is figunner overpowered or is fortefighter under powered? [Archive]

Niloklives

Jun 24, 2007, 08:56 AM

there are a lot of different topics out there regarding porper figh play. none of them incluse spamming tornado dance. generally, on small to mid mobs you want to vary between dus dagas and buten or risingstrike coupled with a mechgun or xbow, thoigh for dps, go with mech since xbow doesn't get it's 3rd shot of the larger element bonus on a figh(yet). this will help maximize your damage in a short period of time and keep the enemies off their feet. on larger mobs you use your Double Saber. spiral dance and toarnado dance each have their uses. but 9/10 times spiral will be a better PA for the situation. only time you use tornado is when you're up a large sized multisection enemy that can be knocked down. like kamatoze or kogg nads.

But the point is being a fighgunner does not mean setting a palette full of DSes and spamming tornado dance. Playing like that will make you a burden to your team. hope that helps.

Arika

Jun 24, 2007, 09:02 AM

They are well balance~
depend on mission too

Traize

Jun 24, 2007, 09:59 AM

Hmm, I appreciate it, but I only have 2 DoubleSabers, backed up by Twins, Double Pistols & Claws...

It sounds like I could benefit from a few more guns, going by what you've said...

Oh no, I'm hijacking a thread again!

Lonzell

Jun 24, 2007, 11:33 AM

Tornado Dance 4 Life!

SolomonGrundy

Jun 24, 2007, 12:02 PM

I voted fortefighter is underpowered, and my feeling on this are pretty well known.
Figunner is a good balance: good ATP/HP, *great weapon selection* Limited trap use, but enough to get by. they do chew through pp a little fast, but back up weapon or a pp recharge cube go a long way. FiGs compare favorably with other classes.

If fortefighters had DFP, the way fortetecher have MST, that might go a long way twoards fixing the imbalance. Short of that, the only things I can think of, is some sort of melee weapon that counts as ranged damage, or inflicts an SE3.

Lonzell

Jun 24, 2007, 12:17 PM

Yea but that's what Gunners are for. ForteFighters should only be concerned with hitting things with sticks.

SolomonGrundy

Jun 24, 2007, 12:25 PM

On 2007-06-24 10:17, Lonzell wrote:
Yea but that's what Gunners are for. ForteFighters should only be concerned with hitting things with sticks.

why do fortegunners get access to 3 melee weapons then, including what is arguably the best melee weapon in the game (spear)?

Even still, I'd be willing to concede the point if fFs got +++ DFP

ljkkjlcm9

Jun 24, 2007, 12:31 PM

Fortefighters should be the tanks of PSU, meaning they should have a lot more DFP than they currently do have

THE JACKEL

omegapirate2k

Jun 24, 2007, 12:43 PM

Last I checked, neither are overpowered.

I noticed a MASSIVE increase in my damage capabilities when I went fortefighter and capped it, the axe is a very powerful tool to rape things with, not to mention the swords which have huge leaps in atp by the time you get to 12 star (and the agito repca, which may end up with the same attack as a the 10* axe when grinded to +10)

Fighgunners have the benefit of increased ata and EVP, and the access to alot of ranged weaponry, which is quite nice, if you ask me, they just don't have the same damage potential as a fortefighter.

KiteWolfwood

Jun 24, 2007, 12:52 PM

Lets see. Fortefighter versus Fighgunner stats. Both Cast so favored type bonuses do not apply. Both male too.
Hp: FF +250
ATP: FF +77
ATA: Fi +61
TP: Fi +42
DFP: FF +42
EvP: Fi +77
MST: -
STA: Fi +2

So Fortefighter has 250 more Hp and 77 more atp. This difference would only matter if 722 Atp weren't enough to equip everything you would need and at the moment it is plenty.

Fighgunners have 61 more Ata. Don't know all the details on Ata so make your own comments about this. Other stats don't matter really. But Fighgunner gets +2 STA on Fortefighters. Now this is big. Being up close an personal with megid spewing damubarta spraying mobs you need all the STA you can get.

They have the exact same selection of weapons. Except trading double sabers for axes. Also ranks are jumbled. Whats this? Fighgunners get access to Twin handguns, Crossbows, and Mechguns.

They also both have 30 skills. But Fighgunner has 10 bullets up on Fortefighter.

Did I mention traps? I didn't? Well there ya go I mentioned them. Fighgunner also has access to a few traps. Most notable would be Burn G.

