Help selecting PAs for Male Human PT

[SolomonGrundy]

Here's what I have so far.

Melee:
Saber: all of them
Sword: Spinning break
Axe: planning on Durega
Spear: undecided, help!
Knuckles: undecided, help!

Bullets:
Bow: all of them
Pistol: Maylee hit, Light, Fire
Shotgun: Virus, Ground, other?
Grenades: Ice
Laser: undecided, help!

Considering:

Something for the knuckles:
Bogga Danga? Good for mobs, looks cool
Bogga Zubba? Accurate, good crowd control, expensive and slow
Dus Majarra? Dus Robado? I need some circular PAs, don't I?

I am open to suggestion for bullets: esp laser or additional grenade bullets.

I was also thinking of omitting spears altogether: I have 2 other charaters that use them (fF and WT). It's just that spears are unfairly good.

[soolayah]

I'm not too knowledgable about anything, but here're my views on stuff. xD

I find Bogga Danga spreads out the mobs a bit too much in parties - Robado is better. I use Zubba the most though, it's good for stuff like polavohras, vanda mehras and olgohmon. Although I suppose you could just use Rising Strike, but I switch between them whenever I run out of PP in one weapon. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Iv'e used lasers once, and didn't like them. I would give them another chance now that they're getting a boost soon, but I'm running out of PA space. xD

I have fire, dark, ice and ground 'nades. I'd suggest fire, since it can burn even big monsters at lv 21+.

Maylee Hit is the HP drain one, right? From what I heard it wasn't really good enough to be worthwile, but I've never used it, so I don't really know. I'd suggest lightning, since shock is my favorite SE by far, and handguns are your only mobile SE weapon, and get SE3 at lv 21+.

I'd get lightning for shotgun too. Mobs that cant hit you > mobs that die a little faster from SE.

Dus Majarra is rediculously good, so I'd get that, but go ahead and skip spears all together if you want. xD
I tend to never really use Dus Robado unless I force myself to level it, since I don't really see the point going in the middle of mobs, and always use shotguns on small monsters anyway...

Well... yeah. Hope I was helpful. xD

[panzer_unit]

hmm...

Knuckles - you want these, they're good single-target melee weapons and the off-brand B-ranks are insanely competitive with Tenora A's.
For PA, Bogga Zubba gives you a solid launch move. You've got NOTHING else to cover that aside from incomplete Anga Redda, Gravity Break, and Rising Strike combos. None of those options are very effective in comparison.

Sabers - it comes in handy to have all the Saber moves. Gravity Strike isn't much on paper but racks up some nice damage on 3-target enemies. I'd suggest the full spread of handgun elements to go with it. Leveling them all is going to be a bear but the power and utility blew my mind the moment my first handgun skill dinged 21.

Swords / Spears - I don't use spears either. IMO you need Tornado and Gravity for sword as well.

Grenade - fire... you're not a fortegunner, grenades aren't going to be anywhere near your best direct-damage weapon against most large enemies. The knockdown is what's invaluable as a team support attack, and burn's not a bad effect to add to the bargain.

Laser - phantasm? I'm gonna try it out when I get frags ... you'll get more later when the base weapon effect becomes more worthwhile. It's more powerful to level one bullet at a time to 30 rather than going evenly on all elements at once. They don't have element % or SE worth trading off on max lv.

[HFlowen]

On 2007-10-01 13:21, SolomonGrundy wrote:
Here's what I have so far.

Melee:
Saber: all of them
Sword: Spinning break Gravity Break and tornado
Axe: planning on Durega Duregga is great, Jabroga is too.
Spear: undecided, help! Daggas, and especially Majarra
Knuckles: undecided, help! Danga is shinny, robaddo is strong, never liked zubba...

Bullets:
Bow: all of them
Pistol: Maylee hit, Light, Fire
Shotgun: Virus, Ground, other? Both ult PA's are good for PT
Grenades: Ice Duranga
Laser: undecided, help! Maylee has it's uses, phantasam is great, at least until they give all lasers SE 2 and flinch, =P.
Protranser has some GREAT options now that the other Ult pa's are out.

[SolomonGrundy]

Why are berzerk grenades good for a PT?

Also, if I have the high damage saber PA which is single target, do I need the sword as well?

