For those who hate the cutesy artstyle.

[Niered]

First off, the fact is that I myself would rather see a more true to form Phantasy Star art style in this game, but that doesnt mean that I think the art style is a bad decision. In fact, its pretty much nearly a requirement.

Call it what you may, kiddy, cutesy, chibi, etc, this graphical style although not as mature looking as other titles in the series, is a good design choice. This is because as you lower the total amount of polygons on screen, you need to make creative and aesthetic choices in order to continue communicating the idea, figure, or action that is taking place.

The bottom line? When youve only got so much ink in your pen, draw Charlie Brown, not Conan the Barbarian.

Still not convinced that these big headed, anatomically deformed characters are necessary for a smooth running but still aesthetically pleasing game? Lets see some examples (Bear in mind I dont vouch for the quality of these titles, this is simply a comparison):

http://www.meristation.com/EPORTAL_IMGS/GENERAL/juegos/NintendoDS-Rol/46/IMG-cw4648a87768f77/293942655200705101810093122pe.jpg

Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles Rings of Fate

Both in gameplay and art style this game most closely resembles PSZ. And look what theyve done! Deformed characters, so as to allow more things on screen and facilitate wireless (thought not WiFi). You can argue that since this series first installment was cute as well, this doesnt count, but these characters are considerably more deformed than even there gamecube counterparts.

http://dsmedia.ign.com/ds/image/article/884/884791/spectrobes-beyond-the-portals-20080626043347984_640w.jpg

Spectrobes

Spectrobes is another game with cutesy characters and real time combat. Once again one could argue that the game is Disney made, and facilitates such an art style off the bat, but realistically that never hurt the games frames per second. It also helps that the game cheats, walling you off into small battle arenas allowing for greater detail in the creatures.

http://www.universo-nintendo.com/files/Imagenes/Capturas_Soma_Bringer.jpg

Soma Bringer

A gorgeous title, but one that also cheats graphically. The environments are 2D paintings, only the characters are 3D. Keep in mind though that they are still much more deformed than say, PSO.

http://www.nintendononstop.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/dungeon-explorer-screenshot.JPG

Dungeon Explorer

Dungeon Explorer actually HAS well proportioned characters! It also looks a little more mature than the rest of these games. But at what price? Y'see, rather than actually using 3D models for the characters and creatures, theyre all 2D images in a 3D environment. This means that you have little to no character customization (Its easier to change/add polygons than redraw hundreds of frames of character animations for the sake of a hat) the view is stuck where it is, and you end up getting choppy animations. Not something I want in my PSZ.


So what am I trying to say? That although the situation isnt ideal, its not simply because they wanted to make phantasy star a kiddy game (although they arent looking at the younger age groups enjoying this as a bad thing.)

Im not trying to say youre wrong for disliking it, im trying to point out that all in all, its for the best. This way we get better gameplay, better frame rates, and most of all, we actually get wi-fi!

[RachaelH]

I think the art style in 'Soma Bringer' was fantastic. I am a big fan of 3d models on 2d backdrops when it is gone well (Chrono Cross is still beautiful to this day)

This is not really an option for Phantasy Star Zero due to the PSO and PSU viewpoint being very much an 'over the shoulder' perspective. The art style will allow for the player to 'forgive' the lower details of the 3d models due to the general charm of that style.

[Saphion]

As I've said in another thread, people who skip games based on a 'kiddie' art style have missed out on some seriously quality gaming.

[VR-Raiden]

Yep, anyone bitching about the "cutesy" art-style isn't worthy of this game anyway. :)

then again I will play a Cast, so it doesn't really affect me as much.

[jnblz316]

All I care about is the game play. The art style I don't mind one bit.

[Niered]

Im glad to hear some positive responses! Realistically, everyone here is right, although I am an artist by trade, I realize its place. In gaming, gameplay comes first, art style a distant second.

[Rei-San]

I hate it when people critique a game solely on it's graphics rather than its game play. :nono: That's why so many title are deemed under-rated and also the reason why "Japan only" games wont come to America. Cause people are too shalow. I for one don't mind the art style. It's cute and unique at best. And what do you expect? :-? It's the DS. It has to make room in it's harddrive to make it what Phantasy Star is and always has been.

[Risingsun]

I think the stylized and simplified art style is exactly what enables this game to be played over the internet with 3 other people. Besides, the style makes the game both functional and pretty on a system with very limited hardware capabilities compared to the competition.
Besides, PSZ Stylized characters allow for a decent range of character creation.

[Zantra]

I said it was cutesy, but that doesn't mean, that i'm not going to get it.

I need something to renew my faith in Sega and Sonic Team.

[ann_mitama]

Hey that's a good point. I'm glad that their not making complicated art designs, now we can enjoy the game play and customize characters.

