Dazzle DVC 170 TV Tuner issues

[Dopples]

I'm having issues with recording using the S-Video slot on said TV Tuner. These pictures might help...

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o226/Dopples/080107_212427.jpg
This is the TV Tuner I'm using

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o226/Dopples/080107_212633.jpg
This is what I'm using to connect it to the TV (Front)

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o226/Dopples/080107_212649.jpg
Back (Note, the AV plugs on the left are the PS2 cables. If I can get this to work, there'll also be a Wii and second PS2 plugged in)

Now, if I just plug the chords straight in, I get controller lag while streaming the video. If you don't understand what I mean, imagine pressing a button, or moving the joystick, and it doesn't respond for about a second, then it does what you inputted. Obviously, this isn't ideal for action based games (i.e. Kingdom Hearts 2 FM+, Tales of Destiny Remake, etc.).

Basically, this is what I want the TV Tuner to look like...
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o226/Dopples/080107_212751.jpg
When it's working. If you can't see what it is, the Video (Yellow) is still plugged into the TV, while the audio and S-Video chords are in the tuner. This entire thing is plugged into the system switch, which'll allow me to simply press a button to switch which system is played.


Any clue on how I can get this to work?

Edit:Also, sorry about the large image size. Photobucket hates me.

[Getintothegame]

Hey, I have the model below that TV Tuner! Let's see if I can help you any...

Well, S-Video doesn't carry any color information, if I recall correctly. You'll need both the yellow video AND S-Video to make it work. Hm... I know what you mean about the lag. It's not the best card for capturing video games. I use it for PSOW Cam only since you dont' really need to see a true live image.

What I'd do if I were you, is try getting an AV splitter. I imagine you can get them from Radio Shack, basically what you want is something to take the video signal to go to two sources. I'm not sure what this would do to image quality, since I've never personally tried it. It's worth a shot though!

[Dopples]

Well, I know it's possible to do as long as long as the Composite cables have a S-Video slot. Cloud8745's videos are done with chords that are almost exactly like a splitter (Though to be fair, his chords were designed especially for video games.) The problem I figure, is that the splitter is recognizing the fact that both ends of the S-Video cables are plugged in. I think the cause is that the ends of the chords are made of a wide rubber, so it's not recieving the signal.


Of course, that's just speculation. Also, cool, PSOW Cam uses the same TV Tuner brand I do http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Sinue_v2]

Is this is an old problem, or did you just buy the unit? A lot of these kinds of devices have a bit of video lag to them, especially if it does a lot of filter work or encoding on the hardware like it sounds this product does. It may just have not been meant for real-time interactive media, and more for the passive copying of media off of video tape or camcorder onto your PC... and the lag is just the nature of the beast. Kinda like how Sattelite Internet is great for surfing and downloading - but pretty much useless for gaming or video conferencing.

From what I've seen, it doesn't look like the unit has any sort of video pass-through. So does your TV have a video/audio output - or are you only viewing from either the TV or the PC? Are you splitting the signal?

I dunno, but from the way it sounds - the slowdown is in your Dazzle unit. I have the same model of Pelican HD system selector and I didn't notice any video lag from it. However, I would caution against using one of those. I had one destroy a Viewsonic NextVision VGA adapter. It's hard on your TV and any video processessing equipment to just switch out video feeds like that - especially if they are in various different resolutions. I've been running my system selector on my new VGA adapter and haven't had any problems yet - provided I shut down the monitor and the adapter first before switching systems. Which of course, sort of defeats the point of a no-hassle switcher.


Well, S-Video doesn't carry any color information, if I recall correctly. You'll need both the yellow video AND S-Video to make it work.

S-Video does carry color information - but not in the same band that Composite does. S-Video will seperate the chroma from the color, providing a brighter and sharper image. But it's all contained in the same cable. Component works similarly - except that it lumps the Chroma back in with the color - and then seperates the colors into their own seperate channels. (Red, Green, Blue - Y, Pb, Pr)

But your solution is the right one from what I see. It'll still slow down on the PC side, but so long as he's not playing from his PC - a video splitter will get rid of the lag. Get an S-Video splitter if you can find one. It shouldn't affect video quality or image lag in any noticeable way. Not that it really matters on a Composite/S-Video connection. You'll probably also want two audio splitters so that you can have sound on both your PC and TV.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2008-01-08 10:50 ]</font>

[Getintothegame]

On that, I still thought you needed both the AV cable and the S-Video cable to get the signal?

[Dopples]

I just bought this TV Tuner, so that's not an issue. For an example of what it can do on the setup I want, watch this (http://"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODxmvB95wB4"). As you can see, it records just fine for games, and the guy uses the setup where there's the S-Video and Audio cables plugged into the tuner, and the video is on the TV. So, I assume this should work.

