PSU-XBox 360: PSU Economy Speculation - In Danger

[RevolutionXx]

Hello, I've been playing for about 8 months or so (on and off) and the
Phantasy Star Universe economy has greatly changed and my personal speculation is that it
is in danger of collapse.

BOARD GLITCH March - 2007
In March 2007 SEGA fixed a very important board glitch that made it possible to keep the board you
were synthesizing but you still lost the synthesis ingriedients. This is one of the very first
glitches that effected the economy. After removal of this glitch A rank weapons were at an all time
high. This infllation of prices made it very impossible to get even a 7* weapon at cheaper than NPC
prices.

S RANK BOARDS & A RANK SLOTS May - 2007While the community struggled to earn money through the missions Crimson Beast and Lab Recoverey the
mission Mad Beasts S2 was realeased and the beginning of S rank weapons started to arise. A few individual
groups of people used these new equipment items as a way to take full control over the Phantasy Star Universe
economy. A rift occured in the economy upon release of these weapons and these groups used that to their
advantage. While many people who found great rares were attempting to make meseta these groups closed on their plan.
They bought everything in shops that were S rank boards and A rank slots and sold them all for up to 3 Million meseta higher.
Making it nearly impossible for anyone to acquire any of the new equipment without finding it. This made sure
for these groups that only certain people in the community could achieve this equipment. I personally saw Halarods sky rocket from 3-4 Million to
9-10 Million in a matter of weeks.

A prime example of this is the Hard / Power Charge which increased by about 2 Million Meseta in this period.

1UP CUP October, November - 2007
A spark of enlightment shined on the dulling economy when the Famitsu/1UP Cup released.
This Event has made it possible for many gamers to achieve the S ranks they have dreamed about for a long time.
I started playing 2 days into the event starting after quitting for 3 months. I came back with a few B rank rods, 6* armor, and
300k. Today, because of this event, I now have 2 Halarods, Baji-Senba, A rank rods, and some nice decorations.
I have also been able to help out my friends in achieving there S ranks, Just yesterday I bought my friends a 2 Million Meseta
Deva-Zashi (a very good deal i must say) that being her first S rank.
I have speculation that, yes the 1UP cup has helped many people, but if Ambition of the Illuminus does
not bring the missions we have grown to earn money and experience on then this game COULD revert back to its economy that
many people were desperate to change.

MACHINE GUN GLITCH October - 2007
Though many believe the machine gun glitch to be rather harmless it could acctually change the entire face of gameplay and the economy
for ever. If many people don't know the machine gun glitch cannot be fixed as it is a button glitch and has to do with the actual mechanics
of the machine gun and Xbox 360 Controller. Many people have changed to Fortegunners, Fighgunners, and Guntechers. I am not trying to exploit or say these
classes are worse or less of value than the other classes and not ALL people are doing this, but people that are switching to the class from fortefighters and other classes
are doing this to use this glitch.The Problem is that many people will not invite your or remove you if you cannot do this glitch. Therfore many other classes will become very scarce and possibly die out altogether.
The glitch makes it so that you can shoot the machine gun without losing PP (unless going to fast, which will automatically give you a full machine gun anyway) and lets you continue to shoot while you have
any status effect on you and / or are dead. This glitch makes it very possible to complete the bonus mission and get a lot more S rank boards to drop. Once people return to normal lifestyle after this event
many missions will be too easy and make the game completely different of what SEGA intended it to be. More & More people are being "forced" to switch to get into higher level parties
and make money. This can severely alter the entire game. If this continues (as i'm speculating it will) many weapons will continue to decrease in price while machine guns increase in price.
Beam Vulcanics are now selling for 500K with 4 grinds. It also makes it all to easy to level up your photon arts.

I do not want to see this game fail due to the lacking economy (as this is the reason i quit in the first place). I would also like to see people have a little more morales and decide to stay with the class they have chosen and enjoy as opposed to the pressuring economy and players.

