PSU Premier Disc Review

[parabolee]

Got my hands on the Japanese PSU demo disc and thought I'd let you all know my thought's...

The demo is pretty big, took me about an hour to get to the end of it (Although it could take a lot less since I took my time to look around and I had to wade through the Japanese). The demo ends with a boss battle but I actually didn't fight the boss as I accidental quit the demo when trying to figure out the option menu's http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif But never mind I would rather not spoil too much, and I certainly got plenty of a taste from what I played

OK first of all the good -

For a PlayStation 2 game it looks pretty good (which means the PC and 360 version will look even better). What I liked best about the demo is the fact that it really FEELS like PSO. The graphics and music are different enough to feel all new and fresh but similar enough to feel like home to the PSO fanatic.

The cut scenes are really good, even in Japanese I thought they were funny, the world looks really detailed and will be a real pleasure to explore. The battle controls are TIGHT! You hold down R1 to use the gun or release for the sword, you can also go into first person aim mode for shooting. L1 locks on to an enemy (although not with the gun strangely) and you can sidestep around them while fighting. The button timing feels great, even better than PSO, and the high power attack now uses TP or some other measured bar below the weapon that charges up, so you have a limited amount of them. But they do some wicked damage. I found the fighting to be lot of fun and am excited to explore the depth in the full game. I leveled up to 3 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Now the bad -

It may look good for a PS2 game, but it still looks pretty shit on the PS2! Jaggies and crap texture resolutions make it look very last gen. Let's hope the PC and 360 versions look a lot better.

At first the controls feel, well... weird. you set of running from standing too fast, and although it uses true 360 degree analogue you will find it "sticking" into the 8 directions too much for it to feel as fliud as DC or GC PSO (Xbox used 8 directional for some reason). But you get used to it after a while and it feels a LOT better once you get some weapons and start kicking ass.

Also the camera control just doesn't feel as intuitive as PSO, the camera lags behind when making sharp directional turns and forces you to correct it with the second analogue, which is a problem because when using the second stick to move the camera you'll find that the camera zooms in a little to your player. Which then zooms back out when you stop moving it! REALLY annoying! You can also press L1 to snap the camera to behind you like in PSO, and this works fine. As long as you are stood STILL that is! If you are running around and doing this it whips around in kinda jumpy snappy way that is hard to describe but annoying nonetheless.

Let me make onne thing very clear though, I am being VERY nit picky here. but as it's Phantasy Star I want the best and the controls just don't feel quite right to me as far as the camera goes. I think PSO felt better and that is disappointing, but something that will be got over pretty quickly I imagine.

No I want to address the crappiest thing in the demo, a lazy piece of programming that I do not expect from Sonic Team! while wondering through the large lobby ship area I came across some benches and was pleased to discover that I could sit on them by pressing O. So I pressed O expecting to see a simple sit down animation like you would in the most average of games. BUT NO! My character VANISHED into thin air and then REAPPEARED sat on the bench! WTF!!!!!!!! How fucking LAZY is that! Also ti finish off the nit-picking in the city/lobby area there are people walking around and when they go to another area they fade away and vanish, which is fine. What is weird though is that there are a lot of people wandering around big open area's in partially faded away states like ghosts and they vanish and appear at (what seems like) random, very strange and crappy looking. I hope they fix that for the release, but it won't be in the online game I imagine anyway.

OVERALL -

I was both very impressed and slightly disappointed. I'm certainly no less excited about the game and in the end I will be prepared for the few small problems when I get my hands on the full version. Plus even though the 360 version won't look anywhere near as good as nice looking 360 games, it will look a lot better than the PS2 version I played. Thus making the game appear a little better looking to me, just because of the uglier version I have already played.

Well 2 weeks for the Japanese release! I just hope that we don't have to wait 3 months for a US release and then another 2 for a 360 release! God that will kill me!

[Polly]

No I want to address the crappiest thing in the demo, a lazy piece of programming that I do not expect from Sonic Team! while wondering through the large lobby ship area I came across some benches and was pleased to discover that I could sit on them by pressing O. So I pressed O expecting to see a simple sit down animation like you would in the most average of games. BUT NO! My character VANISHED into thin air and then REAPPEARED sat on the bench!

When that first happened to me, I had to do a double and triple take to make sure I wasn't seeing things. How damn lazy do you have to be to not do a simple sitting down animation? It's ridiculous.

I'm also in agreement about how snappy centering the camera seems to be. I don't think it's any different than PSO's centering other than it's just faster, which makes your eyes feel like they're being jerked around. It's something I adapted to quickly, but still feel it could have been smoother. I don't really bother with manual camera movement much just out of PSO habit and never found myself ever NEEDING to use it.

My only problem with the controls is that the d-pad is used for cycling through menus and that just feels plain awkward to me. I found myself taking my index finger off the L1 button and bringing it down over the controller and cycling with only the up arrow, which sucks and hurt cause I have small hands xD Maybe if I had a couple extra fingers on my left hand it wouldn't be so bad. I just don't like feeling I had to stop moving to navigate menus. Hopefully I can throw that on the right analog stick at least with the PC version.

Combat's smoove like butter. Targetting feels nicer than I was expecting it to be from the videos I'd seen. I use a healthy mix of locking and free targetting to get the job done. I like that they also give you the option to toggle secondary weapon use and strafing too.

My real complaint is how much damn loading the game does. Surely they could have optimized it a bit more. So many cutscenes, so many small areas that they dropped you off into where your only choice is to head toward the exit for more loading. Getting started was immensely annoying. Even on my second and subsequent times through it later, I ended up skipping cutscenes and dialgue for six minutes until I had a weapon in my hands, and even then there was still two or three more minutes of blabbering and loading.

The Premiere did its job, though. I was excited for the game, but now that I've actually played it, I want it even more.

16 days, 15 hours, 59 minutes, and 23 seconds till it arrives at my house. :(

[Tycho]

I hope they fix that for the release, but it won't be in the online game I imagine anyway. *grins*

[Fryetholly]

Don't worry, loadings are far shorter on the pc...
I played a demo version at the Japan Expo in France, and I was amazed how long were the loadings. Hopefully, I knew by playing the pc beta version that loadings weren't like that, even on my crappy comp'.

For what you said... I totally agree, especially for the bench thingy. The most stupid thing I've ever seen.

By the way, about the graphics, the PS2 version looked more or less like the PC one... Well, it was a bit shiner on the computer, with better textures, but not that better you see.
The good point is : if you have a good computer, the game won't lag as it does on the PS2 (which isn't my case, but I don't want a crappy unupdatable PS2 version... Plus I don't have a PS2 ^_^).


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Fryetholly on 2006-08-19 01:21 ]</font>

[l3iohazard]

sweet more info... although now i want to play more

[UniKoRn]

I've just played through the offline mode and beaten the boss.. seems pretty cool!
Can't wait for the english version to come out so I actually know what is going on!

[Phaze37]

Waitaminute.... You can't navigate menus using the right analog stick?!? SAY IT AINT SO!! That is VERY disapointing and stupid. In PSO I constantly use the c-stick to navigate the quick menu while moving my character with the left analog stick. *sigh* Leave it to Sonic Team to leave out such an important yet easy-to-implement feature...

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Phaze37 on 2006-08-19 05:19 ]</font>

[kyori]

Ooooooh. Can I see pictures of your premiere disk please?

[Saner]

how can you expect to rotate the camera while in menus anyway if they didn't reserve the right analog stick for that?

I like not needing the right analog to navigate the menus. this lets me multitask better in the heat of battle while keeping a good control of the view of the surroundings.


the bench warping thing is not bad. at least you can sit down on benches/chairs in the first place http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif . FF11 didn't have chairs you could sit on at all.

[Saner]

For a PlayStation 2 game it looks pretty good (which means the PC and 360 version will look even better).

It may look good for a PS2 game, but it still looks pretty shit on the PS2! Jaggies and crap texture resolutions make it look very last gen. Let's hope the PC and 360 versions look a lot better.


I think its harsh and unfair to judge a game's graphics based on the generation.

If it looks good that's all that really counts. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

there are many games with some jaggies but that didn't stop them from looking beautiful. unles you're THAT nitpicky. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif but it's really not a problem.

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j104/shirubania/psuscreen23.jpg

I mean the PS2 version is already the best looking Phantasy Star game for consoles, even more so than Gamecube PSO.

