Full MMORPG experience, or no? [Archive]

Wavey

May 1, 2006, 03:18 PM

Well its certainly multiplay from I what I have played. Its possible to solo, and also have your "tutor" npc fight with you. But I found it very hard in some areas like this. The lobbys can hold alot of people, which is a bit like a hub, with shops, etc. You can then form parties, or from what I have done, join random parties already in play. The game has levels, and within these levels there are, hmm, i'll call them Stages.

Again from what I have played, there is roughly 4 stages then a "rest stop" where you can purchase 'mates, fluids, etc. There are alot of players here also, who are also taking a "rest". I am unshure if you can add others here into your party. It is then onto another few stages then a boss.

Please correct me if I am wrong http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif I guess its "instanced" dungeons with big hub areas more akin to WoW/

Axios-

May 1, 2006, 03:25 PM

On 2006-05-01 13:10, Kou-Diacyper wrote:
It's hard to compare both games. WoW is more of a "sandbox" MMORPG. From what is being shown on the beta it's going to be contained to areas rather than just one big landscape.

Yeah, I'd agree with that. But remember, that its being contained can easily be a very good thing. With the issues that arise between kill-stealing and the like, instancing can be very useful. The way I see it is that even if all the players are in one vast world, how many are you ever interacting with at a time?

If the debate is between WoW and PSU, there are some very clear distinctions. First, WoW has been around for a long while now, but PSU will be brand new. That always weighs very heavily with me. Next, PSU is a bit more of an action RPG in that it's not click 'attack' and let your guy go haywire until you click something else. In PSU, it's press a button/key everytime you want to say, swing a saber. Whichever one you prefer is entirely your decision, but I choose the action orientation of PSO and PSU because I feel that it brings the player closer to the character.

Now, as for whether or not PSU is a full MMORPG experience or not. (Please people don't turn this into a thread debating the definition of 'MMORPG'. For the sake of this post, let's say PSU is one.) I think that PSU's online experience should provide enough entertainment and value to be worth your time and money regardless of whether you play the offline game or not. I'd say that PSO was definitely worth it for me, and it appears that PSU does just about everything PSO did and then some. The PS franchise has had a lot of experience with online gaming in the recent years, and I wouldn't expect them to drop the ball there. I'd be more concerned about whether the offline game lives up to the early PS games. (Not that it won't. >_>) However, for more details on just what the experience is like, consult your nearest beta player. I'm not one of them. -.-

Oh, and if my opinion or most other people's on this board opinion's matter to you, get PSU. It never hurts to boost the population http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

Okay, well, sometimes it does hurt to boost the population; just not now.

Shade-

May 1, 2006, 04:06 PM

It's far more of a MORPG than a MMORPG. any interaction that goes on in cities will be unhindered and much like a MMO, but as far as the actual gameplay, it's going to be always limited to 6 players, far from "massive". Granted, most of the time in the other MMOs, you don't interact with anyone outside your party anyway, so how much is actually lost due to the party system is arguable. But it your party is struggleing with a bungh of mobs, high level players cannot swoop in and save the day. Really, that's about all that is lost other than large scale PvP and massive boss fights.

Nubaa

May 1, 2006, 04:22 PM

PSU and PSO are probably much more comparable to something like Guild Wars.

[ This Message was edited by: Nubaa on 2006-05-01 14:23 ]

Shivore

May 1, 2006, 04:22 PM

So if I understand this right, PSU will pretty much force you to be in a party all the time, unlike the free MMORPGs I've played, and WoW, where it's more optional. If that's the case, then that's good. I've also looked at reviews for PSO and the are all good, and this looks like it will be even better. I think what I'll do is try the 7 day free trial that WoW offers every once in a while, just to see if it really is special, but most likely I'll go for PSU. I don't think I'll buy anything until September at the extreme earliest, so I've got some time to watch and really think about which way to go. Thanks for the help guys, and if anyone else has something to help me decide, let me know.

Shade-

May 1, 2006, 04:25 PM

On 2006-05-01 14:22, Nubaa wrote:
PSU and PSO are probably much more comparable to something like Guild Wars.

Yepp, it works in the same basic way guild wars and teh new D&D game work. cities are full MMORPG style, but dungeons are instanced for your party only.

