Guntecher Frag PAs

[Dymalos]

Hello, I've recently returned to the game after having quit back in the fall of 2007. My main was and is a Guntecher, back then I spent my frags on Yak Zagana and Mayalee Fury, in hindsight I probably shouldn't have done that. But anyway I've been breezing through the Story Missions, and now I've gotten another 90 PA frags, my question is what discs should I buy with them?

I'm considerng either Killer Shot for dealing with Robots or Giresta. But I'm open to any suggestions outside of these.

[Ace1jeM]

I would get Killer Shot first and level that up while you save up for Giresta next, since Giresta can be leveled in buff parties (and I think Killer Shot would be more important to get for a Guntecher).

[Chuck_Norris]

Depends, really. Do you play a lot of missions with robots? If so, then you'd probably wanna go with Killer Shot first. But if not, I'd say Giresta. Especially if you like to play in groups.

[Dymalos]

My primary partner is also a gunner and generally incapable of defeating high level robots, he also just recently picked up Killer Shot. I went ahead and got it as well because I figure it'll make it go a bit quicker to have two killer shots plucking away at the monsters.

Definitely doing Giresta next I suppose.

Also should I level Mayalee Fury? I've heard that it's useful for twitch locking sub bosses and generally big monsters, but how often does this strategy get employed?

[darkante]

Killer Shot is excellent at lv 21+.

Scrap Mayalee fury, it´s just a waste of time. Things go down relative fast as it is.

[Hrith]

Yak Zagenga? =/

I wouldn't get Giresta, it's useless enough at Lv50, let alone Lv30.

[panzer_unit]

What's wrong with Giresta?
I always find the banked HP regeneration useful when I whip out Boma Duranga.

[Akaimizu]

Funny enough. Whenever I switch from Guntecher to Gunmaster, I tend to realize how much I could tank a bit using that Giresta buffer. Even in the offshoot case you get blind-sided by a strong hit, and then it did nothing because the buffer auto-recovered the damage. Almost funny how, if I take some hits a little here and there, the Giresta makes it seem I didn't..but since soloing Gunmaster, the same situations I have to remember to heal more often.

There hasn't been a lot of actually useful Ult PAs for a Guntecher to buy. I find Giresta one of the more decent ones. Besides, you'll have more PA frags than you'll know what to do with.

[Hiero_Glyph]

Yak Zagenga? =/

I wouldn't get Giresta, it's useless enough at Lv50, let alone Lv30.

Please ignore Hrith, he really believes that his opinions provide evidence to suport his case. Besides, he's mostly harmless on these forums as he cannot delete your posts.

Simply put, Giresta heals for a fixed % (3% of the player's total health every ~5 seconds at 21-30) every tick for the entire duration of the technics (4 minutes at 21-30). Any time the tick activates but no health needs to be healed, it stores this amount into a buffer. This buffer will activate any time a player takes damage and instantly heal them for the amount of the damage or until the entire buffer is used.

What this means is that Giresta is a great utility PA for GTs as you will often be engaged against an enemy and unable to heal others immediately. Giresta will help to cover these times and provide some healing for those players without you even having to lift a finger. Likewise it will heal you as well and make your life much, much easier when you take a few hits.

Just remember that Giresta is a buff and should be cast with your other buffs. Also note that if you cast Giresta again before the current duration expires it will reset any amount of health stored into the buffer back to zero. As a result you only want to cast Giresta when you cast the other buffs. It should also be noted that casting Resta will have no effect upon the buffer from Giresta and that you should use Resta exclusively once you have allowed the Giresta buffer to build.

If you have any other questions regarding Giresta feel free to ask. I encourage you to try it out for yourself and see if you feel that using Giresta is useful for you or not. Alternatively you can simply listen to Hrith and not use it since his opinion is absolute. The choice is yours.

[biggabertha]

Giresta takes longer to cast, heals for around the same as Resta, costs more PP than Resta and upsets things with Yak Zagenga users.

Giresta's got a nice sound to it being cast though and most of the time, PP is hardly an issue. That just leaves the HP buffer thing and the time taken to cast it.

