[DC_PLAYER]

I still like the v2 game, ppl can still build the chars without any concerns about mags, mat plans and even ids, there is more problems when playing pso gc or bb, in wich case ppl often stress about good mags to combine with mat plans and ids play a large role.
On v2 everything is more relaxed, a tad more challenging due to ultimate enemies beeing a pain, especially online.
I enjoy the game, i don't play as much as i used to, but, i sometimes create skins or try and take some good screenshots, as there are few screenshots around with good quality.

I still prefer the default pso and not the modded versions as they not apeal to me.
Yes, for me PSO is still a good game, despite beeing old it's still fun to play.

[Cranberry]

Having been involved in PSO since 2003 I have a lot of experience on PSO and I have not ignored the other versions. Having watched the changes to the game, and having experienced them to a larger degree than you might realize, I do feel I can make an accurate assesment.

[9898]

Originally Posted by Cranberry

Having been involved in PSO since 2003 I have a lot of experience on PSO and I have not ignored the other versions. Having watched the changes to the game, and having experienced them to a larger degree than you might realize, I do feel I can make an accurate assesment.

i'd like your opinion on a recent item then. how do you feel about Dark Flow's role in the current HU gameplay and why do you think the rainbow change is a bad idea? i think every notable player can agree that the game is less homogeneous than before, and choosing whether to use rainbow / df on a single target (yes, single targets) or multi target is often a more complex choice than meets the eye. do you think this is a bad change, especially given how simple hunter is in terms of weapons choice? i dont think once playing hunter i ever experienced the choice paralysis i did when playing RA (particularly fleshie), but i think surely this is a step in the right direction for a more complicated class.
this brings me to my next point, being that hunter still plays exactly the same as on v1. verbatim. idt a single weapon, let alone the slew of changes that have happened over the years can prevent the game from being "pso". i feel as though in this case having not played the changes / had to experience them first hand is definitely something that could possibly disqualify an opinion such as "x server's psobb is not pso anymore". i think that would be a very fair criticism that you could level at some of the other servers, but not this one. if you want to discuss this point further i'd be glad to, but i'd rather not post away unless i have an audience. something tells me that when we are playing the exact same thing we are seeing two very different worlds.
i'm agreeing to disagree in the end and i much appreciate you entertaining a little lively discussion the perspective from a different version of the game is interesting.

[Cranberry]

The reason I don't like Dark Flow and Rainbow is because they are very unbalanced. Both of them are custom modifications, and both immediately became the most sought after items, and replaced everything else in their weapon category.

[9898]

Originally Posted by Cranberry

The reason I don't like Dark Flow and Rainbow is because they are very unbalanced. Both of them are custom modifications, and both immediately became the most sought after items, and replaced everything else in their weapon category.

this kind of slippery slope in logic is unhealthy, because then what happens when they are nerfed and the next thing below them is deemed "too broken"? there's always going to be a good answer and a best answer to any given situation, whether in real life or in game. that doesn't make the game easier by any means, it is only artificially difficult in other's eyes. the most difficult things to accomplish in life and in games will require all of your resources to accomplish. i wrote a blueprint in my previous post as to how rainbow has actually "balanced" (brought more variety i think is the definition of balance you are trying to use) the game more. gamecube is a much less "balanced" game in your definition than bb at the moment, so i guess i wouldn't mind if you elaborated more. in the end games really don't need balance, just enough variation / relevant options in any given situation to keep things interesting. i think if anything discovery is fun, and whatever tweaks can be done in order to keep the game fresh / fun that is reasonable and doesn't upset the existing variety to the point of stagnation / elimination of relevant options is good. just some thoughts off the top of my head.

[DC_PLAYER]

All of the above = the reasons i don't play BB.

[Cranberry]

I disagree pretty strongly with most of that. I'm very much with DC_PLAYER on this. When you take a game, and start drastically changing it, it's not the same game anymore. I see this a lot like baseball vs softball. Softball is similar to baseball. Softball kind of looks like baseball, and it kind of plays like baseball, but it is not baseball and there are some very significant differences (though rules can vary between leagues).

Call us purists if you must, but both DC_PLAYER and I want to play the true game, not an alternate version that has changed the rules.

To elaborate on my softball vs baseball example, here are the rules my area had.

