Just wanna separate Hu from Fi tread. They are have different play style, based on tree and affixes
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Just wanna separate Hu from Fi tread. They are have different play style, based on tree and affixes
BURLY CLASS FOR BURLY CHARACTERS. All muscle, little speed. My favorite class but it's been in kind of a wierd place in the meta for some time... Think our best quality is our mobbing with super-armored attacks. Assuming the enemies present can survive an MPA, so this is typically on Ult or XH areas with lots of mobs. Forces are better mobbers than us though, and our bossing is inferior to Fighter when it uses our own weapons generally...
There are some amazing hunter players out there, but they have to work very hard to get as much out of the class as they can. Idk if its harder than other pros at their respective classes, but the results people get out of Hunter are generally inferior.
Taunt enough Goldras and your Graptor should hit AIS Exoda harder than a Fighter's :wacko:
actually ppl who play hunter main because they love this class, talking about dps/burst damage hunter main are not good compare to other class
beside they have good stat and skills.
but with ATK > everything else meta these day hunter is so underrated
looking for the new difficult which guffur can 2 shot people
then there will be where hunter shine :-?
Yes, their class description is accurate: "they shine at solo combats".
More specifically, at combats where they can control the number of enemies: AQs, XQs, UQs, and even TAs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vL5X-...?v=vL5X-MSPOg4
Also in long combats, like vs Elder, Loser, Diabo, etc.
However, if they're in combats where being part of a MPA and being fast is required... yeah, they're not gonna shine in those (TDs, Magatsu, etc.)
All in all, is a fun class.
Finally a thread for all the massive otome out there
Partizan > Sword > Wired Lance
Based on what situation? because they all excel at certain ones, not to mention you could be using all 3.
Maybe they meant usage ratio. That sounds about right. Partizan : Sword : WL is probably around 6:3:1 or 5:4:1
Isn't this just a universal subclass?
Hunter will be good when we finally abandon Guard Stance eating every other added skill just to be forgotten after. Now if Sega were as kind as to add more damage skills as Hunter main and not skills that are vital to the functioning of the medium tier Hunter weapon that should be able to function without it, that would be nice. The whole automated/flash/iron/massive will buff after EP3 was such a dumb decision. It was more of a buff for Ranger and LB Fighter than Hunter main using Hunter weapons. Not to say how terrible of a decision is giving "spam over end or anything other with super armor over and over again ignoring all hits" as a viable playstyle for a class.
Hunter needs
A) tanking or at least aggro management to become important, which warcry grabbing aggro continuously while active
B) some good main class only skill that is better than a situational damage boost requiring a hell lot of points for 15% dmg, not working on bosses and needing at least 5 enemies in range while grabbing aggro which can sometimes be a bother to you and others, or a skill used only to make this one unwieldy mainclass weapon worth using or give a small, brief damage boost to another mainclass weapon
mainclass weapon boost titles were a step in the right direction but I hope ep 4 cleans up at least part of this mess and nerfs some retarded mechanics.
The game is easy enough, if we do a bit less damage in exchange for less BS metathe game will greatly benefit from it.
Hell no titles weren't a step in the right direction. It was the worst kind of fix for the problem of Fighter main having main class only skills that are way better than every other class that matters for that. Now we get absolutely no incentive for Hu/Fi to even begin using Double Saber/Knuckle/TD because you lose 10% from title, 15% from crit, 20% from LB + all the attack/PP boosts. Same with Br/Hu and many other classes that never had anything going for them. Sega just destroyed the whole idea of using weapons that aren't main class because Fighter's main class abilities were 15%/20%/PP regen/attack stat boost.
Well, at least it's a little incentive to use hu weapons as hu main...
Sword was actually usable but clunky and nobody would want to bother with it as Fi/Hu. Now there is no reason to even bother. I bet it would be overall better if critical strike was just made sub skill too.
wait, Hunter is separate main class? i thought its limited to sub
If Critical Strike is a sub skill, Bo/Fi would be like the best thing ever. If anything, it should be more worthwhile to use Hunter gear, and ability to cancel out some PAs.
And maybe change weapon Gear and tweaking some utility skill.
- Sword Gear: Making it fill like Katana Gear instead of the old gear, which would quickly lose gear and give it a minor damage buff on full gear.
- Gear Unleash (changing Massive Hunter): main class only, converting all your gear to give you a super-armor and damage resist buff. Can be activate by Just Guard or manual activation. Manual activation have a maximum duration of 10s/per gear and 60s cooldown while Just Guard activation give 5s/per gear with no cooldown.
For Wired Lance, I do want SEGA make WL's PAs easier to connect with boss hitboxes. For example, Heavenly Fall is just retarded on high attitude since it only deal damage on the grab but not the landing.
