't been meaningful since normal mode vol dragon was still a threat. I'd maybe bump that up to HM being relevant, but the point still stands that death has never been more than a minor annoyance for most content, especially in 12 man EQs.

[Dark Mits]

I wasn't clear: 2.3k DEF + 1.7k HP assumes Deband Drink for RDR buff and TEcher present. Pre-buff states are lower (1,8K DEF + 1,4k HP). I don't think it's an unreasonably defensive build, in fact I get just 55 DEF and 270HP from affixes, which is extremely easy to reach with basic ones that drop around. I'd say the only reason to not be able to reach that, is to have specifically affixed for full damage, which is what we usually call "glass cannon". Having L-Party Toughness and permanent Jerky isn't unreasonable as well.

Also the game does need to punish mistakes more severely. You cannot have people try to give a damn to improve themselves if you tell that: "Oh no, you critically failed to counter a scripted enemy attack, I will punish you by giving you 5 seconds time out." At the same time, if the difference between doing horribly and doing great is like a 10second difference in the run, then why would I want to try to play well? This lack of punishment is the reason why you also see so many people just afk at Ultra Fields, but also actively gather items once the boss dies.

Note that when I say severely, I do not mean stuff like 3 deaths and you're out, or 1 death and you're out. I mean stuff like dropping the player's quest ranking to A, then to B, and have A reward 75% of total rewards, B reward 50%. This way the highest rewards are not axed, but the player does not get as many Excubes / Photon Spheres / Disks as in the case of getting S. And it will also help to serve as a way to try to improve one's self.

[Kondibon]

I wasn't clear: 2.3k DEF + 1.7k HP assumes Deband Drink for RDR buff and TEcher present. Pre-buff states are lower (1,8K DEF + 1,4k HP). I don't think it's an unreasonably defensive build, in fact I get just 55 DEF and 270HP from affixes, which is extremely easy to reach with basic ones that drop around. I'd say the only reason to not be able to reach that, is to have specifically affixed for full damage, which is what we usually call "glass cannon". Having L-Party Toughness and permanent Jerky isn't unreasonable as well.As a Su player "lol".


Also the game does need to punish mistakes more severely. You cannot have people try to give a damn to improve themselves if you tell that: "Oh no, you critically failed to counter a scripted enemy attack, I will punish you by giving you 5 seconds time out." At the same time, if the difference between doing horribly and doing great is like a 10second difference in the run, then why would I want to try to play well? This lack of punishment is the reason why you also see so many people just afk at Ultra Fields, but also actively gather items once the boss dies.

Note that when I say severely, I do not mean stuff like 3 deaths and you're out, or 1 death and you're out. I mean stuff like dropping the player's quest ranking to A, then to B, and have A reward 75% of total rewards, B reward 50%. This way the highest rewards are not axed, but the player does not get as many Excubes / Photon Spheres / Disks as in the case of getting S. And it will also help to serve as a way to try to improve one's self.The game HAS places where that kind of thing can be applied, and it's not normal EQs.

If you think the difference between playing well and not is only 10 seconds you must be out of your mind. 10 seconds is usually enough to make or break getting another run in anyway. That said, who cares whether or not other players want to improve in casual content in a casual game? Just look at expert matching. So many people just give up on it. What makes you think tying rewards to number of deaths is going to make those people want to improve? Anyone who is dying enough to exhaust everyone's resources probably won't care either way.

People will AFK for rewards regardless of how death affects them, but I've never even really seen someone do literally nothing.

EDIT: I think a better way to put what I'm trying to say is that the reward for good play in PSO2 has been overachieving, not avoiding large punishment failure for a long time. In a casual game, rewarding people for doing well is better than punishing people for doing poorly because it gives hardcore players something to strive for, while making sure the game is fun for casual players. It's fine if death is a slap on the wrist that only costs time, in a game where doing well means you want to waste as little time as possible. I've seen the difference in drops from getting 2-1 vs 2-2 alone. Heck, even in the 2-1 runs where people break all the turrets and try to break the flybys I get considerably more drops than my runs where people don't. The point system in the new EQ is perfect for that.

