fire wlement on striking weapons useless....?

[GreyWolf360]

thats what some guy told me when he was tring to sell me an ice double saber...i already have a ice twin saber and am tring to have a different type of weapon for each of the 6 elements (play preference if you will)

then i told him this guy was selling me a bone dance for 25k...he was like "whatever" and we finished the mission with a S http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

so basically....would a 20%(or less) fire synthed bone dance turn out 'ineffective' for this game? or was he just tryinna hustle me~

[Kupi]

Well... Gohmons, Ageetas, and Kamatoze are all ice-elemental, so if you're running outdoor missions on Neudeiz, it'd be wise to pack at least one fire weapon. The little chirpy things on Moatoob are also ice-elemental, and I'm sure there's at least a few more. Granted, there aren't a lot of ice enemies in the current most popular missions, but so long as the potential exists (and it does) for something with ice enemies in it to take the top spot, fire weapons will have value.

Rule of thumb when bargaining prices: when the other guy says your weapon's useless, don't believe him.

[bloodknight]

no such thing as an "ineffective" weapon while higher percents do more damage i wouldnt worry about getting anything higher than 20% unless you find a really good deal.

[imfanboy]

There are, at present, 5 enemies with the ice element: 3 on Neudaiz and 2 on Moatoob. A fire Double Saber isn't a bad idea for those type of enemies.

[Gen2000]

Probably just another player who barely leaves Parum if ever, so ignore him. Fire Element Melee weapons rocks Neudiaz's face.

[Ether]

To be honest fire element (on melee weapons at least) is pretty useless. As mentioned, only 5 enemies in the whole game are ice element, and two of them (ageeta and lapucha) are low threat enemies that die extremely fast. Its a great element for Eastern Peril, but even there you have to switch for Tengohgs and Onmagoug

Now compared to enemies who are fire element, you've got de ragan, gol dolva, onmagoug, jarba, every single flying enemy, vanda, and then some. Pretty much every single stage in the game contains fire enemies if it isn't a single element stage. So a fire element weapon has few advantages, but disadvantages nearly everywhere, which is too bad

Oh and if we ever get maximum attack, expect fire weapons to be in even less demand as we get 7 missions full of nothing but fire enemies

Edit related to the above post: Fire element doesn't rock Neudaiz because there are just as many fire enemies (worms, ollaka, and tengohg) as there are ice. There are no stages that contain ice enemies without fire ones as well, which futher decreases fires value because you're forced to carry ice as a backup anyways, or face doing under 100% damage

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2007-04-01 20:17 ]</font>

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-04-01 20:10, Ether wrote:
To be honest fire element (on melee weapons at least) is pretty useless. As mentioned, only 5 enemies in the whole game are ice element, and two of them (ageeta and lapucha) are low threat enemies that die extremely fast. Its a great element for Eastern Peril, but even there you have to switch for Tengohgs and Onmagoug

Now compared to enemies who are fire element, you've got de ragan, gol dolva, onmagoug, jarba, every single flying enemy, vanda, and then some. Pretty much every single stage in the game contains fire enemies if it isn't a single element stage. So a fire element weapon has few advantages, but disadvantages nearly everywhere, which is too bad

Oh and if we ever get maximum attack, expect fire weapons to be in even less demand as we get 7 missions full of nothing but fire enemies

Edit related to the above post: Fire element doesn't rock Neudaiz because there are just as many fire enemies (worms, ollaka, and tengohg) as there are ice. There are no stages that contain ice enemies without fire ones as well, which futher decreases fires value because you're forced to carry ice as a backup anyways, or face doing under 100% damage

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ether on 2007-04-01 20:17 ]</font>


Ignorant. Fire saber, or twin swords is essential in responsibly conributing to Neudiaz missions. Juggling gohmons is an art, and knocking over Kamatoze saves everyone the pain of dambarta.

Now if you want to argue that ice armor is useless, I will listen: more than once I have been badly pummeled trying to wear ice armor in neudiaz. I tend to switch between fire and 'green' (with whatever has the highest MST).

[Gen2000]

Well if you just carry one element of a weapon fine but I would think most good Hunter players wouldn't mind having a "backup" weapon and would prefer doing as much damage as possible to an enemy anyways and actually switch weapons depending on the element of the enemy.

Yes small mobs like Ageeta and Lapucha are small threats but it's a nice stroke to e-peen to be able to kill them in one combo. More importantly though the quicker you can take down S/S2rank Gohmons and Kamatoze the better.