For lasers: phantasm puts enemies to sleep, right? why is this good..is the shot cost cheap or something?

I guess the penetrating handgun is awful for a PT (low damage mod coupled with poor ATP)

[HFlowen]

Duranga has a SICK atp modifier, and PT's have a good amount of health.

Spinning Strike (Saber) is a very strong, very fast, very ACCURATE pa that only hits one target. Gravity break is stronger and hits two targets with it's second and third combo but costs more and hits slower. They both have their uses.

Phantasm Prisim caps at 190% atp (other lasers cap at 160 or 165). It also Flinches enemies.

And penetrating hit sucks for anyone. >.>;

[Pillan]

Don’t think so much about PT’s stats right now, but plan for the future. PT has around 10% more ATP than GT (slightly less than WT), so low mod arts such as the penetrating handgun bullet will work fine (though the lower ATA might hurt).

Sabers: Rising Strike is a must. The other 2 can be replaced by similar skills on other weapons (Dus Majara for Gravity Strike and Gravity Break for Spinning Strike) and are only needed if you’re a saber nut like me.

Swords: All the PAs are alright, but Gravity Break is the only art that can’t be done as well or better with a spear. Tornado Break’s 170% to 4 targets, getting stronger with each move, or Dus Robado’s 230% to 3 targets, getting weaker on the second and stronger on the third, and Spinning Break’s 205% vs. Dus Daggas’ faster 160%.

Spears: See the above. Looks like Sonic Team finally balanced them to the point where swords do slightly more damage but are slower and less accurate. But, still, they only really differentiate in function between the ults.

Axes: Duranga gets buffed to like 260% ATP, so that’s a must, and Jabroga is nice. Redda can act as a Dus Daggas/Spinning Break/Gravity Strike substitute.

Knuckles: 260% ATP Bogga Zubba and 220% or so Bogga Robado kind of leave the 180% Bogga Danga in the dust. Bogga Zubba is the only one of them that really has its own niche though.

Bows: If they’re your primary boss slaying gun, get all of them. Otherwise, dark, fire, and ice are all that are worth keeping because that’s all that effects large mobs. Masei-sou has some bad reviews, but I like it simply because it’s the only PA with stun. The accuracy issue isn’t big once you get it to 21+, but getting it to 21 is the main problem.

Pistol: Get all of them if they’re your primary boss slaying gun. Otherwise just get the ones you want. HP drain might be a good consideration. The penetration isn’t necessary since you can use laser cannons, but I can’t say anything bad about it.

Shotgun: Get all of them just because they’re useful for sending out SEs and for opposite element damage. The EVP/ATA down is a must for axe spammers, especially since it’s getting buffed to SE 3 at 21. I don't know how important Chamga would be to you though.

Grenades: Duranga has a higher ATA mod, so your damage won’t be that much less than fG. Maga is even more useless with the enemy STA nerf (though the cost was lowered to like 40). Burn and Infection are good ideas since it’s nice to get the SE damage on large mobs while stun locking them (probably even more so with the element nerf).

Lasers: Phantasm has a higher ATA mod, so that might be useful (all lasers get buffed to 185-190% ATP). Sleep and freeze would probably be the most useful, just to hold the enemies in place to get the constant penetration damage.

[SolomonGrundy]

Thanks pillian, that was pretty helpful.
The reason I am using sabers is that I anticipate using pistols a good bit, and I am SICK of spears!

Also, will PTs get Shadoogs in AoI?

I do like the gravity break, I'm just worried that if I get it, I'll never use the saber PA again. And sabers are more accurate, and the saber PA is more accurate. If I want to heap damage on a single target, I DON'T want to miss.

I like how accurate zubba is. I'll have to see what S2 deljarbans are like for evade. If it's as bad as I suspect it will be, then zubba is the way to go. Knuckels have high accuracy, this PA has high accuracy, and deljabas are happy to sit around and hurl megids at you.

For Bows: Fire and Dark are for SE. Earth bow is for Maggas, Elec for Dimma, Light for Falkis. That leaves ice, and I just figured why not make the suite at that points.

The ultimate bow PAs can suck it.

[HFlowen]

No Shadoogs.

Just the same stuff we have now at S rank.

