Who here think's PSZ has a lot more depth than what it lets on?

[GHNeko]

see topic title


i ask because as i post and lurk (lolwut) on these forums, i keep coming over random tidbits that dont seem to be common knowledge and geniuenly new.

i thought this game was like a PSO Lite, but i'm starting to think different.

Don't get me wrong. It doesnt have all the depth and potential of PSO, but i think there is more to this game on what I initially let on, despite i already figured this game had some depth.

i'm guessing i gauged it incorrectly and not deep enough.

does anyone share this sentimate?

inb4JP_PSZ_Players.

[somaclast]

Well yeah there is an incredible amount of esoteric detail that isnt in the manual that people either have to learn through trial and error or previous PSO knowledge...but yeah I agree haha.

[Epically Leet]

Is has plenty of depth, indeed!

I would say the fact that I don't understand everything - even after 20 hours of gameplay - proves this. At least to me.

[Amherst_Wind]

What would a JP PS Zero player have to say that would be so detrimental to your point? :l

[Kishiin]

I agree. As a seasoned PSO, even PSU veteran, a lot of the basics of this game will get picked up on, but I feel that this is one of those games that would have benefited from a longer instruction manual for new players.

[Dawndus]

I feel that this is one of those games that would have benefited from a longer instruction manual for new players.

This, definitely. Pop over on the Gamespot PZ0 forums, and prepare to be in shock. About 50%+ of the people there haven't ever played a Phantasy Star game in their life.

And back on topic, this game is huge for being in such a small cart. :p

[StaticWings19]

i do agree that there is much more to this game than it lets on.

game wise im still finding new controlls (and i JUST used the photon fortafier guy)

plot wise im trying to debate if it ties in to PSO at all. (@tm im thinking it may come before it)

[BIG OLAF]

plot wise im trying to debate if it ties in to PSO at all. (@tm im thinking it may come before it)

It comes well after the story of the Pioneer Project (PSO). You'll figure it out for yourself soon enough.

[StaticWings19]

It comes well after the story of the Pioneer Project (PSO). You'll figure it out for yourself soon enough.

REALLY! ive already beaten it and it didnt really say anything about that.

i assumed prequal because the pioneers were fleeing a dying planet (and the planet in zero is sort of dying) and also they called the planet earth (not ragol) so i assumed it all happened after earth died and they moved on.

EDIT: also because the weapons look older and more western. (less cyberpunk more steam)

[GHNeko]

What would a JP PS Zero player have to say that would be so detrimental to your point? :l

They've had the game for practically a year longer so they probably can possibly know a lot more, or probably everything and disagree with me.

When you're more knowledgeable, you can properly gauge something better, so there is the chance that a JP player could come in and say, "No. What US knows now is almost everything already." etc etc.

[Akaimizu]

No. I wouldn't say that. Heck, some of us Japanese players learned new stuff *after* the US version came out. When it came to this game, not everything was revealed or understood while just the Japanese version was out.

But even then, this game did have some neat stuff, tucked away, that we had to discover along the way. But any good Phantasy Star online game does that. It has plenty of easy-access features that a player can jump in with, but more things to discover as they play. Not only that, other differences that come with playing online and with a different set of players on different maps. There are some interesting setups or traps, switches, etc. that don't show their heads until you eventually land the proper random setup of a particular location to see.

How chained PBs work is another thing I didn't know much about until the US version, as well. I got a recent PB that has a pretty good 2 chain bonus. What it does is put a good level of both buffs on your party members and both debuffs on the enemy. It's great to see them work together because it's like having a 4X damage modifier.

To the credit of this game, coming up with a true random map configuration, was an idea that works better than what one first sees. While initially, the building blocks of the random maps don't immediately impress; what you may run into when all parts come together, can be unique. It goes a long way to keeping things fresh, even if you run the same map locale over and over again.

[Hatrix]

I thought PSZ possibly took place after PSO when Sarisa was talking about a book she borrowed me about two hunters that saved the world. Maybe they where Rico & Flowen. She also mentions about slaying of dragons or whatever but its still kind of vague.