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j104/shirubania/psuscreen2.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j104/shirubania/psuscreen22.jpg


ya the Xbox360 and PC versions will look better, but the PS2 version is FAR from ugly. even with the low quality snapshots we seen it already looks really beautiful and presentable the way it is. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[Dingo]

That 'right-stick not controlling your character while in the menu' realy has me worried, that was a lifesaver in PSO

[Saner]

why?

you can still move with left analogy stick while in the menus, right?

right stick is for camera. d-pad is for navigating menus and I think switching weapons when not in menus.

[Dingo]

But for PSU while in a fight you can't scroll through the menu and run at the same time right?....which worries me since it came in handy in PSO

[Saner]

On 2006-08-19 07:02, Dingo wrote:
But for PSU while in a fight you can't scroll through the menu and run at the same time right?....which worries me since it came in handy in PSO



YOU CAN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehHrsKArKgc&NR

this one was scrolling through the menus at one point in the battle while moving around.

It makes sense to be able to move while still in menu.

[Kamica]

The chair sitting is ridiculously nitpicking. There are obviously reasons that it was implemented into the game like this. It wasnt fixed in the beta, it wont be fixed
in the premiere disc, and youll still see it in the full game. Sonic Team knows how to do a sitting down animation, it isnt like this because they were lazy.

As for bodies reappearing and disappearing...thats a reasonable complaint. I dont ever remember it being too bad in the PC version though. Maybe someone who played the beta more than me would be able to say differently.

[ryeenae]

I think Dingo means you can't use the D-pad and the left thumb stick with the same hand, and you'd have to take your right hand off of the right stick to be able to still move around. So even though it is possible to continue running while in the menus, it's just annoying.

I wish they'd handled it like Kingdom Hearts 2 had, where you could hold down either R2 or L2 (I forget which) to switch the right thumb stick between camera and menu. Though I'm not sure, does PSU use either of the second shoulder buttons for anything?



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ryeenae on 2006-08-19 07:53 ]</font>

[Saner]

On 2006-08-19 07:52, ryeenae wrote:
I think Dingo means you can't use the D-pad and the left thumb stick with the same hand, and you'd have to take your right hand off of the right stick to be able to still move around. So even though it is possible to continue running while in the menus, it's just annoying.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ryeenae on 2006-08-19 07:53 ]</font>


you can use the d-pad and the left thumbstick with the same hand. I played many games that involved menu navigation with d-pad and movement with left thumbstick. just get your pointer finger off the shoulder buttons and use that to operate the d-pad while using your thumb on the left stick for movement.

but if you are not in the heat of battle you can simply hold still and use your whole left hand to operate the d-pad for menus. people will find ways to adapt to these controls.


but are you saying we can't move while adjusting the camera with right analog stick? well that's okay since you can still L1 to reset the camera behind you. so basically you can still turn the camera by facing in the appropriate direction and pressing L1.


in Dreamcast there was no manual camera control feature and people only had the trigger to adjust the camera.

[Dingo]

Geez Saner that just sounds so cumbersome http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif my left hand would totally get cramped up

[Saner]

navigating through menus during battle/movement won't be so common.

weapons and using items are shortcutted without having to open the menu anyways. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif



I still wonder about that right analog stick and not being able to move while rotating camera thing they said. it doesn't make sense.


but ya it's unfair to call Sonic Team lazy about bench sitting warping. you'd think with all the over the top PA animations they have done and emote animations, that they can't do sitting animations?



they can if they wanted to and I'm sure they have good reasons why there are no sitting animations. if its for the good of the game then its worth leaving out those animations. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Dingo]

Yeah PSO had it shortcuts, but playing as a FO meant you had to access the menu sometimes to choose different spells, equip another melee weapon or use fluids, just because there were not enough shortcuts.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Dingo on 2006-08-19 09:11 ]</font>

[Saner]

with 6 weapon slots they can cycle between. and staffs being able to equip 4 Techs EACH, it's really up to the FO how easy or unorganized their play style is. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

besides Photon Points slowly recharge over time.

[Polly]

On 2006-08-19 07:59, Saner wrote:


On 2006-08-19 07:52, ryeenae wrote:
I think Dingo means you can't use the D-pad and the left thumb stick with the same hand, and you'd have to take your right hand off of the right stick to be able to still move around. So even though it is possible to continue running while in the menus, it's just annoying.


you can use the d-pad and the left thumbstick with the same hand. I played many games that involved menu navigation with d-pad and movement with left thumbstick. just get your pointer finger off the shoulder buttons and use that to operate the d-pad while using your thumb on the left stick for movement.



Read other peoples' posts much?

Oh wait...

[Inazuma]

uh, you can change your controls on the pc ver. i dont plan to use the default controls myself. its up to us to create our controls.

this is one of the main reasons i prefer the pc ver. sure, it will look much better, but being able to setup our controls exactly how we want is a big advantage over the ps2 ver.

[parabolee]

Comments on your replies -

GRAPHICS

The graphics on the PS2 look quite crap. They would have looked good 5 years ago but for anyone that has owned a Gamecube, Xbox and/or Xbox 360 it's going to look REAL UGLY!

Besides the more detailed characters I honestly think PSO looks nicer on the gamecube, because the PS2 suffers from the worst anti-aliasing making the game look very rough around the edges.

LOADING TIMES

This is one thing I didn't mention in the review and wish that I had. I found the loading times to be amazingly short! Now the loading times for cut-scenes were a little longer and that is understandable but playing online is my main concern and so having loading screens for stepping through doors into new rooms in the battle area's concerned me. But the loading is usually 2 to 3 seconds! Fantastic programming for a PS2, I you barely even notice that there are loading times at all at these points! I was very happy with it.

THE CHAIR SITTING

I did say I was nitpicking but nonrtheless this is REALLY CRAP! I know some of you just want to love everything about PSU and I do to, but let's not pretend this is acceptable because it isn't, it's not going to spoil the game or anything but it just looks SO crap! i imagine it will be used for getting bed and other places where an animation ould have been cool! We will live with it and it it wont detract from our enjoyment. BUT it does detract from the quality of the game. I mean in FFXI you couldn't sit on a bench that is true, but you could sit down with a full sitting animation for gods sake! Even PSO had a full range of animations like sitting in a chair and things, it's just lazy!



but ya it's unfair to call Sonic Team lazy about bench sitting warping. you'd think with all the over the top PA animations they have done and emote animations, that they can't do sitting animations?

How is it unfair! I KNOW they can do a stting animation! That's why it sucks that they have chosen the lamest and ugliest way to do it! Hell a poor sitting animation would be better than the warp to sit BS!

Can not wait to get my hands on the full game!

[Dingo]

Awwww man anti-aliasing is soooo overrated IMO. I think the character-models have a terrific polygon-count, this is not something that could be said about the ones in PSO. From what I have seen, PS2 owners should not be complaining about graphics, so I'm happy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Jeral]

Any idea on a 360 European release (gonna be gay cus the americans are gonna be capped before I can even get on it lol)

[Dingo]

European 360 release.....ouch. It seems like 360 owners will get screwed with the release date anyway, and add to that the fact that Europe always gets screwed a little more. I mean come on! Final Fantasy 12 is coming six months later than the american version and one year later than the japanese version....but i digress.

[parabolee]

On 2006-08-19 12:55, Dingo wrote:
Awwww man anti-aliasing is soooo overrated IMO. I think the character-models have a terrific polygon-count, this is not something that could be said about the ones in PSO. From what I have seen, PS2 owners should not be complaining about graphics, so I'm happy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif


No my friend lack of anti-aliasing is the main reason why so many PS2 games are so ugly! Even the Dreamcast had great anti-aliasing which made all the DC games look bright and smooth and PS2 games look dingy and rough! Compare PS2 Quake 3 to Dreamcast Quake 3!!!

Anti-aliasing is one of the most important aspects of nice 3D graphics.

For those PS2 users that only have that option for PSU, I'm glad you will be happy with it. Personally I would rather go out and buy a new PC to play this game on than play the ugly version I played last night. And if it wasn't coming to 360 this is exactly what I was going to do.

[Jeral]

Baaah humbug! At least 360 gets its own version or something, diff server to Ps2 and PC users so we dont get screwed to much, But hey Im used to the damm americans getting everything before me for example Dead Rising came out early this month, comes out early next month for europeans, And by that time us peeps have done moraless on it, and europeans got nothing to say for it, sucks.

[A2K]

That chair thing actually does seem a bit strange. We get a whole slew of new emotes but there isn't room for a "sit down in chair" animation?

As for the menu thing, I suppose it'll just require a bit more management. Instead of doing it while running around I'll probably just end up hanging back or retreating for a short spell to tinker with those things.