[panzer_unit]

Get gravity break AND spinning strike. Yeah they're both high-damage single-target moves. you'll need those on both sabers and swords just to get the most out of your restricted PP supply without carting around half a dozen swords. Also the subtle differences are important. Gravity Break is easier to tag targets with... more reach and less delay... and the crowd control hits are multi-target. Spinning Strike is more accurate, and much more energy efficient when you're whittling down a single tough monster, since both moves are 2 hits and both have crowd control.

I've whiffed entire Zubba attacks on S2 Deljabans from time to time. You'll be well-challenged to hit those things.

Gravity Break is the better move no doubt. Easier to hit with (range and speed wise) with better crowd control and more damage. On the other hand Spinning Strike is cheaper, much more accuraty, and deals Wipeout on the first move.

[TUSCAN]

focus on bullets. get as many as you can and then get a few melee arts. if you really plan on taking your protranser all the way then this will pay off come the expansion. I find bullets take longer to level due to the fact that you're always changing from one element to another, whereas when using melee arts you can cover all elements with the same art.

your damage isn't going to be great so try to focus on filling the holes in your party by using status effects and crowd control.

I'd suggest every elemental bow and handgun bullet, and every single shotgun bullet. Ice, dark, ground and duranga grenades. lasers I have always liked, but they are very situational at this point in time. for now I'd just work on maylee and phantasm. once the expansion is released you will have alot of oppertunities to level the elemental bullets, as well as the rest of the grenades.

for melee, I use knuckles, spears and sabers because I need the speed to make up for my lack of power. knuckles are great for their ata, their mobility, the range of crowd control abilities among the photon arts (and ick hick, which is, imho, tres cool), the fact that all you really need to do is chain the first attack of the regular combo together for fast damage, and the rabol gant/gudda gant combo. I'm sure you know all about spears. again, the armor/weapon combo for the spears will go a long way for a protranser.

I really enjoy melee and plan on leveling all the melee arts I can in the expansion. I'm sure the timed attack system will force me to introduce alot more melee into my gameplan. right now, however, I'm limited as to how many arts I can learn and I know that any bullet I max out now I'll still be leveling come the expansion, so I'm focusing on getting as many bullets I can to 30.

[SolomonGrundy]

yeah, I am going to lean on swords as my damager, rather than spears. Quite a few swrd PAs are getting a boost, in AoI.

for bullets, I don't want to get everything in handgun AND bow. Just for areas where I want mobility.

Light: goazorans
Fire: sworded olgohmons

I also went with the healing handgun bullet art, 'just cause' - what other enemies do I need to be highly mobile against?

[Hrith]

Sword: You can replace Spinning Break by Gravity Break.
Tornado Break is better than Dus Robado, contrary to popular belief, and even moreso in AoI. You should get that one

Axe: Dugrega is awesome. Redda is meh. Jabroga is probably not worth it on PT -- PT is not as strong as FF, and no PP reduction, too. Dus Daggas and Dus Robado have better DPS, anyway.

Spear: Daggas and Majarra are both good, Majarra may have high PP cost for PT.

Knuckles: Not Bogga Danga, either left is a good choice.


Shotgun: Thunder shotgun is probably the best one, so get it, it will be even more broken after the STA nerf.

Grenades: Get another one. I'd suggest earth, but any you fancy is fine, as long as you find a use for it.

Laser: Thunder is a must, even at Lv1 shock really help, so with Lv2 around the corner, it will be an awesome PA.
Second one is up to you, but do not get Mayalee Prism, it just sucks too much.
Phantasm Prism is probably a bad choice for PT, too (higher PP cost and bad SE).



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Hrith on 2007-10-02 05:23 ]</font>

[IsoDonk]

So far with my PT, I've gone for:

-Tornado Break
-Bogga Danga
-Dus Daggas
-Rising Strike

Barada Everything (bar the PA frag arts)
Everything-sou (again bar the PA frag arts)

-Boma Banga
-Boma Diga
-Burning Prism
-Frozen Hit

I intend on picking up the dark grenades and perhaps another Laser Cannon art eventually but I've got enough to be levelling at the moment as it is.