So not to be to biased towards Fighgunners. Fortefighters get that 80% PP usage. Pretty useful thing going for Fortefighters right there. But is that trait alone enough to call a Fortefighter the master of its domain? Maybe. Probably not. Who knows.

Take this as you wish. Balance? Well who is to say what balance really is. You have to balance the scale before you try adding the weights, or something like that.

Lonzell

Jun 24, 2007, 01:20 PM

On 2007-06-24 10:25, SolomonGrundy wrote:

On 2007-06-24 10:17, Lonzell wrote:
Yea but that's what Gunners are for. ForteFighters should only be concerned with hitting things with sticks.

why do fortegunners get access to 3 melee weapons then, including what is arguably the best melee weapon in the game (spear)?

Even still, I'd be willing to concede the point if fFs got +++ DFP

Simple. A fall back weapon for when they run outta bullets, or a enemy gets too close. Unlike a Fortefighter, which can just still swing their weapon around when they've depleted their PP, a ForteGunner is forced to recharge their gun in some shape or form when they run out, or else they have no weapon to fall back on.

In comes the few weapons they do get. With these, this at least gives them another attacking option if by any small chance they run outtta bullets mid mission, with no PP chargers in sight.

Jun 24, 2007, 01:58 PM

Fortefighter is overpowered.

Fighgunner is overpowered in the sense that hybrids are meant to be less forte-like awesome, and be, well, hybrids, but instead, fighgunner feels like an alternative Fortefighter.

KiteWolfwood

Jun 24, 2007, 02:08 PM

Give Fortefighters Slicers in the expansion. That will make everything right in the world.

Mwabwetumba

Jun 24, 2007, 02:33 PM

I think it's comfortable being a ForteFighter... whenever there's trouble ahead, I can just whip out my trusty handgun and go pew-pew instead of having to bother with traps and all such things... I'll let the FG's handle that while I cruise around with my lil' pea-shooter.

Niloklives

Jun 24, 2007, 03:37 PM

FGs are not in the least a trap oriented class. while you're using yur pea shooter, a FG pulls out a mechgun and hits harder and faster with the same mobility. Fighgunners obviously in heneral do less damage than FFs in melee combat, but they make up for it with all that versatility.

SolomonGrundy

Jun 24, 2007, 04:00 PM

gib moar DFP nao!

Finae

Jun 24, 2007, 04:24 PM

Fighgunner got boring for me a couple months ago. Most of the time, I'm partying with fortegunners or protransers so I used to let them handle that since they looked a lil pissed off sometimes when I'm doing their job.

So fortefighter all the way. May not be as versitile as a fighgunner, but that damage sure is good. When I play with most fighgunners, they usually suck. Especially when I'm playing on my FF. Fortegunners make up for my nonversitility in guns as good fortegunners dish out a ton of damage. But solo wise, it rarely happens unless I want to go do eastern peril or something. So I don't think neither are underpowered and they sure aren't overpowered. If you want to talk overpowered, you need to go find a l33t newman fortetecher. When level 90 cap comes along with sleeping warriors s2, whoever gets that psycho wand will be doing damage a FF/FG dreams about lol (including sori/tech charge and hiragi-senba or w/e else tp boosting armor also). Gogogo dambarta lol.

Hrith

Jun 24, 2007, 05:04 PM

If FF needs FG and FT to be good, doesn't that make FI better?

FI is much better in solo and reduced parties. The traps are more than welcome, it's not like you can carry 99 of each as FG or PT. The machineguns are amazing against Jarba, Tengohg, Jusnagun and the like. The twin handguns are awesome for FPS mode (flying monsters, especially bosses). The difference in damage (or ATP, see first post) is barely noticeable, while the ATA does make a difference.

I don't even understand why people are head over heels about FF damage, their DPS is lower than FI's in most situations. Anga Redda's big numbers don't mean higher DPS, at all.

Mwabwetumba

Jun 24, 2007, 05:06 PM

On 2007-06-24 15:04, Hrith wrote:
... Anga Redda's big numbers don't mean higher DPS, at all.

It looks good though.

