Seed Vitae: any skills stun, or knock this guy over

[SolomonGrundy]

Running fight for food the other day and whipped out my pair of trusty twin sabers.
Using rising crush, I want after the seed vitae - but he did not get flipped/stun locked like seed vance does.

Are there any PAs which DO stunlock seed vitae?

[Xaeris]

I find that Rising Strike's second hit (single saber just to be clear on the distinction) can deal a knockback where more standard skills for that purpose fail. I haven't tried it on a Vitace seeing as I can just bust out a grenade launcher, but on kamatozes which can't be knocked over by Rising Crush, Rising Strike can. Might be the same here.

[BahnKnakyu]

Naw, it has the resistance of a Vear, so you're gonna have to Mayalee Fury/Prism its butt if you want to permanently stunlock it.

[SolomonGrundy]

mayalee fury also does not work.

[Niloklives]

he's pretty stun resistant. I've yet to find a way to lock him

[Zorafim]

Remember the days when knockbacks actually worked? There are so many enemies that I fight that simply won't get stunned by PAs anymore, while they can throw me around easily.

[Niloklives]

heh...this huy I usually just burn or pick away at with dualies (fighgunner) or as GT I burn him wiith my bow and switch to light xbow to pile on the damage...

[Mystil]

You can try the following.. All of these have knockdown/backs within combo 1-2 range so you want need to level them up much past 11.

Buten Shuren Zan - you can spam combo one and immediatly use it again, when the "stun time" recoils(IF the stun kicks in) to get a stun lock affect.

Dus Rabedo. This will not stun but flinch(big difference)

The third twin dagger PA, but it has SHOOOORT range.


That's all I can think of. The rest are too far into combo 2 and 3.

[SolomonGrundy]

@Zorafim: yes, the game has gone QUITE far out of it's way to ensure that skills do not work, but DoTs, and debuffs do.



Buten Shuren Zan does not work, but you can sneak in hits and not get tagged.

Dus Rabedo: not what I'm looking for

The third ultimate twin dagger PA: can anyone confirm that this works?

[Xaeris]

The first and second movement of Hishou Jinren-zan have never worked for me for the purpose of knocking them down. I use it anyway for the sake of knocking up whatever friends it has next to it, but yeah, these things are sturdier than redwoods it seems.

[TheBlackDeath]

On 2007-08-10 08:56, SolomonGrundy wrote:
The third ultimate twin dagger PA: can anyone confirm that this works?

I got hishou jinren-zan while I was a fortefighter and all I have to say is that it is the end all be all of stunlocking skills. Every hit causes them to flinch and the last hit causes knockup. It works wonders on the seed-vitace and pretty much every other enemy that requires stunlocking. It's not recommended on something like a polavohra though because the first combo knocks them away from the rest of the hits.

[Niloklives]

are you sure you're talking about the right seed? I've used this on the vitace and gotten swatted away every time.

[TheBlackDeath]

On 2007-08-10 10:36, NIloklives wrote:
are you sure you're talking about the right seed? I've used this on the vitace and gotten swatted away every time.


Kind of a shot in the dark here but maybe it's because you're on a different version. From what I've heard there are minor differences between the three versions. For example, on the 360 bees are like fighting the devil's spawn but from what I've heard on PC they move and still shoot stingers but don't do the "invincible" charge, and on PS2 they don't really do anything at all except occasionally teleport. If there is such a difference in AI maybe there could be a difference in certain interactions between the player and an object.

Other than that perhaps a more logical reason might be due to lag. Of the videos I've seen on the PS2 and PC versions it lags so much that the actual hit on an enemy occurs long after it's already connected. So even if you do hit it, before you can take advantage of it being stunned it knocks you away with a sweep attack and then registers the hit.

[Niloklives]

that hardly makes sense since I can stunluck anything else in the game with little trouble.

also this Bee/Bug BS I still have yet to see. there are 4 different bugs. 3 mechanical and 1 organic. the organic one does not move unless it gets hit with a kick back PA at qhich point it turns. aside from that you can sit stil and just shoot them in the back. I play on PS2. play with both PS2 and PC users and not one person has had information that contradicts my personal experiences once they actually stop and pay attention to the enemy movements. most people just assime the bugs are all the same until then.

But I can stunlock anything else with my double saber, my twin saber and my dagger. vitace though as soon as a hit him with anything that WOULD stagger him, he spins and bats me away hitting me with an ATP down and making me feel silly for even having tried.

[TheBlackDeath]

First of all, where did I say that I'm the only one who could possibly know anything about this game. Therefore that does not make what I said BS. I said it was a shot in the dark because I don't really know since I've never played on PS2 or the PC versions, and no one else can really know from one's own personal experience. That said I'm not just making stuff up and just because what I say doesn't fit with your line of thinking doesn't make it wrong.

