Ranger - Final Report (lots of Status Effect talk itt)

[LoneVandal]

EDIT! Thanks to the patch last week I'm flip flopping back to my original stance of "fuck Ranger, Sega hates them and they aren't very useful.".


Original Post:

Ok. Now that I'm done with my knee-jerk reaction to how crappy RA starts out, now that I've played (60 hours plus), seen, and researched enough to sift through the "my mom's friend's dog said" bullshit people like to post on these forums, it is safe to say I've got RA's "role" figured out. By this I mean what makes them unique compared to say Hunter even if a Hunter can still inflict status with a Handgun, and what your real options are until Sega releases more content / changes something.

It is all about A) the status effects (not really so much in C Rank missions though), and B) shooting the Dragon in the head with your Ice Rifle.

Status is .. interesting. It is your most useful ability while smashing up monsters, but, you won't know it until you're in B Rank or higher (which screwed with me majorly). Prior to B-A missions everyone else kills things so fast it makes you wonder why you're even there, and what the point of those cool debuffs you've got is. It becomes extremely appearent in B-A rank missions when monsters get assloads more HP and all around nastier.

First and foremost, your effects start out nasty and get nastier. Dual Handguns and Rifles start at Status Effect 2, which I'm going to abbreviate as SE# from now on while explaining why this matters.

Contrary to what some people here have posted, your SE# level on the lower right corner of bullets and FO techs is not your proc rate, it is how powerful the debuff itself is. Rifles are reported to achieve SE3 at L11, I'll confirm soon. Dual Handguns may, I'm about to confirm that as well, but SE2 is nice as it is. Freeze lasts twice as long as SE1 Freeze, the Fire damage over time does 5% monster hp a tick (read: a whole damn lot in B-A modes, more than your shots do, ESPECIALLY vs. high dfp monsters, it doesn't save them from the burn dmg), and I'm pretty sure Shock / Mute just get extended durations.

Hunters can't get SE2, period. Single Handguns start at SE1 and do not get SE2 until L11 Bullet level. As you can imagine, SE4 is probably very nasty and once we can get L21 bullets I would not be surprised if at least Rifle gets to inflict SE4 debuffs (possibly including a 10% per tick Burn damage over time, if the pattern stays like what I'm seeing).

Yes, FO can hit things with debuffs, but, they can't do it as fast / often. From what I've seen duo'ing with a FO for 20+ hours, they proc at about the same rate as RA. However, they spend about 4x as much time per attack, so effectively RA can debuff 4x as many enemies in the same amount of time, especially with Dual Handguns.

I'm not going to spend too much time explaining Mech Guns because they are horrible weapons all around (so far, as are Shotguns), which only inflict SE1 and according to PSUpedia never graduate to SE2 even past L11 Bullets. While I'm talking up weapon types, single Handguns are actually extremely good if you get them SE2 and your Knife PA to 10 as well, at L11 their elemental damage changes from 5% to 13% and you will notice the 8% damage boost when using proper elements. It is also a nice setup to keep on hand because the centaur-ish assholes in Shikon and Mizuraki are extremely resistant to bullets, but not to melee or techs. Yup.. just bullets.. bastards. Not that it matters if you can whip out a 600-800 dmg L10 Dagger PA once or twice. So yeah.. Handgun + Knife = good.

On to Ranger unique strength #2:

Bosses. While the Hunters get smacked around constantly and have to waste their time (and the FO's time healing them) avoiding getting one-shot by random Boss X, you're doing consistant (nearly non-stop) damage. Sure you have to pay more probably, but you may end up top DPS on a boss fight just because you almost never have to let up.

I said Ice Bullets on the Dragon in the example above, because this is one of those times where if you really learn the game and pay attention you can shine. The Dragon is Fire and his lowest dfp point is his head. Not the neck, as I see many people settle for because it is a larger target, but the head. You'll do roughly 10% more dmg per shot if you can learn to target specific areas on bosses and around another 10% more if you hammer them hard with the right elemental counter. It only adds maybe 5-10 dmg a shot, but you're going to shoot a rifle about 100 times or more in a boss fight, so it adds up over time.

These low dfp locations so far are:

Head on the dragon
Wings on the gargoyle boss (you can temporarily destroy them even)
Center "body" on the giant robot (it looks like a person kind of, also I'd like to do more research on this boss)

In each example they are extremely hard to target without using first person mode and shooting at from Rifle range, lest you waste time having to move and set up constantly to avoid getting killed because you were too close to the boss.

On a closing note, from what I've seen SUV attacks aren't that cool and we're probably better off taking the +PP regen Extra unit when it becomes available Online. It was a combination of talking to and playing with FOs like Luceid and Cross, talking to wata, and spending time in some JP B rank missions that has helped me come to these conclusions. Next time someone asks you what RA is good for, point them here.

Edit: For those of you who want to be "cool kids" like Dios, come to irc.lunarnet.org #rpgfan

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: LoneVandal on 2006-09-20 15:38 ]</font>


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: LoneVandal on 2006-09-23 22:44 ]</font>

[Saner]

so you're saying RA is good. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

[Itsuki]

I for one really like the status effect ability of mechguns and think it works well with paralysis and silence. It definately sucks with ice and fire, but in situations where you want a status effect ability to proc fast and often, its good. I actually find it ideal for melee range situations, if I want something to last and go for a long period of time I'll switch to dual handguns. I think mechs are ranger only for a reason.

The main problem with shots right now is that a) You can only get PA's to 20, and b) You can't get powerful ones or grind them online yet. Grinding them being the big issue. Most people may not think grinding is all that big of an issue, but its a substantial increase in damage. With 3 star rifles, grinding them up can bring them from 60-70 a shot up to 120-130 a shot (what I currently deal with +7s).

And yes, bosses are where rangers shine. Specifically on Onma and Dragon right now. Not only because we can hit the weakpoints, but because we hardly need to even move. Most dragon fights involve me circling to the dragon's side, slightly outside of the dragon's maximum range, and just pointing it at the dragon's head/neck/wings and shooting. You don't necessarily always want to hit the head. If the head is moving around to much, or in a bad position, you're better off taking a reliable hit at the neck, rather than taking a miss. And sometimes dragon puts you behind him. Running to the side so you can hit the head is a waste of valuable shooting time, dragon's wings take the same damage as his neck and are huge targets even from behind (assuming you can shoot past the tail). You only end up having to move a few steps the entire battle, and thats if you know you're going to get hit. Hell, sometimes I don't even move unless its the flames, because I'm probably going to dodge it and if I don't, it won't kill me. I haven't had too much experience with dragon B yet as RA since I'm still rather low for dragon B, but I did 2 runs against him yesterday at level 19, and dodged 3 out of 4 of his attacks that hit me. Thats pretty nasty. (Keep in mind level 15 is the absolute minimum for fighting him and many people fight him till almost level 30)

[AngelLight]

This is no shock....I figured all along that RAs would be good for the non typical roles...such as CC and debuffing. Sounds like they went the route of Mesmers on GW (with long range of course). Least popular class, but you'd be stupid not to have one type thing.

I think what you may not be realizing is that shots can affect more then one target....so the logic is, its weaker debuffs but you infect more targets.....so I'm not so sure if shots are useless or not. As for Machine Guns....that's really sad actually....I was looking forward to using one....are you sure there's not maybe use for it elsewhere (example, for rapid burst dmg after a melee strike.....perhaps to interrupt a target?).