Bo/Fi would probably be okay anyway. Brave + Critical Fighter is still almost the same modifier as the whole Fury tree and it would at the very least need to watch out for Brave or combo PAs to get TAJA. Sword gear is okay as a concept except for the fact that Sword is disgusting at gear level 0 and only gets okay at max. And Sword is really not the weapon to need more super-armor or damage resist, it needs pure damage.
Sword being hard to achieve high DPS with compared to other melee weapons is definitely intended. Any more damage on the easier-to-use PAs and it will be way too good.
It's not only hard to achieve it but also impossible if the boss decides to just forget about attacking and get stunned. It's not like there aren't many classes that are way too good in the game anyway. Was it intended too? Sword deserves to be a little OP if only because sacrifice bite and gear boost have no affinity with weapon switching on top of Sword alone eating way too many PA palettes.
The thing about Sword being OP, I do have some experience with it due to playing in SEA server during the Ep3 damage value on ep2 mechanic.
Example: Rising Edge dealing 20k damage upward on 0 gear or Over End hitting 100k dmg on weakpoint (and I only used a mere 50 ele +10 Lambda Aristene, having around 1k8 s-atk with shifta tonic ex). Of course, it can't compare to the broken Br/Hu in the same period but it does it works.
Changing to JP server, seeing Sword damage being halved despite using better gear is kinda make me doesn't wanna play Sword anymore.
I don't think sword needs to do more damage, I feel it does plenty. The issue during MPAs is more with its speed and the fact it needs to wind-up in order to get to its full potential. Even with max fury gear it can sometimes be difficult to get this, depending somewhat on your MPA. For solo play I think it's fine.
Essentially it's the dedication required for sword that puts people off it I believe. You need to Sacrifice Bite, which goes when you swap weapon. Then you need to build gear, and it's a heat-type which means it wears off over time if you're not hitting anything or again if you swap weapon. If you do manage to get a full sacrifice bite PA off however you should already get max gear or near it if you took Fury Gear.
For bosses you're generally better off using Ideal graptor-zenith. I want to say Holding Current is better DPS against bosses too than most of what Sword offers, assuming you can land it on a good target. I tend to like using that on Ult Agnis too cause fuck chasing birds around with a sword.
Sword is best used on groups of HP sponges (XH golds and UQ lili mobs for ex). Partizan and WL for bossing or for killing shitty mobs faster.
Slide Shaker > Nova Strike for ULT/XH, not sure about Over End tho
Why would anyone waste 25 points of precious PeePee and no damage on setting up TAJA for Over End when you can do it naturally with any of the gapclosers not wasting any time and dealing more damage at that.
Ah, yes, I remembered SonicArrow fills a lot of gear for each hit ...... that's before SacrificeBite buff (gear filling), I think.
hunter discussion?
more like hunter shitposting
hurrr subclass and shit
more news at 11
Say, if I got these kind of damage from UQ Lilipa ..... Too bad it's old weapon, not current weapon. It's not possible atm.
Spoiler!
Is it gonna be possible to get 1 damage taken (changing that 9 damage taken into 1), should I change my affixes to Astral + Ability3?
That'll mean ..... +50 Def for each units, and +50 from weapon :o Giving a total of 200 more def, and +60 Attacks (+15 x4 from Ability3)
Since the most expensive fodder will be SoulCatalyst only ..... 1 fodder for 5 of 6 affixes I needed, 1 DarknessSoul + 1 affix (maybe).
Sure, I'll sacrifice Stamina3 to get Ability3 though. But, if it's possible to get 1 damage, it'll be funny LOL
Note : Using almost the usual FuryStance Tree (modified version from when the SS is taken) and 200 S-Atk Mag, of course. Drinks are ShiftaDrink :o
It's under DebandCut + DebandToughness too.
Well, T-Def special only give T-damage resist and elemental resistance ._.
I'm using default DragonEx (Lv3) Units ... gave 5% S-Def, I think.
I like to use Sac Bite->Overend for TAJA against things that really can't be grabbed by Sac.
On the topic of how they should fix Hunter:
Honestly, I think the stances shouldn't be thought of as "one is offense and the other is defense". I think the stances should change how your characters acts, and changes how PAs work altogether.
Fury Stance will give your character more attack speed and make him/her more reckless. PAs make cost less PP and be faster, the step being similar to it's function now, maybe change the weapon actions.
Defensive Stance would give your character more tankiness while being more poised kind of guy, while still giving him power in some way(maybe make attacks scale off of hp and defenses, but not as much?). Weapon actions are better guards, PAs change to be a bit slower, but more powerful cost a bit more PP. Step can be something like a shield bash.
Rough idea of what is in my head of how I would like to see Hunter. Probably won't happen tho.
Why would you have a TAJA combo? You are supposed to combo PA into PA depending on what you need. The only real useful starter it Guilty Break from distance into any other PA since it offers you no wasted time and good damage.
