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  1. #141

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    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    Long story short, the breakneck speed of gotta go fast has been around since at least ep 2 and is mostly unchanged.
    And in fact nowadays potentials are more diversified than ever, did you guys not see that Sega brought back PSO1 style mechanic changing weapons?
    Weapons that create a shockwave when you stop after running, weapons that create lighting when you use a pa, etc., not to mention potentials nowadays are mostly good.
    In ep 2 or 3 there were still a lot of stupid conditional potentials that would dictate your playstyle or gtfo. Rainbows were still important.
    Instead nowadays we have convenience and plenty of options that are different but not limiting like before.
    Yet Atra Ex and Lightstream are the top weapons to still be using (bar Orgei TMG's of course as an example) outside these other 15*'s that have "unique" potentials that are underperforming compared to Atra/LS/Austere and they're made that way for a reason. Ya you don't have to play Meta and be special running around with your Stinger partisan making shockwaves which is incredibly useless in just about majority of the endgame content but it doesn't mean they're good, if anything become 15* luxury camo's

    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    PS: How the hell can a bonus enemy that takes 20 seconds to kill if the mpa is really slow and then adds 5 seconds for the death animation make or break and entire eq?
    buddy, I can tell you this literally happens every seasonal where your mpa isnt picking up the slack and its :29 at the end of the quest only for the bonus boss either to stall spawning or just the normal timing to get through it and try to rush camp and restart before :30 hits. PuG or TMPA runs, it still happens and naturally the more runs, the more chances at that loot. Your silly "for fun" doesnt apply to everyone in the mpa, you have non expert blocks for fun
    Last edited by ArcaneTechs; Sep 30, 2019 at 11:44 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_importer_ View Post
    Tell you what mate, I'll decide when my topic goes into the QQ post or when it needs to be it's own thing, and you can do the same for yours. Alright, cool. Cheers

  2. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kril View Post
    Yet Atra Ex and Lightstream are the top weapons to still be using (bar Orgei TMG's of course as an example) outside these other 15*'s that have "unique" potentials that are underperforming compared to Atra/LS/Austere and they're made that way for a reason. Ya you don't have to play Meta and be special running around with your Stinger partisan making shockwaves which is incredibly useless in just about majority of the endgame content but it doesn't mean they're good, if anything become 15* luxury camo's
    While I agree power creep has stopped and some weapons are kinda really not worth the effort, I'd argue we got plenty of very solid/useful weapons this time around compared to EP4 "let Austere be the best for one year straight" and EP5 "horrible weapons til Atra introduction"

    Just for argument's sake :
    -Resonant series : stronger than Atra EX, great series for PH to actually complete your weapon sets since you can't have 3 Lighstream
    -Iclucio Talis : great utility for TE and BO and very useful potential that is likely to stay relevant.
    -Genos bow : Nice utility bow for banish combo spams during stuns. The pot may be too akward to use as a main weapon but the niche use is definitely there
    -Chaval series : both very solid weapons outside of their gimmick, and pot activation can make it pretty close to LS output, so that's pretty good in my book
    -Tisha launcher : Very solid launcher, with power similar to Atra EX and a potential that makes it a great sub weapon if you have better, and if not can easily be used as a main weapon.
    -Orgei TMG : well nothing to add.
    -Serpent Blazer : One of the best pair of boots for bossing, can be even witha nd often surpasses LS on some bosses due to the Vinto speed buff and range making the PA more reliable and letting you sneak extra loops or hit moving targets you can't with vanilla Vinto.

    That's already a lot of weapons that you can use as standalone or alongside your Atra EX/Lighstream. Not arguing with fields being irrelevant due to them featuring only one to no interesting weapons though, which is a shame. They really should have given it Enchanted Forest treatment and just put a lot of weapon series like they did for LQ but oh well
    Last edited by Zephyrion; Oct 2, 2019 at 10:42 AM.

  3. #143

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    Quote Originally Posted by mother clusterfck View Post
    Also, more damage cap, resetting damage to go down, that is pure insanity. RPGs thrive on progress, that is why we play and much more so with online rpgs than single player ones, so reverting progress is like pissing the players in the face.
    Yes, we all play rpgs cause we are nerds that like to see big numbers. It's obvious, numbers are the obvious way to feel progress and considering how endgame enemies grow stronger along with players, if the numbers don't grow equally it is nothing but a standstill.
    Seasonal eqs can be quite fun but if we play nearly the same quest with nearly the same enemies but the damage stays the same than it is mere repetition, that can't be fun.
    If they increase the damage cap then have fun seeing Gunners with their nearly 2+ Million damage IF type-0.
    If they dont increase the damage cap have fun not having any progression at all because you're stuck at 999,999.
    Besides number squashing already is a thing in 4 man Rematch type quests/triggers and Solo mamadesu where your DPS is halved out of the box.
    There is more room to improve & progress when you don't always hit the 999,999 damage cap. Increasing the damage cap will just make OP classes more OP.