I would say there is a less demand for Fire Elements because of fire/ice enemy ratio like you mentioned before, but it's mainly because hardly leaves Parum anyways so they don't even have to worry taking em on anyways, Ice/Ground with a dash of Dark is all they need. I wouldn't go so far to call it useless though because there are few of us who do missions outside of Parum.

Classes like Fortefighter, all they have is "LAWL BIG DAMAGE", so yeah I'll take a nice Fire Element Axe or Spear to splash 800-1500 numbers across your screen.

[SolomonGrundy]

fyi: decent % melee weapons (30+%), allow forte fighters, and even figunners, to take down 1/2 damage from melee creatures that don't punish you for getting close.

I have delivered beatings to robots using a ground (+3) soda accas, 28%. Even with thier reduction, my atp+swords arp allows for hits that add up.

[Ether]

On 2007-04-01 20:24, SolomonGrundy wrote:
twin swords is essential in responsibly conributing to Neudiaz missions. Juggling gohmons is an art, and knocking over Kamatoze saves everyone the pain of dambarta

Controlling enemies has nothing to do with the element of the weapon http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[SolomonGrundy]

Controlling enemies has nothing to do with the element of the weapon http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif



actually it does. high damage from a weapon causes flinch.

[Shiryuu]

Forest Infiltration has great drops (if you get lucky), and it's primarily ice/earth/light.

[drizzle]

On 2007-04-01 20:10, Ether wrote:
Edit related to the above post: Fire element doesn't rock Neudaiz because there are just as many fire enemies (worms, ollaka, and tengohg) as there are ice. There are no stages that contain ice enemies without fire ones as well, which futher decreases fires value because you're forced to carry ice as a backup anyways, or face doing under 100% damage

You should be carrying weapons for every enemy type you will encounter anyway. Or do you bring a single element wherever you go? OF COURSE you bring both fire and ice weapons to neudaiz.

[Soukosa]

On 2007-04-01 20:10, Ether wrote:
To be honest fire element (on melee weapons at least) is pretty useless. As mentioned, only 5 enemies in the whole game are ice element, and two of them (ageeta and lapucha) are low threat enemies that die extremely fast. Its a great element for Eastern Peril, but even there you have to switch for Tengohgs and Onmagoug

Now compared to enemies who are fire element, you've got de ragan, gol dolva, onmagoug, jarba, every single flying enemy, vanda, and then some. Pretty much every single stage in the game contains fire enemies if it isn't a single element stage. So a fire element weapon has few advantages, but disadvantages nearly everywhere, which is too bad

Oh and if we ever get maximum attack, expect fire weapons to be in even less demand as we get 7 missions full of nothing but fire enemies

Edit related to the above post: Fire element doesn't rock Neudaiz because there are just as many fire enemies (worms, ollaka, and tengohg) as there are ice. There are no stages that contain ice enemies without fire ones as well, which futher decreases fires value because you're forced to carry ice as a backup anyways, or face doing under 100% damage

Trying to justify not carrying another weapon for doing efficent damage on half of the enemies in the missions? Just wow...

If you can't handle changing elemental weapons for the enemy you're currently attacking then you fail as a hunter player and should just go be one of those forces that use Diga on everything. There is no execuse as to why you can't take a fire weapon to Neudaiz or Moatoob.



On 2007-04-01 21:38, Shiryuu wrote:
Forest Infiltration has great drops (if you get lucky), and it's primarily ice/earth/light.

Pity few people do it since all of the melees are like "AAAHHHH! Bots are scary!! *runs back to Parum*". Which is a shame, considering Aganna is probably the most melee friendly boss in the game.

[SolomonGrundy]

Pity few people do it since all of the melees are like "AAAHHHH! Bots are scary!! *runs back to Parum*". Which is a shame, considering Aganna is probably the most melee friendly boss in the game.

I agree, that boss is uber hunter friendly...maybe even moreso than the dragon! (dealing with the robots is not bad. Fire armor ftw (since all they do is shoot fire anyway.

[imfanboy]

Earth armor ftw - their explosions are earth element. my wartecher isn't even knocked down by S-rank explosions while wearing a Rabol Hard or whatever it is that comes with 18% earth.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

I kind of agree with Ether that there is a lack of dangerous Ice enemies. Even when there are ice enemies, there are fire enemies that are even more dangerous. Even in Neudaiz, Olgomons and Kamatozes pose very little threat compared to worms, which are BY FAR more deadly. Same with Moatoob, while there are Jishagaras and Lapuchas, the Vandas are definately worse. The fire does have more use in te Agata Onmagohg mission, which has no worms, and cows are annoying at worst. And I agreea bout the robot boss too, I HATE those robots adn because of them, I see it pointless to even try to get an S rank, but the boss is a total pushover, well, at least the Neudaiz one.