Niloklives

Jun 24, 2007, 05:14 PM

it's been argued that Foretclasses are better suited for partying. if you have a bunch of gunners in party, a FGs versatility becomes less apparent. but with a group of fighters, a fighgunner's ability becomes very apparent. I'm not the kind of person who likes depending on others in these types of situations because quite frankly, most everyone I've played with sucks. in S and S2 missions, (meaning they're not noobs in the sense f time invested) they die right and left, wear 30% light armor in the hive, use fire weapons against fire enemies because they like the color red, spam poison traps because they think it's the best DoT or is at least the same as the others, stray from the group then demand everyone else rush to help them when they get overwhelmed, constantly cast diga and dambarta at everything they see and use items to buff only themselves, waste all 10 of their photon charges using a BS skill in the first room...I mean the lis goes on, but it's painful to watch. I saw someone with a shiny new rucar..like 28% light in MBS2 trying to gravity dance a jarba from the front then get pissed time and time again as they got sent rolling down the hill using another scape having been cause by yet another megid or dambarta.

So I don't rely on my party. I try to work with them to the best of my ability, but I depend only on my skill and my ability, because there's no way I can know for certain the fG in my group isn't going to try to pin a bel pannon in a corner wit their grenade launcher while big enemies firebomb the rest of the group. heck in a group of 5 techers and my figh against onmagoug, I was the only one trying to shoot it down when it flew. 5 FTs and none of them had a bow. atleast as a figh I can be ready for being in a group of retards.

Lonzell

Jun 24, 2007, 05:20 PM

Tornado Dance or guns Vs. Jarba onry, plzkthxbai

Soukosa

Jun 24, 2007, 05:27 PM

So how many of these pathetic topics is there gonna be before people realize that there's nothing wrong with the FF class and it fits into a role different from FI? Probably never.

So we either get someone that fails at the class claiming it sucks because they can't get what they want from it, someone that tries and finds that it doesn't fit their tastes so they state it sucks, and now someone that hasn't even tried either one thinks that the class sucks?

Looking purely at the class's stat mods is one of the most idiotic things you can do when comparing classes. Stats don't dictate everything you can do with that class. There's far more to a class than stats, such as weapon selection and special abilities like PP cost reduction, which is rather godly.

Also, just because a class can solo better than another doesn't mean it's better, stronger, more over powered than another one. Heaven forbid that they actually put in a specialized class in a game centered around partying http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

ShinMaruku

Jun 24, 2007, 05:49 PM

Indeed. Pick classes for your own use and play as effective as possible.

Lonzell

Jun 24, 2007, 05:56 PM

Sweet, i'm gonna pick force and use swords onry

Hrith

Jun 24, 2007, 06:09 PM

On 2007-06-24 15:06, Mwabwetumba wrote:
It looks good though.Hell yeah http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_cool.gif

On 2007-06-24 15:14, NIloklives wrote:
it's been argued that Forte-classes are better suited for partying.Fortegunner is the best party and solo class =/

if you have a bunch of gunners in party, a FGs versatility becomes less apparent.Yeah, that is a given, but with such a minimal difference in ATP, I'd rather keep my guns and traps.

On 2007-06-24 15:27, Sounomi wrote:
So how many of these pathetic topics is there gonna be before people realize that there's nothing wrong with the FF class and it fits into a role different from FI?There's nothing wrong with FF in itself.
What's wrong is that FF should have a clear edge over FI in damage and defense, and they don't. Barely less ATP, but the superior ATA = same damage; DFP means nothing compared to elemental % on shields.
On paper, they fit into different roles, maybe, but in gameplay, they don't.
FI is a FF with guns and traps. FF is a FI without guns and traps.
Blame Sonic Team, not the players who realised this.

So we either get someone that fails at the class claiming it sucks because they can't get what they want from it, someone that tries and finds that it doesn't fit their tastes so they state it sucks, and now someone that hasn't even tried either one thinks that the class sucks?I really like both classes, and I'm very good at either. But no matter how much I love playing FF and spamming axe PAs, unless I'm in a full team with rangers and forces doing their job, facts remind me how FI is a better class.

You're really doing your best to try and convince yourself that FF is just as good, but different.
It's true FI's advantages are situational, but when those situations are 80% of the time, I call that "better".

Maybe when the game is swarming in S grade weapons, and S grade weapons that have actually higher stats than A grade ones, we can talk about weapon choice, until then...

Neith

Jun 24, 2007, 08:13 PM

Fortefighter's aren't underpowered. Fighgunners certainly aren't overpowered either.

