Any point to Fortetechers now?

[Kamica]

-Level 31 Attack Techs do not get increased SE
-There is not a huge difference in power between level 30 techs and level 40 techs
-Level 31 support is awesome
-Madoogs have the fastest casting time
-Acrotecher is a decent melee force
-Madoogs allow fast support for melee forces

Discuss.

[HFlowen]

Level 31+ techs look cool?

I'ono. Fortetech is the only class I never bothered with much.

[ljkkjlcm9]

is there any point to Fortegunners now?
-Level 31 bullets do not get increase SE
-Level 3+4 SE can be applied by other classes now
-Shadoogs shoot auto and apply SE
-PT gets S of the big ranged weapons
-Shadoog allows melee fighters to apply SE while attacking
-Level 31+ bullets do not get additional bullets(shotgun/Xbow)

see, your comparison can work for any class if you look enough
but this game, it's about teamwork

THE JACKEL

[PJ]

Uuuh

Still the most powerful in terms of technique damage?

I mean, it pretty much is the case for all the fortes.

[relentless]

On 2007-10-02 06:27, HFlowen wrote:
Level 31+ techs look cool?

Look better, more range and well.. I don't care as long as the spells actually DO get better stat-wise.


Well, I can't really judge right now. I need to test AT out myself and compare it to fT.
My originally plan for my main was: main fT / AT as side job
So uhh, can't say much to this. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Rashiid]

Forte = power power power. aka LOLBIGNUMBURZ

Any other - more flexible; usually the 'fun' classes.

[HFlowen]

Well, to be more serious than my previous post.

They still have rods and the element boost they can get and techs still gain 1% element per level as far as I know. Plus the better TP.

I have no clue how that holds up to faster casting time though. *Shrug.*

[Sychosis]

I've been saying it for a long time (my buddies online can attest to this http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif). I hope the JP players flock to AT and almost totally abandon FT. That way ST might just realize that FT needs the same support cap as AT to be desired for a party.

TECHNIC damage is too low in comparison to melee and SE damage to build a TECHNIC damage class off of.

[drizzle]

With their -25% PP cost, they're hands down the best class for buff levelling!

[Rashiid]

if fortetecher did get 31+ support; id be all over it.

but since it doesnt (im a buff/resta man-whore) then im goin acrotech

[CelestialBlade]

Fortetechers still get the highest TP mod. It's like saying Fighgunner is better than Fortefighter because of its weapon variety, or that Guntecher is better than Fortegunner for the same reason. Forte-classes indeed lose out on variety, but they have the stats where it matters. Not to mention they also come with exclusive S-ranks, don't get me started on Acro-class weapon selection.

[PJ]

On 2007-10-02 06:42, Typheros wrote:
don't get me started on Acro-class weapon selection.



PLEASE do. I don't think anyone even THINKS about it >_>

[Rashiid]

got a beef w/ mah whip; yo?

[Indica]

Fortetechers use rods, no need to say any more

[Eleina]

Want damage in a party err get a fighter xD
Want Support well AT is better support.. or GT has the same lvl as fT (with added traps and easy SE weapons) he he he

fT will be just good for blinding ppl and overloading graphics cards with lvl 31+techs lolz
fG will be kinda useless as well compared to fgihgunner xD (a fighgunners zagenga > a fG's, fighgunner can trap as well, and can spam just attack with lvl 40 skills instead of 20)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Eleina on 2007-10-02 07:49 ]</font>

[Parn]

I don't see the problem, to be honest. I mean, FOmars had the strongest shifta/deband in PSO, but we didn't go "FUCK, WE GOT A FONEWEARL IN THE PARTY I WANTED A FOMAR". Acrotecher or Fortetecher, you still can buff the party and it's great because any support techs are better than no techs. The game has been made much easier anyways.

Just relax and play!

[Sychosis]

On 2007-10-02 07:36, Indica wrote:
Fortetechers use rods, no need to say any more



Except that wands have already been proven to do more damage over time than rods when using Basic, Ra, and Gi TECHNICs.

The only thing a rod has over a wand are Dam (requires the already fragile techer to be in melee range), Nos, Megiverse, and Regrant TECHNICS.

Wands are better for dealing damage with 14 of the 23 attack TECHNICs. And better for casting ALL of the available support TECHNICs since aside from resta, they all ignore TP.

And Parn, IIRC FOmars didn't have better support, just a wider range. If a wider range was all level 40 buffs/debuffs had over level 30 support, there wouldn't be a problem.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sychosis on 2007-10-02 08:01 ]</font>

[beatrixkiddo]

On 2007-10-02 07:49, Parn wrote:
I don't see the problem, to be honest. I mean, FOmars had the strongest shifta/deband in PSO, but we didn't go "FUCK, WE GOT A FONEWEARL IN THE PARTY I WANTED A FOMAR". Acrotecher or Fortetecher, you still can buff the party and it's great because any support techs are better than no techs. The game has been made much easier anyways.

Just relax and play!



Er, shifta was the same for all classes, it just depended on Tech Level. The only difference among the classes was RANGE, which was boosted for a few classes.

[Lyrise]

Some lv31 techs have SE boosts. Also, you're failing to account that while the techs themselves have the crummiest powerboost on paper (31-40 in total is 10%), in reality its a lot higher than that, since you are also getting a better range on those techs. (You need to account for the 200 TP difference between both classes as well)

More to the point, this is basically a retelling of Fortefighter vs. Fighgunner. It's all about playstyle; not necessarily "omg FT is no longer the strongest teching class overall, must switch to AT" (I really pity anyone whose thought process is exactly that). AT in a sense represents support best. You help everyone with support techs, yet maintaining offensive ability enough to spread damage around. enough to kill, but not enough to output supreme levels of damage.

Both classes have different functions in mind, and IMO, the field will level out even further when the PA caps get upped to 50 (not saying this will happen soon, but it will most likely happen, all the attack data and color data is there, why not use it?)

[Rashiid]

fortetechers STILL have highest TP
fortetechers got a free 25% off technics (trust me; that DOES make a huge difference)
fortetecher's resta will still probably heal more; just not as wide.
Fortetecher w/ a wand/Madoog will be deadly.

[McLaughlin]

Since no one else seems to have jumped on it...

Forces aren't supposed to melee. That's a moot comparison point. Either one of them is fucked in any situation involving fisticuffs.

No, Whips are not damage dealing weapons.

[Dj_SkyEpic]

I'm building a second main (fF) against my fT to deal damage in 1up Cup.

I just got to say... Majarra is hawt.

[Deragonite]

question about techniques:

seeing as how almost all melee is getting a significant damage boost, and elemental %'s on weapons only affecting the additional ATP that weapon adds, will Techniques be the same?

Will Elemental damage from techniques change to only multiplying the weapon's TP? or still stay the same and multiply your total tp?

[Umberger]

On 2007-10-02 08:18, Lyrise wrote:

Both classes have different functions in mind, and IMO, the field will level out even further when the PA caps get upped to 50 (not saying this will happen soon, but it will most likely happen, all the attack data and color data is there, why not use it?)



I was going to say that...especially if they give Fortetecher 40 Support TECHs at that point. Also, I don't think you mentioned that the 31-40 gives you another 10% element too (not sure how big a deal that is over on the JP servers after that recent patch). Plus, we don't know how a level 200/20 Fortetecher is going to end up looking (in terms of TP) compared to a 200/20 Acrotecher.

Then there's all those 13*+ weapons to factor in at some point. Yeah, there's going to be quite a few people who switch from FT to AT...but FT is by no means "screwed" or "worthless" in my opinion.

[SolomonGrundy]

Fortetechers get pp redcution, exclusive access to Rods (and I don't care what anyone says, rods have significant advantage over wands), and exclusive access to level 31+ techs. I belive they also have highest in game TP, and MST.

Compare to fortefighters: 2 other jobs have level 40 melee PAs. Fortefighter's backup weaponry is a pistol, and only level 20 at that. Fortetechers get 2 impressive, accurate, and elemental weapons - bow and card.

Comments have already been made regarding fortegunner.

That being said...I think ALL the forte-types are losing ground to hybrids in the expansion.

[OldCoot]

It is all about the look. Those level 31 techs look cool. I wonder if I will need sunglasses for this game soon.

[Pillan]

I thought the point of the forte-classes was always doing “unparalleled” damage with its weapon selection. fG has enough ATP to do more damage than GT with all of its gun S ranks, fF has enough ATP to do more damage than FG with its S ranks, and fT has enough TP (on top of the extra 10~20% modifier) to do more damage than AT with its S rank. And this is in addition to their other attributes (significantly more ATA and HP on fG, more HP and DFP on fF, more MST on fT, and lower costing PAs).

The only class that really took a relative nerf was fT, but that was Sonic Team’s mistake in the first place. Can anyone here name an online game where the black mage was also a better white mage than every other class? (PSO doesn’t count…)

Of course I have to agree that applying Just Attack/Timed Attack to skills was a very bad idea since it throws melee damage to 1.5 times the damage of everything else in even the worst case scenarios. My bet is they’ll either add a ranged/tech version of the system or just buff the PA mods on all bullets/techs to take JA into account.

But, if it really bothers you that much, just play Beast and Cast fF, FG, or AT since those are the only classes you need at this point.

[-Ryuki-]

Asking if there's a point to ForteTechers, is the same thing being asked to ForteFighters and ForteGunners. With the hybrid classes getting upped in versatility and power, are the Forte classes not so Forte? That's the question you should be asking, instead.

[SolomonGrundy]

The only class that really took a relative nerf was fT, but that was Sonic Team’s mistake in the first place. Can anyone here name an online game where the black mage was also a better white mage than every other class? (PSO doesn’t count…)

So, Wts not getting level 20 support was not a nerf?

Also, why is no one focusing on the range advantages of 31+ techs and only focusing on the damage?

[Rashiid]

On 2007-10-02 09:17, Obsidian_Knight wrote:
No, Whips are not damage dealing weapons.


did you see the vid i posted in the aoti screenshot thread?

that whip was ripping enemies apart.
about 500s; and an entire whip combo has A LOT of hits.

add those up....

[-Ryuki-]

He might've been sarcastic, Rashiid.

[Reipard]

So, Wts not getting level 20 support was not a nerf?

It's not a nerf if they never had it to begin with. 'Nerf' implies that something they had was taken away.

I'm with Parn on this one, overall. I don't see the big deal. If you like your class, just be one and use what you have. As long as you're having fun, who cares?

[Pillan]

On 2007-10-02 12:32, SolomonGrundy wrote:
So, Wts not getting level 20 support was not a nerf?


We were discussing the fortes, so I wasn't thinking about them at the time. But, sure, they dropped from second strongest to weakest.


On 2007-10-02 12:32, SolomonGrundy wrote:
Also, why is no one focusing on the range advantages of 31+ techs and only focusing on the damage?


Well, if the damage is more than enough to compensate for the lack of support, why would you mention the range? That's just an extra glaze on an already oversized cake.

But, yes, more damage, more range, a bigger animation, and, in the case of barta, zonde, dambarta, and damdiga, a higher effect level.

[panzer_unit]

lv40 dam-techs should have awesome reach, and co-incidentally got SE boosts and work best on rods... things that make you go hmm.

[-Ryuki-]

There aren't SE boosts. SE5 does not exist.

[desturel]

On 2007-10-02 14:05, RyukiZero wrote:
There aren't SE boosts. SE5 does not exist.


http://psu.fei-yen.jp/wiki/html/DB2FA5D5A5A9A5C8A5F3A5A2A1BCA5C42FA5C6A5AFA5CBA5C3 A5AF.html

Barta level 31 goes from SE1 to SE2
Zonde level 31 goes from SE1 to SE2
Dambarta level 31 goes from SE3 to SE4
Damdiga level 31 goes from SE3 to SE4
Dammegid level 31 goes from SE2 to SE3

I think megid should have received an SE 4 boost as well, but the cut in PP to cast is nice.

[Zorafim]

If a class goes from the second best buffer to the fourth best, one could consider that a nerf.

[-Ryuki-]

I meant there's no boost from SE4 to SE5. SE5 doesn't exist.

