Online Gaming Ethics

[RamenEater]

From my FFXI and other online gaming experience, there is such a thing as online gaming ethics. These games have become such a sub-culture that people sort of lose grip of the big picture of life and argue over very little things.

One big controversy among online players is cheating. People using programs to get what they want and ruining game experience for others.

It'd be nice if people can discuss this topic in this thread with no flaming.

Do you guys cheat playing offline games? I mean I do all the time, but when it comes to online and all the other peoples feelings, its not moral. That's because people pay for the game. What if we didnt have to pay for the game, would cheating still be such a big
deal? Why is it such a big deal in the first place?

What do you guys think?

[Nani-chan]

I'm part of the crowd that left PSO 1&2 because of the excessive cheating.

Cheating including duplication of items.

The reason why people dissaprove of cheating is that for us "honest" players had to do other methods for getting those items. Mainly, killing Rare monsters, and bosses.

The other form of cheating was disruptive.. Yes I'm talking about Noling, Player killing, etc. Sure maybe it felt good for the people cheating, but for victims.. not so much.

[Ceravic]

One reason that I quit FFXI is because end game the only way you can get ahead is by either botting or buy buying gil online and using that.

One exerpt from the leader of one of the more famous botting LS on my server:
"Lol, the new bot I just finished last week is pretty much unstoppable unless I'm not in range. You should probably stop wasting your time if you see me at Fafnir camp at a timeframe when my internet is working well. It uh, yeah, ingores delay patch, lol. On your screen it will look yellow for a long ass time, but to me its red from 0.0 seconds. Sucks pretty much for you."



I'd never sink that low to where I need to cheat to make people on the internet think I'm cool. I try to address everyone with respect if they do the same to me.

[RamenEater]

On FFXI, it was taboo to talk about cheating/botting and thigns like that. To me, something like that becoming taboo shows that online gaming has gotten too serious maybe? I dunno, i just feel it is. Before I was introduced to all this ettiquette, i was a naive little boy running around trying to have fun. Until people told me to STFU cause they've dived so deeply into the sub culture they've lost sight of whats really important.. I think..

[Ceravic]

Well, one aspect of this game I'm excited about is the fact that if I don't want to play with the asshole cheaters, I don't have to. 6 friends, running around killing stuff = fun.

[Losodo1976]

I don't use cheat devices/codes for offline or online games, nor do I exploit weaknesses in the game (duping tricks, etc). For me, it's not really that cheating is moral or not, it's just that in online games cheating ruins it for other players. Cheating in offline games just means you got no skillz, lol. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Miyoko]

I used to cheat offline all the time. However, I've gotten to the point where I'm a skillful enough gamer, that I get more enjoyment pushing myself to see if I can legitly complete games, because most of the fun now comes from beating the challange, and no longer from beating the game like when I was younger.

I still cheat offline games if I've beat the game though. Like Resident Evil 4 -- After playing through it 3 or 4 times, it starts to get stale. Giving yourself unlimited ammo with the mine launcher can make things refreshing again.

However, I REFUSE to cheat online.

[RamenEater]

Yea i know what you mean, the PSO community was always alot friendlier. But you say "asshole" cheaters, not that i'm defending cheating. Like Nani-Chan stated, there are players out there that will attack the player itself, and others that hack the game.

I just don't understand why it's become taboo to say you are cheating. If the people aren't attack you directly, why do people make it a point to curse them out and not associate with them. Of course they don't have to attack you directly, they can hurt the economy of an mmo. But if your RL friend was cheating online, would you go so far as to stop being their friend?

[Ceravic]

The only offline game I really cheat in is the Grand Theft Auto series. Sorry, driving around living the sweet life of a gangsta and learning how gangsta I can truly be doesn't excite me. Taking a rocket launcher and shooting a prostitute with it, however, is good old fashioned American fun.

[RamenEater]

It probably boils down to a clash between different types of gamers. Players that are just casual and have no idea about gaming ettiquete versus the games that are really hardcore.

I think you have to have played a decent amount of online gaming to really get molded into thinking, cheating online is bad.

[February]

I duped some stuff in the DC Version, but just for myself. I had so many Twin Brands, Stag Cutlery's and G Assasin's sabers stolen from me that I began duping my favorite wepons just to be on the safe side. Other than that, No I've never cheated in an online game.