[Dingo]

But parabolee you're willing to call a PS2 game ugly because the lack of anti-aliasing? I can see why you would call a multiplatform title ugly because of that reason though. Lack of AA just never bothered me on my blurred out CRT TV-screen http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[PhotonCat]

Awwww man anti-aliasing is soooo overrated IMO. I think the character-models have a terrific polygon-count, this is not something that could be said about the ones in PSO. From what I have seen, PS2 owners should not be complaining about graphics, so I'm happy

Aliasing is one of the most WORSE things in a game. When I play I NEED AA to be on. It looks horrible without it, like most PS2 games.

But then again, I am not getting the PS2 version, I am getting the PC version.



But parabolee you're willing to call a PS2 game ugly because the lack of anti-aliasing? I can see why you would call a multiplatform title ugly because of that reason though. Lack of AA just never bothered me on my blurred out CRT TV-screen

It's no lie. Out of all 3 PSU versions the PS2 does look the worst. The PS2 has no AA and is the less-advantaged system out of the 3.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: PhotonCat on 2006-08-19 13:34 ]</font>

[Phaze37]

navigating through menus during battle/movement won't be so common.
That is blatantly wrong. I'm curious, did you ever even play PSO online for gamecube, xbox, or blue burst on PC? I don't know about you, but I switched weapons all the time in the middle of a battle, so anything that makes that more awkward to do is a very bad thing from my point of view.


but ya it's unfair to call Sonic Team lazy about bench sitting warping.
You'll defend Sonic Team no matter what they do won't you? Sonic Team always makes stupid mistakes in their games and I'm getting tired of it. They're lazy. I just pray that they actually playtest PSU properly, because that would be a first for Sonic Team.


they can if they wanted to and I'm sure they have good reasons why there are no sitting animations.
Trust me, laziness is the only reason. If they can't be bothered to animate it, they'd be better off just removing the ability to sit down. It's one of those things that makes the game look sloppy. I'm trying to convince my friends that were disapointed with PSO to come and try PSU, and they're very skeptical. I don't blame them, after I convinced one of my friends to buy a network adaptor he lost all of his good weapons to FSOD within 10 minutes of playing online. They know how lazy Sonic Team is and they don't even play Sonic Team games very often. Little things like this just prove that they're still lazy, and that's enough to affect my friends' decision to get the game or not.

This topic made me change my mind about getting the PS2 version. I'm getting the PC version instead so that I can change the controls to allow me to navigate menus with the right analog stick. Yes, it's that important to me. In PSO I'd often switch weapons over 10 times per battle, because I could do it easily while dodging enemy attacks. It was one of the features that made PSO alot of fun. It wouldn't be hard to make it so that the right analog stick moves the camera when you're not in a menu, and navigates menus instead when a menu is open. But like I've said several times before, Sonic Team is lazy. I guess I'll just move camera control to the directional keys on the keyboard since I won't be using them that much, but knowing Sonic Team it might not even be possible to do that. Blue Burst had very limited control customization (more proof of ST's laziness) which forced people to use third party programs like JoyToKey just to get the game to control like it did on gamecube. I'm getting the PC version so that I can use JoyToKey to overcome any inadequate control options PSU might have, but even then JoyToKey isn't perfect either. I could never get Blue Burst to control exactly the way I wanted it.

[BhabakaBBR]

i think that they didn´t put a char siting animation because it would bug and u would be able to see 2 peoples siting in the same place one on top of each other

[Axios-]

I'm fine with the navigating menus thing. I played GCN, and I had no problem scrolling with the d-pad while moving with the control stick. If that's a problem, you can either map keys differently or rough it out. Of course, it'd be better if this weren't an issue. As for the sitting animation, they were lazy. Just plain lazy. There's no getting around that. It's not a game-killer or anything, but the only reason that there isn't an animation is laziness. Look at how many emotes are at our disposal.

[uhawww]

I like how everyone's complaining about a non-release, free and limited version of the game...


I say, save your vitriol and judgement for the retail.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: uhawww on 2006-08-19 16:01 ]</font>

[-Shimarisu-]

Haha, it's not bloody difficult to switch weapons, are you people on crack?

For PSO: OK, depending on your set up I guess the buttons are gonna differ. For me it's right shoulder back button, then triangular button, THEN I scroll through the shortcut menus that pop up, if the last one wasn't for weapons. THEN I scroll down a list of WRITTEN words with the D-Pad I have to read quickly to select the weapon.

PSU: X button plus D-pad. And the menu's all in icons, not words.

NOES!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: -Shimarisu- on 2006-08-19 16:07 ]</font>


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: -Shimarisu- on 2006-08-19 16:09 ]</font>

[Dingo]

Some of us don't have experience with the weapon switching system in PSU, sorry about that shimarisu

[Ash1ey]

The whole menu scrolling is not any different from the DC days of PSO. It wasnt problem back then.. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Steve II on 2006-08-19 16:08 ]</font>

[Dingo]

DC did not have a right analog stick right? How was menu scrolling and evading enemies at the same time not a problem? (I'm not trying to sound cynical by the way I'm really just curious:P)

[kyori]

Weapon switching is only a real issue IMO on ps2. Either you can ergonomically manage or you'll have to stop to a brief switch. Also, it's real pain that you can't do it while holding L either. Meanwhile on PC, I was able to to switch midbattle without ever pausing and keeping the action going. And a final word about the complaints, the camera is perfectly fine and I'll just leave it at that to save myself some trouble.

[-Shimarisu-]

On 2006-08-19 16:00, uhawww wrote:
I like how everyone's complaining about a non-release, free and limited version of the game...


...That they pirated. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[kyori]

On 2006-08-19 16:13, -Shimarisu- wrote:


On 2006-08-19 16:00, uhawww wrote:
I like how everyone's complaining about a non-release, free and limited version of the game...


...That they pirated. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



I'm still waiting for those photos!

[Dingo]

On 2006-08-19 16:00, uhawww wrote:
I like how everyone's complaining about a non-release, free and limited version of the game...



...That they pirated.
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif blasphemy! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

Anyway: we'll find it all out once the final version gets released, indeed.http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Parn]

On 2006-08-19 15:41, BhabakaBBR wrote:
i think that they didn´t put a char siting animation because it would bug and u would be able to see 2 peoples siting in the same place one on top of each other
Bingo. This individual hit the nail on the head. When you click on a chair, it automatically positions you in an appropriate spot, if there's multiple seats. As an example, when you approach those tables with stools in Parum with multiple seats, it's treated as one single target and places you in a vacant chair.

This is going to be fairly long since I'm going to go ahead and be in defense of Sonic Team here. Proportion is a major issue when dealing with situations like this, which is why just about every online game tries to avoid letting you sit on objects (the ones that do generally have no proportion adjustment in their character creation, or suffer a similar situation that PSU has). Because not every player is the same height, trying to program in animations for sitting down on a static object would be more work than necessary, especially over something so trivial.

The comparison of Final Fantasy XI doesn't apply... you simply sat on the ground, and if you're on a slope, your character is either partially floating or inside the terrain, so don't tell me that doesn't look ridiculous. Final Fantasy XI does have your character shown mounting chocobos which is the equivalent of sitting on an object, but the chocobo's proportions are scaled to your character's size, so the animation is easily made to work... in PSU however, chairs don't scale because it's a static part of the environment. Those benches aren't going to move. The comparison of Phantasy Star Online's bubble chairs doesn't apply either... those things were intentionally designed to be big, simple, and bulky to cover up most of the clipping going on. Also once again, they're not a static part of the environment.

The only way they would have been able to make things work based on the engine they're using would have been to create a unique set of animations for every height possibility. If the animation was shared for all proportions like they are for all the emotes and attack animations where nothing other than a character's feet placement is considered, a character who's average height would sit properly, but a smaller character would end up inside the chair, and a larger character would be floating above it. Or alternatively, if the game was programmed to have your character's rear end to land in the correct spot (which is the case considering the end result when you do sit in a chair), a smaller character would suddenly be floating in the air while the animation happened, and a larger character's legs would be in the floor during the animation process. All of this of course, is seperate to the additional programming of having your character walk to the seat.

You folks call it laziness, but I call it getting your priorities straight. They've delayed this game for over a year to fix bugs on top of the two to three years of development prior to that, so using the word "laziness" to describe this is absolutely ridiculous. There is legitimate reason for the route they took, and if you sincerely believe that "laziness" was involved, well... whatever. Personally, I find it hilarious when I read things like


Little things like this just prove that they're still lazy, and that's enough to affect my friends' decision to get the game or not.
considering all the actual content in the game. You have to be a really petty individual to let a chair animation make or break a game for you. Good luck with your uptight friends.