That's how you do it. You first think about what PA you want to use for normal PA reason then just think about chaining it so you can get your TAJA out of it. There is no reason to have something useless like Stun Coincido or Sonic Arrow purely for setting up TAJA.
This.
I love sword pas in general, they are badass, strong and have good range/aoe.
Nova Strike for example has massive aoe and hits hard enough to be good on bosses.
But gear + sacrifice bite mean you are forever too late to the party, like dagger.
Weapons that are relying on gimicks to be good can never be as good as weapons you can use straight away in general. In controlled situations they can be anything but sword or dagger is not something you can simply pick up and use for great effect in most situations.
What sword needs is for gear to be 10% damage and a range boost like for partizan. Good and useful, but not crucial. And sacrifice bite to be made obsolete but buffing all pas half its power and making the pa worthless. Now sword is readily available and not something you can't even pull out of its sheath before others killed the enemies.
Hell, if you are soloing and there is a boss that forces you to dodge a lot you will lose all your gear.
Well, tbh OE is vastly overrated. Outside people showing off controlled situations like easy solo bosses I have yet to see many good uses of it. It's just too slow and with anyone else around mobs and bosses are quite likely to move out of range. And in the first place the aoe is shit for mobbing.
Even solo some bosses can easily move out of the way. It's only real advantage is that it doesn't need to be charged.
Hell, even though you have super armor this doesn't prevent enemies from damaging you and despite using it rarely I had plenty of cases where enemies hit me so much I had to heal ASAP afterwards.
In most cases (provided you have a good amount of gear ready) Rising Edge or Nova Strike are better.
I always get a good deal more damage (more than just from Average S Charge) with Nova Strike than with OE and both are at lvl 17.
Anyway, I also feel like Wired Lance suffers greatly from having so many grabs. It's just that these will piss off everyone else cause they rarely are strong enough to kill anything right away, but will make it hard for everyone else to hit the enemy.
Gear and Sacrifice Bite are easy enough to charge but make the weapon useless when you have to recharge both of them during weapon switches and at really low hp mobs, and sword also is nowhere near good enough to warrant the unreliability they bring. The dead enemies before you are done with gear meme has gone long enough. It's mostly that Force can pull out AoE that you were never able to, or other weapons keep outdamaging sword even at full gear thing. The main problem is precisely because sword has pretty poor DPS notations and DPP notations just help to make up for horribly slow normals that can't cancel and recover 10PP at the best hit. And no Daggers are crazy good at anything that doesn't have to do with mobbing.
OE is also good and if you don't use both Nova and OE you are pretty bad. OE is low player population/high hp mobs/many mobs killing hero perfect for TD4 MPAs that consist of mostly crystal gods that can't even play AIS properly. But of course you have to be smart enough not to either die or miss it most of the time by just predicting aggro properly. Over End is also one of the few PAs that are good damage dealers when you want to stay in the air. Sword also doesn't have much problems with bosses that attack too much when you just start Ignite Parrying. Even uncrafted twister from air JG or JG into ride slasher is fast enough for pretty much anything.
And holy shit Hu/Brs are so disgusting.
And no Sonic Arrow is bad. Gear building is almost entirely taken care of by Guilty Break as gap closer for Hunter mains or Sacrifice Bite that you need to use for damage bonus anyway. Even then you would probably prefer Ride Slasher or crafted Twister Fall.
Well, all I see is someone that claims a lot and delivers nothing. If stuff is so easy, please don't be another pointless braggart and prove what you are talking about.
And not just once or twice because as I mentioned, it's the unreliability that makes it bad.
Also, predicting aggro is BS. This game has bs aggro management and enemies can get aggro from people halfway across the map. It's often luck.
And honestly, if you think fi is good for TD I question your sanity. Next you're saying fi needs LB and brave stance cause fuck wise stance. Cause ofc you are an epic aggro manager than can always generate more aggro than towers.
What do I need to deliver to you? A hunter soloing Leone duo from Ult Lilipa in 5 minutes which means two ultra aggressive bosses at once? Not even much Ignite Parrying cause it's quite bad for hitting Brave and weakpoints there properly. The problem is that you people believe that Sword can never be good because it has to use Sacrifice Bite and Gear. The truth is it only matters to that extent in something like TAs with half of it being dashing around, other than that if everything dies before you are done unsheathing it, it's your fault. Just do the math, if you can't manage to even start it up, without the gear requirement you would've been left doing one light PA or Over Ending empty space. It should be removed but it won't make Sword much better, especially at things it has always been kinda good at.
Predicting aggro isn't BS, the only random element that matters is pretty much your MPA's behavior (that can be predicted to decent extent). Other than that you hit enemies to build up aggro, cast War Cry to reset with small aggro on you that can be taken off by light damage done by other players.
I don't even know where I said that Fighter is good at any kind of TD that doesn't mean Twin Daggers. How the fuck are they slow to start up anyway, you are slow.