[Getintothegame]

Ah! I see! That's a GREAT idea! I'm really interested to see if a splitter would work as well. I'm just not sure if there's enough current to carry the signal through both cables, though.

That's really cool, Dopples.

[Dopples]

Heh, that's what I thought =P the problem that I'm running into though, is that the video isn't coming into the Tuner as well as the TV. The audio comes in to the Dazzle just fine, so I know that it's possible. What I think the problem is, is that the splitter isn't sending out a S-Video signal, even though it's plugged in. Which I'd assume is the fault of the splitter.

[Sinue_v2]

Your link is busted.

In any case, It looks like you're plugging a composite video source into the switcher, and then expecting the switcher to output both S-Video and Composite. It won't do that. That unit doesn't do any video conversion. It's merely a pass-through. It needs to have an S-Video source to output an S-Video signal. If you had a cable that provided both S-video and Component from the same source - then you'd be in buisness. Something like this:

http://images.tigerdirect.ca/skuimages/large/C184-40591-main.jpg

And that HD system selector isn't a splitter, it's the opposite. A splitter has one source and multiple outputs. Your plugging MULTIPLE sources and having them come out of a single output - then using a "switch" to change between the various inputs. It does the same thing with the Ethernet, by the way. It doesn't work as a hub/switch. If you're on the 360 and you want to play PSU on the PS2 - it will disconnect you from live if you switch over the box to PS2 input. Hell, if you had your cable box plugged in to it and you wanted to switch from PSU to watch something while waiting on a party - it would disconnect you.

[Dopples]

On 2008-01-08 20:03, Sinue_v2 wrote:
Your link is busted.

In any case, It looks like you're plugging a composite video source into the switcher, and then expecting the switcher to output both S-Video and Composite. It won't do that. That unit doesn't do any video conversion. It's merely a pass-through. It needs to have an S-Video source to output an S-Video signal. If you had a cable that provided both S-video and Component from the same source - then you'd be in buisness. Something like this:

http://images.tigerdirect.ca/skuimages/large/C184-40591-main.jpg


And that HD system selector isn't a splitter, it's the opposite. A splitter has one source and multiple outputs. Your plugging MULTIPLE sources and having them come out of a single output - then using a "switch" to change between the various inputs. It does the same thing with the Ethernet, by the way. It doesn't work as a hub/switch. If you're on the 360 and you want to play PSU on the PS2 - it will disconnect you from live if you switch over the box to PS2 input. Hell, if you had your cable box plugged in to it and you wanted to switch from PSU to watch something while waiting on a party - it would disconnect you.



Oh...I see. So those chords are what I need? Where can I get them?

[Sinue_v2]

It doesn't have to be that particular brand. You can use either a generic pair, the official Sony cables, or the expensive high-end Monster Cables. The ones I posted are a higher-end brand which has a lot of shielding and what looks like gold plated contacts. However for Composite/S-Video quality video signals, there's really no point. You're probably not going to notice the difference between the high-end and low-end cables.

Check out your local pawn shops or game stores and see if they have one used for a discount price. If not, you can probably get them at Wal-Mart, Radio Shack, Best Buy, Sam Goody, etc.

Also, as far as your video lag - I asked if it the unit was old or new because I wanted to know what the event was which caused the problem. If the unit was old and you had no lag prior to recently, or if the unit was new and you're just now having the problem - then it would narrow down what the possible problems are. Just troubleshooting. Anyhow, as far as the video lag - I still think it sounds like that's from the Dazzle unit itself. From the product website, it lists some of it's features like: "On-board MPEG-1, MPEG-2, MPEG-4, and DivX recording hardware". This encoding process in the unit itself is likely what's causing the lag since it takes time for the unit to process the input and then send it on to the computer. It's USB is compatable to both 1.1 and 2.0, but if your PC is older it might not support USB 2.0, which is much faster than 1.1. Unlikely, considering the minimum system specs for the unit's software, but it's possible. You can tell for sure whether or not your PC is USB 2.0 capable if you open your device manager and expanding the Universal Seriel Bus branch. If it's 2.0, it should have an "Enhanced USB Host Controller" listed.

[Dopples]

Well, my Device manager says that I have a USB 2.0 port, so maybe if I switch to that, I could be able to record using just the Composite cables?

[Sinue_v2]

If you have USB 2.0, you have USB 2.0. I don't think anybody would put a mixture of 1.1 and 2.0 in the same system unless it's a case where you upgraded an older system from 1.1 to 2.0. Switching the ports shouldn't do anything. But still, the problem is probably in the unit itself, and nothing that can be helped. As said, I don't think it was designed for interactive media recording in mind. That slight video lag is acceptable when recording to your PC off a camcorder or from your VCR/DVD player.

