[panzer_unit]

So, Kion and I are plowing through Train S2 last night... it's rough but we make it to the bossfight. My PA's... Durega, Zubba, everything... aren't working at all to knock these things down. I'm resigned to taking the usual craploads of damage and having a fun roll on the floor every now and then.

Then Kion pulls out a laser and starts spamming Mayalee Prism, producing flawless knockdowns all the time. I'm still beating away in melee, no different than before... so IMO it must be that Mayalee Prism has a higher-priority knockdown effect than Durega or anything you can do with a melee weapon.

It's nice that there's some obscure use for Mayalee Prism, but it's really damned annoying that these things CAN be knocked over... just not by the people who get knockdown as basically their only form of defense.

[Pillan]

Well, given that every month we get another update that says “enemies weakened and drop rates increased”, and the most recent one effects enemy STA, maybe we’ll see an increase in the melee art effects as well as bullet effects.

[panzer_unit]

Sega can do whatever it wants with overall difficulty level, but I'd like to see Fortefighter be the #1's with what few special effects they get (to wit: launch, wipeout, blow away) rather than having to rely on a Guntecher muscling creatures around. Talk about an ego-bruising!

We'll be hiding behind Fortetechers for defense next :/

[Kuya]

Panzer...why are you not a gunner anymore?

Guess lasers are ok...or you can be like me and infect SE4 them, run to the next room and wait it out. I do this because:
1) I'm a newman so my HP looks close to a beast's ATA
2) I'm playing at work so I have to play in a super small window to hide myself.

[panzer_unit]

I'm still a gunner... just not right now. I've got a lot of good light element melee weapons, so I'm all the way fighter while HIVE S2 is hot.

EDIT: Lasers can be way better than okay. Supposing you're not playing at work you can virus and then stick around with a laser to keep the midbosses pinned down while the rest of your team goes on full offensive for huge damage. I wonder if it works on SEED Vitace too?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-09-06 10:21 ]</font>

[CelestialBlade]

I'm one of those people that thinks Rangers are just fine and Melee isn't as gimped as everyone seems to say....but this is something I do agree with. Bullet PA effects seem to be much more reliable than Skill ones, and IMO nobody needs Knockdown more than a Melee-type. See Levia's Kamatoze topic, for instance.

Not sure if Sega's even aware of this but considering they ARE willing to listen to our opinions....maybe it'll get some sort of improvement in the near future. We'll see.

[Niloklives]

o.O I can rising strike them no problem....TD works too.

Also for the gunners, nades work just as well as mayalee prism. so virus these guys with the cheap ones then nd pin them down with nades...or if you're like me, and don't care about time...just virus them and leave the room for about 20 seconds then come back and do it again.

[panzer_unit]

Really? I hit 'em with the knockdown moves on Tornado Break and Anga Durega and they didn't fall... just spazzed out on me with some attack instead. I don't think I got through the final move on Durega un-interrupted. I forget if I hadoken'd them with Renzan or not, and Bogga Zubba didn't do jack but that's launch so it probably doesn't count.

I'll see where I can get with Rising Strike next time I go through... especially since I'm working on a high-grind shop rapier anyway.

[Pillan]

On 2007-09-06 10:34, NIloklives wrote:
just virus them and leave the room for about 20 seconds then come back and do it again.

Dilla Grena are a very strange enemy. Their HP is so low that, despite their half ranged and half melee damage, shots from any gun still do more damage/time than virus. They're the only large mob that I can think of that takes less than 1000 from each tick of Virus at 100+.

Of course you could virus trap them and attack them, but I don't have that option when I play GT.


EDIT:

More on topic...

Rising Strike seems to have a higher knockback level than most skills. I haven't tested whether it works on them, though, since I deleted the art.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Pillan on 2007-09-06 10:49 ]</font>

[panzer_unit]

Something else I noticed about them - I forget if this is S or S2 but probably applies in both cases - is that my grenades would only knock them down if I did more than 100 damage to one of their target points. Not relevant to what was going on last night (fortefighter w/ elemental pikor says no) but something to make a note of.

EDIT: delete Rising Strike? wtf. That's really pro, or just insane.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-09-06 10:59 ]</font>