Hitting your children

[BahnKnakyu]

The hitting women topic actually brought me to another issue I've always wanted to talk about.

Is it right for parents to hit kids as a form of discipline?

I participated in conversations with parents - the ones I've talked to are from the baby boomer generation who feel that it's their given right to discipline and raise the child the way they want to, and that GIVIN' DAT KID A COUPLE LICKIN' s is an effective way to teach kids what's right or wrong.

Now the part that I find odd is this: some of the people I've spoke with that said this are also the ones that believe that stuff like violence overall is a wrong thing to do, and the portrayal of violence and TV is one of the worst things about the media today and OMG PLZ LET ME CONTROL WHAT MY KIDS CAN OR CAN'T SEE.

Maybe I'm just connecting two completely unrelated cans of worms together to make a 1 gallon jar of worms, but I find this rather hypocritical of parents to do. First and foremost, I am against corporal punishment for children. Smacking kids in the rear with a paddle (i.e. the good ol' private school treatment) was never my idea of proper discpline. Talking, counseling, offering alternatives, trying to find out the source of the kid's behavior imo are the most ideal ways of addressing problem children.

Some may say that they use corporal punishment as a last means of discipline to get their children to quit the misbehavior, but at the same time I think that if the "previous steps" they are using before they go for "The Final Solution" is not effective, then it's probably a good idea to find new ways to address it without having to smack their kids.

I honestly don't think it teaches the child much. You instill fear into the child, yes, and maybe for a short or long period it may discourage their behavior, but think of it this way: You are resorting to violence to solve a problem that can probably be solved through other, more peaceful means. Additionally, it may cause the kid to misbehave even more because you're pissing them off as much as they are pissing *you* off. Perhaps it will instill the notion in the kid that if someone doesn't listen to you or does what you want, smacking them will solve the problem for you. I think this is part (and definitely not the only reason) why kids turn into bullies.

And yes, I was smacked as a kid for misbehaving. Did it help? Not really. Did it make me more rebellious? You bet. Did it turn me into a bully? No, but I think it's partially because being smacked by my parents *taught* me that using violence as a solution was wrong - maybe I'm lucky I didn't turn into a school bully, who knows. But I always, always had this firm belief that violence isn't the proper answer for disciplining your kids, especially something as important as child misbehavior.

Maybe I'm thinking into this too much - what do you all think?

[Sekani]

I generally don't try to pass off personal experience as law, but I have a very hard time believing that the following statements are not universally true:

Kids who are spanked are 100% of the time more well behaved than those who aren't.

Kids who are spanked when they're younger turn out to be more respectable and well-mannered teenagers.

The teenagers who go on to do crazy things like shoot up schools were never spanked when they were younger.



Also, don't try to confuse physical discipline with child abuse. Any sane person should be able to tell the difference.

[MetaZedlen]

OP, you are making it seem like all of these kids are so very intelligent at that young age, when they are NOT, so they don't know what precisely is going on, except for the fact that "if I do this again, I am going to get spanked."

My parents did this to me, and to tell you the truth, it worked out very well, because I was at a very young age to where I didn't know that getting spanked was such an evil thing, and by the way, I see it as one of the best ways to discipline your kids, but at an early age, so it doesn't cause any serious damage to them. I know this because my mom told me about a couple things I used to do when I was at that toddler age, and after getting a good ass-whipping, I didn't do it again, because I knew that if I did it again, then I would get my ass beat, which was very painful...

There is a significant difference between violence against your kids and strict discipline.

[Aisha379]

Also, don't try to confuse physical discipline with child abuse. Any sane person should be able to tell the difference.

As long as this is kept in mind (IE: We do not punch our kids in the face or sling them against fricking walls) then I believe spanking is okay.


Can't say I'm a fan of kids getting slapped in the face, I think thats demeaning and more emotionally hurtful than anything (very nearly had it done to me before when I was a little younger).


The important thing to remember is that you don't just spank alone, my parents always told me exactly what it was I done wrong PRIOR to being spanked, and I think that helps a lot. It never made me rebellious. Made me mad at them for a little while, but I usually got over it.

Humorously I was discussing this on another forum before more than a year ago, two of us believed spanking was fine when done correctly, and two did not. Ironically enough, the two of us who did were spanked ourselves, and have never been in trouble with the law or anything. The two against spanking had never been spanked in their lives, and both were drug addicts with some pretty bad behavioral problems (both on and off said forum).

I'm not implying this is the norm, of course, but its an intriguing thought nonetheless.

[Schubalts]

One round(OK, maybe 5 or 6) with a wooden spoon or a belt and you know what you should not do.

[Night_Raid]

Just to start off, when I was a kid. Doing wrong meant getting your ass kicked. So there was no other choice but to act right, less you enjoyed pain. And to this day, I may not be the most polite guy on the face of the earth, but I know damn well what to do and what not to.

Okay, I know it's not within the rules to denounce the validity of someone's rant. But there's no way in hell a child has the intelligence to understand complex physiological issues. If a child misbehaves and all their parents do is talk to them. They're going to think "Well, that wasn't so bad. If I do this again all he's going to do is talk to me" At such an early age, a child needs the fear of god struck into them. Kids might not be mature or intelligent enough to understand why they act the way they do. But I'll tell you now, pain is a language universal on it's own. Even the dumbest of animals can put two and two together "If I piss in the house, that equals pain" Same goes for children "If I punch my sister in the hooters, then that equals ass whooping" While I'm not denouncing talking with your child, It's still necessary to cement "Doing this is bad" in their brains up until the age where they're mature enough to understand why doing so was bad.

[Ranmaru]

Well, I wouldn't really want to hit my kids, because my mother hitting me would only cause me to get two to three seconds of "OMFG U BICH U HIT ME WAT AM I TO DO" in that frame, I would do something crazy and stupid.

Anyways, I wouldn't want to get that, but when their younger, a spanking may be ok if only neccesary. Everytime I was it, was not neccesary. -_- *shows up from school and sees mom looking at a paper with a 40% on it, gets hit on mouth next second*

I would rather only use yelling and strictness to discpline my kids, you know?

Night Raid, you are right, if one of my kids hit their sister, that would grant them a opening of a can of ass whopping. Definetly if they did something wrong when they are young, maybe... (dunno about breaking a vase, that would be an accident, and I wouldn't have expensive stuff that would be broken lol)

But when they are older, I would not. ^^

[Blitzkommando]

Small children don't know the art of diplomacy. Nor should they at 4 years old. What they do understand though is that if you tell them no followed by a spanking they associate what they did with pain and won't do it again.

