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Sminger
Oct 25, 2006, 01:31 PM
Just installed my PC version and noticed theres no CD key... how weird. So you just need to buy an account and you can play without purchasing the game...why would they do that? I remember the Dreamcast and Gamecube versions having 2 CD keys.

Saikyn
Oct 25, 2006, 01:32 PM
Does that mean I don't have to buy a 2nd PC copy and I can just burn my copy for my brother and he can play online with it so long as he purchases a Hunter Liscense for his account o.o?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Saikyn on 2006-10-25 11:33 ]</font>

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 01:33 PM
wow... but i doubt sega can slip up that big..

Eviltaru
Oct 25, 2006, 01:33 PM
yep i'm wondering if I can just pass out my dvd and let all friends to install it at least they'll get the offline free !!! Or every dvd has a hidden key in it?

Ri0T
Oct 25, 2006, 01:34 PM
o_# if this is true I just wasted about a hundred bucks. Can anyone else confirm this?

EnixBelmont
Oct 25, 2006, 01:35 PM
I would assume it has a hidden key.....If not, not like I'm complaining XD

Eviltaru
Oct 25, 2006, 01:36 PM
On 2006-10-25 11:35, EnixBelmont wrote:
I would assume it has a hidden key.....If not, not like I'm complaining XD



look everywhere on the PC box, manual, dvd, there's no CD-KEY provided like the JP version did! This is totally weird from Sega US!

Mikesnav
Oct 25, 2006, 01:36 PM
That would be a little too easy...

Sminger
Oct 25, 2006, 01:38 PM
thats what i was thinking but no where does it ask for a cd key, i would think it would ast least do it when u register your username.. right? But it didnt..

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 01:38 PM
wow, this has to be tested, a couple of my friends are getting it, if we can save money, hell yes

Disastorm
Oct 25, 2006, 01:42 PM
theres no cd key. Im downloading the patches right now (unless it asks for one after that, although I doubt it since I can't find a cd key anywhere)

Shinomaru
Oct 25, 2006, 01:42 PM
yea my copy doesnt have a key

BrandonBa2
Oct 25, 2006, 01:47 PM
Sega really makes me wonder sometimes if they enjoy not making money.

Sminger
Oct 25, 2006, 01:48 PM
This is so bizzare, especially for a PC game bc it can be so easily distributed...

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 01:49 PM
You...need a key to register the game for Offline play though, right? It's also required for getting a Guardian's License.

Wow?

Disastorm
Oct 25, 2006, 01:50 PM
nope no cd key to get a guardians license. You can register one right now yourself at phantasystaruniverse.com if you want

I think sega of america needs to fire whoever made the decision to remove the cd key.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Disastorm on 2006-10-25 11:50 ]</font>

BrandonBa2
Oct 25, 2006, 01:50 PM
On 2006-10-25 11:49, Zeta wrote:
You...need a key to register the game for Offline play though, right? It's also required for getting a Guardian's License.

Wow?



Nope, just buy the license from playsega.com . In other news expect the PC/PS2 population to skyrocket.

Ri0T
Oct 25, 2006, 01:52 PM
Well, a lot of MMO's coming out nowadays don't require a purchase of the game at all. (not saying that PSU is an MMO) They make more money from the subscriptions.

Like Enix said, there might be a hidden key though. Neverwinter Nights had a hidden CD key if I remember correctly.

pkazama
Oct 25, 2006, 01:53 PM
wow it does sound a bit too easy for real. Maye SEGA is "playing games" with us instead. But im sure there must have been something installed within the cd that registered your game's specific information on your PC?

Jozon
Oct 25, 2006, 01:53 PM
no, it was clearly on the front page of the manual for nwn

Miller
Oct 25, 2006, 01:55 PM
This can't be right... I will have an extra copy to sell on ebay if it is..

Killuminati
Oct 25, 2006, 01:55 PM
hmmm no cd key ....

BrandonBa2
Oct 25, 2006, 01:55 PM
Putting a different key inside the game on each CD would have been a pain in production. I'm going for Sega got really lazy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

BioWarrior
Oct 25, 2006, 01:55 PM
It COULD be the fact people found a way around gameguard for story mode and they figured this way people who download it for storymode may decide to play it online and still give them money.

Ri0T
Oct 25, 2006, 01:57 PM
Well... i could confirm if there is a hidden cd-key i guess since i have 2 other people in the household that are also getting licenses. I have to get off work first though.... which is in like, 5 hours. T-T

Killuminati
Oct 25, 2006, 01:59 PM
On 2006-10-25 11:55, Miller wrote:
This can't be right... I will have an extra copy to sell on ebay if it is..



I am just wandering if it is because if so I don't even need to buy the game at all.

Ri0T
Oct 25, 2006, 02:02 PM
On 2006-10-25 11:59, Killuminati wrote:

On 2006-10-25 11:55, Miller wrote:
This can't be right... I will have an extra copy to sell on ebay if it is..



I am just wandering if it is because if so I don't even need to buy the game at all.

Yeah, it would be nice to not have to buy 2 extra games...

I forgot about eBay though... lol, i somehow foresee many many PSU PC versions going up for sale on eBay very soon.

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:03 PM
Wow, maybe its because they are depending on the offline to rack up sales, and not the online.

BrandonBa2
Oct 25, 2006, 02:03 PM
At least I got a PS2 and PC version so its not that bad for me.

Percival
Oct 25, 2006, 02:05 PM
Maybe Sega is counting on moral integrity to prevent illegal duplication and distribution?

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:05 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:05, Percival wrote:
Maybe Sega is counting on moral integrity to prevent illegal duplication and distribution?



hahhahaa

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 02:09 PM
On 2006-10-25 11:50, BrandonBa2 wrote:

On 2006-10-25 11:49, Zeta wrote:
You...need a key to register the game for Offline play though, right? It's also required for getting a Guardian's License.

Wow?



Nope, just buy the license from playsega.com . In other news expect the PC/PS2 population to skyrocket.



Expect the level of cheating to increase exponentially.

Disastorm
Oct 25, 2006, 02:11 PM
i really hope they get active on banning cheaters... especially with the fact that theres no damn cd key.

AngelLight
Oct 25, 2006, 02:12 PM
Hmmm no CD key will mean that if they ban people, at best they can only ban a hunter's account and maybe an IP addy.

This could be a problem for the online community in terms of griefers and direct player to player hacks (example: Illegal PKing, FSODing Other People, etc.)

Mikesnav
Oct 25, 2006, 02:16 PM
No CD Key = More players
More Players = More people cheating

However, I don't believe No CD Keys leads to more cheating in general.

Sega can still ban people my IP/MAC address, which would be far more effective than by CD key.

Ri0T
Oct 25, 2006, 02:19 PM
o.O I would laugh until i died if a PSU hacker FSOD'd my PC, lol.

Disastorm
Oct 25, 2006, 02:20 PM
what kind of screen of death is the FSOD?

*edit* just searched it, lol it would be funny if it happened to pc users.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Disastorm on 2006-10-25 12:22 ]</font>

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 02:20 PM
I get the feeling Sega of America is going to do for PSU what it did for the prior games. So much for wishful thinking :/

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:20 PM
It's still not certain if this is true..

Disastorm
Oct 25, 2006, 02:21 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:20, RamenEater wrote:
It's still not certain if this is true..


Unless its built into the DVD, its true.

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:21 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:20, Grigori wrote:
I get the feeling Sega of America is going to do for PSU what it did for the prior games. So much for wishful thinking :/



What did they do?

Disastorm
Oct 25, 2006, 02:23 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:21, RamenEater wrote:

On 2006-10-25 12:20, Grigori wrote:
I get the feeling Sega of America is going to do for PSU what it did for the prior games. So much for wishful thinking :/



What did they do?


he means they let it go rampant with hackers.

kassy
Oct 25, 2006, 02:26 PM
EDIT: browser double posted -_-



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: kassy on 2006-10-25 12:27 ]</font>

kassy
Oct 25, 2006, 02:26 PM
Wow, what a stupid move on Sega part if true.

Still, not going to jump to conclusions just yet, will wait for actual confirmation.

AngelLight
Oct 25, 2006, 02:26 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:16, Mikesnav wrote:

Sega can still ban people my IP/MAC address, which would be far more effective than by CD key.



Guarantee you, if it's a script kiddie then all they would have to do is go to another computer and do it from there. Think for example a School Computer Lab or going over to a buddy's house (in that case its even easier since parents these days are dumb about letting kids pay for just about anything on their CCs, just get your friend's parents to help you out).

But yes you're right, the actual fact of not having a CD key isn't directly enough to open up hacking.

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:26 PM
yikes, a price to pay for this

Anathian
Oct 25, 2006, 02:27 PM
My copy is apparently making me register before even playing offline. Not to mention that there were errors during the install anyone else have this prob?

