Utterly pissed off...

[JordanM]

After reading the update news on PSU, i have recently become bummed out by the game.


2.2: So erm, is it like PSO's offline mode?
A: Not really. While PSO's offline mode was essentially the online multiplayer mode without team-mates, PSU features an in-depth story, forcing you to play a central character who slowly unravels the mysteries of the Graal system, encountering, and teaming with, a host of other adventurers. This leads you on a (pre-determined) line of events, much like your conventional single-player RPG. It is not known if you will be able to accept outside quests or missions in the offline game, but it is extremely doubtful. The core battle system and gameplay mechanics however, are the same in both 'versions'.

2.3: Can I create my own character to play as in offline mode?
A: No. In offline mode, you play as Ethan Waber, a pre-created male human character, conjured up by Sega. It has recently been revealed however, that you will be given the ability to customise Ethan's outfit somewhat, which will then be reflected in all ingame events and cut-scenes.

2.4: Is there a multiplayer offline mode?
A: No. The only offline mode that exists, is the single-player story mode.

There's a 50% chance I might consider paying monthly. But then again, look how bad the other PSOs have bombed because of Pay to Play.

[OdinTyler]

How is this bad? Youre getting 2 different types of modes to choose from.

1) If you like traditional RPGs without an online element, you have offline mode to work on. Have fun & beat it. When you do, youve conquered a good game.

2) Online mode takes what is in offline & expands it as you have a char created by you, expanding what youve been through before. Basically, higher replay value.

Personally, I havent seen too many RPGs do something like this. We may not agree with everything put forth in PSU, but, you gotta admit, its alot to choose from.

[Shadow_Wing]

Well you don't have to play online, its all really a choice you have. I don't believe that PSO was really killed by pay to play (FFXI, WoW, EQ, SWG and so many others are pay to play) but was just underdogged by being on non-popular consoles (DC and GC noteablely).

[ouhei]

I think the new offline mode is great, having a PS game with a big detailed story is awsome, I always wished there was more story in PSO. And the online gameplay seems to be very unique and fun.

I don't really see how you can say the other PSO's bombed on pay to play, the GC version was packed for a long long time. I can't remember if PSO version 1 on DC was p2p, its been so long since I played >.< BB seems to be decently occupied considering the complete lack of promotion for it here in the states.

[OdinTyler]

Well, Ive played PSO since V1. I remember when there was freeplay & other times you had to pay. Needless to say, that was annoying. But, a fact of life. PSU is giving more from the beginning than PSO ever has. I say give it a chance. When you get the game, you have 2 modes to choose from. Whatever you choose, based on what we know, I cant see how you wouldnt come away loving this game. Take it from someone who's tried it already. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Tomeeboy]

It could have been much much worse. They could have scrapped the 40-hour offline story mode all together and just released a game that was online only and pay to play. Having both a massive offline story mode and a massive online mode is not a common feature of RPGs these days.

[Dre_o]

Well said Odin and Tomee, an those of you who dissagreee gotta remember, THE GOOD THINGS IN LIFE AREN'T FREE AND you get what you pay for. (most of the that is, don't pick me apart for that)

[ajenteks]

On 2006-01-16 19:39, JordanM wrote:

look how bad the other PSOs have bombed because of Pay to Play.



Is it the Pay to Play that killed them, or the lack of support Sonic Team gave in exchange for the money? v2, and Episodes I & II were all bug, exploit, and hack ridden from the get-go, with asshats like Barubary in the limelight of the communities and Sonic Team doing nothing in response.

I think Sonic Team is the reason the Pay to Play versions bombed, and I think those are mistakes they've finally learned from, but we'll see.

[OdinTyler]

LOL Barubary! Is he still playing? Hes still there? Man that dude was ridiculously famous over what hes done. Its not directly the pay to play that kills games but the lack of support from admins on a server. If they just take our money & dont do their jobs, that would kill any game out there. Its up to ST to step up & do the right thing this time around. If they dont, theyre really digging quite the hole.

[Yummi]

I agree what kills an online p2p game is mainly the lack of new content. If the servers are not maintained, and the quests aren't given like promised the game will likely bomb once everyone hits the max level. It doesn't neccessarily mean the game is crap, or is a flop. It just means once you do your business youre forced to move on unless you like that kind of repetition.

[Kent]

Sonic Team has no justification for taking money for PSO. Blizzard does the same type of game (non-MMO, instance-based online RPG), does it for free, and has better servers and provides more support. :/ That monthly fee is basically all profit (or, at least, a very large portion of it is profit).

However, if in PSU we get regular updates and cheat prevention (unlikely), then it may be worth it.

[Sinue_v2]

Well, on the plus side, you could look at it this way...

When PSO was around, Sega was in dire streights financially. Sonic Team probably couldn't afford to keep a dedicated team of designers working on new content constantly - and our HL fees went to helping to fund development on new games like Blue Burst, Sonic, and Billy Hatcher.