Heck, if you really want to tie player deaths to it, then losing personal points would probably make more sense, but that's effectively the same as what you said, so eh.

[Loveless62]

They've been eating it up for a long time, but we're already long past the stage where failing and dying in EQs actually meant something. A lot of things that have been added over the course of 6 episodes need to change before dying and rezzing can be meaningful again.
Be careful what you say about this, or Sega will give us another EQ like Deus rematch or Dragon rematch with death limits.

[Karen Erra]

Man, when did it start to be necessary to punish people who may not be playing very well and everybody is up in arms that people "need to" improve. If someone wants to improve, send him or her on getting the super awesome expert requirement done. Even though I still think it's fucking stupid, I think punishing somebody for playing bad is fine for that or in content like solo UQ. But for a regular EQ like this, c'mon. Just let the people have fun. I also don't get why the auto resurrect is so bad in a lot of peoples eyes... isn't it pretty irrelevant if the game auto-revives you or another player does?
The person will get revived either way (unless the participants of the MPA are all douchebags and even then you could still use your half-doll), so I don't really see the point in that complaint.

[Dark Mits]

As a Su player "lol".You have to clarify this for me. I guess you mean that as Su your stats are overshotting mine by a large gap? Which would be in your benefit :-D


The game HAS places where that kind of thing can be applied, and it's not normal EQs.Disagree. The game, and any game in general, should have mechanics that are possible to fail in all content that isn't labeled "Practice".


If you think the difference between playing well and not is only 10 seconds you must be out of your mind.It was a rough estimate, but let's think of it this way. 8 players in the field require 8mins to clear the quest assuming everyone plays their best. Someone dies and they are unable to perform for 10-15 seconds until someone else rezzes them. Then they die a second time, and then they die a third time. That's 45seconds of them not contributing, or in other words 435/480 = 90,6% upkeep. At the same time, 3 other players also spend 10 seconds each to stop their damage actions, so that they run and rez the dead player, and then run back to the enemies. The upkeep of those is 470/480 = 97,9%.

So we can consider that the group now has 4 players with 100% upkeep, 3 player with 98% upkeep (the ones who stop to rez) and 1 player with 90% upkeep (the player who dies). So the total group performance is at around 98%, or about 2% slower. 2% of 8mins is 7 seconds. This does not take into account downtime between waves which can be used to rez players without performance hit, as well as performance hit due to losing buffs. But I think that on average, assuming that the above numbers are realistic, then having 3 deaths in a quest just slows it down by about 10seconds.


10 seconds is usually enough to make or break getting another run in anyway. That said, who cares whether or not other players want to improve in casual content in a casual game? Just look at expert matching. So many people just give up on it. What makes you think tying rewards to number of deaths is going to make those people want to improve? Anyone who is dying enough to exhaust everyone's resources probably won't care either way. Yes, it makes or breaks getting another run. And that's a good thing, it gives players an incentive to want to strive for better performance.

The players who care to improve are exactly those who care to improve. What I mean is that if I want better results, I will have to see what I am doing wrong, what I can change, what I can fix, what of those changes and fixes is within my time and currency budget etc. This also applies for Expert. Those who gave up, and this includes me, are those who see that the amount of effort and changes required to overcome the obstacle are too great to be a quick and easy fix.

Tying rewards to player performance may not make players want to improve, but it will make some of them. And that's a win for everyone.


People will AFK for rewards regardless of how death affects them, but I've never even really seen someone do literally nothing.I have entered Ultra Fields a total of 4 times since they were implemented. In 3 of those there was an afk person staying at a distance from the group, but strangely enough moved to the boss remains once it was cleared. It might have been someone's alt account, who took advantage of the guruguru design to get twice as many rewards for no additional effort, who knows. I wouldn't be surprised.