As for offline games, in PSO no. I never owned a GS for that system (Or really any others). I have used it to unlock stuff that I couldn't do in WWE games but that's pretty much it. Cheating's just not fair to everyone else playing.

[crazyrobot]

Cheating online is not cool anymore. There once was a time when I didn't care if you were cheating or not unless it directly effected my playing(FSOD).

I think its safe to say no one will admit if they cheat or not, but in any online game there will always be that small few that cheat/hack/corrupt ..etc.. online play.

[Nani-chan]

There are many people who feel strongly about this issue. It's just that more people are against cheating than for it; so it's natural to feel pressured.

The other issue is that people become frustrated with GM's. When GM's (law) fail to uphold the rules and the issue isn't resolved then the frustation is shown towards the cheaters more.

I apologize for being serious, but I just want to voice my opinion. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[RamenEater]

It's all good Nani-chan. I like talking about these things, and I believe there is a philosophical aspect to online gaming. One big thing to me is that gaming is a hobby, something that isn't really significant in the grand scheme of life. It's just that the sub culture has expanded so much that people follow it and forget about the real things that matter. It's a weird topic, I go around in loops in my head thinking about it.

I think if you were to conduct a survey with people that don't play games and ask "Do you think cheating on an online game is something that should be of great concern?" Most people would say "who cares its just a videogame.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RamenEater on 2006-10-12 01:28 ]</font>

[Nephias]

This is less of a gaming ettiquete topic and more of a "Cheating and its impact on our sub-culture/hobby" kinda deal.When I read the title I was expecting a discourse on playing nice/not being a idiot;with that said though I don't care for cheating.

Its fine for offline games after you beat them to increase longevity however your not gonna be taken to seriously if you have to cheat to even play normally.As for online games,cheating online is for skilless lamers and whatever weak justifications could be used for offline are made moot online as a cheater's actions affect us all.

TL;DR If you cheat online kill yourself.

[Kyuu]

On 2006-10-12 01:48, Nephias wrote:

TL;DR If you cheat online kill yourself.
TLDR = Too Long Didn't Read... not sure how that fits in there. o_0

Edit: Oh, and do whatever you want offline, but cheat online and die. ^_^

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kyuu on 2006-10-12 01:53 ]</font>

[RamenEater]

Hmm see, that is the kinda attitude that has been molded into you though. Like I said, if you had a close friend that you introduced to online gaming, and he started cheating, would you go so far as to stop being his friend?

You can say players are skillless and weak, but playing a videogame well or not does not make a person. Videogames shouldnt be about being "taken seriously" because it shouldnt be a serious experience at all.

We can say cheaters are enjoying the game differently, but then again you can counter that and say, they aren't thinking about other players. It's like this never ending loop.. good discussion thought =D

[Miyoko]

Videogames shouldnt be about being "taken seriously" because it shouldnt be a serious experience at all.


Tell that to Jack Thompson >_>

[RamenEater]

I hate that dude lol.

[crazyrobot]

On 2006-10-12 01:54, RamenEater wrote:
Hmm see, that is the kinda attitude that has been molded into you though. Like I said, if you had a close friend that you introduced to online gaming, and he started cheating, would you go so far as to stop being his friend?

You can say players are skillless and weak, but playing a videogame well or not does not make a person. Videogames shouldnt be about being "taken seriously" because it shouldnt be a serious experience at all.

We can say cheaters are enjoying the game differently, but then again you can counter that and say, they aren't thinking about other players. It's like this never ending loop.. good discussion thought =D



Online gaming these days are a bit more complicated to get away with cheating. The chances that a casual gamer/person new to online gaming knows anything about cheat/hack/corrupting is highly unlikely. A friend you introduce to any online gaming these days would have to go extremely out of his/her way to even cheat. Most likely if the person you brought online was cheating he/she would probably at some point get caughtand at worst get banned. I wouldn't go as far as to stop being his/her friend but to try to make him/her stop before he/she gets caught.