[tyler2zelda]

*confused* WTF did I just read? >_<

[AngelLight]

The future of rangers everywhere http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[tyler2zelda]

Works for me.

[vg_geek86]

o_O;;

Not enirely sure what I just read, sounds like this game has ALOT more to it then PSO *Which is a damn good thing* But it will all come to me when I start playing.

[Itsuki]

Ahh, thought of a good way to explain the mechgun vs handgun arguement.

The basic idea would be: Would you rather have 2 monsters paralyzed or 1 monster paralyzed for 2x as long? Thats the difference between mechguns and handguns.

[Kaply]

There are some additional oddities that conflict with the ranger's role as described in the OP.

Status effects seem to only be in effect if they don't conflict, or maybe only one prevailing status can be in effect? Not sure which it is. For instance, I have never seen a flaming frozen enemy. Nor have I seen a silent(earth) shocked(thunder) enemy. I believe I have seen a shocked frozen enemy though.

As for frozen, it feels like frozen can be broken with melee.

Burn damage can do a lot of damage, but bosses are immune to damage (mini bosses as well, svaltus?). They also take a long time to tick.

Dual handguns, from my experience against the dragon work as well as rifles if it's aimed at the neck or the even better the head when it's lowered. It may end up depending on your bullets/weapon quality as to which can push out more damage.

One other thing about rangers is that because of their speed and range in attacking, they can in essense "taunt" enemies away from other players. This can serve a few purposes. You can herd enemies so that other players can use multi target attacks easier. You can extend/delay an enemy's attack because they have to run to you to attack in most cases.

Psupedia's data is from beta, some of the raw data hasn't been updated to online stats.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kaply on 2006-09-20 09:02 ]</font>

[Zarbolord]

I'm gonna play my first character as a FO/RA... So debuffs are my speciality? I like that!
Ice Dual Handguns was in my plans since the start. Sounds like I've hit the target http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Jozon]

pfft...........beast still own bosses hard, nanoblast ftw! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[Tycho]

Thank you. I had been wondering which of the two possible effects these 'SE levels' had.

[HUnewearl_Meira]

Well LoneVandal, I think you've just decided the first character I'm going to make.

[Cry0]

This is exactly why i like ra.

Their hidden depths. They may seem 'useless' at first glance (and i use that term loosely). But if you know more about the game, you become a lot more powerful. I for one will take absolute benefit from status effects.

[Wubbie]

So basically what you're attempting to say is that you've finally figured out what a good chunk of us were telling you? You're not ment for DPS, you're like the special team in football... In order to save "Stamina" you simply sit out. (An analogy to using daggers to guns 24/7)

Glad to hear you got it... I'm heading back to the fire you want me to burn in.

[Tetsuro]

This is good to hear, esspecially from Vandal. I'm actually starting to think I might make a ranger rather than a hunter once the game comes out.

[Polly]

So in summation: Everything everyone else told me about Rangers in my other threads was right to begin with, but now I'm gonna say it was all my idea.

[Ether]

On 2006-09-20 12:03, Wubbie wrote:
So basically what you're attempting to say is that you've finally figured out what a good chunk of us were telling you? You're not ment for DPS, you're like the special team in football... In order to save "Stamina" you simply sit out. (An analogy to using daggers to guns 24/7)


Exactly what I thought

Rangers being good on bosses: Cross said it first
Using single dagger on the big guys in Shikon: Watashiwa did it in his video
Ranger being a status effect class: EVERYONE said it first

[Authenticate]

Yes, it's a big conspiracy! No one can ever have doubts and then change his mind! That's just unpossible! He's obviously trying to steal a nuclear weapon, and is using this Ranger discussion to distract us. Too bad I saw right through his ruse. I'm on to you, buddy.

Edit:
On a more serious note, has anyone found out what Virus/Infection does? Ya know, the status that procs off Dark element stuff?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Authenticate on 2006-09-20 13:01 ]</font>

[Valkayree]

Congratulations, Vandal, I don't have the game, and you supported all the arguments I made in the first post where you complained about ranger. Ranger contributes with status effect debuffs, and first person targeting is very important. Very good post, it supports my decision to start as a ranger 100%, and is a fine example of good research.

[Niki]

Well, thanks to Vandal, the make-up of the US servers will now be 70% Rangers. Guess I won't be playing one after all. ;p

Go, Cast Force!



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Niki on 2006-09-20 13:58 ]</font>

[Blackwaltz-R]

It was still lame to make the complaints started in previous threads though since this is a natural process. Can't get somehting to work? then the problem has to be with you and not with the game itself, All games have some sort obstacle they have to overcome with the game mechanics otherwise it wouldn't be a game.

[LoneVandal]

Yeah cause Wubbie, Triela, Ether, and Authenticate definitely did the research on status effects and told me all about the details, like what exactly Fire does. Wait, no they didn't. I sure as heck didn't espouse trying Handgun + Melee before seeing Wata's video, nope, not me. Not even in my multi-paragraph post about using Handguns + Sabers even, didn't ever suggest that before seeing anything wata did.

Also yeah I totally am taking all the credit for all of this, which is why I gave mention of Cross, wata, and Luceid. It is a conspiracy how I did that, you see, by mentioning them I made it seem like this was 100% me to people who don't know how to read entire posts.

Get bent, all of you, I knew you'd come in here acting like you'd done me some kind of "service" by telling me "lol learn2play" in the other threads. How about posting something useful for once, like stats or figures of your own research?

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 08:55, Itsuki-chan wrote:
Ahh, thought of a good way to explain the mechgun vs handgun arguement.

The basic idea would be: Would you rather have 2 monsters paralyzed or 1 monster paralyzed for 2x as long? Thats the difference between mechguns and handguns.



It is also a matter of, would you like to run out of PP in the first room / not do hardly any damage at all while adding those status effects? If so, gogogo Machine Gun.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 14:12, Blackwaltz-R wrote:
It was still lame to make the complaints started in previous threads though since this is a natural process. Can't get somehting to work? then the problem has to be with you and not with the game itself, All games have some sort obstacle they have to overcome with the game mechanics otherwise it wouldn't be a game.



Actually the complaints in the first thread were more based around how useless / expensive we are in C Rank games, which holds true for the most part because your status effect thing never has time to work / doesn't work on bosses / bosses don't have enough HP for your constant DPS to factor in too much.

[Blackwaltz-R]

Get bent, all of you, I knew you'd come in here acting like you'd done me some kind of "service" by telling me "lol learn2play" in the other threads. How about posting something useful for once, like stats or figures of your own research?



LOL thats what you get for starting inane rants that only apply yo YOUR personal hang-ups. You fail to realize that your threads translated to "ZOMG I PHAIL SO HARD THIS GAME IS TEH LAME". Your problem was that you were playing the game from a counter-intuitive mindset which could only be fixed by a revelation. Plus it doesn't help that you are playing the game in JAPNEEZ.

[Authenticate]

Hey, I gave you that man-ho advice remember? I never said anything about elements and status effects (other than my question obviously). Get your facts straight, VandASS. u c wut i did tere?

You don't have to call me stupid, I already know I am.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 08:56, Kaply wrote:
There are some additional oddities that conflict with the ranger's role as described in the OP.