[Vickie]

se5 does exist we just cant use it yet i'm gueesing. Vanda Merhas have lvl 5 burn



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Vickie on 2007-10-02 15:45 ]</font>

[pikachief]

enemies and NPCs can get whatever they want >.>

[Arika]

-There is not a huge difference in power between level 30 techs and level 40 techs

>>> OH!, so there is no the 10% hidden elemental mod add on lv 30-40?

fT will be just good for blinding ppl and overloading graphics cards with lvl 31+techs lolz
fG will be kinda useless as well compared to fgihgunner xD (a fighgunners zagenga > a fG's, fighgunner can trap as well, and can spam just attack with lvl 40 skills instead of 20)
>>> not really, at least virus trap will work good, and who know what is the damage modifly for zagenga lv 40 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

note .... now both eleina and seleina was left out by Heleina http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Arika on 2007-10-02 15:48 ]</font>

[pikachief]

my shotty PWNS! T_T

*remembers protransers*

MY CROSSBOW IS STILL AWESOME!

*remembers fihggunners crossbows*

well at least i still have S rank rifles T_T

*remembers guntechers S rank bows*

ummmmm at least we get shadoogs? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

*remembers taht shadoogs run on TP*

;_;

[-Ryuki-]

Allow me to rephrase, once again.

WE well never get SE5.

[Pillan]

On 2007-10-02 15:46, Arika wrote:
and who know what is the damage modifly for zagenga lv 40 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


Zaganga just gains 10% ATA from 31-40. FG will actually do more damage per hit with it, but not much, and fG will always have more than enough accuracy (coupled with a larger multiplier) to make up for the small difference.

[Vickie]

On 2007-10-02 15:49, RyukiZero wrote:
Allow me to rephrase, once again.

WE well never get SE5.



how do you figure you work for sega?

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-02 15:58, Vickie wrote:

On 2007-10-02 15:49, RyukiZero wrote:
Allow me to rephrase, once again.

WE well never get SE5.



how do you figure you work for sega?





lol vickie's gonna keep defending this till sega themselves says no SE lvl 5 >.>

even if we get lvl 50 bullets http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

[SolomonGrundy]

It's not a nerf if they never had it to begin with. 'Nerf' implies that something they had was taken away.

and what do FTs 'lose?' are they getting lower level techs, bullets or skills?

Or were you saying that FTs lose out on being #1 at support?
because WTs were second best at support. Now they are the worst.

[PALRAPPYS]

Fortetecher:
S Rods
S Wands
S bows
S cards
Long-range Bow
Lv40 Attack Tech
Lv30 Support Tech
Lv30 Range
Lv10 Melee
25% PP Reduction on Techs
Higher TP & MST

Acrotecher:
S Whips
S Sabers
S Dagger
S Cards
S Pistol
S Wands
S Madoogs
No Long-range
Lv30 Attack Tech
Lv40 Support Tech
Lv20 Range
Lv20 Melee
Auto Me/Quick
Higher HP, ATP, DFP, ATA, and EVP

[-Ryuki-]

If anything, I'd go Whip and Madoog, then Wand and Madoog, with Twin Penetrating Dualies.

[Remedy]

How do you figure that ATs get an innate Me/Quick?

And yeah, rods are really the only thing keeping me as a Fortecher. Gotta have my Psycho Wand, it's tradition. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-02 16:59, Remedy wrote:
How do you figure that ATs get an innate Me/Quick?

And yeah, rods are really the only thing keeping me as a Fortecher. Gotta have my Psycho Wand, it's tradition. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



yup and i'd rather go with the wand/madoog combo!

more PP, quicker, and still has 4 slots http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[PALRAPPYS]

On 2007-10-02 16:59, Remedy wrote:
How do you figure that ATs get an innate Me/Quick?



They do get it. O_o

[Rashiid]

and im keeping my Me / Quick.

jesus im gonna be resta-ing at god-speeds!!

bwhahah just call me 'Healdii'

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-02 17:03, PALRAPPYS wrote:
They do get it. O_oFirst I've heard of it. =o.O=

Figures. Sega hates tech-oriented forces still, I guess. Don't know why I expect anything different - it's been that way since PSO DC v2. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-02 17:07, Rashiid wrote:
and im keeping my Me / Quick.

jesus im gonna be resta-ing at god-speeds!!

bwhahah just call me 'Healdii'



Im not calling u healdii until u get a har/quick http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Rashiid]

AT + Me / Quick + Madoog = i honestly dont think i can go any faster http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Vickie]

On 2007-10-02 16:01, pikachief wrote:

On 2007-10-02 15:58, Vickie wrote:

On 2007-10-02 15:49, RyukiZero wrote:
Allow me to rephrase, once again.

WE well never get SE5.



how do you figure you work for sega?





lol vickie's gonna keep defending this till sega themselves says no SE lvl 5 >.>

even if we get lvl 50 bullets http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif



i'm just sayin ppl always talkin' like they know what's comin out when they don't know shit, Sega prolly dont even know what the fuck is comin out. Like the famitsu ppl like "Well never get famitsu" and we are.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-02 17:18, Vickie wrote:

On 2007-10-02 16:01, pikachief wrote:

On 2007-10-02 15:58, Vickie wrote:

On 2007-10-02 15:49, RyukiZero wrote:
Allow me to rephrase, once again.

WE well never get SE5.



how do you figure you work for sega?





lol vickie's gonna keep defending this till sega themselves says no SE lvl 5 >.>

even if we get lvl 50 bullets http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif



i'm just sayin ppl always talkin' like they know what's comin out when they don't know shit, Sega prolly dont even know what the fuck is comin out. Like the famitsu ppl like "Well never get famitsu" and we are.



sega said we are getting all teh content the JP are getting so i never doubted the famistu...

lvl 5 SE i do doubt though http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

soryy :/

[Vickie]

it's cool i don't care if we do or don't, we don't need em anyway just sayin people on here need to stop Confirming shit that they don't get from the horses mouth.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Vickie on 2007-10-02 17:24 ]</font>

[ThEoRy]

You are asking if there is any point to my entire existence?

Is there any point to yours? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Kamica]

On 2007-10-02 09:17, Obsidian_Knight wrote:
Since no one else seems to have jumped on it...

Forces aren't supposed to melee. That's a moot comparison point. Either one of them is fucked in any situation involving fisticuffs.

No, Whips are not damage dealing weapons.



How often do you see a foie do 1977 damage? That's the amount that I did with a Just Attacked Crimson as an Acrotecher. Melee forces are so in.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kamica on 2007-10-02 19:31 ]</font>

[Arika]

Hey Kamica, fT hidden elemental mod still rise from lv 31-40 ?

[Miyoko]

On 2007-10-02 07:43, Eleina wrote:

fG will be kinda useless as well compared to fgihgunner xD (a fighgunners zagenga > a fG's, fighgunner can trap as well, and can spam just attack with lvl 40 skills instead of 20)



Because fG's only use Yak Zagenga, misses / ATA are never taken into considering, and the same traps Fighgunners use...

Ooookay then.

[Kietrinia]

*hugs her staff* You can't make me give it up! Never ever ever! *shakes head furiously*

[Eleina]

On 2007-10-02 15:46, Arika wrote:
>>> not really, at least virus trap will work good, and who know what is the damage modifly for zagenga lv 40 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


Burn > Virus arika chan :3
As for zagenga 40...well it has the same atp mod as zagenga 30 xD
fG will do 50 extra damage with elemental xbows than FG and 100 more than GT..he he he


On 2007-10-02 19:46, Miyoko wrote:

Because fG's only use Yak Zagenga, misses / ATA are never taken into considering, and the same traps Fighgunners use...

Ooookay then.



Well for damage FG will be better than fG (melee + just attack)
FG can now spread SE easy with lvl 30 xbows (this wasn't really possible with lvl20 ones)
FG is only really lacking virus traps but with monster sta nerf virus SE 3 will stick to large mobs as well
As for ata it doesn't really bother ppl that much anyhow...how many ppl use SPS on beasts?

fG will conserve the advantage on ragan type bosses with that lovely boma duranga <3

I'm not bashing on the fG class lol it just seems that they are gonna lose alot of their current overpowered state v_v which makes me cry



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Eleina on 2007-10-02 23:40 ]</font>

[blargh4242]

WHOOPS WRONG WINDOW

Yeah, no. NOT banned

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: blargh4242 on 2007-10-03 00:33 ]</font>

[ashley50]

wow anotehr one?

wait...this is the old one lol

[pikachief]

that should be an insta-ban ;_;

[ShinAnt]

Why hello again. Good thing. I need to save the rest of this.
inb4ilikewherethisthreadisgoing>.>

[Mayu]

~COVERS PIKA'S EYES!!!!

[Jakosifer]

The hell? XD

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-02 23:47, Mayu wrote:
~COVERS PIKA'S EYES!!!!



mommy how come i dont have the thing that purty lady has? O.o

lol jk that was SICK http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

[Sasamichan]

Hope no one is at work.

[Para]

in b4 lock but seriously.. deleting a post will work unless people start quoting it -_-

[Eleina]

x_x

[beatrixkiddo]

The mods don't seem to be~

[Eleina]

On 2007-10-02 23:56, Para wrote:
in b4 lock but seriously.. deleting a post will work unless people start quoting it -_-



they should ban the guy first or he can copy/paste ie into others topics x_x

[Eleina]

On 2007-10-02 23:56, beatrixkiddo wrote:
The mods don't seem to be~



"Must save it b4 i delete it..." jk xD

[ShinAnt]

Liar. HANDS WHERE I CAN SEE THEM! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Eleina]

Lolol no active mods xD ha haha

[Midicronica]

whoooooooa, buddy! WHAT IN THE FUCK! I was totally not expecting that! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

Have fun with your ban, dawg! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

[Retehi]

Wonder how many weaboos people r-clicked those.

[Freshellent]

On 2007-10-03 00:18, Retehi wrote:
Wonder how many weaboos people r-clicked those.



Sadly,I thought the same thing.

[Xaeris]

So...B7 then.

[PMB960]

NUUUUUUU ITS GONE!!!!! I WAS ONLY HALF WAY DONE! HALF WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Eleina]

On 2007-10-02 23:40, blargh4242 wrote:
WHOOPS WRONG WINDOW

Yeah, no. NOT banned

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: blargh4242 on 2007-10-03 00:33 ]</font>


Although cunning someone will report you xD

[Shadow_Wing]

On 2007-10-02 23:42, ashley50 wrote:
wow anotehr one?

wait...this is the old one lol



When I saw that.... I thought the same thing... Dammit pre, why must he send me Dojins lol

[Sasamichan]

On 2007-10-02 23:40, blargh4242 wrote:
WHOOPS WRONG WINDOW

Yeah, no. NOT banned

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: blargh4242 on 2007-10-03 00:33 ]</font>



Just be glad no mods were on.

[blargh4242]

feel free to PM me and I will send you a copy of it http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Sasamichan]

On 2007-10-03 00:47, blargh4242 wrote:
feel free to PM me and I will send you a copy of it http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif



I PMed you.

[Arika]

On 2007-10-02 23:31, Eleina wrote:

On 2007-10-02 15:46, Arika wrote:
>>> not really, at least virus trap will work good, and who know what is the damage modifly for zagenga lv 40 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


Burn > Virus arika chan :3
As for zagenga 40...well it has the same atp mod as zagenga 30 xD
fG will do 50 extra damage with elemental xbows than FG and 100 more than GT..he he he


On 2007-10-02 19:46, Miyoko wrote:

Because fG's only use Yak Zagenga, misses / ATA are never taken into considering, and the same traps Fighgunners use...

Ooookay then.