AngelLight
Oct 25, 2006, 02:28 PM
you have to put in a CC card before playing offline? or just register on Playnet?

infected
Oct 25, 2006, 02:28 PM
..... owned. Basically.

Where do you guys live that got the game? CA? cuz if so. I'm going to call my gamestop NOW!

grndzro
Oct 25, 2006, 02:28 PM
I'm sure that upon installation it makes a unique cd key tied to your account.
There is technology now that can burn each cd key directly onto the cd so the installation can internaly verify each copy, Might prevent onlne play if 2 of the same copies try to register.

They could also have a database of every legit key upon login/registration/subscription.

kassy
Oct 25, 2006, 02:31 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:28, grndzro wrote:
I'm sure that upon installation it makes a unique cd key tied to your account.
There is technology now that can burn each cd key directly onto the cd so the installation can internaly verify each copy, Might prevent onlne play if 2 of the same copies try to register.

They could also have a database of every legit key upon login/registration/subscription.



That's what I'm thinking, there's something we're not seeing.

Seriously, no piracy measures, Sega couldn't be that stupid http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

Alpha-Hunter
Oct 25, 2006, 02:31 PM
if's that's the case it'll probably prevent to people with the same internal keys from logging in at the same time. offline and online in this case. if this is so then not bad at all.


On 2006-10-25 12:28, grndzro wrote:
I'm sure that upon installation it makes a unique cd key tied to your account.
There is technology now that can burn each cd key directly onto the cd so the installation can internaly verify each copy, Might prevent onlne play if 2 of the same copies try to register.

They could also have a database of every legit key upon login/registration/subscription.

AngelLight
Oct 25, 2006, 02:32 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:28, grndzro wrote:
I'm sure that upon installation it makes a unique cd key tied to your account.
There is technology now that can burn each cd key directly onto the cd so the installation can internaly verify each copy, Might prevent onlne play if 2 of the same copies try to register.

They could also have a database of every legit key upon login/registration/subscription.



Given the past track record of all of Sega's games (including Chromehounds which is under their own version of hacker invasion), I would expect this at the very least assuming SEGA didn't totally lose their minds about having any sort of respect from their customers.....

Mikesnav
Oct 25, 2006, 02:33 PM
What good would creating a cd key upon installation?

If somebody makes an iso out of it and people download it, wouldn't they too get their own key upon installation?

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 02:34 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:21, RamenEater wrote:

On 2006-10-25 12:20, Grigori wrote:
I get the feeling Sega of America is going to do for PSU what it did for the prior games. So much for wishful thinking :/



What did they do?



Nothing. That's the problem.

Suddenly, I don't mind waitning an extra day for the game (Xbox 360).

Mikesnav
Oct 25, 2006, 02:34 PM
And for the record, Oblivion didnt have a CD key.

Not online, but you get the idea. There's other methods to protect it.

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:36 PM
I just wish someon can confirm it =/

entropyboy
Oct 25, 2006, 02:39 PM
yea really

came someone install on multiple comps and confirm this for everyone?

Legenden
Oct 25, 2006, 02:41 PM
OoooMG! thats nice, now all we poor europeans need to do is to wait for Sega to make it avaliable for download like they did with the Japaneese version:),..

Seriously do you really think they could manage to print unique CD keys into every single copy of the game?,.. don`t think so, if theres no cd key there is no cd key..

I will buy the game anyways as I love to have all the classics in origional form,.. and I know it`s already a classic:)

Pixels
Oct 25, 2006, 02:41 PM
This is so weird -_- but this could be nice if the game gets upped to the internet.. i could play the singleplayer until the EU version came..

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 02:55 PM
Stupid question but do you need teh disc to play the game?

infected
Oct 25, 2006, 02:56 PM
don't need it for other MMO's why this one.

Ri0T
Oct 25, 2006, 02:58 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:39, entropyboy wrote:
yea really

came someone install on multiple comps and confirm this for everyone?

I will do it, but i have to get home first... unless i just don't come back from lunch break after getting the game.

Anyway, if no one's confirmed it by the time it's time for me to install, i'll do it.

RamenEater
Oct 25, 2006, 03:02 PM
My friend is bringing me a copy now, we're gonan try it. But someone has been telling me that you register and link the game through your sega acccount. So i dunno..

Randomness
Oct 25, 2006, 03:05 PM
Well, it couldn't be too hard to have each CD have a unique key... They get written during production, so it would just slow it down a bit, I think...

Sizzors
Oct 25, 2006, 03:14 PM
WOAH! SEGA screwed up on the NA release date?

Hmm... Seems likely...

BrandonBa2
Oct 25, 2006, 03:17 PM
On 2006-10-25 13:05, Randomness wrote:
Well, it couldn't be too hard to have each CD have a unique key... They get written during production, so it would just slow it down a bit, I think...



Hundred thousand individual keys on a disc would not just slow it down a bit http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Cause_I_Own_U
Oct 25, 2006, 03:18 PM
Sega knows subscriptions > box sales, they are in it for the $$ they are a buisness after all

Feelmirath
Oct 25, 2006, 03:20 PM
No CD key, eh?

Might make some people step into the DVD drive age, heh.

Dr_Lantis
Oct 25, 2006, 03:25 PM
This has to be tested; I'd be sad if SEGA really messed-up ;_;

Itoshi
Oct 25, 2006, 03:32 PM
This IS not good. We're gonna have more hackers(I'm playing totally legit on PSU) this time, which sucks. Sega better be smart enough, or I will complain to them.

chibiLegolas
Oct 25, 2006, 03:39 PM
On 2006-10-25 12:05, Percival wrote:
Maybe Sega is counting on moral integrity to prevent illegal duplication and distribution?



I know it's unrealistic, but I'm a madly dedicated enough PSO/Sega fan to do right by them and go buy the official game if I needed to.
(I personally am getting the 360 version though).

Come on folks, aren't we ALL die hard PSO fans?
I mean, we're here on a forum about PSO/PSU.
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif'

I for one WANT to support Sega and WANT to see them continue 'n prosper for the future. Sure they have faults too. But come on, they gave us Sonic, Panzer Dragoon, PSO, etc.
And you DO want to have more PSU releases in the future right?

I know I wept inside when I first heard that they failed at the console wars and couldn't continue.
So lets at least support them for the games they're BRINGING OUT.

Long live sega and PSO/PSU!



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: chibiLegolas on 2006-10-25 13:42 ]</font>

Tycho
Oct 25, 2006, 03:49 PM
I lol'd.

Mewn
Oct 25, 2006, 04:03 PM
On 2006-10-25 13:49, Tycho wrote:
I lol'd.


I lol'd harder.

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 04:23 PM
I hardly lol'ed ;_;

Dr_Lantis
Oct 25, 2006, 04:26 PM
I must know if SEGA truly screwed themselves by this mistake and if the buying the game would just be a waste (even though I already have the game).

BrandonBa2
Oct 25, 2006, 04:30 PM
More hackers are good because sega can find problems faster and fix them while all the script kiddies are like WTF DATS NOT FAIRZ

Diablohead
Oct 25, 2006, 04:34 PM
I'm thinking about ebaying my copy once I get the game running smooth and have no need for it, if worst comes to worst I will backup psu first.

The Ģ36 in return will pay for my online bills up untill like febuary.

FenixStryk
Oct 25, 2006, 04:40 PM
If this is true, I have one thing to say for you PC users...

HA! How do you feel now, huh? Real crunchy, I bet? It's about time the 360 users got a pat on their back! YEAH! Where's your blind PC fanboyism now, huh? HUH?! Gonna go crawl in your cave and get a 360 now, huh?! Wouldn't you know!

...Err, sorry. Just got tired of all the PC fanboys.

AlphaMinotaux
Oct 25, 2006, 04:42 PM
fuck i wasted 50 bucks where i could have downloaded the game in like 2 days for free :/

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 04:43 PM
...why would anyone care enough to buy a 360 just because the PC version (presumably) doesnt have a CD Key?

Diablohead
Oct 25, 2006, 04:46 PM
ebayyyyyyyy

Rubesahl
Oct 25, 2006, 04:52 PM
On 2006-10-25 14:42, AlphaMinotaux wrote:
fuck i wasted 50 bucks where i could have downloaded the game in like 2 days for free :/



Precisely how I feel -__-; Its not like its a special edition or anything either. The box is as light as a feather and the booklet is in Black and white http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif The japanese one for PC was too so it doesn't make much diff there XD Anyways, I'll consider myself the guinea pig for my friends who haven't bought it yet . ___ .;;

Shrevn
Oct 25, 2006, 04:58 PM
OK let me say this first off (as a passed duper cloner is PSO) No CDKey doesnt mean shit... period. What it means is if you dupe a item clone money w/e you do you get banned per say. You will have an easier time to just remake a hunters license and do it all over again. W/out having to get another serial key. DOESNT MEAN open hacks will be going on in the lobby have more common sense then that. Is it a stupid mistake by segas part? hell yes... but doesnt mean its all over kids... & Hackers dupers and cloners will happen w/ or w/out serial keys nomatter what anyone says. Get over it already

Sleet_v2
Oct 25, 2006, 05:05 PM
SO basically Sega is going to loose a lot of money.