Anyway, I was only talking about the organic bees, the mechanical ones don't seem to give me as much trouble. I've had times where I was just setting up in a good spot to tag a large group of bees with my shotgun when they all turn and charge at me. Even so, I understand that not all of them are the same, because even though they have similar attacks they are executed differently.

Name me a different enemy that can burrow underground, shoot fireballs and megid, and spin like the seed vitace that you can stunlock using the same methods. No the Seed vance doesn't count and all the other enemies are just that: different. Sometimes the Seed vitace just decides to be a bitch and knocks you away everytime you get close, other times you can get a hit in and knock it down and keep it from getting back up.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-08-10 12:00, NIloklives wrote:


also this Bee/Bug BS I still have yet to see. there are 4 different bugs. 3 mechanical and 1 organic. the organic one does not move unless it gets hit with a kick back PA at qhich point it turns.


on the 360 this enemy has several moves. One of which is a charge move. it most definitely does not just sit there.



But I can stunlock anything else with my double saber, my twin saber and my dagger. vitace though as soon as a hit him with anything that WOULD stagger him, he spins and bats me away hitting me with an ATP down and making me feel silly for even having tried.

SEED vance gets knocked over when hit by a variety of attacks. the S rank version, SEED Vitae does not. At leas, not on the 360 servers. It does not even do the heavy flinch that enemies like jaraba do when it with launch, or blow away efects.

[Mystil]

I do know for a fact that Anga Redda will knock them over, I have done it. Need 21+ though. I suspect you want stun effects that don't require going past combo 2.

[Niloklives]

On 2007-08-10 14:43, SolomonGrundy wrote:
SEED vance gets knocked over when hit by a variety of attacks. the S rank version, SEED Vitae does not. At leas, not on the 360 servers. It does not even do the heavy flinch that enemies like jaraba do when it with launch, or blow away efects.



I'm pretty sure I said that. I'm fairly certain I said that I have yet to see any means of stunning vitace, let alone stun locking him...because MY experience with vitace is that they're a pain in the ass and nothing a fighter wants to get close to. I'm not the one who said use hishou. in fact I said Hishou wouldn't work

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-08-10 19:12, NIloklives wrote:

On 2007-08-10 14:43, SolomonGrundy wrote:
SEED vance gets knocked over when hit by a variety of attacks. the S rank version, SEED Vitae does not. At leas, not on the 360 servers. It does not even do the heavy flinch that enemies like jaraba do when it with launch, or blow away efects.



I'm pretty sure I said that. I'm fairly certain I said that I have yet to see any means of stunning vitace, let alone stun locking him...because MY experience with vitace is that they're a pain in the ass and nothing a fighter wants to get close to. I'm not the one who said use hishou. in fact I said Hishou wouldn't work



you did say that http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif I was quoting multiple peeps in one post and not giving quote credit where it was due. please accept my aplogy.

ok,so - seed vitae, on the list of enemies that suck to fight. They are tech resistant too...

[MrNomad]

Anga Redda and Dugrega are great at knockback, but mostly dug

[Niloklives]

not vs vitace they aren't

[Konstanse_Xx]

I remember soloing against these as FF, I just spammed Redda when the thing was busy launching Foie/Megid, I know it's not stunning but I can pretty much kill it without getting it at all. o.o

[SolomonGrundy]

This is a wartecher...and a newman at that. The reason I would like to stun Mr. Vitae, is because I don't want him casting foie, or using jellen on my NPCs. Jellend NPCs don't hit for very much damage :-/





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-08-13 07:10 ]</font>

[Konstanse_Xx]

Ah I see, well I don't play as my FF anymore, in fact I play as a Newman and I use every weapon pretty much except knuckles, if I run into any Vitace, I'll try to lok for a way to stun them at least for a small amount of time.

[TheBlackDeath]

On 2007-08-13 07:09, SolomonGrundy wrote:
This is a wartecher...and a newman at that. The reason I would like to stun Mr. Vitae, is because I don't want him casting foie, or using jellen on my NPCs. Jellend NPCs don't hit for very much damage :-/

Well that limits things a bit. The only other things I would suggest if rising crush and hishou jinren-zan don't work is bogga robado, shousen totsuzan-ga, and maybe senten kanzan-ga. Barring that, I don't know, because even soloing(tech charge hunting FTL) I've managed to stun the seed-vitace with every PA that has knockback/up somewhere in the combo. Maybe a way to solve this would be to do some field testing? If you want to meet up with me we can try out different PA's and try to find one that works the best.

[SolomonGrundy]

I'm up for that. how often are you online?

