JP PSU gamers are nice and all but... [Archive]

Itsuki

Nov 23, 2006, 05:11 PM

Ya, cosmos atomizer is moon atomizer X. Photon Charger Cosmos is just called Photon Charger Cosmos.

Anyways, ya, looks like you'd have to come to world 1. Now I don't wish to burst your bubble, but while american players may not say congratulations for every cosmos atomizer, pretty much all of the english speaking games will say congratulations to every single non-cosmos non-cosmos/scape board rare. Meaning, you're still going to be saying congratulations 10 times a mission.

And we always say Otsukaresama (Nice work) at the end of missions. Personally, I think its just common respect.

BooChan

Nov 23, 2006, 05:13 PM

Thats just the way the japanse is.Honorifics are apart of the society.

-Shimarisu-

Nov 23, 2006, 05:24 PM

I just got tired of playing with really nice, chatty people who after a while would say something like "I really love PSU, because it has no foreigners on it."

Happened to me three times, seriously fuck the Japanese PSU market, nobody ever said stuff like that on PSO.

Itsuki

Nov 23, 2006, 05:31 PM

And you think the americans are any better? If anything, the US/EU crowd is worse. Either way, there will always be idiots. The japanese will atleast (generally speaking) treat you nicely even if they don't like you. I wouldn't be suprised if in some american parties you got kicked for being courteous because the party leader hates people that talk to much.

Bleemo

Nov 23, 2006, 05:37 PM

On 2006-11-23 14:31, Itsuki-chan wrote:
And you think the americans are any better? If anything, the US/EU crowd is worse. Either way, there will always be idiots. The japanese will atleast (generally speaking) treat you nicely even if they don't like you. I wouldn't be suprised if in some american parties you got kicked for being courteous because the party leader hates people that talk to much.

Japanese are known to be racist. VERY racist. If you honestly believe the Japanese will treat you nicer, you haven't played FFXI with them. NA/EU usually are completely fine playing with other countries.

I honestly can't wait to see how the Japanese react toward playing with the NA/EU on the Xbox 360 version. Being forced to play with people from other countries without any means of identifying their race before playing with them is exactly what they need.

-Shimarisu-

Nov 23, 2006, 05:38 PM

^Don't think I sit in with your opinion please. You're quite wrong. The Final Fantasy market sounds like it was just shit. PSO was great. Differernt games/consoles attract different players. PSO was marketted as a global game, it caught a large population of non racists. PSU is on the PS2, arguiably a console owned by a lot of dumb, selfish kids the world over. It was marketted as a closed, JP-only game. That's gonna make racist retards flock to it like flies on shit.

I've never been kicked on US (edit - whoops I was kicked once, booted when I joined without a word, which was so weird I forgot about it), and I find idiots quite amusing actually.

Least I can pour scorn on idiots on US without getting blacklisted by most the damn game and my name spread about as a troublemaker.

Sometimes I need to be able to switch between both enviroments. But if you thought the JP crowd was as friendly as on PSO, you're sadly mistaken. To that I say "LOL, rude idiot PS2 owning kids."

I blame the PS2, oh and 2chan. Fuck 2chan for teaching the JP internet that it's great to be an asshole.

US and JP have equal amounts of idiots, JP just trains its idiots better not to fling their monkey shit. That's changing though online, and I guess it depresses me.

[ This Message was edited by: -Shimarisu- on 2006-11-23 14:46 ]

Choja

Nov 23, 2006, 05:40 PM

On 2006-11-23 14:37, Bleemo wrote:

On 2006-11-23 14:31, Itsuki-chan wrote:
And you think the americans are any better? If anything, the US/EU crowd is worse. Either way, there will always be idiots. The japanese will atleast (generally speaking) treat you nicely even if they don't like you. I wouldn't be suprised if in some american parties you got kicked for being courteous because the party leader hates people that talk to much.

Japanese are known to be racist. VERY racist. If you honestly believe the Japanese will treat you nicer, you haven't played FFXI with them. NA/EU usually are completely fine playing with other countries.

I honestly can't wait to see how the Japanese react toward playing with the NA/EU on the Xbox 360 version. Being forced to play with people from other countries without any means of identifying their race before playing with them is exactly what they need.

This, sir, is why we're awful. Those delicious stereotypes those. I lost already.

Just woke up from a nap, and look what I see. Wouldn't their Partner Card say so?

Bleemo

Nov 23, 2006, 05:45 PM

On 2006-11-23 14:40, Choja wrote:
This, sir, is why we're awful. Those delicious stereotypes those. I lost already.

Just woke up from a nap, and look what I see. Wouldn't their Partner Card say so?

I'm not about to delve into which stereotypes are correct, and which are not, but in FFXI the Japanese treated NA horribly. I have never been so racially detested in my life during my time playing FFXI. I have read plenty of disgusting, racists stories that came from the JP on FFXI.