Also Kef, please- FG (or FI? Have I missed something here?) doesn't have an advantage over fF 80% of the time. Against any monster with no melee resistant, Fortefighter is far superior. Fighgunner's situational advantage only comes into play when a melee resistant creature shows up. I also noticed you contradict yourself in 2 posts you've made around the PSU boards (one on the official boards, I think). Here, you're saying DFP means nothing. In another topic you're saying fF's DFP is really nice. Surely that's slightly contradictory?

I've said this numerous times. Fortefighter is a far, far superior melee character to a Fighgunner. Fighgunners are hybrids- they are NOT designed to be as good a gunner as a Fortegunner, or as good as fighter as a Fortefighter. As a Fighgunner Beast Female, you'd have a hundred ATP less than a Fortefighter. You also have around 40 less DFP, combined with slightly less health.

Surely those stats show you you're not meant to melee like a Fortefighter. Don't get me wrong, I know Fighgunners can melee extremely well, and I know they're a very, very good class, but having been in parties with many, many Fighgunners, not one of them is as good at melee combat as a Fortefighter of the same level. I'll admit fF is outclassed by FG in some situations, because of the use of traps/firearms, but saying the advantage is present 80% of the time is a joke.

In related news, sick to death of people wailing on Fortefighters, don't make me bring up n00b Fighgunners http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Niloklives

Jun 24, 2007, 10:29 PM

^ I'll be the first to rant about noobfighgunners and it's one of my favorite classes. I say bring it =p

Also while Kef and I rarely see eye to eye...I can say while he's certainly wrong about that 80%, I think most of those situations come up with not just noob FFs, but noobs in general, and having to make full use of that versatility just to make up for the lack of intelligent party members. so while a FF is unquestionably a better melee combatant than a FG, the FF will struggle more in inadiquate parties, making the differences between the two classes far more apparent. That's where thar outlandish 80% comes from...I hope.

Eitherway I'm not debating over which is better. in optimal circumstances. the Forteclasses should be all one needs. but the Hybrids fill in for the many remedial moments we find ourselves faced with in this game. And as far as hybrids go, FG is very well balanced.

For me though I have to go FG. At the end of the day...I just miss my guns.

[ This Message was edited by: NIloklives on 2007-06-24 20:39 ]

imfanboy

Jun 25, 2007, 01:12 AM

OK.

What defines usefulness in a class in PSU? I'd divide it into the following areas:

1) Damage dealt

2) Technic access

3) trap usage

4) DoT effects

5) Ranged weapon usage

HP and DFP doesn't matter a ratass, because elemental % can seriously make up for any lack of either. So, the fortefighter has only one useful subset, damage dealt. However, damage breaks down to several sub-areas:

1) Regular damage

2) Damage against melee-resistant enemies

3) Damage against bullet-resistant enemies

4) Damage against technic-resistant enemies.

Now, we can see that the Fortefighter is useful in 3 out of 4 areas, which would be great, except that melee-resistant enemies outnumber any other kind of resistant enemies, and several of them are large enemies, like Tengouhg, Jarba, or the Jusnagun. The rest are flying enemies.

Out of the bosses, many of them are flying monsters as well for much of their time: Onmagoug, Dimmagolous, Maggana after his base blows up, and Fakis come to mind as spending a helluva lot of time in the air, while all three of the dragons fly upwards as well: cutting into fortefighter usefulness.

Now, think about this: The figunner ranks highly in all but one of those areas, Technic access. Even in the damage subsets, there is only one enemy that is both bullet and melee resistant.

If you plot damage out on a curve, the fortefighter spikes real high against any enemy that isn't melee-resistant, but dips to almost nothing against any other enemy. The figunner damage is only SLIGHTLY lower than the fortefighter's, but is much flatter so they never slow down in the damage dealing. Surely, if you've played fortefighter, you've noticed that even using Anga Redda with a decent elemental % rates you a mere 400 a hit against the aforementioned big enemies like Jarbas, while my newman female guntecher does more than that far faster, to say nothing of my cast figunner.

"OK," you say, "but they can really whoop ass against all the other enemies!" The thing is, ANY class can whoop ass against all the other enemies. The damage difference is barely noticable. ANYONE can kill the enemies that the fortefighter is so strong against, without ending up with their cocks in their hands if they bump across anything else.

Hell, when my beast was a fortefighter she was dealing only 150-200 more damage per hit with AXE PAs than when she was A PROTRANSER, and I can use traps, guns, and SE4 effects as a PT so I never ever feel useless!

