PSO2 will not be a good game without Server Side Saving!

[Fobius]

Today in a group, one person level 100 came into my game i asked them to leave politly... they eventually did. But before they did they admitted to using the GS to get them 100.
In another group today a guy admitted to duping.

Why do people have to cheat? Doesn't take the fun out of the game, and also ruin the economy of the game.

Anyways, PSO2 will be crap without server side save. They should have known this stuff would have happended.

[Ambrai]

I highly doubt that they will do that since I bet that a good percent of the player base does not play online. So they would lose the sales from that aspect.

My biggest concerns for PSO 2 that will make or break the game is....

Ditch the Serial Number BS. This wasn't done in the Japanese version and it shouldnt be done here. Its just too buggy.

Do not make saves read only.

Option to toggle the swear filter on and off.

Server side backups every 5 minutes of your char. That way if you crash and lose all your gear, you can shoot an email to sega who can send you your VMU file back as an attachment.

[Spy]

i agree with alotta Ambrai's ideas. As to server-side saving exclusivly I think that's a bunch of BS. Look at Diablo 2 and the joke it has become. The harder anyone makes it to cheat the better the cheaters get.

PSO2 Idea: Bigger chat bubbles, a "whisper" system, and an actual trade system. And no more damned DB's Sabers/Varistas.

[Ryoji]

Funny thing is, before the US release of PSO, Sega officials claimed they had protections against gameshark codes and such, when asked about it by various game news sources. Either it was a bunch of BS or their protections didn't help much. I'm voting for the 1st one.

PSO2 Ideas: Translucent chat bubbles, so they don't get in the way of other things going on, better yet, let there be a way to toggle a small section of the screen to display text messages, sorta like on any given First Person Shooter. That would be better than bringing up the chat log.
Would be nice if they could make the gameplay feel more...I dunno..3d. It feels too darn flat right now. Also would be nice if they implemented a skill system, sorta like in Diablo II. It would make gameplay deeper and more interesting. And more stuff with mags! I love mags! They're a wonderful idea! give them more of a personality and such, and have them do more things, like attacking or defending or something (depending on what type of mag they are). another really good option would be...get rid of the chat button on the controller, or at least give us the option to get rid of it and replace it with a useful skill slot... Or allow us to bind skills to the Function buttons on the keyboard. Switching weapons was also a deadly pain.. I'd also like the storyline to be set more in the actual Phantasy Star storyline, bring back arranged versions of old PS music, or new music with the same musical themes. And bring back the classic Phantasy Star designs. Oh and of course, give us more races, classes..and both genders of each http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/icon_smile.gif

[myau1]

Well there are plenty of other things to worry about than cheating! Gameplay, and options and technical stuff is what will make or break PSO 2. I am a level 100 and everyone online accuses me of cheating. In actuallity, only about 1 out of every ten people i encounter online actually cares whether i did or not. I did not cheat to get there. I play constatly. It sucks to see people ostrisized for the way they choose to play the game, but that just the way it goes. I say server side anything sucks. Why not ditch all this password and serial number crap and jut allow us to save our chars anytime we choose like. Set up save points all over the place. I have lost so many weapons and items due to the damn server. Im more conerned with the story and game play of the next game than I am with cheating. You should also be able to turn off the censorship crap. It's great to have that in there for parents of young kids but I'm 27 years old and I feel like i should be able to communicate in the way i feel nessassery, but that way if I type f**k kids wont see it but my friends playing with me will. Oh well only time will tell. At least we dont have to deal with the Metroid issue!

[Socrates]

Translucent chat bubbles, oh lord yes. Sometimes in a busy Lobby, I can't select anything on the menus because those darned bubbles obscure everything.

As to the skill system, if they don't implement that, maybe at least have it so that if you use a spell a lot of times, you get better with it. That way, a person who has used Gibarta almost exclusively for the last ten levels would be significantly better with it that another player with the exact same stats that just yesterday bought the disk. That way, you could end up with 'specialist' forces. You could do the same thing with Hunters and Rangers with their weaponry -- a hunter that uses dagger-type weapons all the time, or sword-type, etc.