The HP buffer thing doesn't stack so you magically have more HP than you already have - you still take the huge damage then the HP goes back on quickly.

Case in point - I got hit for 3500+ damage on my Protranser. He has over 3300HP and had a whole minute of stacked Giresta on him. I still died.

I also know that it's probably not worth using Giresta with Boma Duranga - one shot takes off about 1000HP off of me. Which is one or two more shots of Boma Duranga before I have to use a Trimate or the Force uses Resta/Giresta.

Sure, they can get off one Diga/Foie in that time but if you're doing the Trimates, why bother having Giresta if it'll save you 500 meseta from that extra trimate used...?


Giresta revives people, I forgot about that but a scape doll will bring you back too - and so will Moon Atomizers. It might be useful in the restricted /R missions though.

One though, Bruce died while me and my friends were doing Bruce's Dungeon S but because my friend was casting Giresta at the time, he was revived straight away and we didn't get a failure of any sort. (We S ranked it after that, I think, heh).

So, it has some limited uses - but I'd only use it cosmetically. When Resta gets to Lv. 31+, it looks so pretty that I am going to have a real hard time to know which one to use.

Obviously, if you're going for Time attacks, you will go for Resta hands down. Every split second counts and adds up.

Giresta just sounds nicer - that's my only opinion of it.

Oh, wait... the way you can have +69 coming up from behind you is also golden if you have the right amount of HP.

[darkante]

Simply put, just use Giresta for that fast regen buff.
And then just proceed to use Resta until it wears off.

Easy no?

[panzer_unit]

Giresta takes longer to cast, heals for around the same as Resta, costs more PP than Resta and upsets things with Yak Zagenga users.
...
I also know that it's probably not worth using Giresta with Boma Duranga - one shot takes off about 1000HP off of me. Which is one or two more shots of Boma Duranga before I have to use a Trimate or the Force uses Resta/Giresta.

This will change next year or something but since none of the Master classes can use Crossbows, probably nobody who's a prick about time attacks will be shooting Yak Zagenga. I doubt anyone still playing Fighgunner cares if you're messing up their 1HP run. It's not like resta magically leaves your Fighgunner alone either. You heal anybody, you will heal your crossbow dude unless he is lost somewhere in the previous block.

The difference between someone using Giresta effectively and not has always been very noticable to me as a Protranser shooting Duranga in missions like Awoken Serpent with lots of stuff to use grenades against. You can whip out your grenade, help blow something away and not have to panic-heal in the middle of the process. In a big party it totally frees you from having to put anything but atomizers and traps on palette, in a small party it will take a big bite out of how hard you hit your stack of trimate over the course of a tough mission.

[Syl]

Giresta and Killer Shot easily come to mind. Yak Zagenga is a waste as GT, considering that if you're doing your job, you'll be dropping heals whenever you can.

You might want to check out the debuff shottie PA, it's not too horrible and it's decent in small parties where shit doesn't drop in a second or two. This one is totally optional though considering it's not a big priority to get at all. It acts as a good PA dump after getting Giresta and KS and it's good against neutral enemies.

One thing you have to remember about Giresta is that it lightens the load on the healer. Sure it doesn't prevent you from getting 1 shot, but if you drop to a dangerously low amount, the heal padding is there to bring you up from getting scratched to death. Using Giresta instead of Resta though is bad as it is slower and a bigger TP drain.

[ArmedesInf.X9000]

Other options to consider maybe Megistar good if u really wanna use Yak zenaga(a typo maybe) as it decreases ur HP, r even save up and use Megid(i dont quite remember if u need 99 or 90 PA frags atm) Megid is a gr8 alternative to Killer shot and u dont need to lower ur rank in weapons if u dont want to that way. Some other options that i think should be considered :D

[Dymalos]

Alright, I've taken up Killer Shot, and I still have about 180 potential PA frags from the story missions. So I'm thinking I'll go Giresta (90 PAFs) -> Megistar (25 PAFs) -> Hikai Shuha-zan (25 PAFs).

Are either of the Twin Handgun or Longbow License PAs' worth considering?

