Hi does anybody use Rabol Asted?

[Slickk]

Seems like everybody is using a Crimson Line. Yamata-senba has good stats. What is best for a Beast Fortefighter?

[Weakness]

I would suggest straight defense. At which point a Yamata-senba would be good. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif I would try for two or three with good %'s if you have the cash.

[magenta]

I use rabol asted (dark) and im a fortefighter
generally think its better than a yamata-senba due to MUCH better evp boost, and mental strength boost for wartechers (since i might just become one).

[Slickk]

Hey so you think Yamata-senba would be best?

[magenta]

as a beast fortefighter you have enough def, so work on your evp and men strength.
yamata-senbas are popular among forces cos of its def..though it has added bonus of boosting a claw weapon (9* giza) i think, but it wont matter much if youre a fortefighter.

plus.. rabol asteds are cheaper (generally) than yamatas.. esp good %s

[Slickk]

Alright Rabol Asted it is then!

[Reiichi]

EVP = awful for hunters

EVP will kick in and interrupt your PA, your swings, etc.
Yamata-senba has the lowest EVP of all the 9* armors, and also the highest DFP which although doesn't matter that much, will make it easier for you to not get knocked down or flinched.

If rabol asteds are cheaper, it's because noone wants them. The only people who like EVP happen to be forces, but they won't get enough base DFP to ever equip the high EVP armors.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Reiichi on 2007-02-09 23:54 ]</font>

[Slickk]

so Yamata-senba then? lol

[Reiichi]

Let me ask you slickk. You've blocked attacks before with your EVP. Do you enjoy having your PA interrupted (thus wasting PP) mid PA combo? Or your swings interrupted mid combo? And when you get mobbed you'll do even more blocking and will have a hard time getting any attacks off. That's lost damage that you could have done, and wasted PP.

[Slickk]

You do have a good point.

[magenta]

On 2007-02-09 23:52, Reiichi wrote:
EVP = awful for hunters

EVP will kick in and interrupt your PA, your swings, etc.
Yamata-senba has the lowest EVP of all the 9* armors, and also the highest DFP which although doesn't matter that much, will make it easier for you to not get knocked down or flinched.


and interrupts+taking no damage is preferred to no-interrupts and taking damage.

ive had both a yamata-senba and rabol asted dark, and with rabol asted ive used up less mates, and scapes than with yamata senba



If rabol asteds are cheaper, it's because noone wants them..

or yamatas are just overhyped.

[magenta]

On 2007-02-09 23:55, Reiichi wrote:
Let me ask you slickk. You've blocked attacks before with your EVP. Do you enjoy having your PA interrupted (thus wasting PP) mid PA combo? Or your swings interrupted mid combo? And when you get mobbed you'll do even more blocking and will have a hard time getting any attacks off. That's lost damage that you could have done, and wasted PP.


fortefighters are boosted with using up less pp than other classes anyway:P. and its a choice between taking some damage while still being able to act, or being interrupted and not able to attack.

[Slickk]

Ohh! Debate! Debate! Debate!

[magenta]

rabol asted - better evp, mst boost - interrupts but u wont take damage - cheeper

yamata - only +55 def more than asted which wont matter much for fortefighter, youll still take as much damage when u do get hit then when wearing rabol asted (when it doesnt interrup XD) - considerably more expensive esp with 20%+ elements

i think i know why i chose asted, and chose to sell my yamata



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: magenta on 2007-02-10 00:12 ]</font>

[Reiichi]

Uh, I prefer no interrupts and taking damage to interrupts and no damage. Course that's up to personal preference.

I'm not there to be a meat shield. I'm there to do damage. Fortefighters do plenty damage when they can spam their PAs without interruption. I can't spam if I'm getting interrupted.

Fact of the matter is, you kill slower when you go EVP and get interrupted. That and it's incredibly annoying. I have nothing against using up a few more mates.

----

The only reason I'm using a yamata-senba, is because nafri-senba boards aren't sold in stores. I'll give you a hint as to why, it's not because of the set bonus.