I didn't see you name any though, so uh.. ok



Status effects seem to only be in effect if they don't conflict, or maybe only one prevailing status can be in effect? Not sure which it is. For instance, I have never seen a flaming frozen enemy. Nor have I seen a silent(earth) shocked(thunder) enemy. I believe I have seen a shocked frozen enemy though.

As for frozen, it feels like frozen can be broken with melee.

Burn damage can do a lot of damage, but bosses are immune to damage (mini bosses as well, svaltus?). They also take a long time to tick.


Yes, you can't inflict opposing status, yes you can stack non conflicting. One is usually enough so it doesn't really matter that much. It would also require you swapping weapons while fighting the same mob to inflict 2 at once. Not sure any mob lives long enough even in B rank to make 2 debuffs matter.

Yes damage in general can break Freeze, but it seems higher ranks get harder to break in addition to lasting longer when not being targetted.

Minibosses that I've seen so far are not immune to any status effects (but I'm not sure I've tried all 4 on all of them, I do know Ice and Fire work). This includes the Linear Line, Relics, and Shikon minis.



Dual handguns, from my experience against the dragon work as well as rifles if it's aimed at the neck or the even better the head when it's lowered. It may end up depending on your bullets/weapon quality as to which can push out more damage.

Right, but you give up a lot of range, and thus spend more time chasing the target.

[LoneVandal]

LOL thats what you get for starting inane rants that only apply yo YOUR personal hang-ups. You fail to realize that your threads translated to "ZOMG I PHAIL SO HARD THIS GAME IS TEH LAME". Your problem was that you were playing the game from a counter-intuitive mindset which could only be fixed by a revelation. Plus it doesn't help that you are playing the game in JAPNEEZ.



Actually my problem was that the class I was dead set on playing seemed to bring nothing to the table when partying with FO and HU in C Rank missions, and that is mainly because it doesn't really until monsters have enough HP to make debuffs / sustained damage matter.

[Kyuu]

While I'd have to agree that there's a lot that is pretty reminiscent of things that people were trying to tell you in your other threads, I still say it's a good read. Despite my protestations, I have to admit I was starting to think twice about my RAnewearl, but seeing it laid out like that has rekindled my hope that I'll enjoy her enough to keep her as my main character.

And LoneVandal is right, let's not make this into a "I TOLDZ U S0!!1" thread.

[DiosGX]

Currently I have a level 87 Ethan playing as a hunter, and my extra mode level 37 Cast playing as Ranger. Doing this to get a scope of job potential before the US version hits.

In regards to shotguns being "useless", you're going to want to grind it for a larger ATP, and you'll also want to be higher level to use it effectively. If you want an example, my handguns can pop off 80-100 per shot, whereas my shotguns will do about 40-60. When you consider however, I am hitting 4 enemies at once thanks to the bonus spread shot, that totals out to 160-240 per shot technically.

While my shotgun can now have quite a blast radius, its SE is still level 1. You must however consider, you're hitting 4 targets per shot, so having its SE level higher than that would actually be kind of broken. You're doing 4X the proc chance per shot as opposed to handgun's 1. I am quite liking my Lightning Shotgun (Shockgun, lawl witty) right now. Shotguns were never good singular damage in PSO, in fact even at level 150 RAcast my Final Impact (so sexy) did not do over 250 per shot without shifta. But when you're nailing 5 enemies for 250 per shot, that's a lot of damage being shoved out the door.

As for SMGs, try using Earth bullets and focus on a single tech using enemy who is a threat. You'll see a lot of these late in the game's areas. Five-hundred damage Foie to a level 80? Yeah, silence that please. I personally find SMGs to be a great way to shove procs out quickly. I use a dagger with SMGs myself, as I find them to be most suited for my play style.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 14:45, Kyuu wrote:
While I'd have to agree that there's a lot that is pretty reminiscent of things that people were trying to tell you in your other threads, I still say it's a good read. Despite my protestations, I have to admit I was starting to think twice about my RAnewearl, but seeing it laid out like that has rekindled my hope that I'll enjoy her enough to keep her as my main character.

And LoneVandal is right, let's not make this into a "I TOLDZ U S0!!1" thread.



Yeah and something else no one bothered telling me in the old threads that would have shut me up faster:

RA regen PP around 50% faster than FO. FO still take a lot longer to run themselves out because of their animations, but at least we do get a bonus in that respect that makes the 1:4 RA dmg per PP:FO dmg per PP ratio comparison seem a little less harsh.

[Wubbie]

I explained those things BEFORE wata posted in his video, Vandal... We asked you why and HOW you were going without fire, multiple times... You stated that it doesn't help the party...

Please, shut your mouth and suck it up... You were wrong, admit to it, tough guy.

[Sev]

On 2006-09-20 14:54, Wubbie wrote:
I explained those things BEFORE wata posted in his video, Vandal... We asked you why and HOW you were going without fire, multiple times... You stated that it doesn't help the party...

Please, shut your mouth and suck it up... You were wrong, admit to it, tough guy.



Does being correct on a forum really mean that much to you?

Seriously... Everyone should just drop it already. No matter what you tell someone, they need to witness it for themselves to see whether or not they like it's playstyle. And once again...

He's mentioning that C Rank sucks. He still stands by that fact... And I wouldn't doubt it because if the mobs are getting mowed down faster, what the hell does a Status Effect really matter at times?

Please... Just give it up... Turn your flame off.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 14:49, DiosGX wrote:
Currently I have a level 87 Ethan playing as a hunter, and my extra mode level 37 Cast playing as Ranger. Doing this to get a scope of job potential before the US version hits.

In regards to shotguns being "useless", you're going to want to grind it for a larger ATP, and you'll also want to be higher level to use it effectively. If you want an example, my handguns can pop off 80-100 per shot, whereas my shotguns will do about 40-60. When you consider however, I am hitting 4 enemies at once thanks to the bonus spread shot, that totals out to 160-240 per shot technically.

As for SMGs, try using Earth bullets and focus on a single tech using enemy who is a threat. You'll see a lot of these late in the game's areas. Five-hundred damage Foie to a level 80? Yeah, silence that please. I personally find SMGs to be a great way to shove procs out quickly. I use a dagger with SMGs myself, as I find them to be most suited for my play style.



We can't get higher than 3* shotguns, we also can't grind them. It fucking sucks not having access to Mota. I've said it many times, don't bother comparing offline to online.

[A2K]

What is this? "Stuff everyone else already knew last week" day? Har har har. Next thing you know, you'll be telling us that monomates heal HP! Oh boy, I can't wait for that! You say this Sniper does less damage than my Yasminkov 9000? Unpossible! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

I can see it now, an twenty page thread entitled, "Like Mates in PSO? Not here" where you spend PARAGRAPH AFTER SCATHING PARAGRAPH detailing how screwed up cost/HP ratio was and it just wasn't "worth it" or "fun".

Not that, tee hee http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/mayo.gif, it even matters because a little imbalance is at least not something broken liek http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/donut.gif BSOD or voice chat. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/hotdog.gif http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/cake.gif http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/burger.gif

Oh dearie me, I'm just so completely overwhelmed by all these earth-shattering revelations you've made! Someone go out and alert the world of your findings via the Internets. All of them.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_bondage.gif

Haha, hmm, hooouu... http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

In all seriousness, I was actually quite recently witness to this power when I joined a game with a two or three relatively Japanese RAs all armed with different rifles in Raphon Relics. I swear that during the entire run they kept the game locked down. Everything was frozen and shocked. Made the whole run a cinch, really.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 14:54, Wubbie wrote:
I explained those things BEFORE wata posted in his video, Vandal... We asked you why and HOW you were going without fire, multiple times... You stated that it doesn't help the party...