[parabolee]

Look I'm as big a fanboy of Sega and Sonic team as anyone but those of you defending the crap chair teleport/sit just sound dumb.

The arguments over people sitting on top of each other is stupid, that would require the smallest amount of programming to prevent!

Look the game is going to be AMAZING, so don't worry about something as small as that crap sitting teleport. but it is crap!

Oh and in the demo I found that tthe method of changing weapons was fine, can't see anyone having problems with it myself.

[Polly]

All the good things people have said about the game in this thread are overshadowed by the one small gripe they had. Way to look on the bright side, PSOW.

[therealAERO]

Can't you have the controls setup so if you hold one of the top buttons it lets you use the right analog stick as a selector? Or was the PSO? I can't remember, but what I can remember is that...the controls for PSU were sweet.

[-Shimarisu-]

On 2006-08-19 17:51, parabolee wrote:
Look I'm as big a fanboy of Sega and Sonic team as anyone but those of you defending the crap chair teleport/sit just sound dumb.



I think the way you sit down is great. It's kinda cute how you just warp there. It's like a cut in a soap opera. You know, one minute you are stood up, chatting with all the cute guys, next you're sat in a chair enjoying a soda. Like you're on a date! It's a nice transistion. I hope they implement more of this scene shifting thing. It's really a lot of fun. ^______________________^

[vitius137]

I see your point about the chair sit programming. I kinda assumed the reason for no animation was something like that. You teleport onto the seat because it puts you there. If it let you sit as you wish several problems would occur, sucha s the ones Parn graciously pointed out. I'm still excited about PSU and in no way is my opinion of it any worse. In fact, this small problem actually made me think about all the great stuff they DID do that many other MMOs were too afraid to try.

They didn't have to add the ability to sit on chairs and they didn't have to make a complex character create system. They could have added other craptastic interactive elements on lobbies but instead they chose to put their effort where it really counts. I'd hate to have eveyone in my party look the same even if it meant I could have the most beautiful sitting animation ever created.

They only thing I'm dissapointed with is the fact that we still have monkey-ass camera, but I'm pretty sure EVERYONE expected that. >.>

Really can't wait for PSU >.< >.< >.< >.< T_T

[Parn]

On 2006-08-19 17:51, parabolee wrote:
Look I'm as big a fanboy of Sega and Sonic team as anyone but those of you defending the crap chair teleport/sit just sound dumb.
No more dumb than listening to you folks complain about it.


The arguments over people sitting on top of each other is stupid, that would require the smallest amount of programming to prevent!
Yeah, and they addressed just that with their current method. Way to pay attention.


Look the game is going to be AMAZING, so don't worry about something as small as that crap sitting teleport. but it is crap!
You're the one that made a big freaking deal about it in the first place. Your "the bad" section was a good bit larger than "the good" in your review, and the biggest thing you talked about was how you sat in chairs. Who gives a shit.

[Ether]

Teleporting into a chair breaks immersion.

You may be able to come up a great technical explanation of why they did it, but none of that matters to the casual fan. I guarantee everyone who sits down for the first time is going to have the same "What the hell?" reaction. Having a chair magically appear underneath you in PSO was better than this method

Edit: Come to think of it, WoW did the same thing with its chairs, minus the vanishing for a second part


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2006-08-19 20:24 ]</font>

[Parn]

Breaks immersion? The immersion is broken every time you hit a loading screen (which is very frequent, I might add).

6.5+ million World of Warcraft players don't seem to give a shit about "breaking immersion" when they sit in a chair after immediately teleporting to a position in front of it. I guarantee that the casual gamer isn't going to care about sitting down in a chair to begin with.

[Fleece]

On 2006-08-19 20:22, Ether wrote:
Teleporting into a chair breaks immersion.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2006-08-19 20:24 ]</font>



Good its a fucking live action fighting game not a 3d chat lobby for paedophiles.

*Guy stands*

*Guy warps to sit down*

Who gives a crap

*Guy Swings sword*

*Guy warps across battlefield and sits down*

"HOLY CRAP!!!!" - Fleece


Only then would i actually care at all. We get more Morons by the day.

[Tystys]

Why are we arguing over how our character sits?

I can just see the player character now..

PC 1: They still arguing about it?
PC2: Oh yeah
PC 1: See? I told you, man! One little mess up and these nerds FLIP
PC 2:Bwahahah, I know man. Let's see how long it la--wait, is that guy right there looking at us?

*points to me*

Yes, morons, I can see you

PC 1:OHSHI
PC 2:BAIL!

[ShinMaruku]

Some people are gonna piss on this game really, they expect too much!

As for Sonic Team being lazy, that's a given.

[Fleece]

If you dont like it Go Code your own game, you can call it 'Fantasy Star Universe' and i wont buy it. Ill pirate 500 copies of it and hand them out on the street just to boycot your moronic asses Lol.

[Jife_Jifremok]

Breaking immersion? Having to use a third-person view for just about everything breaks any chance of immersion in the first place. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

While I thought at first that Sonic Team's laziness brought about the teleport sitting, Parn's explanation really...explained it well. Although, I remember playing Star Wars Galaxies and having no troubles with sitting on chairs, and that had lots of height and weight possibilities. Then again, I may have simply failed to notice any clipping. And that game was bugged as shit. But at least they got the chair sitting right. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

As for the menu controls: That shouldn't be a problem. Left thumb for movement, right thumb for camera control, left index for the menu. Well, up and down might be a little trouble but adaptation shouldn't take long.

[Kamica]

On 2006-08-19 20:22, Ether wrote:
Teleporting into a chair breaks immersion.

You may be able to come up a great technical explanation of why they did it, but none of that matters to the casual fan. I guarantee everyone who sits down for the first time is going to have the same "What the hell?" reaction. Having a chair magically appear underneath you in PSO was better than this method

Edit: Come to think of it, WoW did the same thing with its chairs, minus the vanishing for a second part


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2006-08-19 20:24 ]</font>


My first reaction was more along the lines of "Wow! You can sit down on benches!"
I think mostly everybody will either think the same way as I did or just not give an arse.

[Saner]

This so-called "Review" is one of the worst yet. Honest and opinionated yet really really overreacting about the "bad points" that really are not bad at all.


if chair warping and "10 year old" graphics are such a downside, maybe you shouldn't buy the game at all and save us from your pessimistic attitude. you shant be missed. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

[-Shimarisu-]

My first reaction was "Wow neat I look so cute sat on da floor. :3"

[Ether]

On 2006-08-19 21:42, Saner wrote:
This so-called "Review" is one of the worst yet.


Too long for you?

[Fleece]

On 2006-08-19 21:42, Saner wrote:

you shant be missed. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif




Neither will you.

Feels good doesn't it.

[vitius137]

On 2006-08-19 21:04, Fleece wrote:
If you dont like it Go Code your own game, you can call it 'Fantasy Star Universe' and i wont buy it. Ill pirate 500 copies of it and hand them out on the street just to boycot your moronic asses Lol.



million dollar idea. no, seriously you can make a million dollars that way*

*not really...

[Saner]

Neither will you.

Feels good doesn't it.



Neither will you.

Feels good doesn't it? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saner on 2006-08-19 22:04 ]</font>

[Kamica]

On 2006-08-19 22:04, Saner wrote:



Neither will you.

Feels good doesn't it.



Neither will you.

Feels good doesn't it? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saner on 2006-08-19 22:04 ]</font>


Summary:

Pesron1:You suck
Person2:No U
Person1:No U

[Saner]

On 2006-08-19 21:49, Ether wrote:


On 2006-08-19 21:42, Saner wrote:
This so-called "Review" is one of the worst yet.


Too long for you?



nope. just too closed-minded. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

I seen all of these pessimistic previews and reviews before on other games. It's sickening and pathetic how much they nitpick without knowing all the facts why things are as they are. Sonic Team could give parabolee a personal lecture about things like warp seating, but it isn't worth their time. There's millions of Parabolees out there and it's impossible to satisfy everyone.

And after the game's release they either buy the game and play it and keep saying they hate this and that (contradicting their enmity towards things). or they don't buy it yet continue their chorus about "how much better it could have been". http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

[Ether]

On 2006-08-19 22:10, Saner wrote:

nope. just too closed-minded. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif


Closed minded? This is the first review by a person here that isn't 100% OMG PSU IS SO KEWL ITS THE GREATEST GAME EVER. I fail to see how admiting the game isn't perfect and has faults = close-minded

[vitius137]

k guys. I just watched a beta movie on youtube ( http://youtube.com/watch?v=WbWih5t1g4I ) that showed someone sitting in a chair in a lobby. This movie made me mad. Not at Sonic Team or the person who made the movie. I got mad at those who are complaining about this.