[TaciturnBadger]

Personally, I think this has quickly become one of the most in-depth and functionally impressive action/RPG's available for the DS today. My biggest complaint with the system on its whole was that the list of titles available all seemed largely "gimmicky," even some of the better ones (Phantom Hourglass is a perfect example). As far as how deep you want to go, I'm a firm believer that the entire Phantasy Star line goes as deep as you want it to. Sure, you can beat Normal and say you're done with it, but then you're missing out on some of the games finer aspects.

On the same token, I also believe that the games' nuances are left mostly out of the instruction manual. As a hardcore PSO/PSU player, sure, I can pick up the game and knock most of the idiosyncrasies out of the park just from experience. So the manual tells you how to feed a mag, sure -- but does it tell you what the different effects on combat and gameplay are, in a realistic setting? Or provide enough of an overview that giving a FOnewm's mag 57 Clear Sabres is a really, really fretarded idea? No. Of course, that all comes from experience.. which, sadly, can't be taught. For a complete noob to the series, it probably does have a steep learning curve. Immediately having said that.. any MMO with a die-hard following will all-but require enough depth to create a steep learning curve.

All that rambling aside..

..it's PSO I can take with me. I mean, I can punch Dark Falz while taking a dump at Burger King. How much @$$ does that kick?!?!

[Epically Leet]

Don't take dumps in public restrooms. When you least expect it, something'll come up from the toilet and bite you in the butt.

[TaciturnBadger]

I typically don't, it was mostly for illustrative purposes. I don't need a toilet booma trying to get a little too personal with my backside...

[GHNeko]

No. I wouldn't say that. Heck, some of us Japanese players learned new stuff *after* the US version came out. When it came to this game, not everything was revealed or understood while just the Japanese version was out.

Well, coming from my gaming roots. It applies to me, so I guess it's habitual me to apply it here. Hurr.

[Blood Raven]

Being a newbie to the series I must say I love this game. I bought it from reading what you all said but now having it makes it seem so much more complicated. I read a ton of stuff but even when you go through the game there is so much you don't think about till it's right in your face or after its gone and your like hey...wait a minute.

I do have to admit the little info packet they gave with the game simply didn't do much. However, I assume it is on purpose and they are trying to get people to buy the strategy guide (I am considering this). I do agree this is the best RPG out there for DS and it is more complicated then many MMORPG's I play. This was well worth the 35 dollars I spent. :D

[BIG OLAF]

i assumed prequal because the pioneers were fleeing a dying planet (and the planet in zero is sort of dying) and also they called the planet earth (not ragol) so i assumed it all happened after earth died and they moved on.


Do the side quest "Mother's Memories". Actually, I might as well tell you.

[SPOILER-BOX]The Earth of PSZ was called "Coral" before the Great Blank. If you remember correctly, the home planet that the people aboard the Pioneer ships fled was also called "Coral". As for them fleeing a "dying planet", that much is correct. The Coralians (I guess?) built Mother Trinity to help alleviate the environmental problems, but Dark Falz "infected" her, and she went berserk. Following this, most people went underground, but some boarded the Pioneers 1 & 2 to attempt and find a new, suitable planet for (eventually) everyone on Coral to escape to.

Needless to say, everyone got screwed, anyway.[/SPOILER-BOX]

[zetagear]

Don't take dumps in public restrooms. When you least expect it, something'll come up from the toilet and bit you in the butt.
zombieland hahaha

back @ topic

yes theres a lot of depth in psz its even a dating sim and a hentai game(OMG tentacles... pee...) XD

[Randomness]

Do the side quest "Mother's Memories". Actually, I might as well tell you.

[SPOILER-BOX]The Earth of PSZ was called "Coral" before the Great Blank. If you remember correctly, the home planet that the people aboard the Pioneer ships fled was also called "Coral". As for them fleeing a "dying planet", that much is correct. The Coralians (I guess?) built Mother Trinity to help alleviate the environmental problems, but Dark Falz "infected" her, and she went berserk. Following this, most people went underground, but some boarded the Pioneers 1 & 2 to attempt and find a new, suitable planet for (eventually) everyone on Coral to escape to.