If all of the fortefighter players would just level up protranser to 10 they'd realise just how gimp the FF is. I can't imagine how big numbarz against easy-to-hurt enemies can possibly cloud the mind to the fact that FFs can do almost nothing against anything else.

[ This Message was edited by: imfanboy on 2007-06-24 23:15 ]

Niloklives

Jun 25, 2007, 01:28 AM

that's where the versatility comes into play. but the cost down and better regen that a FF has over a PT makes the FFs axe far more potent than a PTs even if they only do 200 more per hit, that's over 1k on a full combo and a FF can get way more uses out of that axe than a PT which makes that extra 1k that much more appealing. As I said, FFs are one of the least versatile classes in the game, but when it comes to doing what they do...no one does it better.

And I canno stress enough what that cost down does for FFs. they are the best class to make use of an HPC just making their damage skyrocket even further. 200 damage extra is nothing to turn you r nose to. especially once that 200 becomes a 300 or a 400 with each class set to its optimum. That's not to discount PTs in the least, but you can't turn and say the PTs are better FFs than FFs themselves.

SolomonGrundy

Jun 25, 2007, 01:39 AM

I don't even understand why people are head over heels about FF damage, their DPS is lower than FI's in most situations. Anga Redda's big numbers don't mean higher DPS, at all.

bing bing bing! we have a winnah!
/Boston accent.

Uriko (and everyone else), I'm not sure what game you are playing, but it's not PSU. There are very very few areas in the game without a melee resistant enemies. And as soon as this occurs, FiGs pull ahead. The only saving grace for fF is the pp reduction.

I've done this before, but I'll do it again: the LARGEST ATP difference between a FiG and a fF is 107, the largest DFP gap is 45.

107 ATP is 22 points of damage per hit, and 45 DFP is 9 damage. With regard to weapons, that 22 damage will get lost in the shuffle for anything but dual daggers...oh but look, FiGunner get S rank dual daggers. Funny how that worked out.

Someone take screenshots and show me I'm wrong, if you think I am .

That aside, the other difference, melee wise is Axe vs Double Saber. FiGs are more accurate, and Double saber has slightly more ATA (in the 7-9* range). Twin saber PAs are arguably better. And Twin sabers are defininetly faster.

Basically, fortefighter is the best at killing stuff no one really has trouble with anyway. Even 'King' type enemies are better handed by FiGs, as 'King' does not make an enemy immune to weapon SE, and a virus/fire crossbow or Twin Handgun helps make short work of these enemies.

and this is not even considering traps, which is a HUGE advantage.

Even the other 2 forte-type classes have more options than fFs. fTs have level 30 bullets, and fGs have a decent melee weapons (better than fFs ranged weapon selection!), and Traps.

How one can even begin to say that fortefighter are overpowered is playing a different PSU. (probably one with a PM full of 50% ank pikors).

imfanboy

Jun 25, 2007, 01:45 AM

Protransers aren't better FORTEFIGHTERS, they're better CLASSES overall. Everyone says that forte-classes are meant for teamwork, but that isn't how it works out with the fortefighter because it has almost NO place in a team.

I know it has better PP usage. The question is, does it matter a ratass? Using Anka Redda, it only added up to ONE more full combo out of an axe. I still have to bring multiple weapons or Photon Charges in order to keep using my PAs.

It doesn't matter if you can deal 1k extra damage against a Polty or a Lapucha (the only enemies that aren't likely to interrupt your combo with Anga Redda), because ANYONE can kill those. When you end up dealing LESS damage than a protranser against the real roadblock enemies like Tengouhgs or Jarbas or yes, even Polahvoras, and don't even have the option of using some DoT to even out any inability to deal regular damage...

No. Just no. PT is a better class than FF. The PT is more useful in more situations and is useless in almost NONE, whereas there are far too many times in this game where the fortefighter ends up staring uselessly and going, "Duhh..?"

imfanboy

Jun 25, 2007, 01:47 AM

On 2007-06-24 23:39, SolomonGrundy wrote:Basically, fortefighter is the best at killing stuff no one really has trouble with anyway.

For once, I agree with you. The entire problem with fortefighter is summed up in this one beautiful sentence: Fortefighter is the best at killing stuff no one really has trouble with anyway.

Any other time, the fortefighter is useless; worse than useless, because the FF is taking up a party slot that could be taken up by someone more versatile.