[DraginHikari]

Unfortunely, people are naturally judgment and usually on ever DS game I've ever looked at you get some PSP or strict console players who just simply bash a game based on a few minor issues.

Why people even comment on games they obiviously have no interest in is something I'll never quite get.

[Mysterious-G]

I can understand that people are shocked when the art style of a game they know for years suddenly changes so drastic.
That has not have to do with disliking the style, you just have to get used to it.

[AweOfShe]

I just thought I'd throw this in:
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z104/AweOfShe1/kiddygames.gif
It pretty much sums up what I think. :P

EDIT: Also yeah, I don't mind the art-style, but I'll admit it took me by surprise. I was a big fan of Kubooka, back in my Lunar days. :P

[Saphion]

I swear, there's a Penny Arcade for every occasion.

Those guys are fantastic.

[deso123]

I was gonna say that the blond haired boy has to be a little gay boy but then I look at Saphion's avatar and I feel the retaliation coming... I think I'm going back to psobb anyway. They had good looking levels and great monsters in version 1 and some nice things in version 2. I think I took those for granted.

[Niered]

I was gonna say that the blond haired boy has to be a little gay boy but then I look at Saphion's avatar and I feel the retaliation coming... I think I'm going back to psobb anyway. They had good looking levels and great monsters in version 1 and some nice things in version 2. I think I took those for granted.

Hes less effeminate than Ethan Waber, any guy that shows off their belly button/midriff is just askin' for a fudge pack.

[VR-Raiden]

I was gonna say that the blond haired boy has to be a little gay boy but then I look at Saphion's avatar and I feel the retaliation coming....

Well, you ended up saying it... lol...

If you're passing up this game because the default HUmar looks "a little gay," you're being pretty silly. You don't have to play as a HUmar.

[Epically Leet]

I have no problem with it what-so-ever. It has a charm.

[Hucast-Kireek]

Cutesy is when something turns into a happy-happy game with no enemies, that's cutesy, like Nintendogs.

I think of Phantasy Star Zero as the MegamanZero of the series, a distinct yet awesome art style, not cutesy what so ever, and even if it were its the fun and game play that counts, look at Mario games.

[Gimph]

I don't mind the artsytle. It doesn't bother me, and there's no way it could EVER stop me from playing it. Phantasy Star is Phantasy Star, no matter what the artstyle is like... That in itself makes it fantastic. :D

And Kireek, what are you talking about? Those dogs are vicious.

[Hucast-Kireek]

LOL, wow Didn't know XD neva played it! but you get the idea! :P um...who let the dogs out?

[SubstanceD]

Even though I don't aprove of some of the new character designs ( I don't care for the new Humar look or the new Ranger look ) I have no problem with "cutesy character designs".

I do have issues with the framerate and the overall visual quality of the game but I guess those things can't be helped when you take into concideration just what a feat it is to have Phantasy Star Zero on the DS at all.

[Niered]

Even though I don't aprove of some of the new character designs ( I don't care for the new Humar look or the new Ranger look ) I have no problem with "cutesy character designs".

I do have issues with the framerate and the overall visual quality of the game but I guess those things can't be helped when you take into concideration just what a feat it is to have Phantasy Star Zero on the DS at all.

What framerate issues? every video weve seen has been nothing but smooth.

[SubstanceD]

What framerate issues? every video weve seen has been nothing but smooth.

Maybe it's just me but the two clips that I looked at seemed a bit 'choppy' to me. It's not that bad that game looks unplayable but it's obvious that the console PSO and PSU games look smoother.

[Saphion]

It'll be hard to tell for certain until we get some direct feed videos.

There's only so much you can see from off-screen footage.

[SubstanceD]

It'll be hard to tell for certain until we get some direct feed videos.

There's only so much you can see from off-screen footage.

True. It probably looks alot better on the DS screen.

[Mike]

...

None of those games were based on a where the art style was so different though.

[Niered]

None of those games were based on a where the art style was so different though.

I dont understand what youre poorly worded response means.

[Nitro Vordex]

True. It probably looks alot better on the DS screen.
It's also quite possible that you might have gotten lag while watching the movies. But, we'll see.

I dont understand what youre poorly worded response means.Sorry, couldn't resist. ^^;

[furrypaws]

I dunno, I like the cutesy graphics. Maybe I've just gotten used to them? Eh.

[Seority]

<3 everything about this game so far~
It's kicking major ass to the PSP in my book, and the cutesy style helps! ^^

[the_importer_]

I love the new art, but then again, I'm an Otaku, so I don't think my vote counts :P

[DreXxiN]

Fucking cute shit ruining mah series.

No really though, I'll still get it. So PSOish, it has to be good.

[Vanzazikon]

I never did care about art-style in any game. A lot of people say it doesn't match me cause of the way I look. They said, "Why are you playing these cartoon games?" I just said, "because it's freakin awesome, why?"