EDIT: I think a better way to put what I'm trying to say is that the reward for good play in PSO2 has been overachieving, not avoiding large punishment failure for a long time. In a casual game, rewarding people for doing well is better than punishing people for doing poorly because it gives hardcore players something to strive for, while making sure the game is fun for casual players. It's fine if death is a slap on the wrist that only costs time, in a game where doing well means you want to waste as little time as possible. I've seen the difference in drops from getting 2-1 vs 2-2 alone. Heck, even in the 2-1 runs where people break all the turrets and try to break the flybys I get considerably more drops than my runs where people don't. The point system in the new EQ is perfect for that.Yes, and I agree on that. The key is to determine what is extra rewarding vs what is punishment. For example, I mentioned above that S gives 100%, A gives 75% and B gives 50%. What if I said that S gives 200%, A gives 150% and B gives 100%? And I echo your observation regarding 2-1 vs 2-2 runs, because I have had similar happen to me.


Heck, if you really want to tie player deaths to it, then losing personal points would probably make more sense, but that's effectively the same as what you said, so eh.Yes. I prefer ranking per player than per mpa. Which is why I like the grading system in the Ultra Fields. And the good thing is that the reward isn't exactly game breaking either; 1st takes 3 xcubes, 2nd and 3rd take 2 xcubes, 4th and below get 1 xcube. You could say that the rewards are split 100% - 66% - 33% or 300% - 200% - 100%, but in the end they are a small extra reward for players who actually try to perform what is asked of them.

[ArcaneTechs]

You have to clarify this for me. I guess you mean that as Su your stats are overshotting mine by a large gap? Which would be in your benefit :-D


SU players are immortal as long as their pet doesn't die and even if it dies you can swap fast enough to still be alive yourself, but if I was a SU player in Armada I'd be getting my Maron Magnum ready every fly-by

[NightlightPro]

inb4 new UH TD + death limits

[isCasted]

As someone who generally asks for more challenging content, I mostly do it because it drives up value of self-expression, because extra constraints make you move involved in the process of clearing the challenge. That said, fairness is highly important for motivation. I'll be far more likely to improve myself if I am able to experiment and take extra risks, knowing that punisment for my mistakes will be predictable and I won't be screwed over by randomness or laziness of other people at mooning me.

Good god, it takes me back to DF Loser days when he was actually hard, when I gave a shit about gearing the best I could and complained about pug performance. I would throw moons at any given opportunity, rush my damage output more than anyone (because late block gaijin hour pugs), only to end up lying on the floor at the last 15 seconds of the fight and lose all EXP and drops because no one gave a shit about reviving me. It's a great thing that nowadays it's a non-issue in Expert pugs, but non-Expert players that actually have the potential to become Experts don't deserve to be held back by others. Autorevive is as good as it gets for that purpose with the current system.

[ArcaneTechs]

As someone who generally asks for more challenging content, I mostly do it because it drives up value of self-expression, because extra constraints make you move involved in the process of clearing the challenge. That said, fairness is highly important for motivation. I'll be far more likely to improve myself if I am able to experiment and take extra risks, knowing that punisment for my mistakes will be predictable and I won't be screwed over by randomness or laziness of other people at mooning me.

Good god, it takes me back to DF Loser days when he was actually hard, when I gave a shit about gearing the best I could and complained about pug performance. I would throw moons at any given opportunity, rush my damage output more than anyone (because late block gaijin hour pugs), only to end up lying on the floor at the last 15 seconds of the fight and lose all EXP and drops because no one gave a shit about reviving me. It's a great thing that nowadays it's a non-issue in Expert pugs, but non-Expert players that actually have the potential to become Experts don't deserve to be held back by others. Autorevive is as good as it gets for that purpose with the current system.

they dont have to feel the need to be held back anymore if they just clear the Expert Req

[Selphea]

I wasn't clear: 2.3k DEF + 1.7k HP assumes Deband Drink for RDR buff and TEcher present. Pre-buff states are lower (1,8K DEF + 1,4k HP). I don't think it's an unreasonably defensive build, in fact I get just 55 DEF and 270HP from affixes, which is extremely easy to reach with basic ones that drop around. I'd say the only reason to not be able to reach that, is to have specifically affixed for full damage, which is what we usually call "glass cannon". Having L-Party Toughness and permanent Jerky isn't unreasonable as well.

Now that you break it down i can say these are definitely not non-expert stats. Non expert means people are still gearing up and levelling classes and Techer remains one of the least popular classes based on class polls.