As for importance - I would suggest that the full range of bow arts are all but essential, and depending on how patient you are, the shotgun ones also - I only have Megiga up to Lv21 which is a nice all-rounder as it infects but the shotgun's damage is lacking a little until higher levels with PT so it's worth making your life as easy as possible with the appropriate element usage http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[panzer_unit]

Jabroga is good on a Protranser. I'd suggest using it instead of Duranga. It doesn't have the same DPS, but does like 4x the damage for comparable PP without blowing through your HP. For simple mob suppression any grenade will work, even unskilled (the third "ultimate" grenade PA, it's so cheap to fire and accurate)

[Hrith]

I'm not sure what you mean about Jabroga vs Dugrega. Dugrega is much safer to use and costs much less PP. Also, Dugrega is not a damage PA, it's used for knocking down baddies and keeping them pinned down. For damage Dus Daggas is the way to go as PT.

[HFlowen]

Duregga =/= Duranga

[panzer_unit]

On 2007-10-02 09:08, Hrith wrote:
I'm not sure what you mean about Jabroga vs Dugrega. Dugrega is much safer to use and costs much less PP. Also, Dugrega is not a damage PA, it's used for knocking down baddies and keeping them pinned down. For damage Dus Daggas is the way to go as PT.


Duranga... Boma Duranga. Blame Tenora Works for being unable to come up with unique-sounding names.
Dadan Danga Dunga Durega Duranga

Beasts, go figure.

[Hrith]

oops http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_shy.gif

[OldCoot]

For the laser cannon and one more grenade shot, I would go with dark.

[SolomonGrundy]

so the sleep PA cost MORE per shot than elemental lasers do?

Can someone tell me the costs of each ultimate laser PA, and the cost of a 'typical' elemental bullet? PSUpedia is down.

Also, thinking about the ultimate axe PA, vs. the ultimate shotgun PA. We're really only talking about dragons here, right? Ice will hit deregan, deragnus, and zolagoug plenty hard.

Finally, why are folks down on Dus Robado?

[TUSCAN]

the sleep laser get's lvl 3 status and has a 198% damage modifier at lvl 31. it will be very effective. I'm not sure about pp.

do you mean ultimate axe vs. ultimate grenade? my lvl 1 boma duranga hits just as hard as my lvl 30 boma riga, or ice grenade, on de ragan. and it's really fun to use, promotes teamwork, ect. I haven't used the new axe pa because I don't have the room for it, so I can't compare the two. I'm sure it's really great though, and I've got the disk sitting in my pm waiting for the expansion.

Dus Robado on a protranser is pretty inefficient, due to the pp consumption, when compared to tornado break. it feel alot more clumsy than tornado break and takes a little longer to get to the knockback and I think this is why most people choose not to use it.

I personally plan on lvling every pa my protranser can use in order to make my protranser fully adaptable to any situation ( I wanted to try boma duranga so I learnt it over my lvl 17 boma maga. I was so upset lol ). remember in the expansion you will be able to transfer fully leveled pa disks amongst your characters so I'd reccomend lvling all the pa's that none of your other charactes have. the expansion will be here so soon that it won't have a negative impact on your game not to have a few essential pa's while you lvl up secondary or even tertiary ones.

[panzer_unit]

I've got Anga Jabroga. What drew me to Jabroga is the sick amount of damage you can do per PP spent. It costs about the same as a max level grenade skill (48 vs 40? I forget) but:

Most of what I shoot with grenades is bullet-resistant - jabroga does twice the damage of a grenade
Jabroga hits twice - double again
Jabroga has a sick damage modifier - double again
Jabroga uses Axe ATP, and can have as much of any element I need - double again

... so each use of this PA does somewhere 8~16 times the damage of a grenade depending on equipment. So it's at an advantage even on a weapon with 1/4 the PP. Unlike Boma Duranga it's not ripping through my healing supplies either.

Boma Duranga seems like more of a Fortegunner skill... spending 'mates to save photon charges is a very reasonable tradeoff for that job. Also, since the damage you take (the main cost of use) scales up/down with damage done (am I right on that? is it 15% of the damage you do or 15% of your HP) it's a good candidate for firing at single smaller targets as well.

[Hrith]

But... grenades are 8~16 times faster? >_>

If you use Anga Jabroga for damage, know that Dus Daggas and Dus Majarra are both better, cost less PP on a much more accurate weapon (low Protranser ATA).