Notice, I said "without any means of identifying their race before playing with them". To get their Partner Card would require them to play. Also, I'm sure you will see plenty of "JP only" titled missions on the Xbox 360 version.

BooChan

Nov 23, 2006, 05:45 PM

I wouldn't consider the japanese racist but they are just preferential. Meaning they prefer to be among themselves. Because their society is based on harmony and coutesy our society is based on you choose to treat people based on what mood we are in. To them americans are very boorish and rude. And they are right. And we are even worse on the internet. Now if the Japanese forced foreigners to sit in the back of buses,lynched them,, and denied them basic human rights. Then I wil consider the japanese racists. Stuck up, proud, discriminating and a bit condescendng the japanese are but they are not racist in regards to the american definition of racism or doing racist actions.

Choja

Nov 23, 2006, 05:52 PM

On 2006-11-23 14:45, BooChan wrote:
I wouldn't consider the japanese racist but they are just preferential. Meaning they prefer to be among themselves. Because their society is based on harmony and coutesy our society is based on you choose to treat people based on what mood we are in. To them americans are very boorish and rude. And they are right. And we are even worse on the internet. Now if the Japanese forced foreigners to sit in the back of buses,lynched them,, and denied them basic human rights. Then I wil consider the japanese racists. Stuck up, proud, discriminating and a bit condescendng the japanese are but they are not racist in regards to the american definition of racism or doing racist actions.

You just extended my discussion to salv-
Wait, I've said that before? Must be deja vu.

I don't think I'll be able to fit in the conversation. Sorry. o_x

Note: You guys are near the zone where it stops being good and suddenly starts being personal attacks on a race, which isn't great.

-Shimarisu-

Nov 23, 2006, 05:54 PM

Haha the old "What happened on FFXI shows the world what Japanese are truly like" argument.

That one's a classic. What if they are basing their opinion of what Americans are tru;ly like, on their behaviour in-game? Think that's why there might be "JP only" games?

Americans don't know how to play courteously, as a whole. Their entire method of play fucks with the methods favoured by the japanese. Except now you can force courteous play, you have randomised rares, and a kick function to get rid of morons spouting abuse. So it's a moot point.

The attitudes of Japanese on PSU are based on changing attitudes on the Japanese internet, and the fact that it's a less mature crowd this time. Surely the importers CAN'T have missed the spamming that's quite prevalent in jp uni 1?

I think it's changed for the worse, but if I want to interact with Japanese I can just walk out of my door. And they aren't the shower of retards I often encounter on PSU.

The US market on PSU has improved since PSO. The JP market has got worse. The US market may well STILL be worse, but it won't depress me as much as the JP market getting worse does, and like I say if I kick idiots on US I won't get a bad name for it, but on JP I CERTAINLY WOULD.

That's not the real reason I came to US though.

[ This Message was edited by: -Shimarisu- on 2006-11-23 14:57 ]

therealAERO

Nov 23, 2006, 06:02 PM

I personally don't have that much trouble with the japanese. But my other friends have had previous encounters that they told me about. Stuff I shouldn't even say on this forum

Bleemo

Nov 23, 2006, 06:15 PM

On 2006-11-23 14:54, -Shimarisu- wrote:
Haha the old "What happened on FFXI shows the world what Japanese are truly like" argument.

That one's a classic. What if they are basing their opinion of what Americans are tru;ly like, on their behaviour in-game? Think that's why there might be "JP only" games?

Americans don't know how to play courteously, as a whole. Their entire method of play fucks with the methods favoured by the japanese. Except now you can force courteous play, you have randomised rares, and a kick function to get rid of morons spouting abuse. So it's a moot point.

The attitudes of Japanese on PSU are based on changing attitudes on the Japanese internet, and the fact that it's a less mature crowd this time. Surely the importers CAN'T have missed the spamming that's quite prevalent in jp uni 1?

I think it's changed for the worse, but if I want to interact with Japanese I can just walk out of my door. And they aren't the shower of retards I often encounter on PSU.

The US market on PSU has improved since PSO. The JP market has got worse. The US market may well STILL be worse, but it won't depress me as much as the JP market getting worse does, and like I say if I kick idiots on US I won't get a bad name for it, but on JP I CERTAINLY WOULD.

That's not the real reason I came to US though.

[ This Message was edited by: -Shimarisu- on 2006-11-23 14:57 ]

I wouldn't stereotype the entire race based on FFXI, but simply most of their market. PSU's market virtually would be the same as FFXI's, and what happens all over FFXI in abundance is easily enough to stereotype their general gamer's attitude toward playing with other countries.