At first I thought you guys were talking about an abrubt dissapearance that lasted maybe a second. This would give you some reason to complain IF you are extremely picky.

This movie shows someone walk up to a stool, fade out for maybe less than half a second and faded in sitting on the stool perfectly. HOW CAN YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT THIS? That's as good as it gets! name one game as great as PSU that has better sitting animations in lobbies. If you can, you can go to that game's forum.

I don't need people making me worry and scaring off other potential buyers by making a huge deal about something like this. Focus on something else; the character creation, the levels, enemies, battles, shops. These are the things that matter and you guys complain about how you can't do a full sitting animation >.<

People are complaining more about this than the camera issue which I am not sure how to feel about. It looks fine in the beta movies but I'm not sure how good it is in battles.

Anyway I hope that some of you will be able to forgive sonic team for not perfecting their game with all sorts of minor details. Hell, I've had much larger dissapointments in their last 5 sonic games that failed because of their incompetence and you guys call them lazy because you can't watch yourself bend down to sit in a chair. bah I say.

PS. I'm sorry if I have offended anyone but I really think the sitting animation is perfectly fine and I think no one has the right (at least not now) to call sonic team lazy because of this. I hope you understand.

EDIT: lol, spelling err0rs. I have a crappy keyboard v.v

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: vitius137 on 2006-08-19 22:29 ]</font>

[Niki]

On 2006-08-19 20:40, Fleece wrote:

We get more Morons by the day.

Ah, yes the internet. Morons call it home.

Wait, I probably shouldn't talk... ö_ô;;

[Saner]

On 2006-08-19 22:17, Ether wrote:


On 2006-08-19 22:10, Saner wrote:

nope. just too closed-minded. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif


Closed minded? This is the first review by a person here that isn't 100% OMG PSU IS SO KEWL ITS THE GREATEST GAME EVER. I fail to see how admiting the game isn't perfect and has faults = close-minded




well neither is it healthy to be on the other side of the spectrum calling this and that ugly (with caps) and other nasty wails about 'flaws' that are only flaws in their own point of view but treat them as fact when they're not.

AND HE DARED TO CALL SONIC TEAM LAZY!!!! One would have to be really ignorant, selfish, self-centered, ungrateful to say that about developers, when they themselves have no BLOODY idea why they made those decisions to present things that way.

And it's obvious Sonic Team cares about its creation more than anyone else who just gets a chance to try out the game for free.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saner on 2006-08-19 22:30 ]</font>

[vitius137]

On 2006-08-19 22:26, Saner wrote:

AND HE DARED TO CALL SONIC TEAM LAZY!!!! One would have to be really ignorant, selfish, self-centered, ungrateful to say that about developers, when they themselves have no BLOODY idea why they made those decisions to present things that way.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saner on 2006-08-19 22:30 ]</font>


Actually all you'd have to do is play one of the recent Sonic games to say that about Sonic Team. But I agree that no one really can call a developer lazy because you never know what or why they make certain decisions. It might just be limitations or bad luck.

[Saner]

well ya I'm not saying he has no right to voice his opinions but naturally we have our own opinions about each others opinions, whether we agree or disagree.

and I feel this review is for the most part unfair towards Sonic Team and PSU.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saner on 2006-08-19 22:37 ]</font>

[Niki]

On 2006-08-19 22:33, vitius137 wrote:

Actually all you'd have to do is play one of the recent Sonic games to say that about Sonic Team. But I agree that no one really can call a developer lazy because you never know what or why they make certain decisions. It might just be limitations or bad luck.

Well, in my experience, developers are lazy, particularly localisation developers. If QA testers didn't force them to do their jobs, well, we'd all be playing ET.

[Kyuu]

I did say I was nitpicking but nonrtheless this is REALLY CRAP! I know some of you just want to love everything about PSU and I do to, but let's not pretend this is acceptable because it isn't, it's not going to spoil the game or anything but it just looks SO crap! i imagine it will be used for getting bed and other places where an animation ould have been cool! We will live with it and it it wont detract from our enjoyment. BUT it does detract from the quality of the game. I mean in FFXI you couldn't sit on a bench that is true, but you could sit down with a full sitting animation for gods sake! Even PSO had a full range of animations like sitting in a chair and things, it's just lazy!

That's why it sucks that they have chosen the lamest and ugliest way to do it! Hell a poor sitting animation would be better than the warp to sit BS!
Well, quite asides from Parn's excellent description of the amount of effort it would take to program such a rediculously trivial thing, I'd have to disagree with you. The teleport thing is much better than a crapjob sitting animation. I played WoW for quite a long time. Now if you know anything about WoW, you know that you have zero control over your character's height and proportions. Now even with that, the sitting animations have clipping problems, not to mention problems with multiple people trying to share the same chair/bench. Now they got it down well enough to be passable, but it still isn't terribly good. Now you add to that the height and proportion issues that PSU would introduce...

FFXI lets you sit on the ground you say? Guess what! So does PSU! I've seen more than a few pictures from the closed beta that showed characters sitting and even laying on the floor. And I'm sure the sitting/laying emotes have full animations. Probably anyone who played the beta and/or the Premiere Disc can confirm this.

Is the teleport ideal? No. But neither is it "laziness." It's more like Sega had their priorities straight, and didn't waste time and resources making a sitting animation for the chairs and benches. Just be happy you can actually sit in them. Most companies wouldn't have bothered putting in that functionality at all with all the height/proportion issues. And if it's so apalling to you, then don't sit on the chairs for chrissakes.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kyuu on 2006-08-19 22:39 ]</font>

[vitius137]

LOL. omg I guess you're right. It's human nature to be lazy (don't count on me to hold a strong argument http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

http://www.duelinganalogs.com/?date=2006-08-14

EDIT: maybe this thread should be locked seeing as its only an opinion biased flame war that isnt getting us anywhere (although I have learned a lot from Parn ^_^)


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: vitius137 on 2006-08-19 22:43 ]</font>

[Saner]

I think even sitting on the ground is a warping transition. where's Shiramisu?

but it's nothing bad. it's better than not being able to sit at all. or a loading screen popping up when you are about to sit down. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Kamica]

On 2006-08-19 22:45, Saner wrote:
I think even sitting on the ground is a warping transition. where's Shiramisu?

but it's nothing bad. it's better than not being able to sit at all. or a loading screen popping up when you are about to sit down. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif





You dont warp when you sit down directly on the floor.

[vitius137]

On 2006-08-19 22:45, Saner wrote:
I think even sitting on the ground is a warping transition. where's Shiramisu?

but it's nothing bad. it's better than not being able to sit at all. or a loading screen popping up when you are about to sit down. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif





I'm quite sure sitting isnt a warp transition. I saw it in Parn's emote video a while ago.

[Saner]

oh ok just checking.
see? Sonic Team isn't as lazy as people claim.

Sonic and Phantasy Star are two different subjects.

ironically, Sonic Team has always been better at making Phantasy Star games than Sonic games.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saner on 2006-08-19 22:49 ]</font>

[vitius137]

wait, Saner didn't know that?!?!?

*looks outside window to check if apocolypse is coming*

[Saner]

well the emote video of Parn that I've seen, only showed the standard standing emotes, not sitting on the floor.

[Roken]

Just saw the 'warp sitting', it really isnt as much as a big deal as many of you are putting it. They have many more emotes than other MMO's and do the traditional, sitting on the floor. They didnt HAVE to add sitting on benches and what-not.

As for PS2 graphics, I agree with Saner that they're far from ugly, and once again another big deal blown out of proportion. We know 360 and PC ( with a good system ) will have better graphics, but that doesnt mean the graphics on PS2 are crap.

...In any case, I say its time for a real 'review' thread, not a chair-bashing ( >.> ? ) thread.

[Inu_Shadi]

okay i just saw that video, and the way most of you were describing it made it sound like it was just like... no effects at all, just dissaperaing and reappearing all of a sudden, but its nothing like that. I think it looks great! You fade out, and then fade in really quickly!

[Dingo]

Well I don't think you could say that it looks great http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif I mean....SITTING ANIMATION THAT WOULD BE GREAT!

Meh let's just drop that topic now and try to get back to talking about reviewing the premiere disc

[Foxix]

Could someone please tell me what video this is O_o?