Well for damage FG will be better than fG (melee + just attack)
FG can now spread SE easy with lvl 30 xbows (this wasn't really possible with lvl20 ones)
FG is only really lacking virus traps but with monster sta nerf virus SE 3 will stick to large mobs as well
As for ata it doesn't really bother ppl that much anyhow...how many ppl use SPS on beasts?

fG will conserve the advantage on ragan type bosses with that lovely boma duranga <3

I'm not bashing on the fG class lol it just seems that they are gonna lose alot of their current overpowered state v_v which makes me cry



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Eleina on 2007-10-02 23:40 ]</font>


oh, so zagenga lv 40 atp mod is reveal? didnt care to see fG info , but yes burn trap > virus and then what? u forget about time that u alway solo with seleina? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif ( u use virus when burn is not enough)

[Eleina]

On 2007-10-03 00:59, Arika wrote:
oh, so zagenga lv 40 atp mod is reveal? didnt care to see fG info , but yes burn trap > virus and then what? u forget about time that u alway solo with seleina? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif ( u use virus when burn is not enough)



I rarely use more than 5 traps http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif
As for little Seleina just check my sig and you'll see that she is prepared to go FG http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Arika]

fG is deserve too be nerfed yay, cuz they try to mock me to make alt so much http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif
(good, I didnt make alt fG back then, and I have starex account to borrow)
my next alt is beast.... male or female ? <_<

[Remius]

Wait what the hell

[imfanboy]

On 2007-10-03 01:08, Arika wrote:
fG is deserve too be nerfed yay, cuz they try to mock me to make alt so much http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif
(good, I didnt make alt fG back then, and I have starex account to borrow)
my next alt is beast.... male or female ? <_<



Female beasts are cuter - Champagne is cuter than even Arika.

You should know that.

But I need to redo my siggy - that outfit is so ugly on her.


Aaaanywaaay.... Fortetechers are overrated anyway. It's funny, Cherry and I were actually TALKING about this not two days ago. I wonder if he'll give up his epeen Psycho Wand and go to Acrotecher for the power boost? :mrgreen:

[BigBadWolf]

Fortetecher + Me /Quick + Rod = better than all

The only weapon that could have benefitted from Acrotecher's speedboost is the rod, and since they can't use rods. Acrotecher is dead to me.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: BigBadWolf on 2007-10-03 04:57 ]</font>

[Zael]

lol rods are only good for dam and nos attack techs.

For everything else, wands are better.

[Vickie]

Fortegunner is not nerfed, well if your a good fortegunner that is.

I am glad that they are shitting on us fortegunners because now there will be less fortegunners running around.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Vickie on 2007-10-03 07:37 ]</font>

[Genoa]

I feel the same way about Fortetecher. Fortetecher post-aoi is going to change the way we thought of "force" since PSO
PSO, Forces all alike could support (though FOnewm wasn't exactly the greatest due to his lack of support range techs... still)
NOW it seems Fortetecher will be pretty good at support, but will be using more... Attack techs due it that being it's TRUE FORTE anymore.

We'll have to think of Fortetechers as a class who CAN support very well, but are primarily attackers just like any other class.

Personally, I prefer support over attack (when it comes to techs). As for non-tech, I like ranged weapons.
Therefore, Guntecher post-aoi is going to be great http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif. The same support techs as Fortetecher (lvl.30) while having lvl.40 Bullets just like a Fortegunner.

[Vickie]

yup save the forte classes for those who really like one particular style of play. f a whip or throwing blade ill take a rifle and laser cannon any day, besides who knows what forte only gear will come out.

-oh yea lets not forget about them shotty guns
-as for melee its not like i can't Bash your head in with a gun.lol





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Vickie on 2007-10-03 08:40 ]</font>

[Rashiid]

damn ii missed something http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

[Neith]

On 2007-10-03 05:38, Zael wrote:
lol rods are only good for dam and nos attack techs.

For everything else, wands are better.



I only use a wand for Resta and Reverser. Everything else I use Rods for. Even with just a Me / Quick, the speed is fast enough for me. That, and I prefer the PP sink rods have. I've always found wands to burn out too fast.

[Sychosis]

On 2007-10-03 09:22, UrikoBB3 wrote:

On 2007-10-03 05:38, Zael wrote:
lol rods are only good for dam and nos attack techs.

For everything else, wands are better.



I only use a wand for Resta and Reverser. Everything else I use Rods for. Even with just a Me / Quick, the speed is fast enough for me. That, and I prefer the PP sink rods have. I've always found wands to burn out too fast.



PP won't be an issue with madoogs. A wand/madoog combo will have more PP and regen PP faster than a rod.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-03 08:29, Vickie wrote:
yup save the forte classes for those who really like one particular style of play. f a whip or throwing blade ill take a rifle and laser cannon any day, besides who knows what forte only gear will come out.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Vickie on 2007-10-03 08:40 ]</font>


funny those are the only 2 guns i dont like....

no wait i like laser cannons, just not rifles http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif Rifles are SE-ers, nothing more.

if forte classes gain alot on their class levels and stay much stronger than the mixed then im stay fortegunner. If not im going to protranser http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Cz]

On 2007-10-03 09:58, pikachief wrote:
Rifles are SE-ers, nothing more.



but i use my ice rifle (phantom) + phantom line on Onma and it scares him away. I hardly use rifles to SE as much unless it is those Tenghoh. Rifle can do some massive damage to a single target.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-03 09:27, Sychosis wrote:
PP won't be an issue with madoogs. A wand/madoog combo will have more PP and regen PP faster than a rod.And do less damage per spell (and possibly overall - I'd have to do a lot of math) than a Rod. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[Reipard]

but i use my ice rifle (phantom) + phantom line on Onma and it scares him away. I hardly use rifles to SE as much unless it is those Tenghoh. Rifle can do some massive damage to a single target.

Indeed. People tend to underestimate the sheer power of a rifle shot.
A level 16 Elemental advantage tends to pump my damage to 3-400 a shot. And I'm a freaking Guntecher.

The status effects are just the icing on the cake~. But man do they need to level faster.

[Sychosis]

On 2007-10-03 10:30, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-03 09:27, Sychosis wrote:
PP won't be an issue with madoogs. A wand/madoog combo will have more PP and regen PP faster than a rod.And do less damage per spell (and possibly overall - I'd have to do a lot of math) than a Rod. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



Except that rods only outperform wands when using Dam, Nos, Megiverse, and Regrant TECHNICs. Every other TECHNIC has been proven to do more overall damage when cast from a comparable wand.

[SolomonGrundy]

Except that rods only outperform wands when using Dam, Nos, Megiverse, and Regrant TECHNICs. Every other TECHNIC has been proven to do more overall damage when cast from a comparable wand.

a. that's 1/3 of the techs in the game
b. some of those techs are the best in the game (megiverse, dambarta, nosdiga, etc).
c. if you want to cast faster with wands, you still have access to S ranks, AND the highest TP in the game.

[Umberger]

On 2007-10-03 11:51, SolomonGrundy wrote:

Except that rods only outperform wands when using Dam, Nos, Megiverse, and Regrant TECHNICs. Every other TECHNIC has been proven to do more overall damage when cast from a comparable wand.

a. that's 1/3 of the techs in the game
b. some of those techs are the best in the game (megiverse, dambarta, nosdiga, etc).
c. if you want to cast faster with wands, you still have access to S ranks, AND the highest TP in the game.



Not to mention that enemies last like what, 10 seconds in a full party? Seriously, the whole DPS crap is so pointless...just use whatever you like to use.

[PJ]

I prefer the look of rods over wands. Infact, the only wand I'll use is Tenora, so thankfully I got the 6* one to +8(From a certain Snickerman http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif)

I bet the wand/madoog combo will be an obsolete ghetto rod combo once high rank s-rank rods and wands come out.

[Umberger]

On 2007-10-03 12:27, PJ wrote:
I prefer the look of rods over wands. Infact, the only wand I'll use is Tenora, so thankfully I got the 6* one to +8(From a certain Snickerman http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif)

I bet the wand/madoog combo will be an obsolete ghetto rod combo once high rank s-rank rods and wands come out.



Psycho Wand with no grinds still has 286 more TP than the 9* GRM Wand (Sheldorte) grinded to 10. Granted the Psycho Wand is leaps and bounds above even the Okarod, and that the Sheldorte+10 is 1 TP shy of the Halarod...oh well. Point is, this game isn't that intense of an RPG where you need to worry about DPS...things will die quick enough. No one's going to notice/care that you got off two casts of Diga on that Volfu with a Rod, when you could have got three with a Wand/Madoog and killed it maybe 1 second faster.

[Dragwind]

This is a stupid argument...every class plays different, and they're all fun. Just play what you want, they all throw in good damage when you know how to use them right.

Why worry about such trifles? No class is going to be useless. Relax. There's no "class war" going on here. If you think there is, you're imagining it, or arguing with little kids.

[Cz]

all classes are good in the hand of a good player. That is all. End of topic. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[relentless]

On 2007-10-03 13:39, BunnyGirl wrote:
all classes are good in the hand of a good player. That is all. End of topic. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif


You and Drag just made my day.
All classes ftw!

[SolomonGrundy]

That's NOT true. Currently there are not a lot of reasons to play guntecher, and as a result, few do. Same too for ProTranser.

I feel it's vaid to be concerned that the job you treasure is still worthwhile - that thre are not other jobs which completely eclipse it. But we are not there yet with FTs, IMO.

[Reipard]

That's NOT true. Currently there are not a lot of reasons to play guntecher, and as a result, few do. Same too for ProTranser.

Sure there are. Being a Guntecher is like being a Fortegunner with support techs. My techs have saved me a lot of meseta and pulled a party out of the mud many times. Just because it's level 10 doesn't mean it's absolutely worthless.

Protransers are amazing too. Everyone looks at the stats and goes ~_~ but don't realize that a Protranser can help a party clear an area so much more quickly than they could without it. The traps and heavy weaponry really do help a lot.

[Aries2384]

Protransers are amazing in parties (good ones anyway.. we all know the bad ones) and I have known a few who have really impressed me with what they bring to the party. Gunners bring alot to the party too. Ultimately though, the jobs for each class should fall in each class (the forte's) they are the most heavily beefed and heavily supported in their own classes and will excel over the hybrids in terms of damage and efficiency. (and anyone foolish enough to say that "we dont need techers, we have fighters" is a fool. Seriously, my techer outdamages 99% of the "fighters" out there, and the one I didnt outdamage was toting 50%'s. Yeah thats expensive) Every class plays a vital roll. You can have good players and bad players. And lately on the xbox360 there have been a ton of really bad techers... so I can see why a guntecher could save a party every once in awhile. Or maybe if they're throwing out debuffs. Hey thats fine I guess, but my techer is a damage dealing/ buff throwin/ resta whorin/ debuff flinging - crazy person. The feeling changes from player to player. Like I said, there are good ones and bad ones.
"Any point to Fortetechers now?" Pfft. Ignorance. You sir. Are too confident. How many of you (who don't have techers) pay attention to the damage a techer does? How many people would wade into a crowd of enemies in the harder S2's if they didn't think the Techer would be there to throw a resta or two. How many nanoblasted power beasts would there be? How many gunners would whine about spending meseta on agtaride and zodiaride because there is no techer? Not many and way too many are the answers my friends. THe point is. Character classes compliment each other and saying one is useless is like cutting off your own arm or leg. Useless yet? Pretty much. No hybrid class can beat a Forte class in its speciality. They may be funner or have access to more weapons but I say again NO hybrid class can ever beat a Forte-whatever in its speciality. Point-Set-Match. Thank you.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Aries2384 on 2007-10-03 16:59 ]</font>

[AerisZeal]

On 2007-10-03 11:54, Umberger wrote:

Not to mention that enemies last like what, 10 seconds in a full party? Seriously, the whole DPS crap is so pointless...just use whatever you like to use.



QFT
Finally, someone said it.. so true.

[Sasamichan]

On 2007-10-03 16:57, Aries2384 wrote:
Protransers are amazing in parties (good ones anyway.. we all know the bad ones) and I have known a few who have really impressed me with what they bring to the party. Gunners bring alot to the party too. Ultimately though, the jobs for each class should fall in each class (the forte's) they are the most heavily beefed and heavily supported in their own classes and will excel over the hybrids in terms of damage and efficiency. (and anyone foolish enough to say that "we dont need techers, we have fighters" is a fool. Seriously, my techer outdamages 99% of the "fighters" out there, and the one I didnt outdamage was toting 50%'s. Yeah thats expensive) Every class plays a vital roll. You can have good players and bad players. And lately on the xbox360 there have been a ton of really bad techers... so I can see why a guntecher could save a party every once in awhile. Or maybe if they're throwing out debuffs. Hey thats fine I guess, but my techer is a damage dealing/ buff throwin/ resta whorin/ debuff flinging - crazy person. The feeling changes from player to player. Like I said, there are good ones and bad ones.
"Any point to Fortetechers now?" Pfft. Ignorance. You sir. Are too confident. How many of you (who don't have techers) pay attention to the damage a techer does? How many people would wade into a crowd of enemies in the harder S2's if they didn't think the Techer would be there to throw a resta or two. How many nanoblasted power beasts would there be? How many gunners would whine about spending meseta on agtaride and zodiaride because there is no techer? Not many and way too many are the answers my friends. THe point is. Character classes compliment each other and saying one is useless is like cutting off your own arm or leg. Useless yet? Pretty much. No hybrid class can beat a Forte class in its speciality. They may be funner or have access to more weapons but I say again NO hybrid class can ever beat a Forte-whatever in its speciality. Point-Set-Match. Thank you.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Aries2384 on 2007-10-03 16:59 ]</font>


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v134/zane19/anything%20else/walltext.jpg

[Rashiid]

xD xD xD

why are ppl comparing damage from fortetechers and acrotechers?

heller? 'FORTE!'