55 Def and 270 HP across 3 units is at least 4 basic affixes per unit on what looks like a Lightstream, Izane or Zeinesis set. These are farmed sets with planned out affixes. It's not something i realistically expect to see on players rocking 3x Stella Wall - and there are quite a few of those!

The purpose of these Armada/Yamato type quests are to help players gear up. The 15⭐s from this quest are pretty mediocre but they come pre-grinded and don't need a long assembly or upgrade path. I really wouldn't slow down the rate people get badges at all. It's welfare gear and if people put in the time they should get it.

There's a place for hardcore MLG content but Armada isn't the right kind of quest for it.

[Poyonche]

inb4 new UH TD + death limits

UH TD with one tower and all waves are "Warning" with "+60% Atk and HP" and at every death you have a -50% Rare Drop malus. :wacko:

[Kondibon]

The main thing I'll say is that if it wasn't so easy to have a lame cheap death in PSO2, or the content in question was built around doing organized groups on your own time I'd agree that the death penalty should be stricter. This isn't DMC or some single player game with standard level based progression though, it's a game where you're grinding the same quest multiple times a week, or even multiple times a day, for months. Expecting people to be at their 100% the entire time is dumb. I don't think anyone deserves to lose out on some of their drops in a regular quest because they happened to not be paying complete attention for a moment.

Also, as it is right now, even if you went along with the idea of rank affecting things, no one is going to lose ranks anyway unless people outright ignore them, which is what the 5 second revive is for.
So sure, slap a point penalty on getting less than an S-rank. :wacko:


SU players are immortal as long as their pet doesn't die and even if it dies you can swap fast enough to still be alive yourself, but if I was a SU player in Armada I'd be getting my Maron Magnum ready every fly-byI don't roll with multiple marons anymore so I can't do it every flyby. But yes I was joking about Su being immortal with "glass cannon" gear. Most of my deaths with Su in Armada happen because I forget the weapon palette swap hotkeys don't work during the trial announcement for the bosses at the end of sectors 1 and 2, so I throw melon or marron and can't switch to synchro before I get grazed by something with 5 hp left.

[Dark Mits]

Now that you break it down i can say these are definitely not non-expert stats. Non expert means people are still gearing up and levelling classes and Techer remains one of the least popular classes based on class polls.These stats are exactly the following:
Weapon: Ability III - 15 DEF
Rear: Historia Soul + Omega Reverie + Stamina III = 25 DEF + 100 HP
Arm: Ares the Soul + Ability III = 15 DEF + 35 HP
Leg: Ares the Soul + Double Reverie + Stamina III = 135 HP

With the exception of Ares, which I think I made with Historia and some random boss soul, everything else was just slapped from common drops.

-=Pre post edit=-
I just checked those Stellar Walls. They give combined 45DEF + 255HP. Excluding my weapon, that's 5DEF more and 15HP less than what I posted. Of course, the units themselves lack in DEF and HP compared to Austere + Lightstream.

Also, non-expert is a different discussion. Expert or non-expert is not a division based on stats, though they can affect to a minor degree; it's a division on skill and mindset.

[ArcaneTechs]

I don't roll with multiple marons anymore so I can't do it every flyby. But yes I was joking about Su being immortal with "glass cannon" gear. Most of my deaths with Su in Armada happen because I forget the weapon palette swap hotkeys don't work during the trial announcement for the bosses at the end of sectors 1 and 2, so I throw melon or marron and can't switch to synchro before I get grazed by something with 5 hp left.

i was meme'ing about maron revolver in Armada, not that having a couple for Sector 1/2 isnt a bad idea for ships

[Kondibon]

Now that you break it down i can say these are definitely not non-expert stats. Non expert means people are still gearing up and levelling classes and Techer remains one of the least popular classes based on class polls.I forgot to respond to this, but I've seen people with decked out moderately affixed lightstream sets in non-expert. Whether or not they just turned it off, were playing on an alt (it's off by default per character), or what, I don't know, but I've seen it enough that it's worth noting. I've also seen people in the help thread asking for help despite having better gear than me.


i was meme'ing about maron revolver in Armada, not that having a couple for Sector 1/2 isnt a bad idea for shipsSome day I'll level and candy my other Marons. Someday.

