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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by otakun View Post
    Sorry, I have a terrible memory, I just remember they werent on their usual set. I think it was the live broadcast where they had the Dekgeki people on.
    That was from their live streamers asking them why do they repeat the same content over and over again (in the context here Xmas on Ice), and their reply was that their engine is pretty limited in what they can do and they don't want to spend a lot of time on it when they can just use what they already have. They apologize for it, but they blame their engine.
    PSO2 Details: Ship 02 || Sirius-91 Cast || Lacey-458 Caseal || Team: ChibiRoar!

    Quote Originally Posted by Xerenia View Post
    Oh no! What am i going to do, this was my whole entire life, and now it's going to be gone. :C Guess i'll just go and troll other proxies. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

  2. #12

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    Can you blame the negs? When I first started playing back in 2014, it took me a year to catch up by doing everything that EP1 & EP2 had to offer. I left in spring of 2016 (before the Yamatto EQ) and when I came back in October 2017, it took me 3 months to catch up to everything I had miss.

    All that's left is to get 7 classes from 75 to 80, finish my last 2 achievements for Lv50 Tech crafting and get 1000 Titles. In short, SEGA is getting lazier with every episodes.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirius-91 View Post
    That was from their live streamers asking them why do they repeat the same content over and over again (in the context here Xmas on Ice), and their reply was that their engine is pretty limited in what they can do and they don't want to spend a lot of time on it when they can just use what they already have. They apologize for it, but they blame their engine.
    Duly noted.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirius-91 View Post
    That was from their live streamers asking them why do they repeat the same content over and over again (in the context here Xmas on Ice), and their reply was that their engine is pretty limited in what they can do and they don't want to spend a lot of time on it when they can just use what they already have. They apologize for it, but they blame their engine.
    I don't know if they realized that their current way with repeating content is really killing the game. They probably do...but...don't want to spend a lot of time on it....ok...
    test

  5. #15

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    Regardless of whether they realize it or not, if the engine sucks they can't do shit about it. They admitted in one of the interviews that PSO2 was originally a low-budget experiment. The amount of traction it got was most likely unexpected.

    At this point I mostly blame it on SoJ executives for not giving the dev team enough resources to get rid of the technical debt so that the process of making any changes to the game wasn't so painful. Japanese corporate culture is far, far from the healthiest.

  6. #16
    Hardcore Casual Dark Mits's Avatar
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    The engine may be limited when it comes to creating new unique type of content, I can understand that. But reusing assets and game logic with new textures shouldn't be a technical hurdle. I mean, they can create new fashion items without slowing down at all, so I don't think it's an issue of "the game runs out of indexing options". I don't understand why it would be hard to create a new Free Field that uses Naberius logic in environment creation using Enchanted Forest textures and lightning, and spawning Demons.

  7. #17

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    Very strange, considering the whole procedural field system seems to be designed specifically to avoid manually crafting maps and "spending a lot of time on it".
    Yet they recently did everything to avoid any modular fields, up to a point map is actually a bunch of setpieces put together like Vegas or Buster.

    Unless something terrible was hardcoded in 2012 into field generation algorythm, or its so inefficient that procedural generation will kill servers on peak time, then I dont understand why they can quickly add something like two AQs and make change to two ult maps, make a dengeki city map, but hesitate to do it in seasonals and ult amduscia. Unless people related to its creation have left the development long ago, and those who work today have only this much time to retrofit unused modules from previous development. But that would be bizarre.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by silo1991 View Post
    if is because of gameplay i agree ,in case of the story is aceptable for me :/ and would be better is the updates were more constant (specialy if we see characters of ep 1 to 3 which were absent in EP4 )

    i wonder why JP players didnt complain about the artistic direction of EP4 , at least that would make artist be more creative with the enemies desings and the story

    in sumary all the dislike is because of gameplay :P
    Nice projection. Ep 5 makes ep 4 look like a masterpiece - not just in gameplay. Story-wise, art design, everything. JP players realize this while western ones still have a hateboner for ep 4 that just won't go away. Sounds like a medical condition.