RECAP:
THE GOOD
More S ranks
decreasing prices
increasing income
cool novelty items

THE BAD
machine gun glitch
possible economy slump after 1UP cup

THE UGLY
Men's Bikini (it is just WRONG & it doesn't work)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RevolutionXx on 2007-11-03 19:29 ]</font>

[buzyb77]

Ok... Not a Bad Rundown on the Glitches and Rundown of what bad ...including the Banana Hammocks.

But Remember that their are two updates comming

1. Pre PSU:AOI

2.AOI....as any realplayer on Xbox will not be "forced" to get this DLC at some point



Then you got the Moron Factor...How many people are being really Dumb and Shouting about this Glitch/Explloit...


Btw I and my Friend have never booted one because they do or don't do this Glitch...But we have Blist/muted and Bad feedback complete tools

[-Tidus_415-]

On 2007-11-03 19:16, RevolutionXx wrote:
If many people don't know the machine gun glitch cannot be fixed as it is a button glitch and has to do with the actual mechanics
of the machine gun and Xbox 360 Controller.

BS...The Laser Cannon Glitch was a button glitch and it was fixed in AotI for the japanese.

[Wallin]

I'm trying really hard to stay police and impartial as a PC player, but I have to say it's funny to see practically the entire 360 population fall so quickly to temptation after all the crap we get on the PC/PS2 side.

I do feel sorry for all of the honest players who were negatively impacted by the machine gun glitch. Been hearing a lot of pleading to Sega that's fallen on deaf ears. I hope everything works out okay for these people.

[-Tidus_415-]

Oh yea btw the Economy is not "in danger" as you say. You act as if everyone can get S-rank units and 11* weapons as easy as everything else.

[bahk]

On 2007-11-03 19:30, -Tidus_415- wrote:

On 2007-11-03 19:16, RevolutionXx wrote:
If many people don't know the machine gun glitch cannot be fixed as it is a button glitch and has to do with the actual mechanics
of the machine gun and Xbox 360 Controller.

BS...The Laser Cannon Glitch was a button glitch and it was fixed in AotI for the japanese.



I don't know how to do the mechgun one so I can't speak for it, but laser simply took advantage of the goggles resetting the wait time. So obviously all you'd have to do is fix the goggles.

Unless mechgun uses a similar mechanic, it won't be so simple.

[shotsfired]

i play the game for fun, and hope to find S ranks. thats all that matters to me. i have a few good friends that I play with regularly, if we get S ranks great if not oh well. just like REAL economy, it's based on the people who are in it. if you are dumb enough to buy a ridiculously priced wep, then people will continue to price it at that pricepoint. be smart with your money!!! I want the cool weps like the next guy, but if i dont find 'em, I dont get 'em....

[shotsfired]

btw, the mech gun glitch is not that bad, just dont play with anyone who uses it. like I posted previously, play with people you know, and have fun!!!

[Wallin]

On 2007-11-03 19:35, bahk wrote:

On 2007-11-03 19:30, -Tidus_415- wrote:

On 2007-11-03 19:16, RevolutionXx wrote:
If many people don't know the machine gun glitch cannot be fixed as it is a button glitch and has to do with the actual mechanics
of the machine gun and Xbox 360 Controller.

BS...The Laser Cannon Glitch was a button glitch and it was fixed in AotI for the japanese.



I don't know how to do the mechgun one so I can't speak for it, but laser simply took advantage of the goggles resetting the wait time. So obviously all you'd have to do is fix the goggles.

Unless mechgun uses a similar mechanic, it won't be so simple.



From the reports I've seen here and on the PSU forum, apparently just about everyone under the sun knows how to do this - you know it's bad when people can't get any groups because they're ALL booting people who aren't gunners.

This is the post on PSU, which got locked.
http://boards2.sega.com/psu_board/viewtopic.php?t=51849


On 2007-11-03 19:34, -Tidus_415- wrote:
Oh yea btw the Economy is not "in danger" as you say. You act as if everyone can get S-rank units and 11* weapons as easy as everything else.



Taken from that PSU post:
"I have proof of this, it's utterly powerful... I've messed with it on my low level to see what the deal was. You're able to possibly do 30-40 instances of damage a second. With that being said, a level 100 with maxed out bullets can do 200-300 damage an instant, 10,000+ damage a second."