My parents would tell me what I did wrong then spank me and go over again what I did wrong. It didn't happen often but when it did it worked and I never did it again.

[Xaeris]

Spanking is a form of negative punishment. It suppresses the behavior you're disapproving of (assuming that junior is making the connection between getting spanked and lighting the curtains on fire), but doesn't fill the void with anything. So while junior may know not to light the curtains on fire anymore, he may just light the carpet instead.

Ideally, you want your rugrat to engage in productive, or at least untroublesome, behavior, so reinforcing those occurrences serves to overwrite bad behavior. Kids are stupid, but they can understand that good behavior supplemented with rewards is a more worthwhile expenditure of their time than being a hellion in training.

Realistically? Well, shoot, there's nothing keeping you from using both methods of behavior molding. Spanking is laughably ineffective by itself, but it makes a good supplement. Personally, I feel there are more inventive forms of punishment that relieve you of any need to lay a hand on your kid, but that's just me.

[Night_Raid]

In response to Xaeris: Well, of course getting your child to engage in productive activities will stave off any negative behavior. But what happens when Little Jhonny Hellraiser decides to try and play with fire for no apparent reason (And don't tell me that'll never happen, we're talking about kids here) and burns a hole in the carpet? Now, what do you do to correct this? Your method only works on one half of the spectrum and doesn't account for correcting negative behavior. Sure, most of the time a child who's given productive activities will stay on the right track, but curiosity is a bitch. And kids are the epitome of curiosity. Hell, the only thing separating them from cats is walking on all fours. So, while your method is a preventative measure, spanking still remains a corrective solution to negative behavior.

[Xaeris]

Six measly lines and you couldn't be bothered to read the entire thing?

[Night_Raid]

Well, you say that there's nothing to stop someone from using both, but you believe there are alternative forms of punishment. While I agree that giving your child productive things to do is good for preventing problems to begin with seeing as how it "Overwrites negative behavior" but it doesn't rule out the possibility of misbehavior, it simply makes it less likely. My point was that spanking is a reliable and universal corrector in a worse case scenario.

[Magus_84]

Well, you say that there's nothing to stop someone from using both, but you believe there are alternative forms of punishment. While I agree that giving your child productive things to do is good for preventing problems to begin with seeing as how it "Overwrites negative behavior" but it doesn't rule out the possibility of misbehavior, it simply makes it less likely. My point was that spanking is a reliable an universal corrector.

You're not getting the point, I don't think. You seem to be associating "give them productive things to do" with "try to distract them and keep them out of trouble".

That's not the point he's trying to make.

Let's say Johnny Hellraiser lights the carpet on fire. You spank him, without going over what he did wrong or why what he did wrong. Being a young kid, he doesn't learn the reasoning behind not lighting things on fire. He just learns that "spanking is bad", and will attempt to avoid it. Then you end up having to discipline him every time, because you've set it up so that the only thing he responds to is pain.

Contrast this with little Susie Hellbringer. She lights the curtains on fire. You put them out, approach her, explain what she did wrong and why what she did was wrong. You're talking to a kid, so presumably you'd know your kid well enough to explain it in terms they understand. Susie learns that lighting the curtains on fire is bad because it could spread and end up burning down your house, or something similar.

You provide context for why what she did was wrong. Then, if need be, you spank her so that she learns that from now on, when she does something she knows is wrong (she knows because you explained it to her), she gets punished with a spanking. You place the burden on her to think about her actions and not do what's wrong, but you supplement it with punishment when she does do something wrong willfully.

Second half of this is, though, that you need to reward her when she does right. People in general will tend to work harder for a reward than they will in fear of a punishment. The most important thing is consistency. Set up a framework, and stick to it. When they do this wrong, they get this punishment. When they do this right, they get this reward. Keep the rewards away from stuff like candy or something. Go for praise, hugs, etc.

When you do end up punishing, it helps to link the punishments to general principles that are easy to understand, such as "don't burn things" or "don't do things that could hurt people", or stuff like that.

For the record, I was spanked very few times as a kid. And when I was, it was after a warning, in which I got the whole "this is why what you did was wrong". The spankings came after, along with a reward for not doing whatever it was I did.

There are far more creative and useful punishments than spanking, though. It's the sign of a lazy, inept or willfully ignorant parent when the only method they rely on is physical discipline.

[Xaeris]

When I say more inventive methods, I mean more inventive methods of negative punishment to use in conjunction with positive reinforcement. Pain, while unpleasant, is a fleeting sensation and eventually, some kids are likely to figure out "hey, this doesn't actually hurt that much," and decide that it's worth it for whatever shenanigans they want to engage in.

The key to punishment is duration. Something moderately unpleasant over the course of a couple minutes is easy to shake off. Something mildly unpleasant over the course of two hours, not so much. My own mother made me stand in the corner (stand, not sit), facing the corner, for an hour, two, if I did something especially stupid. It's hard on a six year old's legs, but more than that, that's 1-2 hours of his waking day (which is short enough as it is when you're 6) when you're 6) shot, being horrifically bored. That boredom makes a point far better than two minutes of a stinging sensation.

[Night_Raid]

It's my fault that I worded it pretty poorly, so it's easy to see how I came off, heheh.

"Contrast this with little Susie Hellbringer. She lights the curtains on fire. You put them out, approach her, explain what she did wrong and why what she did was wrong. You're talking to a kid, so presumably you'd know your kid well enough to explain it in terms they understand. Susie learns that lighting the curtains on fire is bad because it could spread and end up burning down your house, or something similar."

I neglected to pretty much sum this up within my last post. Of course you'll have to let a child know that what they did was wrong. However, in my opinion punishment is solid. What I'm getting at is a combination of the two, attempting to make them realize what they've done is bad, and a punishment as a deterant. But then again, psychology isn't that black and white so there are variables. But overall I agree with most of the points.

Giving them productive activities
Explaining why doing so is bad

And rewarding for good behavior never hurts either. However I just wanted to reinforce the use of spanking, but only in combination with letting them know why they shouldn't.

EDIT: NOTE:This was posted during the same time Xaeris was writing as well.
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Well, I have to say. An hour of standing in the same place would be a major bitch to sit...er, stand through. Point taken

[BahnKnakyu]

See Xaeris' and Magus_84's description - they expressed it far more eloquently than I did.

