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  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zephyrion View Post
    Am I the only one satisfied with the state of things ? everyone got 2 to 3 weapons with tons of PAs, and more to come? If anything I'd want them to do a major PA damage/behavior for most of the less useful PAs (shoutouts to FI for not even using a third of their PAs).

    We got major balance overhaul in EP5 along with new skills (more or less impactful, that I can agree with) and more to come, old classes are still changing as much as they used to, and only really stagnated in EP4 sooo...I'm calling nostalgia lenses on this one.

    If any new weapons were to came out, I'd rather have those on a whole new class with their own skills and all
    The old PA's are old, they belong in episode 1. The new enemies and challenges require modern gameplay tactics. There's no way to make old classes dynamic like phantom of hero without a new weapon type that changes how the old classes fight.

  2. #22

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    I think old PAs and weapons are mostly fine. At most, I would like if they removed hitstop altogether, but not a big deal. What I really want though, is for a revamp for regular attacks. For me, a big reason advance classes feel smooth is because you can rely in their normal attacks for more than just PP healing(fast, almost no hitstop, aoe, good damage) and lets be real, they have better aesthetics which play a big deal in making things feel smooth.

    Now to be fair, they did increase the damage already and also added more stuff, but some still feel lacking(partizan, rifle, rod and talis) and overall they still feel slow (Sac Bite Sword is one of the best normals with both DPS and Aoe, but it doest feel anywhere close as smooth as Hero Sword). I can understand that they cant be as good as the advanced classes, but I would like the whole animations were changed into new faster and flashier ones

  3. #23

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    Hero's talis have PSO slicers PA, while phantom rods have PSU Slicers PA. Now... where are my PSZ slicers?

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyHarken View Post
    The old PA's are old, they belong in episode 1. The new enemies and challenges require modern gameplay tactics. There's no way to make old classes dynamic like phantom of hero without a new weapon type that changes how the old classes fight.
    Why would you ever want that tho ? Old classes trades ease of use and fluidity for massive DPS when you set them up properly. Most of the actually useful PAs with proper conditional setup do way more than any successor class could ever hope to achieve. It's just a different way of playing which is fine in my book.

    Like personal opinion but LOTS of people complain about Ranger not being fluid enough, or Hunter being too slow, but isn't that also fine ? I don't always want to zip around and kill things with lightning fast multi-hits, sometimes I also feel like going for giant swords that feel like I'm swinging actual claymores, indulge in partisan combo system and peculiar rhythm (nailing combos, playing around them to set your charge parries correctly, managing your PP and being rewarded for keeping up with all your tools by good ol graptor nuke makes me feel better than anything successor classes ever had to offer to me, but that's personal feelings), or just play with my positioning to then unleash rifle and launcher nukes on enemies. While I wouldn't be against further QoL I defo don't want them to completely change what makes Hunter and Ranger...well Hunter and Ranger.

    tl;dr Smoothing things up is fine, but overhauling old classes too much would only bring boring uniformization. Phantom is fun because it's the only one playing this way, same for Hero
    Last edited by Zephyrion; Apr 28, 2019 at 06:31 AM.

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zephyrion View Post
    Why would you ever want that tho ? Old classes trades ease of use and fluidity for massive DPS when you set them up properly. Most of the actually useful PAs with proper conditional setup do way more than any successor class could ever hope to achieve. It's just a different way of playing which is fine in my book.

    Like personal opinion but LOTS of people complain about Ranger not being fluid enough, or Hunter being too slow, but isn't that also fine ? I don't always want to zip around and kill things with lightning fast multi-hits, sometimes I also feel like going for giant swords that feel like I'm swinging actual claymores, indulge in partisan combo system and peculiar rhythm (nailing combos, playing around them to set your charge parries correctly, managing your PP and being rewarded for keeping up with all your tools by good ol graptor nuke makes me feel better than anything successor classes ever had to offer to me, but that's personal feelings), or just play with my positioning to then unleash rifle and launcher nukes on enemies. While I wouldn't be against further QoL I defo don't want them to completely change what makes Hunter and Ranger...well Hunter and Ranger.

    tl;dr Smoothing things up is fine, but overhauling old classes too much would only bring boring uniformization. Phantom is fun because it's the only one playing this way, same for Hero

    Not sure if you're not quite getting what I'm trying to say, but I never mentioned changing the old classes. I clearly said new weapons with more dynamic options to be added, not replace what is already there. Also, please remember that I never mentioned their DPS was lacking. Been playing Ranger for since the game has existed, and I recently tried Phantom, which made me realized that SEGA is just keeping old classes relevant by giving them power buffs, instead of keeping adding new photon arts, or give us more toys to play with.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyHarken View Post
    Not sure if you're not quite getting what I'm trying to say, but I never mentioned changing the old classes. I clearly said new weapons with more dynamic options to be added, not replace what is already there. Also, please remember that I never mentioned their DPS was lacking. Been playing Ranger for since the game has existed, and I recently tried Phantom, which made me realized that SEGA is just keeping old classes relevant by giving them power buffs, instead of keeping adding new photon arts, or give us more toys to play with.
    It amounts to the exact same thing though ? Bringing new weapons to the table means that you consider old weapons outdated and want old classes to play exactly like successor classes. It also would completely kill any sense of class identity regardless, or even be contrary to what class skills dictate

    They're indeed keeping old classes relevant with power buffs, but I consider this fine because I do think all they need is keeping up. Every class is set to get new PAs for every weapon for the course of EP6, so you're covered on that part already. as for "new toys" it's exactly what new classes should bring you. If you're giving new things to old classes, either you make said things good and kill all incentives for players to play the brand new shiny classes/use old weapons, and if you make them underwhelming, they end up feeling like bad jokes. Each class plays and feels a different way, and imo, best way to promote new flavours of gameplay is keep the new toys for brand new classes.

    When all is said and done though it's only my opinion. I do think there would be benefits in giving new weapons to old classes, just I feel that the cons outweigh the pros.
    Last edited by Zephyrion; Apr 28, 2019 at 08:59 AM.

  7. #27

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    Not to mention the director for EP6 seems to get the right idea by moving away from weapon series sharing same potentials across all weapon types and bringing more unique weapons to the table that might change the way a class is being played.
    Not to mention Crafting is getting a revival soon so we might be seeing the return of the good old days where classes could be built in a huge variety of ways.
    Not to mention we just got Phantom as a subclass which can be effectively used by half of all Regular classes to change up the gameplay style.

  8. #28
    Psychotic Asian Goth Girl [Ayumi]'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by landman View Post
    Hero's talis have PSO slicers PA, while phantom rods have PSU Slicers PA. Now... where are my PSZ slicers?
    We don't have PSO Slicers. Quit kidding yourself.

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by [Ayumi] View Post
    We don't have PSO Slicers. Quit kidding yourself.
    Hero Talis is literally Slicer.

    In the same way that Ph rod is Scythe.

    That's sega's way of implementing new weapons without creating new ones, the next class will probabaly take another weapon and make it behave like a new weapon.

  10. #30
    Hardcore Casual Dark Mits's Avatar
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    The only "fix" old classes need is "normalization" of utility, and to allow multiple copies of same class to work cooperatively and not destructively (for example 2 TEs is overkill).

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