Why should I roll a beast

[Morganna]

Odd question, I know. Bear with me.

See, a part of me wants to roll a beast, for the pure melee pwnage, as well as 35 second godmode.

However, there is a part of me that resists it, for some reason.

It might be looks, it might be some revulsion at the idea of genetic man/animal hybrids, it might be a preference for more 'sophisticated' races like newmen, etc.

Can anyone give me some good reasons to roll beast?

[ashley50]

highest damage that no one will be able to surpass?
can dispose of enemies, fast?

[Dragwind]

Well nanoblast is pretty fun in my opinion. It was possibly the second reason I made mine alongside fanfic purposes. Although I'll say I often have a hard time playing my beast due to how I hate the way most clothing looks on them, and those catlips ":3" kind of get annoying.

[OldCoot]

If you have a slot open, I would go for it. Great Fortefighters and Fighgunners. I think what summed it up was doing runs with a person who had a level maxed beast. He would nano at the boss with the attack beast and we would clear the boss quickly. I just had to pop a star if his hp got knocked down.

[Cracka_J]

Beasts are great for big numbarz, highest HP, and the uber red (male) nano.
Downsides are horrid ata, and the inability to defend yourself during the nanoblast period.

If you're going to play beast, you're best suited in a fighter class. I would highly recommend also picking MALE beast, as the female nano, comparatively, is flaming poop on a stick. Male nano can do the 1-2 basic hit combo fast, which means more just attack crits and more dps. You'll also benefit with the highest ATP in the game from male beast.

I've played a few variations, and I find myself much more suited with Female Cast for fighter. Solid ATP, high DFP, and invincibility during SUV period. Just my personal opinion, but I find them the much more tactical choice of the 2 races. That and you can abuse the extra ATP off of restrictive units like the Lumirus / Kaos Knight that take quite a bit away from ATA. Casts don't get molested by that unit like beasts do.

[Hrith]

highest damage that no one will be able to surpass?Thanks for the lulz.

[darkante]

highest damage that no one will be able to surpass?
can dispose of enemies, fast?

Well, ATA does play a thing or two.
I say Cast is equal in Power because of that.

[amtalx]

Thanks for the lulz.

Like a horse to water...

[xTwiztidClown]

If you wanna be a fortefighter than Beast is probroly the best choice.

[Sanjo]

I'll agree. My beast's nanoblast IS poop on a stick. She's incredibly hard to control compared to a male. Gah.

B> new nanoblast controls.

[drizzle]

Fur

:3

[Genoa]

Nanoblasts used to dominate SUVs completely during the game release. But this is because B-rank SUVs didn't compete with Nanoblast. Fortunately for CASTs, they created upgraded SUVs at higher grades, giving them more uses and power.
What did nanoblasts get?
Nothing >_>
Don't get me wrong, Nanoblasts are still useful and are nice for certain situations.
However, In comparison to SUVs, Nanoblasts aren't as helpful in most cases.
SUVs are nice because you can deal incredibly powerful damage instantly and get right back into action.
Nanoblasts can do more damage over time (directly compared to a SUV) but this leaves you vulnerable (if you're not invul).
Not to mention, Since it's only a direct comparison to a SUV, the length of a Nanoblast vs. a SUV means if someone SUVs and Nanoblasts at the same time, the CAST does their SUV damage and goes back to using their normal attacks. Add up the damage done by SUV and weapon damage in the time a Nanoblasts lasts, and you usually end up beating the Nanoblast.

Nanoblasts need a little pick-me-up in my opinion.

Nanoblasts also hinder any kind of techer from supporting. (If you're some kind of beast-techer)
A CAST techer is better at support since the TP needed to heal can be done by any character just fine, but a SUV is nice and fast, where Nanoblast puts the party on hold from support. And usually when you choose to Nanoblast, it's in a situation that's hot and heavy... the time that support is usually needed most <_>

For me, I'm holding out for Beast Gunmaster.
Gunmaster has no access to melee, so Nanoblast can give you that melee versatility. There's no racial bonus' for Master Classes, because a Beast vs. CAST Fortegunner... the stats are quite close due to that +3% bonus for CAST FG.
Gunmaster also has more ATA than Fortegunner, so a Beast Gunmaster with even higher PA bullet levels (meaning more Accuracy to your hits on top of GM already having more ATA) means you'll hit just fine.

[DreXxiN]

You don't roll a beast because the L/KK unit makes your cast have beast ATP but with + 50 ATA and paradi instead of a nano that you just kind of fall over using if not invincible in 5 seconds.