But seriously Fighter isn't bad at TD when you realize you TD4 is composed of really many Exoda and you can utilize your DS for mobbing or even some decent crafted Partizan for some situations. And how can taking aggro off towers be hard? One War Cry resets it and then you hit the mobs a couple of times and they should be dead before they can regain anything. You can easily take it off bosses or mobs alike without War Cry just by doing huge damage.
Seriously why would you talk about how Sword is bad when playing Hu/Br of all things.
Edit: Also yes Wise Stance is a problem because often mostly on bosses as Fighter you end doing a thing called huge damage which makes it always turn to you unless someone does better damage. It's pretty probable even with Brave Stance, and gets worse when you get better modifiers from Wise Stance.
Fi is about limitbreaking, huge melee dps , hu is more gear , tank and aggro better. +10% hu weapons damage.
I swear Hunter discussion is dead in 46 posts. This place is nothing but filthy Hu/Br's thinking Austere makes them good. Or filthy Automate Hu/Fis thinking Austere makes them good with 60 attack 110hp units. Or filthy Hu/Fis with 120 attack units and Austere that still suck. All of them are filth. Hu/Br's will probably still think they are good after TAJA PP save. And seriously fuck Chainsawd.
You know what a true Hunter is? It's a Hunter with Ideal Sword. Because he goes against the stereotyping of Sword = mobbing (where most of them pretend they are good cause no way to prove otherwise, if it's TD just blame it on Forces and something something). He follows his weapons even in the depths of no damage hell, ready to perfect it wherever and whenever. None of those guys that just grab Sword to spam Over End with Automate choose Ideal. Ideal as a weapon also represents true hard work. No schedule, no RNG, only best mode over and over again.
It's not really different with other weapons. 90% of Wired Lance users? Fucking Fi/Hu whipping it out for HC only. 90% of Partizan users? Spam that one fucking volg into pick up throw combo Fi/Hu with that PUT damage up Partizan holy shit. I see so little real Hu/Fis nowadays. Hunter can't even get decent buffs nowadays because Hu/Fis are 90% fake and are just happy they can go in a corner and launch their over end spam macro while surviving on massive otome, so they say hunter is good and give us more defensive skills actually to help Ra/Hu out wwww. Or those guys that can only solo XQs on automate and think all is well cause Hunter can just be the easiest class that doesn't do shit besides managing to survive while playing like a retard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4
For real tho just stop...
What's the highest DPS option for Sword nowadays? Crafted Twister Fall? Better to spam one PA or to combo?
Most of anything with TAJA nowadays it's better to combo. Theoretically your highest both DPS and DPP right now is Ignite Parrying when you hit your JG during it.
Other than that there is problem with DPP versus DPS. Theoretically fully hit crafted twister or even normal twister do great DPS, but their DPP sucks compared to most of everything. Crafted Twister when held long and Over End though do okay DPS and have great DPP. Generally with how many options you have I would say you want to prioritize Ignite over keeping TAJA (as in I would rather hit Ignited Parrying without TAJA than other sword PA with TAJA), and combo any other (not ignite) PA into another as much as possible. Generally I just use Over End and Rising Edge as general DPS with long DPP, with crafted long Twister, albeit I dislike how the shockwave can miss weakpoints. Ride Slasher is good, but not amazing if you can hit all ticks. Nova Strike is overall a pure downgrade of Rising Edge at single targets but the hitbox is useful at times. Guilty Break lets you continue combos after the boss moving while keeping the DPS up, but don't use it too much. Short Twister is good when you have some PP to dump.
DPS and DPP stats are best taken from Swiki.
Edit: Also the Swiki page about crafted Twister can be kinda misleading as it's done based on perfect -10PP max damage craft. -8PP and around 190% power crafted Twister I feel is already good enough but -10PP is worth getting for sure, together with any additional power.
hu is good just moveset is a bit too slow. sword is still faster than the others but mobbing in this game is still just a matter of seconds which makes it annoying.
also that part about ideal made me burst into bits so hard.
This makes me think how Hu needs specific Sword-only skills. Kinda like Gu tree where it can use two weapons but most of its skill set focuses on TMG.
I'm not sure I understand why the new skill - Charge Parrying - has five levels. Invincibility frames?
You know what a true Ranger is? It's a Ranger with Ideal Launcher. Because he goes against the stereotyping of Launcher = mobbing (where most of them pretend they are good cause no way to prove otherwise, if it's TD just blame it on Forces and something something). He follows his weapons even in the depths of no damage hell, ready to perfect it wherever and whenever. None of those guys that just grab launcher to spam Cluster Bullet with Automate choose Ideal. Ideal as a weapon also represents true hard work. No schedule, no RNG, only best mode over and over again.