[RamenEater]

Hm, that's a good point Crazyrobot. I remember when I was younger my friend played diablo or EQ, don't remember what it was but he was telling me about GM's. The concept to me was just confusing, like "wtf? online police people? hahaha", some of that mentality is still with me.

I guess when money is involved everything changes =P

[ecchichuu]

On 2006-10-12 01:54, RamenEater wrote:
You can say players are skillless and weak, but playing a videogame well or not does not make a person. Videogames shouldnt be about being "taken seriously" because it shouldnt be a serious experience at all.


I hate arguments like "It's just a video game" There are plenty of people who care about PSU. 12,000 angry comments on one of Miyoshi's blog posts proves it. Cheating online demonstrates a lack of consideration towards other people's values and feelings. Many people clearly get angry about cheating and it's just a matter of the cheaters not caring. It's the stereotypical capitalist American "I win you lose, me me me screw everyone else" mentality.

I respect that belief though. I think the best solution would be if SonicTeam could make a separate Universe/servers for people who want to cheat. Like most people here, I don't care what you do to yourself, as long as you're not ruining my experience.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ecchichuu on 2006-10-12 05:36 ]</font>

[wildstar]

"A time comes when a man can't hide from the things that he's done." ~ Commander Adama

If cheating becomes rampant in this game I hope it at least happens AFTER I've met, had fun with, and learned to trust at least 10-20 cool people in PSU (non-cheaters, of course). Then, at least, we can play in locked games and utterly ignore the cheaters (which is exactly what I did in GC PSO for almost two years, successfully).

If it gets to a point cheating can hurt my experience directly (NOL, pw-break, FSOD, etc.) and ST does nothing to stop it, I will retreat offline, redoubled in my utter hatred and disgust for cheaters and their half-baked, self-serving, 'it's just a game' excuses.

[Pontifus]

On 2006-10-12 01:54, RamenEater wrote:
Videogames shouldnt be about being "taken seriously" because it shouldnt be a serious experience at all.



You, sir, are by far the most enlightened person here. I mean, one of the main reasons I'm getting into PSU is that I expect it to cater to more casual gamers...i.e. those who don't play for like 12 hours a day and schedule their lives around 6-hour dungeon raids. I mean, sure, I guess there will be hardcore gamers, too, and that's cool, but I don't want to be limited to playing with the kind of people who have only a tenuous grasp on reality (you know, like far too many WoW/FFXI endgame players), and I don't want to be forced into becoming such a person just to enjoy a game.

I may not be a "hardcore" gamer, per se, but I still don't like hacking. I'm in favor of account bans and such. Seriously, few things are worse than the guy who spent two hours getting the gear that took you two months to accumulate.

[wildstar]

EDIT: I had a big long post here, but I can sum it real quick: I'm anti-cheater for a lot of reasons. The End.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: wildstar on 2006-10-12 06:44 ]</font>

[mogshaz]

Does anyone realize you are planning on paying Sega for a game that you believe will have hackers in it? If i remember right the monthly fees are for server upkeep which i believe includes banning people for cheating. If Sega can't atleast stem the flow of cheaters on their servers they deserve your complaints not the people on the message boards saying "its just a game". cause guess what; THATS TRUE!

[Rejor11]

I believe that cheating and hacking in a P2P online game is not good.

When it comes to ethics, I just remember that the pixels on the screen are actual people and treat them accordingly. It just so happens that half of those people are just plain a-holes.

[AppieDPC]

Good ol' topic like the ones we used to have around when PSO was out on DC/GC/Xbox.
I see so much return in these replies from back then.

Sorry, I'm old ;D

[McFlyVII]

On 2006-10-12 01:26, RamenEater wrote:
It's all good Nani-chan. I like talking about these things, and I believe there is a philosophical aspect to online gaming. One big thing to me is that gaming is a hobby, something that isn't really significant in the grand scheme of life. It's just that the sub culture has expanded so much that people follow it and forget about the real things that matter. It's a weird topic, I go around in loops in my head thinking about it.

I think if you were to conduct a survey with people that don't play games and ask "Do you think cheating on an online game is something that should be of great concern?" Most people would say "who cares its just a videogame.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RamenEater on 2006-10-12 01:28 ]</font>


Sorry for the late comment but I wanted to put in my 2 cents. I am a very casual gamer, in fact PSO and PSU will be the first online games I have ever had to "pay" to play. I agree 100% that gaming whether console or online is just a hobby. Of course it doesn't fit into the grand scheme of things, nothing material really does nowadays. The only thing that truly matters to nature is survive and procreate. That's it.