Softball: The ball is larger (obviously), You're not allowed to bunt. You're not allowed to "lead off" of bases. You're not allowed to try and steal until the ball has passed the plate (typically means you can't start running until the catcher already has the ball), you had to pitch underhand, and the ball had to rise at least 6 feet before reaching the plate. If one team pulled 9 runs head of the other team, they automatically won.

The baseball league had traditional MLB rules (more specifically, national league rules, where the pitcher got a turn to bat). Back when I played, I surprised my parents by signing up for baseball instead of softball (I was one of the very few women that did true baseball and not softball. I think there were 3 or 4 women in the entire league, myself included). I wanted to play true baseball, not a modified and altered version of it, that is softball. The rule chanages to softball have a very significant affect on the very way you play the game.

I see the modifications to BB the same way. When you start significantly changing the rules, it's not the same game anymore, even if parts of it still look and play similarly.

Simply put, DC_PLAYER and I are purists. We want the traditional game for our respective versions, not a modified one. That's why he has stuck to V2, and I have stuck to Gamecube. Our respective versions have remained in their pure form, and have not been changed and modified like BB has been. Similarly, I don't say that Version 2 and Gamecube are the same kind of PSO either, as they are very different.

[DC_PLAYER]

well yes, but the main problem for me is that other ppl decide how i should play (meaning they change the rules left and right) and the data becomes stored elsewhere.

I like games where i can play anytime i want (pso bb isn't it), for as long as i want and the way i want, stuff like no steam skyrim, no origin/EA mass effect,.....

PSO v1&v2 and PSO GC are the only ones that fit into that category, despite PSO BB beeing a PSO game that uses the same areas and stuff, the core of the game is not apealing to me, i only use it to take screenshots to be exact.

[9898]

Originally Posted by Cranberry

I disagree pretty strongly with most of that. I'm very much with DC_PLAYER on this. When you take a game, and start drastically changing it, it's not the same game anymore. I see this a lot like baseball vs softball. Softball is similar to baseball. Softball kind of looks like baseball, and it kind of plays like baseball, but it is not baseball and there are some very significant differences (though rules can vary between leagues).

Call us purists if you must, but both DC_PLAYER and I want to play the true game, not an alternate version that has changed the rules.

To elaborate on my softball vs baseball example, here are the rules my area had.

Softball: The ball is larger (obviously), You're not allowed to bunt. You're not allowed to "lead off" of bases. You're not allowed to try and steal until the ball has passed the plate (typically means you can't start running until the catcher already has the ball), you had to pitch underhand, and the ball had to rise at least 6 feet before reaching the plate. If one team pulled 9 runs head of the other team, they automatically won.

The baseball league had traditional MLB rules (more specifically, national league rules, where the pitcher got a turn to bat). Back when I played, I surprised my parents by signing up for baseball instead of softball (I was one of the very few women that did true baseball and not softball. I think there were 3 or 4 women in the entire league, myself included). I wanted to play true baseball, not a modified and altered version of it, that is softball. The rule chanages to softball have a very significant affect on the very way you play the game.

I see the modifications to BB the same way. When you start significantly changing the rules, it's not the same game anymore, even if parts of it still look and play similarly.

Simply put, DC_PLAYER and I are purists. We want the traditional game for our respective versions, not a modified one. That's why he has stuck to V2, and I have stuck to Gamecube. Our respective versions have remained in their pure form, and have not been changed and modified like BB has been. Similarly, I don't say that Version 2 and Gamecube are the same kind of PSO either, as they are very different.

the analogy you provide is in depth, but it invalid considering that the rules governing sega bb, this bb and gc are exactly the same, they come from the same source and use the same underlying mechanics. v2 to any other version i think is an exception, v2's handling of damage (%s and ATP in particular) and weapons (eg frozen shooter spec being an ata check w/o damage, stats being different than bb and gc counterparts) are DRASTICALLY different than gc.

i guess if in the end you want something unmodified that's fine, and we really have nothing more to discuss. i think no matter what version of the game we play, we are playing a very different game, and that has nothing to do with the gameplay itself

[AlexCraig]

That's why I like the BB server I play on. We didn't change that much from how BB initially was. Granted it, as BB, is different from how DC and GC were, but it is still BB as it was originally intended to be played.