I'm not JP, I couldn't tell you exactly what JP think of American gamers and their impression of them, but in all honesty it can't be any worse than the JP's image. JP just generally do not like playing with other countries for cultural reasons, so they will deny them in their parties, and even sometimes cause all sorts of racial slurs(Which I saw way too much of.).

I'm not sure how much you've experienced playing with the JP on FFXI, but it was pretty clear they were limiting their parties to JP only for their own personal fear of playing with other countries rather than their image of NA players. Sure, it is highly understandable why they would, but it's just not good sportsmanship. I have never met any westerner not willing to play and enjoy the game with players from other countries.

I'm far from complimenting the US market because of this, though, because US gamers do a great job giving their kin a moronic image across the world, however the willingness to play with other countries is much different.

VanHalen

Nov 23, 2006, 09:04 PM

On 2006-11-23 14:45, BooChan wrote:
I wouldn't consider the japanese racist but they are just preferential. Meaning they prefer to be among themselves. Because their society is based on harmony and coutesy our society is based on you choose to treat people based on what mood we are in. To them americans are very boorish and rude. And they are right. And we are even worse on the internet. Now if the Japanese forced foreigners to sit in the back of buses,lynched them,, and denied them basic human rights. Then I wil consider the japanese racists. Stuck up, proud, discriminating and a bit condescendng the japanese are but they are not racist in regards to the american definition of racism or doing racist actions.

hey americans created the internet and we created the rules to be boorish and rude http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif and yet you may have a point about american people doesnt mean the rest of the world is better japan has signs in train stations that say beware of perverts. and other countries have their own problems that we hear about on the news

Kuai

Nov 23, 2006, 10:51 PM

If you all love Japan so much why don't you just move there.

DoubleJG

Nov 23, 2006, 10:58 PM

On 2006-11-23 19:51, Kuai wrote:
If you all love Japan so much why don't you just move there.

I wish I could http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif Asian women are cute.

Back on topic, the FFXI JP community WAS very racist against American players because we were seen as "inferior" to them, and the ability to communicate was very very helpful. So, JP tried to stick with JP only.

As for PSO, English and JP players could get along quite well. The only main reason why PSOJP players ever avoided english players was because majority of the US community cheated online. I ALWAYS prefered playing in a JP game on PSO simply because they were never item hogs as American players were. And, if they ever said anything negative to me, I couldn't understand it in the first place lol.

Yet, if the PSUJP community is a bother to you, well, come join the PSUE community. It really isn't all that bad http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Natasha_M

Nov 23, 2006, 11:09 PM

Look if you hate Japanese so much then abolish all that is japanese..
Thats right.. all your Playstations..Sony tvs.. Cars.. and even PSU cause they are japanese products..
The reason why JP avoid E is because E players are now famous for cheats, rude gestures and no purpose harrassment. If you can't see that then well you are just cruel yourself.
Wheres the E see crimes and gunshooting as "cool" the japanese don't really they perferr etiquette and supportive gameplay. Seriously why play a online community game and spread the hate. If ya hate them then just stick with your own friends...If you have friends that is then there should be no problem gee.

Choja

Nov 23, 2006, 11:28 PM

On 2006-11-23 20:09, Natasha_M wrote:
Look if you hate Japanese so much then abolish all that is japanese..
Thats right.. all your Playstations..Sony tvs.. Cars.. and even PSU cause they are japanese products..
The reason why JP avoid E is because E players are now famous for cheats, rude gestures and no purpose harrassment. If you can't see that then well you are just cruel yourself.
Wheres the E see crimes and gunshooting as "cool" the japanese don't really they perferr etiquette and supportive gameplay. Seriously why play a online community game and spread the hate. If ya hate them then just stick with your own friends...If you have friends that is then there should be no problem gee.

Can you reload my common sense/logic cannon for me? Thank you very much! ^_^

Conversation over. It should stop right after this sentence.

Spellbinder

Nov 23, 2006, 11:41 PM

This is truly a shame. All he wanted was to meet some people to play with, and it turned into a flame war.

But, as Kamica stated before, there are a fair amount of players on World 1. I've hosted a few meet & greets to get people together and exchange cards, so now we have an idea of who's staying and who's not on World 1. So, if you don't mind making a new character, feel free to drop by sometime.

daylight129

Nov 23, 2006, 11:44 PM

Or you can pick, I think, a better alternative. Support our SEGA and...

Buy US PSU

Slitz

Nov 23, 2006, 11:50 PM

Phantasy Star is racist. ;D
Obviously, none of you remember NK. ;l
And the fact that the JPs of PS usually kept on their own little servers.
If Phantasy Star was as diverse as you actually say, then we'd all be happy on one little gay server.

Shazbot

Nov 24, 2006, 12:13 AM

So uhm, yeah, remember how the guy who orignally posted this topic was just wondering if there were any JPSU World 2 English speakers out there? That was cool, I think.