No this is NOT biased..I have an equal leveled M Beast and M CAST...

Sadly the balance of this game is totally overthrown..

And really, I didn't even have fF LEVELED on anything but my beast...but then it all changed when Paradi was released..and..well now you can guess what happened.

[Inazuma]

the days of beast being on top are behind us. now there is no reason to play beast since cast is superior. just take a look at the recent japanese MAG+ TA teams. its 100% casts. there is no balance in this game.

if you want to play as a force type, newman is good. everything else is all cast. i dont think there is a reason to pick beast at all, sadly.

[darkante]

the days of beast being on top are behind us. now there is no reason to play beast since cast is superior. just take a look at the recent japanese MAG+ TA teams. its 100% casts. there is no balance in this game.

if you want to play as a force type, newman is good. everything else is all cast. i dont think there is a reason to pick beast at all, sadly.

Sadly i have to agree, they are mostly there for looks atm.

Nothing beats a Beast in rawrness, imo. ;P

[Pillan]

There are still advantages to Beasts. The obvious one being that a Beast can use a Lumirus / Kaos Knight as well and retain their ATP advantage. You may be worried about the accuracy drop, but this is easily made up by high accuracy photon arts (most every skill at 30+), rifles, twin handguns, machineguns, certain ultimate bullets, knuckles, twin daggers, daggers, Anga Jabroga, and Zodial/Zodeel. Yes, you’ll suffer against Deljaban, but who doesn’t? Their major disadvantage is that a Nanoblast can easily be replaced by [insert high element weapon here] while there’s nothing anyone can do that has the range and power of Paradi.

[Seority]

I wonder if anyone will ever just be a beast gunner to help hit those high numbarz with the gunners ata?
Or maybe use CASTS high ata to be FF so they can hit high numbarz as well?

Oh wait... :wacko:

It's true that CASTS are surpreme right now. Sorry there ;/

[Inazuma]

There are still advantages to Beasts. The obvious one being that a Beast can use a Lumirus / Kaos Knight as well and retain their ATP advantage. You may be worried about the accuracy drop, but this is easily made up by high accuracy photon arts (most every skill at 30+), rifles, twin handguns, machineguns, certain ultimate bullets, knuckles, twin daggers, daggers, Anga Jabroga, and Zodial/Zodeel. Yes, you’ll suffer against Deljaban, but who doesn’t? Their major disadvantage is that a Nanoblast can easily be replaced by [insert high element weapon here] while there’s nothing anyone can do that has the range and power of Paradi.


what good is having a higher atp number if you are still killing monsters slower than cast overall? and dont forget that cast can use the same items as beast, plus the race exclusive killer elite rifle. whats more important? killing monsters or looking at a number on the screen?

im hoping the big content update or whatever it is, will give us a much needed rebalance. there are so many things that needs adjustments it blows my mind.

[Pillan]

I thought everyone who played PSU had a fairly good understanding that Cast ATA does not outweight Beast ATP in terms of DPS ever and Cast ATA only outweighs Beast ATP in terms of KPS when the Cast and Beast are killing things in the same number of hits. If the Beast can kill most things in one less hit than the Cast, the Beast is killing them greater than 10% faster at all times (even after you apply ATA). And the Beast is always killing bosses faster. The real advantages of Cast are Paradi takes out a huge spawn of medium or small mobs instantly and if the Beast ATP translates into still killing in the same number of hits, the Beast is losing out by on the order of 2-4% purely from the ATA difference. This is true regardless of class.

And the couple ATP and ATA that Killer Elite has over the other rifles really isn’t enough reason to play as Cast. That and you can just grind the Kubara version if you care that much. Or wait for the now-confirmed sequel and worry about the 13-15 star rifles. Also don’t forget that rifles are one of the absolute weakest guns in the game, only really becoming useful when their range is appropriate or when necessary to stun a large mob.

[drizzle]

I thought everyone who played PSU had a fairly good understanding that Cast ATA does not outweight Beast ATP in terms of DPS ever

No but Paradi does

[Pillan]

But why is it better?

I’d argue the reason has more to do with mission structure than the race balances. If there were less high-quantity medium mob spawns and more large mob spawns such as those in missions like Electronic Brain, I could easily see Beasts retaining an advantage. However, on missions like the other three current GBRs, there are huge medium-mob spawns constantly in every block, making the SUV option much more useful.