Acro is support d00ds; mixxed w/ 'ok-good' spells; and decent melee and bullets - more of a transer then protraners.

Fortetecher - nothing BUT spellage.

[Chaobo99]

fotes do get madoogs..and..whips too ;/..and they are just plain better as far as teching goes..AT are hybrid fighters

[pso123hrf]

I'm waiting for someone to use the term everyone hates:

noob (i'm not calling anyone a noob, don't flare me >.>)

Did anyone 'prove' that they were better than someone else over a game yet? if so lemme know O:

[Spellbinder]

This topic is still alive? *kills topic*

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-03 18:04, Rashiid wrote:
Fortetecher - nothing BUT spellage.Were that true, we'd get level 40 support techs. We don't. Sega is returning us to the PSO days where melee Forces trump tech-based Forces. It ticks me off. Again, my attachment to the Psycho Wand is the only thing keeping me as a FT, and even then, it hurts to do so, since I'll get out-done at my main job (support) by another class.

At least in PSO, I could get S/D/J/Z/R 30 too. =/

[PJ]

What's to stop you from healing? Chances are your resta is still better than lower TP level 40 Resta, Reverser doesn't matter at fucking ALL. Bigger range, my ass, I JUST got Reverser to 21. That's all the range I'll ever need. Giresta, same deal with Resta.

So, the most IMPORTANT support techs are probably still better than Acrotecher. S/D/Z/R... really? Do you feel THAT gimped that you get ONE level lower than the Acrotechers do? Christ.

EDIT: Speaking of which, how many Acrotechers will even GET Resta to 40? So many people suck so fucking much at forcing in this game that their restas are obscenely low levels anyways. Good Lord are they low.

EDIT2: And finally, for the love of God, can someone tell me in WHAT scenario, other than bosses, will a wand do more damage, "Over time?" What enemies fucking LIVE long enough for you to get that, "Over time" bonus?

And if the answer is solo, don't even bother answering. Christ.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: PJ on 2007-10-03 18:42 ]</font>

[Remedy]

I dunno about you, but another five percent ATP, DFP, TP, and EVP is a significant difference to me - not to mention another five percent on debuffs.

Also, the TP difference between us and Acros is minimal. Someone posted a shot of a female newman going from FT 15 to AT 15 and the difference was barely 200. The levels WILL matter more, you watch.

It's just so dumb that tech forces are getting punished even more now. At least, in the old days, we could support just as well, and our Resta was better. Now even that isn't true. =-.-=

[PJ]

So, if your class sucks so much, why not just play Acrotecher? Fucking masochist.

Atleast I still know Fortetecher is a good class.

[Xaeris]

So, 200 TP is nothing, but 5%, that's just ginormous?

[Remedy]

It's still a good class - I never said it wasn't. It IS, however, eclipsed by the Acrotecher class. It supports better - the main job of any GOOD Force - and given what people are saying, it does comparable damage, too. It's also more resilient, too.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-03 18:52, Xaeris wrote:
So, 200 TP is nothing, but 5%, that's just ginormous?

All I'll say is that an AT and FT, each with their respective best Retier, probably have TP that's so close to each other, it's pointless to try to argue it.

I'll know more when I get a new PC and can do the math, though.

[Sekani]

Let's hope your PC is smart enough to figure out that all those numbers you're whining about in the end won't mean a thing.

As someone once said, PSU is a very simple game: you push buttons and things die. Quit hyperventilating over the details.

[Parn]

Fortefighter : Fighgunner : : Fortetecher : Acrotecher

That's what I see, anyway.

[Mystil]

On 2007-10-03 18:54, Remedy wrote:
It's still a good class - I never said it wasn't. It IS, however, eclipsed by the Acrotecher class. It supports better - the main job of any GOOD Force - and given what people are saying, it does comparable damage, too. It's also more resilient, too.


Not really. It was the main job because of melees. When in truth..FTs are the black mages of PSU.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-03 20:04, Parn wrote:
Fortefighter : Fighgunner : : Fortetecher : Acrotecher

That's what I see, anyway.



um...wut?

[Umberger]

Fortefighter is to Fighgunner much the same as Fortetecher is to Acrotecher.

[Parn]

It's an analogy dude.

[EJ]

I believe AT is the fomar of PSU since they have higher ATP, ATA, DFP, and EVP than a FT but then again since i don't see claws for them I will stick to my WT.

[Alisha]

It's not a nerf if they never had it to begin with. 'Nerf' implies that something they had was taken away.

this phrase is dead wrong. you dont have to take something away from a class to nerf it. as far as im concerned many of the hybrids are like invasive species to the fortes. imagine what would happen if all the gazzeles in africa suddenly become velociraptors. the lions have not been nerfed but they have been stripped of thier right to the top of the food chain.

[Kimil]

On 2007-10-03 20:26, Umberger wrote:
Fortefighter is to Fighgunner much the same as Fortetecher is to Acrotecher.



... Hmm Wellll, lets see.

Fig does less Damage than FF, worse stats, doesn't have the PP save, and lacks the big bad S rank Axes. Unskilled players flock to Fig to use only one aspect of it, Double Sabers.

AT does less Damage than FT, worse stats, doesn't have the PP save, and lacks the big bad S rank Rods. Unskilled players will flock to AT to use only one aspect of it, 40 lvl Buffs.



Yup, FF is to Fig, what FT is to AT

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 00:13, Kimil wrote:
Unskilled players will flock to AT to use only one aspect of it, 40 lvl Buffs....lol?

Maybe if you had said "players that care about more than themselves," that statement MIGHT be valid, but I assure you, level 40 support techs will not allure unskilled players. Most won't even cap S/D/Z/R/J/Z/Z.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 00:13, Kimil wrote:

On 2007-10-03 20:26, Umberger wrote:
Fortefighter is to Fighgunner much the same as Fortetecher is to Acrotecher.



... Hmm Wellll, lets see.

Fig does less Damage than FF, worse stats, doesn't have the PP save, and lacks the big bad S rank Axes. Unskilled players flock to Fig to use only one aspect of it, Double Sabers.

AT does less Damage than FT, worse stats, doesn't have the PP save, and lacks the big bad S rank Rods. Unskilled players will flock to AT to use only one aspect of it, 40 lvl Buffs.



Yup, FF is to Fig, what FT is to AT




my fighgunner is fine with doing 500's on her quick attacks and 800-1000's on her slow hits. I also dont like axes, i aslo dont miss as much as u (i sitll do just not as much) And i have ranged weapons which are always nice to have http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

Im going AT for the large combination of weapons, the striking, ranged, and tech weapons! Mechguns, twin pistols, cards, and wands and madoogs, and then whips, sabers, and daggers. Also I dont like rods either, the casting is alot faster on AT which i like alot, The lvl 40 buffs is the last thing im worried about.

PLease dont judged a whole class by a couple of random people whoi misuse them sometimes.

[Rashiid]

On 2007-10-03 18:32, PJ wrote:
Speaking of which, how many Acrotechers will even GET Resta to 40? So many people suck so fucking much at forcing in this game that their restas are obscenely low levels anyways. Good Lord are they low.


Day of Aoti release:

Mission 1 - get some madoogs/shadoogs.
Mission 2 - go to crimson beast and get resta to 32ish
Mission 3 - get all buffs to 31

it will lvl on its own; i resta too much.....
i put GH-45x model's to shame http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_disapprove.gif


and as for unskilled players; im going Acrotech to SUPPORT of others; not for 'lulzbuffz myselfz'

guess its no skill helping others anymore....

[CelestialBlade]

On 2007-10-03 20:04, Parn wrote:
Fortefighter : Fighgunner : : Fortetecher : Acrotecher

That's what I see, anyway.



Truedat. It's about time another class came along that actually gave fTs COMPETITION in the Teching department. fFs and fGs have had it since advanced classes were released, and it's just....outright hilarious seeing all these fTs raising hell over having the same thing happen to them. You've had it coming for a long time, and it's about time we had some variety for Force-types. I personally am very happy to see it. Finally, there's no one class in this game that has *everything*.

If it upsets you that much, do what I plan to do with my fT: dual-class fT and AT.

[Guildenstern]

On 2007-10-03 18:13, Chaobo99 wrote:
fotes do get madoogs..and..whips too ;/..and they are just plain better as far as teching goes..AT are hybrid fighters

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif Actually I do not think Fortetechers get whips -or- madoogs. IIRC those weapons belong to hybrid TECH classes only.


Im going AT for the large combination of weapons, the striking, ranged, and tech weapons! Mechguns, twin pistols, cards, and wands and madoogs, and then whips, sabers, and daggers.
Yeah, that's why I'm going AT too. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif I like the variety. The level 40 support I could take or leave, I don't spend enough time casting Resta to really care if it's level 40 or 30. That level 31+ Shifta is going to be super nice for my melee hits though...:3

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Guildenstern on 2007-10-04 05:07 ]</font>

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-03 18:32, PJ wrote:
What's to stop you from healing? Chances are your resta is still better than lower TP level 40 Resta, Reverser doesn't matter at fucking ALL. Bigger range, my ass, I JUST got Reverser to 21. That's all the range I'll ever need. Giresta, same deal with Resta.

So, the most IMPORTANT support techs are probably still better than Acrotecher. S/D/Z/R... really? Do you feel THAT gimped that you get ONE level lower than the Acrotechers do? Christ.

EDIT: Speaking of which, how many Acrotechers will even GET Resta to 40? So many people suck so fucking much at forcing in this game that their restas are obscenely low levels anyways. Good Lord are they low.

EDIT2: And finally, for the love of God, can someone tell me in WHAT scenario, other than bosses, will a wand do more damage, "Over time?" What enemies fucking LIVE long enough for you to get that, "Over time" bonus?

And if the answer is solo, don't even bother answering. Christ.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: PJ on 2007-10-03 18:42 ]</font>


my lvl 35 has lvl 15 resta is that good enoguh at that lvl? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif (will be higher when i get into another resta party)

also yes i am a resta spammer, as my beast dies many many times, so much to the fact people look at me weird when im doing the most damage in the party yet getting killed by a badira in seabed XD

my answer to your questions....

I Solo

[PJ]

On 2007-10-03 23:28, Alisha wrote:
this phrase is dead wrong. you dont have to take something away from a class to nerf it. as far as im concerned many of the hybrids are like invasive species to the fortes. imagine what would happen if all the gazzeles in africa suddenly become velociraptors. the lions have not been nerfed but they have been stripped of thier right to the top of the food chain.



Uh, lol wut

Frankly, pre-AoI Hybrid classes were weak. People can argue with me all they like, but it won't make the statement any less true. The only reason people play them now is to be different.

Now hybrids are atleast not crap versions of Forte-classes.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 05:47, PJ wrote:

On 2007-10-03 23:28, Alisha wrote:
this phrase is dead wrong. you dont have to take something away from a class to nerf it. as far as im concerned many of the hybrids are like invasive species to the fortes. imagine what would happen if all the gazzeles in africa suddenly become velociraptors. the lions have not been nerfed but they have been stripped of thier right to the top of the food chain.



Uh, lol wut

Frankly, pre-AoI Hybrid classes were weak. People can argue with me all they like, but it won't make the statement any less true. The only reason people play them now is to be different.