There are far more creative and useful punishments than spanking, though. It's the sign of a lazy, inept or willfully ignorant parent when the only method they rely on is physical discipline.

This is what I meant. There are other and far more better ways to discipline your children without having to resort to a slap. That may have worked in the good old days, but that type of treatment shouldn't work now, in a day where humans claim to be "better" than that.

Maybe I'm just being too idealistic here. When I was slapped as a kid for doing something wrong, I wasn't told why it was wrong nor was I given warning, it was often one of the first or second forms of punishment given to me, and if I asked why the thing I did was wrong, I was often given the whole "COS I SAID SO AND UR TOO YOUNG TO KNOW WHY" line.

And again, I still have an issue with making kids FEAR pain as a means of deterring their behavior. It works, I suppose, but there are other ways that can be equally as effective - taking away a posession they enjoy using, denying them certain rights, and heck, something as even as passive as making them stand in a corner IMO works.

Different strokes for different folks I suppose.

[ABDUR101]

I can recall afew occassions when my ass got cranked, spanked or shaken for doing something wrong or stupid. Obviously there were others; but the ones that I recall getting it were warranted, I was just being out of line and had my own kid did it; I'd of smacked them too.

All of my siblings were raised the same way; and it was all from how my mom was raised by her grand mother(our great grandmother, who we had the priveledge of knowing). It was along the "Spare the rod, spoil the child" mentallity, and I for one am very glad I was given the licks I was.

My mom would give me an ass beating for things I did wrong or out of line, my dad would give me an ass beating for things I did VERY wrong or out of stupidity.(I.e. fucking around until something got broke). Both were effective in teaching me how to act and what is and isn't acceptable.

Someone telling you "Hey, we don't do that" only works some of the time, and I got pulled to the side and had plenty of verbal warnings for things; it wasn't an immediate ass-kicking for everything I did wrong. If I was out of line, I got my share of warnings and if I kept going, BAM right in the kisser!

Having my ass beat was a good thing; it comes down to who's dealing out the ass-beatings and if it's justified. I was always told WHY I got my ass beat, and then it helped me say "ok, I can see what I did wrong and why I got my ass beat". In the end, I beat myself up more than any ass-beatings my parents gave out; because of guilt and regret for doing whatever it was in the first place.

[washuguy]

Theres a right way and a wrong way to hit children in my opinion. Yes they should be beat if they do something that calls for a beating. What that something is is up to you... BUT: Never hit the child just cause you're angry with them. You hit them in the right frame of mind. You should be thinking: "Ok they did something wrong, I'm going to punish them for it." After you DESTROY THEM AND DRAG THEM TO THE DEPTHS... I mean, spank the little bundles of joy (Almost lost it...) , let them know why you did it, and that thing they did was wrong. If you do it right, the next time they do something bad you might not even have to beat them anymore. One of my friends only had to spank his kids a couple times and they got the message. He just needed to shoot them 1 look and they knew to stop. Oh, and none of that slap on the hand stuff, thats childs play, and they wont give a damn...

[washuguy]

I can recall afew occassions when my ass got cranked, spanked or shaken for doing something wrong or stupid. Obviously there were others; but the ones that I recall getting it were warranted, I was just being out of line and had my own kid did it; I'd of smacked them too.

All of my siblings were raised the same way; and it was all from how my mom was raised by her grand mother(our great grandmother, who we had the priveledge of knowing). It was along the "Spare the rod, spoil the child" mentallity, and I for one am very glad I was given the licks I was.

My mom would give me an ass beating for things I did wrong or out of line, my dad would give me an ass beating for things I did VERY wrong or out of stupidity.(I.e. fucking around until something got broke). Both were effective in teaching me how to act and what is and isn't acceptable.

Someone telling you "Hey, we don't do that" only works some of the time, and I got pulled to the side and had plenty of verbal warnings for things; it wasn't an immediate ass-kicking for everything I did wrong. If I was out of line, I got my share of warnings and if I kept going, BAM right in the kisser!

Having my ass beat was a good thing; it comes down to who's dealing out the ass-beatings and if it's justified. I was always told WHY I got my ass beat, and then it helped me say "ok, I can see what I did wrong and why I got my ass beat". In the end, I beat myself up more than any ass-beatings my parents gave out; because of guilt and regret for doing whatever it was in the first place.
I remember a long time ago I was bitchin for a box of cereal... I think lucky charms my mom beat my ass. I thank her for it cause i'd probably be spoiled and unappreciative.

[BlaizeYES]

i'm not going to really voice my opinion long and hard on this, but i was hit as a kid and i still got into alot of trouble. hitting did nothing. i also had a mean streak of getting into alot of fights when i was a kid and being a shithead. maybe its related, hmmm? i actually had this same conversation about how to raise kids on an airplane with some random lady yesterday, and i dont want to repeat myself. but she agreed after a half hour of debating, and that was good enough for me. the OP started talking about about "fear"... its pathetic to have someone NOT do something out of FEAR. and theres nothing i find more pathetic than people that think "fear" constitutes "respect," with anyone, not just parents. whats even funnier when you see some guy that is like 6'10 and is like 350, and then you'll see people around him that are kissing his ass... because they're AFRAID of getting their ass kicked, and others around him will just agree with everything he says, too, and think hes cool if he talks to them... because they think that "fear" of getting their ass kicked makes them think that guy is "cool." think of it the way that guys will treat hot girls differently, and think "hot girls" that acknowledge their presence as a reason to think that hot girl is "cool." i treat people that people are "afraid" of like everyone else... i rid myself of any ass kissers. i'm not going to get into it, i've been drinking... this is my last day of no work until i'm back to the grind. DAMNIT

what is it that you want? i want my foundation to be the same color as my skin


GOODNIGHT

[BlaizeYES]

And again, I still have an issue with making kids FEAR pain as a means of deterring their behavior. It works, I suppose, but there are other ways that can be equally as effective - taking away a posession they enjoy using, denying them certain rights, and heck, something as even as passive as making them stand in a corner IMO works.

Different strokes for different folks I suppose.


i just read this post, and what you said is right. you'd be surprised how much you can "beat" a kid psychologically at 8 years old

[Seority]

I knew the difference between "spanking to learn" and "spanking because dad is angry" when I was a child.
When I did something, and my dad told me it was wrong to do and not to do it again, yet I did do it again, then got spanked, I stopped. When my dad came home yelling at my mother and throwing lamps at me, I know I didn't do anything wrong. It was him being upset.
I got spanked, and I was very disciplined, my kid sister wasn't and she throws tantrums when she's told to walk the dogs around the block as if getting off her butt to do somthing for 10 minuites will kill her. She gets away with it too. That's why she's almost 12 and still whining and crying about dumb things. I learned at age 8, crying would get me nowhere, so I didn't.