Some other ideas I'd love to see:

- a second template. Six slots, especially for forces, just isn't enough. My suggestion: have all four buttons be assignable hotkeys, with a right trigger template and a left trigger template. Want to recenter the screen? Both triggers at the same time.

- How about using the d-pad for more than just assigning chat macros? Several opportunities present themselves -- let and right could be used to rotate your character, up and down could be used to cycle through available targets in range.

[ninvampire]

I just thought of another way to better impliment combos. I'd like to see combos that you can "learn" that are even more dynamic and ditch the limit of 3 hit combos. Rather limit the combos based on feasibility of the weapon. Strength should be a factor on the ability to combo. For instance, daggers could have a virtually unlimited combo since they're easy to wield (And why must you move forward using such a weapon to combo?) Whereas a huge sword would require much more strength to continually swing around.

Guns on the other hand would have "combos" based on ammo limits. Rangers could consistantly fire off until they "run out of ammo" and have to "reload." It also doesn't make sense that guns could have a "hard attack." Special attacks would be permitable, but all gun shots should be considered "normal." In addition, damage from guns should be based on ATA, not ATP. It's not like being physically stronger will make a bullet do more damage.

Sega also needs to allow us to move while attacking. Being an action RPG, I think it's silly that you have to plant yourself to attack with all weapons. Certain weapons may require stability in order to be used (in certain situations) like a shotgun or railgun that would have a large recoil. Strength could be factored in here on the effect of the recoil. For example, someone with a higher strength may be able to absorb the recoil in their arms and be able to actually move around while firing their gun, albeit the accuracy would drop.

I have a few other ideas that I would like to elaborate upon, but I have a "project" that I will detail out in another post.

[Natasha]

Actually, hard attack does make sense for guns, I'd argue. Think of it, in the game the main difference between a normal and hard attack is the amount of time it takes. If you take an extra second to aim, then it would make sense to do more damage(especially in the ATA affecting damage system you proposed...) Though, in this situation hard attacks being more innacurate(like they are in the game) doesn't make sense...

[ninvampire]

Ahh ... very good point. I shall definitely ammend this into the list I am working on.

[ReikenFeralsbane]

of course, my customization is a must in pso2. i dont like seeing me everywhere, even though my character reiken is the best lookin one (scar and all). they should be more races to choose from, new alien species, cyborg (can use techs, but is like an android) myabe like some nekos for the japanese people who love them so much, kats are koo.
new trade feature is a must. thats the only thing sonic team deserves a slap in the face for imho.
take out those godam db sabers man, and have an actual "luck" stat that helps you get better items.
oh oh!!!! infinite bank!!!!! you can only put like 100 items in that thing, if that. expand it man, i got like 40 grinders, and im a weapons collector, i need the space!
hhmm...alot more mags, so i dont see my mag everywhere i go, or that cape lookin one, everyone has that. im tempted to use my mag cell. oh the sector id crap...stupid, take it out, i meen leave it in, just take out the factor that it determines what weapons and items you get.
http://us.f122.mail.yahoo.com/ym/ShowLetter/pso.jpg?box=Inbox&MsgId=9589_10673_778_858_27246_0&bodyPart=2&filename=pso.jpg&YY=95723&order=down&sort=date&pos=0

[EvilEd]

No! No! No! Don't remove Section IDs! The game is much more interesting with. In fact. add more section IDs and while you're at it add more weapons only available to certain section IDs.

Why bother trading with other players if everyone can get the same rare weapon. I find it more interesteng when I encounter a player with a weapon I've never seen before.

I'd even go further with it. Mag evolution is effected by your Section ID, (A & B). But how about splitting into A, B, C, and D? So many possibilities.

How about making Section IDs determine how a dungeon is randomly contructed w/ monsters. Have each section ID have it's own unique boss monster? That would encourage online gaming more.

Bottom line is, there are just so many things Section IDs could be. Without it, it would get boring after awhile.