Foxfire15

May 1, 2006, 04:25 PM

In a sence. though, with hopefully, a better interface. I hated the guild wars interface.

Axios-

May 1, 2006, 04:27 PM

I don't think that PSU will necessarily 'force' you to be in a party, but it will definitely encourage it more than a lot of other games. In some other games, the party systems seem to be built just for fun while the best training is in being alone. PSO wasn't like that, and it appears that PSU isn't either.

voxie

May 1, 2006, 04:35 PM

What I love about PSO (and PSU?) is that it's easy to pick up and play as well as drop. You don't have to be stuck in a game for hours, just do a quick mission run or whatever... it's perfect for all kinds of player moods, the long-term and short-term http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

RoninJoku

May 1, 2006, 04:51 PM

crap it won't let me delete my post >.>

Basically, what Voxie said sums up my feelings...

[ This Message was edited by: RurouniJoku on 2006-05-01 15:05 ]

linkzone

May 1, 2006, 05:18 PM

My room mate plays WoW nonstop, it looks cool but im a fan of PSU, and i dont like playing more than one online game at a time. I got board with Guild Wars fast. So now i wait for PSU with bells on.

RFB

May 1, 2006, 05:40 PM

Why does people keep comparing PSU to Guild Wars, when the only thing that both have in common, is that maps are instaned for each group?

Classes, skills, equipment, even the environment is completely different, GW is medieval, PSU is sci-fi.
And the most important difference of all: the battle system. GW has the typical online RPG battle system, where you click on the enemy, auto attack activates, then you go choosing skills and moving around. PSU on the other hand, is hardcore real time. It's almost like a beat-em-up.

Forget about soloing in PSU. 1)it's pretty rough to do anything worthwhile without a group of 3-4 players 2)with others is when the fun starts in PSO. Techs flying, hunters spamming P-Arts while the bullets from the rangers come at top speed from behind them.
3)

What I love about PSO (and PSU?) is that it's easy to pick up and play as well as drop. You don't have to be stuck in a game for hours, just do a quick mission run or whatever... it's perfect for all kinds of player moods, the long-term and short-term Voxie nailed it.

Some extra notes:
1)You're asking wether to get WoW or PSU in a PSO/PSU board? aint it obvious what the answer is? =P

2)Now seriously, avoid WoW. During the time it'll take you to get to level 60, and once you reach there, do a buncha runs of the 5-10 men instances, you'll love the game. After that, forget it. PvE is like a big lottery: raid kills a 40-man boss, then pray so that an item you want drops. Then pray so that you win the DKP bids for it over everyone else on the raid that wants the same item. And PvP wise, Blizzard killed it. Thats mainly what made me leave WoW. PvE seemed pointless, and PvP was no more.

3)If you really wanna see what PSU is like, http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic=110971&forum=20&start=0
There are a lot of pictures and videos from beta players in there, you can take a look of what the game is like.

Shade-

May 1, 2006, 06:04 PM

On 2006-05-01 15:40, RFB wrote:
Why does people keep comparing PSU to Guild Wars, when the only thing that both have in common, is that maps are instaned for each group?

Classes, skills, equipment, even the environment is completely different, GW is medieval, PSU is sci-fi.
And the most important difference of all: the battle system. GW has the typical online RPG battle system, where you click on the enemy, auto attack activates, then you go choosing skills and moving around. PSU on the other hand, is hardcore real time. It's almost like a beat-em-up.

Forget about soloing in PSU. 1)it's pretty rough to do anything worthwhile without a group of 3-4 players 2)with others is when the fun starts in PSO. Techs flying, hunters spamming P-Arts while the bullets from the rangers come at top speed from behind them.
3)
*snip*

Very good points. The connections I was trying to draw was the simmalarities in the actual networking of the games. I didn't mean they were similar gameplay wise at all, but it really isn't common knowledge, and I shouldn't have treated it as such http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

Axios-

May 1, 2006, 06:07 PM

Has anyone else had enough of medieval-set ORPGs? I know I have. -.-

PSU a gogo, baby!

vitius137

May 1, 2006, 06:15 PM

medieval mmos have been done to death. anyway i really hope that later on it will be possible to solo effectively... thats one of the big things im looking forward to.
Guild Wars phailed for me for 3 reasons.
1)repetitive gameplay
2)low level cap (reach max level in one week and get your desired build by two weeks tops, after that theres not much more you can do)
3)NO SOLOING!! T_T you have to spend time running around town like an idiot looking for a party willing to accept you and if you just want to do a quick something you have to get henchmen to be able to beat a single group of enemies.