I dunno if I could move to World 1. I like how things are generally cheaper but I just don't think I could raise another 3 PMs without shooting myself in the face first.

Oh but...being able to communicate in English....*bites nails* I suppose I could go back to playing both Worlds...

Shit. Okay people. Tell me where I should look for you on World 1 and I'll try my best to find you. Message me if that's easier too.

Kamica

Nov 24, 2006, 02:01 AM

On 2006-11-23 21:13, Shazbot wrote:

So uhm, yeah, remember how the guy who orignally posted this topic was just wondering if there were any JPSU World 2 English speakers out there? That was cool, I think.

I dunno if I could move to World 1. I like how things are generally cheaper but I just don't think I could raise another 3 PMs without shooting myself in the face first.

Oh but...being able to communicate in English....*bites nails* I suppose I could go back to playing both Worlds...

Shit. Okay people. Tell me where I should look for you on World 1 and I'll try my best to find you. Message me if that's easier too.

It would be easier to arrange a meeting if you had instant messaging.

But...importers tend to hang around universe42 often

sepa

Nov 24, 2006, 02:43 AM

>>Japanese are known to be racist. VERY racist. If you honestly believe the Japanese will treat you nicer, you haven't played FFXI with them. NA/EU usually are completely fine playing with other countries.<<

Other people have been trying to point out to you, in a nice way, that you are a moron. Get out more, and dont say "Japanese are known to be racist" , cause you had bad experiences with Japanese people in a video game.
On a side note, i'll stand alone and say id much rather play with people who are respectful and polite than some of these annoying kiddies on US servers. Waiting in a lobby on a US server means you get to see some dumb kid typing in fuk over and over and thinking hes funny for doing it , or get to see another kid typing in rap lyrics and thinkin hes impressing someone. Those are the people who annoy me. Not people who say hi and thank you.

Natasha_M

Nov 24, 2006, 04:04 AM

Its funny though its usually the E or G or S or whatever non J player that invades J servers and then call them racist?? First of all you invaded! you have your own servers on PSO yet deserted them to invade J. Its obvious they can't speak english so its not like theres much they can do to talk to you. As far as my experiences go I am able to play with J because i speak J, when i see a random E invade all they do is wreck havoc. Beg for items and spam. Yet the J hardly even retaliate one bit if worst comes to worst they just desert the E in the game and remake another.

So yeh if they are racist because they avoid E players then tough, cause you can hardly blame them. This might also be the reason why Sega seperated the servers for J and E on PS2/PC.
You can imagine the attitude especailly on the PS2/PC platform.. you know the crime spree GTA lovers (no offence its a great game)

Bleemo

Nov 24, 2006, 07:22 AM

On 2006-11-23 23:43, sepa wrote:
>>Japanese are known to be racist. VERY racist. If you honestly believe the Japanese will treat you nicer, you haven't played FFXI with them. NA/EU usually are completely fine playing with other countries.<<

Other people have been trying to point out to you, in a nice way, that you are a moron. Get out more, and dont say "Japanese are known to be racist" , cause you had bad experiences with Japanese people in a video game.
On a side note, i'll stand alone and say id much rather play with people who are respectful and polite than some of these annoying kiddies on US servers. Waiting in a lobby on a US server means you get to see some dumb kid typing in fuk over and over and thinking hes funny for doing it , or get to see another kid typing in rap lyrics and thinkin hes impressing someone. Those are the people who annoy me. Not people who say hi and thank you.

You are a moron.

Don't post again.

-Shimarisu-

Nov 24, 2006, 08:04 AM

On 2006-11-23 19:51, Kuai wrote:
If you all love Japan so much why don't you just move there.

Hi.

I did.

sepa

Nov 24, 2006, 12:50 PM

>>You are a moron.

Don't post again.<<

Good job not only did you prove you are ignorant, but also an internet tough guy. Please, keep going i need the laugh.

HiKeRI

Nov 24, 2006, 01:06 PM

Japanese are nice people, they are racist by the moment they see something that bothers them, if you are not a nice person towards them then that is what you'll expect from them, also the japanese hated NA people on FFXI because not only did they act that well but they begged too damn much, and asked to many q's or always needed help from others or simply because they don't just want to bond with you while you are trying to force them to bond with you, i was on a JP LS and thats how i saw things around not only with the NA but sometimes inside the ls (as in themself - The JP-) in the end once they see that your worth talking to or being around with then thats how you gain the JP friendship. (Although there are many nice JP people outthere that don't make you go thru all that stuff) Hell i remember when it was only about 1 month of joining the LS and when they come up with the -[Leader of LS starts talking with LS members] then - Al, yuo lot noe plz (weird happy jp face) and bang a Kirins Osode.