Now if you were to take a poll about anything ex: football, and ask someone who hardly ever follows it whether cheating in it is "earth-shattering". They would also say "who cares". The theory can be applied to anything. There was a day when football was just a game. Over the 10's of years it has grown into an institution that is backed by lots of money and real-life penalizing laws. I think we are just scratching the surface of how technologically advanced we are becoming. I mean pirating is already an offense punishable by law. How long will it take for cheating in any way become the same way. Definitely not now but turn it into a multi-billion dollar business in say 50-100 years and nolers could very well become the hackers and pirates of today. Technology is booming so much that it will not take long until things like paper and anything unelectronic will become obsolete.

The problem is the fact that society today not only promotes cheating but almost encourages it in all facets of life. That I think is wrong. A videogame is a very menial thing in regards to cheating but adopting the "just doing whatever is within my power to stay ahead" attitude can have bad reprocussions in other areas of life.

If you dupe or bot just for your own pleasure and enjoyment, by all means go ahead. Just please don't try to mass circulate these dupes for money gain. There is, in my opinion, no sensible reason for noling or character deletion. So it doesn't belong in online gaming. A person pays real money and takes enjoyment out of playing a game. The last thing he wants is for some other player to ruin his experience. If it doesn't effect my gameplay in anyway, I could care less ;P.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: McFlyVII on 2006-10-12 07:00 ]</font>

[justbrak]

This is the biggest reason I am going to play on the 360. The chances for encountering cheaters increases highly with the PC involved. Just ook at how much people have already hacked different aspects of the beta. Great points made in this thread. It is really sad that people will tie their self image into a game and have a low enough view of themselves that they will result to an action as low as cheating in order to make themselves feel better.

[foamcup]

I have skills, therefore I don't need to cheat like some noob.

[Senel]

I just quit FF11 i played it for about 4 years and i never bought/sold currency luckily i had a strong enough family in the game that i had all the support i needed, cheating really dose destroy the fun factor of a mmo when a player cheats to aquire the same item you busted your ass for it kind of makes it seem pointless to put forth time and energy when another player will just take the easy way out... Well what ever if your a frequent poster to the message boards then more or likely you have enough pride and love for the game that you play honestly <3 11 days left!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[EnSill]

I do agree with McFly.

I played PSO because it was fun, I'll play PSU because I want fun http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif
Meeting people who cheat to get more money or items would be ok: they do what they want, I don't care.

But someone using hacks to ruin my game (FSOD in mind), or corrupting others characters... I can't see where is the fun there.
It's not fun for the victims of course.
And if someone gets fun doing that, he really has a problem.
There's no reason why I should give up my pleasure being in a cool game with great people, just because some guy can't enjoy the game as it is.

The "Haha, it's no big deal, it's a just a game" excuse is just lame.
When you spend time doing something, whatever it is, you'll be frustrated if someone comes and just blow it out as if it was nothing. (Even more if you paid the game, and pay a monthly fee http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif )

[BlueDagger]

I cheat offline all the time... In fact I just downloaded all the Mortal Kombat: Armageddon codes onto my Codebreaker yesterday.

When it comes to online, I never cheat. However, in PSO it was a different story, becuase using "hacked items" was such a normal thing, and Sega seemed to make like it didn't exist... But in PSU I'm staying "legit" since I'm going to have been there since the beggining. The couple times I tried being legit in PSO, I liked it, but it was just to much preasure, especially with the way people acted at the mere mention of hackers.... One of my (ex)friends nearly had a heart-attack just becuase I had a duped sword in my bank...