[panzer_unit]

So Hrith you know so much... do grenades 16 times faster than you can wind up and hit with Jabroga? My guess (based on spamming jabroga while a gunner was shooting grenades, and counting grenade hits) would be something more like 6x tops.

More importantly, you're doing about twice the damage PER AXE as you're dealing PER LAUNCHER. That's the worst of PT's problems even with their godawful stats right now... energy efficiency. Launcher's better at a lot of things... but when you need raw killpower, Jabroga is similar and better.

With Daggas and Majarra you're right next to the target the whole time and vulnerable to interruption. That's especially bad for Daggas since the power-move is at the end of the PA, probably less of a problem for Majarra... I think... since the second move seems to be the majority of its damage. Either way, the point of Jabroga is you charge up somewhere save and when you get around to the attack you only risk getting hit for a fraction of a second. That's why a PT would use a grenade in the first place... instead of any of the PA's that I assume they'd have.

Protranser ATA's no different from Fortefighter ATA, supposing they don't use Barada Maga to drop EVP... are you saying Anga Jabroga can't work for Fortefighter? I guess it's meant for all those axe-wielding Fighgunners then?

[pokefiend]

On 2007-10-02 12:56, SolomonGrundy wrote:
so the sleep PA cost MORE per shot than elemental lasers do?

Can someone tell me the costs of each ultimate laser PA, and the cost of a 'typical' elemental bullet?


Phantasm costs around the same as any elemental PA. Mayalee costs double. However Mayalee is very useful when soloing, and Mayalee in many cases is the best crowd control PA to exist.

Phantasm is a MUST have for cannon specialist (like my KOS_MOS character ^_______^). It's not only great now because of its +1 SE lvl and flinch, It'll be still awesome in Aoi when ST alters the sleep SE to match that of the Stun SE.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=lxO0t6jbbLk

1:12-1:20

[TUSCAN]

I can't wait to get some s rank axes to use with jabroga. it sounds like it's gonna be a real killer.

honestly the only thing I use grenades against these days are kog nadds, dragons and dru gora. and oftentimes I find myself cleaning up the dru gora with my spear. but I really find the grenades are incredible against the dragons and kog nadds. once you get the rhythm the grenades hit one after another in quick sucession and it's really easy to keep from getting knocked around thanks to their range.

I really wouldn't say that duranga is a fortegunner move, but rather a party move. I'll pop a trimate before I'll need a photon charge, so I'd rather spend 500 meseta on the charge and use the move in the presence of a healer (admittedly, this limits the usefulness of the move, but it's already a limited use weapon). also, it goes to lvl 40 on a protranser. jabroga cannot do this, hence I choose to lvl the bullet first.

[TUSCAN]

looks like there were a couple posts while I was writing the last one.

the only thing I don't like about jabroga is how it brings you into the dragon, say, and you then have to run around and set up again, or you get knocked around a bit and lose time. I find I can stay beyond the range of de ragans AoE moves and still hit without interruption, and for De Ragnus I simply need to run back a little bit when I see him winding up.

I'm a total bullet lover though, so I'm biased. I've often thought of going fortegunner but I can't bear to part with all the super cool melee weapons protransers get.

[Hrith]

On 2007-10-02 14:23, panzer_unit wrote:
So Hrith you know so much... do grenades 16 times faster than you can wind up and hit with Jabroga?Well, no, I was just humouring you.
But I doubt Anga Jabroga has better DPS on dragons than grenades.


More importantly, you're doing about twice the damage PER AXE as you're dealing PER LAUNCHER. That's the worst of PT's problems even with their godawful stats right now... energy efficiency. Launcher's better at a lot of things... but when you need raw killpower, Jabroga is similar and better.I cannot see the 400 PP of an axe doing more damage than the 1200 PP of a grenade launcher.


Protranser ATA's no different from Fortefighter ATA, supposing they don't use Barada Maga to drop EVP... are you saying Anga Jabroga can't work for Fortefighter? I guess it's meant for all those axe-wielding Fighgunners then?AXE-WIELDING FIGHGUNNERS, REVOLT!