Can I ask what did you smoke to make something like that? :wacko:
Glad to see that Hunter discussion is almost entirely about Sword.
because Partisan is a Fi weapon and WL doesn't exist
Wtf, this doesn't make a lick of sense LOL. Those Overmate heroes, or hell, just about anybody that's glossed over the other 13* choices don't choose Ideal because Ideal is a terrible choice for Sword. If you're using an Ideal Sword whatsoever, you're not spending your CM or time very wisely.
Also, the new skill is great, definitely a must have if you aggressively use charge attacks a lot.
Ideal is beautiful and it's been available since cmode release yet it still has comparable damage with Austere that will most probably be top damage for quite some time. Ideal isn't a dumb choice unless you are one of those guys that just switches to other weapons on bosses cause Sword sucks, which means you aren't a true Hunter. Damage on mobs is comparable to Invade Sword anyway, and rest of the swords is just mobbing damage upgrade and worse or comparable boss damage.
Ideal is about 20% weaker than Austere for mobbing, so yeah, it's bad.
Woah the bossing sword is weak for mobbing compared to the highest damage sword in the game, so bad. What more didn't I know?
And fuck you if you are a guy who thinks some weapons aren't allowed in some EQs. What are you so scared of? That you get blacklisted by some Pick Up Throw spammer on Magatsu? You guys are horrible weapon sluts that can't even stay faithful to your weapon-fu.
I'm faithful to partisan, don't be ridiculous. I've been using partisan since back when it sucked. Nothing wrong with being dedicated to your craft, just know you will be judged for it. I've seen dedicated sword users do their thing and even do well spaced ride slashers into golradha clumps. I don't find anything wrong in doing what you like to do, as long as you're good at it.
I will say sword on constantly moving and shifting things is an exercise in frustration though, but you do you.
Considering you were suggesting using it on mobs, I'm not sure where to begin on what you don't know.
Anyway, weapon specializing is just an unnecessary self-imposed restriction that only guarantees you're worse than a player that doesn't restrict themselves. Advocating it makes no sense. If sword is the best weapon to use on a boss, then sure, go for it. But if it isn't, then you really should make another weapon for it.
Nobody in this game plays a weapon. They play classes. Using one weapon exclusively even when another would be a better alternative just makes you bad at playing the class.
That's because I was saying that in the end if you get Ideal you do great on bosses and mob damage is acceptable enough compared to swords that actually compete with ideal based on grind time or how long they've been in the game. 20% lost compared to the best Sword isn't much when you consider that often you don't even need it on mobs.
And if you think weapon specializing is so bad then why don't you just say that class specializing is also bad and everybody should just roll with Forces and whatever the other good classes are in the EQ in addition to that one support guy that provides buffs and WB. And I can be the worst Hunter possible, only being the best Swordsman matters. I will just become the one guy that plays weapon and not a class.
20% loss isn't close to comparable but if you say so...
If you're focusing 100% on sword idk why you aren't talking about using Austere or Orbit considering you have nothing else to use the stones for. Especially if you're trying to be the best sword user. Since you aren't doing that the claim is meaningless. Especially since being the best Hunter and the best sword user aren't mutually exclusive goals. Using sword 100% of the time doesn't make you good at sword. That's flawed logic.
And class specialization is bad, but that's another topic entirely.
I only used comparable for boss damage which can be deduced quite clearly from the rest of my post since Austere is used as top damage example while in mobbing section I mention other swords that are mobbing upgrade, which means that comparable must've been only used to mean boss damage.
And Austere and Orbit are another thing entirely. Orbit isn't even that good, you want one to keep on your back pretty much but using it for actual combat is matter of preference. Austere is tons of schedule only quests, and yes I pretty much said it does the best damage. Doesn't make Ideal bad just because it's a straight upgrade from it, which people imply.
Using sword 100% of the time sure can help you being good at it, and not using it on a multum of EQs surely does disqualify you from mastering it.
And class specialization is only bad if you really care about pure efficiency only however obtained, which many people don't.
Man, you're full of shit.
First you say that Ideal does damage comparable to Austere, then comment that the mobbing with Ideal is on par with Invade like that's a good thing when the mobbing is inferior to Red Sword, which is the most entry level thing you can get. Then you say that Orbit isn't even that good when Orbit's damage is comparable to Ideal's on bosses and works on mobs. It's just 2-3% short of Austere and is tremendously easier to acquire compared to it, with some extra perks and a virtually meaningless drawback. Though by now how many people haven't acquired the 400 Caligula needed for a 60 element Austere? Using the schedule only excuse only works for new players, which you likely aren't if you're so good at sword.
Then you say that if you switch from sword to something else because sword sucks, you aren't a true Hunter. After saying that, you say that being good at Hunter doesn't matter to you as long as you're good at sword. So, what, are you a true Hunter or a good sword user? Or is being bad at Hunter synonymous with being a true Hunter? Never mind how retarded the true Hunter shit is, you aren't even good at sword to begin with if you're running around with Ideal on everything. There are plenty of better geared Hunter players that are better at sword and WL + partisan, so you can't even use the baseless claim that only using sword makes you better at it than people that don't use sword exclusively.