[ShonagarACE]

Alright, I've taken up Killer Shot, and I still have about 180 potential PA frags from the story missions. So I'm thinking I'll go Giresta (90 PAFs) -> Megistar (25 PAFs) -> Hikai Shuha-zan (25 PAFs).

Are either of the Twin Handgun or Longbow License PAs' worth considering?

I think Chousei is a safe bet, I plan on getting it for GT. Should be pretty mean at 40.

In before someone like Hrith says it's the worst idea ever to do anything at all.

[biggabertha]

Twin Penetration has really low range and mimics the use of a Laser Cannon. It's only benefit seems to be tagging enemies - it's so very weak... but I saw/noticed how it got a slight change in the future from the JP servers. I think a lowered PP cost and a higher ATP modifier (currently, it's about 100% at Lv. 40 I think...).

Twin Mayalee deals tier 2 Zalure to enemies it hits. It's otherwise, fairly weak for pure damage. Defence down isn't as useful as it was but if Machineguns eventually become the strongest weapons going, Zalure might actually start to come in handy.


Chousei-Sou is a slower firing rate on the already slow firing rate of Longbow. It does have longer range and a nice ATA modifier though but I think you'd be better off with elemental longbow PAs for damage and SEs but it could come in handy for the range. It doesn't hit worms from far away though - normal Longbow and Handgun-type weapons fare better there (and Rifles).

Masei-Sou is a short range PA with Stun lv. 2. It's got an even slower firing rate than Chousei-Sou and costs a lot to use. It even has a shamefully low ATA modifier but in a future update, it gets a nice boost in SE, firing rate and a lowered PP cost.

I'm not totally sure on the details but I am fairly sure that as things are now, you don't necessarily need any of those four PAs.


Hikai Shuha-zan's a good choice, I'd almost forgotten about that one.

Yak Zagenga's nice for the ATA modifier on it and is really awesome to use on neutral enemies. Probably the best thing against the humanoids that love to duck and tumble around.



I still don't like Giresta for any practical reasons - I prefer it aesthetically. Boma Duranga's rarely an issue unless I'm fighting a boss - I have Boma Riga, Boma Diga and Boma Megiga for those situations that I need to keep enemies pinned or for general damage.

Fortegunners, Fighgunners and Guntechers will want Yak Zagenga in the future with the AotI supplemental update, I'm sure - getting an extra 10% accuracy sounds kinda nice, to be honest...

When we get Military Subway S3 - I REALLY wanna start abusing PAs like Phantasm Prism, Frozen Prism, Yak Zagenga, Yak Maga and if we ever get De Ragnus S5 or something, I want to put Mayalee Shot/Hit to good use...!

[ShonagarACE]

Chousei-Sou is a slower firing rate on the already slow firing rate of Longbow. It does have longer range and a nice ATA modifier though but I think you'd be better off with elemental longbow PAs for damage and SEs but it could come in handy for the range. It doesn't hit worms from far away though - normal Longbow and Handgun-type weapons fare better there (and Rifles).


Yeah, all of that is pretty good advice. But as long as we're talking about that update we'll get in the distant future, Longbow's in general get a firing speed increase. I'll still be leveling this one. :-)

[biggabertha]

Chousei-Sou has about two or three steps more range than the elemental PAs when they're at Lv. 40.

I've got all eight Longbow PAs at Lv. 40 and trust me, if you want damage, Ensei-Sou, Jisei-Sou and Insei-Sou do more damage than Chousei-Sou PER HIT (unless you're shooting fire creatures with Ensei-Sou etc.).

If you want the longer range, go on ahead but you never really need it. Even though it takes the same amount of hits to level, the elemental Longbow PAs will level faster than Chousei-Sou and muuuuuuuuuch faster than Masei-Sou.

Unless you just want to level one Longbow PA and ignore the rest. Then I have no argument at all.

[ShonagarACE]

Chousei-Sou has about two or three steps more range than the elemental PAs when they're at Lv. 40.

I've got all eight Longbow PAs at Lv. 40 and trust me, if you want damage, Ensei-Sou, Jisei-Sou and Insei-Sou do more damage than Chousei-Sou PER HIT (unless you're shooting fire creatures with Ensei-Sou etc.).