Thats gunna be GREAT for the longevity of this game.

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 05:07 PM
Torrent released and it was evidently confirmed that there is no internal CD key.

Dr_Lantis
Oct 25, 2006, 05:09 PM
What the hell SEGA...

googles
Oct 25, 2006, 05:10 PM
glad i got the ps2 version. Gonna download the pc version though.

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 05:11 PM
Sega of America for the WIN! or....the LOSE! Whatever point you choose to look at it from.

Eviltaru
Oct 25, 2006, 05:30 PM
LOL we got screw over.... for those who bought PC version >.< but anyway if there's US version torrent up in a few days then Sega really got screw up !!!

Sonic646
Oct 25, 2006, 05:34 PM
Good. Now I have a free game to play while I wait for my DELAYED 360 VERSION GAHH

Raven_Flight
Oct 25, 2006, 05:41 PM
Actually the torrents are already up and running.....ummm....not that I'm downloading as we speak or anything......."runs off cackaling"

Eviltaru
Oct 25, 2006, 05:46 PM
On 2006-10-25 15:41, Raven_Flight wrote:
Actually the torrents are already up and running.....ummm....not that I'm downloading as we speak or anything......."runs off cackaling"



US or JP version though?

Wallin
Oct 25, 2006, 05:48 PM
Sweet, now I don't need to get a copy for my brother.

So now if you got it for X-Box 360, you had to pay $60 instead of $50 and you can't share the disc, while PC users are apparently going on rampages of free software. How interesting...

Diablohead
Oct 25, 2006, 05:50 PM
It's US, I was talking to the guy who started the thing http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Raven_Flight
Oct 25, 2006, 05:58 PM
Yep tis the US version...upon reflection my last post made me sound like an ass http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif I do feel bad for those that spent so much money only to find that they need not have.

Guilty-Mirage
Oct 25, 2006, 05:59 PM
This thread makes me sick...

Mostly because of some of the people posting in it.

Thieves. Stealing a game you're allegedly fans of. That's just pathetic.

Dr_Lantis
Oct 25, 2006, 06:02 PM
Piracy stuff you love does make me sad, but obtaining a game with no flaws instead of buying the game also makes me sad. I just feel so jipped that the PC box is so cheap (I have the legit PC game, but I feel depressed that I "wasted" my money on it.

Killuminati
Oct 25, 2006, 06:11 PM
On 2006-10-25 15:59, Guilty-Mirage wrote:
This thread makes me sick...

Mostly because of some of the people posting in it.

Thieves. Stealing a game you're allegedly fans of. That's just pathetic.



I don't know but I think Sega knew this would happen. Maybe they did it just to get more subscribers to the game. I don't know if they would risk selling less copies just to make more money on subscriptions. I already bought the game for PS2 wasn't plan on buying pc version but since a torrent is up I might as well try it out to see if my computer can run it. I don't see it as stealing.

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 06:14 PM
That or Sega of America just doesnt care about the game :/

AlphaMinotaux
Oct 25, 2006, 06:16 PM
still can't over the fact that i wasted 54 dollars just now for nothing....54with tax. all i can say is GG sega gimme my cd-key!

Dr_Lantis
Oct 25, 2006, 06:21 PM
On 2006-10-25 16:16, AlphaMinotaux wrote:
still can't over the fact that i wasted 54 dollars just now for nothing....54with tax. all i can say is GG sega gimme my cd-key!



Ditto

Quark713
Oct 25, 2006, 06:28 PM
Now I'm sad...
Even though I'm getting the 360 version, this could be bad for Sega, which means its bad for PSU. And that's bad for ME!

MXdude
Oct 25, 2006, 06:40 PM
well now atleast people who were not sure if the PC version would run on their computer can test it now. I still think its a big mistake by ST, but maybe they would rather get the monthly fee. *shrugs*

CrimsonHalo
Oct 25, 2006, 07:08 PM
Yeah I feel quite ripped as well. Sega are Pieces of S*** for this. No CD-Key implementation. Ugh. Ah well I should have waited instead of purchasing right off the bat.

FLEABttn
Oct 25, 2006, 07:29 PM
Friggin pirates.

jimmer411
Oct 25, 2006, 07:31 PM
this just saved me money on buying a copy for my brother to play! were getting a license right now. ill post results soon!

Ecstasy
Oct 25, 2006, 07:31 PM
Wow, today SEGA has truely proven they cannont do a single thing right outside of making good games. Without a Activation key anyone can just sign up for the billing, and download the torrent, and save $50. Every MMO i have ever played even required you to enter at Activation code when you sign up for billing. SEGA truely is full of idiots. who know nothing about marketing a game, But what a shock NOT!!!

Aphael
Oct 25, 2006, 07:43 PM
Hopefully Sega actually intended it. There have been games in the past released as both downloads and as solid media, with the former being free and the latter costing money (Though not anywhere near $50, granted).

So despite the fact this is more than likely a monumental screwup, I at least want to pretend that they had the torrent-fest worked into their budgeting of the game

norrisj15
Oct 25, 2006, 07:49 PM
has anyone tried to install a already installed copy of the game on a different computer. if so that'd be awesome, but i highly doubt it. we can all hope

jimmer411
Oct 25, 2006, 08:00 PM
i installed it on a different computer. offline works perfectly. playsega.com is down so im still trying to make a 2nd guardian license to test it.

Sev
Oct 25, 2006, 08:03 PM
People who weren't gonna pay for the game, simply weren't gonna pay from the start. It's still stealing/pirating anyway you look at it though. No point in trying to justify it to be not so.

AquaFlare7
Oct 25, 2006, 08:08 PM
On 2006-10-25 18:03, Sev wrote:
People who weren't gonna pay for the game, simply weren't gonna pay from the start. It's still stealing/pirating anyway you look at it though. No point in trying to justify it to be not so.



To be honest the japanese version had an officially free game download. I knew of the torrent and still paid for the game willingly to show my support, but there is no sense in worrying about a torrent that actually helps to build a bigger community http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

Ether
Oct 25, 2006, 08:11 PM
On 2006-10-25 18:08, AquaFlare7 wrote:

To be honest the japanese version had an officially free game download


No it doesn't, you need a CD-Key to download it. Not to mention making an account requires a CD-Key, and an account is required for offline mode

infected
Oct 25, 2006, 08:11 PM
I won't be surprised if sega put a unique key in each version and starts banning accounts that use that version. But thats doubtful.

I knew this was going to happened. Stupid Sega is ran by R-Tards.

jimmer411
Oct 25, 2006, 08:14 PM
On 2006-10-25 18:11, Ether wrote:

On 2006-10-25 18:08, AquaFlare7 wrote:

To be honest the japanese version had an officially free game download


No it doesn't, you need a CD-Key to download it. Not to mention making an account requires a CD-Key, and an account is required for offline mode




thats the thing tho, there is NO cd key.

Randomness
Oct 25, 2006, 08:15 PM
So its really free replacement/copy for computers without DVD drive?

pkazama
Oct 25, 2006, 08:31 PM
wel i don't care if it has it or not i'm still buying it for the heck of it. Does that mean PS2 and 360 versions have cd-keys?

XredX
Oct 25, 2006, 08:32 PM
hmm so if you make a new account get a free month GL agian but have to start over ??

xToMx
Oct 25, 2006, 08:43 PM
not sure but i think imma still buy the game just incase, i would buy the ps2 one now but i dont have an online adapter so w/e, ill admit im dling the torrent one just cause ive been waiting for ebgames to get the game itself for past 3 days and still gonna have to wait till friday so immma enjoy playing the offline mode in the mean time

kazuma56
Oct 25, 2006, 08:48 PM
Hmmm, well it may have been intended on their part... because PSO:BB WAS download only, they weren't making a profit then and the profit they are going to make from PSU is likely the same thing they are banking on.

Edit by Moderator: Please don't discuss the illegal distribution of the game.

Kyuu
Oct 25, 2006, 08:50 PM
On 2006-10-25 18:49, kazuma56 wrote:

Where are you getting the torrent from? can you send me the link?
Torrent = illegal, which equals can't talk about it on PSOW.

kazuma56
Oct 25, 2006, 08:54 PM
....my mistake, was supposed to be PM'd.....

Aaomi
Oct 25, 2006, 09:04 PM
On 2006-10-25 14:40, FenixStryk wrote:
If this is true, I have one thing to say for you PC users...