I completely understand about the sitting animation though. However the graphics look fine and for people who are complaining about it, you are fricking comparing it to the 360 and PC. Brilliant. PS2 games have never been much to look at and I am suprised just how much they have managed to squeeze out of the hardware. Graphics really dont matter to me anyway, I dealt with it in PSO, Disgaea, any nippon ichi game, Oendan, Phantom Crash, and countless other games and I will deal with it now should I have to.

[parabolee]

On 2006-08-19 20:16, Parn wrote:

On 2006-08-19 17:51, parabolee wrote:
Look I'm as big a fanboy of Sega and Sonic team as anyone but those of you defending the crap chair teleport/sit just sound dumb.
No more dumb than listening to you folks complain about it.


The arguments over people sitting on top of each other is stupid, that would require the smallest amount of programming to prevent!
Yeah, and they addressed just that with their current method. Way to pay attention.


Look the game is going to be AMAZING, so don't worry about something as small as that crap sitting teleport. but it is crap!
You're the one that made a big freaking deal about it in the first place. Your "the bad" section was a good bit larger than "the good" in your review, and the biggest thing you talked about was how you sat in chairs. Who gives a shit.



You sir are a rude idiot.

I love people that jump into discussions and start flaming because they feel something they like has been slighted! God you guys would only be happy if I don't report on the bad things. Why don't I edit that original post and remove the bad since non of you can deal with even the smallest (nit picking) ctitique! Grow up!

I wasn't making a big deal out of it at all. I said I was nitpicking for god sake! It is the defend all the games flaws crowd that made it a big deal. I said a lot of good things about the game and that it was going to be amazing but you all had to jump over the few small downsides THAT I SAID I WAS NIT PICKING AT!!!!!

[parabolee]

On 2006-08-19 22:10, Saner wrote:

nope. just too closed-minded. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif



Closed minded? This is the first review by a person here that isn't 100% OMG PSU IS SO KEWL ITS THE GREATEST GAME EVER. I fail to see how admiting the game isn't perfect and has faults = close-minded


well neither is it healthy to be on the other side of the spectrum calling this and that ugly (with caps) and other nasty wails about 'flaws' that are only flaws in their own point of view but treat them as fact when they're not.

AND HE DARED TO CALL SONIC TEAM LAZY!!!! One would have to be really ignorant, selfish, self-centered, ungrateful to say that about developers, when they themselves have no BLOODY idea why they made those decisions to present things that way.

And it's obvious Sonic Team cares about its creation more than anyone else who just gets a chance to try out the game for free.


OMG you people are INFURIATING!!!

Saner you could not be MORE wrong about what you have said about me. You are so closed minded and sure that PSU can do no wrong that you have blind sided EVERY SINGLE THING I said about the game and locked in on the few NIT PICKING details that I mentioned. For god sake what part of -

"Let me make on0ne thing very clear though, I am being VERY nit picky here. but as it's Phantasy Star I want the best"

Do you not understand!!

You call ME close minded because I dared to mention a FEW SMALL things that were less than perfect!

Let me exaplin something for you that will hopefully detroy yoour ignorant perceptions. I am a HUGE PSO fan, and I am so excited for PSU that I paid $50 to have a promo poster imported from Japan to frame on my wall!

I fully expect PSU to be litrally the GREATEST GAME OF ALL TIME! I'm not exagerating here I really am more excited aboutn PSU than any other game ever. Sonic Team are my all time favourite software team and I pretty much buy everything they put out. Does this soumd "ignorant, selfish, self-centered, ungrateful"?

I said I expect better from them for a reason! because I DO!

Now do you understand how ridiculous you sound saying that I am "on the other side of the spectrum" of "OMG PSU IS SO KEWL ITS THE GREATEST GAME EVER". The truth is I AM a "PSU is going to be the best thing ever", kind of guy! But because of that the small flaws stand out to me, will they prevent me from loving the game like it is my first born child? No, but I am open minded enough to notice and point out the game few flaws.

And just for you here is a sanitized version of my review, I think this is the version you were looking for 9and should serve as a reminder of all the GOOD things i said that you ingnored because there was some (small "nit picking") parts that got you all riled up.



Got my hands on the Japanese PSU demo disc and thought I'd let you all know my thought's...

The demo is pretty big, took me about an hour to get to the end of it (Although it could take a lot less since I took my time to look around and I had to wade through the Japanese).

For a PlayStation 2 game it looks pretty good (which means the PC and 360 version will look even better). What I liked best about the demo is the fact that it really FEELS like PSO. The graphics and music are different enough to feel all new and fresh but similar enough to feel like home to the PSO fanatic.

The cut scenes are really good, even in Japanese I thought they were funny, the world looks really detailed and will be a real pleasure to explore. The battle controls are TIGHT! You hold down R1 to use the gun or release for the sword, you can also go into first person aim mode for shooting. L1 locks on to an enemy (although not with the gun strangely) and you can sidestep around them while fighting. The button timing feels great, even better than PSO, and the high power attack now uses TP or some other measured bar below the weapon that charges up, so you have a limited amount of them. But they do some wicked damage. I found the fighting to be lot of fun and am excited to explore the depth in the full game. I leveled up to 3

I was very impressed.

Well 2 weeks for the Japanese release! I just hope that we don't have to wait 3 months for a US release and then another 2 for a 360 release! God that will kill me!


Wow I sound really negative and close minded don't I!



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: parabolee on 2006-08-20 11:02 ]</font>


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: parabolee on 2006-08-20 11:03 ]</font>

[Kamica]

On 2006-08-20 10:42, parabolee wrote:


On 2006-08-19 20:16, Parn wrote:

On 2006-08-19 17:51, parabolee wrote:
Look I'm as big a fanboy of Sega and Sonic team as anyone but those of you defending the crap chair teleport/sit just sound dumb.
No more dumb than listening to you folks complain about it.


The arguments over people sitting on top of each other is stupid, that would require the smallest amount of programming to prevent!
Yeah, and they addressed just that with their current method. Way to pay attention.


Look the game is going to be AMAZING, so don't worry about something as small as that crap sitting teleport. but it is crap!
You're the one that made a big freaking deal about it in the first place. Your "the bad" section was a good bit larger than "the good" in your review, and the biggest thing you talked about was how you sat in chairs. Who gives a shit.



You sir are a rude idiot.

I love people that jump into discussions and start flaming because they feel something they like has been slighted! God you guys would only be happy if I don't report on the bad things. Why don't I edit that original post and remove the bad since non of you can deal with even the smallest (nit picking) ctitique! Grow up!

I wasn't making a big deal out of it at all. I said I was nitpicking for god sake! It is the defend all the games flaws crowd that made it a big deal. I said a lot of good things about the game and that it was going to be amazing but you all had to jump over the few small downsides THAT I SAID I WAS NIT PICKING AT!!!!!



Nobody here ever said that they dont want to hear about any possible bad parts of the game. Nobody said we would be satisfied if we only heard good things.

The fact that this whole argument started is no ones fault but your own.

Look at the lengths of your paragraphs. The second longest paragraph is the one in which you were nitpicking over something that shouldnt be nitpicked in the first place.

Also, you yourself was the one who wouldnt shut up about the whole ordeal. You allowed it to continue.
Your the one who caused this be be blown way out of proportion, dont throw the blame on other people please.

[Saner]

I didn't say your review shouldn't say bad things about it.

it's just that the things you picked, like chair warping, and saying the PS2 is ugly (in caps, AS IF it's too awful to even play with that version), infuriated me. I seen the PS2 media and pics and I feel it looks beautiful as it is.

I'm sorry if I insulted you. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

[Parn]

On 2006-08-20 10:42, parabolee wrote:
You sir are a rude idiot.

I love people that jump into discussions and start flaming because they feel something they like has been slighted! God you guys would only be happy if I don't report on the bad things. Why don't I edit that original post and remove the bad since non of you can deal with even the smallest (nit picking) ctitique! Grow up!

I wasn't making a big deal out of it at all. I said I was nitpicking for god sake! It is the defend all the games flaws crowd that made it a big deal. I said a lot of good things about the game and that it was going to be amazing but you all had to jump over the few small downsides THAT I SAID I WAS NIT PICKING AT!!!!!

You have no business using the word "rude" to describe anyone, nor telling someone else to grow up.


How fucking LAZY is that!
That's your own words. You claimed that a group of programmers who have devoted over three years of their life to this game, were being lazy. Perhaps you are the one that needs to grow up first?

It's not about what you're critiqueing, but rather, how you were doing it. As an example of what I'm talking about, I never once addressed your complaint regarding the right analog stick. It was a legitimate complaint.