Needless to say, everyone got screwed, anyway.[/SPOILER-BOX]

Response to spoilers:

Actually, I'd argue that the Pioneer Project left before Mother Trinity went corrupt. Once she went berserk, she wiped the planet clean pretty fast... That, and it would make Falz's appearance coincide nicely between PSO and PS0. So... 200 years after Zero? This of course, assumes that the Pioneer ships can ignore special relativity (Which is what makes lightspeed an absolute speed barrier), though, given the times in the PSO Ep I intro, and the warp-gate-ish seal (that happens to be the title screen, photon blasts, etc as well), this is likely.[/spoiler-box]

Mild spoilers:PS0 is probably [spoiler]200ish years after PSO

PS0 could have done with less in-your-face plot points. PSO requires a decent amount of speculation to piece everything together.

[Eclipse5632]

PS0 could have done with less in-your-face plot points. PSO requires a decent amount of speculation to piece everything together.
I don't like having to speculate about what happened in the game I just played. I liked how PSO had that kind of cryptic conspiracy-theory-type plot, but I never got a solid answer as to what the hell was going on and I'm too lazy to scour the internet for answers.

[Randomness]

I don't like having to speculate about what happened in the game I just played. I liked how PSO had that kind of cryptic conspiracy-theory-type plot, but I never got a solid answer as to what the hell was going on and I'm too lazy to scour the internet for answers.

True. PSO doesn't really give you a definitive answer for a lot of things... but most of it IS eventually stated outright.

Not sure how much more detail was in BB's gov't quests.

[Eclipse5632]

True. PSO doesn't really give you a definitive answer for a lot of things... but most of it IS eventually stated outright.

Not sure how much more detail was in BB's gov't quests.
Admittedly, I never completed Episode 2 and never touched 3, so that might have something to do with it now that I think about it. >_>

Oh well.

[MinscTFA]

Well yeah there is an incredible amount of esoteric detail that isnt in the manual that people either have to learn through trial and error or previous PSO knowledge...but yeah I agree haha.

I'm reminded of the different thickness of the manuals in my Japanese and English copy of PS0. The english manual, which has both english and french, is thinner than its Japanese counterpart (no color either >.> ). May have something to do with the font size but I still think things are dumbed down.

[StaticWings19]

Response to spoilers:

Actually, I'd argue that the Pioneer Project left before Mother Trinity went corrupt. Once she went berserk, she wiped the planet clean pretty fast... That, and it would make Falz's appearance coincide nicely between PSO and PS0. So... 200 years after Zero? This of course, assumes that the Pioneer ships can ignore special relativity (Which is what makes lightspeed an absolute speed barrier), though, given the times in the PSO Ep I intro, and the warp-gate-ish seal (that happens to be the title screen, photon blasts, etc as well), this is likely.[/spoiler-box]

Mild spoilers:PS0 is probably [spoiler]200ish years after PSO

PS0 could have done with less in-your-face plot points. PSO requires a decent amount of speculation to piece everything together.

mmmmm yeah ill get right on that mission.

so Zetagear, you're saying that [SPOILER-BOX] 1 the planet that PSZ happens on starts to die. 2. they build mother trinity 3 Mother gets infected. 4 they board the pioneers? [/SPOILER-BOX]


and randomness says that [SPOILER-BOX]the pioneer project launced and the people who got left behind built trinity in a last attempt for survival? [/SPOILER-BOX]

id have to agree with randomness since pioneer 2 was supposed to have almost everyone from coral on board meaning that few people would be left and would be the ones who [SPOILER-BOX]built mother trinity in a last ditch effort to survive[/SPOILER-BOX]

anyone with evidence against that, do speak up!