Pure-chan

Nov 24, 2006, 01:45 PM

I'm really disappointed that the servers are separate. A bunch of pages on my card list were JP players and I was hoping that we'd be able to find each other again on psu.

Still, I can understand why ST chose to separate the servers. For the people crying foul over JP players saying that they 'prefer psu's JP only servers' -- please think back to the gc days, when US hackers (like xXsanjuroXx) would actively hunt down and bulk-corrupt JP players by restting the lobbies, then FSODing players as the initial lobby-burst gamesave would trigger...

Yeah.

I stopped playing PSO mid-2005, but I can still think of a good 10-20 US/EU hackers/coders who were notorious for being total jerkoffs. Can anyone on this topic list off even five jp players that were well known for harrassing and/or damaging behavior?

It's a shame that the actions caused by some of the US/EU population managed to effect all of us; however, to ignore the fact that those actions reflect on us, you would need to either be in denial, or have missed the decline of PSO entirely.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/panda.gif ...The panda agrees with me.

[ This Message was edited by: Pure-chan on 2006-11-24 12:47 ]

Doh42

Nov 24, 2006, 01:59 PM

Japanese players, even in Final Fantasy 11 were often the most kind, generous, funny and amicable person I've met. They would never turn down a stranger in need, they always would stick together, even for "stupid" things, like going out in Batallia Downs to see the snow (it only snows during "winter" of FF11 in that zone; I happened to be farming, and told my japanese LS members that, and they make a get-together for screen shots with me)

Of course, you will see a lot of them, especially during NA peak hours (which would be early morning in Japan; read: KIDS) who don't understand english, aren't curteous and are both more noobish than most "american nooblet". A 7 year-old japanese kid playing is mostly not as good as a 27-year old american gamer, both at communication, team-work, curtesy, etc...

If you want to play with "fun" japanese players, you have to be playing at 6-18 AM (EST).

I have made lots of friends from Japan in Final Fantasy 11. Many that I wish I could go and visit in person, because of their kindness. So please, the problem isn't the japanese people... It isn't really us either; it's more culture clashing, and the "fear" of stereotypes. Once both parties get to know each other, everything works fine.

Then again, I am a very polite person, I try to learn as much japanese as I can, and I would help them learn how to write english properly, while they'd help my japanese skills.

ezcactus

Nov 24, 2006, 04:50 PM

Oh boy, I've had to deal with enough of this crap from FFXI.

America has assholes.

Japan has assholes.

Sure there are nice people out there, but that doesn't mean they all are. Most people use stereotypes to judge others. The average american kid probably thinks that every Japanese person is an ancient ninja that constantly pout off ancient proverbs while watching anime or playing video games. Mainly this is how American TV portrays them.

But if you think this ignorance is restricted to only America, then you're wrong. Most Japanese get their view of America from the same TVs. Most kids over there watch MTV and other crap and think all Americans are egoistical gun totting gangstas with 50 inch rims on our rides, shooting up punks and keep it real. Or Warmongering overall wearing hillbillies that constantly yell "kil dem towel heads!"

There are open minded people on both sides of the pond, you just have to find them.

Now I know some people will say "But cactus, every single Japanese person I've played with is so nice and friendly!"

The reason it seems this way, is because it's mostly the open minded people that will interact and talk with you. The nice guys will gladly party and chat with you. The ignorant will generally not even bother you once they discover you've foreign. This makes it seem as if they're all nice, but really, it's only the nice ones that will... well... be nice.

Summary: Not every Japanese player is an ancient samurai warrior sitting at a computer. They're Geeks and Fat arse nerds just like you and me.

Golto

Nov 24, 2006, 05:25 PM

I was in a party that had some congrats here and there but one person kept on saying shut up. I guess the party leader was a friend of this jerk so the party dissolved.

Looks like someone forgot about ww2 up there. The Japanese and Nazis were very mutually adrimable to each other because of their 'superior race' stances. Japanese used Chinese for live disections and Korean women as sex slaves because they were racially superior. You can't say Japanese aren't racists but every group in the world has some racism.

Bleemo

Nov 24, 2006, 06:20 PM

Log on to FFXI, search for any JP player you can, write down as many party comments with the words "JP only" in them as you can. Then, search for as many NA players as you can with the words "NA only."

After finding zero NA with this comment, and most JP with this comment, explain how this is not discriminatory.

It's bad sportsmanship to be completely unwilling for the most part to play with other nationalities. Culture or not, just about every culture that is able to play FFXI has been openly willing to play with other nationalities to a great extent, except the JP. When it comes to their own culture, they simply don't like outsiders in it. This is including their online games. It's rude; discriminatory; and not something that any gamer should condone. Even how understandable it is given their culture, that doesn't mean it's the correct way to think or act.

