A clue that there will be no DLC outside Japan? [Archive]

Amherst_Wind

Feb 6, 2009, 08:51 PM

That's unfortunate. It's also more or less what happened to Tales of the World.

With Tales though they only had the items to add, unfortunately adding the items to existing missions in this game is only half a solution. The missions themselves are also needed, they're fun and unique, and missions is pretty much the main thing PS Portable lacks...
I wonder what will be done about Unrecorded Order, has anyone found any Weapon Badges yet? I know I haven't found any but I see someone who data mined the demo found they were in there but what use would they have...

Mike

Feb 6, 2009, 09:02 PM

True. Without new missions, things don't tend to last as long. Since we don't know about the full version, it could be that they are just added in as regular missions. Something tells me they aren't though. Even if badges are still in the data, they just could be "turned off" and not drop. Not offering any post-release support is lazy on SoA's end. It can't be that hard to host a download quest every two weeks.

D14BL0

Feb 7, 2009, 01:23 PM

SEGA has always been very lackluster as far as DLC for any EN-released games. Remember the original PSO? Didn't last too long as far as DLC went. JP release had DLC years after EN support died.

T_Esquire

Feb 7, 2009, 01:32 PM

Yeah but alot of SoJ's thing is all the screw-ups SoA did during PSO on the DC. There was also the rampant cheating through cheat apps like Codebreaker, most commonly done by US players. SoJ just hates the US, period. It's amazing we're even getting PSP and PS0.

Rakukojin

Feb 9, 2009, 12:06 PM

Actually, after some thought, there will have to be DLC in the US version, as there is at least one enemy (Zasharogan) that does NOT show up in any of the preexisting missions.

Akaimizu

Feb 9, 2009, 12:11 PM

As easy it is to distribute the DLC, I don't really see a reason why they wouldn't include it for the US release. Take note, pretty much all the DLC includes basically no actual story material. Mainly just making sure any new items (if they are indeed new) have their descriptions set. And maybe some text to translate trade missions. On the other hand, these are pretty quick translation jobs; and considering the bang-up job they seem to be doing on the US demo, and how fast we're getting this game, shows promise. I kind of dig how we're getting a few new translations for text that the NPCs say during missions. Even the same PM, I remember from before, has new things to say. No simple cut-n-pastes here.

Usually, I would expect the story material, among others, would generally being the slowest translation aspects of the game. Probably why when on the PSO-DC, the japanese side had a slew of missions and all we had was Letters from Lionel, for the longest time.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 9, 2009, 12:44 PM

Actually, after some thought, there will have to be DLC in the US version, as there is at least one enemy (Zasharogan) that does NOT show up in any of the preexisting missions.

The Zasharogan appears inside the 3 person door in the True Darkness multiplayer mission, but you need 3 people. Before DLC in Japan you could see all the enemies however several required you to play multi mode, with DLC however you can find them all in single player.

As easy it is to distribute the DLC, I don't really see a reason why they wouldn't include it for the US release. Take note, pretty much all the DLC includes basically no actual story material. Mainly just making sure any new items (if they are indeed new) have their descriptions set. And maybe some text to translate trade missions. On the other hand, these are pretty quick translation jobs; and considering the bang-up job they seem to be doing on the US demo, and how fast we're getting this game, shows promise. I kind of dig how we're getting a few new translations for text that the NPCs say during missions. Even the same PM, I remember from before, has new things to say. No simple cut-n-pastes here.

Usually, I would expect the story material, among others, would generally being the slowest translation aspects of the game. Probably why when on the PSO-DC, the japanese side had a slew of missions and all we had was Letters from Lionel, for the longest time.

Actually a few of the DLC missions have a lot of text, Forest Labyrinth and Famitsu Quiz Stadium have tons.
But the important aspect isnt if they will or wont, its that Sega US have added all these DLC items to the main game... so why? The most logical answer is that we wont be getting DLC missions, its as simple as that unfrotunately.

Akaimizu

Feb 9, 2009, 01:02 PM

Actually. I wouldnt say that's the most logical answer. It is one possible answer. Or it could be that since the game is coming out after 12 DLC updates, they probably don't want to start the US copy from square one. It is indeed possible for them to include DLC and distribute it on the main disk, if there's room. Who knows, perhaps it'll be loaded with content nearly up to what the Japanese have now, so when the next distribution comes, they will be in line.

This DLC isn't like some special server addition. Nor does it have to deal with bringing servers online to make sure it syncs. It's just a simple Web-file distribution that the users can download and then it installs itself. While the answer could possibly be either way; I'm not going to assume they would go as far as to remove such a feature.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 9, 2009, 01:08 PM

D14BL0

Feb 9, 2009, 04:12 PM

I wouldn't be surprised if there's no DLC in the EN version, but look at it this way.

