Questions about Team Composition

[Saligun]

When i read about guides about what the best characters to use for c mode are. It seem kinda unfair to suggest that only the HUCAST/HUcaseal/FOnewearl are the only characters that can get the job done,Also why should the ranger class get treated like their just a annoyance when they join the group.Don't get me wrong i love the HUcaseal/FOneweral(HUcast is a bit over rated to me),But this is called CHALLENGE MODE after all .So it's the skill of the player being put to the test not the skills of the characters you can use,so if you can beat c mode with a HUcast(Rated the best) fine but you should be able to beat c mode with any characters and if you can then you can say you past the challenge completely but if you can't beat c mode with a RAmarl(Example)(She get dumped on alot as the worst ranger for c mode)Then you can only blame youself not the RAmarl she's not controling the character you are...

[Gimph]

Well, I don't think anyone would say that any character is incapable of completing Challenge Mode. Any skilled player should be able to beat the entire thing no matter what character type they're using. But the guide reccomends certain character classes because their specific abilities make Challenge Mode easier. Certain characters are stronger than others. Certain characters have more HP or TP than others. Each character has their own strengths and weaknesses. The guide simply states that most people would find it easier with certain ones.

[AlexCraig]

I wholeheartedly agree, Saligun. I use my RAcast when I did a bit of Challenge mode with my brother (using his HUmar), and I hate how people are so biased about it.

[Saligun]

Here's a example in defence of the very belittled RAmarl,I was in cave 2 on a c mode mission with a FOnewearl and a hucast and 2 RAmarls,well we lost the HUcast about half through the mission but me and the 2 RAmarls managed to finish the cave 2 area anyway.

[Cranberry]

Its possible to clear challenge mode and get an S-Rank weapon using any character.

It's more if you're doing a Time Attack. Unless you happen to get an extremely good ranger gun with high hit% and a fantastic special, a team with rangers will always be slower than a team with hunters.

The hunters will do a lot more damage, and can simply kill faster than the rangers can. Especially once you get to the point where hunters are also able to use guns, rangers are pretty much out-classed in challenge mode. They do less damage, their higher accuracy doesn't compensate for their lower damage, especially when hunters find hit% weapons.

This isn't a flame against Rangers, or saying that no ranger should be in challenge mode. In fact they should go into challenge mode and get themself an S-Rank weapon. And if you don't feel comfortable meleeing a dangerous monster, by all means have the Ranger pick it off with a gun while you focus on other things. That said, if you are going for the fastest possible time, the majority of the time you're only slowing yourself down if you opt for a ranger instead of a hunter.

But, in the Rangers defense, here is a story that shows what can happen if luck is with the Ranger.

I was once in a C mode game and the stage was the mines. We had a RAcast in the team and very early in the run a 60 or so hit instant death special gun dropped. It was either Dim or Shadow I think. That RAcast instant death killed virtually everything, and thanks to him we had the entire area cleared and Vol Opt dead in about 20 minutes. Easily the fastest time I've ever accomplished on that stage. And we never would have accomplished it without that RAcast there. This is a rare case in which it was better to have a Ranger than a hunter because we happened to get an extremely good ranger drop right off the bat.

[DC_PLAYER]

It's more because each char has a function, so when you want damage it is suposed to choose the hucast and when you want suport to pick a good force.

However for me it doesn't matter when the team is composed by 4 players, balanced or not the job is done either way.

[RAmar Lv.200]

Hey I Have RAcast!

[Splash]

If you ever head online and ask for a Cmode game and you were using a Ranger to do so, chances are you are going to get rejected on the spot.

It's not about the character, it's about what are the chances of you and your team passing. First of all, Challenge mode is serious business, at least for online it is. You mess up and fail the team due to a foolish accident and you essentially just lost all hope if being able to ask again for assistance in later Challenge mode games. No one wants to waste another 40 minutes-1 hour doing a stage again just because you were the one that caused the entire team to lose and you were being foolishly ignorant to advices. You select a Ranger to play, you better as heck not cause a disruption to your teammates, and if you do, don't be surprise that they would intentionally fail just to get you off the team.

Advices are to make things easier, for yourself and for your teammates. If you were a HUcast/HUcaseal/FOnewearl, you would get a better chance at getting accepted into Cmode games, you would also get a better chance at passing those stages, and you would be able to get your S-rank faster as a result.

When classes are placed in tiers, it is from a beginner's point of view. An advanced Cmoder could easily use any class to clear Challenge mode. For that matter, an advanced Cmoder could most likely also clear any stage with any type of team combinations. From a new person's standpoint and wants to seek advice, the tier essentially shows how well you will be able to withstand the difficulties of Challenge mode for each class. It doesn't mean that they can't be good, it just means that if you had this low tier class, you aren't likely to be surviving on the field for that long.