However, since the Sammy merger - Sega is in a much better position financially, and they can definately spare the extra cash to hire full-time moderators and updaters. Blue Burst could have this also, but it was more or less just and experiment with netcode to see what worked and what didn't, in anticipation for PSU. PSO's good name was already too far ruined for them to really make a 180 turnaround.. so they probably let many of the issues with it slide and put the extra money towards making PSU even more stable.

Though, weither or not that's the case.. has yet to be seen. Sonic Team should definately have adequate funding this time around - both the make the product solid initially as well as provide continued and consistant online support. There really was no excuse for the abandonment of PSO - and there sure as hell won't be any for PSU when the need arises.

[Yummi]

On 2006-01-17 04:18, Sinue_v2 wrote:
Well, on the plus side, you could look at it this way...

When PSO was around, Sega was in dire streights financially. Sonic Team probably couldn't afford to keep a dedicated team of designers working on new content constantly

They were in dire straits but they managed to give the Japanese version alot of events, maintence, and downloadable quest the NA version didn't have. One has to speculate is it just flat out laziness with the translation, or them not caring about a specific playerbase.

[DarK-SuN]

Considering that, at the time, the majority of US players were cheaters and were ruining the game entirely, it's of no surprise they neglected the US audiance in the DC days.

An example of this is a certain event (forgot which) that the US didn't have, but JP and EU users did.
It also happenned in the GC version if I'm not mistaken.
Of course, US players could still log into the EU ships and play the quest, so it's no biggy; might have been more the lazyness of SEGA of America to put them up, rather than lazyness of Sonic Team itself.

[SirAri]

I was dissapointed about the lack of offline player customization, due to the fatc that I like to get friends get together and play pso.

But I'll probly end up paying to play due to the awesomeness.

Question: Can you have two people play online via the same console?

Also, who is Barubary? And what did he do?

[DarK-SuN]

Also, who is Barubary? And what did he do?


Barubary was a person who didn't rest until he/she/it made sure that all kinds of cheats were made available and all sorts of protections were broken for the Dreamcast version of PSO (both V1 and V2), rendering such versions of PSO the incubators of cheaters, GSers (as they were called back then) and "script kiddies" alike.

[Yummi]

On 2006-01-17 05:22, DarK-SuN wrote:
Considering that, at the time, the majority of US players were cheaters and were ruining the game entirely, it's of no surprise they neglected the US audiance in the DC days.

Not entirely true. ALOT of players did not cheat on the mass scale it was definately sorted few. I remember playing for maybe 3 or 4 months before I ran into my first Resta assassination. Most of the US players were not cheaters, and were forced to do so to get the rares that werent ever to be released to us. Like Eggblaster, and alot of other ones. These were jpn events only, and you couldn't participate without the japanese version. And as for neglecting the US audience, they started wayyyyyyyyyyy before we many many started cheating alot; dupes, mods, etc.. We had one or two downloadable quest from the release, and of 1 or 2 more were released then that's as far as it went.

And im pretty sure there were as many JP cheaters as NA, and if there weren't its simply because their servers had patches where they couldn't. I fondly remember Sega's ability to somehow send out a patch to stop certain rares from being obtained, but they couldn't send out a patch that stopped restakill? BSOD? Item Mod? They turned their focus on stopping NA from getting items that they'd never get legit anyway lol.

[DarK-SuN]

There was a patch for restakill and so on; after a while restakill only caused the caster itself to commit suicide, it was pretty funny, I assure you.

JP patches were the same as the US and EU patches.
Trust me, there were plenty more US cheaters than from any other region put together.
One such example was the fact you could go to a JP and EU ship with relative safety, but not so in the US.

I played for way more than 3 to 4 months before I found a cheater; I played PSO for the DC since V1JP (which barely had cheaters), then V1EU (which was around the US release date as well, when the cheaters started to "prosper"), V2JP (there was a period of "cheatlessness", then it all went to hell as soon as Barubary started to release stuff), V2PC (which was for asian territories only), V2US (it was already hell hole by then) and then V2EU before jumping to PSOX and PSOGC (and later PSOBB), making for 5 years of PSO gameplay.
Of course, this is just my opinion, from my own experiences; I could have been lucky/unlucky in my PSO experiences more, or less, than you.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DarK-SuN on 2006-01-17 05:52 ]</font>

[Sinue_v2]

They were in dire straits but they managed to give the Japanese version alot of events, maintence, and downloadable quest the NA version didn't have.

Not really. I don't think the JP got much more than a handful of extra quests the US and EU players didn't throughout the entirety of PSO's Dreamcast stint. Maintinence was done on all servers, and many of the events were sponsored in part by outside companies like Famitsu Magazine, which isn't available in the US.