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: BlueDagger on 2006-10-12 07:50 ]</font>

[crazyrobot]

On 2006-10-12 07:34, Senel wrote:
I just quit FF11 i played it for about 4 years and i never bought/sold currency luckily i had a strong enough family in the game that i had all the support i needed, cheating really dose destroy the fun factor of a mmo when a player cheats to aquire the same item you busted your ass for it kind of makes it seem pointless to put forth time and energy when another player will just take the easy way out... Well what ever if your a frequent poster to the message boards then more or likely you have enough pride and love for the game that you play honestly <3 11 days left!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



lol There were some crazy ppl who played FFXI that obviously bought gil lvling up over 8 jobs to lv75 in less than 6 months. they upgrade relic weapons and get shadow mantle/ring in less than 3 months. They never farmed, didn't craft, and had over 500,000,000 gil worth of gear and weapons. Only to end up selling their accounts to someone stupid for a few hundred dollars when they probably spent thousands on their character. In a sense this is cheating, but for the most part he/she only ended up cheating themselves of a fun and natural gaming experience. Which also indirectly effects everyone who plays.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: crazyrobot on 2006-10-12 08:21 ]</font>

[Axel3792]

On 2006-10-12 01:54, RamenEater wrote:
Hmm see, that is the kinda attitude that has been molded into you though. Like I said, if you had a close friend that you introduced to online gaming, and he started cheating, would you go so far as to stop being his friend?

You can say players are skillless and weak, but playing a videogame well or not does not make a person. Videogames shouldnt be about being "taken seriously" because it shouldnt be a serious experience at all.

We can say cheaters are enjoying the game differently, but then again you can counter that and say, they aren't thinking about other players. It's like this never ending loop.. good discussion thought =D




Exactly. It's just a freakin' game. Again, unless you are paying for it (which PSU requires), it has no bearing on real life whatsoever.

[galaxy]

ok i didnt read the whole post but i just wanted to say this.

its not a matter of preference when it comes to cheating online. it just shouldnt be done. why? because it is in the terms of service, which ALL online games (at least consistent world type games) have. Regardless of how you think you want to play, you can't.

the problem with things like duping in pso, and cheating in general, is that it can affect others play time. in pso, if someone traded or gave me a weapon, i had no idea whether it was hacked or duped or whatnot. and i didnt want to resort to not accepting gifts from anyone or trading with anyone, cause hey, thats part of the fun of online gaming. sharing. but the issue here is that the two are not mutually exclusive. and its a one way street. if no one cheats, then NO one has a leg up...but if only a few people cheat, it may begin to affect far more people than the cheaters may thing, even indirectly (i don't even want to party with someone who has duped or hacked equipment. even if they dont physically share the equipment with me, they are affecting the experience i get, and the challenge of running through a mission).

cheating online just should not be allowed. i mean, it isnt, but it should be enforced.

[EnSill]

On 2006-10-12 08:09, Axel3792 wrote:
Exactly. It's just a freakin' game. Again, unless you are paying for it (which PSU requires), it has no bearing on real life whatsoever.


Erh... You're talking about a game that people are paying for, you even say it yourself http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif
What's your point exactly ? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

[Drown]

I think that when you effect the quality of gaming for other players, then it becomes an issue. I personally do not cheat, because, in my mind, the concept of an RPG is to put time and effort into a character in order to develop him/her.

Ultimately, though, we should keep in mind that the cheating is against ST's rules and game concept, and is punishable as such. If ST is going to server ban you for hacking, then it probably isn't acceptable conduct.

[RamenEater]

Ahh i love waking up and finding more replies to my posts haha. Great arguments though guys, good intellectual discussion about videogames, can't get any better than this =P.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RamenEater on 2006-10-12 11:02 ]</font>

[Asim]

Th ethic is that you guys will be like >_>;; randomly and I will be calling you all nerds.

[wildstar]

On 2006-10-12 11:41, Asim wrote:
Th ethic is that you guys will be like >_>;; randomly and I will be calling you all nerds.



>_>

[Valkayree]

Wow, you guys pretty much said it. Offline, whatever, do what you want, you are just cheating yourself. Online, giving yourself an unfair advantage, even if it is just by using Windower, is immoral and unethical, this is true, because you can potentially emotionally harm other individuals. The only individuals who strive to cheat online are those who are displeased with their real lives and hope that by cheating they can enter some uber hacking club where everyone speaks l33tsp33k and they will be known more by their game handle than their real name. They will never have to socialize or step out of their parent's house ever again, they can sink themselves into their virtual world where they compensate for their lack of actual gaming skill by downloading 3rd party software, installing it, and once they get rid of the attached viruses, they can reap the benefits by cheating other players, maybe thinking that at least someone out there will think they are cool. Just picture the guy PKing in WoW on that new South Park season 10 episode.

