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  1. #121
    Sega Stockholm Syndrome GHNeko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TehCubey View Post
    @Kril where did the evil casuals hurt you? You can say, I won't tell others, promise.


    i think the casuals hurt him in the form of wasting countless boosters and stealing away dozens upon dozens of runs over the years because he decided to pug up for whatever reason and rolled a shitty MPA.

    happened to me and i hate it; nothing is less fun then having people's own personal methods of enjoying PSO2 impact mine. they can do what they want, but considering i can't directly prevent said people from finding their way into my MPAs; i'd rather have a method of filtering said people out to some degree.

    no offense to casuals, but regardless of the nomenclature for "expert matching", the purpose is to seperate people with a subpar understanding and/or below average performance from people who give enough of shit to at least learn to cheese. it makes no sense that people who care to do well or get good results in the game should be subjected to people who think nothing of others around them and do as they please without consideration to people's boosters and efforts; especially when making private MPAs isnt always an option so to say "just find a private group" as a counterpoint to people wanting higher quality pugs via filtering is pretty messed up imo.

    on top of that, expert match making needs to keep up with the power scaling of the game. as such it needs to keep going up in difficulty, while also not being gated behind good rng or bad rng as well as not being time gated via limited runs. Anyone should be able to attempt to become an expert at any time and as much as they want without limit, while also making sure that you can meet minimum requirements for performance and understanding of your class and the game.

    seems good to me tbh

    not like expert is required anyways. i dont see why people want to keep the barrier so low for something that isnt necessary. it's already fairly easy as it is.
    Last edited by GHNeko; Apr 21, 2019 at 08:49 PM.



  2. #122

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    Well it seems most of the issue is with the year old solo XQ part, so I will be a nice guy and compile the fastest runs of each class I can find.

    Summoner (2:57): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LSSlzqIZPY
    Hero (2:57.9): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6it8wwUiAg
    Gunner (2:56): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=001ZE3UqpxE
    Hunter (2:46): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIIv78oTqjM
    Braver (3:26): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECKuZUhJm30
    Fighter (3:30) (I don't believe this is the fastest but whatever I guess): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xgkyH4blKk
    Force (2:32) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4ceCtlTEWo
    Bouncer (4:46) (again, can't find faster but there must be): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRSjtfuNlFk
    Ranger (5:02) (same deal): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ioNbUfe2s
    Techer (7:46) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuKZxVMtabQ&

    By the way some of these were done almost a year ago but this quest isn't that famous to time attack. Also one of these was done by me and I don't even play this game.
    Last edited by dont_talk_to_me; Apr 21, 2019 at 09:24 PM.

  3. #123

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    Quote Originally Posted by GHNeko View Post
    i think the casuals hurt him in the form of wasting countless boosters and stealing away dozens upon dozens of runs over the years because he decided to pug up for whatever reason and rolled a shitty MPA.

    /post
    I know all of that and I too get annoyed when I get a crap MPA with an average of 20k DPS, which is why I think it's a good idea that we are back to expert reqs you can't get carried to clear.

    But my comment wasn't about all that, it's about Kril ranting about participation trophies, Sekiro and muh politics in video games. What does all of that shit have to do with PSO2? You want to rant about that, go to /v/ or something.

  4. #124
    Sega Stockholm Syndrome GHNeko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TehCubey View Post
    I know all of that and I too get annoyed when I get a crap MPA with an average of 20k DPS, which is why I think it's a good idea that we are back to expert reqs you can't get carried to clear.

    But my comment wasn't about all that, it's about Kril ranting about participation trophies, Sekiro and muh politics in video games. What does all of that shit have to do with PSO2? You want to rant about that, go to /v/ or something.
    considering the pushback he's been getting before that point for supporting the idea of a filter, i'm not surprised he lost his cool lol

    the word elitist has absolutely been used in an unfair and undeserved fashion already.



  5. #125

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    If you guys want to throw opinions on what kind of quest is best for the expert requirement, that is completely fine. But if you start pointing at each other on who's elite and casual, I don't think you will find the answer here, ever. We have run into this discussion many times; expert block introduction, expert block req change, and random times when casual/elite topic is brought in, but we will always stuck on the same loop if we talk like this.

    I always see most of pso-world people always try to make themselves to look like they are part of the 1% (if not, less than 1%) of the whole player base, judging on how you guys keep trying to get into the best meta you can find and ditch every other opinion that in fact probably contributes less than that, even by 5 - 10% difference of a single run. That is completely OK, since we are debating about being an expert by expert requirement here, and we always try to be the best and help others to be the best even though some don't really want to, but is that number of players is the right number to gate people as expert for the PSO2 team? I'm pretty sure we all don't know.

    In my opinion, sega doesn't provide this "expert" gate as a mean to make players good individually, but rather to make each of you who is an expert or feel like an expert to easily find people who actually strive to be better; players with closely the same goal, while also at least keeping the blatant leechers at the bare minimum. This way, it's much easier for you to filter people who really want to play the best they can, to form the dream team/group you ever wanted.