Personal experiences aside, the correct debate would be aimed toward their general market, not the few(or many) that you have had good experiences with.

[ This Message was edited by: Bleemo on 2006-11-24 15:25 ]

Bleemo

Nov 24, 2006, 06:24 PM

Double post.

[ This Message was edited by: Bleemo on 2006-11-24 15:25 ]

Spellbinder

Nov 24, 2006, 06:32 PM

On 2006-11-24 15:20, Bleemo wrote:
Log on to FFXI, search for any JP player you can, write down as many party comments with the words "JP only" in them as you can. Then, search for as many NA players as you can with the words "NA only."

After finding zero NA with this comment, and most JP with this comment, explain how this is not discriminatory.

I didn't wanna get dragged into this whole JP discussion, but I'll give it a shot.

Out of all the JP players whose comments said "JP only", how many of them were you able to say to them "I'm not from Japan, but I do speak Japanese, is that alright?"

You'd be surprised how many party invites you'll get if you can speak their language. From my three years of playing on FFXI, I made quite a few JP friends, and I did ask them, why do alot of JP players do what they do, not playing with English players. I would always get one of three answers.

1.) They like to be able to communicate in their own language.
- Let's face it, depending on what you're doing and where you're going to level up, you need to communicate with your team, and thanks to FFXI's very very poor translation system, it's not that easy unless everyone speaks the same language.

2.) Due to cultural differences, English players come of as rude to Japanese players or, they really are just that rude.
- When the game first released things were pretty peachy, but (I'm sure I'll get flamed) a while after the PS2 release things started to turn a little sour. Maybe it was the PS2 players, or maybe a combonation of English speaking noobs from PC and PS2 but you have to admit, English speaking players tend to be abit more rude and quite frankly, alot of JP players got tired of it.

3.) A combonation of #1 and #2.

So ya, it's not entirely discrimination. People will party with who they think they'll have an easier time. I mean really, is it that practical to have 6 people trying to function as a unit when none of them can understand each other?

HiKeRI

Nov 24, 2006, 06:51 PM

On 2006-11-24 15:32, Spellbinder wrote:

On 2006-11-24 15:20, Bleemo wrote:
Log on to FFXI, search for any JP player you can, write down as many party comments with the words "JP only" in them as you can. Then, search for as many NA players as you can with the words "NA only."

After finding zero NA with this comment, and most JP with this comment, explain how this is not discriminatory.

I didn't wanna get dragged into this whole JP discussion, but I'll give it a shot.

Out of all the JP players whose comments said "JP only", how many of them were you able to say to them "I'm not from Japan, but I do speak Japanese, is that alright?"

You'd be surprised how many party invites you'll get if you can speak their language. From my three years of playing on FFXI, I made quite a few JP friends, and I did ask them, why do alot of JP players do what they do, not playing with English players. I would always get one of three answers.

1.) They like to be able to communicate in their own language.
- Let's face it, depending on what you're doing and where you're going to level up, you need to communicate with your team, and thanks to FFXI's very very poor translation system, it's not that easy unless everyone speaks the same language.

2.) Due to cultural differences, English players come of as rude to Japanese players or, they really are just that rude.
- When the game first released things were pretty peachy, but (I'm sure I'll get flamed) a while after the PS2 release things started to turn a little sour. Maybe it was the PS2 players, or maybe a combonation of English speaking noobs from PC and PS2 but you have to admit, English speaking players tend to be abit more rude and quite frankly, alot of JP players got tired of it.

3.) A combonation of #1 and #2.

So ya, it's not entirely discrimination. People will party with who they think they'll have an easier time. I mean really, is it that practical to have 6 people trying to function as a unit when none of them can understand each other?

I back this up.

Bleemo

Nov 24, 2006, 07:02 PM

On 2006-11-24 15:32, Spellbinder wrote:
Out of all the JP players whose comments said "JP only", how many of them were you able to say to them "I'm not from Japan, but I do speak Japanese, is that alright?"

You'd be surprised how many party invites you'll get if you can speak their language. From my three years of playing on FFXI, I made quite a few JP friends, and I did ask them, why do alot of JP players do what they do, not playing with English players. I would always get one of three answers.

1.) They like to be able to communicate in their own language.
- Let's face it, depending on what you're doing and where you're going to level up, you need to communicate with your team, and thanks to FFXI's very very poor translation system, it's not that easy unless everyone speaks the same language.

2.) Due to cultural differences, English players come of as rude to Japanese players or, they really are just that rude.
- When the game first released things were pretty peachy, but (I'm sure I'll get flamed) a while after the PS2 release things started to turn a little sour. Maybe it was the PS2 players, or maybe a combonation of English speaking noobs from PC and PS2 but you have to admit, English speaking players tend to be abit more rude and quite frankly, alot of JP players got tired of it.