And what is this logic of "you can't be good at sword if you don't use it everywhere"? That makes no sense. Just because someone doesn't use sword there doesn't mean they're not good at it, it means that there's still something that can do what they need to do better. No matter how good someone might be at sword, they will never be able to, for example, eliminate an A.I.S. Exoda in 3s like they could with a partisan. You can't simply say that someone not using sword everywhere is worse at it. It means they're using their tools the most effectively they can. The only situation where you could possibly justifiably use this reasoning is if sword was the best at everything possible out of all of Hunter's weapons, which is simply not the case.
Honestly, why does Hunter draw all these scrub-tier cases? The tank Hunter thread was bad enough.
I'm gonna go with "buyer's remorse" of a sort, not sure its the right phrase. You invested all that time and effort into an overall inferior build/loadout, so let's defend it against all valid constructive criticism.
To be fair, Hunter as a main class has had it kinda rough for the early years. They were the number 1 subclass and couldn't really stand on their own as a main-class at all until around Episode 3 and even then they only became marginally functional as a main-class. Wasn't helped that as I recall for the most part of episode 1 and 2, Fighters were better Hunters than Hunters were due to having powerful off-class options. This only left their survivability as their one unique quality, only tanking was pretty quickly determined to be utterly worthless in PSO2. Given skill tree resets or additional trees cost actual money I can full well believe the bitterness this could create.
Orbit isn't that good because you are thinking it's not straight downgrade from Austere when you have a no ele one for sheathing. The sheathed potential is pretty bad for sword because it has tons of hitstop and you pretty much lose everything you've gained from 60% regen on hit by not regenerating PP during swings. No, you aren't smart because you've noticed I use good or bad depending on what I compare it with. And no not everyone can just get on every scheduled PD.
And no Red Sword mobbing isn't better than Ideal, it's pretty much the same if you are without unit set.
And the problem is I just don't care about your definition of Hunter using all weapons and being good at them all. I don't care if your definition of Hunter doesn't apply to me, so I just called mine a Swordsman (a type true Hunter).
Why are you even implying I run with Ideal on everything. I rated it as a Sword worth getting because it just is, and said when you get it you are a real Hunter, because all the scrubs just avoid it see yourself. And why are you telling me that there are plenty of better geared Hunter players and they are all better at WL + Partizan too and they all just drop the Sword whenever they see Magatsu. You don't even know me bitch.
How can you even call yourself good at something where you are only good at doing one thing with it. Maybe those Pick Up Throw masters at Magatsu are good at Partizan? I don't care about people who can Volg Magatsu because Volg is strong. I care about beauty and elegance in the form of the master of a weapon. All of you bowmen or Forces that switch for the FOTM are just giant homosexuals from my point of view.
And fuck you, you are a scrub too. Aren't you just some Shifta boy for tryhard teams? Honestly a Techer guide guy calling some class a scrub magnet man. What times to live in.
but hey wired lance also only has 2 pa's kaiser rise (building gear) and holding current (wasting gear) :wacko: (also people using lances on mobs are literally the most annoying things out there.. well other than the classes that juggle enemies for ages and dont kill)
edit: at vantpers ideal sword sucks get over it. even ares does pretty much similar damage and works on mobs orbit and austere are even better (and orbit vs austere is debatable on most weps including sword)
Yeah pretty sure Austere Calibur walks all over Ideal Sword even against bosses...
I've used a 60% Austere Calibur and a 60% Ideal Spear against a Magatsu on VH by myself (Saiki armor so no weapon set bonuses for either). Essentially a DPS race I wanted to try because Austere's DPS felt SO GOOD that I was curious if it actually beat Ideal Spear. Turns out it doesn't, but Austere wasn't as far behind as I thought it'd be tbh... It's pretty solid.
I said scrubs avoid Ideal as in thinking it's bad sword. I never said everyone who doesn't use Ideal is a scrub, just that you will never see a scrub with it. And no Austere is just plainly better because you actually get less PP in combat with Orbit's sheathed latent thanks to Sword being slow, and for sheathing PP regen you only need a trash one.
Ideal is alright and fine to use
It's just so specific to what it does. A lot of the harder to do MPAs such as TD doesn't really focus on bossing, and when you do boss, you usually use a AIS.
Overall, the other 13* swords do more damage, but if you want to do more damage you can get Ideal. Just it's not *ideal* to gimp your overall damage and lack in some areas.
Lets just put it this way...
Record 1 video during EQ to show that Ideal sword is marginally good to contribute in MPA. Preferably MD4, if you know what i mean.