I'll spank my kids when they are little, and once they learn responsibilty, I'll teach them that way. If they continue to act 8 when they are 12, I WILL spank them like 8 year olds are. How I was raised, and that's how I will raise them.

[Broodstar1337]

Anyone who says spanking is a bad form of punishment is not a parent.

[Abashi76]

I think its ok for mothers to spank kids, but not fathers. The only exception would be if the kid (son) did something really horrible, like hit a girl or something.


I knew the difference between "spanking to learn" and "spanking because dad is angry" when I was a child.
When I did something, and my dad told me it was wrong to do and not to do it again, yet I did do it again, then got spanked, I stopped. When my dad came home yelling at my mother and throwing lamps at me, I know I didn't do anything wrong. It was him being upset.
I got spanked, and I was very disciplined, my kid sister wasn't and she throws tantrums when she's told to walk the dogs around the block as if getting off her butt to do somthing for 10 minuites will kill her. She gets away with it too. That's why she's almost 12 and still whining and crying about dumb things. I learned at age 8, crying would get me nowhere, so I didn't.



No wonder you think its ok for men to hit women. Your father slapped you around all the time, and your mother probably hasn't spanked you once. Thats how most families in the US are, unfortunately. Why does the father have to always be the disciplinary figure?

This is why virtually everyone in America thinks its so kool and sexy for men to slap other people around, especially against women/girls.

[Tessu]

Growing up, I was never spanked or beaten. However, there were times I wish I was.
Instead of any sort of physical abuse, I got MUCH emotional abuse for doing something wrong. I was yelled at to no end.
If I had to pick, I'd definitely choose getting spanked over getting screamed at. I grew up as a REALLY timid kid (I'm still pretty timid ;\).

As far as other situations go, I would rather teach the kid by just holding them down and speaking to them rationally. I'm sure parents aren't going to think that'll work when their kid is screaming or freaking out, but they can't do that forever, right? Realistically I know this might not work, so I pass spanking as 'okay'. Just make sure your kid knows why he or she is getting hit and what they can do to stop.

Taking privileges away can also be an effective method, as far as I'm concerned. That was my other main form of punishment, and for me it worked wonders. And my sister.

[Anduril]

I was spanked like 5 times in total as a kid and I learned my lesson quick, on the other hand my sister was spanked more often, but never seemed to get the point, even with the spanking only coming after the repeated explanations as to why what she was doing was wrong. Spanking as a form of discipline works, but you also have to take into account the personality of the individual child. Some children are just more predispositioned to act out than others and some children have an easier time understanding the associations between doing something wrong and getting punished, and because of this certain children need to be dealt with on a different level. My Grandmother had been raising children from before she had her own and she brought years of knowledge into trying to raise us right trough different forms of authoritative parenting, giving praise and reward for jobs well done, and giving reasoning, taking away things (which only works well when a child has a good grasp of object permanence) and spankings when there was acting out. It is really all about balancing the rewards/punishment system.

[Neith]

I honestly don't think it teaches the child much. You instill fear into the child, yes, and maybe for a short or long period it may discourage their behavior, but think of it this way: You are resorting to violence to solve a problem that can probably be solved through other, more peaceful means.


It really depends on the parents/child. Some children won't learn from being smacked, and yeah, it'll make some children get worse. Likewise though, if you sit with some children and talk it over, it won't always work. In fact, I'd even say some kids are conscious of what they can get away with, and would sit there and act apologetic, only to run off and disregard everything you just tried to tell them.

I was smacked as a child, and you're damn right it worked. Yes, it's a bit cruel, but the pain of getting hit as a child is the deterrent some kids need to get the message.

Put it this way, I've seen loads of irritating kids who live near me, and I've seen how their parents handle disobedience. 'Oh, stop that, no TV for you tonight'. A lot of parents kinda annoy me because I know that if I'd have done something bad, and got 'punished' with no TV for a night, I'd just go to my room and do something else instead. I know a few times my parents would take things away from me, and it'd just annoy me so I'd find something else.

No TV -> Turns on console -> No console -> Turns on music -> no Music -> I'd have gotten some toy cars out -> No toys -> I'd get some paper and draw. Talking it over with me was ok for light offences, but for more serious stuff, I generally would get wound up (and consequently wind my parents up) until I was smacked. After that I'd calm down, almost guaranteed.

So, my opinion is that the punishment administered should depend on the child/parents/severity of offence. I don't think a blanket punishment works, and I don't think non-violent measures always work- but I will admit in some cases it's all you need.

[ABDUR101]

I knew the difference between "spanking to learn" and "spanking because dad is angry" when I was a child.
When I did something, and my dad told me it was wrong to do and not to do it again, yet I did do it again, then got spanked, I stopped. When my dad came home yelling at my mother and throwing lamps at me, I know I didn't do anything wrong. It was him being upset.
I got spanked, and I was very disciplined, my kid sister wasn't and she throws tantrums when she's told to walk the dogs around the block as if getting off her butt to do somthing for 10 minuites will kill her. She gets away with it too. That's why she's almost 12 and still whining and crying about dumb things. I learned at age 8, crying would get me nowhere, so I didn't.

I'll spank my kids when they are little, and once they learn responsibilty, I'll teach them that way. If they continue to act 8 when they are 12, I WILL spank them like 8 year olds are. How I was raised, and that's how I will raise them.

I'm with you on that. My dad has been known for his temper; growing up he'd flip out, turn over tables(the kitchen table with everything on it, a coffee table with large glass centers, etc). I knew when he was just being a prick and being a dickhead. I've gotten my ass beat when he was upset, but it wasn't BECAUSE he was upset that he'd hit me; if I did something that was wrong during his times of being a prick; I'd get it many times worse than normal.

It's like this, I've never once been in a store and asked for something and got backhanded for it. I've seen kids in stores merely ask for something and their parents will just all of a sudden explode "God damnit I said no! You're not getting ANYTHING! NOTHING! STOP ASKING OR I'M GOING TO BEAT YOUR ASS INFRONT OF EVERYONE!". This is not adult behavior; the adult merely has to say "No, I already told you we can't." and if the child keeps instigating; do what my mother did "If you ask one more time, when we get to the car I'm going to beat your ass in the parking lot infront of everyone." The humility of having my ass beat infront of everyone was a deterrent.