[SolomonGrundy]

I am playing a Male Human Protranser. in terms of ATA stat, he should not be too far off a female cast Fortefighter (24 ATA less at level 80).

Not the highest ATA, but not the lowest either. I'll have to study both PAs before I pick one.

EDIT: pokefiend, there is no laser demo in that link. It shows a beast female using the new fish-y twin claw art.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-10-02 15:40 ]</font>

[Hrith]

Yes, but in the video, you can see the player being put to sleep by the Rappy's Grants and not waking up when the rappies hit her.

[panzer_unit]

On 2007-10-02 14:57, Hrith wrote:

More importantly, you're doing about twice the damage PER AXE as you're dealing PER LAUNCHER. That's the worst of PT's problems even with their godawful stats right now... energy efficiency. Launcher's better at a lot of things... but when you need raw killpower, Jabroga is similar and better.I cannot see the 400 PP of an axe doing more damage than the 1200 PP of a grenade launcher.


Jabroga: 950/hit * 2 hits = 1900 damage (lv13 skill... estimated numbers for PT based on the 1100 I do as fF)
Grenade: 225/hit (lv30 skill... if I'm remembering properly, been a while since I was a PT)

... if going through the math for PA modifiers and half resistance and crap isn't proof, these are based on numbers from in-game. Jabroga's (lv13) doing like 6x more damage per PP spent than a grenade (lv30). Grenades only have like 3x the PP of axes.

EDIT: I do mean to try out Boma Duranga when we can finally swap skills in and out. It's got similar advantages, but costs health. I don't mind landing beside a monster that I've just sent rolling and having to jog back into position.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-10-03 06:43 ]</font>

[biggabertha]

The thunder element to both your Laser and your Shotgun are great choices for both solo play and team play. Even though I have all of the elemental bullets for Longbow, Shotgun and Handgun, I can safely say that getting thunder element for Longbow and the Handgun seem like a waste since you use them very sparingly but I suppose that's the whole point.

For the time being, I think you should just bite the bullet and use what you have at the moment and level those up. Come expansion time, unlearn some of them in favour of newer ones and try them out yourself. Asking for advice is awesome but only experience will teach you the quickest way.

P.S. Get all the PAs for your favourite weapon no matter how shoddy they are since it's your favourite weapon, you'll FIND a way to use those PAs!

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-03 10:08, biggabertha wrote:
The thunder element to both your Laser and your Shotgun are great choices for both solo play and team play. Even though I have all of the elemental bullets for Longbow, Shotgun and Handgun, I can safely say that getting thunder element for Longbow and the Handgun seem like a waste since you use them very sparingly but I suppose that's the whole point.

For the time being, I think you should just bite the bullet and use what you have at the moment and level those up. Come expansion time, unlearn some of them in favour of newer ones and try them out yourself. Asking for advice is awesome but only experience will teach you the quickest way.

P.S. Get all the PAs for your favourite weapon no matter how shoddy they are since it's your favourite weapon, you'll FIND a way to use those PAs!



I have every element on the bow for boss purposes. Only virus and fire are really *needed*

yeah, I basically picked saber as my favored melee weapon, and that' why I got all the PAs for it.

[panzer_unit]

... this is PSU, and worse yet we're talking about Protranser. Nothing is NECESSARY, there are so many ways to cover what you need for status attacks, damage output, etc.

Bow however is REALLY well suited to investing all 6 elements. There are bosses that make ALL of them worthwhile except for Fire... and the Burn SE is absurdly against almost all large monsters.

[SolomonGrundy]

Did you see that AFs can use traps? Including virus traps
I'm seriously considering switching the human to a AF, or at least doubling.

Trap use really changes the dimensions of AF...

[panzer_unit]

LOL Acrofighter... except for taking their Tornado Dance away, it would be the perfect class for all those Fighgunners who thought PSU weapon management was still too complicated and hard.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-10-03 13:51 ]</font>

[SolomonGrundy]

what's not to like about AF, now that it has traps?

great stats, decent weapon selection, including cards for ranged damage (and HP recovery, ftw. S rank shadoogs (hopefully the only class to get them), and s rank slicers.

slicers are gross.

