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Gamemako
Dec 7, 2006, 06:04 PM
To put this issue to rest, I'm creating a poll as to which race makes the best wartecher. This is meant to be judged objectively, but it does eventually boil down to preference, so truly the correct answer is "there is no best." However, in the spirit of fun, on to the details:

HUMAN:

Pros:
-Balanced abilities
-Second highest TAP
-Decent ATP
-Stat bonus for class/race combo

Cons:
-No racial ability (SUV/Nanoblast)
-Doesn't specialize in anything

NEWMAN:

Pros:
-Highest TP for best tech power
-Good ATA to offset horrible Wartecher ATA
-Good EVP and MST
-Stat bonus for class/race combo

Cons:
-No racial ability
-Abysmal ATP
-Low HP and DFP

CAST:

Pros:
-Best ATA to offset Wartecher penalty
-Best DFP and good HP
-SUV weapons
-Good ATP

Cons:
-Terrible TP prevents equipping decent wands
-Poor EVP and MST
-No race/class combo stat bonus

BEAST:

Pros:
-Best HP and ATP
-Good DFP
-Nanoblast
-High HP is good for HP-based spells

Cons:
-Terrible ATA means attacking from behind is a must
-Poor ATA prevents use of bows
-Relatively poor TP and EVP
-No race/class combo stat bonus


The order is from left to right from the PSUpedia page. Don't complain to me about beasts being last or humans being first or any of that crap.

Yes, I left CASTs off of the tie votes. I sincerely doubt they will get many votes because they lack an essential part of the class (that is, the 'techer' part). And I only have 9 slots. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

If there is something I missed, post and I will add it.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Gamemako on 2006-12-07 16:37 ]</font>

Legenden
Dec 7, 2006, 06:55 PM
BEAST:

Cons:
-Terrible ATA means attacking from behind is a must
-Relatively poor TP
-No race/class combo stat bonus

You forgot their poor EVP. Wartecher is the class with the highest EVP, beast negates this advantage. I know some people might not like to evade attacks becouse they break Photon arts.

Another note about the beasts poor ATA: One of the most interesting weapons Wartecher gets is the bow, but they won`t be any good for beasts becuse of their low ATA witch I think is worth to mention..

edit: Wartecher EVP=2nd best

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Legenden on 2006-12-07 17:25 ]</font>

KiteWolfwood
Dec 7, 2006, 07:05 PM
Wartecher is one of the classes I feel that does not matter what race you choose. Why? Because with wartecher you can either go melee or magic. All the races can do one or the other really well or humans who do both equally.

Nayte
Dec 7, 2006, 07:14 PM
I dont get the last option since wartechers can use spears.
Anyway, I think the beast ATA is over-exaggerating a bit. Are you honeslty telling me that a beast a wont be able to attack from the front what-so-ever. If so, then proof please.
Oh and i thought Fortetechers had the highest EVP.
Might want to add crea weapons in there somewhere maybe. Since wartechers seem like they could be one of the best (if not THE best) solo classes, crea weapons would give a good advantage.

I would personally go with human or newman for the best class for wartecher, and thats not just because of the stat bonuses.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Nayte on 2006-12-07 16:15 ]</font>

EphekZ
Dec 7, 2006, 07:18 PM
HUmans>all

Gamemako
Dec 7, 2006, 07:36 PM
On 2006-12-07 16:14, Nayte wrote:
I dont get the last option since wartechers can use spears.
Anyway, I think the beast ATA is over-exaggerating a bit. Are you honeslty telling me that a beast a wont be able to attack from the front what-so-ever. If so, then proof please.
Oh and i thought Fortetechers had the highest EVP.
Might want to add crea weapons in there somewhere maybe. Since wartechers seem like they could be one of the best (if not THE best) solo classes, crea weapons would give a good advantage.

I would personally go with human or newman for the best class for wartecher, and thats not just because of the stat bonuses.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Nayte on 2006-12-07 16:15 ]</font>


We have a beast wartecher here who insists all wartechers will be required to attack from the back, not just beasts. Admittedly, he has more experience than I (about a half hour versus an entire beast WT -- he wins).

Fortetechers have the highest EVP at 200%. Wartechers have 160% EVP. Real crea weapons can be used by all races; only crea replicas are human/newman exclusive.