[Dark Priest]

I forgot to respond to this, but I've seen people with decked out moderately affixed lightstream sets in non-expert. Whether or not they just turned it off, were playing on an alt (it's off by default per character), or what, I don't know, but I've seen it enough that it's worth noting. I've also seen people in the help thread asking for help despite having better gear than me.

Some day I'll level and candy my other Marons. Someday.

Well i can tell you from my own experiences that sometimes we just tick it off. i do this fairly often for the ultra runs as well, go in none expert rooms to just help out, Although the downside to this is you're tanking quite a bit. For obvious reasons..

Or in other cases for people who aren't me, they are likely there in parties with their friends who are unable to get the expert tag.

[Kondibon]

Well i can tell you from my own experiences that sometimes we just tick it off. i do this fairly often for the ultra runs as well, go in none expert rooms to just help out, Although the downside to this is you're tanking quite a bit. For obvious reasons..

Or in other cases for people who aren't me, they are likely there in parties with their friends who are unable to get the expert tag.Yeah, those are the reasons I usually have it off too. Though, I have still seen cases of people with lightstream not being able to complete the expert requirements.

[Selphea]

These stats are exactly the following:
Weapon: Ability III - 15 DEF
Rear: Historia Soul + Omega Reverie + Stamina III = 25 DEF + 100 HP
Arm: Ares the Soul + Ability III = 15 DEF + 35 HP
Leg: Ares the Soul + Double Reverie + Stamina III = 135 HP

With the exception of Ares, which I think I made with Historia and some random boss soul, everything else was just slapped from common drops.

-=Pre post edit=-
I just checked those Stellar Walls. They give combined 45DEF + 255HP. Excluding my weapon, that's 5DEF more and 15HP less than what I posted. Of course, the units themselves lack in DEF and HP compared to Austere + Lightstream.

Also, non-expert is a different discussion. Expert or non-expert is not a division based on stats, though they can affect to a minor degree; it's a division on skill and mindset.

It looks like we can agree 3x Stella Wall and no Techer around isn't going to get players near 1.8k HP and 2.3k Def. Those need tanky affixes on a tanky set, beyond what the game normally gives (tanky affixes on squishy set) or what players normally affix (squishy or balanced affixes on tanky set).


I forgot to respond to this, but I've seen people with decked out moderately affixed lightstream sets in non-expert. Whether or not they just turned it off, were playing on an alt (it's off by default per character), or what, I don't know, but I've seen it enough that it's worth noting. I've also seen people in the help thread asking for help despite having better gear than me.

Some day I'll level and candy my other Marons. Someday.

Definitely there's going to be a range of people at different levels of gear. The quest is for everyone but they need to design for worst case scenarios, like matchmaking pulling 12 random lv85 Phantoms with 3x Stella Walls and +30 Ray together.


The main thing I'll say is that if it wasn't so easy to have a lame cheap death in PSO2, or the content in question was built around doing organized groups on your own time I'd agree that the death penalty should be stricter.

Agree and there's a whole lot of cause and effect behind those lame cheap deaths being a feature. There's been so many iframes and healing sources added over time that you need a complete cluster screw to endanger players now.

[Dark Mits]

Yep, unfortunately instant death mechanics have been Sega's "go to" solution for danger in quests, when they have already implemented a tool that would have better results: Max HP buff (like Sukunahime's during Magatsu).
-> Less chances of instant death which means...
-> More builds are viable
-> Avoiding damage is not significantly devalued since getting hit means that the player will have to recuperate anyway, ie. getting hit still produces "downtime"
-> Increases the relative value of -mate items, Star Atomizers and Mag HP Restore actions compared to Lifesteal, Megiverse and Resta, without again devaluing the latter.