My nephews have acted out growing up; and I've helped raise all of my neices and nephews. One time we were setting down with my youngest sister(9 years my senior) and her three kids. One of the twins took all the skin off his half a chicken breast, ate it, then licked all over his chicken breast and said "ok, I'm done. I'm gonna go throw this away." I immediately said "No, you're not throwing that away. I don't know who GAVE you that entire half of a chicken breast, but they should'nt have. You can take it home and heat it up later."

And he began to argue "I won't eat it anyway, I'll just throw it away when I get home." So I explained that there are other people who would have liked to have had that to eat later, but since he decided to lick all over it no one else would want it. He merely laughed at me and started giggling. This is when I got angry, a fucking 10 year old is laughing at me; and my mother and his mother are setting there telling me to leave him alone. I told them both to fuck off; that MY money paid for as much as the dinner we were having as anyone else's; and I'm sure as fuck not having a 10 year old laugh in my face and not have the only other two 'adults' use common sense and back me up on this issue of food being wasted.(I was raised, by my mother no less; to waste not want not and to always be thankful for what we have instead of what we don't).

I got up from the table, and I told everyone to stop wondering why I never sit down at the dinner table to eat with everyone else. If I'm going to have that kind of stupid shit happening and me be made out to be the bad guy, then fuck it, I'd rather eat alone somewhere else.

It was a very big fight which I did'nt bother typing the whole thing out, but basically during the meal I was getting told to shut the hell up, getting dirty looks from mom and being told to shut up, my sister telling me to goto hell, etc. None of that bothered me, it was the mere fact that I was right that the kid should'nt be wasting that much food when there are plenty of other people in the house that would have eaten that peice of shit, had he not licked all over it and discarded it.

Had that been my kid, laughing and giggling at someone who was trying to make an attempt to be nice and explain why we don't waste food, I'd of jumped across the table and had them swallow some teeth. Again, I'd of had the same thing done to me, by my mother no less; because thats how we were all raised.

But, thats ok; because I made it clear to everyone that I'd start being a major dick when it came to things like that; and I've cleared things up with my nephews nicely a year or two ago. My brother and I had enough of their "We're better than you because mom and nanny are on our side" bullshit, we put it straight to our mother and theirs(and them, they were all present) that we were going to start dishing out what WE got when we were kids and acted like pricks to our seniors; verbal warnings, two at most, followed by swift backhands if the shit continued or persisted.

Since that 'talk'(though it wasn't a 'talk', it was a 'this is how its going to be, if you don't like it, don't come around'), things have been 100% better. My nephews have their moments of acting out and saying some really fucked up things, and I take ahold of them, get in their face and say "Look, I know you're trying to be a wise-ass, and I've told you afew times to chill out and knock it off; last warning. Anymore and I'm going to smash you."

Guess what? The shit stops when I issue that warning. Wanna know why? Because I've backhanded each of them afew times because they did'nt think I'd do it.

Mean what you say, say what you mean; kids are the ultimate bullshit readers. You can give warnings all you want, but you take that first step into a solid backhand and make it a reality and you have kids who will start listening.

And there are ALWAYS exceptions; my one nephew can get his ass beat and he'll just laugh at his mom while she does it. However, my brother, myself or expecially my dad threatens to take ahold of him(my Dad's angered tone has been known to stop blood circulation), he cuts the shit out immediately because the kid knows to respect us.

I've seen kids get their asses beat and just not care. Know why they don't care? They don't have respect or fear of the person doing it. All you pussies saying 'oh thats bullshit, it makes people grow up thinking being feared is cool blah blah blah". Tell you what; the FEAR of my father getting mad at me was more than enough to keep my ass in line. The FEAR of my dad taking action against me for doing something bad kept me in line.

Know what keeps me in line now? The FEAR of letting my parents down. And not merely on trivial matters, and I don't aim to keep my parents pleased; because I don't even back down from them if they're wrong and are going over the edge for no reason out of anger. I've had my dad flip out on me for no reason, even this past year, and I've gotten in his face and gave it right back because he was wrong. It wasn't a yelling match, it was a "Hey asshole, the only time you need to be flipping out on me is when I do something wrong or stupid; any other time you chill the fuck out before you talk to me. You talk to me with respect, because I do the same for you. If you can't do that then stay away from me until you can."

He listened, and he did'nt say "You're right, I apologise", but he'd stand there, look me in the face and silently listen while I told him what I thought. Then we'd start joking about something and get back to work, and it's as if the fight never happened.

I've learnt to be decisive and to the point, brutally blunt when it comes to talking to people. Some people can't take it, and don't like it; but it gets the job done without all the bullshit.

Just yesterday a different nephew was trying to talk shit and act bigger than me; I cut him down and made him feel like he was two inches; because I'm not against putting a child in their place when they attempt to take on an adult or any of their seniors in the family.

Again, thats how I was raised. I'm a hellishly nice guy to everyone, and I've had all kinds of people take advantage of my good nature; but when someone crosses me it's full-bore. I don't fuck around with anyone, family or not.

In closing; there is no single best way to raise kids. Some kids NEED their asses beat, some kids NEED to have that fear factor to keep them in line, and some kids don't and are just good kids. If you don't NEED to beat your kids, consider yourself damn lucky.

Parents; they were kids once too, and we're all only human. We all fuck up, we all learn new things along the way. Whether you're the parent that screams and beats their kids in the store for no real reason; maybe after reading a thread like this someone that does that will realise "Hey, that guys right...thats abit excessive." and they'll stop doing it. Maybe a parent who doesn't beat their kid, or hasn't realised other ways to keep their kids in order will read this thread and get ideas. It's all a learning experience.

I've helped raise seven neices and nephews, ages 9-23. I feel no need to have kids of my own, because I've been there for all of them. I've learned through all of them, and I've had to handle each of them differently. Some through intimidation, some through swift-backhands, and some just listened and did'nt need anything else.

[seph_monkey]

hahaha yeah i would beat my kids, just because ive been around families where the little kid is being a complete brat to his mom or to just some random kids and the parents are completely aware of it and do nothing just shrug and say "wat am i gonna do with him!?" and later they grow up to be some super bully cause he never got his ass handed to him *deep breath*

i do not belive in violence but with kids all you have to do is give them a few spankings and they will learn there lesson. but i was raised pretty bad so i did not have the joy to get myself JUST spanked.