Rather be perceived as an "internet tough guy lol" than whatever you think you are. None of you ever talked about B Rank or the mechanics of Fire, there were no examples of how Fire could do 90 dmg a tick even in C Rank against 2 specific enemies who have assloads of hp (by C Rank standards). Maybe if you tried posting information instead of your opinion people would be more willing to listen to you.

[DiosGX]

On 2006-09-20 15:02, A2K wrote:
Oh dearie me, I'm just so completely overwhelmed by all these earth-shattering revelations you've made! Someone go out and alert the world of your findings via the Internets. All of them.


Somebody has something to prove on the internet, eh?

Look, your Sixth Grade schoolboy crush on Vandal is incredibly obvious now, but he's my sex slave, so back off.

Also I must wonder, if his posts are so full of blatantly obvious facts, why are so many people now saying they're taking a shine to ranger?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DiosGX on 2006-09-20 15:07 ]</font>

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 15:02, A2K wrote:
A lot of dumb crap as usual in my topics


If everyone knew Fire did 5% a tick at SE2, someone should have posted that information along with "lol fire does damage newb". No one bothered finding out useful information like that though, it was easier to act like a jackass.

[A2K]

On 2006-09-20 15:06, DiosGX wrote:
Somebody has something to prove on the internet, eh?

Look, your Sixth Grade schoolboy crush on Vandal is incredibly obvious now, but he's my sex slave, so back off.


No! I will kill you then liberate the crap out of him and then he will be mine. Believe it!

[Ether]

On 2006-09-20 15:07, LoneVandal wrote:
it was easier to act like a jackass.


On 2006-09-16 14:35, LoneVandal wrote:
You're so full of yourself it astounds me. Go die in a fire.

[DiosGX]

You have to be willing to accept his voracious Cast-styled prosthetic genitalia.

[Sev]

What's the burning that I smell?

Does anyone else smell burning?

Does it ever end? Hold on... Dumb question... No it doesn't. Because there seems to be nothing better to do in spare time then this.

As long as it's all in good fun guys.



On 2006-09-20 15:10, DiosGX wrote:
You have to be willing to accept his voracious Cast-styled prosthetic genitalia.



*Blink*

Wow.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sev on 2006-09-20 15:13 ]</font>

[CpwninOBrien]

lol rape artist wtf lol

[LoneVandal]

Ether, you're right, you in particular spent more effort acting like a jackass than most people would have spent being useful. Thanks for correcting me.

[A2K]

On 2006-09-20 15:07, LoneVandal wrote:


On 2006-09-20 15:02, A2K wrote:
A lot of dumb crap as usual in my topics


If everyone knew Fire did 5% a tick at SE2, someone should have posted that information along with "lol fire does damage newb". No one bothered finding out useful information like that though, it was easier to act like a jackass.


What are you, dense? I'm not explicitly averse to doing research, the main problem is that IT COSTS ME FIVE TIMES AS MUCH TIME AS IT WOULD AS A HUNTER.

[Wubbie]

On 2006-09-20 14:57, Sev wrote:


On 2006-09-20 14:54, Wubbie wrote:
I explained those things BEFORE wata posted in his video, Vandal... We asked you why and HOW you were going without fire, multiple times... You stated that it doesn't help the party...

Please, shut your mouth and suck it up... You were wrong, admit to it, tough guy.



Does being correct on a forum really mean that much to you?

Seriously... Everyone should just drop it already. No matter what you tell someone, they need to witness it for themselves to see whether or not they like it's playstyle. And once again...

He's mentioning that C Rank sucks. He still stands by that fact... And I wouldn't doubt it because if the mobs are getting mowed down faster, what the hell does a Status Effect really matter at times?

Please... Just give it up... Turn your flame off.



I'm not attempting to be CORRECT, I'm attempting to show moral value... I'm sorry but I don't enjoy when people take advantage of myself or other people, you can cower and turtle all you want, but it's not my style... I do not condone "plagerism" or other forms of not showing an author or philosphers credit and many members on the board are caught in the act of Vandal not respecting them.

[PJ]

I'm sure it was

Is everyone on JP PSU a jerk? Seriously

[LoneVandal]

Wow, and what exactly have you or anyone else ever contributed to one of my threads for me to plagaurize? I think the most useful thing you ever did was post a link to someone else playing. Besides that you just flame baited me.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 15:18, PJ wrote:
I'm sure it was

Is everyone on JP PSU a jerk? Seriously



Well, no, unless you say something bad about PSU. Then you better watch out cause the posse is coming for you, ready to post inane bullshit in your topics.

[DiosGX]

On 2006-09-20 14:58, LoneVandal wrote:
I've said it many times, don't bother comparing offline to online.



The comparison would fit if you had access to Moatoob to grind them, so it is much less comparing on and offline, as opposed to you not having the ability to do something online. The planet is there, the grinding is there, just inaccessible for now.

[Sev]

On 2006-09-20 15:16, Wubbie wrote:


On 2006-09-20 14:57, Sev wrote:


On 2006-09-20 14:54, Wubbie wrote:
I explained those things BEFORE wata posted in his video, Vandal... We asked you why and HOW you were going without fire, multiple times... You stated that it doesn't help the party...

Please, shut your mouth and suck it up... You were wrong, admit to it, tough guy.



Does being correct on a forum really mean that much to you?

Seriously... Everyone should just drop it already. No matter what you tell someone, they need to witness it for themselves to see whether or not they like it's playstyle. And once again...

He's mentioning that C Rank sucks. He still stands by that fact... And I wouldn't doubt it because if the mobs are getting mowed down faster, what the hell does a Status Effect really matter at times?

Please... Just give it up... Turn your flame off.



I'm not attempting to be CORRECT, I'm attempting to show moral value... I'm sorry but I don't enjoy when people take advantage of myself or other people, you can cower and turtle all you want, but it's not my style... I do not condone "plagerism" or other forms of not showing an author or philosphers credit and many members on the board are caught in the act of Vandal not respecting them.



Plagurism?

Philosphers?

You're attempting something... But it sure as hell ain't showin moral value. No one is taking advantage of you... You put information on a forum... And really... I don't think it was YOU in particulair. If someone uses that information to come up with their own ideas it's not anything like Plagurism... And he did thank the people that helped him understand.

He doesn't need to thank you. You didn't do anything in the first place.

[LoneVandal]

The comparison would fit if you had access to Moatoob to grind them, so it is much less comparing on and offline, as opposed to you not having the ability to do something online. The planet is there, the grinding is there, just inaccessible for now.



Sorry Dios, but I must correct misinformation wherever it appears. Even coming from your sexy robotic mouth.

The comparison doesn't work because:

A) I'm pretty sure Shotguns actually do get SE2 online. They just have ass for accuracy / damage / PP because you can't get higher than 3* and can't grind them yet.