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Wallin on 2007-11-03 19:40 ]</font>

[buzyb77]

We are looking into the glitch and have reproduced it ourselves. There is a upcoming fix to the goggle controls for PSU (probably due to the laser glitch) that will arrive with all of the other major changes to get ready for AOTI. I'm pretty sure this will fix the mech gun glitch.

-ChillAura

A site admin on the PSU bords at sega

[Wallin]

...I hope they're not waiting until AoI or the week before to fix it... I highly doubt they'll do it this weekend as emergency maintenence, that's just more time for people to exploit the system.

[RevolutionXx]

On 2007-11-03 19:34, -Tidus_415- wrote:
Oh yea btw the Economy is not "in danger" as you say. You act as if everyone can get S-rank units and 11* weapons as easy as everything else.


I said that NO one has them and the people who do get bought up by people with more money who are in clans. and thats also why its called a speculation = prediciton.

[Indica]

Im sick and tired of people complaining about the Machine Gun glitch, WGAS!

I dont use this weapon and I think I know 1 person out of everyone I play with uses the maching gun...and I dont she uses this glitch. Even if she did, she only uses it once in a rare while.

[RevolutionXx]

On 2007-11-03 19:51, Indica wrote:
Im sick and tired of people complaining about the Machine Gun glitch, WGAS!

I dont use this weapon and I think I know 1 person out of everyone I play with uses the maching gun...and I dont she uses this glitch. Even if she did, she only uses it once in a rare while.


You'd be surprised

[Wallin]

On 2007-11-03 19:51, Indica wrote:
Even if she did, she only uses it once in a rare while.

"But officer, it was just the one time!" XD

[-Tidus_415-]

On 2007-11-03 19:35, bahk wrote:

On 2007-11-03 19:30, -Tidus_415- wrote:

On 2007-11-03 19:16, RevolutionXx wrote:
If many people don't know the machine gun glitch cannot be fixed as it is a button glitch and has to do with the actual mechanics
of the machine gun and Xbox 360 Controller.

BS...The Laser Cannon Glitch was a button glitch and it was fixed in AotI for the japanese.



I don't know how to do the mechgun one so I can't speak for it, but laser simply took advantage of the goggles resetting the wait time. So obviously all you'd have to do is fix the goggles.

Unless mechgun uses a similar mechanic, it won't be so simple.



It is sort of similar. Instead of goggles its uses 1st person mode.

But I hope the glitch gets fixed. Like the OP said its making the other classes that cant use mechguns useless.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: -Tidus_415- on 2007-11-03 19:56 ]</font>

[omegapirate2k]

The only problems with the economy are assholes who overprice their stuff or just display it. This has always been the case. And with 1-up and rares being so easy to find in the expansion people might start to lower their prices and price 10 and 11 star items realistically.

The new shop function will improve this, although there will still be those idiots charging over npc prices on mats.

[Phoenix_Black]

The 1 Up Cup is bad for the economy.... Too much meseta is being generated. Think of it this way. If The game has an internal bank that supplies money, and plays can draw lots of money from it in short amounts of time via 1up, more money is in circulation. Now, think about this. Where is everyone going to go to get their awesome weapons, armors, and slots? Player Shops. The only way we can practically return money to the "internal bank" is by buying from the NPC shop. The meseta will go down in value, and prices are going to hike up. It's inevitable...

[buzyb77]

On 2007-11-03 19:49, Wallin wrote:
...I hope they're not waiting until AoI or the week before to fix it... I highly doubt they'll do it this weekend as emergency maintenence, that's just more time for people to exploit the system.



um.. um...you have no Clue to the Process do you

1. find and reproduce Glitch
2. figure out how to rewrite the script
3. write code
4 test code
5. Send it to M$ for Certfication (360 only folks)
6. implemnt it



um waillin if its not fixed in about 2 months then do a Chicken little rutine

[Complex_Jao]

wow...you put alot of work into this.Good Job but i have to say i am most worred about the "possible economy slump after 1UP cup"

[bahk]

I need to start paying more attention to derails...



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: bahk on 2007-11-03 20:09 ]</font>

[RevolutionXx]

Thanks.