Actually, I think the only weapon which was released durring a special JP only even was the Heaven's Punisher. The EggBlaster and Nei's Claw remained banned items up till v.2 when Towards the Future was released. The only other Japanese only quest/eventI can recall which gave out specialized items that the US/EU didn't get was Sunset by Secret Base in which you could gain mag cells.

GC Ep I & II did a much better job at providing all quests for all territories... and recieved a helluva lot more quests and events (though not maintience) than the DC versions ever did. However, it was still patetically low considering the HL price hike.

[vox3om]

All I can say is that I'm praying for this game to eventually be released on xbox360 lol. I've got it sitting here...but it would look so much better with a nice PSU SITTING NEXT TO IT!

[Sinue_v2]

Considering PSO's near blanketing coverage this generation - I see no reason why Sonic Team wouldn't eventually port it to the next generation consoles, with perhaps Revolution being the only exemption depending on how well they can adapt the control scheme to the Revo's new controller.

[Kano-Okami]

If the 360's security is as malleable as its predecessor, then getting PSU on this new xbox shouldn't be a problem. /mod

[OdinTyler]

1. I have to say that there were ALOT of cheaters from the JP servers. Thats not to say they came from just one region. Its sad to say there were alot of cheaters all around & thankfully, with online & offline separate, that holds off alot of them.

2. None of us want to pay per month for service. However, if ST keeps up their end, I dont see there being a problem. Its only when they fail to do as they say they will that a problem arises.

3. In the past, Japan has seen more content as a whole than other regions. Its just a fact, no sense denying it. Giving content to only your region is a pretty bad way to do business, but, not much can be done about that. I only pray that such practices do not continue on PSU.

4. Given that Japan doesnt particularly like the Xbox, I really dont see it being on the X360. To say over & over 'I want it on a next-gen console' is completely missing three points:

a. If ST wanted it for other consoles, it would be delayed as such.
b. The consoles were chosen for the reasons given. Anything a player says is merely speculation & not necessarily what ST will do.
c. IF (& this is a BIG IF) a next-gen were to be considered, since what I stated above about Xbox is true, expect the other consoles to possibly get a shot, not the X360.

[Espilonarge]

Ok lets get some facts straight.

PSU is a new game thats started from scratch meaning no other code from other games has been implemented. Second, Sonic Team has already stated that PSU will only be released on PS2 and PC and no other console. Third, only certain elements from PSO have been implemented but no code was used from it.

If duping/crashing becomes a hassle again, it will most likely be taken more seriously. If Sega does do there job right (since thats who works the servers) then the server will be modified and patches will be sent out. Hopefully it'll be more like a firewall this time around, blocking out possible problems before they happen.

Personally I'm getting somewhat tired of the people here who hate P2P, want to see it on GC/360/Etc or arn't happy because theres no "Offline" mode like in PSO (as in Offline like PSO, not the Story.) Be glad this is a new game and not just another dumbed up version of PSO.

Now do I have to start stuffing peoples mouths full of cookies to shut them up?

[OdinTyler]

Hey Espil Im with you. Hand me some cookies so we're ready to stuff mouths (if need be). LOL Finally, someone who's paying attention! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[DizzyDi]

On 2006-01-17 17:21, Espilonarge wrote:
Ok lets get some facts straight.

PSU is a new game thats started from scratch meaning no other code from other games has been implemented. Second, Sonic Team has already stated that PSU will only be released on PS2 and PC and no other console. Third, only certain elements from PSO have been implemented but no code was used from it.

If duping/crashing becomes a hassle again, it will most likely be taken more seriously. If Sega does do there job right (since thats who works the servers) then the server will be modified and patches will be sent out. Hopefully it'll be more like a firewall this time around, blocking out possible problems before they happen.

Personally I'm getting somewhat tired of the people here who hate P2P, want to see it on GC/360/Etc or arn't happy because theres no "Offline" mode like in PSO (as in Offline like PSO, not the Story.) Be glad this is a new game and not just another dumbed up version of PSO.

Now do I have to start stuffing peoples mouths full of cookies to shut them up?



PREACH!

[DeathMachine]

MMMMM...cookies...Wait,...must stay on topic. How many quintillions of times are these SAME arguments to be made? Does no one read the previous topics? Will this have to be a sticky? Jeez! NO ONE ASK ANY OF THE PREVIOUS QUESTIONS AGAIN!

[SirAri]

On 2006-01-17 09:42, Sinue_v2 wrote:
Considering PSO's near blanketing coverage this generation - I see no reason why Sonic Team wouldn't eventually port it to the next generation consoles, with perhaps Revolution being the only exemption depending on how well they can adapt the control scheme to the Revo's new controller.



If you do a Wikipedia search, you'll find that the revolution also allows you to use your regular game cube controlers, so things like this wont be a problem.