//EDIT: Oh yes, and Dus Daggas is a joke I make about beast hunters.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Gamemako on 2006-12-07 16:40 ]</font>

Genobee
Dec 7, 2006, 07:51 PM
wait i thought Beast get a boost for being a fortefighter?

SoiFong
Dec 7, 2006, 08:24 PM
On 2006-12-07 16:51, Genobee wrote:
wait i thought Beast get a boost for being a fortefighter?



they do .. but this isnt the Fortefighter poll.
Wartecher Onry ...

-Shimarisu-
Dec 7, 2006, 08:51 PM
Meh, not all will be REQUIRED to attack from the back, but it's certainly a method of play that will result in much more hits.

Even beast is not REQUIRED to, btu you should still learn to. By my experience the only hunter class that can effectively attack head on is Fighgunner. HOWEVER, it breaks combos so why do it anyway? I still attack from the back on a cast fighgunner.

Voted human/beast tie because beasts get:

Soloing, with buffs, close to a tie for best ATP in the game with fortefighter. And close to (same as?) the same ATA. And resta as bonus. This is will be the best solo character once buffs are released.
The lower EVP boosts the chance for nano. However with armour equipped, youll still be blocking a heck of a lot of attacks. My beast wartecher can block A rank BOSS attacks more often than not, with 6* armour.
Highest HP in game makes for better use of dark techs.
Low TP, HOWEVER the TP on female beast is ENOUGH to equip grinded B rank wands from around the level 40 mark, which is a vital boon to damage you will do tech wise. And yes, I said DAMAGE. You can still cause respectable tech damage with high grinded wands, as the majority of your TP is on the wand.

Gamemako
Dec 7, 2006, 09:36 PM
Beast fortefighter has 132% ATP and axes. That makes them the masters of 1750 ATP. Beast fortefighters also have 103% ATA. Megistar makes beast wartechers own pretty hard in terms of damage. Their naturally high ATP makes them amazing candidates for twin dagger abuse. Still, in raw damage fortefighters win. They just can't heal themselves, which sucks pretty bad when you've got no EVP whatsoever (50% for fortefighter and crappy for beast racial). Hence, why wartechers are so great at soloing.

Kanore
Dec 7, 2006, 10:06 PM
Why is Human winning over Beast? Human can literally take anything except for Fortecher... it should be ruled out.

Beasts are perfect: They're built to be Hunters, which Wartecher leans to, and because of that they're gonna need to be able to self-heal.

Gamemako
Dec 7, 2006, 10:35 PM
On 2006-12-07 19:06, Kanore wrote:
Why is Human winning over Beast? Human can literally take anything except for Fortecher... it should be ruled out.

Beasts are perfect: They're built to be Hunters, which Wartecher leans to, and because of that they're gonna need to be able to self-heal.



Your argument makes absolutely no sense. Please clarify.

Ronzeru
Dec 7, 2006, 11:44 PM
On 2006-12-07 19:06, Kanore wrote:
Why is Human winning over Beast? Human can literally take anything except for Fortecher... it should be ruled out.

Beasts are perfect: They're built to be Hunters, which Wartecher leans to, and because of that they're gonna need to be able to self-heal.



Prolly cause humans are very well balanced, and Beasts are very shitty when it comes to magic.

Kent
Dec 7, 2006, 11:58 PM
Wartecher, just like Humans, are all about versatility. With all those melee weapons, second-best Technique usage of the Expert types, and access to A-rank Longbows, Wartechers will be well-suited to being able to do combat of any type, and thus, a race best suited to being able to do any type well, would be best. Newmen would come in a close second here, due to their higher ATA and TP, but lower ATP (and whatever difference in defensive stats).

-Shimarisu-
Dec 8, 2006, 12:06 AM
Everyone here is voting with absolutely no clue of how this class works in practice.

It's cute.

Humans and beasts are equally good, Humans for balance, beasts for all the extra, odd little bonuses they get from the class.

Newman is secondary, IMO it's not worth nerfing their TP, and their ATP is naturally nerfed.

Cast would be good but getting there is hard, you have to level to gain the ability to use better wands. Maybe it's worth taking on once your base level is higher and buffs are released. Also they do not gain the bonuses of very high HP and ATP as base. So beast is still better, being higher in HP, ATP and TP (ATP and TP being vital to the class, HP being a bonus for megistar.)

Well this is a very versatile class. It's good in the hands of anyone. The method of play varies considerably between races. I still think humans and beasts get the most from it, however.