RFB

May 1, 2006, 06:56 PM

Vitius, you wont have soloing, but you wont need it either. Remember, in GW, you cant join a group thats already on a map.
In PSU, you can join already started missions, as long as the team is not full, and you meet the requirements for the mission.

You wont be able to do anything alone, but you'll never be alone, you will always be able to join someone.

electricocean

May 1, 2006, 07:03 PM

I've played so many damn MMORPG's in my 17 years on earth that I want to throw up.

Here's a list before I start ranting:

Dark Age of Camelot
World of Warcraft
City of Heroes
City of Villians
Ragnarok
Lineage 2
Everquest
Final Fantasy XI
Star Wars Galaxies
Anarchy Online
Eve
Guild Wars

Okay, now that I got my experience list out of the way, let me rant http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif.

You're trying to compare WoW to PSU.
Let me say this... if I ever pick up WoW again, it will be because I'm giving my account to someone.

The game gets so repetitive once you get to level 60.

I'm a level 60 Rogue in a guild that does the highest level instances(dungeons). You have to raid every week to get items, and go to the instance over, and over, and over, and over again praying to god that your little dagger will drop. Finally your little dagger drops, but OH NOES you don't have enough DKP because you got sick of waiting so took a piece of armor instead. So you know what that means? Four more weeks of raiding for you, guy.

The lower levels are fun as someone pointed out. I personally bought the game thinking the PvP would be awesome, but no. It wasn't. It wasn't at all. PvP is like grinding levels, except your farming people over and over. It's not even competitive PvP. You don't care if you die in PvP at all. All you do is go to the graveyard and run back to your body and zerg the other players. Fun, right?

PSU seems fresh to me. Something different. I think they nailed the combat system on the head with the fast paced action type. I really like the whole "anime'ish" style to it too. It's done really well. The charachter customization looks outstanding too. The array of weapons seem awesome too, unlike WoW's boringness.

Me and my friends(there's 4-5 of us buying it) are planning on always running missions together on 360 all day playing together. This wasn't possible in most other MMORPG's because you ALWAYS needed the perfect balance of classes. But not in PSU.

Now that I'm done, I have a few questions http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif.

Is there PVP at all in this game in any way whatsoever?

Are there any mini games at all?

Are there player shops in the game?

How many different kind of clothes styles will there be in the shops? (estimate)

And how exactly does a mission work? Can I have an example of one full mission and how long it would take to go through?

Also, would you repeat the same mission anytime from levels 1-200.

Thanks.

-wintermute (someone took my damn name on the forums. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif )

RFB

May 1, 2006, 07:16 PM

On 2006-05-01 17:03, electricocean wrote:

I'm a level 60 Rogue in a guild that does the highest level instances(dungeons). You have to raid every week to get items, and go to the instance over, and over, and over, and over again praying to god that your little dagger will drop. Finally your little dagger drops, but OH NOES you don't have enough DKP because you got sick of waiting so took a piece of armor instead. So you know what that means? Four more weeks of raiding for you, guy.

The lower levels are fun as someone pointed out. I personally bought the game thinking the PvP would be awesome, but no. It wasn't. It wasn't at all. PvP is like grinding levels, except your farming people over and over. It's not even competitive PvP. You don't care if you die in PvP at all. All you do is go to the graveyard and run back to your body and zerg the other players. Fun, right?

I know how you feel. Level 60 Undead Rogue here too. I've only gone to Molten Core twice. Never more, thank you.

And PvP used to be fun. Before the Honor system. Before the honor system, you wouldnt grind in PvP. There was nothing to be gained trough PvP, cept for the thrill of competition against other players. Those, let me tell you, were AWESOME times. Camping with other rogues in stealth the Astranaar exit. The raids between Astranaar and CrossRoads. The UnderCity raids. The havoc at Booty Bay. The endless fighting at Tarrern Mill / Southshore. It was awesome.