  9. #19
    The Lone Gamer of the Apockalypse Zorak000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by isCasted View Post
    Regardless of whether they realize it or not, if the engine sucks they can't do shit about it. They admitted in one of the interviews that PSO2 was originally a low-budget experiment. The amount of traction it got was most likely unexpected.

    At this point I mostly blame it on SoJ executives for not giving the dev team enough resources to get rid of the technical debt so that the process of making any changes to the game wasn't so painful. Japanese corporate culture is far, far from the healthiest.
    yeah this is probably the best explanation of most of it, including the regional servers, and stuff that screams "corporate made us do it" which usually results in them later throwing us a bone or two when corporate is done looking at it

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Mits View Post
    The engine may be limited when it comes to creating new unique type of content, I can understand that. But reusing assets and game logic with new textures shouldn't be a technical hurdle. I mean, they can create new fashion items without slowing down at all, so I don't think it's an issue of "the game runs out of indexing options". I don't understand why it would be hard to create a new Free Field that uses Naberius logic in environment creation using Enchanted Forest textures and lightning, and spawning Demons.
    The thing about technical debt is that it works in mysterious ways. A single-responsibility principle ("Every class/function does only the thing it's designed to do") is a very reasonable thing to follow until you suddenly find out that more things need to be done, but it's too late to rewrite large chunks of code in a new way, the deadline is soon, it's 4 AM on Sunday etc. So you make a compromise, let an entity or two do some extra things, assume that they're going to work under certain specific conditions (like assets having specific properties) and not handle the corner cases properly etc. Or maybe you think you can afford the debt, because you're merely prototyping and not making the final solution, so you'll do it for real later, and the "later" somehow never happens.

    And then you somehow end up with unique environment creation logic for every single area in the game, each for some odd fucking reason having to pass unique data to player logic, enemy AI etc, also having to read and write some of that data to a shared global state at a very specific memory offset, allocating a very specific amount of memory that you have to guess (because there's no way to estimate it, let alone let the engine calculate it automatically; having memory amount just be adjusted as necessary automatically instead of having a chunk with a fixed precalculated size would simply be a dream) for everything and all that other bullcrap. Nobody on the team knows how it ended up this way, other than that they had some potential improvement ideas in the past that were abandoned due to time constraints. So the best you know is: 1) what absolutely must be changed when you copy and paste all of that garbage if you just want to make a copy and 2) all of the things you have to remember to change for every single thing you'll want to change. At this point you just want to assume that things will work, because you really can't be sure.

    So you want to try adding a new field. Suppose you've had fields with up to 10 000 000 polygons, and fields with up to 1000 light sources (I'm really stretching it with this example, but I hope it makes a point). At the moment you only want to make sure your engine can handle 4 000 000 polygons and 600 light sources. You might expect a crash due to lack of memory, so you know you can fix that if you need to. You might have some stutter, but whatever. What happens is certainly something you wouldn't expect - the music is fucked up. After hours, maybe even days of trying to find out the cause it turns out that you did, in fact, not allocate not enough memory, but the reason it didn't crash was because it was writing data to a very much usable chunk of memory that just so happened to be shared with music. Why weren't graphics fucked up then? Oh, they actually were, you just didn't notice that shadows were slightly off. More so, the bug doesn't happen in the offline mode, because for some weird reason the networking algorithm uses extra memory because your new field has slightly rounder corners than usual, and so the memory allocator packs different memory chunks together tighter. So you are asking what kind of asshole designed it this way, and you hear a story of a guy who was fired 2 years ago who was a team leader. He dared to ask the executives to give some extra time to make the code slightly more future-proof after missing a deadline because how fucking dare he not do everything right the first time around. Yet if it wasn't for his hyper-efficient networking algorithm the game wouldn't have been shipped at all.

    I am so fucking bored today...

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