HA! How do you feel now, huh? Real crunchy, I bet? It's about time the 360 users got a pat on their back! YEAH! Where's your blind PC fanboyism now, huh? HUH?! Gonna go crawl in your cave and get a 360 now, huh?! Wouldn't you know!

...Err, sorry. Just got tired of all the PC fanboys.



::poke::

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

bleyzwun
Oct 25, 2006, 09:09 PM
I dont really see the problem with it. CD Keys havent stopped hackers before and they wont now. I bought my copy and I will be kinda heated if you can just download it and play online. Even so I wont be that mad. Sega was always gonna make their money off subscriptions which is what is still going to happen. Not many people are playing the game for story mode (i dont think). Maybe it's like a few people said and they did this on purpose. If so this COULD be a good move on their part. If people try the single player and decide they like it theyre most likely going online with it. Then they have to pay. More subscriptions = better content and expansions (i would hope). Regardless I bought my copy and I'm not that upset about the situation.

xToMx
Oct 25, 2006, 09:11 PM
sry bout that

anyways, *whistles*

ummm sumone answer my free trial topic O_O!@!!$$%!2

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: xToMx on 2006-10-25 19:26 ]</font>

Para
Oct 25, 2006, 09:22 PM
Im curious... I noticed that gameguard pops up when you start PSU. Now what if you started PSU with internet connection then turned off your internet... would you still be able to play offline mode?

SpikeOtacon
Oct 25, 2006, 09:28 PM
On 2006-10-25 19:22, Nites wrote:
Im curious... I noticed that gameguard pops up when you start PSU. Now what if you started PSU with internet connection then turned off your internet... would you still be able to play offline mode?



No, it apparently requires constant internet connection. Not as bad as the shoddy Half Life 2 'no offline' problem on it's launch.

jimmer411
Oct 25, 2006, 09:36 PM
free trial is 15 days if you sign up for monthly, 30 days if you do the 6month thing.

SpikeOtacon
Oct 25, 2006, 09:39 PM
On 2006-10-25 19:36, jimmer411 wrote:
free trial is 15 days if you sign up for monthly, 30 days if you do the 6month thing.



So you have to pay no matter what? Or is it like Ragnarok where you can just sign up and after the 15 days are up you can't access the game any longer?

Merumeru
Oct 25, 2006, 09:52 PM
XD o well, im pretty sure copying isnt possible on the ps2 due to DNAS checking and such

you psu fans have fun not spending money and having a chance to get your licenses deleted XD

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 09:53 PM
I bet there is something that keeps two of the same CD from being able to sign online at once, and since you have to be online to play at all that could crack down on it. Maybe game gaurd has something built into it. Or maybe it was something intentional and they figured they would make up for it with not having to pay for making the physical disk and still getting money from the online subscription. SEGA would have to be seriously mentally challenged to have not done this on purpose, its been the standard for games forever. Not really something you just overlook.

AquaFlare7
Oct 25, 2006, 09:59 PM
On 2006-10-25 18:11, Ether wrote:

On 2006-10-25 18:08, AquaFlare7 wrote:

To be honest the japanese version had an officially free game download


No it doesn't, you need a CD-Key to download it. Not to mention making an account requires a CD-Key, and an account is required for offline mode



You are right, I just double checked. I recieved my copy of PSU JP from a friend with conections and so I guess I was confused on the distribution.

Sinsko
Oct 25, 2006, 10:00 PM
You can play offline without a key - I have it installed on two machines now... however I cant get to the register site to try to Validate even one key.

This will be cool.. just get the game for free and pay the monthly fee. Blue Burst anyone?

Sinsko
Oct 25, 2006, 10:02 PM
Also - the disc are mass produced - an image is burned to the dics.


Did sega create millions of unique images? Doubt it...

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 10:11 PM
I'm just throwing out ideas. Chances are they did mean to do it and figured the free games some people would be getting was far out weighed by how many more people will be online and how some people once they play it for free and like it will actually go out and buy the game. The same people that never would have picked up the game if not for the free download.

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 10:17 PM
Are any of you actually listening to yourselves? What company in there right mind would deliberatly go out of their way to lose money on purpose. I dont buy the whole "method to the madness" story some people here are dishing out. Its true that even with CD Keys, people will still find a way to hack into them, but the protection provided is at least an attempt at securing a profit. Sounds like Sega going to lose further money on this investment. If Sega really wanted people to not buy the game, yet purchase a hunters license, they would have just provided a free download.

Im still wondering why SoA wouldnt have one if SoJ does :/

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 10:21 PM
The thing is, how do you unintentionally leave out something like a CD-key? It isnt something that you just overlook. Maybe there is some security feature below the surface that is as now, unknown. Maybe not. Also, how long have people been playing PSO and PSO:BB? I'm sure there are MANY people that have payed there origonal purchase price over multiple times in online subscription fees.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 10:22 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:00, Sinsko wrote:
You can play offline without a key - I have it installed on two machines now... however I cant get to the register site to try to Validate even one key.

This will be cool.. just get the game for free and pay the monthly fee. Blue Burst anyone?



Cool? *scoff*

How dishonest people are nowadays, and here everyone was so excited and the "evil" starts spreadin as soon as someone finds a "door" into piracy.

If some of you really supported the game and Sega, you wouldn't even think about piracy. But thus is to be expected of people...Geez.

What a pitiful sight. And here people wonder why games get so bad all the time.

Talk about disappointing, I certainly am glad to be on a different server, things like this sicken me.

People always looking for a damn handout.

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 10:26 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:22, Tahldon wrote:

On 2006-10-25 20:00, Sinsko wrote:
You can play offline without a key - I have it installed on two machines now... however I cant get to the register site to try to Validate even one key.

This will be cool.. just get the game for free and pay the monthly fee. Blue Burst anyone?



Cool? *scoff*

How dishonest people are nowadays, and here everyone was so excited and the "evil" starts spreadin as soon as someone finds a "door" into piracy.

If some of you really supported the game and Sega, you wouldn't even think about piracy. But thus is to be expected of people...Geez.

What a pitiful sight. And here people wonder why games get so bad all the time.

Talk about disappointing, I certainly am glad to be on a different server, things like this sicken me.

People always looking for a damn handout.



If there are no measures to keep you from installing it on multiple computers than they arent bypassing anything. So is it still technically illegal? Serious question so please don't turn the flames toward me.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 10:33 PM
Your asking it that way can be taken in two different ways.

Ok, you can install it on many computers, yes, that's great. But the real question is, do you need the disc to be able to run the game on a specified machine? If the answer is yes, then how will you play both on both machines with ONE disc?

The answer is, one can't. It'll all lead to trying to BURN a copy of it! Isn't that illegal? If my memory serves me right.. the word that describes that is "Piracy".

Is installing the game on two different machines illegal? No, by all means go ahead. But if you can't play both and you only have one source of media.. will that lead to something illegal?

Hm?

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 10:37 PM
Alright, thanks for the quick answer.

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 10:39 PM
The more ass hats that can get on the game, the more cheating, and the worse it'll be.

I'm glad to be on the Xbox 360.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 10:43 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:39, Zeta wrote:
The more ass hats that can get on the game, the more cheating, and the worse it'll be.

I'm glad to be on the Xbox 360.



I absolutely agree, Zeta.

You've no idea how utterly disqusted I am reading some of the stuff in this thread.

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 10:45 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:26, Neo187H wrote:

On 2006-10-25 20:22, Tahldon wrote:

On 2006-10-25 20:00, Sinsko wrote:
You can play offline without a key - I have it installed on two machines now... however I cant get to the register site to try to Validate even one key.

This will be cool.. just get the game for free and pay the monthly fee. Blue Burst anyone?



Cool? *scoff*

How dishonest people are nowadays, and here everyone was so excited and the "evil" starts spreadin as soon as someone finds a "door" into piracy.

If some of you really supported the game and Sega, you wouldn't even think about piracy. But thus is to be expected of people...Geez.

What a pitiful sight. And here people wonder why games get so bad all the time.

Talk about disappointing, I certainly am glad to be on a different server, things like this sicken me.

People always looking for a damn handout.



If there are no measures to keep you from installing it on multiple computers than they arent bypassing anything. So is it still technically illegal? Serious question so please don't turn the flames toward me.



Technically, no. But you need to have the disc in the PC, which leads to burning the game, which IS illegal. It's called Piracy.

There's also Moral Integrity, but evidently no such thing exists anymore.

S7rife
Oct 25, 2006, 10:46 PM
Yeah I'm still going to get the game for the 360 even though I could probobly get it for PC for free (Hey, I might later on), but it just seems wrong to steal from a company that put so much effort into a good game that is worth paying for.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 10:50 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:45, Zeta wrote

There's also Moral Integrity, but evidently no such thing exists anymore.