----

If you synth armor youself, it costs the same material wise. Perhaps it might cost you more because you might have a harder time dumping the low % rabol asteds?

----

Any money saved on mates, is used on extra photon chargers to make up for the wasted PP... and you still kill slower.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Reiichi on 2007-02-10 00:20 ]</font>

[Slickk]

Okay thanks brother. I am looking at Rabol Asteds now!

[Slickk]

Okay now I'm confused again lol.

[magenta]

interrupts never affected me much, even with axe, because maybe i fight better with axe and other weps. for example in bruces dungeon I dont go head to head with a group of vandas, their flames would either burn me or interrupt my attacks.. i go to one end of the line of vandas, and attack em from the sides - result = no PA interrupt from vanda breath.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: magenta on 2007-02-10 00:18 ]</font>

[Slickk]

Hmm... nice choice of tactics.

[Slickk]

your aim sn is to be the best?

[GoldenFalcon]

To add to the usefulness of Yamata-Senba for Fortefighters: Once Yamata-Misaki (11* dual claw) comes out, that combo will be the combo to rule them all, since Yamata-Misaki also stuns enemies I think. And looks cool.

[Slickk]

thats the one thats better than Ran-Misaki right?

[magenta]

On 2007-02-10 00:29, GoldenFalcon wrote:
To add to the usefulness of Yamata-Senba for Fortefighters: Once Yamata-Misaki (11* dual claw) comes out, that combo will be the combo to rule them all, since Yamata-Misaki also stuns enemies I think. And looks cool.



and GOOOOD LUcck finding/synthing/trading for that claw XD

[Reiichi]

Because circling behind 2 mages is easy compared to many other monsters. The more time you spend trying to play safely the less time you spend attacking. Different playstyle I know. Mages are a bad example too since they don't move much and are easy to get behind.

If I use an axe i will attack from the back as much as I can because it's so inaccurate. With more accurate weapons I don't have to take the time to do that. I just go up from the front or whichever position will allow me to maximize damage. If receiving damage allows me to do more damage then I'll take it if it's a reasonable trade off.

An example would be a mob of small creatures. I'd probably just try a renkai in the middle of them. A habit I picked up off of being a figunner as the more monsters clustered together the more fun times there are to be had with a double saber. A bunch of ollakas circling around? Maybe I'll try robado or tornado break in the middle of them. I like to have monster aggro as they stay on me and provide the multiple targets I need to do good damage. Sometimes they attack, but I like to continue my assault without interruption.

A yamata-senba can't even be currently used by male newman fortetechers =/ and only by female newman fortetechers at like lv 68 or 69. But it's a low dfp armor that can also be used effectively by most any other character you happen to want to make. If you want to talk about savings, it's an armor that pretty much works for all your characters.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Reiichi on 2007-02-10 00:48 ]</font>

[Slickk]

lol PWNED!

[Slickk]

Wow. Powerful words...

[Carbinne]

I will state again that my 50% elec Stellaline that is three stars cuts damage from Vahras and... pretty much a whole ton of Parum critters by a whole lot, way more than some Phantomline or Crimsonline with Dark on them. Best of both worlds right there -- you block less due to lower EVP numbers and you take a very noticable amount less from the armor element monsters.

Anyway, I'd worry less about the numbers on the stats and worry more about the number next to the percent sign.

[magenta]

attacking the front of mobs like vandas, deljabans, or getting in their centre, bad idea - terrible at s-rank. it doesnt take much time to just run to the side a little and commence attacking while they turn a bit to try and attack you.

really rabol asted + refining ur fortefighting tactics a little more = better choice (IMO)

[Slickk]

Hmm okay I think I have made my final decision...

[Starzman]

Crimson I use! [Yoda], Sori-senba no more!

Choice will ultimately be yours. High EVP is a pain tho' mid PA.

[Use the Force (if u can find a good one)]

[magenta]

tell tell..

[magenta]

and oh.. one more important thing

remember creatures such as seed vitace and worms that give you certain status effects like zalure and jellen when they hit you..