According to a lot of people who've examined the JP version's code, the item data for ALL items exists, even before it's unlocked by the DLC. It's all there, but disabled until either SoJ says "You can use this now" or by hacking the game; the DLC doesn't actually contain items that the game's code considers "new".

I'm sure the EN version will be exactly the same. If there's no DLC, all of the items will be "unlocked" from the start. So even if there isn't DLC, all the items will be accessible.

However, it wouldn't be strange for SoA to neglect the EN version's DLC. They've done it in the past and it's been a pretty steady trend of giving EN a small handful of DLC missions and then dropping support entirely, while the JP version gets DLC for years and years afterward.

Any of you remember playing PSO? After the DLC ended for EN, the JP version continued to get more and more new stuff, including new MAGs, items, monsters, etc. The EN version actually has most* of this information in its code, but you can't use it without an Action Replay or something of that nature.

*I say "most" because there are a few items that were completely neglected in the EN version. There are a small handful of items that aren't in the EN version's code whatsoever (and they're usually the best items, too).

Akaimizu

Feb 11, 2009, 11:13 AM

True. That's why the current version of the *currently supported* Blue Burst has the extra Japanese download patches applied. Still, I think both portable games will be exciting to play in english...so I'm looking forward to them. From the demo, I actually like the effort, so far.

Lionheart_VIII

Feb 12, 2009, 07:45 AM

man it breaks my heart....

Lionheart_VIII

Feb 12, 2009, 07:50 AM

SEGA will probaly screw the U.S. on DLC....

=' (

Yamishira

Feb 12, 2009, 08:03 AM

So glad I imported the Japanese version right now, if this is certainly the case. It just comes accross as lazy if they cant be bothered to release these missions.

panzer_unit

Feb 12, 2009, 10:58 AM

Well considering the other facts (nobody has been finding Weapons Badges, when the JP demo was full of them, and they are only used in a DLC mission) I still say its the most logical. I will admit there could be other reasons, but if I had to put my money on one reason I'd still stick with mine.

I think it's more logical that the weapon badges got tweaked out of the US demo. If Sega went to the trouble of limiting demo class ranks to 5 and skills to lv11 for demo mode, they could just as easily have gone and pulled weapon badges out of the drop lists rather than loading Trial players up with items they have no use for.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 11:37 AM

I think it's more logical that the weapon badges got tweaked out of the US demo. If Sega went to the trouble of limiting demo class ranks to 5 and skills to lv11 for demo mode, they could just as easily have gone and pulled weapon badges out of the drop lists rather than loading Trial players up with items they have no use for.

You know that backs up my point about the US version having no download missions right?
They removed weapons badges from the entire game (including the trial) because their only use was in a download mission.

panzer_unit

Feb 12, 2009, 11:42 AM

I'm saying you're making nonsense on par with "skills in the US PSP release don't go past 11 because they're not in the demo"... omitting weapon badges makes the trial version more appealing as a stand-alone product, and has no bearing on wether they're going to appear in the release version or not.

I've noticed that the demo has lots of caps in place to prevent players from grinding mightily on the character(s) they intend to import for the release version. Although the amount of effort you can pre-load into character levels, class ranks, photon arts, powerful gear, etc is trivial I did notice that you can still collect Upgrade Grinders and am doing so with great ferocity.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 11:56 AM

Ummm someone is making nonsense here but I'm afraid its not me, you seem to have gravely misread or misunderstood my post.

My point: There will be no DLC for the US version.
My proof: People are not finding Weapons Badges in the US demo.
Explanation: In the Japanese demo people found Weapons Badges. In the Japanese DLC there is a mission to exchange the Weapons Badges.
My conclusion: In the US demo there are no Weapons Badges. In the US they are not available because there will be no DLC mission to use them in.

You seem to have gotten the wrong end of the stick, I've played both trials, I understand the concept of limitations, but thats got nothing to do with what I meant.

panzer_unit

Feb 12, 2009, 12:58 PM

No, I understand your post fine, I just think it's a bunch of sensationalist drama (what? on PSO World?!) instead of a well-reasoned hypothesis.

Where's your proof that weapon badges won't drop in the US retail version? Basing your assumption on the trial is a mistake, it's clear that there have been all kinds of trial-specific tweaks to game data like level, class, and skill caps. Drop charts are the same sort of information and no less likely to have trial-specific changes if you ask me.

Where's your proof that Sega's support for international PSU releases is SO BAD that they would dump something as major as the download missions? Sure the Japanese PS2/PC servers are WAY AHEAD for content updates, but we do eventually see the same things over here even for international PS2/PC version (as far as I know) ... that kind of customer service borders on true love considering that there can't be more than like 1500 people actually using those servers worldwide.