[Night_Raid]

I think its ok for mothers to spank kids, but not fathers. The only exception would be if the kid (son) did something really horrible, like hit a girl or something.



No wonder you think its ok for men to hit women. Your father slapped you around all the time, and your mother probably hasn't spanked you once. Thats how most families in the US are, unfortunately. Why does the father have to always be the disciplinary figure?

This is why virtually everyone in America thinks its so kool and sexy for men to slap other people around, especially against women/girls.

Okay Abashi, since that quick bastard Mman tore you a new one before I got the chance to in the last topic I'm going to come right out and say it. You have got to be the most PAINFULLY ignorant person I've ever encountered on this site, and three years on-and-off is a long ass time.

Just the fact that you've expressed your bullshit generalizations of Americans, not once, but twice. Proves how ridiculously ignorant you are, so allow me to wisen you up, because god knows you need it.

First off, no one has said "YEAH D00D, SMACK THAT HO!" Everyone who has agreed that it's fine to hit a woman has said under the pretense "If she hit me first" You obviously don't know much about America and/or Americans if you think that we're all women hating, dominance obsessed barbarians.

This is why virtually everyone in America thinks its so kool and sexy for men to slap other people around, especially against women/girls.
In America, if you go to a walmart (Or for that matter, ANY large, public area) with your girlfriend. Then turn around and start slapping her, regardless of situation you're liable to get
A. Tackled
B. Wrestled into submission
C. Plain right out get your ass kicked
or D. Any combination of both, easily all three

Hell, I know if I saw some guy beating a woman's ass in public because they were just a prick with dominance issues. I'm going to rush over there, pull them away, and if diplomacy doesn't work (Not that I'd be very diplomatic to begin with, somewhere in the field of "What the fuck are you doing?! Try that shit and your ass is mine") they're catching a roundhouse to the ribcage. And while I don't approve of the lack of equality in the legal system. But if a man hits a woman, busting her lip and is brought to court on assault charges he is absolutely FUCKED due to the strong stigma surrounding hitting women in America. Whenever your hear about a man attacking a woman, the first thing that arises to everyone's mind is "What an asshole! He should be better than that" However, if a woman hits a man hard enough to bust his lip, she's less likely to get it as worse as a man who committed the same crime due to the fact that it's a woman in question who did the hitting. And "Sexy"? How fucking skewed and ignorant can you get? In America, if everyone hears you hit a woman you're quite liable to get shunned because it's usually seen as weak for a man to lay a hand on a woman because most people consider them more fragile.


Why does the father have to always be the disciplinary figure?
Obviously you've never had some lumbering, six-foot five father grab you by the wrist, drag you into a room and smack you over the ass repeatedly with a belt. The reason fathers are usually seen as the disciplinary figure in America is because they're usually seen as a more intimidating figure than a mother. Figure it this way, who are you going to be afraid of:
A 6'5", 295 pound man taking his belt off
or a 5'9" 210 woman
It's a simple matter of having an intimidating presence. As a kid I was scared shitless when my dad got angry at me because I did something wrong. The sheer terror of him whipping my ass was more than enough to keep me in line. My mom was never above doing it herself, but I can sure as hell tell you that when my dad came home and took off his belt I ran for the hills. Needless to say, that kept me straight as a kid because I knew if I misbehaved my dad would be right there with the belt to knock me back in line. Sure I was afraid of my mother too, but my father was just overall a scarier person, and that's what I understood as a kid.

And I don't know where the fuck you get off connecting father being the disciplinary figure to "ABUSING WOMEN IS AWESOME!" (Of which couldn't be any more wrong to begin with anyways) One is a matter of effectiveness, and another is a matter of being an asshole. While there are asshole in America, there are assholes in every culture. Of which you fail to realize. Everything you've just said has proven you to be an uneducated, short-sighted person who could spare to learn a thing or two about a culture before voicing your disapproval and spouting a bunch of cultural bigotry based on false facts.

[Broodstar1337]

Protip: Don't squander your essay writing skills on refuting a troll. You're not gonna get anywhere with it.

[Nitro Vordex]

Off Topic:Abashi is a serious troll, and quite ignorant. Why hasn't he got a warning or something?

On topic: Even at 16, I'm still scared at the thought of my dad hitting me. He's a big fuckin' guy, and I sure as hell wouldn't mess with him. My mom has smacked me across the face a few times, and that sometimes hurts more than my dad. (You know what I mean, psychologically and all.) I think I turned out alright.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

I knew the difference between "spanking to learn" and "spanking because dad is angry" when I was a child.
When I did something, and my dad told me it was wrong to do and not to do it again, yet I did do it again, then got spanked, I stopped. When my dad came home yelling at my mother and throwing lamps at me, I know I didn't do anything wrong. It was him being upset.
I got spanked, and I was very disciplined, my kid sister wasn't and she throws tantrums when she's told to walk the dogs around the block as if getting off her butt to do somthing for 10 minuites will kill her. She gets away with it too. That's why she's almost 12 and still whining and crying about dumb things. I learned at age 8, crying would get me nowhere, so I didn't.

I'll spank my kids when they are little, and once they learn responsibilty, I'll teach them that way. If they continue to act 8 when they are 12, I WILL spank them like 8 year olds are. How I was raised, and that's how I will raise them.

You know, as a little brother, I really hate it when parents try to give younger siblings special treatment, as it may result in the younger sibling not being able to be as successful in life as the older sibling because they were given the easy way by the parents. My mom tried to treat me and my brother as equals, gave us both the same punishments for whatever offenses we did individually, and now, while me and my brother are both taking entirely different paths, it's really tough to say which one of us is more successful.

But yeah, I condone hitting children to discipline them, but only depending on the severity of the offense.

[Syl]

Off Topic:Abashi is a serious troll, and quite ignorant.

Amen to that :wacko:

Not to deviate too much from the topic, but there seems to be a lot of these hitting threads. What's next "Hitting your Pets"? :confused:

Anyways, I haven't been "hit" since I was about 12. I used to get hit every once in a while, the worst being with a metal coat hanger. Eh, I'd say I had more emotional abuse than physical abuse in terms of the psychological trauma affecting me to this very day. I turned out fine though, as far as I can tell.

Yeah, when I have kids, the farthest I'd go is spanking. And of course, it has to have really good reason not just because they did something "bad."