Me and my friends(there's 4-5 of us buying it) are planning on always running missions together on 360 all day playing together. This wasn't possible in most other MMORPG's because you ALWAYS needed the perfect balance of classes. But not in PSU.

Just make sure you have at least 1 Force =P. Other than that, yeh, you can pretty much go with whatever the heck you want.

Is there PVP at all in this game in any way whatsoever?

Unknown. Not in the BETA, but we'll have to see in release. PSO has had a Battle mode for PvP since PSOv2 for DreamCast, but we dont know if we'll see it again on PSU.

Are there any mini games at all?

Unknown. But you can play hide&seek =P.

Are there player shops in the game?

I think you can have some sort of shop inside your room, not sure tho.

How many different kind of clothes styles will there be in the shops? (estimate)

Cant estimate XD but probably quite a nice bunch of them.

And how exactly does a mission work? Can I have an example of one full mission and how long it would take to go through?

It's not really a mission, regardless of the name. You just enter an area, hack&slash every mob, and at the end, depending on how many mobs you killed and how many times your party members died, you're given more or less money, and more or less class experience.

Also, would you repeat the same mission anytime from levels 1-200.

Nope. Missions have different difficulty levels, but you cant do them from 1 to 200. Well, you CAN, but it will take you a bunch of lifes to get to level 200 doing Colony part 1 Rank C.

electricocean

May 1, 2006, 07:28 PM

How long (on average) would a mission take?

Also, someone mentioned a "rest period" what the hell is that?

Oh and are there like objectives or no?

EDIT* You , for example, said Colony part 1.

Does that mean when you're done with part 1 you go to part 2 and so forth?

and when you're done with Colony it's another name like.."Dunes" part 1 or something?

And each mission has a difficulty rating set by the game or by the player?

Will a mission be more difficult with more people in the party?

Sorry if these are annoying questions, I'm just really excited :]

[ This Message was edited by: electricocean on 2006-05-01 17:31 ]

RFB

May 1, 2006, 08:58 PM

On 2006-05-01 17:28, electricocean wrote:
How long (on average) would a mission take?

Depends on the mission, the players and the difference between mob levels/player levels. But so far, it's never been much more than half an hour for each part, at most.

Also, someone mentioned a "rest period" what the hell is that?

Not sure, but 2 possible things come to mind:
1)All weapons have PPs. If you keep using Photon Arts / shooting / using techs, your weapons will run out of PPs, and you need to either have the weaopn equipped without using it's PPs, which could be considered a rest period, or go back to town and use a recharge cube.
2)When you finish a mission, you appear in an outpost, where you can recharge your weapons' PPs and buy some items. Maybe the "rest period" refers to the outpost.

Oh and are there like objectives or no?

Nope, not really. Hack & Slash your way to the end, basically.

EDIT* You , for example, said Colony part 1.

Does that mean when you're done with part 1 you go to part 2 and so forth?

If you wish. When you're done with Colony part 1, you appear at one of those outpost. From there, you can go on to part 2, or go back to the main part of the colony, from where you can go to any other planet, or to the shops, or to your room, or... etc. You are NOT obligued to continue. But in order to reach part 2, you need to finish part 1 first.

and when you're done with Colony it's another name like.."Dunes" part 1 or something?

Unknown, there are only 5 maps available in the BETA. Conoly Part 1 -> Colony Part 2, Parum Part 1 -> Parum Part 2, and Relics, which are available from the Parum 1->2 outpost. So we cant say so far.

And each mission has a difficulty rating set by the game or by the player?

There are 3 difficulty settings set by the game, but you can choose which one to do, if your party meets the level requirements, if there are: C, B and A.

Will a mission be more difficult with more people in the party?

Normally, yes, the more people in the party, the more enemies that usually spawn.

Itsuki

May 1, 2006, 10:39 PM

I acutally think guild wars and PSU have alot in common. If you're trying to compare PSU to anything, then it seems like Guild Wars would be a prime choice. What else WOULD you compare PSU to? Other than PSO of course. Its alot better than comparing it to an MMORPG, since niether one of them are truly MMOs. You can basically say that Guild Wars and PSU, along with some other games such as DnDO, Diablo 2, etc, fit into the same sub-genre. None of them are massively multiplayer, but they're their own little genre of Multiplayer Online RPGs. Guild Wars and PSU, though, are especially similar in structure.