Now hybrids are atleast not crap versions of Forte-classes.



i will agree with u there but hybrid classes are more fun! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[PJ]

I WILL admit, Protranser is a chunk o' fun. I can't wait for the EX Traps >_> And for Grenade Launchers. (My Beast PT is level 50, PT5. Which is suprisingly close)

And I assume Guntecher will be fun once my teching portion isn't complete and udder shit.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 05:58, PJ wrote:
I WILL admit, Protranser is a chunk o' fun. I can't wait for the EX Traps >_> And for Grenade Launchers. (My Beast PT is level 50, PT5. Which is suprisingly close)

And I assume Guntecher will be fun once my teching portion isn't complete and udder shit.



hey guntecher's my favorite class in the game http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

[Garnet_Moon]

All this expert class drama.

All my chars are staying as the basics. Sei will be a lv110 FO20, and not have to worry about teh drama llama.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 06:01, Garnet_Moon wrote:
All this expert class drama.

All my chars are staying as the basics. Sei will be a lv110 FO20, and not have to worry about teh drama llama.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



too bad no S ranks...... wow u cant even use A ranks.... well u can grind... but no cards http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif oh well

[Garnet_Moon]

On 2007-10-04 06:03, pikachief wrote:

On 2007-10-04 06:01, Garnet_Moon wrote:
All this expert class drama.

All my chars are staying as the basics. Sei will be a lv110 FO20, and not have to worry about teh drama llama.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



too bad no S ranks...... wow u cant even use A ranks.... well u can grind... but no cards http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif oh well


Isn't it sad? ; _ ;

[Trinitaria]

People are still fighting over this ? =/

For the love of God, the class is not even here yet and you guys are already fighting over which is better ? This is all pointless, same thing happened with the all the talk about the Madoogs having ultra low PP and now look at them.

Let the game run it's course, if Sonic Team feels that the class is not performing as it should they might perform a stat increase, and besides as an experienced techer I already know that supporting is already over kill, a level 21+ resta will be healing well over 1400+ HP and I am being very conservative there. If you are supporting you are not even going to leave your party with 9/10 of their Health and the range is sufficient (unless your party decides to scatter in a huge room >.< ), support techs like shifta,deband,etc. don't have to be casted every 5 seconds, let the AT cast it and return to inflicting SE's with their whips or whatever tactic they prefer and focus on healing then, less changing of weapons, less likelyhood of someone dying during that brief pause.

I can also imagine that 31+ Resta does not come cheap -.-. Forte Techers will be casting away happily with their discount, rods in hand, and if you are using elemental bonus that's another 12%, add that with a maybe more than 10% bonus for having a 40 level attack tech. if you have, say, 2000TP that is in theory 440 additional TP on an attack on an enemy of opposite element of the spell casted.

Speaking of rods, we don't even know yet what kind of new rods we will be recieving, P-wand by itself is already a monster, even if not grinded. Who knows if they decide to release rods with armor combos or even rods with insanely high TP ?

Forte is not useless, Acro just lessens the burden of the class as a whole. Besides, come AOI there will be hundreds of techers that will be spamming attack techs just to get them to 31+ -.-

We are going to be needing the extra support...

Summed up for all those to lazy to read the block of text ? It's too early to judge, let the game run it's course.

[Rashiid]

On 2007-10-04 05:03, Guildenstern wrote:
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif Actually I do not think Fortetechers get whips -or- madoogs. IIRC those weapons belong to hybrid TECH classes only.

oddly; they do.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 06:44, Rashiid wrote:

On 2007-10-04 05:03, Guildenstern wrote:
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif Actually I do not think Fortetechers get whips -or- madoogs. IIRC those weapons belong to hybrid TECH classes only.

oddly; they do.



no those are just tech weapons http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Reipard]

this phrase is dead wrong. you dont have to take something away from a class to nerf it. as far as im concerned many of the hybrids are like invasive species to the fortes. imagine what would happen if all the gazzeles in africa suddenly become velociraptors. the lions have not been nerfed but they have been stripped of thier right to the top of the food chain.

I think that analogy is way overthinking it, but I guess I see where you're coming from. I still don't think they've been nerfed, though.

Wartechers were never the best at support, they're still not the best at support now http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif. They're just not the best by a larger margin than before.

[Rashiid]

Whips are melee.....but mainly techer classes get them. Acrofighter get em; and they dont tech at all.

and in all technicallity; Shadoogs are tech since they are based on TP.....how come fortetechers cant get emz?
why (which i rly dont understand) dont Figuns get whips?

arnt they the 'quick weapon small arms' class? (im not defending figuns; just wondering myself)

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 06:50, Rashiid wrote:
Whips are melee.....but mainly techer classes get them. Acrofighter get em; and they dont tech at all.

and in all technicallity; Shadoogs are tech since they are based on TP.....how come fortetechers cant get emz?
why (which i rly dont understand) dont Figuns get whips?

arnt they the 'quick weapon small arms' class? (im not defending figuns; just wondering myself)



no i meant techer classes get them

like shadoogs are ranged weapons cuz ranger classes get them http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[physic]

ehhh fortetechers dont need to support, people talk about fortefighters being super powered, ehhh bull, even with buffs they still have to run across the room to hit a mob, by the time you pull off a 3 hit combo on one mob everything else in teh room is dead from a ra who was shooting since you stepped in a room, and a fo who has super range, which will be even greater now. Go try to level Axe in a party and see how much stuff you actually get to kill in a full party, also keep in mind the game is supposedly even faster paced now.

10% more PA and ele% + more tp will make a huge difference in dmg if you were doin 2k, thats 300-400 more a hit. If you were a fortecher because you wanted to be the best support, then you lose, but why should you be good at everything anyhow?

i cant speak on other hybrids, but pro was super pointless before. stats and weaps. even at level 10 it was a barely becoming not a joke.

[Rashiid]

On 2007-10-04 06:52, physic wrote:
ehhh fortetechers dont need to support

boyyyyyyyy you on some good weed boyyyyyyyyy

[pikachief]

yea im a fortegunner and my fig/FF/PT friend who uses axes alot got mad at me when just us 2 were looking for the halp serafi and i was taking every single rare that dropped XD

also i was at seabed and i was in a group 6 and there was a room with 4 badiras then 2 jarbas after, and up a head a bridge then another room with the same spawn.

I stayed with them till 2 badiras died, then ran to the next room(by the time i got to the next room their jarbas spawned) And I killed my badiras and 1 of my jarbas and brought the second jarba to very low health by the time they killed their jarbas.

If any race is over powered its gunners. I still remember back in the day when before moatoob even came out and i was lvl 20 one day at sleeping warriors someone tells me "Rangers arent that great They're more like support, ya know? Like just there kinda on teh side to help but not get hurt. Nice to have them around but not that great."

Pfft i told him that some day i'd be stronger than all them and now we are getting the least in the expansion cuz we are too strong XD GWAHAHAHAHA

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 06:52, physic wrote:
ehhh fortetechers dont need to supportUh... no. The increase in damage that a Fortecher can provide to a party by amplifying their ATP by 20% each outweighs the damage that a Fortecher herself can do.

learn2PSU. learn2Force.


On 2007-10-04 07:16, Apone wrote:
Since debuffs give a player exp are those considered attack or support spells?Support.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 07:19 ]</font>

[Apone]

Since debuffs give a player exp are those considered attack or support spells?
Also isnt having lvl 40 buffs on a wand and having to use up more palette space for all the buffs (if you HAVE to have them all) kinda inconvenient? Shuffling wands/spells seems time consuming.

[panzer_unit]

On 2007-10-04 06:52, physic wrote:
Go try to level Axe in a party and see how much stuff you actually get to kill in a full party, also keep in mind the game is supposedly even faster paced now.
...
i cant speak on other hybrids, but pro was super pointless before. stats and weaps. even at level 10 it was a barely becoming not a joke.


LOL ... never mind. Not about FT's.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: panzer_unit on 2007-10-04 07:30 ]</font>

[Mystil]

Atleast forces wont be the targets for hate and such for being too powerful.

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 07:16, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 06:52, physic wrote:
ehhh fortetechers dont need to supportUh... no. The increase in damage that a Fortecher can provide to a party by amplifying their ATP by 20% each outweighs the damage that a Fortecher herself can do.

learn2PSU. learn2Force.


On 2007-10-04 07:16, Apone wrote:
Since debuffs give a player exp are those considered attack or support spells?Support.

I find it funny that u said SHE. omg too many female newmans in PSU! We must super breed them to make more men or else there will be no more men and newmans will be extinct! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif (actually lets do that i dont like newmans)


On 2007-10-04 07:16, Apone wrote:
Since debuffs give a player exp are those considered attack or support spells?
Also isnt having lvl 40 buffs on a wand and having to use up more palette space for all the buffs (if you HAVE to have them all) kinda inconvenient? Shuffling wands/spells seems time consuming.



No because it doens physically hurt them

and u can have a wand and shadoog both on your pallet, its like a faster rod with more PP, but isnt as strong http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 07:19 ]</font>

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 07:38, pikachief wrote:
I find it funny that u said SHE. omg too many female newmans in PSU! We must super breed them to make more men or else there will be no more men and newmans will be extinct! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif (actually lets do that i dont like newmans)Bad habit of mine. I use feminine pronouns when talking about Forces/Fortechers because of my attachment to Remedy. *shrug* I simply attempt to have her be a paragon of what the class is, can be, and should be, so I use feminine pronouns because of that. I can change it if it really bothers you. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


On 2007-10-04 07:37, Mystil wrote:
Atleast forces wont be the targets for hate and such for being too powerful.Better to be the target of jealousy for your power than the target of ridicule for your lack of it, I say. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 07:49 ]</font>

[pikachief]

On 2007-10-04 07:48, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 07:38, pikachief wrote:
I find it funny that u said SHE. omg too many female newmans in PSU! We must super breed them to make more men or else there will be no more men and newmans will be extinct! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif (actually lets do that i dont like newmans)Bad habit of mine. I use feminine pronouns when talking about Forces/Fortechers because of my attachment to Remedy. *shrug* I simply attempt to have her be a paragon of what the class is, can be, and should be, so I use feminine pronouns because of that. I can change it if it really bothers you. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


On 2007-10-04 07:37, Mystil wrote:
Atleast forces wont be the targets for hate and such for being too powerful.Better to be the target of jealousy for your power than the target of ridicule for your lack of it, I say. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 07:49 ]</font>


no dont i just thought it was funny cuz most newmans are she ^.^ lol

[MrNomad]

Tough one, it really looks like hybrids are becoming the casual classes in AoI. Aren't WTs getting a stat boost that's almost as high as a fF? And they're getting lvl 30 attack spells too, but oh wait only lvl 20 support, it's still not good enough lol! Now it looks like fortes are basically turning into one-trick pony classes with a small boost in dmg. fF will still be lame though. Oh ya, giving up my FG's lvl 30 bullet and guns, double saber, lvl 40 skills etc. is worth a class with only one gun, lvl 20 bullets, an axe, and a 200 hp stat boost....> >

[physic]

On 2007-10-04 07:38, pikachief wrote:
Uh... no. The increase in damage that a Fortecher can provide to a party by amplifying their ATP by 20% each outweighs the damage that a Fortecher herself can do.

learn2PSU. learn2Force.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 07:19 ]</font>

Im not saying that shifta and deband is useless, im saying that 1 level doesnt kill a fortechers whole purpose in being, in fact what your saying implies fortecher was totally overpowered, because not only could they dish out heavy dmg, they also increase everyones stats by 20%

thats not what im really saying, What im saying is fortecher is no longer the best buffer, but they are the best magic attacker. there are six slots in a party and no matter how many acro you have, your only getting buffed once, so now put a fortecher in a pt with acro, and they will totally do the most magic dmg with a large range and a big boom. take out teh acro, and they are still doing more magic dmg than the acro, and are able to heal and add shifta up to 30, which was no small boost.

Frankly just sounds like you want it all, to be king of everything. basically if you want to focus in support go acro, if you want to focus on dmg go forte. Fact is forte couldnt be made useless even with no boosts.

[Powder Keg]

Wow, FT's don't get 31 Support? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. That's like not giving a Fortegunner lvl 31 shot bullets and giving it to a guntecher instead. FT is supposed to be all magic.

On the other hand, it would be nice to not be the buff man all the time if there's someone else around who can do better.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Artea on 2007-10-04 08:32 ]</font>

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 08:24, physic wrote:
Im not saying that shifta and deband is useless, im saying that 1 level doesnt kill a fortechers whole purpose in beingThere is no difference whatsoever between S/D/Z/R/J/Z/Z 21-30. The major difference occurs at 1, 11, 21, and 31, the level that we don't get.