..guess what happens when that hit is interrupted, compared to what happens when its not interrupted XD

interruptions can be good sometimes (saves agtarides or force from rebuffing)

[Slickk]

Bingo! You are the winner!! Rabol Asted for life!!!

[Reiichi]

Deljabans are an immediate kill or immediate flip over. You won't stay behind a pack of 5 for long and you need to incapacitate asap else you'll get a megid from your flanks.

Attacking from the front of a pair of vandas is fine if you know what you're doing. A mob of 5 will depend on how I'm feeling. I'd typically just grab any 2 that line up at the moment and spear stab them. If I feel lazy then maybe I'll just move into the middle or between too and rbz spam. Fire does 0 to me on B, so I get lazy sometimes =p

Well, I'll just say that of all the bruce C/B/A runs I've done, I've never died http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif Not bad for an aggressive berserker style eh? =p

Forces hate people that play like me, but I'm very low maintenance. When things are bad I lay off of suicidal attack approaches. When things aren't I go for broke with damage dealing.

Vitance is annoying -_- worms aren't when they do 0 regardless =p It allows me to let them pop up next to me so that I can smack them. Evade might cause problems there.

For hard hits that would interrupt anyways you might as well evade it since your PA will cancel anyways. For small hits that wouldn't interrupt anyways you might as well not evade it and continue to attack. Most hard hitting monsters I try to avoid chanceing the flinch in the first place. Sometimes I can't do anything about it like on say svalt or vitance spins. For those times evade is blessing. For small hits and mobbing evade is a curse. Most attacks aren't knockdown, so I like to go with less EVP for cleaning up the majority of monsters. Allows me to hug a kogg nad from the sides if I choose to also.

Ah well. Looks like you've made your choice and I'm out of things to say about my beloved yamata. Just be sure you get a good % one else there's no point.

[magenta]

i got decenty high % dark and light ones (not for trade).. just looking to replace my crimsonlines.

[magenta]

Well, I'll just say that of all the bruce C/B/A runs I've done, I've never died http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif Not bad for an aggressive berserker style eh? =p


just probably lucky then XD judging by your foolhardy tactics

but maybe u caused others to die with your reckless style.. i remember a fortefighter who played aggresively spamming rising crush twins PA against bears.. result bear spun killed me. then i got told to not to attack bears lol.. tactically crap logic yup.. and why not tell the ranger who got killed by vandas not to attack vandas lol.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: magenta on 2007-02-10 01:55 ]</font>

[EphekZ]

Personally, i'd rather get my PA interrupted then take dmg.

[PJ]

Personally, I'd rather have an armour that's higher than 2* and with a low elemental percent, but that's just me... http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

*is poor*

[Tra]

magenta:the people I play with... do not die http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif Reiichi being no exception. heh heh if you want to talk about how things work, you come to me! Oh and don't worry about debuffs... you're always buffed when I'm around.


Oh yeah, it really doesn't matter what armor you're wearing, it's just the %... I can tank a Bruce A King Bear as a FT fine with a 44% earth yamata-senba... 300 damage per hit with a ~50% chance to evade haha! it's so easy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

That said... EVP = useless since nothing is lethal in this game atm, if there IS anything lethal, odds aren't very good when you only have like 20% or lower chance evade if you aren't a FT lol.

Scenario 1: You're AoE'ing a buncha little harmless Badiras in parum relics... any evade means your PA is stopped dead.

Scenario 2: In the case where you don't have earth armor for Bruce A, a king bear easily does 1000 damage per hit on you. Now I'd rather you to stay clear of King Bears instead of standing there and taking the chance to hope that your pitiful amounts of EVP will keep you alive. It's pointless unless your evasion happens to be like at 90% or so, but since it isn't, you're still going to die.

either way, I say no to the EVP advantage for the Rabol Asted. You aren't a Fortecher (having highest evade plus the fact that evading actually helps tech-casting), you can't evade much even with it.

btw I use Yamata Senbas because they're the only thing I can use.... I'd use Rabol Asted if I could. T_T

[magenta]

On 2007-02-10 05:44, Tra wrote:
magenta:the people I play with... do not die http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif Reiichi being no exception. heh heh if you want to talk about how things work, you come to me! Oh and don't worry about debuffs... you're always buffed when I'm around.


this is silly and stating the obvious, ie. you wont die if you stay in a good group who know what theyre doing all the time.