B) Offline mode Ethan gets 10% less ATP as an RA than as a HU, online mode RA get closer to 30% less ATP than a HU depending on race, etc.. Your damage won't match up with Ethan swapping between HU and RA by any measure.

[DiosGX]

I don't play ranger on Ethan, I'm using a RAcast in extra mode.

[Itsuki]

On 2006-09-20 15:20, DiosGX wrote:


On 2006-09-20 14:58, LoneVandal wrote:
I've said it many times, don't bother comparing offline to online.



The comparison would fit if you had access to Moatoob to grind them, so it is much less comparing on and offline, as opposed to you not having the ability to do something online. The planet is there, the grinding is there, just inaccessible for now.



Actually this is where you're quite wrong, for many reasons. Offline mode rangers have more ATP and far far more ATA (completely broken amounts of ATP and ATA). Infact, they practically have the same ATP as hunters. More ATP == better with low ATP weapons lik emechguns and shotguns. Even with the ability to grind, shotgun damage would be abysmal.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 15:33, DiosGX wrote:
I don't play ranger on Ethan, I'm using a RAcast in extra mode.



Oh snap, got me. Still, I don't know how extra mode compares tbqh. I know the stats don't match.

Editz: For those of you who want to be "cool kids" like Dios, come to irc.lunarnet.org #rpgfan

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: LoneVandal on 2006-09-20 15:39 ]</font>

[Chaobo99]

I think a RA is good.

[vitius137]

This has convinced me to be Ranger, even though that was what I was origionally gonna be. I kinda got confused and had no idea which class to choose but now Ranger seems perfect for me. Thanks for your in-depth review http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[DiosGX]

On 2006-09-20 15:35, Itsuki-chan wrote:
Actually this is where you're quite wrong, for many reasons. Offline mode rangers have more ATP and far far more ATA (completely broken amounts of ATP and ATA). Infact, they practically have the same ATP as hunters. More ATP == better with low ATP weapons lik emechguns and shotguns. Even with the ability to grind, shotgun damage would be abysmal.



I'm not saying you'll do "good" damage, I'm saying you'll spread out the proc. If you get point blank on an enemy, you have 4 shots (I do right now anyway) hitting all at once.

I also find it hilarious people think offline mode giving you good stats makes it "easy" mode. You have people in your party but they do paltry damage. You're pretty much soloing the entire game, so of course it gives you better stats or you'll never kill anything.

[TwilightSea]

Ah alright, I believe I get each role, but if I'm wrong someone please correct me. So it's like this.
HU = Tank/DD
RA = Debuffer/DPS (varies)
FO = Healer/Nukers

Did I get that right? If so, I've always been a fan of debuffing. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Kaply]

someone posted that shotguns can go up to 5 hits online at level 11+. Granted at this stage with only low ranking/starred shotguns available it's not that much damage, but they potentially can get up to 6 with L21+ bullet. Also I believe shotguns start off at SE2. My recollection is that all two handed weapons have SE2. I'll check that later though. I hadn't really used the shotgun class that much right now because... well beast and low accuracy plus low weapon stats = not much hits at all.

[Itsuki]

On 2006-09-20 15:52, DiosGX wrote:
I also find it hilarious people think offline mode giving you good stats makes it "easy" mode. You have people in your party but they do paltry damage. You're pretty much soloing the entire game, so of course it gives you better stats or you'll never kill anything.



I never said it was "easy" mode. But what you're saying is exactly my point. The difference in stats makes it so you can't compare the performance of the gun as you are doing (you supplied numbers). And you can compare the usefulness of the gun because you don't have party members. You can't even compare the accuracy of the gun (I'm pretty sure shotguns have low ATA too) because rangers have overly high ATA offline and monsters offline have different stats.

As for LoneVandal responding to my mechgun comment, if used properly, you shouldn't waste the pp in one room. Short bursts, even though it says 5pp per shot, thats not for 1 bullet. Spray like 10 or 15 bullet "bursts".

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 16:04, Kaply wrote:
someone posted that shotguns can go up to 5 hits online at level 11+.


Starts at 3, gets 4 at L11, 5 hits is only possible at L21+ which we cannot get right now.

[Kaply]

On 2006-09-20 16:13, LoneVandal wrote:


On 2006-09-20 16:04, Kaply wrote:
someone posted that shotguns can go up to 5 hits online at level 11+.


Starts at 3, gets 4 at L11, 5 hits is only possible at L21+ which we cannot get right now.



Ok, clarifying a bit, I can get four numbers to pop up with shotguns at bullet level 1, you'll only see 3 bullets fly out visually (center stream has two bullets in it).

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 16:10, Itsuki-chan wrote:

As for LoneVandal responding to my mechgun comment, if used properly, you shouldn't waste the pp in one room. Short bursts, even though it says 5pp per shot, thats not for 1 bullet. Spray like 10 or 15 bullet "bursts".



If all you're doing is proc'ing debuffs then Dual Handguns do a much better job (being SE2 from Bullet L1 and having a high rate of proc), and they can do a fair bit of damage.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 15:53, TwilightSea wrote:
Ah alright, I believe I get each role, but if I'm wrong someone please correct me. So it's like this.
HU = Tank/DD
RA = Debuffer/DPS (varies)
FO = Healer/Nukers

Did I get that right? If so, I've always been a fan of debuffing. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



Sort of. We're all damage classes, RA cause Status Effects, FO actually have real atk/dfp debuffs like in PSO (Zelland / Jellen, I forget how you spell them). There is no "tank" in PSO or PSU because the monsters will kill anyone who stands around getting hit very quickly in the later difficulties. Hunter has the highest damage potential, you just need to learn enemy patterns and avoid getting killed as much as possible.

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-20 16:21, Kaply wrote:

Ok, clarifying a bit, I can get four numbers to pop up with shotguns at bullet level 1, you'll only see 3 bullets fly out visually (center stream has two bullets in it).



HOLY CHRIST! Someone actually posted (possibly) real information in one of my threads besides Wata or Cross. I'm pretty sure I only get 3 numbers to pop up, but I didn't spend more than one mission with a Shotgun before deciding it was not feasible in Online mode right now due to our limited access to higher quality models / grinding.

[DiosGX]

On 2006-09-20 16:10, Itsuki-chan wrote:
The difference in stats makes it so you can't compare the performance of the gun as you are doing (you supplied numbers). And you can compare the usefulness of the gun because you don't have party members. You can't even compare the accuracy of the gun (I'm pretty sure shotguns have low ATA too) because rangers have overly high ATA offline and monsters offline have different stats.


What would you rather I write, "My handgun does X+30 damage whereas my Shotgun does X+13 damage, but shoots 3 times resulting in higher damage"?

Come on man, cut me some slack, you got my point.

[mechatra]

On 2006-09-20 16:29, LoneVandal wrote:
HOLY CHRIST! Someone actually posted (possibly) real information in one of my threads besides Wata or Cross. I'm pretty sure I only get 3 numbers to pop up, but I didn't spend more than one mission with a Shotgun before deciding it was not feasible in Online mode right now due to our limited access to higher quality models / grinding.



I'm also pretty sure that the centre shot from the first 3 bullets of the basic shotgn shot actually contain two hits, I still think it needs a quick confirm but IIRC that's the way it is.

[DiosGX]

I've never seen more than 1 number off any single bullet from a shotgun. You sure part of your blast didn't just hit a target twice?

