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  1. #4061

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reilet View Post
    That's a perfect jump cancel Dove, like Gekka... Which you'll never get reliably unless it's directly after a ground used Dispersion Strike. Dove is otherwise 1143 on the ground and like 1333 after something like a full Kite.

    Edit: welp. Crow is getting buffed. Even more reason to use it.
    Interesting. I wonder how big a power buff that is going to be? Going to have to be pretty significant to make a difference.

    I'm not sure what to think about the Dual Blades buffs in general. The Dispersion Shrike change will definitely help in mobbing (this is also one area where I have found Orgei Malice to be useful in my brief experiements with it - the shockwave it adds to Destruction Wing travels a fair distance and hits pretty hard, and Dispersion Shrike builds gear rapidly to fuel it). I suppose the Gear 1 and 2 PA damage increase helps our output between Kestrel Rampage 0's outside of PBF. On the other hand, if Crow is significantly improved enough to be part of a regular combo, given it builds plenty of gear, wouldn't we just go KR0 -> Crow -> 3rd normal or something like that outside of PBF?

    I guess we will know more when we see the new numbers?
    Ship 2:
    Katarin: GUmarl. Lethal precision with a whimsical streak
    "Save the day and look good doing it. That's what this job is all about!"

    Alessandra: FInewearl. A hyperkinetic, photon-fueled mayhem machine.
    "Oho! I actually felt that! You must be pretty strong!."

  2. #4062

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    friendly reminder that Sega managed to kill off BO's Lv85 class skill with a buff to Field Remain, not that upkeep wasnt 100% already but they made sure that skill became pointless instead of counter-acting that by giving a BO only unique trait while fields were up or something.
    Cast - Gt 50, Fg 20, Gm 25
    PSO2 NGS
    Quote Originally Posted by the_importer_ View Post
    Tell you what mate, I'll decide when my topic goes into the QQ post or when it needs to be it's own thing, and you can do the same for yours. Alright, cool. Cheers

  3. #4063

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kril View Post
    friendly reminder that Sega managed to kill off BO's Lv85 class skill with a buff to Field Remain, not that upkeep wasnt 100% already but they made sure that skill became pointless instead of counter-acting that by giving a BO only unique trait while fields were up or something.
    Auto-Field is kind of annoying anyway since Photon Blade Escape doesn't trigger it. At least now I won't have to go out of my way to use Step to dodge (and break my combo in so doing) as often now.
    Ship 2:
    Katarin: GUmarl. Lethal precision with a whimsical streak
    "Save the day and look good doing it. That's what this job is all about!"

    Alessandra: FInewearl. A hyperkinetic, photon-fueled mayhem machine.
    "Oho! I actually felt that! You must be pretty strong!."

  4. #4064

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormwalker View Post
    wouldn't we just go KR0 -> Crow -> 3rd normal or something ?
    You can actually do that combo. It is comparable to Distraction -> weapon action out of PBF. No one does it because no one bothers to see what else bounce can do besides weapon action rotations.

    Distraction -> WA = 1867
    KS0 -> Crow -> N3 = 1811 (ofc w/ max dmg craft)

    Though Kestral got a speed buff and I haven't looked at that yet, so it'll be slightly higher than 1811.

  5. #4065

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reilet View Post
    You can actually do that combo. It is comparable to Distraction -> weapon action out of PBF. No one does it because no one bothers to see what else bounce can do besides weapon action rotations.

    Distraction -> WA = 1867
    KS0 -> Crow -> N3 = 1811 (ofc w/ max dmg craft)

    Though Kestral got a speed buff and I haven't looked at that yet, so it'll be slightly higher than 1811.
    Interesting. That's better than I expected, and when Crow is buffed it'll be even better. Adding Guard Point to Crow will also make it more practical, in the sense of not floating right in front of the boss' face with a sign saying, "Please kill me now".
    Ship 2:
    Katarin: GUmarl. Lethal precision with a whimsical streak
    "Save the day and look good doing it. That's what this job is all about!"

    Alessandra: FInewearl. A hyperkinetic, photon-fueled mayhem machine.
    "Oho! I actually felt that! You must be pretty strong!."

  6. #4066
    Sega Stockholm Syndrome GHNeko's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Reilet View Post
    You can actually do that combo. It is comparable to Distraction -> weapon action out of PBF. No one does it because no one bothers to see what else bounce can do besides weapon action rotations.

    Distraction -> WA = 1867
    KS0 -> Crow -> N3 = 1811 (ofc w/ max dmg craft)

    Though Kestral got a speed buff and I haven't looked at that yet, so it'll be slightly higher than 1811.
    funny you bring up ks0 crow loops

    because i just came to this very conclusion today for trying to make orgei useful. i missed out on serpant so i was like "how do i use this stupid db"

    was gonna use crow > dwing outside of PBF and then some normal stuff during PBF.

    long long time ago when i played FiBo DB, I came up with crow kr0 snatch loops for FiBo Loops and it seems like i'll finally be able to say its optimal now



  7. #4067

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    So, here's a more serious version of an earlier question.

    I like dual blades. I don't really like Jet Boots. I don't hate them, but i can't seem to wrap my head around them. The fact that their whole PA -> Weapon Action gimmick is exactly the reverse of Phantom Shift only causes it to throw me off even more.

    It looks like my Phantom is going to be my main, so for Bouncer I don't feel the need to be completely optimal - but I don't want to be awful on my Bouncer, either. So, while I intend to run DB-only (except for stuff like Anga where you need multiple weapons), I want to do it well.