[zetagear]

mmmmm yeah ill get right on that mission.

so Zetagear, you're saying that [SPOILER-BOX] 1 the planet that PSZ happens on starts to die. 2. they build mother trinity 3 Mother gets infected. 4 they board the pioneers? [/SPOILER-BOX]


and randomness says that [SPOILER-BOX]the pioneer project launced and the people who got left behind built trinity in a last attempt for survival? [/SPOILER-BOX]

id have to agree with randomness since pioneer 2 was supposed to have almost everyone from coral on board meaning that few people would be left and would be the ones who [SPOILER-BOX]built mother trinity in a last ditch effort to survive[/SPOILER-BOX]

anyone with evidence against that, do speak up!
as long as i get to have popcorns and watch what happens

[Night SSc7]

we'll never know unless sega tells us, relax and wait for it

[TaciturnBadger]

As far as the timeline goes, I'd have to say that PSZ would have to have occurred first. It seems pretty backwards to say that PSZ, which has Booma Origins and such, happened afterwards. Of course, this is all speculation until Sega makes an official release. Though I could, plausibly, see the following sequence of events:

1.) Coral is already starting to decline as a result of ravaging wars.
2.) Mother Trinity is built to correct the matter, and Dark Falz corrupts her.
3.) Mother Trinity wipes out Coral and contaminates the planet.
4.) Some of the survivors on Coral build Pioneer 1 and 2 to find a non-contaminated planet.
5.) Pioneer 1 and 2 depart for Ragol.
6.) In the wake of any interplanetary disaster, there will be isolated pockets of survivors, which begin rebuilding civilization.
7.) Dark Falz occupies new host body in Rico on Ragol and is too distracted by the events there to pay any attention to Coral's rebuilding.
8.) Pioneer 2 hunters waste Rico, returning Dark Falz's attention to Coral, thereby cuing Mother Trinity to send Reve and Sarisa down to the surface.
9.) Cue PSZ plotline.

Of course, this assumes that Dark Falz, as a crazy interstellar consciousness bent on chaos and destruction, can occupy two entities at the same time. Granted, it's completely spastic, but hey, we are dealing with a crazy video game plot, here.

[StaticWings19]

As far as the timeline goes, I'd have to say that PSZ would have to have occurred first. It seems pretty backwards to say that PSZ, which has Booma Origins and such, happened afterwards. Of course, this is all speculation until Sega makes an official release. Though I could, plausibly, see the following sequence of events:

1.) Coral is already starting to decline as a result of ravaging wars.
2.) Mother Trinity is built to correct the matter, and Dark Falz corrupts her.
3.) Mother Trinity wipes out Coral and contaminates the planet.
4.) Some of the survivors on Coral build Pioneer 1 and 2 to find a non-contaminated planet.
5.) Pioneer 1 and 2 depart for Ragol.
6.) In the wake of any interplanetary disaster, there will be isolated pockets of survivors, which begin rebuilding civilization.
7.) Dark Falz occupies new host body in Rico on Ragol and is too distracted by the events there to pay any attention to Coral's rebuilding.
8.) Pioneer 2 hunters waste Rico, returning Dark Falz's attention to Coral, thereby cuing Mother Trinity to send Reve and Sarisa down to the surface.
9.) Cue PSZ plotline.

Of course, this assumes that Dark Falz, as a crazy interstellar consciousness bent on chaos and destruction, can occupy two entities at the same time. Granted, it's completely spastic, but hey, we are dealing with a crazy video game plot, here.

but we need to take into account that when dark falz was released in PSO he had been imprisoned in the ruins for a very long time already. meaning that either he can warp space and time, or exist in two places at once.

honestly i wouldnt be too surprised at either.

[TaciturnBadger]

Hmm, good point. Or, here's a couple of other possibilities:

1.) There are multiple Dark Falzes, all of whom are bent on destroying every vestige of Pokémon in the multiverses.

2.) Dark Falz is actually a pissed-off Pal Rappy who was born with only yellow feathers and didn't get a Tootise Roll, therefore he can occupy any non-Tootsie Roll-affected person at any point in time. He was imprisoned on Ragol for so long because Tootsie Rolls only existed on Coral until the idiots on Pioneer 1 brought Tootsie Rolls and cakes with them (hence the existence of the sweet shop in the caves, which allowed Dark Falz to resurface fully).

3.) Dark Falz is now occupying Richard Simmons.