[:Floda:]

Hello all,

Pardon what I'm sure is a very late response to this ongoing conversation, I just joined the forum as I'm sure my 1 post marker under my avatar advertises.

Now for the art style, as presented already in this thread already it definetly helps in terms of lowering polygons and pushing in a lot more content into the game, seeing as in other threads people are looking at apparently up to 6-7 stages.

My concern is how people are looking at this as a "downgrade".This is one of the best looking DS games I've seen, with many varying environments through one stage ( which is more than I can say for PSU) the animations are quick and solid (though ,from the looks of things from the videos available, running looked a tad "hoppy").
Enemy character models look great, I mean...look at rayburn, character customization is recognizable and the art style seems to push more character in the look as opposed to the blank lifeless faces of the previous titles (excluding some hideous face options available in PSU) and more importantly it runs smoothly, the art style is nothing that should turn people away more as it should just be another way to give this game a different experience because whether or not the games anime looks seem "kiddy" in comparison to other titles should not confuse anyone into believing it is in anyway lacking in depth (which seems to be the case in some comments I've seen on some other threads) It seems to hold most of the glory that was present in the PSO ep 1&2 as well as the good aspects of PSU (Photon technics and such) as well as adding new things such as evasion and shields.
Thanks everybody for tolerating my thoughts, I'm at a loss for words today and I'm sure this first post isn't the best for a first impression but hopefully during my time in this community I may present myself better in time.

Thank you

[Akaimizu]

Actually, I beg to differ on the faces in PSU. They were actually pretty awesome. I have yet to make a non-characteristic or a face that just wasn't *full of story* in PSU. I have plenty of pictures, to boot. Actually, the faces were one of the *improved* aspects of PSU.

Still, I think it's fine. Or at least nothing to deter me from getting it. It just has the look (at least for the story mode) that it's pretty much putting kids in the party, unlike the previous phantasy stars which made it a point to have hunters or guardians as at least young adults.

[ForceOfBrokenGlass]

*Points at Lumia Waber*. >.>

Well no, PSU's character maturity level aside, young adults were somewhere near the minimum age.

You could make your character be a child in PSO. It was rare that anybody did that outside of wanting their swords to be 3x bigger than them.

[Saphion]

Hello all,

Pardon what I'm sure is a very late response to this ongoing conversation, I just joined the forum as I'm sure my 1 post marker under my avatar advertises.

Now for the art style, as presented already in this thread already it definetly helps in terms of lowering polygons and pushing in a lot more content into the game, seeing as in other threads people are looking at apparently up to 6-7 stages.

My concern is how people are looking at this as a "downgrade".This is one of the best looking DS games I've seen, with many varying environments through one stage ( which is more than I can say for PSU) the animations are quick and solid (though ,from the looks of things from the videos available, running looked a tad "hoppy").
Enemy character models look great, I mean...look at rayburn, character customization is recognizable and the art style seems to push more character in the look as opposed to the blank lifeless faces of the previous titles (excluding some hideous face options available in PSU) and more importantly it runs smoothly, the art style is nothing that should turn people away more as it should just be another way to give this game a different experience because whether or not the games anime looks seem "kiddy" in comparison to other titles should not confuse anyone into believing it is in anyway lacking in depth (which seems to be the case in some comments I've seen on some other threads) It seems to hold most of the glory that was present in the PSO ep 1&2 as well as the good aspects of PSU (Photon technics and such) as well as adding new things such as evasion and shields.
Thanks everybody for tolerating my thoughts, I'm at a loss for words today and I'm sure this first post isn't the best for a first impression but hopefully during my time in this community I may present myself better in time.

Thank you

Welcome to the forum! That's actually a great first post. :D

[Akaimizu]

*Points at Lumia Waber*. >.>

Well no, PSU's character maturity level aside, young adults were somewhere near the minimum age.

You could make your character be a child in PSO. It was rare that anybody did that outside of wanting their swords to be 3x bigger than them.

I think some of that happened whether you made them small or not. That was PSO for you. My Ramarl was actually a rather tall woman only to be completely dwarfed by half the weapons she could equip.

Lumia, I believe, obtained a proper age before she could become a Guardian, if not slightly before due to reasons of emergency. They kind of made it a story detail. The whole (you're not old enough) aspect of the story. Still, as your point, she's definitely likely the youngest one yet.

PS-enter fatality code-Ø just kind of looked like they were going into 8-year old territory. And while I don't see that as a problem in general for RPGs, it would just be a new thing for Phantasy Star. (Heck, I loved Grandia, and we all know Sue HAD to be in that 6-8 year old category. Even if it was kind of mean to see big giant monsters like Trolls beating her down. She was made cooler because she was like a Miyazaki character. A 6-8 year old that was tougher than a train. (And yes, 8-year olds can take collisions strong enough to destroy trains in Miyazaki films.))