    I currently have:
    * Serpen Blazes +35 (60 wind)
    * Orgei Malice +35 (60 ice)
    * Orgei Malice (not yet ground) (60 fire)
    * Atra Slecht Ex +35 (60 fire)
    * Another Atra Ex weapon that I'm currently not using and can convert to any other type - including another Dual Blades if I want.

    So, what I'm trying to work out whether it's worthwhile to try to build a rainbow set of 15* dual blades (given that I have 5 of them already). My line of thinking on this is twofold:

    1). My understanding is that Break SD Bonus only gives 80% of the effect of the Break Stance skill itself (i.e. you do not get any benefit out of Break Stance Critical and Break Stance Boost with it). Is this correct? Does this effectively make having/being able to use Elemental Stance essential if I want to have good damage output?

    2). S4: Genesis Ring is clunky, since i need a bunch of ring-swap macros to make it work, and it uses up both my S4 slot AND my right ring slot, which could otherwise be used for damage. Am I correct in seeing this as a significant damage loss?

    The biggest problem I see with trying to build a rainbow set is that while I could have five elements right now with a little work, two of those would be Orgei Malice, and I wonder if the way it messes up the damage rotation during PBF might cost me so much damage as to not be worthwhile.

    So I guess the question is, am I losing more damage by relying on Break SD Bonus or Genesis Ring than I would be by using Orgei Malice for two of the elements in a rainbow set?
    Ship 2:
    Katarin: GUmarl. Lethal precision with a whimsical streak
    "Save the day and look good doing it. That's what this job is all about!"

    Alessandra: FInewearl. A hyperkinetic, photon-fueled mayhem machine.
    "Oho! I actually felt that! You must be pretty strong!."

  8. #4068

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormwalker View Post
    So, here's a more serious version of an earlier question.

    I like dual blades. I don't really like Jet Boots. I don't hate them, but i can't seem to wrap my head around them. The fact that their whole PA -> Weapon Action gimmick is exactly the reverse of Phantom Shift only causes it to throw me off even more.

    It looks like my Phantom is going to be my main, so for Bouncer I don't feel the need to be completely optimal - but I don't want to be awful on my Bouncer, either. So, while I intend to run DB-only (except for stuff like Anga where you need multiple weapons), I want to do it well.

    I currently have:
    * Serpen Blazes +35 (60 wind)
    * Orgei Malice +35 (60 ice)
    * Orgei Malice (not yet ground) (60 fire)
    * Atra Slecht Ex +35 (60 fire)
    * Another Atra Ex weapon that I'm currently not using and can convert to any other type - including another Dual Blades if I want.

    So, what I'm trying to work out whether it's worthwhile to try to build a rainbow set of 15* dual blades (given that I have 5 of them already). My line of thinking on this is twofold:

    1). My understanding is that Break SD Bonus only gives 80% of the effect of the Break Stance skill itself (i.e. you do not get any benefit out of Break Stance Critical and Break Stance Boost with it). Is this correct? Does this effectively make having/being able to use Elemental Stance essential if I want to have good damage output?

    2). S4: Genesis Ring is clunky, since i need a bunch of ring-swap macros to make it work, and it uses up both my S4 slot AND my right ring slot, which could otherwise be used for damage. Am I correct in seeing this as a significant damage loss?

    The biggest problem I see with trying to build a rainbow set is that while I could have five elements right now with a little work, two of those would be Orgei Malice, and I wonder if the way it messes up the damage rotation during PBF might cost me so much damage as to not be worthwhile.

    So I guess the question is, am I losing more damage by relying on Break SD Bonus or Genesis Ring than I would be by using Orgei Malice for two of the elements in a rainbow set?
    I'd say nowadays it's kind of pointless to make a rainbow because you'd need to do a rainbow of the same weapon for the damage differential between Break SD and element to matter (the difference between on-ele element stance and break stance is 5% + element differential which is usually only a few % extras, so basically you need all your DB to be roughly the same power or else, the differential falls way too much)

    your best bet atm if you're commited to bouncer is make one light Atra and one dark Atra, without bothering with the Genesis ring SSA, then cover the other elements with ele stance. Orgei Malice is already Ice and should hold, so you can use it if you like the pot still !

  9. #4069

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zephyrion View Post
    I'd say nowadays it's kind of pointless to make a rainbow because you'd need to do a rainbow of the same weapon for the damage differential between Break SD and element to matter (the difference between on-ele element stance and break stance is 5% + element differential which is usually only a few % extras, so basically you need all your DB to be roughly the same power or else, the differential falls way too much)

    your best bet atm if you're commited to bouncer is make one light Atra and one dark Atra, without bothering with the Genesis ring SSA, then cover the other elements with ele stance. Orgei Malice is already Ice and should hold, so you can use it if you like the pot still !
    Hmm. Am I doing the math wrong?

    Elemental Stance + Elemental Stance Up (with weakness element): 1.2 * 1.1 = 1.32x damage
    Break Stance with Break SD Bonus on non-breakable target: 1.35*0.80=1.08x damage

    That's a lot more than 5% difference.
    Ship 2:
    Katarin: GUmarl. Lethal precision with a whimsical streak
    "Save the day and look good doing it. That's what this job is all about!"

    Alessandra: FInewearl. A hyperkinetic, photon-fueled mayhem machine.
    "Oho! I actually felt that! You must be pretty strong!."

  10. #4070

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stormwalker View Post
    Hmm. Am I doing the math wrong?

    Elemental Stance + Elemental Stance Up (with weakness element): 1.2 * 1.1 = 1.32x damage
    Break Stance with Break SD Bonus on non-breakable target: 1.35*0.80=1.08x damage

    That's a lot more than 5% difference.
    It is calculated as (1+(0.35x0.80))=128%.

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