<font size=1>[ This message was edited by: EvilEd on 2001-02-22 13:09 ]</font>

[TheSilverWolf]

Storage space definitely needs to be changed. Currently, the limitations on how many items you can carry are based on the size of the VMU save. If they would increase the save size, they could increase the amount of items you could carry. I think the amount of items you are allowed should be based on your level. As you get to a higher level, you can carry more. Also, how much you can carry could be based on your characters strength. A strong character can carry more than a weak character. However, since force characters are weaker, they should be able to carry "magic" bags that can store heavy item and negate the weight factor. Then, you could have one or two bags in your inventory, and each bag could carry multiple items.

[Natasha]

Hmm... Section ID's should be kept but they need a massive revamp. Having it arranged such that you can't get everything with one character is a good idea, but the fact that certain weapon types etc. can be almost completely lacking simply due to the name you chose can be really irritating. Online, it's mildly annoying, but if you can play offline only...

Imagine having a 50+ hour hunter, and finding out that he'll be finding lots and lots of rare force weapons...(I'm a tad annoyed at this myself... my Ranger gets almost nothing but melee type weapons, which are nothing more than a cash supply to me *sigh*)

So, have the section ID's influence things, but let the class of the characte rinfluence it as well... to make certain you get stuff you actually can use(not everything you can use, and not necesarily the best stuff you can use, but at least something rare and usefull)

[Lugnut]

Spy, I don't know where u get off claiming server side saves is BS. I'm not sure if u ever played the original Diablo online but that just became ridiculous because of client-side saving (cheating). Eventually everyone caught on to the cheating and they all had the same gear near infinite money, etc. etc. It just took the fun out of the game. Anyways, I believe server side is where it is at. I have been playing Diablo II for a long time now and I feel the server side saving is much better than client side. Sure, you still have your share of cheaters in packet sniffing (patched!) and duping (legend or fact?). Yet, there are no instantaneous lvl 100 characters (99 in D2). Also, a server-side save would prevent alot of item losses, etc. Anyways, thats my take on subject. See ya in Puck 09!

[Arcadean]

Ambrai should be working for Sega on PSO2 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/icon_razz.gif

[Fobius]

Ok...
One I never said server side exclusive. You can still have online and offline play with with server side exclusive. Just do what diablo2 did. If you don't want server side exclusive then play on a regular seganet server, this character could also be played offline and brought online to a regular seganet server. Then you can also have specific server side servers, which characters can only be played online.

They will have to implament this some time anyways, seganet will be going on even no the dreamcast won't... Seganet is going to be multiplatform, probably PS2 and XBOX.

I agree with other points made about how to make the game better. We need to be more involved, like some sort of skill system. Mags need to have more options and need to do more for us. For me, my mag only cast things on me like heal, buffs, or invuln when:
-I get a full photon bar
-Encounter a boss
-Almost at death, but still have to wait between 3-5 seconds at almost at death for it to cast anything on me... which most of the time I can't do that or I'll die, only time i can is when i just cleared out a spawn and I'm almost dead.

-Another key thing that needs to be implamented in PSO2. Is that all special items shouldn't be more powerful then all rare regular items. I will refer to diablo2 here but the names shouldn't be the same. Anyways in PSO2 there should be items like UNIQUES(Basically special items), and there should be RARES. Now there are rares in PSO but they are just slighty different versions of regular items in the game. There needs to be rares that can have special properties, maybe boosts stats more then a weapon of same type does. Cast stuff, perhaps cast stuff as it his instead of being a special attack...

-Would also like to see more hotkeyable things. 6 slots is not enough. And the photon blast needs to be on a different hotkey then Right button. I have countless number of times cast a photon blast bye mistake when i was tryign to access somethign like a heal on Right button.

-Anyways the list goes on and on....

One last thing, does anyone no if any of the makers of PSO visit these boards? Or do we know a way to get our ideas in there hands?