Quite frankly, SUVs are only good by comparison to non-melee attacks on large mobs or bosses just because they have that single target per spawn limit. In that case, it’s hard to argue in favor of Paradi over a power Nano.

[Inazuma]

No but Paradi does

took the words right outta my mouth.

and to answer pillan's question. its "better" b/c thx to paradi, cast kills monsters faster than beast. so what if beast can kill some monsters in 1 less hit. cast can kill an entire room filled w/ monsters in just a few seconds, so it more than makes up for it.

if you still wanna argue that beast is better than cast, you shouldnt mention killing speed since they lose there. the only advantage you really have is defense (more HP, hizeri stamina for extra unit). but does beasts advantage in defense outweigh their disadvantage in killing speed? nope

[Pillan]

Once again, what happens when there is no entire room filled with monsters? Using the example I noted above, what use is Paradi when the largest number of spawns are four Heavy Infantry or two SEED-Ardite? Does it still surpass the Beast advantage? As I said, I have my doubts, but anyone with a high level Beast and Cast can feel free to test it if they care enough. Any mission that doesn’t have widespread mobs or incredible quantities of mobs doesn’t really play out to Paradi’s advantage.

And killing in one hit less is a very large advantage when that one hit is less than a burst or an additional combo step. If the Beast is killing in one Jabroga and the Cast sends everything flying with one hit left to kill it, the Beast has a huge advantage. If the Beast kills everything in 5 shotgun bullets and the Cast kills it in 6, once again that’s double the kills per second. Of course the odds of either of those being the case are fairly low.

I don’t think anyone here is arguing that Casts or SUVs aren’t good where they are good. I’m only arguing that they’re not the best because there are still a good number of situations where that advantage doesn’t outweigh playing another race.


I guess I’ll summarize my argument like this: when there are more than 5 mobs arranged in a pattern where Chikki or laser cannons do not work and with no bullet resistance, Paradi always has an advantage. When any one of those conditions is not met, I’m sure a good Beast can find some way to outdo the Cast without much effort.

[Inazuma]

i understand your point but im talking about in general. sure, there may be some situations where beast has the advantage but generally speaking cast is better. for example, beast might kill the boss faster, but over the course of an entire mission, chances are the cast will have the lower clear time.

you could use the same argument for comparing FF to FM. depending on the situation FF could kill faster (high flying enemy), but generally speaking FM is better.

if there is a mission that beast can clear faster than cast, then beast wouldnt be completely useless i guess. but im not sure if such a mission actually exists. paradi is just too damn good.

[Pillan]

If I had to guess on stages where Paradi wouldn’t have much of an advantage, I’d say all of Moatoob minus De Rol Le, the entire Parum Lakeshore area on the non-Mizura maps, the Parum train areas (not SEED train), and SEED Express. I can’t think of anything on Neudaiz and any HIVE areas that wouldn’t favor Paradi. It’s as simple as thinking of areas with few spawns, with lots of large mobs, or with shield or sword and shield only mobs.

I’d say that’s about half the game. It’s just too bad the majority of the Beast-favoring missions don’t have variants that are anywhere near the current level cap on either server.

[unicorn]

You cant argue with Inazuma because he only believes in 3 races and 3 jobs. Male/Female CAST FM/GM and Female Newman MF.

[Genoa]

You cant argue with Inazuma because he only believes in 3 races and 3 jobs. Male/Female CAST FM/GM and Female Newman MF.
Where did we learn how to count =/

[Cracka_J]

Also, on the paradi/nano note....

Beasts are active in nano for around a 25-30 second period.
Casts do less OVERALL with paradi, BUT are only in SUV for about a 3-5 second period.

Meaning, those extra 25 seconds can be spent regaining SUV meter. Figure that into the equation, along with NO RACE BONUS for master classes like Fighmaster, and a small (in comparison to beast) ATA loss with the use of LKK..and you have Cast domination. Expect to see many more cast FM's then beasts...they'll become near obsolete in that type.

[DreXxiN]

I'm sorry for everyone trying to save the beast race, and it's sad but it; just worse performance-wise.

Also a note to Pillan is that there is not a single mob in the game that with a high % axe a beast will be able to one-hit shot them and a CAST would not unfortunately, but I DO see your point.

Regardless, I use CAST for Time Attacks and speed runs, but this doesn't mean you can't have fun with the others.

Hell, I miss the crap outta my human, but he's...well..human.

If someone could perhaps number crunch who has a 50% Zagza/Bil De and very high grind that can 1 hit kill with Beast but not CAST, they should let us know because that could be huge ;3.