If you want the longer range, go on ahead but you never really need it. Even though it takes the same amount of hits to level, the elemental Longbow PAs will level faster than Chousei-Sou and muuuuuuuuuch faster than Masei-Sou.

Unless you just want to level one Longbow PA and ignore the rest. Then I have no argument at all.

Well I'm personally not a fan of leveling every PA for a weapon. I have Insei-sou at 40 and Raisei-sou at 21, but I wasn't planning on using any of the other elemental bullets. So would that still be a decent idea, using Chousei when those bullets don't match the situation? That's pretty much what I was going to do. And I don't know what else I would spend my frags on.

[Syl]

I'd only get Megistar if you're soloing. The last thing you need to be as a GT is a selfish techer ;l

[Hiero_Glyph]

I'd only get Megistar if you're soloing. The last thing you need to be as a GT is a selfish techer ;l

When soloing I swap out the TCSM from my buff slot for an extra machinegun and simply use Giresta and Megistar on the wand.

[Dymalos]

I am getting Megistar for soloing. I know most people discount Guntechers as terrible soloers, but I seem to do alright. I'll still keep Shifta and Zodial handy for when I do group up. Mostly I split my time 50/50 solo and grouping. I wouldn't mind grouping more but it's not so easy to find players around my level.

[biggabertha]

You've got a great mindset already from the get-go, far better than I did when I began.

Back then, it was just: "omg, I can't play with others, my PAs aren't capped and I don't have any A/S rank weapons!!!"

Being a team player is really cool, I have to learn to be not-so-selfish to tell others what they should use rather than what isn't so good to use.

(Or was that the other way around...?)


Either way, Longbows level extremely quickly to Lv. 30. They level to 40 rather slowly, sure but you're going to really feel it with Chousei-Sou in comparison to the other Longbow PAs.

With that supplemental update, I am interested to see for myself how much they will boost it - afterall, I still have two Chousei-Sous to raise to Lv. 40 and Lv. 30 respectively. Wether or not getting them now or after the update for the increased firing rate is up for question though because I REALLY would want them already at their capped levels before I start on any kind of playing in that area.


Oops... so off topic...

Guntecher is cool for soloing - watch out for bullet resistant enemies and give Yak Zagenga a chance if you are going solo. It's a very good solo PA to use in conjunction with Megistar.

Nicely enough, I think Giresta balances out the damage dealt by Megistar at a certain point... but that's no good if you want to use Yak Zagenga...


I'd perhaps consider the Handgun PA fragment bullets too - but you already have Resta and access to Laser Cannons... so both of them get completed old and fairly redundant. Again though, with the supplemental update, that could change for the /R missions, heh.

[Akaimizu]

Guntechers are great solo artists, particularly in their end game. Nowadays, I kind of rip through levels without much effort. I'm a firm believer in staying buffed and keeping my party that way, as a GT. In solo, the combination of my bullet levels, buffs, and specific techs joined with a nice Flame R-mag, generally makes short work of about anything in the game. It's as if I have something to get around any enemy defense. However, it was a long road to get there, further complicated by how long it *used* to take to raise bullets/techs..especially at lower levels.

I guess a new starting GT, these days, would take significantly less time to reach their end game. You kind of have to suck in the fact that much of what you S-class in, isn't necessarily your strongest attack at the time. However, everything can have their use based on your situation and playstyle. Me. I tend to be all over the place, making pallettes that allow me to attack a specific different situation as fast as possible. They've had days of struggle before, but the end game, as I always thought it would be, is definitely satisfying.

[Dymalos]

Well I've lost my momentum in the story missions. It was a good run, and I got 110 PA frags out of it. But I was unable to score an S rank in Rescuing Hyuga #2, I'm simply not prepared for speedily taking out Tirentos robots and Shielded Gaozorans. Fell short by about a minute and a half. Probably going to need to level up a bit more before attempting it again.