Would I prefer actual animations for sitting? Absolutely. Anyone would, and it is a legitimate complaint like the above. However, I take issue with the "Sonic Team is lazy" mentality, as you remarked about which was immediately followed by several other folks quickly chiming in with more of the same. I'm tired of hearing forum posters abroad on different online gaming message boards whine and bitch about a company's so-called "laziness", especially when they don't realize how much is involved to make a game these days. "Square Enix is lazy because I don't have my chocobo racing yet" on FFXI, "Blizzard is lazy because they're reducing raid numbers from 40 to 25" on World of Warcraft, on and on and on and on...

If you had kept the remarks about Sonic Team's "laziness" out of your post, I'd have never said a word.

[Black_Heart]

If you had actually been nitpicking about the lack of sit animation it would have been like this:

"also, you don't have a sit animation, you just dissapear and reappear on your seat, which is no big deal, but kinda bugs me"

THAT is nitpicking. Not a giant paragraph talking about how Sonic Team is lazy, how programming is so advanced that this shouldn't happen, how the game needs a sit animation.

Also, for the love of god, settle down, not everyone has to accept or share your opinion. There are lots of people in the world who will badmouth, disagree with, mock, and pick apart your opinions. That is the internet. I'm not saying they are right for doing it, but you have to realize that is happens.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Black_Heart on 2006-08-20 11:20 ]</font>

[parabolee]

Nobody here ever said that they dont want to hear about any possible bad parts of the game. Nobody said we would be satisfied if we only heard good things.

The fact that this whole argument started is no ones fault but your own.

Look at the lengths of your paragraphs. The second longest paragraph is the one in which you were nitpicking over something that shouldnt be nitpicked in the first place.

Also, you yourself was the one who wouldnt shut up about the whole ordeal. You allowed it to continue.
Your the one who caused this be be blown way out of proportion, dont throw the blame on other people please.



Wrong again, after I posted the whole chair sitting thing blew up, I barely made 3 comments on it after the fact, I was amazed that everyone jumped all over it.

And if you are going to blind side all the good things I said with the lenght of the paragraphs then you are pretty dumb. I could have wrote a book about what vis going to be great about PSU online, but I concentrated on the things that were different in the single player. God your all so childish about this, you all get overly defensive about a few nitpicky remarks made. And worst of all they were made next to remarks like "The cut scenes are really good, even in Japanese I thought they were funny, the world looks really detailed and will be a real pleasure to explore. The battle controls are TIGHT!"

Unless you missed the point I think the game is going to be amazing (no less than the best game ever!)! But no you all gotta hate on me because I dared to point out a few things that i was "slightly dissapointed in"!

[Saner]

Parabolee

It may look good for a PS2 game, but it still looks pretty shit on the PS2! Jaggies and crap texture resolutions make it look very last gen.

that was too harsh on the graphics. and we are looking at the same version.



Parabolee

Now I want to address the crappiest thing in the demo, a lazy piece of programming that I do not expect from Sonic Team! while wondering through the large lobby ship area I came across some benches and was pleased to discover that I could sit on them by pressing O. So I pressed O expecting to see a simple sit down animation like you would in the most average of games. BUT NO! My character VANISHED into thin air and then REAPPEARED sat on the bench! WTF!!!!!!!! How fucking LAZY is that!

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

[parabolee]

You know what i'm sorry I even bothered wasting my time with half of you. I spent 20 minutes writing that up because I thought you all would be interested but half of you are too sensitive to hear criticism. Oh boo hoo you thought I was too harsh in the way I put down the crap chair sitting warp. Grow up, it's crap and that's all there is too it, just because you (like me) want the game to be the best thing ever DOES NOT mean that there can not be something crap about it, and let's face it the chair sitting thing is probably the best thing to be crap.

You all need to toughen up because in the next few months real reviews are going to start coming in from games journalists and they won't be as nice as me.

I love the game already. A lot of them will probably fail to see the beauty of the game and give it harsh reviews. I personally expect it to be a solid 9.5 out of 10, loosing that .5 because of THE CHAIR ANIMATION (joke)!!!

[Kamica]

On 2006-08-20 11:11, parabolee wrote:



Nobody here ever said that they dont want to hear about any possible bad parts of the game. Nobody said we would be satisfied if we only heard good things.

The fact that this whole argument started is no ones fault but your own.

Look at the lengths of your paragraphs. The second longest paragraph is the one in which you were nitpicking over something that shouldnt be nitpicked in the first place.

Also, you yourself was the one who wouldnt shut up about the whole ordeal. You allowed it to continue.
Your the one who caused this be be blown way out of proportion, dont throw the blame on other people please.



Wrong again, after I posted the whole chair sitting thing blew up, I barely made 3 comments on it after the fact, I was amazed that everyone jumped all over it.

And if you are going to blind side all the good things I said with the lenght of the paragraphs then you are pretty dumb. I could have wrote a book about what vis going to be great about PSU online, but I concentrated on the things that were different in the single player. God your all so childish about this, you all get overly defensive about a few nitpicky remarks made. And worst of all they were made next to remarks like "The cut scenes are really good, even in Japanese I thought they were funny, the world looks really detailed and will be a real pleasure to explore. The battle controls are TIGHT!"

Unless you missed the point I think the game is going to be amazing (no less than the best game ever!)! But no you all gotta hate on me because I dared to point out a few things that i was "slightly dissapointed in"!



1.See Blackheart and Parn's latest posts
2. The reason I pointed out the length of the paragraphs is because you are trying to say yourself that it is not that big of a deal and yet this was one of the main parts that you talked the most about.
Im not saying you didnt write enough about the good parts, you simply blew up the bad parts way out of proportion.
3. You really shouldnt have been surprised it blew up. The way you posted it was in such a way that it seemed horrible and was a concern that everybody would care about.

[Saner]

we really don't need reviews to begin with.

We know what we like. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif


good controls information though.

[Black_Heart]

On 2006-08-20 11:18, Saner wrote:

Parabolee

It may look good for a PS2 game, but it still looks pretty shit on the PS2! Jaggies and crap texture resolutions make it look very last gen.

that was too harsh on the graphics. and we are looking at the same version.

I agree. I've seen videos of the graphics and looked at tons of screenshots, the PS2 version looks great.

What do you mean by "last gen" The current console generation is PS2/Gamecube/X-box the Next console generation is PS3/Wii/360 two of which aren't even out yet.

"Last Gen" would be Playstation/N64/Saturn and PSU on PS2 looks a hell of a lot better than any game on any of those systems, you are lying if you say otherwise.

I'm sorry, but I'm not one of those graphics whores who need 12x Anti-Aliasing running at 1600x1200 resolution on every game I play. The PS2 version looks very good to me. Ease of play and setup are what matter more to me than a few jagged polys. I will probably buy both PC and PS2 versions however once I update my graphics card, so I can take screenshots and have shorter loading times. Yet I still want the option of playing PSU on my 27' flat-screen while lounging on my couch.

To each their own.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Black_Heart on 2006-08-20 11:32 ]</font>

[vitius137]

I think it wasn't a problem till people started complaining about it.

[Saner]

well something had to trigger the complaints.

[Parn]

On 2006-08-20 11:24, parabolee wrote:
You know what i'm sorry I even bothered wasting my time with half of you. I spent 20 minutes writing that up because I thought you all would be interested but half of you are too sensitive to hear criticism.
In other words, you're throwing in the towel and don't want to admit that you're wrong. You blew off my point of view once again, falling back on the "you can't deal with criticism" counterpoint. Perhaps linear thought is beyond you, but we already covered this twice, dear!

Hell, kyori mentioned the lack of a Meet User function in the partner card menu while we were playing on the closed PC beta, and I know I said 'that sucks' in regards to it, since PSO had this function which was very useful when trying to meet with a friend in a quick manner. There is nothing wrong with legitimate complaints. The moment you throw "laziness" and other extra factors into it, you're no longer just critiqueing. There's a significant difference between

"Man, those graphics aren't very good."

and

"Man, those graphics aren't very good, probably because Sony makes crappy systems and doesn't have a clue."

If I read a statement similar to the second one in a review, I'd probably take everything they said with a grain of salt.

Again, if you had left "laziness" out of your post, I'd have never said a word.

[Ether]

On 2006-08-20 11:29, Saner wrote:
we really don't need reviews to begin with.