Integrity, that should be burned into some people's foreheads.

I'm so glad there's someone else who actually has some kind of honesty about themself.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Tahldon on 2006-10-25 20:51 ]</font>

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 10:51 PM
And whoever said Sega gets the return on the fee anyway is only partially correct. Yeah, they get the money from the fee, but you're still robbing them of the cost of the game, which cuts into the console's profit as well.

59.99(9.99x) will always be more than just 9.99x (where x= number of months you subscribe for).



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Zeta on 2006-10-25 20:53 ]</font>

SpikeOtacon
Oct 25, 2006, 10:52 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:45, Zeta wrote:
Technically, no. But you need to have the disc in the PC...


Strangely, not for my copy of PSU.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SpikeOtacon on 2006-10-25 20:53 ]</font>

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 10:54 PM
On 2006-10-25 20:52, SpikeOtacon wrote:

On 2006-10-25 20:45, Zeta wrote:
Technically, no. But you need to have the disc in the PC...


Strangely, not for my copy of PSU.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SpikeOtacon on 2006-10-25 20:53 ]</font>


O_O

No CD Key, and you don't need the Disc?

Sega, you're making it really hard to defend you. Throw me a frick-ing bone. (Dr.Evil)

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 10:57 PM
Exactly, you crooks complain about Sega not doing very well, but here you go and promote it by stealing from them.

As Zeta said, Sega gets some of the monthly fee, but the real support comes from purchasing that PSU media from a retailer. THAT'S where their funds come in. *Shakes head*

And here people talk about downloading it for free..burning images...If I was one of the employees at Sega that helped create this game hearing you guys spout such ridiculous crap... I wouldn't know what I'd do with myself.

To talk down so much about Sega, then ROB them. I can't even find a word to even describe the way I feel about this, disgrace, disgust.. those aren't even strong enough words..Pitiful isn't even a nominee..

kazuma56
Oct 25, 2006, 11:06 PM
I don't see what the uproar is about... sure you COULD download it for free, but to play online there is still a fee involved, So if PSU falls of the marketing chain like PSO epiodes did, Sega can still gaurantee themselves that they at least can still make income off of people who are downloading it.

On the other hand, I can see where other people are coming from, its quite stupid of Sega to do this, I find it really stupid actually... but I'm not one to judge companies actions, SOA probably has a reason for this (at least one can hope) or maybe there is some taking or registering of your CD upon patching the game or something (heard the patch was like 150ish mb).

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:06 PM
Revolted comes in at around 5 out of 10. But I'm still lacking in a proficient word...

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 11:07 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:06, Zeta wrote:
Revolted comes in at around 5 out of 10. But I'm still lacking in a proficient word...



Loathe.. abhor.. those sound close.

And I'm glad to say it, I hope someone feels shameful for even -considering- pirating PSU. After how hard the Sonic Team worked on it.

Grigori
Oct 25, 2006, 11:09 PM
If only they could apply the same amount of effort to there other games.

Wallin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:14 PM
Let's see... Sega mysteriously has no CD keys.

Thousands of people are downloading it on torrents and clogging the billing server.

The billing server is charging multiple times if people resend credit card information when the page fails to load, regardless of whether the game was legit or downloaded.

I'll say it again, Sega is pretty genius in my book. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:16 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:14, Wallin wrote:
Let's see... Sega mysteriously has no CD keys.

Thousands of people are downloading it on torrents and clogging the billing server.

The billing server is charging multiple times if people resend credit card information when the page fails to load, regardless of whether the game was legit or downloaded.

I'll say it again, Sega is pretty genius in my book. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



Sega's not the only party at fault.

Pirating ass holes are to blame as well.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 11:17 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:14, Wallin wrote:
Let's see... Sega mysteriously has no CD keys.

Thousands of people are downloading it on torrents and clogging the billing server.

The billing server is charging multiple times if people resend credit card information when the page fails to load, regardless of whether the game was legit or downloaded.

I'll say it again, Sega is pretty genius in my book. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



Even if that -is- the case, then other gamers have only brought it upon themselves.

Usually the humor would be fun, but I have such repugnance for these pirates, I'm glad none of em can get on and play anything.

Wallow in your own greed, creatins! *Roar*

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:18 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:17, Tahldon wrote:

On 2006-10-25 21:14, Wallin wrote:
Let's see... Sega mysteriously has no CD keys.

Thousands of people are downloading it on torrents and clogging the billing server.

The billing server is charging multiple times if people resend credit card information when the page fails to load, regardless of whether the game was legit or downloaded.

I'll say it again, Sega is pretty genius in my book. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



Even if that -is- the case, then other gamers have only brought it upon themselves.

Usually the humor would be fun, but I have such repugnance for these pirates, I'm glad none of em can get on and play anything.

Wallow in your own greed, creatins! *Roar*



Tahldon:1
Pirating cretins: 0

kazuma56
Oct 25, 2006, 11:19 PM
Well either way you look at it, 360, PC and PS2 will undoubtly have their fair share of hacking... it all comes down to how SOA handles the dilemma as opposed to morality issues...i'm buying the game tommorow regardless and thus expect Sega and ST to keep their end of the bargin (content, fixes,patches).

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 11:21 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:19, kazuma56 wrote:
Well either way you look at it, 360, PC and PS2 will undoubtly have their fair share of hacking... it all comes down to how SOA handles the dilemma as opposed to morality issues...i'm buying the game tommorow regardless and thus expect Sega and ST to keep their end of the bargin (content, fixes,patches).



Either way, US HONEST FELLOWS thank YOU for BUYING the game.

Mikesnav
Oct 25, 2006, 11:21 PM
Get off your f'ing annoying high horse bitch. I have a hate for piracy too, but spewing nonsense about it does nothing - except annoy.

And for the record, the REAL cash cow for any subscription based game IS the subscription fee.

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:23 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:19, kazuma56 wrote:
Well either way you look at it, 360, PC and PS2 will undoubtly have their fair share of hacking... it all comes down to how SOA handles the dilemma as opposed to morality issues...i'm buying the game tommorow regardless and thus expect Sega and ST to keep their end of the bargin (content, fixes,patches).



Yeah right. Coutless people getting the game for free are way more likely to hack files THEY ALREADY HAVE than to jump on Live, PAY for the game (what nut case does that?), and then somehow hack the Live servers AND the Sega servers.

Have fun seeing 3000.

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:24 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:21, Mikesnav wrote:
Get off your f'ing annoying high horse bitch. I have a hate for piracy too, but spewing nonsense about it does nothing - except annoy.

And for the record, the REAL cash cow for any subscription based game IS the subscription fee.





You can go ahead and leave now.

The subscription fees are what keeps the server maintained. The only real profit made if from the sale of the product.

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 11:24 PM
Now if only I could get my paid for version BEFORE the people that didn't pay for it...

Quick question to you though Tahldon, are you on such a high horse about everything downloadable on the internet? Music? Movies? Or is it just your extreme love for all that is PSU.

McLaughlin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:25 PM
I pay for my CDs and then rip them to my MP3 player, for my own personal use.

I rent/buy my movies. Pirating can kiss my ass.

FenixStryk
Oct 25, 2006, 11:25 PM
Double posts are lame... then again, so is not having a CD key. Go figure.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: FenixStryk on 2006-10-25 22:00 ]</font>

Nephias
Oct 25, 2006, 11:26 PM
Nice circle-jerk ya got going on here.


Though I am legitimately surprised over this turn of events.Really now,their not THAT stupid are they??

Wallin
Oct 25, 2006, 11:28 PM
In this case, definitely.

Sega not only charges lower monthly rates than pretty much every other MMORPG, but the game also comes with a complete single player version.

I don't know why Sega doesn't learn the first time - Dreamcast didn't have any software protection on it's games either. It just doesn't make much sense.

Yaski
Oct 25, 2006, 11:28 PM
Shhhh, Dont give anyone else anymore ideas. I for a fact know that there is some sort of encryption on every CD. Strangly enouph Sega was so kind enouph to slip up on CD's and misdistribute them with that Stronghold Legend Disc 2 lol.. Oh well. What else is in store for us...

kazuma56
Oct 25, 2006, 11:30 PM
Yeah right. Coutless people getting the game for free are way more likely to hack files THEY ALREADY HAVE than to jump on Live, PAY for the game (what nut case does that?), and then somehow hack the Live servers AND the Sega servers.

Have fun seeing 3000.



I say the exact same people that bought PSO for all the consoles (free PSO v1 and v2 on PC via private servers) and those that don't have access to good PCs capable of running the game.

Remeber that the "live" experience may even be more convient to some, no having to open up a 3rd party program to VC with others and your not at your PC all day.