    So I believe sega is trying their best to keep expert requirement to gate probably 10% - 20% of the players whether we like it or not, leaving enough space for people who aren't satisfied with that to form their dream team from the people they found there. If they keep the expert threshold below 1 - 2%, then there really is no point.

    It's always our job in the end to find a proper mpa, and if we say this expert block is the only ideal mean to do that, I think we're on the wrong track.

    I think it might be good to assess the expert requirement by that view.

  6. #126

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    Quote Originally Posted by TehCubey View Post
    I know all of that and I too get annoyed when I get a crap MPA with an average of 20k DPS, which is why I think it's a good idea that we are back to expert reqs you can't get carried to clear.

    But my comment wasn't about all that, it's about Kril ranting about participation trophies, Sekiro and muh politics in video games. What does all of that shit have to do with PSO2? You want to rant about that, go to /v/ or something.
    Exactly. That's my real point. There's a gray area between leecher and expert, especially since being good at soloing and being good at party content isn't the exact same thing. Some people can be good at their class' toolkit but a.) get messed up by everything focusing them down all at once (especially when multiple bosses at once are involved) and/or b.) main a class that's sub-par at solo content (especially speed kills which are a new objective for this.)

    My real frustration with PSOW is how fucking toxic it is to anyone that doesn't fit its definition of "skilled," not the existence of a new and improved Expert rank. The place acts like "wasting Triboosters" is the worst thing in existence.

  7. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shinamori View Post
    It took me 11 mins to just beat mother. I don't really don't see who these are "easy".
    It took me 2 tries to S rank this quest on braver and I just started playing braver this week.

    Can you record yourself doing an 11 minute mother?

  8. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mega Ultra Chicken View Post
    Exactly. That's my real point. There's a gray area between leecher and expert, especially since being good at soloing and being good at party content isn't the exact same thing. Some people can be good at their class' toolkit but a.) get messed up by everything focusing them down all at once (especially when multiple bosses at once are involved) and/or b.) main a class that's sub-par at solo content (especially speed kills which are a new objective for this.)

    My real frustration with PSOW is how fucking toxic it is to anyone that doesn't fit its definition of "skilled," not the existence of a new and improved Expert rank. The place acts like "wasting Triboosters" is the worst thing in existence.
    You say speed kills but neither of the S rank requirements are really tight. If they are, guess what, It looks like it's time to reassess how good you truly are vs how good you think you are. Honestly, and I'm not trying to call anyone out, but most of the time people who think they are 90% good at their class are closer to 50% Which is fine. However it stops being fine when you are trying to blame the game or the elitists for your inability to do something. Yes, some classes are much worse at solo than others. Yes, some people would rather sit and just press their offensive abilities without any of that inconvenient gameplay bullshit getting in their way. However as I had said before, this place seems to be more skewed to people calling out said elitists than actual elitists.

  9. #129

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    Quote Originally Posted by dont_talk_to_me View Post
    You say speed kills but neither of the S rank requirements are really tight. If they are, guess what, It looks like it's time to reassess how good you truly are vs how good you think you are. Honestly, and I'm not trying to call anyone out, but most of the time people who think they are 90% good at their class are closer to 50% Which is fine. However it stops being fine when you are trying to blame the game or the elitists for your inability to do something. Yes, some classes are much worse at solo than others. Yes, some people would rather sit and just press their offensive abilities without any of that inconvenient gameplay bullshit getting in their way. However as I had said before, this place seems to be more skewed to people calling out said elitists than actual elitists.
    Except I was not blaming them for my inability to S-rank those quests. My issue comes from treating trying and failing as identical to not trying.

    My issues with PSOW go way further back than this change. Then again, there was a different member base back then too.
    Last edited by Mega Ultra Chicken; Apr 21, 2019 at 09:30 PM.

  10. #130

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mega Ultra Chicken View Post
    Except I was not blaming them for my inability to S-rank those quests. My issue comes from treating trying and failing as identical to not trying.
    Actually no. From what I have seen, the attitude is the issue rather than the actual outcome. People will always sperg out because they have their e-peen fuckery. However, casual is more of a mindset than a playstyle and people often forget this. Good players can be casual and tryhards can be not so good. But people look at it as your skill level is based of how much you no life. Now, if you are trying and failing but you're not willing to give up until you can find some way to get it done that is fine, even admirable. If you are trying and failing and then in the end you decided to give up since its not for you and you end up accepting that you probably wont have expert for now, then that is also fine and fairly level headed.

    But if you try and fail, then start to get upset at how the quest isn't fair, or isn't mpa related content so it has no effect on your ability to perform in mpa related content or basically have to make excuses for why you can't do it while trying to either shift the responsibility off of yourself OR blame the system itself for being wrong then that's where the issue arises. It's not an entitlement, it's a privilege that is earned.

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