-Shimarisu-
Dec 8, 2006, 12:28 AM
On 2006-12-07 20:44, Ronzeru wrote:


Prolly cause humans are very well balanced, and Beasts are very shitty when it comes to magic.



With a grinded Tenora wand, there's very little difference.

Compare:

Human female: Base TP at level 50, Wartecher 1= 374.
Beast female: Base TP at level 50, Wartecher 1= 224.

Best B rank wand (grindable, A rank is NOT GRINDABLE YET) equipabble by both = Waga Crossa

At plus 6 (highest grind it will go to with "very high" chance) TP= 493. At plus 10, TP=576.

TP of human female with +6 Waga Crossa = 867.
TP of beast female with +6 Waga Crossa = 717.

TP of human female with +10 Waga Crossa = 950.
TP of beast female with +10 Waga Crossa = 800.

Add on units and the gap is closed furthur. It's REALLY QUITE NEGLIGIBLE.

The gap widens towards level 10, but beasts still get extra bonuses with megistar, their ability to nano and a gain with buffs while soloing that puts them at ATP very close to a BEAST FORTEFIGHTER.

Gamemako
Dec 8, 2006, 06:28 PM
Alright, now, to give my opinion.

Remember what I said in the first paragraph?

There is no best.

And so, here's the truth of it all, starting with the least popular.


CAST wartechers:

Hmm, and you thought I hated them. Well, these guys play more like guntechers with swords than wartechers. But that doesn't mean they're gimped in any way. The CAST's naturally rockin' ATA balances the poor ATA of wartecher quite well, making them actually able to use slower PAs and hit multiple foes from the front. They can buff and debuff and heal themselves, as well as use other TECHNICs for effect (see: gibarta). This makes them great on the warrior side of wartecher. They actually hit things, and hit them quite hard, especially with buffs and debuffs. With buffs, a CAST wartecher's bow is going to do more damage than anybody else can claim (and they get good ones with that awesome ATA!). They also get those lovely SUV weapons. Score.

Beast wartechers:

Let's see: best ATP, best HP, enough TP to use some decent wands. Take a well-grinded wand and add the great HP to the great HP modifier and unleash evil HP attack. Add that to some bitchin' damage and 100% foolproof nanoblasts and you've got some typical beast-style asskickery. The lack of ATA hurts, but it is still alleviated somewhat by zodial/megistar and zalure and the fact that beast do it doggy-style (pun intended). Not much to show for bows, either, but you're a warrior beast, not a damn ranger. GET IN THE FRAY!

Newmans:

The easiest class to dismiss, of course, is newman. Why? Wartecher. WAR. Not Lol-no-atp-techer. But every newman knows beforehand that he won't be relying on melee combat in quite the same way as a CAST or a Beast wartecher does. In quite the same way, that is. Newmans get the stat bonuses for being wartechers. This does change things ever-so-slightly. Newmans are a very close second in ATA after the bonus, making them effective users of bows. They can equip better wands before anyone else, and they have the best tech power of anyone. Of course, their real ability relies on the player's creativity. Their tolerable ATA allows them to do things like abuse Rising Crush. Run up to a mob, toss them all in the air, whip out a wand, and deep fat fry with gifoie. Newmans cannot be just a warrior with buffs. Well, he can, but he sucks at it. Also, the newman's excellent EVP (with a 165% bonus) and superior heal allows them to survive almost as well as a CAST wartecher. No racial ability hurts, though, and combined with the poor ATP makes for a class born more of creativity and strategy than simple play style. Integration of techs and skills is essential for play as a newman wartecher. For your typical MMO grind-lover, this combo is not.

Human wartecher:

The name of the game is versaility, and humans are nothing if not versatile. Humans have tolerable HP for the 133.8% bonus and enough ATA to use a few bows and hit things occasionally. Their EVP is second best, and their TP also steals the number 2 spot. They grab the class/race combo bonus, which further steps up their abilities. They can fight. They can cast. They are the true, honest-to-God jack of all trades, master of none. They will do everything this class demands of them, and they will do it well. But they will never be great at any part of it. They will never do great melee damage, they will never have incredible HP amounts, and they will never deal insane tech damage. They are truly what humans are expected to be: 100% non-comittal. They reserve the right to do anything and be anything. And so they do.

DoubleJG
Dec 8, 2006, 07:27 PM
HUwartecher here. Loving it so far.