Also, isn't PSU run the same way FFXI is? once "launching" the game you leave the live servers and join segas own servers? thus "hacking" live is removed from this equation (PSOX was hacked also... doubt anything will be different this time around aside from getting access to segas servers as opposed to screwing with the client) which means it is as susceptible as the other 2 platforms.

Neo187H
Oct 25, 2006, 11:34 PM
There has got to be SOME sort of security... I hope.

I guess my extra few days of wait for the 360 will be worth it if all these fears come to reality.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 11:35 PM
On 2006-10-25 21:24, Neo187H wrote:
Now if only I could get my paid for version BEFORE the people that didn't pay for it...

Quick question to you though Tahldon, are you on such a high horse about everything downloadable on the internet? Music? Movies? Or is it just your extreme love for all that is PSU.



High horse huh? Say what you will..but if you feel like I'm on a "High Horse" then obviously what I've said is hurtin you in the heart cause you are -probably- guilty.

Have I said anything about music or movies? I'm talking about PSU.

I'm just going on because I'm seeing complaints all over the place and then people talk about burning the game and such. Then they wonder why Sega has so many problems. Instead of helping, some people just create more problems, what the hell kind of support is that?

I'm just sayin, if you want something to be good SUPPORT Sega and stop tryin to get over on them. Sure, me going on won't resolve the CD Key problem, but is all the conspiring to try and find methods of piracy helping or hurting? You tell me.

Sure Sega's made a few mistakes (In our eyes), but damn, give the people some credit and try to help em out. Don't get angry if the shoe fits your foot and someone's calling you on it.

If you're annoyed by me, then be annoyed.

It's about Integrity with me, I'm just wondering wher e it is.

Koshiba
Oct 25, 2006, 11:38 PM
I might wait a little longer to buy my copy. Would like some of these kinks worked out and certain things explained first. And only reason I would even consider downloading it instead of buying it would just be for it to be temporary to see if it will run well enough on my PC. Since I'm against pirating things as well. But either way, I think I'll hold off on buying it for a couple weeks.

xenokai
Oct 25, 2006, 11:49 PM
Went to wal mart only had 1 copy..... Noticed no cd key..... I got my psu for $25 and my friend got psu for $25. Thats how i look at it. Weve be loyal PSO fan since DC/gc/psobb. There's no harm in letting others use a Legit CD as long as its payed for.

pnpd
Oct 25, 2006, 11:49 PM
Meh, shpiz happens. This is a big ethical issue, I'll definately agree with that but... I gotta say, quit your bitching everyone, it's a game, let's have some fun with it, yeah? So maybe it's encrypted, maybe it isn't, I don't think the real point of the game is to be exclusionary. Sega's not really like that, which is my reason for believing that they sell cheaper than most, it's not a bunch of elitist bs. Although, I did hear, long before PSU came out that it would have a lot more defense against hacking... so I'm thinking, maybe it's bait but then again, what do I know? I just like to play games.

Tahldon
Oct 25, 2006, 11:57 PM
Well, in all honesty, I'm not tryin to be the "holier than thou" bad guy.

I just felt really strongly about the whole situation and seein some stuff in the thread was just fuel to the fire...

But Imma get off the soapbox. Not tryin to make any enemies, just tryin to up the support and all.

*Takes a deep breath* I'm good now. :3

DawnFire
Oct 25, 2006, 11:58 PM
This whole situation seems far too odd to be a mere accident. Even if the previous mis-packaging of some of the game boxes, it seems far too big a mistake for Sega to just let go. Mind you, they have made some mistakes in the past, but this one is rather too large to just be a simple oversight. And from the sounds of it, there seems to also be some evidence that maybe this might have been part of a plan to get more subscribes. Yes, these subscriptions do pay mostly for server fees, but if ST were to gain double the subscribers (guesstimate number for a most likely insane theory, so forgive it) then they would surely gain the cost of thier lack of retail price in a manner of months. And also


On 2006-10-25 20:33, Tahldon wrote:
Your asking it that way can be taken in two different ways.

Ok, you can install it on many computers, yes, that's great. But the real question is, do you need the disc to be able to run the game on a specified machine? If the answer is yes, then how will you play both on both machines with ONE disc?

The answer is, one can't. It'll all lead to trying to BURN a copy of it! Isn't that illegal? If my memory serves me right.. the word that describes that is "Piracy".

Is installing the game on two different machines illegal? No, by all means go ahead. But if you can't play both and you only have one source of media.. will that lead to something illegal?

Hm?



You should note that it is possible to run the game completely without the DVD in your system. Making the use for a burned copy actually useless if only among a certain amount of people. Mind you, this isn't the most moral standpoint. However, you should get your facts straight at the least.

Also, we should focus on exactly what points of morality we are debating here. I understand if this was a huge mistake by Sega, it would be wrong to exploit such a mistake. However, that is not something we know yet, it may have been something still completely planned by Sega. In which case, would allowing a friend to download the game as well (not necessarily through a burned copy, but the original you bought yourself) be considered exploiting? Really can't answer that question yet, instead we have to wait to hopefully hear an announcement from Sega themselves. Maybe they will state that it was intentional, maybe they will say it was an accident and anyone found with a pirated copy will be banned. Or maybe, they will say nothing. Implying that they either do not care, or merely enforcing the possibility that it was all intentional on some level to fulfill some marketing plan to accomplish a larger community of subscribers. Like I said, we can't really tell this yet. And this is all conjecture, so please forgive me if you were offended and/or annoyed, etc.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DawnFire on 2006-10-25 22:00 ]</font>

sscaff1
Oct 25, 2006, 11:59 PM
Well I want someone to confirm there is no hidden encryption. Since I bought the game for the PS2 I would love to have the option of playing it on the PC. Kinda like I did with FFXI.

jimmer411
Oct 26, 2006, 12:03 AM
i finally got thru on the billing site for my brother.

just patched the game, both using my DVD.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: jimmer411 on 2006-10-25 22:05 ]</font>

pnpd
Oct 26, 2006, 12:14 AM
Look, the money's not really in buying the game, it's in paying to play because if you play for a few months without actually buying the game, you've payed it back. I don't think even if it was unintentional that you're really exploiting all that much if you're still paying to play the game, it's like a cover charge kinda, you don't make all that money just selling tickets to the show, you make it in merchandizing.

DawnFire
Oct 26, 2006, 12:18 AM
Good ol' merchandising, maybe they'll come out with Phantasy Star plush dolls and t-shirts. I'd buy some of the plush.

pnpd
Oct 26, 2006, 12:19 AM
Or am I wrong?

DawnFire
Oct 26, 2006, 12:21 AM
You could be, you would have to consider also that they would need to increase their number of subscribers if this was their plan. Even if it is a cover charge, it's a cover charge that you'd need a person playing 5 months to recover the fact you didn't charge them for it. So, the only way to ensure far more profit would be increasing subscriber numbers. If, that was their plan.

pnpd
Oct 26, 2006, 12:26 AM
Yeah, I'd buy some plushies, hell yeah!

Jools
Oct 26, 2006, 12:34 AM
So, do we need to register or anything to play story mode?

Killuminati
Oct 26, 2006, 12:40 AM
On 2006-10-25 21:24, Zeta wrote:

On 2006-10-25 21:21, Mikesnav wrote:
Get off your f'ing annoying high horse bitch. I have a hate for piracy too, but spewing nonsense about it does nothing - except annoy.

And for the record, the REAL cash cow for any subscription based game IS the subscription fee.





You can go ahead and leave now.

The subscription fees are what keeps the server maintained. The only real profit made if from the sale of the product.



You are a fool if you believed they make no money on subscriptions and only make money on game sales.

FLEABttn
Oct 26, 2006, 01:02 AM
On 2006-10-25 21:28, Wallin wrote:
Dreamcast didn't have any software protection on it's games either.

Some did, it depended entirely on the game.

It wasn't talked about really because developers/publishers didn't want to give any hints for the crackers, and the crackers thought some of this stuff was so easy it wasn't worth mentioning.

But, some games did have software protection.

Nika
Oct 26, 2006, 01:56 AM
In the conclusion, it need DVD to run the game or just install?
Because,in my experince, I have been using alchohol 120% to run image file of "the lord of the ring BME2" ,but I can't play with that. (Have anyone try with PSU ?)

Eviltaru
Oct 26, 2006, 01:57 AM
anyone would like to call up Sega "America" for confirmation ? lol ... anyway for whoever that already bought let's lvlup screw this CD-KEY drama! lol >.<

Eviltaru
Oct 26, 2006, 01:58 AM
On 2006-10-25 23:56, Nika wrote:
In the conclusion, it need DVD to run the game or just install?
Because,in my experince, I have been using alchohol 120% to run image file of "the lord of the ring BME2" ,but I can't play with that. (Have anyone try with PSU ?)



once installed... can play OFFLINE & ONLINE WITHOUT DVD!