But from what I've seen transfering gear back and forth, it's all the same.

[Dragwind]

<---Have fun with the stat calculator on the main site here.

I messed with it for a while and tried some different things. If I'm ever going to TA again, it's going to be my CAST again for both GM and FM. My beast will still get some action...but probably just for normal fF runs with his cati/hit.

[Pillan]

As far as the Jabroga note, that was just being used as an example and really could be replaced with [insert skill here] to get the point. Jabroga isn’t the only skill, much less the weakest skill that you use in the game. And I seriously doubt there’s anything that a Beast can one shot that a Cast can’t at max level with 40+% element. Plus the higher ATP does allow a good strategist to take advantage of the skills that do less damage but kill faster that are completely overlooked at this point.

Also am I the only one that noticed that the bar actually refills as you attack during the Nanoblast, extending your time period in that form? Though Casts do get to use their next SUV faster, I wouldn’t really write that off as an advantage since the Beast is gaining more faster as the bar fills disproportionately quicker with higher damage relative to enemy HP. (You can verify this by filling it up with a machinegun versus [insert skill here].)

And everyone here does realize that a Beast Fighmaster wearing a Kaos Knight will have around the same accuracy as a Beast Protranser, right? That’s coupled with higher ATA because of the 10% increase on every skill from 40 to 50 (not to mention that PT has a 30 cap). Until you start hearing Protransers complain about missing, I call BS on anyone being severely affected by Kaos Knight while using melee.

But, anyway, as I said earlier all of the new stages in the game place SUVs in higher regard than any Nanoblast because of enemy organization. Huge circular or wide spread groups of medium mobs, few large mobs until the final room, no range resistant mobs outside of the second spawn on the last room of De Rol Le. It’s really hard to argue that there’s much competition under those conditions. Hopefully they’ll think to add S3 versions of everything so we can get some semblance of competition again.

[Inazuma]

You cant argue with Inazuma because he only believes in 3 races and 3 jobs. Male/Female CAST FM/GM and Female Newman MF.

thats not true. PT and AT are worth using also. so that would make it 2 races and 5 types. anything else is just a weaker version of one of these.

[Pillan]

What’s the female Newman MF contributing though? Why not just leave it at Cast FM, GM, PT, and AT?

[unicorn]

I can count peoples! I meant 2 races (Cast and Newman) but 3 choices cast male OR female, and female newman.

[Inazuma]

sure, you could take MF and AT off the list b/c they dont benefit the party as much as the others would. but then you take techs completely out of the game. in a lot of missions, you could say the same for GM and PT. but w/ all of these 5 types, they each have a different playstyle and contribute something very unique to the game.

the problem w/ the other types is they are too similar. comparing the fortes to the masters, its almost the exact same playstyle but one is way better. also, how much are you willing to lose in order to have a slightly larger weapon selection? it doesnt seem worth it to me.

FT can use long bow and card, and lv 40 support. but you lose so much in exchange for that, its not worth it.

and FF is simply a weak, slow FM that can use handgun and slicer. doesnt sound very good to me. even if someone really liked handguns, it might not be worth the massive lack of power and speed.

it would like if ken was 30% weaker/slower than ryu in street fighter. you can pick ken b/c you like his few unique attacks or the color of his gi but he is too similar and too weak in comparison to ryu to make it worth it.

[acier287]

i have to agree here. whats the point of hybrid classes when master classes do it better. unless your playing the class for fun theres no argument. masterclasses beat forteclasses and hybrid classes...period.

on to the beast cast argument i agree here also theres nothng a beast can do that a cast cant do better. paradi makes all the diffrence. save for maybe 1 or 2 situations where nano actually matters.

[Aisha379]

As someone who plays on both a CAST and a Beast:

I love my beast, it was my first character and still my main. Generally speaking, SUV is best for large groups of weaker enemies, and nano is best on bosses and small groups of large, stronger enemies.

Seriously though people, in the end, I kick copious amounts of ass VERY VERY fast on either character. I do agree Casts are overall stronger and more versatile, but thats because of horrible balancing on Sega's part, and in the end, that horrible balancing makes the game so damn easy that theres really no point in all the nitpicking to begin with.

Well, except for you number lovers and maybe hardcore time attackers, but otherwise, everyone should be able to do great no matter what race/class combination they pick.


Semi-offtopic though, I really do hope they do something about Nanoblast. My beast is a female and the animation is just horridly inconvinent. I use the invincible one though, so I can keep attacking while everyone else is healing and/or dying =X