We know what we like. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif


NOT CLOSED MINDED AT ALL NOPE NUH UH

Also I would like to see someone take this character

http://www.inconsequentialexistence.com/psu/xbox1.jpg

sit him down at this table

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/755/tablesd0.jpg

and see if there are any clipping issues http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2006-08-20 12:31 ]</font>

[Axios-]

I like hearing things that are bad about the game. I'm pretty sure that everyone here is looking forward to PSU and knows that it'll be awesome. The little bad things are interesting to me in these reviews because I wouldn't have heard them otherwise. None of the bad things were a big problem, and the fact that it's been brought to such a huge argument on both sides is a little ridiculous. All in all, I'd rather hear an honest opinion rather than the sugar-coated "PSU is perfect" review that some people would like.

[Dingo]

I guess our hopes are just way up there for this game to be complaining about sitting animations and jaggies on PS2, which are in every PS2 game anyway.

[BaZ2]

Okay I just played through the demo and thought it was awesome it seems to be any PSO gamer would want plus more and with more depth to the story. I can't wait for the whole game especially in english being I played the whole demo not knowing one thing anyone saying. I wish I knew how get option though cause default camera is inverted. Looks fine to me on PS2 it supports HDTV so thats good , Xbox 360 will look the best it has to really so I will probably get it on that, also it will have extra things I bet via marketplace.

[Dingo]

PC will be able to look better than 360, mind you. But I have yet to hear any major bad points about this game.

[Axios-]

The only major bad point that I ever had on this game was alleviated through the notion of expert type. I don't see any major problems for me now though.

[BaZ2]

Actually I have one Major Problem , but I cant really say to much cause I played a demo , but the monsters were pretty much recycled with some visual updates , but their attacks the same as previous games.

[Foxix]

I am willing to bet IGN gives this game a fairly good review. Gamespot will probably knock a point or two down, they tend to nit pick and many good games come out sounding terrible because of it.

[Axios-]

Also, Gamespot seems to be just slightly more focused on graphics than IGN (or at least so it seems to me), and without PSU being a graphical marvel, I'd expect a slightly higher rating at IGN.

[ColonD]

My opinions on what I've heard: Sorted by thought up, not priority.

My 2 meseta on the teleport: I see sitting animations in other games I play all the time, and that would have been difficult to impliment. Teleporting wasn't that hard to add, and it didn't look terrible either. I think, it was the best alternitive to take.
Done, over with, gone.
Other subjects now.

0-35mph run.:
The cities and feilds are huge! (Compared to PSO) I think the fact you can bolt around quickly will help you get arround. (And avoid fans-stalkers. Which we all semi-dream of having.) Makes you feel less closed in a box, or like in the sea-bed lower levels, I got kinda claustrophobic feeling. Sure, real gamers don't run that fast, but then again, we don't need to. I think the PSU people have apt reason to.

As well, you didn't mention to much about the battle system, but it sounds quite nice from what I hear, and what I've seen. However, I don't see many Techs used, do you usually have to preform a lot, playing a force? What are your opinions people?

And, taking note of how PSO had better loot then store-bought stuff, is PSU like this? Or will you actual have to hoard money? (Like I do anyway >.>) I'd hate to have to train intensively, then sell myself as a capable mission buddy, or having to preform, '/dance' for hours as my single girl character I'd make. ><

And I assume you don't see any new clothes, so I won't ask.

So people whom played a bit, answer my prayers/questions! ^_^

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ColonD on 2006-08-20 14:09 ]</font>

[Foxix]

On 2006-08-20 13:49, Axios- wrote:
Also, Gamespot seems to be just slightly more focused on graphics than IGN (or at least so it seems to me), and without PSU being a graphical marvel, I'd expect a slightly higher rating at IGN.



Ya, that's kind of why I stopped going to gamespot. IGN's reviews tend to be longer, more in-depth, focused on a fun factor, and less nit picky. This usually helps me decide if I really want to spend money on a game.

[Dingo]

For rankings and reviews I always start at http://www.gamerankings.com and http://www.rottentomatoes.com. Too bad there aren't ANY reviews, let alone good previews, available for PSU at this time.

[vitius137]

On 2006-08-20 13:52, ColonD wrote:
My opinions on what I've heard: Sorted by thought up, not priority.

0-35mph run.:
The cities and feilds are huge! (Compared to PSO) I think the fact you can bolt around quickly will help you get arround. (And avoid fans-stalkers. Which we all semi-dream of having.) Makes you feel less closed in a box, or like in the sea-bed lower levels, I got kinda claustrophobic feeling. Sure, real gamers don't run that fast, but then again, we don't need to. I think the PSU people have apt reason to.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ColonD on 2006-08-20 14:09 ]</font>


maybe later on areas become bigger and enemies become faster >.<



On 2006-08-20 13:52, ColonD wrote:

And, taking note of how PSO had better loot then store-bought stuff, is PSU like this? Or will you actual have to hoard money? (Like I do anyway >.>) I'd hate to have to train intensively, then sell myself as a capable mission buddy, or having to preform, '/dance' for hours as my single girl character I'd make. ><

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ColonD on 2006-08-20 14:09 ]</font>


LOL, read my mind XD

[Kuzzle]

Well, I just read through all of that... I'm getting new glasses tomorrow, and I'm not currently wearing any, but my vision's not that bad...(I'm far-sighted, by the way) Well, it wasn't before I started reading all these threads, anyway. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Really, I agree with Parn on the tele-sit thing. I mean, it's not a big deal. The running thing, well, I like moving fast. Whee! ...Uh, what? Controls? Yeah, I'll adapt to them just fine.

[vitius137]

I never wear my glasses at the comp (near sighted). It would only make my vision worse. *squints*

[Dingo]

I'm nearsighted too, but only up to 10" in front of me :S. So I have to wear my fricken glasses when watching a computer monitor, and it doesn't feel like my vision is getting any better because of that http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif.

So when did this topic become about glasses again? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[Kuzzle]

I was instructed specificly to wear my glasses while one the computer, and readning, and stuff. It always used to annoy me when people assumed I was near sighted because I had glassed when I was little. My teachers would always be like "Are you sure you don't want to move to the front of the class so you can see better?" and I'd just scowl. 'Course, in my mind I was shouting "Damn you, vile wench! I will not put up with your wretched ways any longer! Guards, off with her head!" Probably wouldn't have gone over too well if I'd actually said that, though. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Uh, back on topic, though... Can anyone direct me to the video in which the emotes where the people sit/lie on the ground are displayed? It sounds fairly interesting...

(Edit: It's a focus issue, mostly. If I look at something that's too close, my eyes focus too far in, I go cross-eyed, and I get a migraine. Glasses help me keep my eyes from going all cross-eyed, and, therefore, help keep me from looking dopey.)


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kuzzle on 2006-08-20 16:45 ]</font>

[HyperShot-X-]

On 2006-08-20 12:23, Ether wrote:

Also I would like to see someone take this character

http://www.inconsequentialexistence.com/psu/xbox1.jpg

sit him down at this table

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/755/tablesd0.jpg

and see if there are any clipping issues http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2006-08-20 12:31 ]</font>


that cast's fat azz gonna eat up that tiny chair for sure, o boy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif

[vitius137]

On 2006-08-20 16:41, Kuzzle wrote:
I was instructed specificly to wear my glasses while one the computer, and readning, and stuff. It always used to annoy me when people assumed I was near sighted because I had glassed when I was little. My teachers would always be like "Are you sure you don't want to move to the front of the class so you can see better?" and I'd just scowl. 'Course, in my mind I was shouting "Damn you, vile wench! I will not put up with your wretched ways any longer! Guards, off with her head!" Probably wouldn't have gone over too well if I'd actually said that, though. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Uh, back on topic, though... Can anyone direct me to the video in which the emotes where the people sit/lie on the ground are displayed? It sounds fairly interesting...

(Edit: It's a focus issue, mostly. If I look at something that's too close, my eyes focus too far in, I go cross-eyed, and I get a migraine. Glasses help me keep my eyes from going all cross-eyed, and, therefore, help keep me from looking dopey.)


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kuzzle on 2006-08-20 16:45 ]</font>


I would also like to see the movie, I looked around a bit but found no trace of it.

Maybe Parn still has it somewhere on his harddrive.
It's not copywrited material so I'm sure Ryna won't mind if we see it again http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif ^o^

[Skye-Fox713]

how dose the camera handle?
what about the controls for psu using a key board what are they like?
which weapon manufacture do you like the best GRM, Youmei, or Tenora Works based on the apperence and stats of the weapons (for those who have played the bata and premier)?

also (if you can on the premier disk) what animations can you do offline, from my knowlage i know you can't do the emotes like dance animations and such, but can you sit down on in the story and extera mode? and you can do cut in chat and normal chat in the offline modes right.

[-Shimarisu-]

Glasses are hawt. :3