[panzer_unit]

I'd perhaps consider the Handgun PA fragment bullets too - but you already have Resta and access to Laser Cannons... so both of them get completed old and fairly redundant. Again though, with the supplemental update, that could change for the /R missions, heh.

The Penetrating bullets rack up hits at an insane rate ... they're must-haves for CAST and Beast characters, especially on solo missions. You'll never go without a fully charged special attack.

I'd say get Chousei-sou and no other skills for bow. Proper element rifle (or even a handgun) cranks out damage at a better rate, but it's cool to be able to spam shots on moving boss targets without the interruption of having to run around to get in range.

[rayner]

I would go with Yak Maga... it will do 2% / 7% more damage at lv 40 than elemental bullets against opposite element, and Jellen. It will eat through your PP though, but with Photon Charges used from the Pallet giving back 100% to both weapons, it's not a problem anymore. I believe it also has 15% more ATA. I forget... it's usually overlooked, but the poor elemental % on Crossbows actually makes 175% ATP modifier pretty good.

I also go with Giresta because I solo ALOT, so I don't care if I reset the bank, and I'll revive my meat-shields at will. I love doing Sakura Blast as my Guntecher... now if a Milla would drop already :-(

[unicorn]

I personally like:

Bullets:
Chousei-sou : Long range. Eventually will be buffed with the supplemental update.

Techs:
Giresta : Regen-buff.
Megid: Used with a dark Ebrozike/Frauduke, and you got yourself a Killer Prism.


PAs I wouldn't get:
Yak Zangega: As a GT, you should always be healing. It might have use in soloing, but FG and FI make better use of it IMO.

Yak Maga: You already have access to Jellen.

Masei-sou: Although the supplemental update buffs it, you can still Freeze/Shock. And most neutral enemies can be burned/get virus, which would deal more damage anyway.

Any other techs. Noszonde/Nosmegid are useless because you have bows/rifles. Regrants is useless. Don't look at Megiverse. Perhaps Nosdiga might be useful, but you already have Diga/Foie.

Barada Chamga: Attract enemies toward you? >_> This is more of a PT skill.

Twin Handguns: They suck. You already have Zalure and would be able to accompany it with a Crossbow/Card/Machinegun. Twin Penetration doesn't sound to practical either.

Handgun PAs: Just no.

[Dymalos]

I was able to finish up a few more story missions successfully, largely thanks to getting Killer Shot to 21. I have to say that 2 people spamming killer shot is an excellent way to breeze through robot heavy missions, all the while earning some excellent XP.

So far I've gotten Killer Shot, Giresta and Hikai Shuha-zan. I'm nearing the 25 PA Frags needed for Megistar, and I'm probably going to get Chousei-sou after that.

Also, I'm not very keen to use Beast Form as a Guntecher... it seems like I do comparable damage with my 30+% 9* Daggers maybe because I run with the Defense Form.

[Dymalos]

Well it's been a while, sorry for the necropost. But I've been doing other types on my main, and only now switched back to GT. And I've got a question that directly relates to this topic, I never really got into shotguns, but I picked up a 5/10 Madam Brella at a good price. I'm wondering if Barada Chamga makes a good substitute for the 6 Elementals, I know it'll suck PP like the subject of some obscene pornagraphic analogy... but is it doable?

[Darki]

It does less damage and also doesn't do spread damage (I mean that each bullet can hit more than 1 targets), so with elemental ones you can, for example, hit 5~6 monsters with only 3~4 bullets but here you'll be stick to max 5 hits.

I don't like shotties on GT, I prefer Xbow for mobility and fast resta swap.

[Dymalos]

Thanks for that info. I guess I'll level all 6 bullets. After hitting the level and type cap, I'm beginning to place a lot more emphasis on DPS over things like mobility and Resta accessibility. 20 of all the Mates are more than enough to do the mission, and killing quickly is more money and loot efficient than simply saving a couple thousand on Mates. I still love the Xbow, but Shotguns are simply monstrous in their damage output and I can't very well ignore them just because I don't S-Rank them, especially considering that a Guntecher will be a better soloer than a GM once the supplemental update hits. We'll have GM base ATP, at least level 42 Bullets and Effect Level 3 Buffs.