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  1. #1181
    Sega Stockholm Syndrome GHNeko's Avatar
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    How are you inflicting Jellen with Hr?



  2. #1182

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    Quote Originally Posted by GHNeko View Post
    How are you inflicting Jellen with Hr?
    I'm not.
    Just figure it's worth considering with Ph around. 5% more damage with a Ph in the mpa, or a passive ~1% at all times is basically the choice.

  3. #1183
    Sega Stockholm Syndrome GHNeko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maninbluejumpsuit View Post
    I'm not.
    Just figure it's worth considering with Ph around. 5% more damage with a Ph in the mpa, or a passive ~1% at all times is basically the choice.
    Oh I wouldnt then personally. I dont feel like it's worth it unless you put that Jellen S1 on TMG and use normal to inflict it.



  4. #1184

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    Quote Originally Posted by milranduil View Post
    rising + 1 slash slam x2 normal3 was better than vapor vapor normal3 before the update, if only by a little bit. now with the buff, it's much better. vapor is basically for tracking, airborne stuff, or precision, not for optimal dps anymore.

    as for talis, you listed 3 bosses that have very few lockons at all making wise hound *not* worth it in those situations (beyond tossing it out for gear only). additionally, bosses like deus have 15% t-atk resist for pets/hero talis making racer racer normal3 garbage dps for them.
    Oh.
    But how about the dpp? It's just as important as dps in most situations.
    Whenever I use hr sword combos I run out of pp fast with the r slash combo and still pretty fast with the vapor combo compared to with talis. Swapping to tmg for pp regen and back also wastes some time and I always get the feeling over the course of the entire fight I do overall more damage with talis cause I don't have to refill pp nearly as much (nm weapon swapping, refilling time cuts into the dps).
    Dunno how much changed since the buff but I doubt it's overly much.

    That aside, any data on how efficient it is to refill pp on hr talis with normals vs swapping to tmg and back? It's of course slower but then talis normals have nice dps and you don't have to swap weapons.

  5. #1185

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    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    Oh.
    But how about the dpp? It's just as important as dps in most situations.
    Whenever I use hr sword combos I run out of pp fast with the r slash combo and still pretty fast with the vapor combo compared to with talis. Swapping to tmg for pp regen and back also wastes some time and I always get the feeling over the course of the entire fight I do overall more damage with talis cause I don't have to refill pp nearly as much (nm weapon swapping, refilling time cuts into the dps).
    Dunno how much changed since the buff but I doubt it's overly much.
    I already told you, the DPP is better than vapor; you're doing more than 1.5 times the damage as vapor for only ~1.25 times the PP.
    The DPP difference is on the swiki chart. If the values haven't been updated since EP6 adjustments, it's even better than what's shown there.
    Last edited by Maninbluejumpsuit; May 12, 2019 at 06:38 PM.

  6. #1186
    エターナルブレイバー milranduil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    Oh.
    But how about the dpp? It's just as important as dps in most situations.
    Whenever I use hr sword combos I run out of pp fast with the r slash combo and still pretty fast with the vapor combo compared to with talis. Swapping to tmg for pp regen and back also wastes some time and I always get the feeling over the course of the entire fight I do overall more damage with talis cause I don't have to refill pp nearly as much (nm weapon swapping, refilling time cuts into the dps).
    Dunno how much changed since the buff but I doubt it's overly much.

    That aside, any data on how efficient it is to refill pp on hr talis with normals vs swapping to tmg and back? It's of course slower but then talis normals have nice dps and you don't have to swap weapons.
    1x slash x2 normal3 combos were 25% better DPP before the rising buff, so even more so now. it's ironic that you ask about efficiency of swapping to tmg or not for talis when sword normals are much better dps than talis normals to begin with.

    i don't really care which weapon you use personally, if you prefer playing talis then play talis. it's only a problem when you make objectively false statements that rising slash isn't that good or has bad DPP when it is sword's best DPS and DPP PA. having a preference is perfectly fine, dumping bad info is not

  7. #1187

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    Quote Originally Posted by milranduil View Post
    1x slash x2 normal3 combos were 25% better DPP before the rising buff, so even more so now. it's ironic that you ask about efficiency of swapping to tmg or not for talis when sword normals are much better dps than talis normals to begin with.

    i don't really care which weapon you use personally, if you prefer playing talis then play talis. it's only a problem when you make objectively false statements that rising slash isn't that good or has bad DPP when it is sword's best DPS and DPP PA. having a preference is perfectly fine, dumping bad info is not
    Yeah, I was wrong. I rarely get any straight answers about hr stuff and I don't want to parse so it's hard to verify for me.
    My issue (and question) with the dpp is that over an entire fight you'll have to refill pp no matter what so if you use a combo with high dps but low dpp the dps across the entire fight might be lower than using a combo with higher dpp, i.e. sword combos vs talis combo.

    Anyway, with 1x slash x2 normal3 combos you mean the [RSlash hold until 1st midair slash + down slash] x2 > [3rd normal] combo?

  8. #1188

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    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    Anyway, with 1x slash x2 normal3 combos you mean the [RSlash hold until 1st midair slash + down slash] x2 > [3rd normal] combo?
    yes, exactly what we've been saying.

    the buff that RS got only pushed Vapor x2 normal to 3rd place otherwise everything has been mostly the same
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    Tell you what mate, I'll decide when my topic goes into the QQ post or when it needs to be it's own thing, and you can do the same for yours. Alright, cool. Cheers

  9. #1189
    エターナルブレイバー milranduil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    Yeah, I was wrong. I rarely get any straight answers about hr stuff and I don't want to parse so it's hard to verify for me.
    My issue (and question) with the dpp is that over an entire fight you'll have to refill pp no matter what so if you use a combo with high dps but low dpp the dps across the entire fight might be lower than using a combo with higher dpp, i.e. sword combos vs talis combo.

    Anyway, with 1x slash x2 normal3 combos you mean the [RSlash hold until 1st midair slash + down slash] x2 > [3rd normal] combo?
    yes.

    that's what sword normals are for, their dps is still very good.

  10. #1190

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kril View Post
    yes, exactly what we've been saying.

    the buff that RS got only pushed Vapor x2 normal to 3rd place otherwise everything has been mostly the same
    Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by milranduil View Post
    yes.

    that's what sword normals are for, their dps is still very good.
    I know sword normals have good dps, used to be a bit more than Rising Slash before the buff.
    But PP refill of sword normals is really bad with only 11pp and Talis refills 28pp in few less frames.
    Wasn't Talis normal 1+2+3 1180 dps? It's now 1052 now.

    The dps chart seems weird though, for example it says tmg normals have 1066 dps but 1279 with attack pp save, how is lower pp cost supposed to raise dps?
    Also, iirc RSlash was 1289 dps when I checked shortly after the buff happened. Looks like someone there a few mistakes with the dps charts the last time someone edited it.

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