  4. #144
    Sega Stockholm Syndrome GHNeko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zephyrion View Post
    While I agree power creep has stopped and some weapons are kinda really not worth the effort, I'd argue we got plenty of very solid/useful weapons this time around compared to EP4 "let Austere be the best for one year straight" and EP5 "horrible weapons til Atra introduction"

    Just for argument's sake :
    -Resonant series : stronger than Atra EX, great series for PH to actually complete your weapon sets since you can't have 3 Lighstream
    -Iclucio Talis : great utility for TE and BO and very useful potential that is likely to stay relevant.
    -Genos bow : Nice utility bow for banish combo spams during stuns. The pot may be too akward to use as a main weapon but the niche use is definitely there
    -Chaval series : both very solid weapons outside of their gimmick, and pot activation can make it pretty close to LS output, so that's pretty good in my book
    -Tisha launcher : Very solid launcher, with power similar to Atra EX and a potential that makes it a great sub weapon if you have better, and if not can easily be used as a main weapon.
    -Orgei TMG : well nothing to add.
    -Serpent Blazer : One of the best pair of boots for bossing, can be even withznd often surpasses LS on some bosses due to the Vinto speed buff and range making the PA more reliable and letting you sneak extra loops or hit moving targets you can't with vanilla Vinto.

    That's already a lot of weapons that you can use as standalone or alongside your Atra EX/Lighstream. Not arguing with fields being irrelevant due to them featuring only one to no interesting weapons though, which is a shame. They really should have given it Enchanted Forest treatment and just put a lot of weapon series like they did for LQ but oh well
    you forgot atus wl on FiHu Poggers



  5. #145
    Hardcore Casual Dark Mits's Avatar
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    I would say that the problem of damage numbers exceeding 999999 should not be tackled by having a hard cap, but instead by rebalancing the PAs/Techs/Abilities/whatever which stand out so much. If IF-0 can deal 2+ million, then lower its power and increase the power of other PAs.

    Generally I'd say that PSO2 is... effed up regarding its damage formula. I mean, we have character ATK in the order of 10^3, weapon attack values in the order of 10^3, and somehow these work out to 10^7 numbers? Even a direct multiplication of these does not reach that high. It's even worse than old Squaresoft games where character and weapon ATK would cap at 99, but damage at 9999. It's even worse in PSO2es where Sizustar linked a video of a character dishing out ~864m damage in about 1.5seconds.

    Meanwhile HP bars are still just in the 10^3 order. This causes the issue that it is outright impossible to balance lifesteal abilities without the already implemented "just cap it at a value which is about a characters 3% of max hp". Or the issue where Megiverse is automatically better than Resta as long as there is a target. At the same time, over the course of an entire episode our damage can increase by a factor of 1000% or higher, but our survivability increases by less than 10% because it would be hard to balance otherwise? So basically going from lvl80 to 90, including all equipment upgrades, I can kill enemies 10x faster or even more faster, but I still die at the same number of hits?

  6. #146
    Filler-man!! _(:3」 final_attack's Avatar
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    Uh, I'm not so familiar with other classes other than Gu ... but, the one who can hit damage cap (without Chain) are Su (Maron grenade) and Hr's TmgHeroFinish?

    Personally, I'm all right with damage cap (at least as a Gu) .... Since it's kinda encourage the use of other PA / skills (?) ._.
    Or maybe the can introduce passive damage cap limit break every 10 mins or something

    Edit :
    I forgot, those with 999,999 damage cap potential can be long a long wait ..... that might not be the best dps ....

    Maybe they should add passive skill that can break damage limit with cooldown or something _(:3」
    So people at least can aim to reach more highest damage numbers, and a bit speeding up for some content.
    Last edited by final_attack; Oct 1, 2019 at 07:35 AM.
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  7. #147
    Hardcore Casual Dark Mits's Avatar
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    Or they can simply split the damage into more hits. Compound Techs have the potential to break 1m damage as 1 single ability, but it's over many hits / ticks.

  8. #148

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    The problem with the "nerfing on IF-0 and spreading DPS across other PA" is that IF-0 is balanced with the idea in mind that in most content it won't go past 999,999. The same can be said about Heavy Hammer, Sword Complex PA, Volgraptor, Marron, TMG Hero Finish, Vinto Gigue etc.

    So if we cut IF-0 Power in half and spread what has been removed to other PA it's technically another buff to Gu. Because the 1m damage that end up in damage cap void aren't meant to be accessible in most relevant content anyway.

  9. #149

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Mits View Post

    Generally I'd say that PSO2 is... effed up regarding its damage formula. I mean, we have character ATK in the order of 10^3, weapon attack values in the order of 10^3, and somehow these work out to 10^7 numbers? Even a direct multiplication of these does not reach that high.
    10^6 actually. No one is capable of doing the true cap of 10mil anymore.

    Also, even at 3000 total attack (which is akin to having an 11 star with nothing affixed and no buffs) with a 100 chain IF0 on GuFi can hit 1 million (3000 × 5 × 18.96 × 1.92 × 1.86 × 1.21 = ~1.2mil), but the reason you don't see that is because there is a universal *divide by 5* in the formula.

    Also chain marron was the reason the 999,999 damage cap was put in place. No super high hitting move was balanced with that cap in mind
    Last edited by Reilet; Oct 1, 2019 at 10:35 AM.

  10. #150

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reilet View Post
    No super high hitting move was balanced with that cap in mind
    That only makes sense when talking about how these PA were balanced originally back in Episode 4 and prior.You can't tell me that Sega releases these new PA like Heavy hammer and Sword Complex PA without expecting people to deal exactly 1m damage (a little bit more for sword due to the shockwave) and move on.

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