[Loveless62]

inb4 new UH TD + death limits
UH TD4 with Apprentice's death beam could be interesting. :D

[Kondibon]

Yep, unfortunately instant death mechanics have been Sega's "go to" solution for danger in quests, when they have already implemented a tool that would have better results: Max HP buff (like Sukunahime's during Magatsu).
-> Less chances of instant death which means...
-> More builds are viable
-> Avoiding damage is not significantly devalued since getting hit means that the player will have to recuperate anyway, ie. getting hit still produces "downtime"
-> Increases the relative value of -mate items, Star Atomizers and Mag HP Restore actions compared to Lifesteal, Megiverse and Resta, without again devaluing the latter.I actually prefer the healing nerfs rather than more hp, because it makes the difference between stacking hp and stacking defense more of a consideration. The only problem is when it affects mates, since they do percent based healing.

[Flatflyer]

I think another interesting way to implement a healing "nerf" would be to make the health restoration be a regen instead of an instant heal maybe, that way we still get our usual heal power but we cant just chug our HP back up to full in half a second.

[Dark Mits]

I think another interesting way to implement a healing "nerf" would be to make the health restoration be a regen instead of an instant heal maybe, that way we still get our usual heal power but we cant just chug our HP back up to full in half a second.This is fairly close to Lifesteal, since Lifesteal from most abilities is getting back chunks of about 30-50 of your HP (around 2%-3%). It could work. I believe the game is in dire need of shifting player attention to more "stuff" outside of incoming enemy attacks that interrupt and the Just Attack window.

[NightlightPro]

I always thought it would be great if they could totaly make expert mode games even more harder. Since the name says it all, they should def. tweak expert mode runs with some additional stuff (for example: being incapacitated in expert armada makes you drop your earned points) but instead, expert runs will benefit players with better rates

[Kintama]

I always thought it would be great if they could totaly make expert mode games even more harder. Since the name says it all, they should def. tweak expert mode runs with some additional stuff (for example: being incapacitated in expert armada makes you drop your earned points) but instead, expert runs will benefit players with better rates

As much as i would appreciate such a change, the playerbase has been too pampered by sega for this, and will simply go with the option of going for the faster, less risky option for cubes; because virtual tokens are more valuable than sheer enjoyment.

[Dark Mits]

As much as i would appreciate such a change, the playerbase has been too pampered by sega for this, and will simply go with the option of going for the faster, less risky option for cubes; because virtual tokens are more valuable than sheer enjoyment.Which is also exactly why Expert Mode was implemented. It was not created so that it would be easier to find like-minded players for hard content; it was created to get rewards faster.

[NightfallG]

Dumb question time: Did they remove the AIS vs Gundam fight and just strip Sector 3 down to Dominus? I thought Gundam came before that one, but after Sector 2, Gundam didn't appear.

[Kondibon]

Dumb question time: Did they remove the AIS vs Gundam fight and just strip Sector 3 down to Dominus? I thought Gundam came before that one, but after Sector 2, Gundam didn't appear.Which boss is at the end is random. It's never both.

[NightfallG]

Which boss is at the end is random. It's never both.

Well shit, never knew that. I just always got the Gundam so I assumed. :v

[TakemiShinnosuke]

This EQ is so fast paced. Even with Hero I still cannot catch up lol. Just how lol

[RibbonSoft]

Well shit, never knew that. I just always got the Gundam so I assumed. :v

This isn't true. Stage 1 and 2 is random but stage 3 is not. Stage three always alternates between the two. So if you did Dominus this morning, the next Armada will always have you do AIS boss battle instead. Then if there is a third one in the day, you will do Dominus again. For example:

Armada 1 for the day: Dominus
Armada 2 for the day: AIS Battle (I generally skip this)
Armada 3 for the day (or Armada 1 for next day, depends how many are in a day): Dominus again
and repeat ad naseum:


It's based on which boss you fought last and when you do your next Armada quest so it is possible to schedule your runs to fight only one of the bosses. I always try to skip AIS one so i can always get Dominus since I find the AIS one boring.

[TakemiShinnosuke]

What if you exit the AIS fight upon entry , re-enter the quest and still get AIS ?? What then

[Sirius-91]

What if you exit the AIS fight upon entry , re-enter the quest and still get AIS ?? What then
Only counts clears, not if you abandoned the quest.