3.) A combonation of #1 and #2.

So ya, it's not entirely discrimination. People will party with who they think they'll have an easier time. I mean really, is it that practical to have 6 people trying to function as a unit when none of them can understand each other?

Heres the issue:

JP are the only ones unwilling to play with others who cannot speak their language. This follows up with my statement of bad sportsmanship. Also, the only communication really needed to grind with is available with the auto translate function--no one should have any troubles telling someone what to do as far as gameplay is concerned.

Of course, it's understandable, if someone can't speak your language it is difficult to communicate with them--but does that mean you should reject playing with them all together? This is not something that should be supported.

In all honesty, I can't see how the JP would deem NA too rude to play with, especially when they are always open to play with them. I think of this more as JP's shyness or fear. I'm not going to deny the NA market is rude in general, but I can also argue about the encounters of JP rudeness. Despite who is rude, in the end, who is willing to play with the other to associate?

We're both bound by a culture--that doesn't mean any culture should be unwilling to play with another unless there has been direct attacks on their person. To completely outright reject another culture is absurd in my opinion, how understandable it is or not.

_Deliverance_

Nov 24, 2006, 07:45 PM

This thread is stupid.

HiKeRI

Nov 24, 2006, 07:51 PM

They do it because they want to even if you like it or not, ive been invited to many JP Party's and like said above they maybe had the JP Only thing on it but i knew little JP they let me in the party for just knowing how to say Hello, Good Bye and Thank You. Just because they want to play with there own culture don't mean they are arrogant or lame/anti-social or so, they do it because they want to whenever you like it or not, its like if i want to solo i'll solo even if someone wants to come along to play with me, because its the mood i am.

susaru

Nov 24, 2006, 07:57 PM

online is different ,being in there country is another thing. i f u research online u find that japanese people or only tolerent of there own people. Even if u spk there language it means nothing . Especially if u are a kokjin , african american trying to live in japan, they always say stay in tokyo and dont wander to nara, okinawa, etc. Because most of the older generation dont like americans because of the war. Its not an opinion its a known fact,

Typhoeus

Nov 24, 2006, 09:49 PM

On 2006-11-23 20:09, Natasha_M wrote:
The reason why JP avoid E is because E players are now famous for cheats, rude gestures and no purpose harrassment. If you can't see that then well you are just cruel yourself.

Sorry this is a couple pages back but....HA HA HA and HA. JP players are even more famous for cheats, ESPECIALLY in FFXI (which seems to be the most common analogy here). Who where the first to mod .dat files?....JP. Who where the first to create a universal Flee Tool?...JP. Who created Mr. Argus to auto-teleport and instantly claim NM's that the gil-sellers still use to this day?...JP. Who created Tobihane to POS teleport letting you harvest and mine 100x faster than a normal player could?...JP. More important than assumptions are personal experiences by individuals. What you need to see is the truths that are being argued by Bleemo, yet he is continuously getting flamed. Yay.

[ This Message was edited by: Typhoeus on 2006-11-24 18:51 ]

MaKaVeLi_X

Nov 25, 2006, 02:38 AM

On 2006-11-23 19:51, Kuai wrote:
If you all love Japan so much why don't you just move there.

Lol, Eh JPs bieng racist wasnt just on FFXI, it was also on pso dc. I can remember bieng told to leave and the JP only stuff way back on DC.

Ryogen

Nov 25, 2006, 02:44 AM

On 2006-11-23 14:37, Bleemo wrote:

On 2006-11-23 14:31, Itsuki-chan wrote:
And you think the americans are any better? If anything, the US/EU crowd is worse. Either way, there will always be idiots. The japanese will atleast (generally speaking) treat you nicely even if they don't like you. I wouldn't be suprised if in some american parties you got kicked for being courteous because the party leader hates people that talk to much.

Japanese are known to be racist. VERY racist. If you honestly believe the Japanese will treat you nicer, you haven't played FFXI with them. NA/EU usually are completely fine playing with other countries.

I honestly can't wait to see how the Japanese react toward playing with the NA/EU on the Xbox 360 version. Being forced to play with people from other countries without any means of identifying their race before playing with them is exactly what they need.

Your basing that a race is racist becuase of your experience in a game. You need to get out more and that is just plain iggnorance. No offence bro but, but you deserve what's comming to you. You just baised the whole Japanese race is racist off a online game. Get out of here and actually learn about people before you talk.

[ This Message was edited by: Ryogen on 2006-11-25 00:04 ]

Bleemo

Nov 25, 2006, 07:09 AM

On 2006-11-24 23:44, Ryogen wrote:
Your basing that a race is racist becuase of your experience in a game. You need to get out more and that is just plain iggnorance. No offence bro but, but you deserve what's comming to you. You just baised the whole Japanese race is racist off a online game. Get out of here and actually learn about people before you talk.

