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AvianKaitos
Aug 14, 2006, 12:34 AM
I’ve been thinking about the “lesser” class-race combinations such as FOcasts, RAbeasts, and HUnewms. Maybe there will be special items out there to bring them up to par with their class counterparts. Perhaps these items could make these class-race combinations more enjoyable.

*of course this is all speculation*

For an example: I’d like to try out a FOcast, maybe they will have a special MST orientated SUV weapon much the way hunters COULD use the Elysion and rangers the Holy Ray.

vitius137
Aug 14, 2006, 01:23 AM
cool idea. not sure if that will be included but it would be pretty awesome ^_^

Pacpunk
Aug 14, 2006, 01:35 AM
yeah that sounds awsome! i like that idea

Kyuu
Aug 14, 2006, 01:37 AM
Uh oh. I forsee an irritable PhotonCat post in this thread's future. He doesn't like the idea much.

It's been speculated there may be such before. Given that there were a few race and gender specific items in PSO, it's certainly probable that they may do such in PSO as well.

We'll see.

AvianKaitos
Aug 14, 2006, 01:57 AM
Yeah I don't want this thread to be a battle ground http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_no.gif

Stepper
Aug 14, 2006, 03:19 AM
That would definitely be a way to restore some of the balance between the races/classes. The only problem is that these special items would almost be guaranteed to be extremely rare, extemely expensive, or only available until late in the game; something that valuable couldn't be easy to acquire.

Phaze37
Aug 14, 2006, 03:31 AM
They'll probably have at least a few items like that.

Jife_Jifremok
Aug 14, 2006, 03:40 AM
I like the idea of making a few items for certain race/class combos, but not if they're just flat-out unequippable to those outside the combos. Like, the equipment designed for just one or two race/class combos might be quite less than optimal for most race/class combos but still equippable. (Perhaps for aesthetic purposes, challenging oneself, or experimentation.)

hypersaxon
Aug 14, 2006, 04:42 AM
PSU has units much like in PSO which can be used to alter stats. Unlike PSO though, certain types of items are associated with a certain slot, so you can't stack a bunch of God/Mind type units for example. You can only put units in slots that they're supported in, like head gear slots for example can only have a certain type of unit.

PandaMasterX4
Aug 14, 2006, 10:22 AM
RSE or Race Specific Equipment goes back from a lot of games. It pretty much gives them the good greens of the class they have so it allows their job to be useable as that job, but in no way can it surpass the race that it was meant for.

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 11:25 AM
I certainly hope that they have an item that increases a HUnewearl's attack and such

Fleece
Aug 14, 2006, 12:29 PM
I Can see the HUnewms obviously getting an ATP booster slot for them only or a HUnewm only sword that boosts ATP.

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 02:07 PM
On 2006-08-14 10:29, Fleece wrote:
I Can see the HUnewms obviously getting an ATP booster slot for them only or a HUnewm only sword that boosts ATP.


That would kick some serious ass

Axios-
Aug 14, 2006, 02:12 PM
I think a straight-up ATP booster for newms would be an underhand way to balance them that would piss off the other races and myself. (I'll be playing a newm). For a good attempt at balance, you don't want to make the newmans be the same as beasts. That would sell beasts short and we don't want that. See: Character Balance http://pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=116700&forum=20&128

For a newm specific weapon, you'd most definitely want some sort of sword that you could map a couple techs to. That way you have some reason to be a newman, and you're not trying to kill the beasts.

Phaze37
Aug 14, 2006, 02:39 PM
I think a straight-up ATP booster for newms would be an underhand way to balance them that would piss off the other races and myself.

Noones saying that it should boost their ATP enough to match that of a beast.

Axios-
Aug 14, 2006, 02:41 PM
No, but you're trying to directly compete with beasts by trying to have the same stat build. Instead, you should channel the newm's abilities and use those to your advantage. A melee weapon with a tech or two on it would do just that.

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 02:56 PM
Except you can't link techs to melee weapons.

Axios-
Aug 14, 2006, 02:58 PM
Yes, yes, we all know that. However, if ST wanted to make a rare melee weapon that could do that, they would. I'm not saying that all sabers should hold techs. It's just possible that one or two rare weapons later on could.

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 03:01 PM
Don't see how. One button is for attack, and one button is for photon arts. Those same two buttons are what allow you to use techs with a rod/staff, hence why you cannot do melee attacks with either of those two weapons.