On 2007-10-04 08:24, physic wrote:
thats not what im really saying, What im saying is fortecher is no longer the best buffer, but they are the best magic attacker.Which is the weakest form of damage output! Awesome! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif And for backup, we have cards and bows, driven by our ATP which is the worst of all the classes! Amazing!


On 2007-10-04 08:24, physic wrote:
Frankly just sounds like you want it all, to be king of everything.No, I want to be what the game claims my class to be - "An expert TECHNIC user that can use all TECHNICs with unmatched power." If someone else's Retier, Shifta, or any other tech is more powerful than mine, mine aren't really used with "unmatched power", now are they? I would have no problem whatsoever SHARING level 40 support techs with Acrotechers. I do, however, have a problem with my main job in a party - support - being taken by a class that isn't a Fortecher.


On 2007-10-04 08:30, Artea wrote:
On the other hand, it would be nice to not be the buff man all the time if there's someone else around who can do better.Except I like doing support. Hell, my motto during the PSO days was "A Force is only as good as the support she can provide. A Force who will not help others before herself is no Force at all.", and now I'm having to choose between that creed, or the use of the weapons I want. It's retarded, like you said.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 08:38 ]</font>

[CelestialBlade]

Fortetechers: Master of Attack Technics, very good with Support.
Acrotechers: Master of Support Technics, very good with Attack.

It's called balance. I still fail to see what's so evil and terrible about having class balance now. I suppose some people want Acrotechers to have, like, level 30 Attack AND Support and be nothing but a watered down Wartecher? Yeah, that makes all kinds of sense.

And it's been stated a hundred times but it's not like this means Fortetechers can't support at all. Considering their TP mod, Fortetechers still have the 2nd best Resta, and 1st is not far ahead at all. This same whining happened in the big Wartecher debate a while back and it's just as pointless of an argument now as it was then.

[realP]

On 2007-10-04 08:47, Typheros wrote:
Fortetechers: Master of Attack Technics, very good with Support.
Acrotechers: Master of Support Technics, very good with Attack.

It's called balance. I still fail to see what's so evil and terrible about having class balance now. I suppose some people want Acrotechers to have, like, level 30 Attack AND Support and be nothing but a watered down Wartecher? Yeah, that makes all kinds of sense.

And it's been stated a hundred times but it's not like this means Fortetechers can't support at all. Considering their TP mod, Fortetechers still have the 2nd best Resta, and 1st is not far ahead at all. This same whining happened in the big Wartecher debate a while back and it's just as pointless of an argument now as it was then.



I think that sums it up right there. Well put! Yet, I do not think people will ever stop crying about it.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 08:47, Typheros wrote:
Fortetechers: Master of Attack Technics, very good with Support.

That's not what the game says, but I have this feeling that the class descriptions will change to be something like that. It's more of the "you should be a melee force, not a tech force" BS that's existed since PSO v2, but this time it's not ridiculous levels of resistances in Ultimate, it's melee forces (ATs) have better support capacity (the real reason you bring a Force along to party) than tech forces (FTs)


On 2007-10-04 08:47, Typheros wrote:
I suppose some people want Acrotechers to have, like, level 30 Attack AND Support and be nothing but a watered down Wartecher?

Not at all. If you'd read my posts, I state that I have no problem whatsoever with them having level 40 Support techs, too.


On 2007-10-04 08:47, Typheros wrote:
Considering their TP mod, Fortetechers still have the 2nd best Resta

I'm not even remotely worried about my Resta, because I'm so immediately reactive with it that it's never been an issue to fully heal someone - if someone dips to 50%, I'm slacking badly. My concern is the power boost and range boost gained by having access to Shifta, Deband, Zodial, Retier, Jellen, Zalure, and Zoldeel 31. That's another 5% to my party's stats and 5% away from my enemy's stats that I cannot use. My slightly higher TP doesn't do shit to compensate for that.

Again, I'm supposed to be "An expert TECHNIC user that can use all TECHNICs with unmatched power." This change is making that untrue.

[Indica]

On 2007-10-04 06:21, Trinitaria wrote:
People are still fighting over this ? =/

For the love of God, the class is not even here yet and you guys are already fighting over which is better ? This is all pointless, same thing happened with the all the talk about the Madoogs having ultra low PP and now look at them.



Exactly, I was thinking the same thing. This TOPIC SUCKS

[ShadowDragon28]

Techers are a nice class and should be helpful no matter what type of Techer. It's the players that
have a Techer and never buff the party or never debuff enemies, that tend to be not-so-helpful and a bit bothersome.

[Powder Keg]

On 2007-10-04 09:06, Indica wrote:
Exactly, I was thinking the same thing. This TOPIC SUCKS


and so does your face. But eh, we manage! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 09:36, Mystil wrote:
EVERY party is going to have ATs and not everyone is going to be an AT. And Resta/Reverser/SD/JZ isn't all an FT is.According to the people playing AoI on the JP servers, a vast majority of FTs are jumping ship to AT, and yes, ATs are wildly popular. Is that because they're new? Maybe, and we'll see, but if it DOES continue...

And no, it's not all we are. It is, however, a very, very large part of what we are, and the real reason, IMO, that Fortechers are desired in the slightest. As it was in PSO, our support is our real calling - our damage can be outdone by Fortefighters with axes and Fortegunners with DoTs and by all measure of other classes. Take away our support, and we're left with only the ability to provide mediocre damage. =/

[Mystil]

First off all

"EVERY party is going"

Should be is'nt. The GOT DAMN PAGE LOCKED UP ON ME..so the edit didn't go through.....



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Mystil on 2007-10-04 09:48 ]</font>

[Remedy]

I assumed that and took it into account when I typed my response. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[CelestialBlade]

Let's change the text in the Fortetecher description to "Expert of attack technics" then. Problem solved?

By that logic, a Fortefighter should get every melee weapon at S-rank AND level 30 Bullets, and a Fortegunner should have every ranged weapon at S-rank. That....isn't balance, and would really kill the game. Force-types now having the variety that Hunter- and Ranger-types have = very good thing. Again, we've needed that for a while.

If you want to be the best support then....go Acrotecher? *shrug* I'm not seeing the point of this considering nothing's going to change.

[Garnet_Moon]

My Newman F will be an Acrotecher. I like rods, sure, but they make me lazy. Not being able to equip them at all should fix that.

I will probably miss the PP reduction from fT, but hey, Forte's are easy mode. I'd like a challenge from the class I play.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-04 09:54 ]</font>

[chibiLegolas]

I'm just curious about AT's lack of ranged attacks for bosses.
Someone else brought it up LONG ago. But with the lack of a longbow, AT might have to rely on long range techs to take down certain bosses?
Compared to FT, at least FT's have that bit of security to lean on.
Their 20 skills just makes them decent. So I wonder if bosses are one of their weaknesses to the class.

[Mystil]

On 2007-10-04 09:46, Remedy wrote:
<snip>

You know half the ATs on our servers are probably going to suck right? Where the only thing they'll have going for them is the lvl40 support.

[Garnet_Moon]

On 2007-10-04 09:54, chibiLegolas wrote:
I'm just curious about AT's lack of ranged attacks for bosses.
Someone else brought it up LONG ago. But with the lack of a longbow, AT might have to rely on long range techs to take down certain bosses?
Compared to FT, at least FT's have that bit of security to lean on.
Their 20 skills just makes them decent. So I wonder if bosses are one of their weaknesses to the class.


Noszonde may only do about 600-900 damage, but it's heat seeking and consistent, and a reliable backup when CARDs just ain't cutting it.

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-04 09:51, Typheros wrote:
Let's change the text in the Fortetecher description to "Expert of attack technics" then. Problem solved?

By that logic, a Fortefighter should get every melee weapon at S-rank AND level 30 Bullets, and a Fortegunner should have every ranged weapon at S-rank. That....isn't balance, and would really kill the game. Force-types now having the variety that Hunter- and Ranger-types have = very good thing. Again, we've needed that for a while.

If you want to be the best support then....go Acrotecher? *shrug* I'm not seeing the point of this considering nothing's going to change.



Good observation. Fortetecher is a very functional class, with plenty of exclusivity. if you want the pretty animations of level 31+ attack techs, you gotta be a FT.

Someone commented that hybrids are weak. FiGunner isn't. It is probably the second strongest job in the game, after fortegunner. This is pre AoI. Post AoI is may become the strongest (depending on the prevalence of robots).

One thing that has not been mentioned: element %s are changing in weapons. The thought is that ONLY the weapons TP count's towards calculating elemental damage - not a characters base TP. That means a weapon like a rod (with higher TP, *and* a higher possible elemental modifier), will become a more effective weapon than a wand/madoog with in AoI.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-10-04 10:01 ]</font>

[Indica]

On 2007-10-04 09:53, Garnet_Moon wrote:
My Newman F will be an Acrotecher. I like rods, sure, but they make me lazy. Not being able to equip them at all should fix that.

I will probably miss the PP reduction from fT, but hey, Forte's are easy mode. I'd like a challenge from the class I play.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-04 09:54 ]</font>


My male human will mess around with Aerotecher and i do like wands. But since it's only limited to 2 slots, I am not loading them up with all buffs. That's why I got Megistar. Everyone else in the party can find their own buffs..lol

[Garnet_Moon]

On 2007-10-04 10:00, Indica wrote:

On 2007-10-04 09:53, Garnet_Moon wrote:
My Newman F will be an Acrotecher. I like rods, sure, but they make me lazy. Not being able to equip them at all should fix that.

I will probably miss the PP reduction from fT, but hey, Forte's are easy mode. I'd like a challenge from the class I play.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-04 09:54 ]</font>


My male human will mess around with Aerotecher and i do like wands. But since it's only limited to 2 slots, I am not loading them up with all buffs. That's why I got Megistar. Everyone else in the party can find their own buffs..lol



You'll have a unique-looking shoulder thing and S-Ranks that people have never seen before. They will think you're an NPC who only self buffs and murders everything on screen.

You'll be fine. I might do Self-buffing only too, because the parties will be comprised of like 5 AT's, one of us has to be greedy.

As for the sixth slot? Probably a Tranny or a AF.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 09:59, SolomonGrundy wrote:
One thing that has not been mentioned: element %s are changing in weapons. The thought is that ONLY the weapons TP count's towards calculating elemental damage - not a characters base TP. That means a weapon like a rod (with higher TP, *and* a higher possible elemental modifier), will become a more effective weapon than a wand/madoog with in AoI.Who, really, uses elemental rods/wands? The damage isn't nearly enough to make up for the lack of immediate Resta/Reverser access, not to mention that it only functions on the proper elemental monsters - a Force running around with an Earth rod when the majority of the enemies are Fire looks really, really retarded when she could have faster Resta under her fingers.


On 2007-10-04 09:55, Mystil wrote:
You know half the ATs on our servers are probably going to suck right? Where the only thing they'll have going for them is the lvl40 support.I know that, but in a utopian world, everyone would play to their classes strengths and ATs would be support-minded first and foremost. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif I'm just frustrated at the fact that I have to make decisions yet again about my playstyle, and this time it's even more invasive than "Okay, I have to raise a whole different mag, slot different units in my armor, and amass a set of hit weapons so I can land hits frequently enough to be important," it's "I have to abandon the ability to use Rods and the 25% PP cost reduction to be able to continue to do my core duty as a Force, or abandon that duty in favor of doing a little bit more damage."

10% more on a spell isn't that much. 190 TP, assuming Foney Fortecher 15/100-ish, form the pictures I've seen, which comes out to... 40 damage. Retier 31 would give me a bigger edge than that, and with less computer lag. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif


On 2007-10-04 09:51, Typheros wrote:
By that logic, a Fortefighter should get every melee weapon at S-rank AND level 30 Bullets, and a Fortegunner should have every ranged weapon at S-rank.Fortefighter: "An expert melee fighter focused on striking attacks. Weapon choice is limited but attack and defensive power is unparalleled."

