Ares NT UQ 100% RDR Campaign - Now over, we're finally off this ride

[Zephyrion]

-snip

Which kinda brings me to this. I feel like everyone is way too much in love with the old CF system... Between the insanely grindy one from mainstay quest (RQ, Amdu UQ) and the EQ CF (better have the time and will to attend most of the EQS to get your baby to +35 because you sure as hell won't be getting any as a drop with such abysmal rates). The issue was alleviated a lot from when solo PD and Union revival happened onwards thanks to more straightforward files, better file rate filling, and longer time windows before file expiration, but the drop rates for Union, Astra and Zeine/Qliphad were still absolute undefendable garbage.

A simple solution to the current gear problem would be making all CF weapons stronger so that they are actually worthwhile alternatives while still being dethroned by BiS weapons. I mean cmon, Mars, which was the best CF weapon series we ever got as of EP5 still doesn't even come close to how strong and versatile Invade is, and therefore, as all CF weapons, end up as SSA fodder. It doesn't really make sense for them to be THAT underwhelming since they still require some effort to acquire. If BiS are power-creeping, CF weapons should follow suit. rant end

[Jene-chan]

Also, campaigns are meant to cycle content so that we don't get bored seeing the same areas and enemies all the time.

this could be done naturally if content was designed to be rewarding in a more permanent sense

content being worthless outside of specific boost periods is the sign of poor design

people don't mind rng as a form of progression, but when it's the /only/ method of obtaining something, so don't be surprised when people get frustrated at it. pso2 used to actually do achievement-based progression but then they stopped mid episode 5. atra weapons are actually a good example of this sort of system working properly. as was said above, i would be game for running a lot of these revivals if the goal wasn't totally removed from any independent effort on my part other than my time with no guarantee of my effort being rewarded

[Aexorcet]

This is a hot issue in reward design, not just for Sega but for literally every online game developer.

- Make rewards entirely 100% deterministic -> Hardcore players earn them asap -> Hardcore players will start QQ-ing that there is literally nothing to do in-game. If content is released at the rate at which hardcore players earn their rewards, non-hardcore players are left behind and quit because they will never ever be able to keep up.

I still find it hard to understand playing the game for nothing but rewards. There has to be something else that makes you want to play. The focus just needs to be on that thing. Hopefully, that would be engaging gameplay. Maybe leaderboards if people want something more tangible. It can also be other avenues to important items like meseta, excubes, grind success boosters, etc. The top weapon helps you get more of those things and isn't the totality of the reward in itself.

- Make rewards drop from multiple content instead of only one -> Literally everyone flocks to the path of least resistance and the rest of the game is rotting and people can't find a group for it.

This isn't all that different from now. They just need to have rotations or something, like you said later in your post. Or, as they did with CF's, require different content to build up to one reward.

There is no reward system that will keep the playerbase happy.

I'm sure that it's very possible to influence what percentage is happy or unhappy, or to make it so that the worst situation that a player can face is only so bad.

[ArcaneTechs]

I think there's a treshold that shouldn't be reached with bad rng...65hours of farming for peanuts = ditching the game once and for all with me. Farming 10 hours non stop Forest when boost was up and getting nothing worth out of it was my last time doing such stupidity for a game which turn to not be one anymore. Am not seeking a secondary job especially when I don't get my bill at end of the day.
'Fuck you sega you won't get me anymore' became a leitmotiv lately...

Edit: Gratz Kril but that's still way too much time for what it's worth.

thanks and im 250% with you, i had a massive suspicion they would pull the lowby drop rates again and they did which is why i farmed so hard despite having to work so i can at least get 3 drops and be done but i needed stuff as SU so that kept me there even longer than i wanted (i was done with Ares on Sat). while everyone got easy SU drops, i wasnt and still struggling with Marron while Melon keeps on coming to me (9 melon 14* eggs)

but ya, i wanted the grind out of the way. thats why i went hard

[vantpers]

- Make rewards drop from multiple content instead of only one -> Literally everyone flocks to the path of least resistance and the rest of the game is rotting and people can't find a group for it.

Not really true since at some point people just get tired of doing only one thing and they might want to do something else just not to go crazy, other even if a bit less efficient ways are only ignored by certain kind of people that absolutely want to suffer for a virtual drop. Looking for a group is also a design problem because free exploration is great when it comes to running underpopulated content. You can fire up your favourite quest and have people join on the go instead of having people join and leave at 5/12 teleporter.