RAmarls are the worst character in Challenge mode, simply because the fact that it has low HP, low ATA, and low ATP, the three most important stats in Cmode. They also can be paralyzed and poisoned. They also cannot use weapons as early as a RAmar can due to that lack of ATA. And when HP does become a factor for survival, she would be in competition with a FOnewearl who are more important in Challenge mode thanks to the fact FOnewearls can do more damage than a RAmarl without the need for materials and FOnewearls can cast Resta/Shifta/Zalure as needed. These are facts that you have to accept, and if you still feel that you want to use a RAmarl to do Challenge mode, so be it. Just know that you are just risking yourself on the battle field and you have been warned already. So if that Dragon one-hit killed you after falling down, well you know the reason why now.

[Saligun]

I'm not just trying to defend the RAmarl or even the ranger class,i'm just wondering why out of 12 different character types why only 3 of them are considered the only ones to use and the others are not considered very usefull for the challenge.

[Saligun]

It's easy to beat C MODE with the right group but if you had to beat C MODE with the most challenging possible team of characters what classes and types could you do it with?

BONUS:What kind of team would be your dream team?


My most challenging team would use:
1.RAmarl
2.HUnewearl
3.Racaseal
4.FOnewearl.


My DREAM team would be.
4 FOnewearls.(One could provide support,while the other three do all the dirty work.)

[Ryna]

Let's assume that we're only talking about Gamecube/XBox/Blue Burst Challenge Mode here. Things are rather different on Version 2.

Hunters - The HUcaseal and HUcast are desirable because they can't be paralyzed/poisoned, have traps, and can restore their HP in a pinch. Traps can make a big difference in nasty waves. In addition, HUcaseals can often use the handguns that are spread throughout a stage and HUcasts are great for raw damage potential. HUmars and HUcaseals are usable, but don't have the same advantages.

Rangers - Depending on the stage, a RAcast or RAcseal can be very useful. As has been discussed above, RAmars and RAmarls suffer from several disadvantages in challenge mode. Those classes don't really shine until you put a lot of levels into them.

Forces - FOnewearls are preferred for a couple of reasons. First, they can do the most damage with single techs (which are the most often used). Second, their stat bonuses are very helpful. FOmars are frowned upon because of their low TP. FOnewms can do a lot of damage, but you need to get lucky on finding tech disks and fluids. FOmarls are good supporters, but aren't the strongest tech attackers in challenge mode.

[Splash]

I'm not just trying to defend the RAmarl or even the ranger class,i'm just wondering why out of 12 different character types why only 3 of them are considered the only ones to use and the others are not considered very usefull for the challenge.
It's simple really.

HUcast has the highest ATP in the game, can't be paralyzed or poisoned, has built in trap vision, and can use traps. More ATP means it can use ATP weapons earlier than other classes, and because of that high ATP, it means that monsters would die faster.

HUcaseal has the potential of the HUcast except it goes for ATA instead. What a HUcaseal is a split between the Hunter and a Ranger. It can use handguns/mechguns earlier and because she also has high ATP, it means that she can damage well with them as well. Not only that, because they have a gun, they could also detonate traps quicker.

And yes, traps are important in Challenge mode. They make things 10x easier than without.

FOnewearls have the highest MST in the game, therefore highest amount of TP, and a 30% boost to simple techniques (Foie, Barta, Zonde) which are the ones you will be using most of the time in Challenge mode anyways. It also has double Resta range, which is also another technique that is useful. And because there tends to be only one Force in a team, FOnewearl does not need to compete for fluids to heal TP. For that matter, it is the easiest Force to use in Challenge mode and it is the most damaging one at that as well.

[TheOneHero]

Oh man, 4 FOnes absolutely rape everything, great for TA. The problem though, is with fluids/scapes, (and in C9, HP mats), that make it a very difficult team to use.

I'll second you for worst team.

For my 'dream' team, I'd probably go 2 FOnes, a HUcaseal and HUcast.

[Splash]

Oh man, 4 FOnes absolutely rape everything, great for TA. The problem though, is with fluids/scapes, (and in C9, HP mats), that make it a very difficult team to use.

Actually, 4 FOneys would slash through ep2c3 like it was nothing. The best time for 2c3 right now was in fact done with 4 FOneys. I believe it was around 10 minutes.


Most "challenging" team: 4 RAmarls. I would love to see how such a team would fair in ep2c3.

[TheOneHero]

I wasn't talking about Ep2 C-Mode; though I have no doubt that they'd tear through Ep2C3. :p

I totally agree on your "challenging" team. I've done some Ep1 C-Mode with two RAmarls in the party, oh-ho man that was awesome. I'll have to find some people to try an Ep2 game with them...

[Splash]

Ah I see. Well FOneys can hold their own pretty well.

But yeah, if you are going to do an ep2 Cmode game, good luck, especially if the team has inexperienced people in it.