Oh yeah, it really doesn't matter what armor you're wearing, it's just the %... I can tank a Bruce A King Bear as a FT fine with a 44% earth yamata-senba... 300 damage per hit with a ~50% chance to evade haha! it's so easy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

and not everyone is going to get a 44%+ yamata or any high ranking armour out of thin air.
%s matter a LOT, but against heavy hitters id also take my chance not getting hit thankyou.



That said... EVP = useless since nothing is lethal in this game atm, if there IS anything lethal, odds aren't very good when you only have like 20% or lower chance evade if you aren't a FT lol.


EVP = useful, esp if one is soloing, as i said Ive already bought a rabol asted 30%dark and decided to sell my yamata 30%dark since out of all the numerous runs i did on S-rank LLS I coped better with rabol then with yamata 70% of the time.



Scenario 1: You're AoE'ing a buncha little harmless Badiras in parum relics... any evade means your PA is stopped dead.


question .. lol why waste spam PA on a bunch of harmless badiras anyway, unless parum has suddenly turned into the new bruce's dungeon quest i hear about.

sure theres a good chance your PA will be stopped if you just stand there spamming PA instead being a little smart, and move about a bit trying not to get surrounded too much.



Scenario 2: In the case where you don't have earth armor for Bruce A, a king bear easily does 1000 damage per hit on you. Now I'd rather you to stay clear of King Bears instead of standing there and taking the chance to hope that your pitiful amounts of EVP will keep you alive. It's pointless unless your evasion happens to be like at 90% or so, but since it isn't, you're still going to die.


44% earth armour - i dont think many people have as easy access to good armour as you have so this is faulty to start with.

and telling a fortefighter to not attack bears is as pretty dam ridiculous since theyre made for the job.
and death can only occur when a player is only careless enough to use the wrong PA on them. So careless players who use wrong PA should be told to use the right PA or get away (yes twins PA rising crush is careless - even if it can stop bear stop theres always a good chance of it being mistimed)

Ive used rabol solid (18% earth) on bruces against bears, and succesfully survived lots of times in B and A. thats because i fight em smart and mostly use 1st and 2nd part of spear PA. I also dont tell other fortefighters to lay off the bear and try hog limelight with spazzy PA thinkin ima so cool.



either way, I say no to the EVP advantage for the Rabol Asted. You aren't a Fortecher (having highest evade plus the fact that evading actually helps tech-casting), you can't evade much even with it.

EVP boost by asted is better than youre making it out to be, and its good for smarter fortefighters who dont think of just running in and spamming PA and getting into situations where their HP is drained quickly

thank you and goodnight.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: magenta on 2007-02-10 09:08 ]</font>

[PJ]

Maybe one day people will learn that there are many options to things, and not one truely defined, best way, period.

Just a thought.

[magenta]

well i only know a few ways dependent on a lil skill and smartness

im not like others who has unlimited resouces, and cant conjure up 44%-50% earh or other element armours so i have to watch out and depend on other stats such as evp and def.

i chose evp since IMO it gives a better deal in the long run for my class, and im not braindead running into middle of mobs spazzing out PA



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: magenta on 2007-02-10 10:40 ]</font>

[Sychosis]

I hate eva as a hunter. As a fortetecher though, it is awesome beyond words.

[Xaeris]

well i only know a few ways dependent on a lil skill and smartness

Color me curious. How does reliance on a mechanic purely based upon a random number generator out of your control at all dependant on skill or intelligence?



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Xaeris on 2007-02-10 10:59 ]</font>

[Reiichi]

Although EVP would help soloing the most in theory of minimizing damage, soloing you are bound to get mobbed constantly because the monsters only have one target to go to. Then EVP kicks in and you're no longer happy. You then run away and try to thin the monsters out with hit and run tactics.