DawnFire
Oct 26, 2006, 02:03 AM
Yeah, would be great if Sega announced something themselves, but that's unlikely.

Aphael
Oct 26, 2006, 04:21 AM
Everyone talking about a potential method to Sega's alleged madness got me thinking "What good would getting a huge playerbase at the sacrifice of recouping some developement cost be?"

Then:

"Oh, since the series isn't as popular here, maybe they want to get a big fanbase installed in preparation for the expansion, and then start hitting people with the security with that."

Also, as has been stated before, a subscription fees do help game costs. It's like most consoles these days. The game console (Representing PSU) is usually sold at a loss to the company, but licensing fees and first party software (Representing server cost) will, over time, make up that difference.

Lythandas
Oct 26, 2006, 04:26 AM
Less prophesizing, and more playing!! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

PandaMasterX4
Oct 26, 2006, 04:29 AM
No key on mine either.

Aphael
Oct 26, 2006, 04:34 AM
On 2006-10-26 02:26, Lythandas wrote:
Less prophesizing, and more playing!! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



Well, when game servers go down I like to sit and ponder the meaning of the universe. And various issues about the game.

When I can actually get on, though, my soul and most rational thought will be forfeit <3

AnamanaAU
Oct 26, 2006, 04:46 AM
I'm still buying the game. It's not like SEGA isn't going to make money though. Then again, all this piracy may force them to increase the monthly fee. Have you guys ever thought of that?

ZEO_X
Oct 26, 2006, 06:42 AM
PC users get the game for free while the 360 users have to pay $60 and then get delayed. Nice.

McLaughlin
Oct 26, 2006, 06:53 AM
On 2006-10-25 21:30, kazuma56 wrote:


Yeah right. Coutless people getting the game for free are way more likely to hack files THEY ALREADY HAVE than to jump on Live, PAY for the game (what nut case does that?), and then somehow hack the Live servers AND the Sega servers.

Have fun seeing 3000.



I say the exact same people that bought PSO for all the consoles (free PSO v1 and v2 on PC via private servers) and those that don't have access to good PCs capable of running the game.

Remeber that the "live" experience may even be more convient to some, no having to open up a 3rd party program to VC with others and your not at your PC all day.

Also, isn't PSU run the same way FFXI is? once "launching" the game you leave the live servers and join segas own servers? thus "hacking" live is removed from this equation (PSOX was hacked also... doubt anything will be different this time around aside from getting access to segas servers as opposed to screwing with the client) which means it is as susceptible as the other 2 platforms.



No. The game runs on Live servers. Once again, this game has no relation fo FFXI. They're two completely different games.

McLaughlin
Oct 26, 2006, 07:07 AM
On 2006-10-26 04:42, ZEO_X wrote:

PC users get the game for free while the 360 users have to pay $60 and then get delayed. Nice.




And the honest people who did buy the PC version got the wrong game >_>

sscaff1
Oct 26, 2006, 07:13 AM
Yesterday I found it impossible to believe that this could be part of Sega's Strategy. Today I don't know maybe I believe it a little more. Just think of the amount of people that we will have to play with. I just hope this doesn't cause cheating/hacking.

drakkula
Oct 26, 2006, 07:39 AM
im an importer who has been waiting for sega to say something about this importers not allowed to buy a GL thing.....

now everybody wants to know why the game came out without a key, believe me....no words will be heard from sega shortly............Sega dont know what the word communication means.........sadly.....

Knight_of_MIA
Oct 26, 2006, 07:52 AM
On 2006-10-26 02:46, JubeiSaotome wrote:
I'm still buying the game. It's not like SEGA isn't going to make money though. Then again, all this piracy may force them to increase the monthly fee. Have you guys ever thought of that?



That could happen indeed.

But I just hope that they really included some hidden encryption. Would be nice to see if Sega suddenly turns the switch "on" after a month or so. While all the people who bought the game honestly may continue with their chars and stay fine, but the thieves will be shut down and thus have to re-enter game idīs, and GLīs. Of course that means, "start all over again".

Haha, sweet seduction babe, so sweet. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

Sega, please do so and nuke them !

rayis
Oct 26, 2006, 08:10 AM
wow i wonder if all this PSU related drama was some kind of crazy marketing ploy from sega to somehow make the game more popular, there for, making more money in the long run to support the game.
theres so much PSU drama going on that im starting to wonder what else can possibly come up....hmmmm Sega...what the feck are you guys up to... none of this shit makes any sense to anyone...



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: rayis on 2006-10-26 06:11 ]</font>

pkazama
Oct 26, 2006, 08:27 AM
and it's not nice either, SEGA may be giving other companies ideas to play around with us also

Varo
Oct 26, 2006, 09:12 AM
Wow, that's pretty amazing. Well, I THOUGHT I was going to have to buy the PC version in addition to the PS2 version I already have. Hrmm... >.>

I don't know if this is good or bad. In regards to cheating, i'm still a firm believe that cheating will be nowhere near what it was in PSO.

Oyako
Oct 26, 2006, 09:12 AM
SoA: Finally.. PSU has hit store shelves! So how are our Sales figures? GREAT! and what about the subcriptions? That many huh? Ok, wait... 8 Characters an account, 4 per world.... the subcriptions are out numbering the game?! Whats going on? NO CD KEY?! You forgot to print out CD KEYS??? ........ok, I want you to get the addresses of everyone who signed up for a GL. Kill them... no one will notice and we'll re launch the game with the damned Key this time... hurry!

damn nerds...

SoJ: Lol

Dr_Lantis
Oct 26, 2006, 09:32 AM
I still feel jipped after buying the PC version...

Axel3792
Oct 26, 2006, 09:43 AM
This could be because if your disk breaks or you lose your game somehow, you couldn't play.

Basic marketing. The ability to not log back in with your original account because of Keycode checks would make one want to do one of two things:

1. Delete their user account, costing Sega money.
2. Make a new character on a new account.

Sega won't risk losing money, period. Ragnarok and a few PSO reviled hackers aside, this is the same reason banning people on any MMO never takes place.

Dionysus187
Oct 26, 2006, 02:14 PM
Well there are ways for it to be on a disc, and then have a key or something imprinted on your installation. Servers might be able to tell if 2 installations of the same disc are running. Have no idea if they did this with PSU though.

Darkchampion3
Oct 26, 2006, 02:17 PM
doesnt matter too much either way. If you *really* want to pirate the software, a CD key isn't going to stop you.

Good imo. I hate it when I lose the cd key for my legit game and have to play it with a crack -_-

chibiLegolas
Oct 26, 2006, 03:55 PM
On 2006-10-25 13:39, chibiLegolas wrote:
I know it's unrealistic, but I'm a madly dedicated enough PSO/Sega fan to do right by them and go buy the official game if I needed to.
(I personally am getting the 360 version though).

Come on folks, aren't we ALL die hard PSO fans?
I mean, we're here on a forum about PSO/PSU.
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif'

I for one WANT to support Sega and WANT to see them continue 'n prosper for the future. Sure they have faults too. But come on, they gave us Sonic, Panzer Dragoon, PSO, etc.
And you DO want to have more PSU releases in the future right?

I know I wept inside when I first heard that they failed at the console wars and couldn't continue.
So lets at least support them for the games they're BRINGING OUT.

Long live sega and PSO/PSU!


It really is disheartening to hear some of us for months have been biting our nails every day to hear a tid-bit of new info, and then wishing, dreaming, and drooling for the game to come out. And when the day finally arrives, they go on & backstab Sega so quickly when it's mentioned that you can ripp the cd and don't need to pay for the cd disc itself.
And even worse, some even feel ROBBED that they bought the actual legal copy!

Isn't this game what you've been waiting for? Don't you think $50-$60 is well worth it for a great game?

Please everyone, just support Sega and insure a mutual future for the both of us!



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: chibiLegolas on 2006-10-26 13:58 ]</font>

pnpd
Oct 26, 2006, 07:50 PM
Screw it, either way, I'm playing it when I can once all the college application crap this month is done, then it's some major brain melting via gaming. Screw the cd debate, I'm playing once all this stressful school bs is done.

jimmer411
Oct 26, 2006, 08:08 PM
On 2006-10-25 23:58, Eviltaru wrote:

On 2006-10-25 23:56, Nika wrote:
In the conclusion, it need DVD to run the game or just install?
Because,in my experince, I have been using alchohol 120% to run image file of "the lord of the ring BME2" ,but I can't play with that. (Have anyone try with PSU ?)



once installed... can play OFFLINE & ONLINE WITHOUT DVD!





Game works fine when mounted in daemon tools. i can confirm 100% that you just need to buy the license and not the game to actually play for PC.

