AT vs FT

[SolomonGrundy]

not complaining, just data seeking

Can anyone answer few of these questions:
1. Is rod speed now identical to wand speed?
2. for the dam-series techs, what is the total % damage advantage that a FT has over an AT vs an opposite element enemy.

(I know rods give +20%, and a level 40 tech has a damage bump, and the opposite elemental damage will increase from 31 to 40 as well. I just don't know what the total modifier is.)

Assume the AT has a 10/10 serdote, and the FT has a 4/10 Psychowand.

[Sychosis]

1. No, wand is still faster (and it better be for the damage trade off :/)

As for #2...if someone doesn't answer in the mean time, I'll run through the old formulas and see if they still work (I don't think bullets and techs were affected by the % nerf).

[Pillan]

I know bullets were effected by the percentage nerf and I'm pretty sure techs were as well. Just miltiply the element by .75 for a quick estimate of its effect after the nerf.

[Hrith]

AT = nurse.
FT = nurse.

No difference.

[Sychosis]

On 2007-12-29 13:13, Pillan wrote:
I know bullets were effected by the percentage nerf and I'm pretty sure techs were as well. Just miltiply the element by .75 for a quick estimate of its effect after the nerf.



Does this apply to the innate % on TEHCNICs as well, or just the % bonus on the weapon itself?

[Pillan]

On 2007-12-30 11:43, Sychosis wrote:
Does this apply to the innate % on TEHCNICs as well, or just the % bonus on the weapon itself?


Both. I'm pretty sure it even applies to enemy attack and defense mods.

[SolomonGrundy]

so, does no one have a single dam tech at 40, and a high grind wand and psychowand to do some quick testing?

I'd be willing to settle for a high grind magical wand, and a medium grind halarod, if nothing else is available.

I don't care about nursing, or elemental nerfing, I just need some raw numbers please.

[biggabertha]

On 2007-12-30 11:13, Hrith wrote:
AT = nurse.
FT = nurse.

No difference.



Actual LAUGH OUT LOUD/LOTS OF LAUGHTER

[Shadow_Wing]

Let me see what I can do, I think it's a +20% damage tacked on from the final calculation.

Diga lvl 16 against distova in Plains Overlords S2 no elemental % on wand and rod. Also have serafi senba on and a har / quick EQed. Base TP on Male CAST fT 4 875 (which is about 40 TP less than my lvl 15 AT)

Using Serdote +10 (672 TP) and P. Wand (1076 TP)

650 damage from a serdote +10 (672 TP)
1030 damage from a P. Wand +6 (1076 TP)

Diga lvl 16 On Vahra:
1230 P. Wand 0%
1285 P. Wand 4%
1320 P. Wand 8%

790 Serdote 0%
820 Serdote 4%

My fT isn't capped so I can't really give u an accurate amount of capped vs capped. Nor are any offensive techs capped http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Shadow_Wing on 2007-12-30 19:02 ]</font>

[Pillan]

If you want a simple magnitude comparison, all level 40 techs have an extra 10% element and rods have that 20% power boost. So, without considering the TP advantage and the extra 3% or so power the tech gains, the Fortetecher has a 31% damage advantage, excluding buffs. (Around 25.5% more with their respective buff caps.)

[Reginaldo]

On 2007-12-30 11:13, Hrith wrote:
AT = nurse.
FT = nurse.

No difference.



LMFAO. Quote of the year.

[Sychosis]

On 2007-12-30 19:33, Pillan wrote:
If you want a simple magnitude comparison, all level 40 techs have an extra 10% element and rods have that 20% power boost. So, without considering the TP advantage and the extra 3% or so power the tech gains, the Fortetecher has a 31% damage advantage, excluding buffs. (Around 25.5% more with their respective buff caps.)



Wouldn't that 10% elemental difference also be subject to the % nerf giving it roughly 7-8% more as opposed to a full 10?

And I *would* get on to test but Xbox Live isn't letting me on Live unless I'm on the dashboard :/

[Pillan]

On 2007-12-30 19:44, Sychosis wrote:
Wouldn't that 10% elemental difference also be subject to the % nerf giving it roughly 7-8% more as opposed to a full 10?

And I *would* get on to test but Xbox Live isn't letting me on Live unless I'm on the dashboard :/


Yeah. I took that into account on the calculation. Basically just (1+.75*.62)*1.2/(1+.75*.46).