Anyway, I care less about "true hunter", even care less about "Ideal"ist or "beautiful".
da heck is MD4? this is not SEA
The only way to play the game wrong is by not having fun! I mean, people can always find other players with similar playstyles. ^.^
Being new to this game, I am having a lot of fun playing as Hu/Fo because it is like a spellsword combination that can use Megiverse to heal which works nicely with Overend's super armor.
Not only does it offer a bit of everything, but a well timed just-guard can bring Ignition Parry up to reasonable DPS.
So far I haven't been having any issues keeping up with my friends, nor have I ever finished lower than 6th place in a one of those mining tower defense quests. Granted, I can't do XH missions yet.
Not really the best logic considering anyone out there can get an Ideal Sword and play poorly.
The reason most people don't go for it is for the same reason people don't go for Ideal Katana. While Sword and Katana can and should be used for bossing sometimes (mostly for shorter fights or against enemies unfriendly to your burst-ier weapon's PAs), they're primarily mobbing weapons due to their good AOE and low PP costs. What they lack in is solid burst damage, which is where other weapons come into play. Using Ideal Sword would (literally) just be a waste of the weapon's potential.
oh just wait till xh when your precious i play for fun style is having trouble doing anything due to pathetically low damage btw who says people with proper builds are not having fun? im quite enjoying myself playing what is considered proper classes like hufi fote brhu rahu gura etc
I call it MD4 sometimes, it doesn't really matter as long as people know what you're talking about.
But, man, this is just silly. Sword's DPS is poor, but you insist on turning it into a mediocre bossing weapon when it's strength lies in mobbing. Sword already has a difficult time keeping up with mobbing in MPAs because of it's slow start up, slow attack speed, and comparatively short AoE range, why would you deliberately hamper your mobbing power further by not having a potential that damages both enemy types? Have you not seen all the Ares, Orbits, and Austeres running around these days? They're blowing Ideal out the water when it's not a boss and that's the majority of the time.
Y'know something else? For someone calling them self a Sword specialist, I find it strange the only Sword they're carrying is one that's effective just against bosses...and are satisfied having that alone. I mean, never mind Orbit's wicked PP regen or Austere's raw strength, TRUE hunters just use the most non optimal potential for everything. The true hunter way!
Pfft, what do I know though, I'm just an filthy Ares using weapon slut. Good shit man. :nono:
https://ak-hdl.buzzfed.com/static/20...3365490-18.png
Thread's over boys. Just waiting for the Guard Stance Tank Hu now to remind us why Hunter threads shouldn't exist.
...but okay, in all seriousness dude, you don't want to be Hu/Fo or vice versa, it may look effective as you're first starting, but that's only because enemies are super weak at the beginning and die at the drop of a feather. When you get to later difficulties, you'll find your damage to be far too low to defeat enemies in a timely manner, and since the game pushes you to clear objectives as fast as possible, you'll want to be sure your damage is up to par or you'll be a detriment to your teammates in higher levels. If you're interested in playing a spellsword-esque class (because there really isn't one), Jetboots Bo/Fi is probably as close as it gets if we're talking about viability. Hu/Te does something of the sort too, but it's not really good. Te/Br is great, but I believe it's a casting class with situational Katana and Bow usage, Lonely knows more about Te stuff.
Whatever you plan to do, have fun doing it foremost, but make sure not to put forth your way of having fun at the expense of others enjoyment when a time sensitive emergency quest appears.
Objection: there's Adapt Spin too for TAJA Holding Current with, and Grappling Charge when Heavenly Fall just isn't viable; also Kaiser Rise is good for its usage, snipe and multi-hit for status effect. But hey, WL users are like the minority in Hu/Fi I guess, so not many people know to use it, especially with the stigma of throwing mob everywhere, which they shouldn't with Other Spin.
^ yeah other spin is good; and adapting spin is great for setting up both Heavenly Fall (front flips) and Holding Current (backflip from point blank)
Grapple Charge however is garbage and I am glad to be rid of it forever since Adapting Spin showed up
you ought to try Hu/Te if you are enjoying supplementing your melee attacks with support techs. subbing force adds very little to hunter, but techer has quite a few skills that can still make you better at dealing damage with your hunter weapons.
using offensive techs isn't really advised outside of Force main class and some Techer main builds though, so try to stick to s-atk on your mag from here on out.
otherwise, if you want to try the spellsword gig I would also recommend checking out Bouncer and Jet Boots
Heavenly Fall even with Adapt Spin have the problem of mob running out of hitbox when you land. So Grapple Charge is used to avoid that. Grapple Charge is the only grab PA that do its full animation even without anything to grab on, so you can use it for prediction attack like other classes do when they're spawn camping.
Spoiler!
Cheers.
Used to think that before I realized people are doing 2x-3x my damage. And my justification of "I can heal with techs" is swatted aside by a person who told me to "meh, get a mate, or automate."