[RamenEater]

On 2006-10-12 11:56, Valkayree wrote:
Wow, you guys pretty much said it. Offline, whatever, do what you want, you are just cheating yourself. Online, giving yourself an unfair advantage, even if it is just by using Windower, is immoral and unethical, this is true, because you can potentially emotionally harm other individuals. The only individuals who strive to cheat online are those who are displeased with their real lives and hope that by cheating they can enter some uber hacking club where everyone speaks l33tsp33k and they will be known more by their game handle than their real name. They will never have to socialize or step out of their parent's house ever again, they can sink themselves into their virtual world where they compensate for their lack of actual gaming skill by downloading 3rd party software, installing it, and once they get rid of the attached viruses, they can reap the benefits by cheating other players, maybe thinking that at least someone out there will think they are cool. Just picture the guy PKing in WoW on that new South Park season 10 episode.



I really don't think cheating on a videogame makes a person so low like you describe. Some people take gaming more seriously than other's, which is why I think people cheat.

It's really hard to defend "cheating is ok", maybe thats the real answer. Since no one can come up wiht a solid argument for it, then it really is wrong. But then still just take a step back to say, "i've just been cheated, that guy screwed me bad. Well.. its just a game, I haven't lost anything really significant."

But then you can even coutner that argument, with what someone else brought up earlier. I didn't get a chance to read the whole thing but just as any other hobbies go, like watching sports, people take it seriously. While someone that doesnt watch it, doesn't understand why its taken so seriously.

Lol, i'm just randomly typing what's coming to my head.

[Ny_Jets51]

gay

[Seidon]

Cheaters honestly don't annoy me as much as those people who say "lol" every two seconds or "^_^".

I hate them with a passion.


I believe the reason that people cheat in video games is the same reason they don't play it with their eyes closed.

They don't want to lose.

But it is amazing the lengths that some people will go to in order to make sure they don't lose.

[MetaXi]

I think it is very simple.

If the game is online and you cheat to beat other people or make their lives harder, by all means kick the idiots ass. It's not fair to those who play fairly to have their lives made tougher because someone wants to cheat.
It's Dishonorable and unjust, and I becomed angered when the higher up's don't do anything about it.

I also believe however if you are playing offline it is okay to cheat, because the only person who loses the satifaction of actually beating the game is the cheater him/herself. So long as it doesn't affect others and their enjoyment of the game, I don't care what the hell you do.

Sometimes cheating does help (It's hard to believe I know.) For instance, my bro lost his character and I felt sorry for him. I learned how to Dupe to give him some items to help him level up as fast as possible. However he will only use the items offline so he doesn't affect other people online.

This is just my long rant and opinion on the subject. This is how I feel.....PYAAAAHHHHHH!

[Kamatz]

While the majority of duping was lousy proliferation the latest fad items (Sect ID cards, TJS, etc) there is a legitimate purpose to it that I will admit to taking advantage of myself. Safety. With all the nol, FSOD, etc that online had, and the time I did invest (I have 1000+ hours on my 151 RAmar primar) I was not about to risk losing my hard-earned of honest-traded items. As such I have a memory card entirely dedicated to the storage of rare items that I'm not actively using. Actively-used items are duplicated and copies (One per item) given to my active-play characters. If I get NOL'd (God forbid), at least the only loss will be the character itself and the time invested.

There is such a thing a being /too/ legit for your own good. I find no evil in backups... frankly, as an IT person I look at it as "just good sense" as long as you have the discipline to do it responsibly and not fudge on things like trades. This has saved me from I-don't-know-how-many FSOD losses and at least one trade theft. (If I trade something off I'll delete the backup copy later.).


The root is that a significant portion of the online gaming community is between the ages of 10 and 18. Rowdy, rebellious, stupid kids to whom it is "cool" to cause trouble for other people, any way possible. Some people never grow out of this. See SomethingAwful.com for an example - The mindset isn't much different, its all about "lol" and usually at other peoples' expense.