[Zephton]

Don't take dumps in public restrooms. When you least expect it, something'll come up from the toilet and bit you in the butt.

sig'd

[Epically Leet]

I've been sig'd! Awesome.

It includes a typo which I just edited out, though. ("Bit" instead of "bite".)

[StaticWings19]

Hmm, good point. Or, here's a couple of other possibilities:

1.) There are multiple Dark Falzes, all of whom are bent on destroying every vestige of Pokémon in the multiverses.

2.) Dark Falz is actually a pissed-off Pal Rappy who was born with only yellow feathers and didn't get a Tootise Roll, therefore he can occupy any non-Tootsie Roll-affected person at any point in time. He was imprisoned on Ragol for so long because Tootsie Rolls only existed on Coral until the idiots on Pioneer 1 brought Tootsie Rolls and cakes with them (hence the existence of the sweet shop in the caves, which allowed Dark Falz to resurface fully).

3.) Dark Falz is now occupying Richard Simmons.

Each solution more probable than the last

[Vayne]

Hello all, I've found this thread rather interesting and thought I'd make an account just to throw my 2 cents in! Some things I've gather about the time line.

1. Coral/Earth's environment is failing.
2. Humans/Casts build Mother Trinity.
3. Mother Trinity tries to help save Cora.
4. Mother Trinity creates the Newmans.
5. Pioneers 1 leaves.
6. Moth Trinity is infected by Dark Falz and starts becoming corrupt.
7. Ragol found.
8. Pioneer 2 leaves seeing that Coral has no hope left.
9. Mother Trinity causes great blank to cleanse the world.
10. PSO storyline occurs: Coral assumed dead, Dark Falz released from seal
11. 200 years after GB, PSZ storyline
12. Dark Falz materializes in Mother Trinity.

So, according to my reckoning the pioneers must have left after Mother Trinity was created because PSZ says that she designed the newmans and newmans were obviously on Pioneer 1&2. My explanation for Dark Falz being at both places is that he is not even a corporal lifeform and more of an entity and was merely influencing Mother Trinity while he was still sealed in the ship on Ragol. Once he is released and defeated in PSO he is free to travel back to earth to fully take over MT and appear in his form we see in PSZ.

Those are just my thoughts, if you see any holes let me know but I think it fits together pretty well!

[Evicous]

Wasn't there something in PSO about Dr. Montague (the mad-scientist FOnewm) creating the Newman race?

[Eclipse5632]

I thought Newmans existed before Mother Trinity, but she just recreated them after the original ones were all wiped out during the Great Blank.

[EJ]

there more than one Dark Falz as was said by the original ps series and newman's were made by humans as said in both psz and pso. Mother Trinity made them again to restore that race and use them for Dark Falz purpose. I remember the creator saying it was a prequel to pso in a interview somewhere on youtube.

[BH.Donyxz]

If you look, there's always a lot of depth. But here's a thought, what if the PLAYERS added an element of depth? My clan name is Black Hound, a PSO refference. And yes, I know it's cheesy and unoriginal, and I'll probably be scorned for it...but what the hell?

[ARChan]

For some reason, I tie what Barlowe said about Dracula (Castlevania: Order of Ecclesia reference) to what EJ said about Dark Falz. And doesn't Dark Falz overtake angry mindsets that wish for something to happen in a macroscopic scale? That seems to be the consistent through what I've seen from PSO and PSZ.

@EJ: Does this also apply to the original PS series?

[Niered]

Wasn't there something in PSO about Dr. Montague (the mad-scientist FOnewm) creating the Newman race?

uhh...what? Dr. Montague IS a newman. Newmans were around a long time before him.

[Akaimizu]

Actually, Dr. Montague was responsible for something entirely different. Not newmans, but casts. His experiments were more in the way of him trying to make casts even more human-like by increasing their emotional capacity. Kind of like a Blade Runner thing. If PSU/PSP and PSO were actually linked, that would be one believable aspect of the transition. Since Casts seem to move, utilize body language, and throw emotions around more than ever in PSU/PSP than they did before.