Fortegunner: "An expert ranged fighter focused on firearms. Weapon choice is limited, but attack power and accuracy are unparalleled."

derp? Your arguments don't work.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 10:40 ]</font>

[Reipard]

I know that, but in a utopian world, everyone would play to their classes strengths and ATs would be support-minded first and foremost. I'm just frustrated at the fact that I have to make decisions yet again about my playstyle, and this time it's even more invasive than "Okay, I have to raise a whole different mag, slot different units in my armor, and amass a set of hit weapons so I can land hits frequently enough to be important," it's "I have to abandon the ability to use Rods and the 25% PP cost reduction to be able to continue to do my core duty as a Force, or abandon that duty in favor of doing a little bit more damage."

I think you're blowing what the lack of level 40 buffs will really do to your character way out of proportion.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 10:41, Reipard wrote:
I think you're blowing what the lack of level 40 buffs will really do to your character way out of proportion.They will remove my status as the top support tech user in the game by virtue of removing it from my class. Support techs are the most important thing a Force does, but there are other reasons I'm attached to being a Fortecher (primarily, Rods). Therefore, it brings me to a dilemma: Do my job, as I see it, and give up things that I enjoy, or shirk what I see as my duty as a Force just to keep my idea of a palette of Gaozoran Rod x3 and Psycho Wand x3.

Again, I see no reason why Fortechers shouldn't be 1/30/40/40, or even 1/20/40/40.

[Reipard]

Honestly, it's not that big a deal. If an Acrotecher or Guntecher are there, they will do the buffs and you get to nuke. If not, you play partial support.

Everyone still wins. Why the hell do you have to give up anything at all? So people won't boot you? They still won't.

Seriously, way overthinking how much it'll affect you.

[Remedy]

It's more an issue of pride, than anything. Trust me, I plan on dabbling between both, and might even dabble as an Acrofighter because the idea of the class appeals to me (or I might just create a newman male modeled after my real life self to do that with, who knows).

You're probably right and I'm probably looking into it too much, but it still annoys me to no end, because it reminds me of the issues between melee Forces and tech Forces in PSO, which was a major point of contention for me (I didn't give in and go Melee Foney until level 148 on PSO:BB, which was my fourth incarnation of Remedy - created twice and leveled to 200 on DC v2 and once on XBox). People will be passionate about strange things. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 09:42, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 09:36, Mystil wrote:
EVERY party is going to have ATs and not everyone is going to be an AT. And Resta/Reverser/SD/JZ isn't all an FT is.According to the people playing AoI on the JP servers, a vast majority of FTs are jumping ship to AT, and yes, ATs are wildly popular. Is that because they're new? Maybe, and we'll see, but if it DOES continue...

And no, it's not all we are. It is, however, a very, very large part of what we are, and the real reason, IMO, that Fortechers are desired in the slightest. As it was in PSO, our support is our real calling - our damage can be outdone by Fortefighters with axes and Fortegunners with DoTs and by all measure of other classes. Take away our support, and we're left with only the ability to provide mediocre damage. =/

Are you kidding me??? A fF will NEVER do as much dmg with axes as an fT with spells, I know because I've seen a fF try to fight a mob while a fT blasted them with dambarta, she was doing about 600 every half second to 3 targets, meanwhile the fF was still starting anga redda and he did about 700 to 2 targets http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif as for fGs, thats only when they're using a shotgun lvl 21 on one target. I think you really dont understand just how much stronger an fT is overall compared to the other fortes.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 10:55, MrNomad wrote:
Are you kidding me??? A fF will NEVER do as much dmg with axes as an fT with spells, I know because I've seen a fF try to fight a mob while a fT blasted them with dambarta, she was doing about 600 every half second to 3 targets, meanwhile the fF was still starting anga redda and he did about 700 to 2 targets http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif as for fGs, thats only when they're using a shotgun lvl 21 on one target. I think you really dont understand just how much stronger an fT is overall compared to the other fortes. Have you ever seen a Fortefighter with high elementally attuned weapons in action? Hell, even a Protranser with them? They will out-damage us any day of the week... and have you seen the pictures of the new stuff that's happening in AotI? That picture of some FF doing over 5000 damage with one hit? Ain't ever gonna happen as a Fortecher, no way, no how. I don't even think you'd get it done with Diga 40 from a Psycho Wand packed at 12% Earth against a Lightning enemy.

[physic]

so basically you just want fortecher to be master of support. wellll the time when fortecher had no peers is passed, good riddance i say. and really the loss to support spells, who knows how much you ll lose, at most id guess 5% it only bothers you if you really want to be mainly support, most forte i know actually want the attack power more, they hoped that wartechers or guntechers would take thier support duties away from them, alas that wasnt the case.

Btw i dont think fortecher dmg sucks at all figuring in range, being able to hit 4+ mobs instantly the fact like half the game has on melee shields etc. the only place i think forte takes a hit is on single mob multi target dmg. I mean really forte was just king before, SE, Buffs debuffs damage, it really had an incredible amount of power for one class.

btw, as a FF mainly, i can tell you that axe is slow as hell, doesnt aim that well. By the time i run up and get to the 3rd, and super strong part of the PA Forte gunner and fortecher has already killed 4 monsters. not to mention many of the power PAs force you to have an enemy already cornered for your PA not to knock them out of the dmg


then the whole 50% weapon thing, that is an irregularity caused by hax. In a normal world very few to no fortefighters would hve a full complement of 50% weapons

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: physic on 2007-10-04 11:05 ]</font>


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: physic on 2007-10-04 11:07 ]</font>

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 10:59, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 10:55, MrNomad wrote:
Are you kidding me??? A fF will NEVER do as much dmg with axes as an fT with spells, I know because I've seen a fF try to fight a mob while a fT blasted them with dambarta, she was doing about 600 every half second to 3 targets, meanwhile the fF was still starting anga redda and he did about 700 to 2 targets http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif as for fGs, thats only when they're using a shotgun lvl 21 on one target. I think you really dont understand just how much stronger an fT is overall compared to the other fortes. Have you ever seen a Fortefighter with high elementally attuned weapons in action? Hell, even a Protranser with them? They will out-damage us any day of the week... and have you seen the pictures of the new stuff that's happening in AotI? That picture of some FF doing over 5000 damage with one hit? Ain't ever gonna happen as a Fortecher, no way, no how. I don't even think you'd get it done with Diga 40 from a Psycho Wand packed at 12% Earth against a Lightning enemy.

5000 dmg, but im sure he pulled that out after the monster took off half his health because a fF has to fight up close http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif I'm not sure just how much extra dmg a fF does in AoI (nor do I care since they still have the crappiest gun selection ever) I was talking about now. But then you said it yourself "highly attuned elemental weapons" It's been a while since I EVER got a weapon over 16 % > >

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 11:01, physic wrote:
so basically you just want fortecher to be master of support. wellll the time when fortecher had no peers is passed, good riddance i say. and really the loss to support spells, who knows how much you ll lose, at most id guess 5% it only bothers you if you really want to be mainly support, most forte i know actually want the attack power more, they hoped that wartechers or guntechers would take thier support duties away from them, alas that wasnt the case.

Btw i dont think fortecher dmg sucks at all figuring in range, being able to hit 4+ mobs instantly the fact like half the game has on melee shields etc. the only place i think forte takes a hit is on single mob multi target dmg. I mean really forte was just king before, SE, Buffs debuffs damage, it really had an incredible amount of power for one class.

Exactly, so what if a fF can do 5000 if he can only hit ONE target??? Id rather do 3000 to FOUR targets, that's a lot more worth it...

[Remedy]

Although, really, to be fair, the only reason I'm arguing this as much as I'm arguing it is that I'm at work with nothing to do right now and no one's watching my cubicle. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Well, that's not that true, I'm pretty passionate about this, but normally I'd be doing support tickets, but nothing at my data center is broke. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif


On 2007-10-04 11:05, MrNomad wrote:
Exactly, so what if a fF can do 5000 if he can only hit ONE target??? Id rather do 3000 to FOUR targets, that's a lot more worth it...

You're out of your mind, Fortechers can't that hard, no way in hell. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif The best I've ever done back in the day was in the low 1000s with Damubarta 30, linked in a 12% rod on Fire enemies. If elements work for us the same way they work for you, then that won't even be nearly as potent as before, since our base TP is so massive. Shit, the biggest Fortecher-launched hit I've ever seen was a low 3000-ish Diga, but that was pre-Psycho Wand. Maybe it's in the 3500-ish range now, who knows.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Remedy on 2007-10-04 11:09 ]</font>

[SolomonGrundy]

It's more an issue of pride, than anything.

this is the real issue, methinks.

[MrNomad]

ya but im talking about in AoI, when fTs and every other class gets a huge stat boost =P

but ya, fTs have always been better in dmg overall then fFs and I have a feeling it'll stay that way come AoI

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: MrNomad on 2007-10-04 11:13 ]</font>

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 11:11, MrNomad wrote:
ya but im talking about in AoI, when fTs and every other class gets a huge stat boost =PFOs and FTs are untouched in their stats (according to the pictures thread), so... :|

[Remedy]

If everyone but us grows stronger, we grow weaker by comparison. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[MrNomad]

well, we dont know if they'll be weaker or not until we play, wont we??? =3

[Zorafim]

If I'm not mistaken, PSO was the first game where a teching character could actually do both support and offensive techs at a high level. The heavy magicians used nukes, and a small amount of support (Rune had a reviving spell, but no healing spells), and support came from meleeing characters more often than not (Except in Raja's case, where simply having him in your party automatically means your party is ten levels stronger). Heck, even the android could heal himself and buff the party. There were a few exceptions, but nobody could cast both NaSar and NaFoi.

I find that support being stuck on one class is rather silly. Resta is almost a lifeblood of a party, considering you can lose most of your health in a matter of seconds due to bad luck. Supportive techniques boost your stats by a large amount, proportionally higher than spending all your money on an equipment upgrade or getting an equipment piece 20% higher than you have. Why should one class do this well, while others can't do it at all?

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 11:14, Remedy wrote:
If everyone but us grows stronger, we grow weaker by comparison. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

But we dont know yet, we gotta wait for expansion remypooo =P

[Remedy]

I see no problem with other classes being able to do so, and in AotI, there'll be four classes capable of doing so at varying levels of skill (Fortechers, Acrotechers, Guntechers, Wartechers), not to mention that the stat boosts are easily imitated in the form of affordable consumables. (Yes, only level 1, but that's still 10% for 3 minutes) The availability of support spells isn't lacking.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 11:16, MrNomad wrote:
But we dont know yet, we gotta wait for expansion remypooo =P=o.O=; I've only been called that by one other person before.

I'm slightly creeped out now.

[MrNomad]

dont worry, I dont biiiite ;3 jeje

[beatrixkiddo]

On 2007-10-04 11:12, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 11:11, MrNomad wrote:
ya but im talking about in AoI, when fTs and every other class gets a huge stat boost =PFOs and FTs are untouched in their stats (according to the pictures thread), so... :|



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/beatrix_kiddo/aoi0227.jpg

Fortetecher stats on the right. And no, the boost from 10 to 11 isn't that big.

[Remedy]

On 2007-10-04 11:19, MrNomad wrote:
dont worry, I dont biiiite ;3 jejeDamn, there go my plans for this weekend.

I MEAN SHIT, BACK TO WORK, GOTTA FIX THIS SERVER =>.>=

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 11:20, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 11:19, MrNomad wrote:
dont worry, I dont biiiite ;3 jejeDamn, there go my plans for this weekend.

I MEAN SHIT, BACK TO WORK, GOTTA FIX THIS SERVER =>.>=

Jaja, I have that kinda ability to make ppl forget their work =P

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 11:20, beatrixkiddo wrote:

On 2007-10-04 11:12, Remedy wrote:

On 2007-10-04 11:11, MrNomad wrote:
ya but im talking about in AoI, when fTs and every other class gets a huge stat boost =PFOs and FTs are untouched in their stats (according to the pictures thread), so... :|


Fortetecher stats on the right. And no, the boost from 10 to 11 isn't that big.

Off topic, but how is the whip in AoI? What classes get to use it?

[beatrixkiddo]

Think of it like a melee Gi-tech. The PA does blowaway on the 2nd combo though.

And it's Wartecher, Fortetecher, Acrotecher only.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: beatrixkiddo on 2007-10-04 11:29 ]</font>

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-04 11:28, beatrixkiddo wrote:
Think of it like a melee Gi-tech. The PA does blowaway on the 2nd combo though.