[BlaizeYES]

.. alright, well i see where most of all you people are coming from. it's less about "raising kids through certain discplinary methods" and more about "getting respect from an annoying 9 year old by having them be afraid of what happens to them if they dont." thats two completely seperate issues, and its not just about "parents hitting kids," the topic is more about "anyone hitting kids to keep them in line." i dont really come into contact with as many young kids as most here seem to have. i guess if i was at a family barbecue and some little kid threw something at my face or was mocking me, i'd have the same views on beating kids as most of you in here have. but that really doesnt happen to me, and it probably never will. hell, i hate kids anyway, and friends of mine that have kids know that, too, and it makes it funnier when they have me meet their babies and i am clearly uninterested on the little turds. maybe kids are AFRAID of me(because of my obvious look of disgust on my face when seeing them) so i've never had a problem with having them "respect" me. who knows.

but enough about respect... when it comes to raising kids, theres nothing that makes me more upset than to see someone growing up afraid to take any chances because of a possible negative outcome(like being hit).

i've met LOTS of people like that skinny kid from the movie "road trip" who constantly worries about everything, and thinks he'll get in trouble if he even steps the wrong way... but most of those kids ive seen happened my freshman year of college. after getting a taste of life away from home and not having to worry about the punishment from their strict parents, they let loose and cant maintain control of themselves, because their entire childhood their parents were the ones that kept control for them. and it happens quite often, too: a kid is normally really reserved and has been told all of his life to go to school, do their work, and not have fun... they've been kept in line out of the fear of being severely punished, not because they understand self-discipline. then, they go out one night with a group of friends, and this wave of excitement takes over them. since they've never been taught on moderation(only abstinence), they will take things too excessively and begin to self-destruct, with nobody but themselves there to create a balance. these same people will be in college for a semester, maybe a year, before having to move back home to their parents so the mom and dad can once again maintain the control in the child's life. my freshman year of college, i saw this happen to about 10, maybe 12 kids. it's sad, because they've become so obedient that they will always remain dependent on the ones they "respect." but even this issue goes deeper than just hitting a child, but it can easily begin with that.

hitting a kid never really teaches anything, and if you're TRUELY the one raising the child(and not just helping out), you'd be concerned with the person your child is going to develop into... because every method of raising those kids will develop their character thats going to be stuck with them their entire lives. i turned out with a good head on my shoulders, but thats probably because i had an iron fist of a dad and a "free spirited" mom. i was terribly rebellious because of my dad's "take no shit" approach, and when i was no longer confronted with his "proven method" when i was like 12 or 13, i wasnt nearly as aggressive or hot-headed as i was before.

but who knows, i guess "everyone is different."

[ABDUR101]

Blaize, I think you basically negated your arguement because as you said; you don't like kids and you've never been around them. If you don't have the experience on dealing with different kids, how they interact with adults, their siblings, other people, etc then who are you to really even have an opinion on the matter?

If you don't know where everyone who deals with kids routinely are coming from, then you don't have a clue. It's a psychological game more than a physical one, but the physical aspect of beating your kids when they need it is necessary for disciplinary purposes. Some people talk until they're blue in the face to their kids, and the kids don't listen. I've seen kids laugh in their parent's faces even after getting smacked or their ass beat, but when someone else steps in and corrects them I've seen the same kids straighten right up. Why? Because thats part of the psychological aspect; if the kid loses respect or thinks their parents are a joke; someone they DO respect or 'fear' disciplining them causes them to actually think about what they did.

As far as the kids who are controlled their entire lives and then when they get an ounce of freedom, they go overboard. Wanna know where I see that happening most? Overly religious families that are very stuffy, boring and clean-cut. The kind of family that shudders at the thought of having kids who have sex outside of marriage, or who have a curfew of 8pm for their kids when their kids are more than capable of being responsible if given the chance to prove themselves. Time and time again I've seen local kids who act high and mighty and "holier than thou', squeeky-clean infront of their family, go turn into booze hounds and sluts as soon as they go out in the world. To be honest they make me sick, because they never learnt moderation; because in their family there is no moderation, it's 100% Sunday-Best Stepford Wives material, and when they finally get the chance to do their own thing they don't know what to do.

Growing up, I was allowed plenty of opportunity to test my responsibility, I've fucked up plenty, but I've learnt from every experience. I started drinking liquor when I was 17, bought by my sister, etc. I learnt self-control and moderation early in life, and I've never had a problem knowing when enough was enough.

As for me 'helping out' and not being the one to actually 'raise' the child; therefore I must not 'care' what they're going to grow up into; you're dead fucking wrong. I love all of my neices and nephews, and I'm teaching them as they go whats acceptable and whats not; that there's a check and balance system for everything in life. I'd rather be the one cracking them along their face now, when it's in our family environment, as opposed to them going out into the world and getting beat to an inch of their life because they instigated a fight, or wreck because they drank too much and had no self control.

Again, it proves that you don't have a clue what you're talking about. You seem to be basing your views off some sort of text book "How to Raise your kids with as little action as possible that might warp their little fragile minds". But you need to remember that life is based on perspective; just because you grew up with a hot headed dad(and I have aswell, my dad can't fix anything without throwing tools, swearing/yelling at everyone and nearly breaking something else. Even going fishing was an initial WTF as he'd curse and yell attempting to find all the tackle.), but that doesn't mean he held an iron fist over me, my dad was there plenty to do things with and have good times with.

In my life there have been plenty good times and bad, and the only reason I turned out decent was because of being raised to show appreciation, accept responsibility, and take the punishments or rewards I earnt. Through the assbeatings and all that, I learnt to respect my family, and how to work with them even through the worst of things.

If I did'nt follow suit with my neices and nephews, and did'nt work with my family(and lets be honest, a good family works together when it comes to discipline), I'd have abunch of obnoxious little fucks running around.

To be honest, I have one nephew to a sister who her and her husband don't beleive in spanking their kids. They sugarcoat things for their kids, shield their kids from negative things, etc. These kids pause at saying "crap", but at the same time they are sneaky, conniving and drive me up the fucking wall. Why? Because they're dishonest. They'll lie to your face to get out of a mere reprimand/being scolded. Bold faced liars.

I'd rather have a kid lie to get out of an ass beating, as opposed to a kid who would lie to your face(even when you SAW them do something wrong) just to get out of being told not to do it again, it was wrong, etc.