[LoneVandal]

Whew, so if anyone has more questions about RA you can fire away. There is some confusion over Shock status effect, at least, people have told me what it does incorrectly more than a few times now.

What Shock does is stop all physical attacks ;o
The exact opposite of Earth's Mute or Silence or whatever you want to call it. Hence you can't have this and Earth debuffs on the same mob, just like you can't have Ice and Fire on one mob. They over-ride each other. Not that it matters all that much since MOST mobs are only good at one or the other, many not having techs period.

[Itsuki]

Actually, even thats a little bit incorrect. Some physical attacks that monsters do are considered skills, and thus can be done through shock/paralysis.

I can't really think of too many off the top of my head... the only thing that comes to mind is worms, that move they do when close where they kind spin their head across the floor? They can still do that. Of course, with that said, theres absolutely no reason you'd silence a worm.

[LoneVandal]

Well.. they CAN cast Foie.

[Ether]

And Jellen!

[LoneVandal]

Jellen seems to be an autodebuff attached to their normal attacks, so I'm not sure it counts as a tech. Kind of like Ranger guns auto-debuffing.

[Zarbolord]

I think that maybe freezing would be the best option then. Stops everything for a while: physical/magical attacks AND movement.

[Blueblur]

Good thread so far.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

On 2006-09-20 15:53, TwilightSea wrote:
Ah alright, I believe I get each role, but if I'm wrong someone please correct me. So it's like this.
HU = Tank/DD
RA = Debuffer/DPS (varies)
FO = Healer/Nukers

Did I get that right? If so, I've always been a fan of debuffing. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



what with the "tank" stuff, you think us hunters are all big, hulking brutes or something?

[TwilightSea]

Tank is a generic MMO term where one player holds the mob in check while everyone else beats the crap out of it.

[Valkayree]

On 2006-09-20 14:15, LoneVandal wrote:

Get bent, all of you,



See if I ever compliment you again for doing good research. By the way, Dick Cheney called for you and he asked me to tell you that he wants his first name back.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Valkayree on 2006-09-21 08:51 ]</font>

[zofia]

:: sifts through the data and the opinions ::

:: bathes in the shower of pure angst ::

ahhhhhhhhhhhhh... that' GOOD! Genki desu!

[Itsuki]

On 2006-09-21 04:06, Zarbolord wrote:
I think that maybe freezing would be the best option then. Stops everything for a while: physical/magical attacks AND movement.

Freezing is one of the best choices, but not for all situations. The leading problem with freezing is that if people attack it, it breaks. Also, it prevents you from doing fire. Against big things that theres only 1-2 of, I find that its often times as useful if not more useful to paralyze / silence and put fire on them. Or just put fire on them.




On 2006-09-21 02:08, LoneVandal wrote:
Well.. they CAN cast Foie.


Sorry, I said silence instead of parlysis. I meant to say theres no reason you'd paralyze a worm, since its main attack is Foie, and it can still do its physical attacks while paralyzed. As for the jellen, it appears to actually be attached to their movement, not their attacks. I'd have to do some more experimenting, but I'm pretty sure both silenced and paralyzed, if they come out of the ground near you, you still get Jellen-ed.

Also, today in relics I noticed the little lizards, when paralyzed, can still do their dash. Though they rarely do their dash either way.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Itsuki-chan on 2006-09-21 09:38 ]</font>

[foamcup]

By the way, Dick Cheney called for you and he asked me to tell you that he wants his first name back.



[ This Message was edited by: Valkayree on 2006-09-21 08:51 ]


I'm sorry, but I just have to say this: That was pathetic. Was that supposed to be funny? Seriously. What makes it even more sad is that you edited that in.

[Axel3792]

yay hopefully this info will make for less HuFo combos http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Authenticate]

This is forum is looking more like the WoW one every day. Drama ahoy!

Edit:
The bullets of the shotgun make act like an arrow from a (photon)bow. If monsters are close enough, a single bullet may hit 2 of them at the same time. Either that, or it's basically a cone and if spaced properly will hit everything in range that is in LoS (as in it's not blocked by another monster).

If this has been gone over before just ignore this. Domo arigato, Mr. Roboto.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Authenticate on 2006-09-21 10:14 ]</font>

[chibiLegolas]

On 2006-09-20 23:41, LoneVandal wrote:
What Shock does is stop all physical attacks ;o
The exact opposite of Earth's Mute or Silence or whatever you want to call it. Hence you can't have this and Earth debuffs on the same mob, just like you can't have Ice and Fire on one mob. They over-ride each other.


Cool. So they can cancel each other on enemies. So my question is:
Does this also apply for player status effects? I can see situations where the party doesn't have easy access to anti (or the PSU equivelant) and the party's ranger can attempt to melt a frozen player if he's got the proper gun out already (just an example).
Or the game just doesn't allow you to target your party members unless you have some healing techs/items available?

And another question, what would you recommend for tagging as a ranger in general? Since hunters and forces can clear up a room in C leveled games, can a ranger have sufficient time to tag everything before everything dies?
Is tagging with only a 3 target spread with a shot enough? I can see one of the reasons to upgrade a shot in the future is for tagging purposes. Is there any other option since PSU doesn't have a slicer type anymore and spears (unless I'm mistaken) doesn't have that wide arc swing? Spraying everything in a room with a mechgun would run you out of bullets. And is straif circling (sp?) with handguns or dual handguns time efficient enough?

I assume B+ rank games are tough enough that you'd have time to tag everything, but I'd still like to know the best way to do it.

[Kaply]

strafe circling isn't possible with the mechguns but is sort of possible with the other guns, sort of possible because you need three hands to do it.

Mechguns auto-strafe when you're firing it, but the camera won't stay behind you at all times so it's sort of hard to tell what you're aiming at if you move too far. So you'll want to use the lockon button to keep the camera behind you.

Strafing with other weapons would require you to have one hand to control character movement, one hand to control camera movement, and another hand to fire the gun. Technically you can control camera and firing the gun with one hand, but that's sort of hard if you're trying to circle right even harder if you wanna fire one handed weapons because you have to hold down R1 on a control pad. This might be easier to do on a keyboard but I haven't examined which keys are necessary.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kaply on 2006-09-21 12:38 ]</font>

[LoneVandal]

Tagging everything is easy enough until Hunters get strong enough to kill monsters in one Photon Art or FO in one Tech, and by that time you're no longer running those missions and should be running B-A. Your main advantage over a FO is how rapidly you can attack, remember, there are no 1-2-3 combos in PSU, you mash the button and you start blasting until you run out of ammo. Since we typically produce the smallest numbers per hit though it becomes frustrating (to me anyway) never getting the killing blows and missing out on that +33% xp.

[LoneVandal]

I'd have to do some more experimenting, but I'm pretty sure both silenced and paralyzed, if they come out of the ground near you, you still get Jellen-ed.


Well, you only get Jellen'd if you take damage, and their coming out of the ground is an attack in itself that hits everyone standing near them unless you start shooting the moment they begin to emerge. You can also get Jellen'd if they use their normal swipe attack (not the 360 degree).

Basically RA > Flower worm things. They really suck, but even more for the other classes because they can't reliably freeze them / attack them without getting jellen'd.

[Spellbinder]

They really suck, but even more for the other classes because they can't reliably freeze them / attack them without getting jellen'd.