And it's Wartecher, Fortetecher, Acrotecher only.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: beatrixkiddo on 2007-10-04 11:29 ]</font>
Ahh, boo to that says my FG, but my WT on the other hand...>>

[CelestialBlade]

The fact that it deals SE is disgustingly awesome, too. Though I forget what level.

Means Wartechers might have a decent SE-spreading weapon now. Bows are okay, but nothing like a Rifle or a Crossbow.

[MrNomad]

Ya, once FGs get lvl 30 xbows, thats it....ST's gonna e-mail everyone saying "TEH PWNZORS HAV ARRIVEEED!!!11111!1" http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Mystil]

Anyway. FTs are gonna be alright.

[Miyuki-chan]

On 2007-10-04 13:40, Mystil wrote:
Anyway. FTs are gonna be alright.



Agreed, just like with any change it's going to take a little getting used to.

Besides, as soon as an FT sees a Diga rock the size of a large house or white's out their screen with 31+ Damubarta, all the concerns will go away and will be replaced by "Ooh! Did everyone see that?!?!" which will be responded to by "How could we NOT see that? You blotted out the sun with your Diga rock/burned my TV's screen out with your Damubarta...".

[MrNomad]

Ya rly, even if fTs do become weaker, which they wont thanks to their pewpy little 31+ spells, they get those new looking kinds that cover our screens like "I AM FT HEAR ME ROARRR" http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[beatrixkiddo]

Actually they made dambarta a lot smaller http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Umberger]

On 2007-10-04 14:10, beatrixkiddo wrote:
Actually they made dambarta a lot smaller http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



I think it's translucent somewhat at level 31 too...Regrants on the other hand...=p

[Niloklives]

On 2007-10-03 17:05, AerisZeal wrote:

On 2007-10-03 11:54, Umberger wrote:

Not to mention that enemies last like what, 10 seconds in a full party? Seriously, the whole DPS crap is so pointless...just use whatever you like to use.



QFT
Finally, someone said it.. so true.



not everyone plays in a full party. in fact I usually play in groups of 2 or 3 at best. things are a bit more drawn out there. you can't just assume everyone is running into a mission like that. for those of us who play in small groups or solo a lot, meta game is more important.

it's not really fair to group everyone together

Also when looking at the forte classes. look at FF who pre AoI had lvl 30 skills, lvl 10 bullets and no techs FG who got lvl 10 skills, lvl 30 bullets and no techs. then FT who got lvl 1 skills lvl 30 bullets and lvl 30 techs. that's right a forte class that got two sets of PAs at max level. even in AoI, a FT gets lvl 10 skills lvl 30 bullets lvl 40 attack techs and lvl 30 support. so of the forte classes, the FT is clearly the most versatile having access to every type of PA in the game. that's hybrid territory they tread in.

The point here being that FTs still have a strong game and are still more versatile than any other forte class, they get fortegunner range and SEs, a selection of melee if they need it, are in second place for support and are the best nukes in the game. why the hell are people griping about them? ATs are good too, but they don't have the range or the SEs that FT has and while they have the best support it's still not enough to make up the differnce in damage. they can do better in melee...that's fine and all but it doesn't give them some amazing advantage that ruins game balance.

AT is another flavor for people to try. "don't like cherry? try blue raspberry" I don't know why people are getting bent out of shape like this, i think the classes have been balanced much better than they are in v1 and AT IMO is a much needed addition.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NIloklives on 2007-10-04 15:05 ]</font>

[Inazuma]

i was worried that AT would be a better type than FT too. but im fine w/ how everything is working out. AT is indeed the games best support char. but FT is still the top for tech damage, and thats the reason im sticking to FT. my lv 40 damumegido does about 1500 damage a hit (w/ lv 31 buffs and psycho wand+2), so its all good. once i max out more techs, im gonna try to compare the tech damage w/ AT and find out exactly how it really compares. dont forget we have higher level bullets as well. and AT cant use the long bow either.

psycho wand is more common now btw. i currently have 3 of em. they are only +2 now but i plan on taking em all to +5. the few lv 40 techs i have seem extremely strong. once i can do a proper tech damage comparison, ill try to remember to post about it here.

[Indica]

On 2007-10-04 14:18, Rashiid wrote:
"SON - for the last time; ACTOTECHER PWNZ DAWG!!"
'iight son you got it you got it'



There isnt a PvP option in the game yet

[Mystil]

On 2007-10-04 14:10, beatrixkiddo wrote:
Actually they made dambarta a lot smaller http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


Dambarta(like all dam spells) is lame anyway. :shrug:

[Cz]

dambarta suck because it level to 30 too quick and it kill enemies too quick...boo boo.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: BunnyGirl on 2007-10-04 22:47 ]</font>

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

I didn't read any of the topic, but no, there's no point.

[Fredrick]

So did it turn out that ATs really do cast faster? If they do, by how much? Any videos?

[EJ]

Don't they have a auto me/quick like how AF have something like a equivalent to a devil battle from pso days.

Also Dambarta is a great tech I still fail to see why people call it a noob tech, because it has great damage and kill the enemy fast? If you use the tech right then it awesome. That like saying diga is crap because it kills too fast and it looks like a hair ball http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

But I think AT is just another alternative if you want to be a melee force like how WT is and AT just bring another option just not as many weapons as WT have.

[Mystil]

On 2007-10-04 22:46, BunnyGirl wrote:
dambarta suck because it level to 30 too quick and it kill enemies too quick...boo boo.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: BunnyGirl on 2007-10-04 22:47 ]</font>


<--has dambarta 24.

Its a crutch and can easily get you in the habit of using it exclusivily. Not a proper way to play the class.

[Niloklives]

the same can be said about ANY good PA

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-10-05 10:43, NIloklives wrote:
the same can be said about ANY good PA



well, to be honest TECHs *are* a total crutch. FTs should use melee. They have access to level 1 skills, as well as spears.

haven't you heard the term "fighting" forces? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Niloklives]

wasn't that a 3D action game on the playstation?

[BigBadWolf]

So after seeing those level 31+ and 41+ techs, and reminded ppl of our level 30 bow skills, have we all come to the conclusion that Fortetecher does indeed still rock in AoI?

[Umberger]

On 2007-10-16 10:55, BigBadWolf wrote:
So after seeing those level 31+ and 41+ techs, and reminded ppl of our level 30 bow skills, have we all come to the conclusion that Fortetecher does indeed still rock in AoI?



I've come to the conclusion that every race/class combo rocks in AoI, and people should just play what they want to play as and use whatever weapons they like. =p

[-Asheth-]

The sad thing is many people want to be the best at something. Have a reason to validate there choices and not be questions on why they did that. Half the time i pay no attention the only thing that strikes me is when i see a Beast FT that doesnt make me boot it just catches my attention i think to myself why and continue playing not my choice its theres.

[Tigerram]

I'm a FT. I'm always going to be a FT. ( One of The few Male Newmans I've seen as FT anyhow.) To think that a FT is worthless...that person is indeed out of their mind.

Yep, it is about looks. But the damage is always going to be big. No matter what. As we get higher through even more level caps, I think all jobs are all going to just be obliterating muthas anyway.

If the opinion is FT's are going to be not worth having...man, either you don't play with them much or at all, or gl telling that to a FT face to face, and see how well supported and healed you get through parties. Anyhow, I'm not ranting, just making a point, if this seems to come out wrong. Many people seem to want to go from FT to AT, but not me. I'm a damage dealer http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[MrNomad]

On 2007-10-22 15:42, Tigerram wrote:
I'm a FT. I'm always going to be a FT. ( One of The few Male Newmans I've seen as FT anyhow.) To think that a FT is worthless...that person is indeed out of their mind.

Yep, it is about looks. But the damage is always going to be big. No matter what. As we get higher through even more level caps, I think all jobs are all going to just be obliterating muthas anyway.

If the opinion is FT's are going to be not worth having...man, either you don't play with them much or at all, or gl telling that to a FT face to face, and see how well supported and healed you get through parties. Anyhow, I'm not ranting, just making a point, if this seems to come out wrong. Many people seem to want to go from FT to AT, but not me. I'm a damage dealer http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

If lvl 40 spells are worth being 2nd best at support and having mediocre stats, then fT is for you http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[SolomonGrundy]

meh, I kinda feel like 1/2 those stats aren't even that bad.

Low ATP? who cares, you are never going to melee. Low ATA? bows and cards make up for it. The kubara ones especially. low DFP? um, force armors have the highest DFP values and the lowest equiping requirements. And the lack of an arm slot is no big loss.

So the basic issue HP. All this noise over HP?

[Spellbinder]

I really don't understand why this has gone on to 17 pages (or 5 from my account settings). But I see it like this:

a.) I think Rods are hot.

b.) I think the level 31+ techs look hot.

c.) I'm having fun.

d.) If an Acrotecher is in the party, I have no problem with letting them cast a buff every 5 minutes instead of me. If there isn't one, I'll do it.

e.) I'm still having fun.

f.) Still.... having fun.


So I think I'll keep playing Fortecher. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Spellbinder on 2007-10-23 10:16 ]</font>

[BigBadWolf]

I think this thread needs to be revived due to the problems FTs are having during the Neudaiz version of the 1Up cup.

If any areas like that become popular in AoI, we'll surely be out of the job X_X.

[CelestialBlade]

On 2007-10-29 05:55, BigBadWolf wrote:
I think this thread needs to be revived due to the problems FTs are having during the Neudaiz version of the 1Up cup.

If any areas like that become popular in AoI, we'll surely be out of the job X_X.



We've had melee-resistant and bullet-resistant enemies forever. Now you finally know how the rest of us feel. You're not "out of a job" just because you don't excel at an area.

[darkante]

Fortechers gets real awesome animation on spells, lol.
Only reason i like them really.
IMO, Magic with nice looks to it >>>>> Magic with high dmg number.
Reason? Look at Razonde at high lv, omg awesome. X)

[-Asheth-]

On 2007-10-29 06:04, Typheros wrote:

On 2007-10-29 05:55, BigBadWolf wrote:
I think this thread needs to be revived due to the problems FTs are having during the Neudaiz version of the 1Up cup.

If any areas like that become popular in AoI, we'll surely be out of the job X_X.



We've had melee-resistant and bullet-resistant enemies forever. Now you finally know how the rest of us feel. You're not "out of a job" just because you don't excel at an area.



There are many Tech-Resistant Monsters also and have been, but the popular missions dont have many of them.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: -Asheth- on 2007-10-29 08:01 ]</font>

[BigBadWolf]

On 2007-10-29 06:04, Typheros wrote:
We've had melee-resistant and bullet-resistant enemies forever. Now you finally know how the rest of us feel. You're not "out of a job" just because you don't excel at an area.


Tech resistant mobs have been around forever, but I don't remember melee damage so high compared to it. My Lv. 30 Foie with 4% fire element on a 9* wand does roughly 800ish damage per hit. On the same mob, I saw a Beast FF come down with Dus Daggas hitting the mob 5-6times scoring as much damage as I was in that one shot.

Maybe FTs won't be out of the job, FT is a cool class, but I can't help but worry we'll be gimped in AoI compared to the other techer jobs that all have better ways of dealing tech resistant mobs and can support as well as we do.

[Soukosa]

There's quite a bit less tech resistant enemies than there is of melee and bullet resistant enemies (bullet especially). Fortetechers have always gotten the better end of the stick with that. With the new enemies, I can only think of 2 enemies that are tech resistant. Yes, 2 enemies. Oh noes, ST hates us FTs because they suck 2 tech resistant enemies in the game. Yeah, one's lightning so Nos Diga will eat it up (with lowish STA at that) and the other's a mini boss before FT orgasm boss boxes. Poor things. Go try playing a gunner where just about anything with a decent amount of HP is ranged resistant or a melee with the plethoria of melee resistant enemies with only one hit point.

Techers get it easy and still get it easy. Yes, I have played an FT, a lv 10x one in fact. I know what its like and still feel that FT has alot of advantages over AT at pure teching which is still very helpful to any party (though if you're worried about that so much, then something's wrong).

[/rant caused by whiny FT players]

[omegapirate2k]

I'm interested in seeing how FT tech damage compares to AT tech damage.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: omegapirate2k on 2007-10-29 15:10 ]</font>