Official Acrotecher Thread

[Pillan]

On 2007-07-21 07:49, EspioKaos wrote:
Acrotecher: Ranger Lv.3, Force Lv.5
Skills: LV20
Bullets: LV20
Attack TECHNICs: LV30
Support TECHNICs: LV40
S-rank weapons: sabers, daggers, whips, handguns, cards, wands, madoogs
A-rank weapons: twin daggers, twin handguns, machineguns, shadoogs

Stats at level 15:
HP: 116
ATP: 106
ATA: 150
TP: 138
DFP: 110
EVP: 220
MST: 190
STA: 100

The class has access to all basic and G traps except Burn, Poison, and Virus as well as faster melee attacks and technique casting.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Pillan on 2007-10-14 08:07 ]</font>

[Shiro_Ryuu]

Yeah, not bad. For techs, if you're just dealing with single targets, I'm sure you can always just use foie or diga or something, and ra techs and melee for multi targets. But yeah, I don't think any race can be better or worse at these Acro classes than the others. You also forgot to add fG in that list of don't suck at jobs since nobody sucks at that either.

Also, Foie seems to be the only access to SE 4 burn for this class, correct me if I'm wrong or something. That could be helpful for big enemies.

[Pillan]

Foie is the only SE 4 burn that I can think of, but burn hits subbosses at SE 3 (SE 3 burn lands as often as SE 4 freeze or infect on your average 30 STA enemy). Foie will deal more damage when it hits, but I’d expect you to be able to get in 3 or so handgun shots between each Foie, making it more likely to burn the enemy but dealing 1% less damage per tick. I’ll actually lean more towards handguns, but I’d say you’ll be fine either way.


Going back to that aside, though fG is impossible to mess up with any race combination, it is very likely to be messed up based on weapon and PA use. I won’t go into details because that would lead to a really long rant that doesn’t belong in this topic.

[Soukosa]

On 2007-05-09 08:58, Pillan wrote:
It’s primarily a support technique class and using it for melee, ranged, or technique damage won’t be very effective. Because it’s at least 10 levels below in every type of art, you’ll really notice the difference. Theoretically it could do a lot more damage with techniques, but that really depends on your ability to have 4 or more enemies within your tech range, making a Cast or Beast aT just as useful, if not more, than a Newman or human in a party. In solo, however, human and Newman have a clear advantage.

You haven't even played the damn class. How can you even know how it plays?

Ugh... I'm getting so sick of you fucking idiots that have never fucking played these classes and yet you think you know everything about them

If you don't use offensive techs on an AT you will suck. PERIOD. If you can't grasp the concept of using such techs along side melee (like 98% of the people on these forums) then just shut up about the class since you don't know how it works. Beast and cast ATs are about as worthless as a beast or cast FT. The class works around offensive techs, just like FT. Just because they have a lower tech cap doesn't mean they'll suck using it.

And yes, I should know how the class plays since I spent all 3 weeks of the beta playing it, unlike virtually anyone else here. (I only know of one other person on here that has played it for an extended period of time.)

[Shiro_Ryuu]

Well, either way, I'm sure that people will still play CAST or Beast Acrotechers even with the knowledge that they will not be the best class. I mean, I've seen CAST Fortetechers, Newman Fortefighters, and the such who pick the class with full knowledge that they may be picking the worst race for the job, but yet still do it. As for me having a Male Human who's going Acrofighter and a Female Newman going Acrotecher(probably the 2 best races for these jobs if Sou is right), I would probably still make these choices even if they were CAST and Beast dominant. But yeah, like I said, I do think that it would be better to use diga or foie on the single targets. Its a waste to use Buten Shuren Zan or Gravity Strike on a single target, and aT TP is the 2nd best. If its a Polty or a Badira, then maybe I might use melee normal attacks to reserve PP on both blade and madoog. Well, I'm just talking out of my ass, I'm not claiming to know anything and just giving my 2 cents as I've never played Acrotecher in the beta. I only got a chance to play the fighter class in chance I had to play the beta, I never got a chance to try out the techer class.

[Pillan]

On 2007-05-09 14:37, Sounomi wrote:
You haven't even played the damn class. How can you even know how it plays?