When you get down to their roots, both games you fight from mission to mission. Inbetween points and cities have lobbies, where you can meet up with people and form groups. Then you go out and do your thing. In both games you can sign on and relatively quickly get stuff done. You can't exactly solo in either, but if you are alone, then you can get a (or multiple) NPCs to fight with you. PSU probably will have less areas, but you can redo them on harder levels of difficulty (GW has ~25 missions, with ~50 inbetween areas). Both also feature battle systems (although radically different) that tend to be more fast paced and player-skill based than what MMOs tend to have, with similar enemy to player ratios shared between both games.

Though of course, PSU features an active attacking system, with a more weapon, equipment, and item based battle system. While GW on the other hand, has passive attacking, with an almost solely skill/spell based battle system. PSU is of course futuristic, but that difference tends to be more of a mute point.

Of course, if you were comparing it based on its battle system, you'd have to compare it to an action RPG. Which would be throwing away nearly all of its multiplayer and online characteristics.

I would try to make an analogy of this, but I'd need a another sort of genre-borederline type game, and the only thing I can think of right now is a recent strategy/card game called Yggdra Union. Which plays like a card game, and its battle system would probably be more comparable to Yugi-oh, but in structure is a strategy rpg similar to a fire emblem. You select what characters you want to bring into a battle beforehand, then you move your characters around on a grid, and attack the enemy characters on the grid. Between missions, there is usually talking and story, and then goes to the next mission.

Even though it plays like a card game, its presented as a strategy RPG. So what do you compare it to? Well, its likely to be compared to both its strategy RPG counterparts like fire emblem, and be compared to its cardgame counterparts. When it comes down to it, it has alot of similarities to both, so neither comparison is truly wrong.

Axios-

May 1, 2006, 10:50 PM

Yeah, I'd agree with that for the most part. People just need to know that PSU is vastly different from WoW. And, Itsuki, you seemed to get off on a hell of a tangent at the end there. O_o

Itsuki

May 1, 2006, 10:53 PM

sorry bout that x.o I kind of type and think at the same time.

Sinue_v2

May 2, 2006, 05:00 AM

I have a quick question about the feild...

I heard a rumor a long time ago, that Telepipes and Escapipes would be making a comeback in some fashion. The difference in them being, that a Telepipe provides you access to a town (or a rest point, apperantly) and an Escapipe would allow you to exit dungeons you enter from the overworld in case you get lost, need to go back for supplies, or if you want to quickly warp a new player in your party to your destination.

Is there any truth to this? Are telepipes, at least, still in the game - and how do they function?

mech259_

May 2, 2006, 05:28 AM

I don't think there are any pipes like that in the beta so far.. =/

However, there is something similar. Each mission so far has 3-4 areas. At the beggining of every area, there is a crystal that you can activate. That crystal can teleport you to any other crystal that you have activates. So if you join a party and they are in area 3, you can just warp there and catch up with them. And if you are running low on mates, you can wait until you reach a new area and use the crystal to go buy more.

linkzone

May 2, 2006, 05:33 AM

the one thing i always hated about GW, was that you had to run 10miles out to go 1mile in. what i mean is the objective would be two feet away but a mountain or river was always in the way, so youd have to run around forever looking for the path to get to the goal and it pissed me off. i hope PSU is more inventive, i hear you can get vehicles to go over water and what not.

RFB

May 2, 2006, 06:48 AM

On 2006-05-01 20:39, Itsuki-chan wrote:
When you get down to their roots, both games you fight from mission to mission.

NO. For the 100th time, even tho they are called missions, they are NOT missions. It's just an excuse to give you money and class exp when you're finished. Other than that, it's just like doing forest runs, Hack & Slash. END.

Inbetween points and cities have lobbies, where you can meet up with people and form groups.

You dont form groups in towns in PSU normally. You meet up with people whose card you have and create the game, or join an already going game. Towns in PSU are there for server switching, PP recharging, shops and gaining access to your room.

In both games you can sign on and relatively quickly get stuff done.