[TheBlackDeath]

On 2007-08-14 18:23, SolomonGrundy wrote:
I'm up for that. how often are you online?


Eh heh, yeah. I'm only online on the weekends and friday night. When I am on though I pretty much stay awake until I'm so tired that I spend a good minute or so running into a wall before I wake up enough to realize what I'm doing.(lol) Then I sleep for an hour and get right back on to mission grinding just so I could possibly find something of any value whatsoever. Anyway, depressing game existence aside, feel free to send me a FR, my gamertag is TH3 B1ACK D3A7H.

[SolomonGrundy]

cool! I'll send the FR tomorrow, I'm trying to catch up with some work tonight.

[A2K]

If even Mayalee Fury doesn't work, there really isn't much hope for much of anything. I seem to recall it actually working in the past, though? You sure you've attempted this when the creature is "idling" and not in the middle of an unstoppable attack animation?

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-08-15 03:49, A2K wrote:
If even Mayalee Fury doesn't work, there really isn't much hope for much of anything. I seem to recall it actually working in the past, though? You sure you've attempted this when the creature is "idling" and not in the middle of an unstoppable attack animation?



to be honest I cannot say for sure. but I AM sure that the twin saber stunlock does not work. I have unloaded many many many PP worth of rising crush on Mr. Vitae, and he can't have been in unstappable animation the entire time.

Still, this is for a wartecher. Maylee fury isn't an option.

[Niloklives]

mayalee fury doesn't work. I've tried it pleanty of times as a GT. what happens is it actually triggers his spin in many cases. he'll be idle then stagger for a split second...then spin...every time.

[LTrav2k]

I always thought that the probability of the stun working was based on how much damage was dealt with the launching/knockback hit of the PA. The only reason I thought this was because there were things where a mob wouldn't be stunned normally by me (go low ATP of wartechers), but then after debuffing stuns would work fine.

Can someone let me in on how the stun part is working now?

[Niloklives]

on lower ranks, smaller enemies are staggered just by hitting them whil on higher difficulties, they can only be staggered by certain moves or weapon types (for example rifles and bows stagger small and midsized enemies no matter the difficulty or the damage)

for example a delsaban is with with the full attack of buten shuren zan. the 4th hit causes wipe out and the monster falls to the floor, while the 8th hit knocks it away. this same omve when used on a jarba instead on falling or flying staggers and ceases its attack. certain moves hit with attacks that carry these properties rapidly, like rising crush or spiral dance. on larger enemies these moves stagger them continuously and they are unable to turn or counter attack.

in this case, grundy is asking if there is a move that will allow a stun lock like this to be used on lvl 50+ seed forms known as seed: vitae. unfortunately, these enemies have an unstoppable counterattack that they perform as soon as they are staggered making it impossible to lock them down.

[SolomonGrundy]

On the plus side it appears that you can wait for them to pluge thier arms into the ground, and bash away with impunity.

Sadly, this does not help with NPCs, as the large arm sweep will still jellen them, and the SEED vitae performs this as soon as the arms pull up.

:-/

[Niloklives]

I will say this: Boma Maga


...Boma Maga

[TheBlackDeath]

On 2007-08-19 17:02, NIloklives wrote:
I will say this: Boma Maga


...Boma Maga



Which also isn't an option for a wartecher. Anyway, grundy and I went and did some testing on the seed-vitace at the end of fight for food S. I went in with every melee weapon I had, as a fortefighter no less, and used everything I could think of to even knock the damn thing down. To my surprise NOTHING worked. Even Anga Dugrega and Bogga Zubba didn't work, and of course Hishou Jinren-zan didn't work. Now this surprised me because when I used to do Hive S missions quite a bit I could always knock down the vitace with Zubba or Hishou. I am 100% sure that I was able to knock it down so the only reason I can see in light of this is that something was modified. I'm sorry I can't offer more proof that I ever could but I didn't really think it would change.

[Niloklives]

as I already said...I've not been able to find a way to even stun these guys. my little message there was simply "your only shot at fighting dirty against this guy" it is the only attack i've seen that stops this guy in his traks and for obvious reasons.

sadly it means you won't be burning him if you do this and hes immune to virus...so pick your poison and good luck

[TheBlackDeath]

I'm starting to wonder if even Anga Jabroga will be able to do anything to the seed vitace. Short of using a grenade launcher or high level technics there doesn't seem to be anything that can even take down the vitace without taking a long time while soloing. I guess we'll just have to wait for Gravity break.

[Niloklives]

that won't do any good cause he;kk just swat you away. your best bet it to get in quick attacks and run back. if you can burn them, do so..,but this game was not made with soloing in mind, so its not suprising tha some of these enemies are seemingly difficult in one on one fights.