Every kid needs raised differently, but true story; this particular nephew took his parent's credit card and used it to buy stuff on Xbox LIVE. The husband got mad at my sister for losing this money, and she was SO stressed over not knowing where it went but knowing she did'nt spend it anywhere. He got upset with her, prolly fought abit, then they called the bank, finding out that the money went to whatever bit at Microsoft or whatever for MS points.

On my nephew's birthday, he got a nice chunk of money; and I told my sister "You guys need to come down on him hard for this; you need to make him pay back the money he STOLE from you guys with his birthday money to make a point that stealing is wrong and there are repercussions for it. Aswell, I'd not let him on LIVE for a while, to show him what it's like to be without when someone takes something from you." Basically, they did'nt do anything like that. All they did was tell him it was wrong, it better not happen again, etc. The worst part is, this particular nephew never goes without. His parents are very kind and loving, and if he wants something all he needs to do is ask; most often he gets gently explained why he can't have it, and that in a week or so they'll look into it again.(His Dad makes damn good money, to say the least, so this nephew and neice are fairly spoilt and think things are merely 'owed' to them. I broke him this past week when he decided to try and talk down to me and invited himself to my stuff.)

Will he steal again? I would'nt be surprised. Growing up I NEVER would have dreamt of stealing money from my mom's pocketbook or my dad's wallet.

One; I realised that was NOT MINE to take.
Two; I had ALOT more respect for my parents than that, I knew how hard they worked for their money.
Three; I knew that if I wanted something, I'd only have to ask and if they could afford it and I deserved it, they'd get it for me.

I'd have gotten SUCH an assbeating too. One time when I was about 7, I was at an aunt's house and was playing with a little toy car. When it came time to leave, I put it in my pocket and took it home to play with it. My mom asked "Where'd you get that? Wasn't that at your aunt's?" I responded "Yeah, she said I could bring it home."

*insert ass beating here* Followed by me calling my aunt and telling her I took the toy, and apologised for taking it.

My parents did'nt merely beat my ass, they made me do things to make up for whatever I did. They PROVED their point to me, and made me FACE what I had done. I had STOLEN a toy, and stealing was wrong. Their method was VERY effective; it wasn't just an "oh shit here comes an assbeating' it was 'here comes an assbeating, and then a moral to be learnt'.

I'm a better person because of that, and I'm glad I was disciplined the way I was. Sure, I wasn't an angel, and I'm still not; but I'm a damn decent person because of how I was raised. Nobody is perfect, it's not about raising perfect kids who will turn into perfect adults; it's about raising kids to have respect for those around them. Whether you beat your kids ass or not, depending if you need to or not; thats such a small part in the grand scheme.

When I back hand one of my nephews for doing/saying something ignorant to someone, or whether I scold them harshly; it depends on what they did and whether it was a 'slip' on their part, or whether they said it in a way that they knew they were being ignorant or not(and yes, you can tell, the same way you can tell someone is being sarcastic or a dickhead when they say something in certain tones).

Sometimes they need harsh words, sometimes they need a close-encounter with a backhand. There is no 'one solution for every problem', there never was for me, but it's about keeping things in check and knowing when enough is enough, and when to lay the smacketh down on things when it gets rowdy or out of hand.

Check and balance for the adults in charge, and one for the kids; incase anyone missed my point.

[BlaizeYES]

most of my opinions on the matter come from middle and upper middle class families that dont document the same type of problems you're talking of... stealing money from wallets was never a concern. there HAS to be a series of bad parenting moves that happen early on that makes you have to use that sort of force to "straighten" them out in the first place. can you honestly say that if you were watching these kids from the time they were born, they'd be as disrespectful or annoying as they end up becoming? you're talking about the steps you have to take because those kids have already started to develop their character through their overly easy-going parents that defend their child when they get into trouble, but dont do anything to stop the behavior... and then thats when you probably had to use that force. or maybe there was some sort of role each kid was playing in the family, and you were stuck with the "middle child" kids that werent given the most attention out of all the children and thats what they were constantly going for... because for kids to turn 7 or 8 and naturally just become shitheads just doesnt add up to me. and it probably has to do with the parents being afraid of their kids hating them, so when the kids are just a few years old, the parents really stress that UNCONDITIONAL LOVE by letting them get away with everything. who knows... and i don't think in the near future i'll open up a daycare to test the sociological and psychological effects of family, authority, and peers on a bunch of little babies. i'd just be wasting my time if they would still be going home to families that are pounding their own childraising methods into the kid's heads.

my opinion is on what i see on issues friends with kids will talk about, and what happens. and when i give an idea on what to do, and they try it, it seems to work. but none of them have kids that are eventually going to live a life of crime on the streets where the parents say "what went wrong." most have never hit their kid, and their children are well-behaved and get along great with others their age. and you're right, i dont have a first-person perspective on childraising a little firecracker, and especially now in my life, i wouldnt want to become a dad. so this issue isnt nearly as personal to me as it is to others who have problems raising their kids or get angry that their "beautiful innocent little angel" turns out to be trash, and then blame others. i'm saying that it's better to not hit kids, because the older they get because of the long term effects of aggression and views on authority. you dont need a book to know that; it just takes numerous case-studies of people your own age, finding a trend, and making your own opinion. and sometimes it's better to get a detatched perspective on this subject, theres no emotional look on this subject for me(no anger to disrespectful kids, love of children, etc), and that's how i plan on keeping it.


and as it seems that this is a subject that is highly sensitive, maybe they should add parenting to "religion and politics" for topics of discussion that will easily start an emotional "discussion"

[Deissa]

if i can get through this topic without wanting to hit all of you it'll be something alright

[Nitro Vordex]

This topic needs spoiler boxes or something, damn. x_x

[thunder-ray]

if i can get through this topic without wanting to hit all of you it'll be something alrightGood luck trying to hit someone on the internet.

[Nitro Vordex]

Only certain people can punch a hole in the internet RRRAAAAAGE.

Good job thunder. :wacko:

[Kadajenova]

conclusion : don't have children

[Shiro_Ryuu]

conclusion : don't have children

This.

[Nitro Vordex]

conclusion : don't have children

Or bag your damn trash people. >:U

[Delete]

Personally, id go meet the spartans on my kid if he was a boy. Only funny if you seen the movie. Honestly though, i think there are ways of handling stuff like that without hitting them. I'd just make sure to treat them with respect and reward them with stuff when they do something good. With that, there probably wouldnt be 2 many problems.