[Wallin]

On 2007-11-03 20:03, buzyb77 wrote:
um.. um...you have no Clue to the Process do you


Are you trying to imply that they're going to do it fast or slow? -_- It could easily go either way.

[Phoenix_Black]

Meh... Nevermind. He edited his post.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Phoenix_Black on 2007-11-03 20:15 ]</font>

[bahk]

On 2007-11-03 20:14, Phoenix_Black wrote:
Meh... Nevermind. He edited his post.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Phoenix_Black on 2007-11-03 20:15 ]</font>


So much talk about glitches I forgot this wasn't a thread only about glitches hurting the economy.

[PALRAPPYS]

On 2007-11-03 20:05, Complex_Jao wrote:
wow...you put alot of work into this.Good Job but i have to say i am most worred about the "possible economy slump after 1UP cup"



The slump may be for 2 days. Then we get AoI.

AoI is a lot like a permanent 1up cup, so I'm not worried. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

Plus for those without AoI, they'll get the AoI patch; that's good too yes?

[buzyb77]

On 2007-11-03 20:12, Wallin wrote:

On 2007-11-03 20:03, buzyb77 wrote:
um.. um...you have no Clue to the Process do you


Are you trying to imply that they're going to do it fast or slow? -_- It could easily go either way.


think of it this way..your car transmission has a problem but you having never worked on a Car before deside to buy a "Car book" and take it apart yourself....with a pair of vice grips and two poo-flinging monkeys.... if you can rebuild a tansmisson in a weekend with those tools Let me know..


in case you don't get the Long winded story as Slow....

Then

All

things

that

require

programming

is

slow

if

you

include

M$

certfication

process

it

can

be

even

SLOWER

thats

why

I

hope

AOI

has

Passed

Certification

and

Hope

the

Fall

update

for

the

XBOX 360

Dashboard

is

soon

and

does

not

mess

with

AOI

code!!!

[Katryn]

It was partially my idea that this thread be posted. RevolutionXx and I play together a lot and we have been discussing the way the game has been going since the expansion is coming, the 1 Up Cup is running, and the game has been out for just over a year.

I was one of the "originals", I guess. I started roughly two weeks after its release. This is a good game and it is very fun. You can make some awesome friends and the nature of the game is to watch your character grow and expand. Unfortunately, some unbalanced economic and political issues inside the game hinder this. (I am speaking about the 360 version, but some of this is probably very general.)

Revolution has done a good job at examining things pre 1up so I am going to focus on the event and the effect it may have on the upcoming expansion. The event, in and of itself, has been a much needed answer for many of us. As with the real world, Phantasy Star Universe has suffered from what finanical analysts and economists call a "polar divide". With all the new people who come in v.s. old people who are leaving, the distribution of items and money in the game has continued to become more and more disbalanced.

If this were merely on eccentric or cutting edge things, event items etc. perhaps it would be more of an annoyance then a (game-wise, at least) financial crisis. But such has not been the case. Prior to the event you could not even obtain a b-rank headslot, a vital piece of equipment for anyone playing a fortetecher or wartecher, without having well established connections.

The 1up cup has changed this. People now have money and items which, in many cases, they have waited to obtain for months. Is there danger from this influx of spending and trading, and from the weaker members of the community rising up? Yes, absolutely. But I strongly doubt that the conventions of the game are going to be rocked to their core by this event. Those who are lounging on 75 million meseta are still going to be those who have that.

The major threats that I can see are two-fold. First off, how will we survive when this event is over? How will AoI effect us? Will it continue the trend of trying to close the gap or will those who have gained some ground once again fall behind? Second, how many of the things that we have paid for from players in Iup cup will come out in AoI? Will it be those who are waiting be rewarded for their patience or will they have potentially have missed there only chance to get their foot in the door here?

As for the machine gun glitch it is both a tragedy and a burning brand showing the desperation of the general PSU Xbox 360 community. Why else would we allow ourselves to give in to something which, if left unchecked, will have the potential to destroy the entire game? Do ANY of you realize the ramifications of this thing? First off, those who have cheated are being rewarded with beter revenues via items and money since they can do missions faster and complete bonus missions. Second, the entire social and class outlay of the game is being destroyed since, as others have said, this glitch makes ALL non-MSG weilding classes completely useless.