Ugh... I'm getting so sick of you fucking idiots that have never fucking played these classes and yet you think you know everything about them

If you don't use offensive techs on an AT you will suck. PERIOD. If you can't grasp the concept of using such techs along side melee (like 98% of the people on these forums) then just shut up about the class since you don't know how it works. Beast and cast ATs are about as worthless as a beast or cast FT. The class works around offensive techs, just like FT. Just because they have a lower tech cap doesn't mean they'll suck using it.

And yes, I should know how the class plays since I spent all 3 weeks of the beta playing it, unlike virtually anyone else here. (I only know of one other person on here that has played it for an extended period of time.)

As I mentioned in my opening statement, my ideas are based purely upon the numbers presented before me. If you want to discredit me simply because I haven’t played the beta, go ahead. You are not required to believe what I say or treat it as law and you’re welcome to voice your opinions and ideas based upon your experience. That’s what this thread is for after all. (I would personally suggest less profanity because it generally dilutes your point regardless of how good it is or how annoying opposing opinions become.)

I disagree when you say Beast and Cast aTs are less useful because there’s only one technique that aT excels in that uses TP at all and a Cast can heal fine with Resta at 11+. Level 41+ Newman Resta seems like overkill to me personally. I also mentioned that you are right that aT clearly would do more technique damage in the case of several targets being within technique range, but I disagree that you’ll get more than 3 targets in your range in the average party which would lead anyone to question whether melee or techniques would do more damage. I answered that question with a simple calculation earlier in that other thread which showed that Buten Shuren-zan does a bit more than half the Dambarta damage per hit even on a female Newman and then brought up the point that Buten Shuren-zan hits twice per Dambarta tick, so in the case of less than 4 targets melee wins out in damage.

You can factor in other things like getting hit and blocking or getting knocked down or enemies being out of range or getting more than 4 targets in the Dambarta range if you want to, but I’m confident enough to stand by that number and say that will be true most of the time. You can also factor in Har/Quick or some other item that the majority of the players don’t possess as well.

I’ll also stand beside my double jeopardy hypothesis which states that any class with lower stats and lower PA limits will never be able to balance with the other classes. You’re losing 10-30% damage as an aT and you already lose 14% base TP and access to rods, so you really will suck. You’re also losing 10-30% melee damage (a lot of melee PAs don’t gain any ATP after level 20, but I’ll assume they gain 1% or 2% per level again after 30) and you have about the same base amount as a GT does right now. You’re losing 15% on the bullets plus whatever element bonus it gains at 31+. It’s clearly not a class that will outdo anyone in terms of damage per time.

I agree that it is the second best techer class, but I disagree that it’s any more or less useful with melee or techs in what I consider the standard party conditions.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Pillan on 2007-05-09 17:47 ]</font>

[Yoshiflash]

hmm...lvl 30 bullets with a 96% atp ..... and S rank cards....

topped off with lvl 41 shifta....

beast and cast will not suck at this.

They will just play it differently.

[Paramedic]

I'm curious to know how Sounomi played AT... (Race, gender, palette selection as well)

[Shiro_Ryuu]

Me too, I wanna know how she did it. I would believe Sounomi more since she's the one who actually tried it.

[Niloklives]

The only thing that has me a bit thrown by this class is at a techer class it lacks the use of bows. I undderstand it was for balancing purposes...but it's just wonky...

Personally I play FT similiarly to how I play GT except using foie and dambarta on a wand and resta/reverser on another witha card in each off hand (normally the first wand is buffs which are now placed on a grinded tomoirod)

the other 3 slots on my pallete are bows with varying bullet types. and while some may say I'm not playing effectiively, I find myself with a very versitile character who is laying out sollid damage from long range and laying down SEs right and left while being able to support my party or take care of myself as needed. I see other forces spamming techs and completely ignoring the rest of the group which I suppose has its merrits..(maybe) and those whoe wish to play acrotecher in a similar way will very likely want to go with a newman...(though they better be using support with those kind of tech lvls)

I think if a Cast or beast wants to play this class more power to them if they can do the job effectively. their primary uses will be to lay down buffs and debuffs and then play the field as they see fit once the support is in place. but if they want to minimize attack tech usage and focus more on support and melee (and I hope the casts are using those twin handguns) why tell them they're wrong for doing it? as long as you get your lvl 41 buffs and debuffs let them do as they please