I've never been able to do anything in GW in less than 1h30m that was worth my time, but whatever.

You can't exactly solo in either, but if you are alone, then you can get a (or multiple) NPCs to fight with you.

How does this relate to PSU?

Both also feature battle systems (although radically different) that tend to be more fast paced and player-skill based than what MMOs tend to have, with similar enemy to player ratios shared between both games.

GW, fast? since when? I was sleeping myself on the Keyboard because the battle system was way too slow. You hit auto attack. Character attacks. 1 year later, character attacks again. I felt much faster with a 3.60 speed 2h axe in WoW.
And the enemy/player ratio, is higher in PSU. There are more mobs per player in PSU.

physic

May 2, 2006, 07:11 AM

ehh GW was fast in that you had 8 skills at your command and depending on your job they recharged very fast. also the enemies did whatever they wer doing to you pretty fast.. Anyhow i think the point of his post was not that gw and pso are the same, but that pso has more in common with guild wars than other mmo such as ffx or WoW. in that respect it seems hes right. If you want an MMO experience, as in the ability to play with and be effected by 100s of people at once. Then psu prolly isnt for you, if you want to be able to play with about 6 people at once and interact with many more in lobbies, then pso might be your bag.

Itsuki

May 2, 2006, 09:27 AM

NO. For the 100th time, even tho they are called missions, they are NOT missions. It's just an excuse to give you money and class exp when you're finished. Other than that, it's just like doing forest runs, Hack & Slash. END.
That doesn't make it much different. So in guild wars you might need to talk to an npc here or there, but for the most part its still pretty much hack and slashing till the end.

EDIT: I'm talking mainly about the missions in guild wars here. If you don't do the bonus in a mission, its generally hack and slash to the end. I'm not talking about the quests and such. Of course, in alot of guild wars missions you may have to hit a series of switches along the way, or say talk to an npc so the next door will open. But when it comes down to it, talking to an NPC to open a door, and hitting a switch to open a door are basically the same thing. The NPC just looks less like a lever.

You dont form groups in towns in PSU normally. You meet up with people whose card you have and create the game, or join an already going game. Towns in PSU are there for server switching, PP recharging, shops and gaining access to your room.
Still effectively the same.

I've never been able to do anything in GW in less than 1h30m that was worth my time, but whatever.
If you wanted to do do something quickly in GW, you'd have a solo build. There are plenty of things you can do in GW that only take 30 minutes, especially if you can do it by yourself or only with a couple people.

You can't exactly solo in either, but if you are alone, then you can get a (or multiple) NPCs to fight with you.How does this relate to PSU?
Well, although I haven't played PSU, my understanding from my friends that have is that you can summon the npc that you started with with fight along side you later if you are alone. I see that as being no different from a henchman.

GW, fast? since when? I was sleeping myself on the Keyboard because the battle system was way too slow. You hit auto attack. Character attacks. 1 year later, character attacks again. I felt much faster with a 3.60 speed 2h axe in WoW.
My point here was that they are fast compared to MMOs. Niether Guild Wars nor PSU is going to become a full blow twitch action game. But compared to a game like WoW, or FFXI, or Lineage 2, or pretty much any other MMO, you are generally doing more 'stuff'. This has nothing to do with attack speed and how fast it "feels". In guild wars, you're generally pressing alot of buttons. If you aren't casting a skill/spell every 3-5 seconds, you're generally dieing. Also, warriors types are generally bad examples of how fast a game plays.

And the enemy/player ratio, is higher in PSU. There are more mobs per player in PSU.
The key word there would have been similar. I haven't been in game in PSU, but from the videos it seems like theres about a 1.5 enemies to player ration on average. Maybe going up to a 2 enemies per player. Guild wars generally floats between 1:1 and 1.5:1. Those are pretty close. Atleast when compared to a game like FFXI, where the ratio is about 1 enemy to every 6 players. Or to a game like Diablo 2, where the ratio is like 10+ enemies to every player.

But as physic said, I'm not trying to say they are exactly alike. I'm only trying to say that their design and play structure is very similar. They both utilize alot of the same concepts here. Thats undeniable fact.