I'd just PA spam pretty much everything. Stuff dies faster, everyone is happy.

It doesn't require unlimited resources, and I know my limits. Rather than take the passive attack from the side or behind every time I don't have to. I mix it up based on the monsters attacks, how well I can endure the damage, and the monster layout to maximize PA targets. Sorry, but even I don't stand still while spinning with my renkai. There's more to it you know.

2* high percent armor IS better than high * low % armor if you are poor. Which do you think is easier/cheeper to synth? Something that uses a few nanosilica or several dozen nanocarbons. One of the good sides of playing on the 360 but a pain if you're on PC/PS2 is the photon prices. Synthing newbie armor and weapons is too expensive with the price of photons these days on PC. B armor is preferred with a body slot so you can utilize rainbow. You don't need A armor unless you're a major EVP fan or have A units.

You seem to think that taking any damage != smart. Fortefighters are built to take and receive damage. Is this bonus supposed to only come into play on bosses? Or can it apply to regular monsters as well? If an attack doesn't hurt me, I should use that to my advantage.

[magenta]

Although EVP would help soloing the most in theory of minimizing damage, soloing you are bound to get mobbed constantly because the monsters only have one target to go to. Then EVP kicks in and you're no longer happy. You then run away and try to thin the monsters out with hit and run tactics.


hmm i dont even have to run away, just sidestep a little to get less mobbed and continue attack, this pretty much what i do against badira mobs on parum, and ageetas on neudiz, and it works. i hardly get bombarded with interruptions that waste me minutes (let alone seconds) of time..



I'd just PA spam pretty much everything. Stuff dies faster, everyone is happy.


stuff dies faster for fortefighter anyway, difference is i avoid more damage onto me


Rather than take the passive attack from the side or behind every time I don't have to.

good practice anyway, and weak mobs die fast, but against evil mobs like vandas, olgohomons, and deljabans its best not to attack straight at their front.



I mix it up based on the monsters attacks, how well I can endure the damage, and the monster layout to maximize PA targets. Sorry, but even I don't stand still while spinning with my renkai. There's more to it you know.

I know enough to quit my yamata for a rabol, and if youre gonna move around then standstill and take hits you might as well get more evp anyway.



2* high percent armor IS better than high * low % armor if you are poor. Which do you think is easier/cheeper to synth? Something that uses a few nanosilica or several dozen nanocarbons. One of the good sides of playing on the 360 but a pain if you're on PC/PS2 is the photon prices. Synthing newbie armor and weapons is too expensive with the price of photons these days on PC. B armor is preferred with a body slot so you can utilize rainbow. You don't need A armor unless you're a major EVP fan or have A units.

ok, though the original question was about rabol, but it will still take time and luck to synth out 44-50% B class armour.. unless you synth them 32 at a time which is time consuming and still incredibly expensive especially in terms of photons, so one is better off looking for cheap deals in shops anyway.



You seem to think that taking any damage != smart. Fortefighters are built to take and receive damage. Is this bonus supposed to only come into play on bosses? Or can it apply to regular monsters as well? If an attack doesn't hurt me, I should use that to my advantage.


taking damage WHEN it can be voided is not smart regardless of how you spin it. Fortefighters are built to take damage, but wont last if you dont avoid taking damage when u can. and not everyone has 44-50% elemental armours, nor the resources (time, money, and cheet enjun) to try and get lucky to make one (even B class ones)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: magenta on 2007-02-10 13:13 ]</font>

[magenta]

Color me curious. How does reliance on a mechanic purely based upon a random number generator out of your control at all dependant on skill or intelligence?


not entirely out of control, by choosing so and so more stat, theres a better chance of that stat helping you out.

and a bit of skill and smart is needed to deal monsters while avoiding much harm to yourself anyway, and im not implying einstein level intelligence lol.

[Slickk]

ok so i use the same slots as you. thanks for the armor dude

[ljkkjlcm9]

hmm, personally I prefer the MST boost, so I go with Crimson Line, cause it has the highest of the 9* armors... but that's just me. Magic hurts me more than anything anyways

THE JACKEL