I have always believed that you can learn more about someone's character from a game like this then from any other genre and with that in mind I must say that I am absolutely disgusted with the Xbox 360 communiuty. Does the greed that corrupts so many in the real world truly need to be brought into this, a chance to be anyone we want to be. Do people really need to accumulate more and more STUFF at the expense of others actual playing styles. Pathetic!

Those who use this during 1up I will tolerate. Those who use it after that ... As far as I am concertned ... have completely forgotten the initial purpoose of the game.

At any rate, only time will tellm what is going to happen. And before anyone tries to accuse me of bitterness: I got everything I wanted from the event already. Its for the sake of those who HAven't that I Speak. Good day.

[Jinto117]

On 2007-11-03 19:16, RevolutionXx wrote:


THE UGLY
Men's Bikini (it is just WRONG & it doesn't work)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RevolutionXx on 2007-11-03 19:29 ]</font>


Hey pal! That's your opinion. I happen to look great in my leopard skinned speedo!

[RevolutionXx]

Lol, you've got to be kidding me.

[Turb0]

Meh, I learned the glitch yesterday and it's good and bad. It does do insane damage and really helps especially in the bonus missions. Also, Faster missions=more items and more points for everyone. On the other hand, it does get really old in not too long, for me anyway. I expect they'll patch it so we may as well take advantage of the faster runs and faster bullet leveling now (if you don't get bored that is).

[buzyb77]

On 2007-11-03 20:41, Jinto117 wrote:

On 2007-11-03 19:16, RevolutionXx wrote:


THE UGLY
Men's Bikini (it is just WRONG & it doesn't work)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RevolutionXx on 2007-11-03 19:29 ]</font>


Hey pal! That's your opinion. I happen to look great in my leopard skinned speedo!




um dude your not the Tod and the Tod does not need to wear the Banana Hammock...

and um.....yeah their are men that wear that thing that are as Big As "Peter Griffin" and as hairy as "robin Williams" any ya know what when I was on the Swim team I hated wearing speedos...I often wore a bikershors style...and woul Slide on Swim trunks after I got out of the Water.... as Did most of the Sane guys..

[bahk]

On 2007-11-03 20:52, buzyb77 wrote:

um dude your not the Tod and the Tod does not need to wear the Banana Hammock...

and um.....yeah their are men that wear that thing that are as Big As "Peter Griffin" and as hairy as "robin Williams" any ya know what when I was on the Swim team I hated wearing speedos...I often wore a bikershors style...and woul Slide on Swim trunks after I got out of the Water.... as Did most of the Sane guys..



Why does every post you make seem to turn into a poorly editted autobiography?

[buzyb77]

um Dude thats a Scrubs Refrence...

[Sekani]

I honestly don't know whether to take this gloom and doom seriously or to just holler "cry more", since your perspective relies heavily on two things.

The first is your ability to actually participate in the perpetually overpriced player shop economy, something which I have never been able to do because my limited playtime doesn't give me a chance to earn meseta at a competitive rate. I buy all my synthing materials from friends or NPCs, and trade for big-ticket items with friends as well.

The second thing is your dependence on random groups. I haven't played on Universe 1 in forever, so I still have no fucking clue what this machine gun glitch is.

[MrNomad]

On 2007-11-04 06:13, Sekani wrote:
I honestly don't know whether to take this gloom and doom seriously or to just holler "cry more", since your perspective relies heavily on two things.

The first is your ability to actually participate in the perpetually overpriced player shop economy, something which I have never been able to do because my limited playtime doesn't give me a chance to earn meseta at a competitive rate. I buy all my synthing materials from friends or NPCs, and trade for big-ticket items with friends as well.

The second thing is your dependence on random groups. I haven't played on Universe 1 in forever, so I still have no fucking clue what this machine gun glitch is.

Then GTFO outta PSU n00b!

[Mystil]

Forcing those in poverty is a real life practice. If you wanna survive you gotta play the same deadly cards.