SolomonGrundy

Jun 25, 2007, 02:03 AM

I amfanboy, what have we ever diagreed on?
0.o

imfanboy

Jun 25, 2007, 02:17 AM

On 2007-06-25 00:03, SolomonGrundy wrote:
I amfanboy, what have we ever diagreed on?
0.o

Little things that weren't worth my time or yours arguing over. *shrug*

Let's stick to the point: FF sucks, and the suckage is NOT inherent to the class itself; the problem is in the variety of enemies which the FF simply can't deal with at all. Dunno how to fix it. Shadoogs, maybe?

But something's got to be done. It's just... awful.

[ This Message was edited by: imfanboy on 2007-06-25 00:24 ]

Niloklives

Jun 25, 2007, 02:30 AM

hey I'm the first to advocate versatility over raw power. Hell my three favored classes are GT, PT and FG. I'm just saying that FFs have their perks.

Then again I'm not a big fan of axes. when I go FF I mainlly use a dagger/handgun combo or twinclaws/twinsabers. the low accuracy f the axe is just so unappealing to me. but I know it has its meritts...good luck getting me to see them =p

Anyway I agree that FF could use more ATP as an exclamation point to their supposed prowess in melee combat and as I understand it, their ATP bonus is jumping to 140% at lvl 10 - though I might be wrong. but that 12% increase while it may be that many classes are getting it, will increase even further at lvl 20 and 30 which will put a good difference between FF and FG so the debate will be less of an issue.

Still, FFs do have their perks so it's not right to overlook them...but I know those perks can seem quite insignificant at times

SolomonGrundy

Jun 25, 2007, 02:42 AM

when I read fanboys's 'it's awful' comment, I wanted to disgree, but I can't...completely.

fF is playable, and it you want to use S ranks knuckles, twin claws, swords and spears (or any rank axe), its your ONLY option (ha,ha!). but of all the jobs, it is the one most easily replaced by another job in a party.

Do you ever see a group spamming "looking for a Fortefighter to do XXX mission"

no.

PS: So many things could fix fF it's not funny, AoI's increase in ATP isn't one of them. Every other job is getting mroe ATP as well.

Niloklives

Jun 25, 2007, 03:02 AM

maybe...but I think the atp incread for FFs will be far more significant all said and done. I mean 140% at 10...maybe 200% at 20 while a figh only has 160 at 20. that's only conjecture right now, but a difference that big in power would certainly up the appeal of a FF..we'll just have to see how it's handled

SolomonGrundy

Jun 25, 2007, 03:40 AM

Dude, it would have to be MASSIVE to = for FiGs getting SE3 with crossbow.

Niloklives

Jun 25, 2007, 04:18 AM

I know how you feel. Fighs are just gonna get stronger come AoI. but time will tell on how ST adresses the balance issues. if I'm right and the ATP bonus DOES get to be as big a difference as I think it will...I mean it's going to be real hard to match damage numbers at that point when looking at FF. but they may overlook FFs too. still...I mean FFs are getting nothing new come AoI. no new weapon types or anything of the sort and thus far all the improvements we've seen have been stat based. I think there may be something positive to say about that. but only time will tell.

Akaimizu

Jun 25, 2007, 09:40 AM

On 2007-06-25 00:42, SolomonGrundy wrote:

Do you ever see a group spamming "looking for a Fortefighter to do XXX mission"

no.

Then you don't see me. Though I'm not a spammer, I do look forward to getting them. Unlike most Figunner's, they usually stick to good old melee (and of course, those awesome spears). As for spamming. I almost never see a specific class ever being spammed for. I don't even remember a (looking for ForteTecher) or anything else being spammed, like that. Maybe I play at wrong times a day.

[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2007-06-25 08:02 ]

Revolt2origin

Jun 25, 2007, 11:25 AM

I agree 100% with imfanboy's comments. I spent months playing as a Fortefighter thinking it would be like my old HUcast. But the experience was far from it. And if I had not tried another class, I would have ended up cancelling my subscription.

What really showed me how awful Fortefighter is, was when I made a Female Beast Fortetecher as a joke... And she turned out more useful than my Male Beast Fortefighter!!!

I now have a Female Cast Guntecher, that makes me feel like an absolute god when I play as her...
And as for my Male Beast main character, well he's now a Protranser. I would have gone Fortegunner, but I thought I'd try to salvage some of the many skills I levelled to 30... *sigh* Wish I hadn't wasted all those PA frags.