[ This Message was edited by: Itsuki-chan on 2006-05-02 07:30 ]

RFB

May 2, 2006, 10:49 AM

On 2006-05-02 07:27, Itsuki-chan wrote:

That doesn't make it much different. So in guild wars you might need to talk to an npc here or there, but for the most part its still pretty much hack and slashing till the end.

If we go down to that, then PSU = GW = WOW = L2 = EQ2 = RO = RFO = DnDO =... keep the list going. Every online role playing game is based on hack & slash. But when on a mission, you have goals, objectives, tasks you need to do. In PSU, you do NOT. There are no NPCs, no levers, no nothing at all! It's just either getting to the end of the area, or killing the boss mob. No goals at all. It's just an excuse to give you some extra money and class experience.

If you wanted to do do something quickly in GW, you'd have a solo build. There are plenty of things you can do in GW that only take 30 minutes, especially if you can do it by yourself or only with a couple people.

Well, my main was healing bi*** build. >_> that could explain it.

Well, although I haven't played PSU, my understanding from my friends that have is that you can summon the npc that you started with with fight along side you later if you are alone. I see that as being no different from a henchman.

1 henchman =/= 7 henchman. In GW you can be the only player in the party, everyone else being NPCs. In PSU only one NPC per party, only the leader can invite the story character.

My point here was that they are fast compared to MMOs. Niether Guild Wars nor PSU is going to become a full blow twitch action game. But compared to a game like WoW, or FFXI, or Lineage 2, or pretty much any other MMO, you are generally doing more 'stuff'. This has nothing to do with attack speed and how fast it "feels". In guild wars, you're generally pressing alot of buttons. If you aren't casting a skill/spell every 3-5 seconds, you're generally dieing. Also, warriors types are generally bad examples of how fast a game plays.

PSU not a full blown action game... not so sure about that. PSU is pretty much a beat-em-up online mixed with an RPG. And doing more stuff in GW than in WoW? no freaking way in hell. I've played Druid, Rogue, Warrior, Priest, Warlock, Hunter and Shaman in WoW. I've played Monk, Warrior and Mesmer in GW. The only WoW class that's slower than the GW classes, is the shaman.

But as physic said, I'm not trying to say they are exactly alike. I'm only trying to say that their design and play structure is very similar. They both utilize alot of the same concepts here. Thats undeniable fact.

I highly disagree with your undeniable fact.

patient

May 2, 2006, 01:25 PM

I've never played GW past a 2 day beta.

I did however have a Lv.60 Hunter in an End Game guild WoW wise. I have since retired it hoping for something better to come along. I don’t expect PSU to be the end all replacement for WoW, but I really hope that there is enough there to satisfy what I went though in WoW.

Reading that there are over 100 people working on PSU raised my brow a bit. I guess what I am anticipating the most is further information about:

1) PvP functionality
2) Dynamic content being put in game as it progresses.
3) Guild/Clan/Linkshell system.
4) How "common" items and rares are. How does this system differ from other MMOs.
5) Class functions and their roles.
6) Free roaming environments.
6) Can’t think of anything to put here.

Really this begs to the question, "What is a MMORPG"? What features will make this a MMORPG and not a Single player game with Online elements?

Personally I think the ability to free explore areas and not just be bound to them by accepting quests is what answers that question for me.

Guess we will have to see what the game offers in its full state come E3 or post beta.

Shrevn

May 2, 2006, 01:49 PM

The question would have to be is it as free as the first PSO games were just jump in a room get warped in hack away fun!?
or will it be more things to do and more quests/missions based then the previous as long as i get to do quests/missions but after im trhu with them just hack away till w/e the level cap is im on board =D

physic

May 2, 2006, 04:31 PM

On 2006-05-02 11:25, patient wrote:

1) PvP functionality
2) Dynamic content being put in game as it progresses.
3) Guild/Clan/Linkshell system.
4) How "common" items and rares are. How does this system differ from other MMOs.
5) Class functions and their roles.
6) Free roaming environments.
6) Can’t think of anything to put here.