Read everything I posted here before you post.

I merely comment on my experiences, but my arguments are not based on experiences.

I wish ignorant folk would take the time to read threads before they post.

Bezmor

Nov 25, 2006, 07:30 AM

Well first of all i dont think the purpose of this site was to debate Japanese racism. But seeing as i am Japanese i have to say that i dont think they are all that rasist. Ive seen some examples of it but not enough to say the are evil. And as for moving to japan you really should to see first hand how they are. Ive seen a random japanese person walk up to an american and offer assistance finding where to go.

Lashiens

Nov 25, 2006, 07:37 AM

Great googily moogily. This entire thread is the stupidest thing I have EVER read on the internet. And I've read some pretty stupid stuff on the interwebs.

American/European Players (including myself): Get your heads out of your collective butts.

Japanese/Importers (also, again, including myself): Get your heads out of your collective butts.

Stop throwing "racist" and "racism" around like it's some kind of simple answer to why. Maybe it's because everyone, in their whole, is

ONE GIANT COLLECTIVE ASSHOLE.

That's right, I said. EVERYONE, the world over, no matter what race, creed, color, or culture, contains at least 1 asshole, and I guarantee at least 10,000 more assholes that know THAT particular asshole. I don't even want to get into the mathematics of it.

My goodness. You people should be ashamed of yourselves. This isn't about saving the world, this isn't some kind of pressing issue of the day. IT'S A VIDEO GAME (even though I take games pretty seriously, but that's besides the point).

Do you know WHY people don't play with other people? It's because different play styles clash. That's it. Nothing more. You don't like someone's play style? Fine. Walk away and find someone that does. It's that simple. Stop trying to turn this into something it isn't, stop making excuses for your poor behavior.

I mean, damn. Just DAMN. This is stupid. I have to deal with racism ENOUGH in my real life, why should I go to a game, which I use to get AWAY from real life's problems, just to walk smack dab back into the middle of it? The lot of you, grow up. And I know a damn good chunk of you are well old enough to be into the range of deductive and logical reasoning.

Now, if a mod could just come by and convieniently lock this thread, we can put this utter stupidity behind us and TRY to act like rational, thinking adults. At least SOME of us, anyway.

[ This Message was edited by: Lashiens on 2006-11-25 04:43 ]

Bezmor

Nov 25, 2006, 07:43 AM

Maybe its time for a mod to lock this thread.

Ryogen

Nov 25, 2006, 11:10 AM

On 2006-11-25 04:09, Bleemo wrote:

On 2006-11-24 23:44, Ryogen wrote:
Your basing that a race is racist becuase of your experience in a game. You need to get out more and that is just plain iggnorance. No offence bro but, but you deserve what's comming to you. You just baised the whole Japanese race is racist off a online game. Get out of here and actually learn about people before you talk.

Read everything I posted here before you post.

I merely comment on my experiences, but my arguments are not based on experiences.

I wish ignorant folk would take the time to read threads before they post.

Ignorance has nothing to do with reading a thread. Watch your words then. Yeah I did read though the whole thread after making the point, put my post remains valid. Try not to sound so shallow when you make a post like that, but you know that your experiences don't subject to the whole race. That is how people usually become racist anyway. 1 experience changes the whole outlook on how a one looks at another.

Paul_pso

Nov 25, 2006, 11:18 AM

Hmmm, iv RARELY met any japanese players that speak any english (comprehendable anyway) however the ones i have spoken to have generally been fine with me... this experience is from pso tho, there was this one chick i met on DC PSO called Ami... that was like 5 years ago... And we still talk over msn after all this time! cool eh? anyway...

Bleemo

Nov 25, 2006, 12:27 PM

On 2006-11-25 08:10, Ryogen wrote:
Ignorance has nothing to do with reading a thread. Watch your words then. Yeah I did read though the whole thread after making the point, put my post remains valid. Try not to sound so shallow when you make a post like that, but you know that your experiences don't subject to the whole race. That is how people usually become racist anyway. 1 experience changes the whole outlook on how a one looks at another.

I didn't want to have to do this, but:

ig-no-rance
–noun
the state or fact of being ignorant; lack of knowledge, learning, information, etc.

Not reading threads and realizing my standpoint on the argument = ignorance. The fact that you quoted the very first post I made on this thread really points out that you didn't read anything--but your word against mine, right?

Your point doesn't remain valid, as it was a false accusation. No where have I based my arguments off of personal experiences.

I'm not sounding shallow as much as I'm trying to debate. Everyone is absolutely insistent on flaming me rather than analyzing my arguments and producing a half-way decent counter argument. If you disagree, please, give a good reason to, otherwise just don't post.