Which is why I can't wait for the Nosu- spells as a FO. Anywho, although I don't play Rangers myself, I still <3 them on a team~ Yay Rangers!! *hears power rangers theme song*

[Ether]

Ironically, I think ranger got nerfed today. I may be jumping to conclusions but I cant seem to set those really big guys in relics on fire anymore.

[watashiwa]

On 2006-09-21 13:47, Ether wrote:
Ironically, I think ranger got nerfed today.


Maybe and maybe not.. It could have made some monsters stronger and some weaker to status effects. But, yeah, the probabilities were adjusted..

You can translate it here: http://phantasystaruniverse.jp/news/wis/?mode=view&id=79

But it basically says that the maintenance that occured to make v1.0007 states that the following things were addressed:

- Completion times for synthing 5* boards or higher.

- The ability to not chat when certain conditions were met during mission setup.

- Adjusting the occurance probability of abnormal monster states.. <-- =(

- Synthesis probability adjustments

- Server stability adjustments

[Arrow203]

Wow you actually posted good this time Vandel, I'm proud of you son http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif All Hail RA! XD

[watashiwa]

I'm slightly pissed, but only slightly, that status effects got nerfed all around.

I ran through Shikon today and out of all the worms, I only froze 3 worms and only one time each..

I really hope that when the skill levels get uncapped, status effects for at least Ranger go back to how they were...

My lightning bullets still affected the robots in Hakura OK though. Not as often as before but I could still status effect a couple of robots per room...

I don't know why they nerfed status effects, but I guess it's because they make harder rank missions a bit too easy in a group.. Well, with burn dropping health by %s and the ability to freeze everything in the room..

Freeze barely procs now.. and I didn't even try my fire guns...

[DiosGX]

Perhaps it is just a proc rate with ice bullets then?

Or try ice bullets on other elemental aligned monsters, and other types of enemies. I know the large enemies in Moatoob pretty much don't take any statuses ever, except ice, and they're earth based.

[watashiwa]

I love you, Dio. I should have tested further.. seems like Freeze was the only one MAJORLY affected.. =P Freeze definitely got a mega nerf.

Just tried Fire dual guns in Parum.. Procing with those on just about every enemy.. My Earth handgun isn't procing as much as it used to but it procs still at a decent rate. Same could be said for my lightning handgun... Everything was adjusted, I think.. 'cept maybe fire? (Which I'd think that would be the worse? Hahaha..)

Unless maybe it was certain weapons or items that got adjusted. I don't have freeze dual guns, but Rifle freezing hardly works.. At least, not against the worms in Moatoob. (They could have adjusted things on a monster basis.. NEED MORE RANGERS TO TEST.. 'cuz I'm sorta lazy.. I just note things as I go along..)

[LoneVandal]

Nope... more was changed http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif You can't set the big lizard centaur shitheads on fire now http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

Man fuck Sega. We can't even play the whole game and they're bringing out the nerf bat on the lowest dps class.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: LoneVandal on 2006-09-21 23:46 ]</font>

[Niki]

On 2006-09-21 23:45, LoneVandal wrote:
Man fuck Sega. We can't even play the whole game and they're bringing out the nerf bat on the lowest dps class.

Yeah, so a Ranger's damage is secondary to their ability to inflict status effects, and it was this critical ability that got nerfed? Suddenly, low DPS seems like even less of a problem.

Well, this is a setback, but I get the feeling this won't be the last 'rebalancing' of the Ranger class.

Thanks to everyone for the information on the update.

[LoneVandal]

Right, so we already sucked at damage, and now they hit us where it hurt, the only thing we were good at.

[DiosGX]

On 2006-09-21 21:00, watashiwa wrote:
I love you, Dio.


Wait 'til US version, you'll be up ons. Or something.

I know you all hate them, but maybe try shotguns and see if those proc more or something when you're point blank. I can't get online or I'd be testing this with you.

[Valkayree]

On 2006-09-21 09:57, foamcup wrote:


By the way, Dick Cheney called for you and he asked me to tell you that he wants his first name back.

[ This Message was edited by: Valkayree on 2006-09-21 08:51 ]


I'm sorry, but I just have to say this: That was pathetic. Was that supposed to be funny? Seriously. What makes it even more sad is that you edited that in.



Not funny, just less offensive. It wasn't meant to be funny, it was meant to get the point across without offending anyone but the person it was meant for. I could have left in what I originally wanted to say but thought would be too harsh for some of the younger posters on the board and just call him a DICK for disrespecting me for complimenting him. And as for you, well, I think you know what kind of negativity I am going to focus towards you for acting inappropriate towards someone who you have never met nor has ever disrespected you, so I will dignify myself even further by not saying it.

[LoneVandal]

Hey Valk, if you carefully read that post again I didn't name you in it. Just an FYI. See, I named people so "it wouldn't offend anyone but the people it was meant for". You're a bit touchy assuming it was directed at you.

Editz: "marks are fun"

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: LoneVandal on 2006-09-22 12:45 ]</font>

[Sgt_Shligger]

I'd have to add this in.

Whoever said it's hard to circle strafe is wrong. With a keyboard, it is damn near impossible but with a controller, its rather simple. Now, to note, you MUST have a melee weapon to circle strafe (but I'm not sure why someone wouldn't equip a melee weapon with there mech/handgun.) You hold lock-on, tap tray switch (not sure what this is called but it brings up the left hand weapon), fire your gun, and repeat.

I also heard someone say there was a trick to strafing with a rifle/bow? Is that true or did I misread somewhere.

[Spellbinder]

With a keyboard, it is damn near impossible but with a controller, its rather simple.

Although I don't play a Ranger or Hunter, my keyboard setup may fall into the near impossible category for any keyboard lovers who may be interested in trying this out for yourself. First and foremost, I use the numpad to move around. I know I know, bad Spellbinder *slaps own hand* but after playing FFXI for nearly two years and adapting the same movement controls to City of Heroes/Villains, it grew on me.

Anywho, to strafe I use the "F" key, and to switch to my secondary weapon (which would be a handgun) is the "D" key. So All I'd have to do is keep "F" held down, and tap "D" when I need to shoot. I think I've circle strafed a little in offline mode, but not enough to say this is a sure fire way to go about it. Just thought I'd add in my two ranger cents. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Valkayree]

On 2006-09-22 12:41, LoneVandal wrote:
Hey Valk, if you carefully read that post again I didn't name you in it. Just an FYI. See, I named people so "it wouldn't offend anyone but the people it was meant for". You're a bit touchy assuming it was directed at you.

Editz: "marks are fun"

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: LoneVandal on 2006-09-22 12:45 ]</font>


My apologies man, thought it was directed at me. Guess I need a lesson in thoroughly reading posts, so for now I'll take my dose of humility.

[physic]

welll stuff is on point, i dont think offline is worthless though, it gives you an idea of some of teh capabilities of stuff. Like being able to use shotguns close ranged to hit a target for like 4 hits. Also shows some of the things that are available later, and potential of some weapons. While right now things are limited, they will not be limited in the same way for much longer than they will be limited. So the fact you cant get to these places now or do something yet, doesnt mean ra suck, merely means they dont start off great.