Oh yeah, btw, my fun resides in not-so-stressful cube/fodder/rare hunting during EQ. And seeing ruined mpas with dead zamba players, dead pa spammers and dead "play for fun" players.
getting orbit / austere is kinda time consuming for people who can't make it to every EQ especially when they missed the initial wave of EQ's so getting ideal / mobbing weapon is okay what are people on about
http://i.imgur.com/0woFq1j.jpg
doubt you would feel much of a difference, heck ideal knuckles are even more damage for some people than aus (ideal + set / vs. no set).
Whatever numbers you used are granting a 2.5% difference in Austere's damage and Ideal's damage. What did you do, set Ideal's potential on? Obviously there wouldn't be much difference for bosses, and no one said there would be. Ideal is weak for mobbing, which is the primary complaint about getting Ideal.
20% would be like running around without any ATK affixed (more likely much larger than that with lower end ATK affixes like most players have), so if you wouldn't notice that on mobbing then you have some pretty bad attention to your damage.
Yes he is using Ideal on bosses that's the point. For someone using pretentious titles like 孤高 under the name you are not very smart. The point is to praise Ideal sword for the bossing damage as it's really important there. The point isn't to notice that the boss damage weapon isn't the best at mobbing. The point is that let's say early EP3 Sword is pretty much still almost the highest damaging weapon where the damage matters most. Let's compare to schedule only EQ Sword that requires even more grind of various content instead of Cmode only Sword that doesn't even need an XH capable character to obtain. Saying that I should've obtained Austere when I didn't and at best I could get a 30 element one isn't a valid argument.
Whatever the reason, Ideal weapons are still very good. Not the best =/= bad.
Remember that some of us got Ideal weapons when it was either that or Ares, and if I can eliminate RNG... I have to this day yet not found a single Ares weapon >_>
Suggesting Austere is amazingly dumb, but with what the game is like today, going for Ideal sword is not the brightest idea, either. Orbit, Seiga or simply Ares swords are not too difficult to get and will perform better overall.
After seeing Su tree closely again, despite most of the stuff is pet related aka main class only, there's some stuff that's interesting for making the "magic warrior or battle mage" HuSu. All Attack Bonus is just Average Stance (though slightly weaker), but the plus is you can cast tech, would be good for those that were previously HuTe isn't it, or Territory Burst + Wand Lover is just too good to pass? Any opinion on that?
Worse/equal to Red weapons for mobbing. That's not "very good". Sure the bossing's fantastic, but you should really get a different sword if you ever use swords for mobs, but all the swords that have better mobbing are 13*s and Ely Sion so I guess it's "OK".
Though yeah nowadays Seiga, Ares, and Orbit are readily available (to a lesser extent for Orbit) and only a few % weaker than Austere, and are equally good for mobbing and bossing. Austere only gets a mention because the guy talks like sword is the only weapon he uses and if he wants to be the best sword user obviously the best sword is necessary for that, right?
Got few questions for you guys, as a player who stopped at the start of EP2 and just came back for EP4:
1) I was pretty much a sword user only back in EP1, so I must admit I have no idea how effective partisans and wirelances are. What are the usual PA for both of them?
2) after reading posts left and right, it seems Sword is pretty weaksauce compared to Partisans and Wirelances due to how long it takes to have the gear + sacrifice bite along with the slow wind up for most of the moves. Is it really better to just run with the other two weapons, or are you actually effective with swords in some situations like bosses?
Back in the day, Sonic Arrow and Over End were the only PA you needed, but I guess not juggling between Guilty Break, Crafted Twister Fall and Ride Slash is a very bad idea.
3) if I understood correctly, crafted red series weapon is a good start. Do you keep them until you manage to grind enough for Invade/Austere series or transitions between both are possible? I must admit the damage variance with crafted red series is really bothersome as far as I could play with a red sword with potential 1.
Current skill tree looks like this. Still have 12 SP left in Fi, but not too sure if dual stance is actually a thing.
i can tell you right now sword is better at mobbing than lances and partizan is up for debate but for bossing partizan volg combos are the strongest you got (note volg wont be great against everything ever also a couple good combos to use with volg are volg zenith normal volg assault slide end) and while im too lazy to look at your skill tree a hu main should have both stances (note there are situations where holding current would be better than volg or situations where you would actually want to boss with sword)
as for vantpers the damage shown under ideal would be what orbit is doing to EVERYTHING not just bosses (and that sweet pp)
Orbit PP is such an overstatement when your attack recovers 6PP more in the time it would take you to recover 4-5PP based on natural regeneration alone. I bet in the time it takes to step + step attack natural PP regen would be more than 3PP you gain for Orbit.
Orbit is a lie good only as 15 element photon collector for Sword.
And I won't use Austere because I don't look good with it. Can't roleplay with it and it's not like I need that 4% damage to ravage and destroy.
I thought he was trolling at first. But he's been trying way too hard lately to be trolling.