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2007-12-30 19:33, Pillan wrote:
If you want a simple magnitude comparison, all level 40 techs have an extra 10% element and rods have that 20% power boost. So, without considering the TP advantage and the extra 3% or so power the tech gains, the Fortetecher has a 31% damage advantage, excluding buffs. (Around 25.5% more with their respective buff caps.)



now factor in the higher tp mod of FT and higher tp of a rod...this is why i wanted an actual damage number. from a dam tech preferably.

thanks shadowing for the help so far

[Sexy_Raine]

On 2007-12-31 01:10, SolomonGrundy wrote:

On 2007-12-30 19:33, Pillan wrote:
If you want a simple magnitude comparison, all level 40 techs have an extra 10% element and rods have that 20% power boost. So, without considering the TP advantage and the extra 3% or so power the tech gains, the Fortetecher has a 31% damage advantage, excluding buffs. (Around 25.5% more with their respective buff caps.)



now factor in the higher tp mod of FT and higher tp of a rod...this is why i wanted an actual damage number. from a dam tech preferably.
thanks shadowing for the help so far



STC + PW for me being a FT I do about 1800 damage to most light enemies from my dammegid 39(almost 40)

STC + Serdote 10/10 for , I do about 1100 damage to most light enemies.

Not part of the topic but I'll say it anyway. Even with the speed boost of higher lv'ed techs, AT lv30 still get a faster animation than FT lv40.

[Shadow_Wing]

On 2008-01-01 15:11, Sexy_Raine wrote:
Not part of the topic but I'll say it anyway. Even with the speed boost of higher lv'ed techs, AT lv30 still get a faster animation than FT lv40.

Well dur... lvl 31+ techs in theory cast slower than lvl 21+ techs in addition to the the fact that AT has innate speed casting <<;

[Shiro_Ryuu]

They kind of changed it so that higher level technics casted faster than lower leveled ones when the rod boost came out as well.

[Shadow_Wing]

although some attack TECHNICS will cast slower than before at low levels (PA level 1-10). For example, at levels 1-10 the TECHNIC Foie was adjusted from 0.1 to 0.2 seconds, and at levels 31-40 it was adjusted from 0.4 to 0.3 seconds.


From the update, in theory, higher lvled spells still cast slower than their lower lvled counterparts, it's just the difference between lower and higher tiered spells is smaller than b4. Though I don't have hard evidence nor do I care enough to test it out exactly, but theoretically from the wording higher lvled spells still cast slower than their lower lvled counterparts.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Shadow_Wing on 2008-01-01 21:12 ]</font>

[Bitey]

Why do you need a raw damage comparison? If all you care about are the Dam-techs then no matter what at a FT equipped with a good Rod will greatly out-DPS anything else.

First, the speed difference between any Technic weapon only applies to recovery times after the Technic has been casted. Also, any increase to casting speed will not make a Dam-tech damaging enemies faster. So, considering those two bits of information, why would weapon speeds matter in the case of using a dam-tech?

If speed does not matter for Dam-techs, then all that does matters are TP stat mods, elemental mods, and any other damage boost mods. If a FT equipped with a Rod is the best in all three of those areas, then a FT equipped with a Rod is best for Dam-techs...

Now if you want raw numbers, then I cannot give those to you. I can, however, say that a Rod generally does 200+ more damage with a technic at mid levels than non-rods and as your levels for everything goes up, that damage difference keeps getting higher and higher...

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2008-01-01 23:22, Bitey wrote:
Why do you need a raw damage comparison? If all you care about are the Dam-techs then no matter what at a FT equipped with a good Rod will greatly out-DPS anything else.

First, the speed difference between any Technic weapon only applies to recovery times after the Technic has been casted. Also, any increase to casting speed will not make a Dam-tech damaging enemies faster. So, considering those two bits of information, why would weapon speeds matter in the case of using a dam-tech?

If speed does not matter for Dam-techs, then all that does matters are TP stat mods, elemental mods, and any other damage boost mods. If a FT equipped with a Rod is the best in all three of those areas, then a FT equipped with a Rod is best for Dam-techs...

Now if you want raw numbers, then I cannot give those to you. I can, however, say that a Rod generally does 200+ more damage with a technic at mid levels than non-rods and as your levels for everything goes up, that damage difference keeps getting higher and higher...



I asked about speed as a seperate quesiton. I want the raw numbers so I can compare the damage, naturally. not the DPS - that is an argument that has been done to death. I just want to know. I have a halarod, I guess I can level dum-barta to 40 myself, and test it.

..but if anyone has the info, it sure would save me a lot of time...

[Sychosis]

Didn't Raine already give the numbers though?

[SolomonGrundy]

On 2008-01-02 10:58, Sychosis wrote:
Didn't Raine already give the numbers though?



Doh! yes, she did! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

thank you Raine...not sure how I missed it. Looks like 60%

a quick question for raine - was this an all dark rod, and an all dark wand?