Kinda sad in a way, since the game is worth the money spent on a new copy.

bleyzwun
Oct 27, 2006, 02:08 AM
On 2006-10-25 20:22, Tahldon wrote:
Cool? *scoff*

How dishonest people are nowadays, and here everyone was so excited and the "evil" starts spreadin as soon as someone finds a "door" into piracy.

If some of you really supported the game and Sega, you wouldn't even think about piracy. But thus is to be expected of people...Geez.

What a pitiful sight. And here people wonder why games get so bad all the time.

Talk about disappointing, I certainly am glad to be on a different server, things like this sicken me.

People always looking for a damn handout.



Seriously... I don't see why you are so mad at people. Before anybody calls me a pirate or whatever, I bought my game. I really don't understand how this is pitiful or evil. You act like you never tried to save some money in your life. I'm not saying that pirating is a good thing. I just feel its not that serious. Also i doubt it's the bootlegs causing games to be bad. Most developers just try to make garbage copies of good games.

If these type of things make you sick, you must be loaded, or have some sort of bootleggable media out. It's understandable that an artist would be pissed about losing money. Honestly though, I already have enough bills to pay. Rent, utilities, gas, phone, insurance, etc. This doesnt leave me much money to play around with. If I can get a handout believe I'm going to take it. I'm sure most people feel the same way (maybe not in this respect, but everybody wants a handout. dont kid yourself).

Tahldon
Oct 27, 2006, 02:28 AM
Lol I got off that "soapbox" a loong while ago.

Augustine
Oct 27, 2006, 02:30 AM
Oh Sega, you guys crack me up! What will you do next? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

Sgt_Shligger
Oct 27, 2006, 02:44 AM
Where do you even DL PSU from?

DoubleJG
Oct 27, 2006, 02:48 AM
Sega will mainly be earning their income from PSU's Gaurdian Licenses. A few unsold game disks will be a decent loss, but not a truly noticeable one. Besides, they don't do enough for everyone to be paying 9.99$ a month to play.

AlphaMinotaux
Oct 27, 2006, 02:49 AM
for the record teh game Dawn of War Has the CD-Key written into the game save files. FOr example a new expansion came out about 2 weeks ago. many people had lost thier cd-keys from the original but the thier CD-Key could be found in the installation folder. but i doubt sega did something liek that.

AlphaMinotaux
Oct 27, 2006, 02:51 AM
On 2006-10-27 00:44, Sgt_Shligger wrote:
Where do you even DL PSU from?


dare not speak of such things! torrents.

Sgt_Shligger
Oct 27, 2006, 02:54 AM
Oh. . . So is SEGA going to pull a fast one with encrypted CD keys built in?

Sailor_V_64
Oct 27, 2006, 02:58 AM
i don't understand how people think they screwed themselfs. 50$ a pop per subscriber? yeah. i think they did that on purpose

Hemorrhage
Oct 27, 2006, 03:02 AM
I'm glad I bought it, I'm having a blast. I am not concerned with there being no CD-key because I wouldn't of pirated it anyway. I buy my games.

But, even if there was a CD-key, ppl who pirated it still woulda have done it anyway. That's how pirates are, if they want something and don't wanna pay for it, there gonna always find a way to get it.

And I wouldn't be surprised if there was some kinda ID attached to each game, so when the game launches it searches the ID where ever it may be (registry, install folder, etc). If more than one person has the ID, all but one of 'em can't play.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Hemorrhage on 2006-10-27 01:06 ]</font>

Kurushii
Oct 27, 2006, 03:10 AM
no ID of such Hemorrhage. That would be too much work. Everyones DVD is the same. Mass marketed copies of a single iso.

Ensnare
Oct 27, 2006, 03:16 AM
See the only reason I feel stupid is because i bought 2, one for myself and one for my brother.. i mean i have an unused copy sitting right here on my desk now due to me noticeing the no cd key right away.. at first i thought it could be encrypted but then i look at how it was packed and said i highly doubt it lol

drakkula
Oct 27, 2006, 04:34 AM
so u guys can use the same disk to play in different PCs???? OMG! what about online? just buy the GL and thats it??? Did sega go insane or what??

Skuda
Oct 27, 2006, 04:48 AM
I believe there is no CD-key for the purpose of having more than one account per person.

On GC, (and I think dreamcast), you saved your characters to a memory card, and could use multiple memory cards for your one disk.

With PSU, if people want more characters, they have to make a whole new account, which you would have to buy extra.

That's how sega is going to make the money, is with the subscriptions, not the game data itself.

Superguppie
Oct 27, 2006, 06:30 AM
ST doesn't want you to buy the game. ST just wants you to start paying your monthly fee. That's where the money is. I think the game costs 4 or 5 months subscription. Many people play over a year.

SylphKnight
Oct 28, 2006, 11:49 AM
I haven't seen this tested, but no: There is just NO KEY. All you do is register for a Sega Account, no key required.

On Sega's behalf; this is something of an act of genius! You see; most people would consider pirating the game anyway. This deters players from pirating the game (although sharing it would be the equivalent), however by doing this they open their doors to an increased number of players who most likely will pay for the online service. By ignoring one bird, they shoot another. Think of it: it's like selling a product that's free to a bunch of idiots (ie: us) then charging them a monthly fee, and if that product gets distributed then a bunch of people pay a monthly fee and Sega still made a free sale out of it all. If we can confirm that this works, I know a bunch of friends who would be willing to play the game as well.

Now, don't get me wrong: I'm GLAD I bought my copy. I contributed to something I'm proud of. However, my friends are not the type who have 50 dollars to spend on something they aren't even sure they'd like. It's like reeling in a free few subscriptions for Sega while I'm at it. Better to have a single sale and multiple subscriptions than one sale and one subscription. I still think Sega's idea was genius.

I also just realized that by doing this, Sega saved themselves a ton of cash by not having to come up with a management system regarding the CD Keys, and saved themselves money on developing, implementing the system into their production, and bandwidth for registration. All three of these things probably saved them atleast $2 or more a CD (Sega only makes about $20 a CD in profit anyways... retailers bump up the price. So in the end, Sega saved 10% on each CD by avoiding this cost. It all adds up!). Also notice that Sega did not release a large number of disks compared to most game launches despite having a large fan base. Their strategy isn't foolish: It's foolproof!


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SylphKnight on 2006-10-28 09:58 ]</font>

Ruby-chan
Oct 29, 2006, 03:12 AM
For those folks who are just bumping into this, the virtue of things such as CD Copy Protection and CD-Keys has been in debate for a while now. Way back when some very arcane copy protection methods were tried out (Anyone remember the pie-chart code things that came with some manuals?) and it turned out that games that did well had little copy protection. If people want your game they'll pay for it. If they're going to pirate it they wouldn't pay for it in the first place, and if you make your CD protection onerous you don't hurt pirates (Who'll bypass it.), you hurt you legitimate customers, who have to deal with the insane copy protection your paranoid delusion has created.

Stardock has had an interesting philosphy on Copy Protection. Here's a little piece on it. http://www.gamespot.com/news/6145864.html You'll note that even after the little incident they didn't change their policy and the game sold very well.

While I'm surprised there's no CD-key in the box, I fully applaud sega for ending the disc in the tray BS. My DVD drive is not an expensive dongle key, dammit, and we all know full well there's gobs and gobs of free tools that would let me bypass such sillyness. Now your legitimate user can go and play his game on his PC and his laptop without having to delve into tools that would be second nature to pirates.

As for CD-keys. That wouldn't have stopped anyone anyway. CD-keys have been around for a while. The day after the first CD-key was made the first CD-key generator was made. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

Oh, and since it's been mentioned: You've always been able to make one backup archival copy of software you own under US copyright law. Let me re-iterate: If you by /any kind of media/ it's perfectly legitimate to make a copy of it for yourself. This is why you can have a VCR, or photocopy a page from a book you own.

The only sticking point to this are cases where it's stipulated in EULA's that you can't copy (Since you don't buy the software, you "licence" it.) However, to my knowledge no one's ever been brought into court over making one personal backup copy of software which broke an EULA, especially since there's a fair chance the ruling could simply invalidate the current incarnation of EULA's.

kramer76
Nov 10, 2006, 08:01 PM
No CD-Key isn't really bad for the community or anything like that. It's just a slap in the face insult to people who bought retail when they only needed a license. Make the game download only or make it require a CD-Key.

SEGA must really believe that PSU is a superior product and is allowing piracy to try and net some subscriptions to offset the loss at retail. Or they're being tremendously cheap, as has been noted by other people.

No one has mentioned how useful it is as a stress test. I've got a really old video card and I'm grateful for the opportunity to actually test the game out and get a feel for it before plopping down $50. Gave me a good idea for the upgrade I need just for PSU.

With that said, SEGA could easily have released a "play for 10 days free cd-key" to try and lure new players and actually slap on a CD-Key in the legitimate copies. WoW did something similar...