But alas, this isn't exactly an artstyle discussion as it would be a possible story one.

[ShadowInferno119]

I think some of that happened whether you made them small or not. That was PSO for you. My Ramarl was actually a rather tall woman only to be completely dwarfed by half the weapons she could equip.

Lumia, I believe, obtained a proper age before she could become a Guardian, if not slightly before due to reasons of emergency. They kind of made it a story detail. The whole (you're not old enough) aspect of the story. Still, as your point, she's definitely likely the youngest one yet.

PS-enter fatality code-Ø just kind of looked like they were going into 8-year old territory. And while I don't see that as a problem in general for RPGs, it would just be a new thing for Phantasy Star. (Heck, I loved Grandia, and we all know Sue HAD to be in that 6-8 year old category. Even if it was kind of mean to see big giant monsters like Trolls beating her down. She was made cooler because she was like a Miyazaki character. A 6-8 year old that was tougher than a train. (And yes, 8-year olds can take collisions strong enough to destroy trains in Miyazaki films.))

But alas, this isn't exactly an artstyle discussion as it would be a possible story one.
Still laugh at the "Mortal Kombat" reference.

But, yeah I think its cool, to see a young person being the prodigy, or the toughest, however a lot of times, that story is played out. I don't mind the art style of the game, I mean, it does allow for more content.

[Omega_Weltall]

I dont relay have a problem with the chibi style just the age lv's of the characters. I donno why but it just irks me to see some 10 year old kid fighting some 40ft dragon when Zarathustra(lol look up Zoroastrianism ) knows that kid would be either steped on, eaten in one gulp and would not have the skills and experience of someone 18-40. now over 40 age starts setting in and you start sucking again unless your Orlandau in FFT he was like 60+ and was the most overpowered chraracter in the game and rightfully so, HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S DOIN!. i know.. i know.. the whole fun over realism thing but... it just really irks me, even when i was 10. But i guess that whats popular in Japan, judging form the massive amounts of anime series that have some kid aged 12-16 as the main character. But thats another argument.



....aleast the Newmans look cool in this one. i might FINALY pic a FOnewm and not cringe when i look at him

[Segya]

So it's realistic for a 18-40 year old to defeat a 40ft tall dragon? with a sword?

[jmanx]

cuz Cutesy means more space for the DS cart.

[Omega_Weltall]

they'd be more inclined to survive. some kid would just go in flailing about. ya then theres the whole "dragon" thing thats not so realistic. i donno it just bothers me.


well FFT had sorta chibi characters but no friggen children

[Aumi]

Well, if you have watched a few anime, then you most likely know that these characters may as well be 15-16 years old. Since it's a manga/anime art style, this makes perfect sense.

[ForceOfBrokenGlass]

So it's realistic for a 18-40 year old to defeat a 40ft tall dragon? with a sword?

Eh, not really. Even in the stories the hero had some epic equipment and some magic handy to boot and even then it doesn't always go well for them.

PSO style Dragons are retarded though. The scales are always tipped in our favor. Take on a very young D&D Dragon. THAT is a pain in the ass.

[the_importer_]

Guys, Guys, if we're going to question what makes sense in video games, we're going to rules out everything >_>

[Omega_Weltall]

Well, if you have watched a few anime, then you most likely know that these characters may as well be 15-16 years old. Since it's a manga/anime art style, this makes perfect sense.
ya and that's what irks me about anime now. i cant watch it anymore unless it was made in the 70's 80's or early 90's i simply cant stomach it. bout 90% of all anime currently has some kid (usualy blond) aged 10-17. Bleach, Naruto, Code Geass, Haru Hru..somethingerother, Lucky Star, Death Note, One Piece, Prince of Tennis, Gundam Seed ( hell damn near every gundam save the 00 series), Pilot Candidate (which was terrible and filled with yaoi overtones... cool animation though).... need i go on?

oh how i long for the days of Golgo 13 and Red Photon Zillion

[Aumi]

I, for one, am perfectly fine with it... And if you look at it from this perspective, there are cases in anime where characters look even more chibi-ish and still are 15 years old, when it's about the character designs. For the phenomenon of teenagers fighting big monsters... I guess it's just selling well, and I personally have no problem with it. Perhaps it's because I'm 15 myself. :-P Well, I guess this all depends on the opinion, but PSØ's art style-choice is, how others mentioned, most likely for better performance and a wider audience.

[jmanx]

Well the Racast looks coolerzors

[Sami]

If you're saying you can never have "realistic" proportions because of the limits you're wrong. You can still do it. But for example the face would be less detailed.

[Niered]

If you're saying you can never have "realistic" proportions because of the limits you're wrong. You can still do it. But for example the face would be less detailed.

Thats not what I said at all, but for the sake of textures and actually getting those details in, its best to have exaggerated features.