[pso2god]

I'll take your "word" for it then it

i havent seen a single 14* from mother/deus, apprentice or dragon/atrum, so i know what you mean, im lucky i get Val and that's if it even comes with a SSA

[zangechan]

ya and how do we know he didnt just read my post and put a higher farm hour count out of frustration? I could have easily said the same thing and moved on


It's not a competition but I'm not sure I even believe you farmed longer than me this past week and didnt get at least 1 Ares and by farming, I mean at least 8-15hrs days this past week

I got 5 merons, 2 marons, a parfait and 12 dias, No Ares. I'm also not the psychopath who goes into every thread related to a farm-able area boosted by campaign and tell people to just grind more because "I've gotten things to drop"

also lol @ not realizing how fucking moronic you sound when you're like "you should have gotten an ares" and then later say "i havent gotten a 14* from an eq" like lmfao dude

[ArcaneTechs]

I got 5 merons, 2 marons, a parfait and 12 dias, No Ares. I'm also not the psychopath who goes into every thread related to a farm-able area boosted by campaign and tell people to just grind more because "I've gotten things to drop"

also lol @ not realizing how fucking moronic you sound when you're like "you should have gotten an ares" and then later say "i havent gotten a 14* from an eq" like lmfao dude

imagine being this triggered kek

imagine all this whining is for nothing when you and everyone else will dump these in the trash once Austere NT finally becomes available

i put a trigger warning for a reason. meanwhile someone thinks im upset over phobos drops (because the series is so good right?)

[Dark Mits]

A simple solution to the current gear problem would be making all CF weapons stronger so that they are actually worthwhile alternatives while still being dethroned by BiS weapons.

This is also another topic of discussion. How "worse" should a farmable equipment piece be compared to RNG drop? Generally I agree with you, because if the absolute BiS RNG drop is even just 0.5% better than some farmable equipment, then the "blessed" players have a very very very slight advantage potential, but nothing that would have meaningful performance impact.

@Jene-chan: But how long should content be relevant? Again another great topic for discussion. If we go by CF availability for example, Underground Nightmare will be relevant up to the next 4 and half months in addition to the already 1 and half months past us. If the Atra series remains one of the top-3 weapons till the end of EP5, that means that Crimson Dragon will be relevant content for over 12 months. How long can content remain relevant before the playerbase starts complaining that we shouldn't have to rerun X-month old content for new stuff?

And on a different tangent, we have EXP farming. Daily FQ are by far the best source for it. This means that content from all the way back to EP1 is relevant for EXP farming, which is a very active part of the game. Time Attacks/XQ are the obvious sources for meseta.

I still find it hard to understand playing the game for nothing but rewards. There has to be something else that makes you want to play. The focus just needs to be on that thing. Hopefully, that would be engaging gameplay.

Multiple reasons to play a game. The common factor for the majority is the sense of progression. Remove progress from a game and the game will still have players every day, but at reduced numbers. Sort of like how we rarely re-touch an offline single-player game after we complete it.

Not really true since at some point people just get tired of doing only one thing and they might want to do something else just not to go crazy, other even if a bit less efficient ways are only ignored by certain kind of people that absolutely want to suffer for a virtual drop.

True. But the point where people hit that "burn-out" with the most efficient path is different for each of us. For example, check how many people run Boss Rush FQ multiple times per day when it's available compared to the rest of the 4th Daily FQs. Personally I only run it once for the sake of getting the daily reward. But I know of some Team members who ignore the rest of the content during the days when Boss Rush is available.

[Jene-chan]

@Jene-chan: But how long should content be relevant? Again another great topic for discussion. If we go by CF availability for example, Underground Nightmare will be relevant up to the next 4 and half months in addition to the already 1 and half months past us. If the Atra series remains one of the top-3 weapons till the end of EP5, that means that Crimson Dragon will be relevant content for over 12 months. How long can content remain relevant before the playerbase starts complaining that we shouldn't have to rerun X-month old content for new stuff?

EQs are different as the game is based around those getting cycled in and out. I'm more referring to the mountain of persistent content that has died because we've basically outgrown the rewards for it. Advanced, Extreme (not Solo EX), Challenge, Riding, Ultimate, and Buster. All of these modes which were interesting in their inclusion and get played when they get randomly boosted, but always die once they're no longer rewarding. All these modes that people could potentially be running IF there was more incentive to run them outside of small boost periods. It's really telling that if someone says "I want to run Ult Nab to get Nem NT" and you just talk them down from it because the rates are low and nobody is going to be doing it.