Anyway, I've been trying to warn some people I know about the class... But most won't listen. In fact one person I know is trying to do the very same thing I tried to. He's playing as a 'pure' Male Beast Fortefighter and he wants *wait for it* a Hard Power Charge unit... I nearly fell over when he told me this (I've already been down that road of bitter disappointment).

BTW about spamming "looking for a Fortefighter to do XXX mission". I can definitely say I've never seen it, while I have seen "looking for Fortegunner" a few times. "Looking for Fortetecher" though is spammed many times at hot spots I've been to. And playing as my Female Beast Fortetecher I was once chased down by a group who wouldn't take no for an answer.

panzer_unit

Jun 25, 2007, 11:27 AM

I don't think anyone's noticed that melee weapons - particularly S-ranks - can tag status effects. If anything (Frying Pan, or Crimson for example) has a nice SE3 burn that should end the worst class imbalance right there. Infect would be good for helping fighters versus robots, but they can proc freeze and possibly confuse which are both really nice for a supporting role... I'm not sure which S-rank knuckles do that.

Being able to do DOT effects is overrated if you're on a team. A lot of people in this thread think that DPS from effects is primarily for enlarging your e-peen, and everyone on a team should be racing to tag the effect before anyone else does (with awesome stuff like fire-on-fire elemental bullets, jogiris, poison trap g's). Fact is that as long as SOMEONE does it, it counts the same for the whole team. Ideally you'd organize a bit and save the DOT role specifically for your teammates with the least direct damage but this never happens IRL.

Akaimizu

Jun 25, 2007, 11:31 AM

On 2007-06-25 09:27, panzer_unit wrote:
Ideally you'd organize a bit and save the DOT role specifically for your teammates with the least direct damage but this never happens IRL.

Too True. It's my main kind of clash with Figunners and Fortegunners. They get all that great direct damage, but they tend to be quick on trying to be the DoT people above me. One of the reasons I love ForteFighters, they're like the perfect Guntecher compliment because they do exactly what the Guntecher wants, no more, no less. It's why I look for em. Something that perfectly compliments me.

[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2007-06-25 09:39 ]

ljkkjlcm9

Jun 25, 2007, 11:33 AM

On 2007-06-25 09:27, panzer_unit wrote:
I don't think anyone's noticed that melee weapons - particularly S-ranks - can tag status effects. If anything (Frying Pan, or Crimson for example) has a nice SE3 burn that should end the worst class imbalance right there.

LOL crimson is a single saber, which means fighgunners get it not Fortefighter.

THE JACKEL

Akaimizu

Jun 25, 2007, 11:35 AM

On 2007-06-25 09:33, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:

On 2007-06-25 09:27, panzer_unit wrote:
I don't think anyone's noticed that melee weapons - particularly S-ranks - can tag status effects. If anything (Frying Pan, or Crimson for example) has a nice SE3 burn that should end the worst class imbalance right there.

LOL crimson is a single saber, which means fighgunners get it not Fortefighter.

THE JACKEL

In a way, I'd rather they keep it that way. Simply boost the Fortefighter to melee god status, I'll say. That's what I really ask for, from ST. If the day comes where Figunners can look at a Fortefighter and say "OMG. Look at that melee damage!" That would be a fine adjustment, for me. Like I said, I love the class, and part of it is because they complete me as evenly as Dr. Evil said about MiniMe. Except, they aren't mini, they are more like BigMe.

[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2007-06-25 09:38 ]

panzer_unit

Jun 25, 2007, 11:42 AM

On 2007-06-25 09:33, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
LOL crimson is a single saber, which means fighgunners get it not Fortefighter.

THE JACKEL

Hot damn, so they do. I thought fortefighter had S sabers for some reason.

ljkkjlcm9

Jun 25, 2007, 11:49 AM

as I said earlier in this thread, Fortefighters should be tanks. They should be able to stand there and take massive physical damage. It's crap that enemies like buffed Go Vahra do 400 damage to them. That's fine that it happens to a fighgunner, but at most it should do 100 damage. Sorry to reference WoW, but it should work like that. Fortefighters should be the warrior classes that end up being tanks and living for a very long time with tons of HP and defense, and fighgunners more like rogues... best melee DPS but lacks the ability to take much damage.

THE JACKEL