[panzer_unit]

Cheesy stats balanced out by rudimentary weapon selection was the reason I didn't like Fighgunner... and it looks like the intent of AF is to do that class one better. With swords, double sabers, mechs, and crossbows Fighgunner is looking like some elite tactical wizard in comparison.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-03 14:21, panzer_unit wrote:
Cheesy stats balanced out by rudimentary weapon selection was the reason I didn't like Fighgunner... and it looks like the intent of AF is to do that class one better. With swords, double sabers, mechs, and crossbows Fighgunner is looking like some elite tactical wizard in comparison.



Figunner is the new Fortegunner. Welcome to PSU, where the classes are not created equal. Anyway, back on topic.

Does zubba stun strateria as it hits, so they cannot do thier cheesy spin-zalure move?



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-10-03 16:57 ]</font>

[panzer_unit]

Zubba might temporarily pause the Stateria only to have 'em spin immediately after when you're recovering. They've got a trick up their sleeve more or less no matter how you try and take 'em. You can eat a bunch of damage in melee, or take a bigger gamble versus their stun-inducing power waves at range.

As a PT I favor virus traps & dark bow, grenades (which do pin them some) to slow 'em down for other teammates and do some easy damage while the DOTs tick. They're big robot jerks and need to be treated with maximum disrespect.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-10-04 08:46 ]</font>

[SolomonGrundy]

by the way, I got Zubba last night, and lol'd at the beatings it gives sendelains. they don't pop-up with the hits, and zubba's wide front attack area is perfect for hitting 2 sendelains, and making them pay.

or as my new level 80 PM would say: "suffer!"

also, spinning strike increases in accuracy, making me glad I selected it over gravity break. PTs low ATP, and sabers low ATP requirements make this a match made in heaven

[panzer_unit]

I'll check Gravity Break tonight, maybe it's done something since lv10 came and went?

[TUSCAN]

y'know, I have a feeling that knuckles are going to be extremely good for PT come the expansion because of the PP regen from regular attacks and the timed attack system.

the regular attack is really fast if you focus on chaining the first hit over and over, which should basically allow you to always keep them full of PP. the timing system and it's critical hits make a good set of gudda gants the strongest knuckle availiable when paired with the rabol gant, which has great evasion, and we all know how good evasion becomes in AoI.

zubba will also become stronger so I think it's going to be a really useful PA longterm. I can't wait to try the new laser PA. protransers are going to become untouchable.

[SolomonGrundy]

I was pretty dissapointed that PTs only get level 30 melee, rather than level 40. They did get an ATP increase, but still have lower ATP than WTs (and no access to S/D/J/Z except with items).

[panzer_unit]

We're pretty much hax Fortegunners now, with much better melee instead of built-in bullet save. IMO that's awesome and there's nowhere on the character class map I'd rather be... especially with Lasers suddenly kicking so much ass.

The lv30 skills thing was kinda disappointing, but AOI wiping out problems with melee weapon PP regen and balancing out element%'s has me pumped anyway.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-04 13:33, panzer_unit wrote:
We're pretty much hax Fortegunners now, with much better melee instead of built-in bullet save. IMO that's awesome and there's nowhere on the character class map I'd rather be... especially with Lasers suddenly kicking so much ass.

The lv30 skills thing was kinda disappointing, but AOI wiping out problems with melee weapon PP regen and balancing out element%'s has me pumped anyway.



no crossbows, rifles, and lower ATP - but that an interesting observation. Interesting indeed.

[panzer_unit]

10% less base ATP right? It's 110% vs 120% I think ... and the difference in total ATP is going to be less than that when you add in the same units and weapons for each.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-04 13:58, panzer_unit wrote:
10% less base ATP right? It's 110% vs 120% I think ... and the difference in total ATP is going to be less than that when you add in the same units and weapons for each.


no no, it's a good observation...I had considered AF the opposite of ProTranser, and FiGunner the ForteGunner foil. Just a different way of looking at things.

[Hrith]

You do 225 damage per grenade hit? o_O

I do 550 with my Fortegunner and I have no power unit.

[SolomonGrundy]

uh - where do you see 225?

and: if this was me, it was probably the time I did the S2, two headed dragon with level 17 earth grenades.

[Hrith]

Well, I still do over 500 damage to Lv100 De Ragnus, but the ATP modifier of grenades at Lv17 is a lot lower than at 30, since you gain 2% ATP per level after Lv20.