[imfanboy]

Well, but if you're going to have one weapon as a figunner that's got good fire %, it might as well be a double saber.

You've got Gravity Dance to deal with ageetas, jishigaras, and lapuchas.

You've got Spiral/Tornado Dance to deal with ohgomons and the big dudes, whatever they're called.

And don't tell ME that Ohgomons aren't dangerous; when 4 champions spawn together they can down half a party with barta before the party's FO even has a CHANCE to react. Worms are an annoyance at best; what's the worst they can do, jellen you? Ohgomons can be a menace.

[Alpha-Hunter]

Ohgomons and Kamatozes punish hunters with Ice. Worms on the other hand are just a huge annoyance. jarba's really need to be ice. why are they even fire to begin with?

[omegapirate2k]

If you buy an 8* weapon for 25k then you already win XD

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-04-02 15:36, imfanboy wrote:
Earth armor ftw - their explosions are earth element. my wartecher isn't even knocked down by S-rank explosions while wearing a Rabol Hard or whatever it is that comes with 18% earth.




what? is that true? the explosions that set you on fire are earth element? Or is this becasue THEY are earth elememnt?

I worry more about the fire they shoot at you when they are alive, but you can see why I'm a beast forte, and you are a newman (MST >> robot fireballs)



I kind of agree with Ether that there is a lack of dangerous Ice enemies. Even when there are ice enemies, there are fire enemies that are even more dangerous. Even in Neudaiz, Olgomons and Kamatozes pose very little threat compared to worms, which are BY FAR more deadly.

?!?!? I've never been killed by a worm, unless frozen by Kamatoze, or Gohmons. That's nutty. Worms are a PP drain, nothing more. Are you put off by the jellen? I have seen B, and even A rank missions, where a buffed fortefighter wearing A rank amror (hardline, i believe), becomes jellen immune (damage reduce to zero.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-04-03 09:14 ]</font>

[Kupi]

Something else I thought of recently: I'll admit that there are relatively few ice-elemental enemies right now. However, don't forget that enemies can also be made to spawn in elements you might not be expecting. Anyone remember the electric Badiras in "Rescuing Hyuga"? As I recall, there's also a frozen Moatoob mission that'll come out... at some point. So, point conceded that that fire weapons aren't the most useful things at the moment. But their time will come, I think.

[SolomonGrundy]

I bet everyone would LOVE a "frozen planet" mission where everything was ice. validate the purchase or synh of ice armor

[Shiro_Ryuu]

Man, I pwn olgohmons and kamatozes with my hunter.

[imfanboy]

So do I - but I do it with a good ice armor, decent fire weapons, and by knocking them up/back instead of just charging blithely into the face of their bartas.

Or are you saying that you'd rather hit them with ice weapons? I can tell you, that's pretty fruitless - my 50% ice double saber does about 50 damage to them per hit... with Spiral Dance. On the 3rd combo.

You should have at least one or two decent fire weapons, more than that if you do Neudaiz at all. You should also have ice weapons too; or have you forgotten that you can put 6 weapons in your palatte?

Lessee... 3 ice weapons, 2 fire weapons, and an Evil Twins is what I go for when I'm there.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

Of course I pwn them with fire weapons and Ice armor, but they are WAY less dangerous than hentai worms.

[PMB960]

On 2007-04-03 18:42, Shiroryuu wrote:
Of course I pwn them with fire weapons and Ice armor, but they are WAY less dangerous than hentai worms.



Actually as a fT Gohmon Barta does about as much damage per hit as a worm does. Considering I have around 550 MST and about 65 DFP thats saying alot. The worms may be more annoying since they move alot and Jellen you but annoying does not mean dangerous.

[Carbinne]

You should gear yourself up with equipment and armor appropriate for what you do. If you wander around a lot, might be good to carry an assortment of stuff. If you hang around a couple spots mainly, carry gear that handles that area well.

My raging stick-photon-pointies-into-monsters character carries mostly light equipment due to constant HIVE runs. The whole line of dark-centered areas that have been opened up make light weapons far more useful than they were a few months ago.

Fire type weapons might see a resurgence in popularity if those wintery areas that I have seen in pictures opens up (and provides good benefits for running it). So if you see a good % on a cheap fire weapon, it might be a good investment for later on. More damage, quicker fights, less risk of damage. Helps to make things run smoother. Too bad they have to be a pain to make.

And yeah, don't bother hitting fire monsters with a 50% fire weapon, it sucks.