[Ryoji]

Server Side saving is definitely needed, of course. Saved Diablo II from becoming as lame as Diablo I was in the end. I swear, I quit playing Diablo I when I was town-killed for the first time.
-I do believe there should be a real trade system in here. The lack of a trade system makes it more prolific for thieves to practice their shady selfish trade and infuriate decent honest players.
-I think the guild card system should be fleshed out a bit more. Would be cool to have a real e-mail system on there instead of the simple mail but I don't know how feasible that would be. Also, I totally hated the sudden loss of all of my guild cards at random times. What could possibly cause this? It would be very frustrating trying to get in contact with these people the way the lobby system is set up without the guild card. if there was a way to do a search, or see a list of names of people who are on each server, that would be nice. Something must also be done about the Display of names in the chatroom. if people are close together in your line of site, the names overlap and are hard to distinguish. Of course these are absolutely trivial things, and there are more important issues to worry about, such as cheating and gameplay issues.
-I tooootally agree to having more slots. I think that the left trigger being used as the "reset view" option is a total waste of a valuable button. I agree that the "hold both triggers to reset view" thing would be most appropriate. also, that could be a way to cast the photon blasts as well. Just press both of the triggers and then the appropriate button and there you go. Who cares if it resets your view. Are you really concerned on where the camera is pointed when you cast your photon blast?
-I'm not totally sure if it's done in PSO, but I think ATA should affect how easily you lock onto things. It's a downright pain as it is right now, being aimed slightly askew from your target and a slight nudge may face you in the wrong way, and still not get a lock on. I also have problems locking on to mines when using the Diska type swords. It locks on, then when I attack, the lock disappears. and why can't we attack the mines with our other weapons besdies projectiles and spells? Ah well, minor quibble really.
-I'll say it again (even though it's been beaten to death)...unique still systems for each individual class/race.
-Touching on the camera thing again, why not give us the option of locking the camera directly behind us? Sure it would change up character movement a bit but some players might like it like this.
-I pretty much figure that PSO2 will be of the "Diablo" grain of multiplayer RPG, but wouldn't it be nice for there to be a full fledged MMORPG based in the Phantasy Star world? There are so many ideas rushing into my head that I don't really have the room to put it in this thread.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

[TommyWichita]

Ok folks I have a question...We are all making comments on how PSO2 should be done...but is anyone submitting this info to Sonic Team? We should inform them if noone is. I am sure that some of the great ideas that I read would be added. If need be I will submit them myself if someone gets a list together..

[DCKaz]

Well a few things-

many of these are obvious points to anyone with EQ and Diablo2 experience.. it's a worthy submittal refined, but lets look what they did right and why some things might have been decided-

protection actually was pretty good. codes didn't get hacked till later, rares can't be hacked, and jumping to 100 characters really knocks out the fun of a cheat (50-60 I could see.. 100? most retire then lol).

duping didn't work at all, though unfortunately one workaround seems to have slipped but it's a bit roundabout (no I won't discuss it), non-trivial, and IMO inherently a bit risky.

server side saving, even at 30 seconds or 1 minute time still doesn't work.. no offline. Even if you wanted that, lets talk of lag addition.. any of you play realm servers with D2? And compare to open? D2 is a lag beast with a modem on a realm server.. period. If you do some mix of offline/server saving gameshark can still slip in. If you go all online and aren't regular enough what stops me from logging off right after I drop my rares (last save I had them - disconnect) meanwhile a buddy picks them up and saves normally? The easiest dupping you'll find.

It isn't trivial gang. You want offline and online in tandem. You want cheats stopped. You want lag free play on a modem. You want perfection in the first or second online console rpg to grace the market. Personally I'll buy PSO2 if saving is *exactly the same way*. PSO is an addictive game, and I'd rather see more class/races, levels, and custom slots then this whole ball of wax tweaked so now complaints will shift elsewher, with cries of 'too much lag', 'why can't I use my offline character' or 'could duping/cheating be any easier?'

In some ways I agree with the people who suggested they've done too much already. I've had to restart my character.. which crushes *my personal* enjoyment more.. losing a character I've lovingly grown up and customized, or the fact KewlD00d93285 can dupe is rare and trade it?

I'd like to see a real trading system (Diablo2 or EQ are fine examples) and added security, no question. But boy this has got game as is, and I'd rather have more game, then all the time for improvements focused on stopping trouble cheaters and thieves.. one can avoid a bit of the latter, but one is restrained to the classes/races/levels of the former.