Suppose we still operate on the theory that Sega is lazy... translating some dialog and using all existing code and services to support mission downloads (or better yet packing them on the disc) would be easier than having to change drop charts so that the Weapon Exchange items are all available as drops, whatever drops the weapon exchange items replace have to be checked to ensure they're still available somewhere etc. Supposing Sega hates us fat inferior round-eyes so much to pull the DLC entirely and not make the items available anywhere else, why bother removing Weapon Badges?

Theory:
I think weapon badges were removed specifically from the US Trial version and will be available in the full game.

Proof:
1) Japanese PS2/PC PSU updates tend to have more glitches than when they come out for the international servers. If there's any difference between JP and US demo games, it's more likely to be a deliberate fix of some sort.
2) You can't use weapon badges in the demo game (unlike upgrade grinders) which is one reason Sega would want to remove them. It makes the trial look a little more professional.
3) Considering you can't level your character, class, or even photon arts to their normal maximums, Sega clearly doesn't intend for fans to use the trial version as some warm-up grind on the characters they intend to import to the full game. It makes sense that they don't want Trial players grinding weapon badges either.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 01:21 PM

Honestly, I'd love to argue but;
1) I can see this is all very wishful thinking on your part, that the US version will have Download Missions.
and
2) My point will be made so much better by Sega when the full game comes out.
So I'll keep it short. :)

Have you played the Japanese trial? Obviously not I take it. There is zero point in talking about "blah blah, level caps, skill caps" because that was all the same in the JP trial.

Can you provide one good reason why, after Sega of Japan put Weapons Badges in the JP trial, Sega of America would remove them from the US trial?

I dont think anything makes more sense than 'There is no use for them = remove them'.

Edit: You seem to keep missing this point so I'll put it in bold.
Weapons Badges dropped in the JP Trial

panzer_unit

Feb 12, 2009, 01:41 PM

Honestly, I'd love to argue but;
1) I can see this is all very wishful thinking on your part, that the US version will have Download Missions.
and
2) My point will be made so much better by Sega when the full game comes out.
...
Can you provide one good reason why, after Sega of Japan put Weapons Badges in the JP trial, Sega of America would remove them from the US trial?

1) it's irresponsible to cause a sensationalist panic when you have only a thin piece of evidence to support the racist conjecture that leads to your depressing conclusion.
2) lol probably not.

Sega could have decided after the JP release (like when testing the US localization) to remove weapon badges, since the items are of no use in Trial mode and starting the retail game with a buttload of imported weapon badges probably isn't a great thing for the game experience either. I've already pointed out that PSU has a long history of JP content being released with bugs and getting fixed by the time the same stuff shows up in the US.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 02:19 PM

I can see you haven't played the Japanese game so I'm going to stop now, SoA will prove my point pretty soon because in Japan the game launched with 2 download missions right off the bat. Theres clear evidence that there wont be any download missions, if you dont want to acknowledge it, thats your choice.

1) it's irresponsible to cause a sensationalist panic when you have only a thin piece of evidence to support the racist conjecture that leads to your depressing conclusion.
Wow... you really need to chill out. The only person in a panic seems to be you...

panzer_unit

Feb 12, 2009, 03:01 PM

Theres clear evidence that there wont be any download missions, if you dont want to acknowledge it, thats your choice.

Wow... you really need to chill out. The only person in a panic seems to be you...

There is? If you have clear evidence like a press release or some insider info from Sega stating there will be no DLC support for PSP-US, you should say what it is. Otherwise read the disclaimer when you boot up the trial version of the software - the release version of the product may be different.

Now that you're clearly out of arguments in support of your position, go ahead and flame me or make accusations all you like. I only wanted to make it clear that the absence of weapon badges from the trial version isn't sufficient for suggesting that DLC will be pulled from the actual product.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 04:15 PM

Despite your throughtful suggestion, I have no intentions of flaming you because the difference between us is I couldn't care less about your opinion on the dlc, while you seem to have really become upset about my opinion of it...

So you think that the removal of an item only usable in download missions and the addition of items available only in download missions to regular missions isn't proof enough?

The fact is people thought there might no be dlc before we even had the trial and after the trial most people seem to agree this could be the case.
All I can say is its gonna be all the harder for you to accept when theres no dlc I guess, try not to let it get to you.