Axios-
Aug 14, 2006, 03:24 PM
So you sacrifice the photon art of that specific weapon for the tech. Techs are basically equivalent to photon arts anyways. I'm not actually expecting this specifically, but people need to realize that if ST wants to balance their characters, there are much more creative ways than just an ATP-boost. That's cheap, and it sells both beasts and newms short by reducing the beasts' advantage and by excluding the newmans' abilities. Regardless of whether or not there is a tech-using melee weapon, it's possible for ST to do whatever they want with their game.

hypersaxon
Aug 14, 2006, 03:29 PM
Or they could borrow my idea and allow Newmans to use a Cane in the left hand when using a HU/FO Expert Level. Dunno if they'd want to go through the extra hassel to add that though, but it'd be nice http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Axios-
Aug 14, 2006, 03:34 PM
Yes, expert type does open up a whole new realm of possibilities since we don't know anything about it. I'd love to be able to wield like that. Hell, dual wielding canes would be sweet. Odd...but sweet.

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 03:35 PM
Yeah, OK. Let's ditch your weapon's photon art, which by the way, is where the majority of a hunter's damage output comes from, in favor of a single technique. Sure. You realize that doing such would make your character considerably less effective?

Meanwhile, it'd be entirely simpler and quicker to have players switch to a tech-casting weapon. What you suggest is flat out silly. But yeah, Sonic Team could do whatever they want. Really.

Axios-
Aug 14, 2006, 03:36 PM
I'm not saying it's the best option. You just need to accept that there are possibilities. I'm sorry if you can't do that.

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 03:38 PM
It's also entirely possible that pink space rabbits are orbiting the earth. It's amazing how many possibilities we can have. Maybe Sonic Team could scrap PSU altogether. It certain is a possibility!

Saner
Aug 14, 2006, 03:53 PM
combining blades with techs would mess up the point of choosing a class. your techs wouldn't do as much effect as a hunter. and your blades would suffer from not having their damaging photon arts, which hunters excel at.

all these balancing debates are getting out of hand. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif people shouldn't feel so insecure about having lower stats compared to other races, in certain classes, etc. etc.

tank1
Aug 14, 2006, 03:56 PM
Unless this game becomes a platformer overnight and all stats are done away with thats never gonna happen saner.

AvianKaitos
Aug 14, 2006, 03:56 PM
On 2006-08-14 13:34, Axios- wrote:
Hell, dual wielding canes would be sweet. Odd...but sweet.


Nothing silly about that, canes DO have a faster casting animation. They’d be like a quicker version of a staff.

Saner
Aug 14, 2006, 04:00 PM
well its not like ST are like: "Muahahaha! Let's nerf the humans and newmans! Oh ya and make combos like FOBeast useless! Muahahahaha!"

you can be sure they tested every combination! People will be able to solo as anything, that's the important thing. And that much proves that when a race/class can take care of themselves, they are sufficient to be helpful in a party.

tank1
Aug 14, 2006, 04:04 PM
Theres no PVP in this game so i dont understand everyones concern over stats its not like your gonna have to fight another players HUbeast so who cares if you do like 10 less damage or cant go super saiyan.

AvianKaitos
Aug 14, 2006, 04:06 PM
Your right Saner, of course those combinations are not useless.

However:


On 2006-08-13 22:34, AvianKaitos wrote:
Perhaps these items could make these class-race combinations more enjoyable.

Saner
Aug 14, 2006, 04:16 PM
"more enjoyable???"

sounds like people want things to be easier for them to handle just by equipping something. powergaming is sooo abused. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 04:33 PM
On 2006-08-14 13:35, Parn wrote:
Yeah, OK. Let's ditch your weapon's photon art, which by the way, is where the majority of a hunter's damage output comes from, in favor of a single technique. Sure. You realize that doing such would make your character considerably less effective?



Well thats y u equip it with a spell like resta so you dont need to carry around mates all the time and can heal more often

Saner
Aug 14, 2006, 04:35 PM
well expert mode looks like it will solve all this.

it sounds almost like Super Ethan except you can be 2 classes at once instead of 3.

so therefore you can equip and switch between blades and tech weapons, for example if you choose HU/FO.