As far as mechguns, you really have to comapre them and use them in terms of one hand weapons, because thats what it is. The mechgun deals the most amount of dmg the fastest, and will be better the higher your base atp is. so when you re fighting certain enmies they will be very useful, also as 1 handed weapons, the whole pp regen thing comes into effect way more. Because you can actually use your other weapon while its recharging, and teh mech does recharge pretty fast i noticed. So basically mech is for people who dont mind meleeing, and want to do quick burst dmg to enemies. It may not be the type of fighting you want to do, but some probably will love it.

[Alexandrious1]

On 2006-09-22 16:17, Sgt_Shligger wrote:
I'd have to add this in.

Whoever said it's hard to circle strafe is wrong. With a keyboard, it is damn near impossible but with a controller, its rather simple. Now, to note, you MUST have a melee weapon to circle strafe (but I'm not sure why someone wouldn't equip a melee weapon with there mech/handgun.) You hold lock-on, tap tray switch (not sure what this is called but it brings up the left hand weapon), fire your gun, and repeat.

I also heard someone say there was a trick to strafing with a rifle/bow? Is that true or did I misread somewhere.





*Looks at his Xbox 360 controller he bought specifically for PSU*

I hope I can get this to work when its out T_T

[LoneVandal]

As long as you bought the wired version, it will.

[DoubleAA]

WoW you just made this game Awsome, i didnt know there was that much to do.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DoubleAA on 2006-09-23 18:15 ]</font>

[LoneVandal]

Thanks to the patch last week I'm flip flopping back to my original stance of "fuck Ranger, Sega hates them and they aren't very useful.". http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif Seriously, just roll a FO. Use a Wand if you want to cast more quickly.

[Kaply]

On 2006-09-22 16:17, Sgt_Shligger wrote:
I'd have to add this in.

Whoever said it's hard to circle strafe is wrong. With a keyboard, it is damn near impossible but with a controller, its rather simple. Now, to note, you MUST have a melee weapon to circle strafe (but I'm not sure why someone wouldn't equip a melee weapon with there mech/handgun.) You hold lock-on, tap tray switch (not sure what this is called but it brings up the left hand weapon), fire your gun, and repeat.

I also heard someone say there was a trick to strafing with a rifle/bow? Is that true or did I misread somewhere.





This only works with ONE HANDED guns also is rather slow to swap between and not really worth the hassle to circle strafe in this manner.

[LoneVandal]

Kaply is right for once.

[HC82]

The status resists weaknesess are going to vary. Wata's video shows that. Enemies are going to be more prone to certain status effects, than others.

I'm noticing a big difference in the procs, but you gotta look at the long term aspect of things. If the game amps up in higher ranked missions, wouldn't it be really cheasy for tough enemies, that are harder to hit and to stun for hunters, to be easily frozen by rangers (think PSOs frozen shooter cheese-fest). Many hunters have stated that higher difficulty levels makes for harder crowd control.

It might seem nerfed now, since the enemy AI isn't really that fierce. The effectiveness of a random proc seems moot when the enemies don't put up an intense fight, but imagine these puppies are laying down the smack all over the place, especially on the unreleased stages. A well placed freeze or knock down can give your team the necessary breathing room to control the situation when enemies are going nuts.

The best way I can equate it to is playing Endless Nightmare Ruins in normal and then in ultimate. Freezing one C-bringer or Del-saber can make a big difference when you've got four of them zipping around in ultimate, but the well placed freeze is less important when facing their slower and less agressive counter-parts in normal.

[Alisha]

Ranger sounds a LOT like blue mage in function.they even both suffer from the same problem.ranger has pp conservation problems and bluemage has mp conservation problems.



On 2006-09-20 08:55, Itsuki-chan wrote:
Ahh, thought of a good way to explain the mechgun vs handgun arguement.

The basic idea would be: Would you rather have 2 monsters paralyzed or 1 monster paralyzed for 2x as long? Thats the difference between mechguns and handguns.



id rather paralyze 1 2x as long essentialy removing it from combat freeing me up to finish off the other.

[Ether]

On 2006-09-24 01:06, Alisha wrote:
Ranger sounds a LOT like blue mage in function


Jesus christ, is there anything you wont try and compare to FFXI? Stop it already, the games are polar opposites

[LoneVandal]

On 2006-09-24 00:17, HC82 wrote:
A well placed freeze or knock down can give your team the necessary breathing room to control the situation when enemies are going nuts.

The best way I can equate it to is playing Endless Nightmare Ruins in normal and then in ultimate. Freezing one C-bringer or Del-saber can make a big difference when you've got four of them zipping around in ultimate, but the well placed freeze is less important when facing their slower and less agressive counter-parts in normal.



What the hell are you even talking about? We have no way of reliably even guessing at which monsters we can freeze now, making a "well placed freeze" an impossibility. The only monsters he was able to freeze even semi-regularly were the little harmless green shits.

[Alisha]

On 2006-09-24 01:16, Ether wrote:


On 2006-09-24 01:06, Alisha wrote:
Ranger sounds a LOT like blue mage in function


Jesus christ, is there anything you wont try and compare to FFXI? Stop it already, the games are polar opposites




its a valid comparison. chill out kay? i did the same thing when i first started ffxi except i was comparing it to pso until i got deeper into the game.

[Spellbinder]

until i got deeper into the game.

Perhaps Ether is coming from the standpoint of, once you've gone deeper into PSU, your comparisons fail to hold much value.

[LoneVandal]

Alisha they suffer from a lot more than that. Once upon a time they were good at inflicting status debuffs, now they suck at that and cannot be relied upon for it, and have always sucked at damage compared to the other classes. PP problems are just icing on the cake.

[DiosGX]

Has anybody in this thread made mention that when a ranger shoots an enemy, they shift their focus off the hunters and start making way toward the ranger? You know, letting the hunters get solid shots in at the enemy's backs without taking damage.

Ranger sure sucks.

It is pretty much like FFXI and casting Flash on an enemy.

OH MY GOD FFXI COMPARISON, CALL THE FIRE DEPARTMENT.

Sarcasm and such laden about. Fo sheezy.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DiosGX on 2006-09-24 02:46 ]</font>

[Sev]

Considering I'll be playing with a RAnewearl friend often... I think I'll get over any problems they really have.

Especially if there shots really do pull aggro away from me. I don't mind not getting hit every now and then.

[mechatra]

I'm totally with Vandal on teh subject of the last patch. Rangers , and to a general extent guns, got raped by the last patch.

[Sgt_Shligger]

On 2006-09-23 23:17, Kaply wrote:
This only works with ONE HANDED guns also is rather slow to swap between and not really worth the hassle to circle strafe in this manner.



Do you not like circle strafing or do you have some other way >_>

Circle strafing is good when you don't have any space to kite an enemy (And of course when you don't want to get hit).

[DiosGX]

Have you even played PSU? It's not possible to lack room.

[mechatra]

On 2006-09-24 13:30, DiosGX wrote:
Have you even played PSU? It's not possible to lack room.



Quoted for truth.
Only situation where you may not have much room is in corridors in places like Relics ect. and in those situations the enemies are small weak and low in number.

[Sgt_Shligger]

Yes, I have played PSU. I've been playing it a lot lately actually. Lack of room as in places where you might back into a corner/wall. Although when I think about it, I also circle strafe (large) enemies that do charging forward attacks.

[LoneVandal]

What is a Yamato Throwing Ass-ass?

[Sgt_Shligger]

. . .

I'm not even going to explain.