Chuck_Norris

Feb 12, 2009, 04:25 PM

I hate to butt in on your conversation argument, but didn't grinders drop from boxes in the JP demo as well? It doesn't seem very far fetched that they would change some things in the demo that they didn't like the first time around. Did clothing drop as much as it does now in the demo? I didn't find an clothes at all when I played the JP version. (And I leveled two characters to 20/5) They might of took the grinder drops out to make it harder to grind, and realease weapon badges in the full release, so they wouldn't take up space. As you might know, in the demo, it's prety easy to fill up on items. As for the bouquet, well, it's also possible that (Like Akaimizu said) they'll include the DLC that japan has already. They seem to have been on the ball lately. (PSU updates, shortening the release date, ect)

Frankly, sodandy, I'm a little surprized at how you just tried to tear Jagd's head off when he posted any other idea than your own. :/

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 04:39 PM

Posting his own idea is fine, several people have, but if someone is going to post "you're wrong because my opinion is different from yours" then they'll get a response. (and geez ripping his head off?? I hardly even raised my voice so to speak)

I suggest people actually read the topic title...
It doesnt say "NO DLC FOR THE US VERSION EVER HAHAHA"
I think hes taking this topic a bit too personally to be honest.

Or then again maybe I am being "irresponsible and causing a sensationalist panic with only a thin piece of evidence to support the racist conjecture that leads to my depressing conclusion."

XD sorry but the more I read that, the more I find it hilarious... has to be the most over dramatic line I've read on a forum lately.

Chuck_Norris

Feb 12, 2009, 05:08 PM

All he said was;

I think it's more logical that the weapon badges got tweaked out of the US demo. If Sega went to the trouble of limiting demo class ranks to 5 and skills to lv11 for demo mode, they could just as easily have gone and pulled weapon badges out of the drop lists rather than loading Trial players up with items they have no use for.

All he was doing was making a logical theory. From how I read it, you came off a little harsh.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 12, 2009, 05:19 PM

You know that backs up my point about the US version having no download missions right?
They removed weapons badges from the entire game (including the trial) because their only use was in a download mission.

Thats what I said in response, you think thats harsh?
I think you'll find the first 'harsh' message was when he said I was talking "nonsense".

Mike

Feb 12, 2009, 07:09 PM

but didn't grinders drop from boxes in the JP demo as well?
I don't remember them dropping from boxes. I remember them dropping from enemies but never boxes. It has been a while since I played the demo though.

I didn't find an clothes at all when I played the JP version. (And I leveled two characters to 20/5)
Neither did I but from what it sounds like, all of the clothing dropping is clothing that is only available in the Japanese DLC. Same goes with a lot of the the extra weapons that only dropped or were available in DLC. Even if they do include DLC up until this point why would they have changed the drop tables so that the weapons dropped from places other than where they are supposed to?

As you might know, in the demo, it's prety easy to fill up on items.
So why drop more weapons instead of an item that stacks?

In the end, Sega hasn't said yay or niegh either way and we can only go on what's different between demos. So with the drop tables changed to have DLC only items dropping from non-DLC areas, I'd say no DLC.

mvffin

Feb 12, 2009, 09:13 PM

panzer_unit

Feb 13, 2009, 10:21 AM

Obviously there's no way to prove either side until the game is out, but so far all signs point to NO DLC. If thats how it is, I'm not buying it. Sega was lazy enough with PSU, I'm not gonna give them more money for another half-assed job.

Sega is SLOW with PSU and AOI and it sucked to play it because of how infrequently content came out, but having quit and stopped caring about it in that respect... coming back to see that even the PS2/PC servers are up AT ALL never mind getting events and updates sorta puts it in a different perspective.

Akaimizu

Feb 13, 2009, 12:57 PM

I don't think it can be proved either way. It's just as easy to say that the US version will auto-include some of the DLC that's already out just to stay close in release availability. To a certain degree, some of us kind of hoped they would include some of the updates in the regular distribution.

Still, it's a wait and see approach with me. I believe the content it will have, will be satisfactory, either way. (Well.....except they better have the Guld and Milla available, in there)

panzer_unit

Feb 13, 2009, 01:32 PM

Rakukojin

Feb 13, 2009, 01:50 PM

I wish SoA would put up some kind of official website. That would probably provide a definitive answer.

Where do you go in the JP release version to download content? Is it on the first menu like New Game/Continue/Download? Or in-game like Guardians' HQ?

Go to "Download" on the title screen, follow the prompts and you'll be taken to a web page. Choose the bottom box in the lower left, then choose the only boxes that appear near the center of the following pages, then choose the left option at the prompt and the file with the download missions will start downloading.

Amherst_Wind

Feb 13, 2009, 02:03 PM

As soon as we see the full games Main Menu it should be pretty clear, the JP menu is;

New Game
Continue
Import
Download

Import is specifically for importing characters from the trial version and nothing else, so we know that will be there.

Download is used for only two things; transfering characters from JP PC/PS2 servers (a feature we know we are not getting) and to download the lastest Download Mission file.

Though there is another way to get the DLC onto your PSP (going to the official JP PS Portable site and downloading it to your PC, then putting it on your PSP with a cable) I'd say if theres no Download menu option then that is a huge indication that there wont be any DLC.