Really this begs to the question, "What is a MMORPG"? What features will make this a MMORPG and not a Single player game with Online elements?

well, in all those dfinitions pso wont really be a a good mmorpg experience for you, some of the info has pretty much been stated.
1) No pvp elements have been discussed, this doesnt mean it wont exist, but it prolly wont exist at its start. Or in a very limited fashion
2)Most content added to this game will be on the disc already, how dynamic it will be depends how far ahead they planned, and what they wish to add. Being ps2 without hdd compatible means that they have an 8mb limit on how much new information they can add. Unles they come up with some new way or do something drastic for ps2ers essentially dont expect much more new content than you d expect on pso.
3)there is currently no guild/linkshell/clan system awhile back teh developer said teams would not be returning, this may change but, probably not, at least not in this incarnation. They mentioned the mail system might be a little easier...
4)Item rareness is pretty unknown at this point, but they mentioned that a well upgraded old weapon may be as useful as a "rare"
5)class functions seem to be similar to before some of teh details are missing but essentially your a melee are ranged attcaker or a magic user, any side abilities you get will be much less useful than your main jobs abilities.
6) all indications are ther will not be a free roaming environment or world, It will all be instanced, at the least. and current info and trends suggest you will be primarily porting to areas from the lobby.

So yeah in those respects, if thats how you define mmorpg psu wont quite be it.

Itsuki

May 2, 2006, 05:16 PM

I highly disagree with your undeniable fact.
If you disagree with it so much, then I'd atleast support your claims by giving a game (other than PSO) that PSU would be better compared to. So far you've only tried to prove your point by disproving mine. And as much as I'd love to go back and forther sitting her disproving eachother, it doesn't go anywhere, and probably would just end up off topic and annoying to everyone else.

So, to elaborate on what physic said:
1) PSU's battle system, much like PSO's, is designed for PvE content. It doesn't particularly appear to have too much PvP content in mind. So assuming PvP is added later on, it may not be very elaborate.
2) As phsyic said, on xbox and ps2 its non-hd. The most you could probably expect is occasional quests, and maybe content thats already made, just not unlocked.
3) I would personally like to see something along the lines of what Blue Burst has, but its unlikely.
4) Although item rareness is unknown, early reports appear to indicate that "common" weapons and armor in general are significantly more rare. While rare items appear to be quite well... rare. The game seems to be trying to make currency more integral. So rares are likely commodities, not dependencies like PSO. Chances are shops and crafting are going to be the more significant parts of the market.
5) Although class funtions are similar, they appear to be broken up and seperated more. There aren't grey area characters like PSO.

"What is a MMORPG"? What features will make this a MMORPG and not a Single player game with Online elements?
It probably won't fit into either of those categories.

VelosofLight

May 2, 2006, 05:55 PM

I think the whole segmented feel to PSO is what eventually got me to quit... I'd hope they'd do something like larger non-story free-roaming hunting levels to keep it interesting and allow you to play with more people for awhile. I've heard no thoughts of this at all though, so it's probably pointless to hope.

patient

May 2, 2006, 06:09 PM

well, in all those dfinitions pso wont really be a a good mmorpg experience for you, some of the info has pretty much been stated.
1) No pvp elements have been discussed, this doesnt mean it wont exist, but it prolly wont exist at its start. Or in a very limited fashion
2)Most content added to this game will be on the disc already, how dynamic it will be depends how far ahead they planned, and what they wish to add. Being ps2 without hdd compatible means that they have an 8mb limit on how much new information they can add. Unles they come up with some new way or do something drastic for ps2ers essentially dont expect much more new content than you d expect on pso.
3)there is currently no guild/linkshell/clan system awhile back teh developer said teams would not be returning, this may change but, probably not, at least not in this incarnation. They mentioned the mail system might be a little easier...
4)Item rareness is pretty unknown at this point, but they mentioned that a well upgraded old weapon may be as useful as a "rare"
5)class functions seem to be similar to before some of teh details are missing but essentially your a melee are ranged attcaker or a magic user, any side abilities you get will be much less useful than your main jobs abilities.
6) all indications are ther will not be a free roaming environment or world, It will all be instanced, at the least. and current info and trends suggest you will be primarily porting to areas from the lobby.

So yeah in those respects, if thats how you define mmorpg psu wont quite be it.

Thanks for answering some of those.

That is what I gathered unfortunately, I think there is a part of me that still has hope for some drastic change to be announced.

I really wish Sega took it a bit father than they have announced they will. Shame.