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 04:43 PM
On 2006-08-14 14:33, Zeig123 wrote:
Well thats y u equip it with a spell like resta so you dont need to carry around mates all the time and can heal more often
Apparently you weren't paying attention. Attaching Resta onto a melee weapon in place of a photon art makes you even weaker as a Newman hunter, assuming they put such a feature in the game. You've thrown away the majority of your damage in favor of being able to heal every once in awhile. You may as well be playing a full-fledged force instead with multiple techs on canes/staves, and then switch to melee weapons when you feel like attacking. Photon arts are integral to a hunter.

But hey, what do I know?

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 04:45 PM
On 2006-08-14 14:43, Parn wrote:

On 2006-08-14 14:33, Zeig123 wrote:
Well thats y u equip it with a spell like resta so you dont need to carry around mates all the time and can heal more often
Apparently you weren't paying attention. Attaching Resta onto a melee weapon in place of a photon art makes you even weaker as a Newman hunter, assuming they put such a feature in the game. You've thrown away the majority of your damage in favor of being able to heal every once in awhile. You may as well be playing a full-fledged force instead with multiple techs on canes/staves, and then switch to melee weapons when you feel like attacking. Photon arts are integral to a hunter.

But hey, what do I know?


Thats y you carry other meele weapons with you that do more damage so it wouldnt weaken you just be an option until expert type is unlocked

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 04:53 PM
Except we go right back to your not being able to link techs to melee weaponry, seeing how rods and staves would be completely pointless if you could do such a thing.

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 04:56 PM
no you just carry a few weapons around and that do more damage so you can still heal without the use of mates until you get expert type....it could be really helpful for a while depending on how hard expert type is to unlock.

Parn
Aug 14, 2006, 05:00 PM
.........I give up.

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 05:02 PM
It would be a rare weapon that you dont normaly find so it wouldnt be an ordinary melee weapon.

hypersaxon
Aug 14, 2006, 05:38 PM
I highly doubt there's gonna be any Hunter or Ranger weapons that allow techs to be assigned to them.

Stepper
Aug 14, 2006, 06:11 PM
I agree with Parn; adding techniques to melee/ranged weapons wouldn't be a good idea. I'd rather see the addition of photon arts and bullets that are TAP based. That way, newmans and humans could put their high TAP to good use without having to sacrifice much.

Zeig123
Aug 14, 2006, 07:33 PM
On 2006-08-14 16:11, Faile wrote:
I agree with Parn; adding techniques to melee/ranged weapons wouldn't be a good idea. I'd rather see the addition of photon arts and bullets that are TAP based. That way, newmans and humans could put their high TAP to good use without having to sacrifice much.


Well I didnt think of that so that would be a good idea as long as they were somewhat powerful.

Saner
Aug 14, 2006, 07:41 PM
in any case if you wanna use techs, then just be a Force.

if you wanna use advanced blades, be a Hunter.



if you want both, maybe Expert Class will provide that, you will still have to switch to a FO weapon to use techs, of course. but weapon swapping is quick anyways.

beatrixkiddo
Aug 14, 2006, 07:46 PM
Actually lol, the funny thing is... in the beta, there was a pair of double daggers that only FOrces could use... but the only people who could (due to the level restrictions) were FObeasts. Not racial equipment per se, just racial due to the limits of the beta.

Fleece
Aug 14, 2006, 08:37 PM
Can Fo's use PA's on double daggars? I might go Fo if they can.

FObeast would be very effective in melee as well:

*Heal*
*Heal*
*Transform*

Etc.

Saner
Aug 14, 2006, 08:42 PM
Double Daggers are a blade type, so I think they can use Photon Arts.

but since a Force uses them, I wonder if they can make use of the PAs....

so ya that's a good question.

but I think I recall a Ranger Cast using a spear and I think he did a photon art. not sure but.... it non-Hunters can't use photon arts, then that is a good thing to make the classes more unique in which weapons they can use fully.

but if any class that can use a blade for example, like dagger, and still use PAs, then that's good too.

Kyuu
Aug 15, 2006, 12:38 AM
I believe forces are allowed to use level 1 PAs.

beatrixkiddo
Aug 15, 2006, 12:46 AM
Yes, FOrces can use PAs but they are limited to level 1. For instance, if you learned a PA up to level 20 as a HUnter but then switched to force, the Force could only use that PA at level 1. If you used a completely new PA on a FOrce, they would just not gain any exp for that PA.