[SStrikerR]

[quote]On 2007-10-01 13:21, SolomonGrundy wrote:
Here's what I have so far.

Melee:
Saber: all of them
Sword: Spinning break
Axe: planning on Durega
Spear: undecided, help! duas robado. since you dont have tornado break, you need this AoE PA

Knuckles: undecided, help! id say eiher the first PA or the ult one. zubba is crap.

Bullets:
Bow: all of them
Pistol: Maylee hit, Light, Fire
Shotgun: Virus, Ground, other? try ice, 5 shots right? 5 freezers.
Grenades: ice is pointless here, your goal is to knockback enemies and keep them pinned in a corner. id say ground or light.
Laser: depends on where you play most. cant help you here.

Considering:

Something for the knuckles:
Bogga Danga? Good for mobs, looks cool
Bogga Zubba? Accurate, good crowd control, expensive and slow
Dus Majarra? Dus Robado? I need some circular PAs, don't I?

I am open to suggestion for bullets: esp laser or additional grenade bullets.

I was also thinking of omitting spears altogether: I have 2 other charaters that use them (fF and WT). It's just that spears are unfairly good.

[panzer_unit]

On 2007-10-06 04:22, Hrith wrote:
You do 225 damage per grenade hit? o_O

I do 550 with my Fortegunner and I have no power unit.


Yeah. That's PT vs large monster (e.g. half bullet damage) ... that's like 90% of the time I'm firing grenades and pretty much why I picked up jabroga. The team loves the knockdown and the burning but it's not much for damage. Burn Grenades + rainbow of axes w/ jabroga makes life a lot easier for me when soloing large monsters.

De Ragan's a different story. Half melee damage makes grenades the obvious choice on the ground.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-10-09 07:46 ]</font>

[panzer_unit]

BTW Solomon... I finally got Gravity Break 21 last night.

I think there's a big ATP jump - my average damage on the first move popped from 1200 to 1400, and the last move does a max of 3x1 @ 1700hp with rides and the right sword. I thought they were all criticals until I popped 2500, 2500, 1700 on an attack and the level of ownage almost destroyed my mind.

That's all as PT w/ 24% gigush+10 by the way. I'll have to switch back to Fortefighter some time.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-15 10:37, panzer_unit wrote:
BTW Solomon... I finally got Gravity Break 21 last night.

I think there's a big ATP jump - my average damage on the first move popped from 1200 to 1400, and the last move does a max of 3x1 @ 1700hp with rides and the right sword. I thought they were all criticals until I popped 2500, 2500, 1700 on an attack and the level of ownage almost destroyed my mind.

That's all as PT w/ 24% gigush+10 by the way. I'll have to switch back to Fortefighter some time.



wow, that's some hard hitting! I'm a little put off by EX traps needing to stay on the palette, to be honest. I was getting more than a little excited by the prospect using an freeze EX trap, and unloading with PAs.

On topic: I've noticed that I'm going really heavy with pistols/sabers (3 on the palette). Did your PT go that route early on as well?

[panzer_unit]

Actually I left my handgun and saber skills to rot until I started leveling Fortegunner... like level 70+ ... and only had skills for handguns, shotguns, lasers and grenades to work with. Obviously my handguns started to see heavy use. Getting Frozen Hit to lv21 and seeing the results was one of those OMFG revelations, along the lines of realizing that Anga Durega would do the same damage as Anga Redda on full combos with more accuracy and first-hit knockdown.

My early PT career was all 2-handed weapons. I'd believed what I said about PT being (almost - fortetecher) the weakest possible class for using handgun and saber without any clue of just how damned powerful the 30/30 skill caps made it.

Now I've got all the elements except light into the mid-20's and (if I'm not on a mission to level something up) I usually have 2 handgun+saber combinations on my palette to cover useful statuses and proper enemy elements. Ideally, I'll fire a bunch of shock or freeze and tag-team that with rising strike for crowd control... then switch to burn + spinning strike and focus on killing individual targets as qiuckly as possible.

[SolomonGrundy]

huh. maybe I switched to early. the low equiping requirements of GRM sabers, and pistols make them great candidates for PTs underwhelming stats at PT1.