I got to looking into it a bit, and another problem is that your PC might just be a bit on the slow side, which could cause the video lag if you're playing on your PC monitor while you're recording. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I would assume your PC is on the slower side, since you're on the PS2 version of PSU instead of the PC version (where you have better video capturing tools like Fraps). It shouldn't be an issue though once you get a setup where you can just set to record on the PC and then go play on your TV.

[Dopples]

Actually, my PC is pretty good, considering Age of Empires III runs pretty well with mid-range graphics. PSU doesn't slow down at all unless there's a lot of PAs flying around, and that's only on the Highest graphics setting. Pretty decent for a laptop I say. But if you want some quick specs off the top of my head...

Intel Pentium Processor 1.86 GHz
1.00 GB of RAM
ATI Mobility Radeon x300

Anyways, I looked at Radioshack's website, and I couldn't find a chord like that. I'll check Fry's next, but I'm not too hopeful.

[Sinue_v2]

Well, actually your processor is a bit on the slow side. It's higher than the minimum requirements, but it's recommended you have a 2.4Ghz. Your RAM meets their recommended specs though. Not sure about your graphics card. Seems rather on the low side, especially since it only has 32/64Mb of onboard memory and then shores up the difference using your main system ram.

If you have a faster PC available to you, you could try hooking it up to that and see if there's a performance boost or not. But again, as I said, if you're going to be playing on the TV and recording on your laptop - then the graphical lag won't make a difference since you're not going to be playing on your laptop monitor anyhow.

[Dopples]

Well, I did some quick recording on Composite only to show how the controller lags, but not the video (For your sanity, I suggest turning down you speakers. Since I'm repeating the same moves over and over again to test the lag, it'll get annoying)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OoOS-PRfio



Is it that noticable, or should I just wait out for that S-Video PS2 chord?

[Sinue_v2]

Youtube says the link contains a malformed video ID.

It may be noticeable in the video's you're taking now, because your reaction to on screen action is taking into account the video lag. However once you're playing and viewing on your normal TV which has no lag, you'll no longer have to adjust your playstyle - and the video will transfer seamlessly over to the PC, even if the PC is recording your actions one step behind what's actually going on.

If you're not concerned with S-Video quality (and it is a noticeable boost over composite) and want something in lue of your new S-Video cables for the PS2, you can get a splitter to run the signal from the back of your system selector to both your TV and the Dazzle unit. Since you're on a laptop that's likely sitting next to you, the sound might not be as much of an issue - but for good measure you might just want to pick up three of them. They're all the same thing for both audio and video. They look like a normal composite (RCA) plug with two wires sticking out of the top that end in two more Composite plugs. Though you'll have to map out how it's going to connect so you know what type to get.

For example, since you're plugging it in to your HD system selector - you'll want an RCA Splitter with a single male end which splits off to two female ends. Your TV and Dazzle both have female inputs, so standard RCA (Composite) cable with two male ends will work just fine. You already have one, so you'll need to pick up a spare to connect the other input. I always tend to have several of these laying around the house from miscelanious devices, so if you look around you might be able to find an extra one. In a pinch, you can just switch your audio to Mono, and then take one of your Red or White audio cables and use that as a spare video cable. It's all the same thing.

There's a little tip for later too, if you move up to HD - in a pinch, you can use composite cables in lue of Component cables. Connect the Y, Pb, Pr inputs to the Red, White, Yellow (you'll have to find separate cables for the audio) composite cables. Since composite cables lack the shielding and quality that most component cables have - your video will suffer some - but it's a bandaid solution and will work for the short term. I had to do this when I ordered my HD Reciever from Comcast and they forgot to give me component cables to hook it up with, and had to wait three days for the next available delivery.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2008-01-10 10:06 ]</font>

[Dopples]

Oh, my bad about that link. Here's an updated one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dja2fmbm2b0p


Anyways, I think I'm gonna get that S-Video chord, though I don't know what I'll do for my Wii, or when I get one, my 360. I'm guessing each have their own seperate chords?

[Sinue_v2]

Yeah, they all have their own separate proprietary cords. You can buy a 3-in-1 I'd assume, but that sort of negates the purpose of having a system selector since you'd have to unplug it and plug it into a different console each time you wanted to switch systems. Though for the 360, if you have an old PC monitor sitting around somewhere I'd really recommend checking out the VGA cables for it. The 360 is just MADE for High Definition and even if it's a small screen, I think it's well worth the investment. Though you won't be able to record with it since I don't think your Dazzle unit has a VGA input, nor would you be able to play it on your TV since even if you got a VGA splitter - they don't make VGA to S-Video/Composite converters.

It's just a great and economical way to get HD out of your consoles without having to buy a HDTV.

[Dopples]

Yeah, I guess so. Oh well, I'll just get that one chord then.