Forces are broken!

[chriscox1121]

so i was playing with my fomar today and i decided to use a diopside (character is low lvl) and i decided to try out it's special move magical sign. What i quickly realized is that it takes hardly no time to charge and it destroys everything in it's path and it does it quick. Enemies stand hardly no chance and it doens't take much from the user to do so and it hardly uses any PP. So I'm thinking to myself, why did the developers put such a broken move into the game. Doesn't seem very balanced in terms of the other classes (hunters and rangers). Have any of you guys thought about this before? It almost doesn't seem fair to play with it IMO.

[ARChan]

Check your defense and think again, please.

From how I see it, Forces are a double-edged sword. You inflict lots of damage on your opponent as they inflict lots of damage on you. That's how it rolls.

[chriscox1121]

Check your defense and think again, please.

From how I see it, Forces are a double-edged sword. You inflict lots of damage on your opponent as they inflict lots of damage on you. That's how it rolls.

i can clear rooms effortlessly without taking any damage or minimal damage

[LeynasMoon]

I don't think I'll say that Forces are "broken", but they are more easy to inflict good damage with and overall pretty efficient in battle.
The classes are not balanced at all, though, I think it's really weird.

Like whenever I first tried it out, Magical Sign was really good, the best Art for the Wand, in my opinion. Just like you'd said, it charges fast, as well as hitting 360 degrees around you (I don't know how, it animates like it's only hitting forward), as well as inflicting Slow on enemies, good for supporting the party. It also has really good accuracy as well.
I stuck with my Diopside for a long time, until I was given my Kouga Shuriken by my love slave, which replaces every weapon I ever used so far as a FOmarl.
Then you get Wand arts like Act Trick, which is pretty useless, although it's novel and fun looking, I'll give it that. Funny Drop has high accuracy, but only hits a group of enemies once per use.

Not much defense for a Force to play with, true, but with the right equipment on (Ancient Robe has amazingly high EVP), you can become a highly evasive little monster, that is if you aren't able to avoid attacks very often yet. Couple that with boosted elemental resistances, and yah.

I'm just happy that Forces are done so well in this version of a PS online game, and yet it made me sad to see the Rangers get the shaft in some ways.

[Java378]

It just seems forces are broken. I have a Ranger alt with the 2nd best attack in it's class. The ATP sucks.

They nerfed the rangers. Rangers can't even shoot over canyons except with the right weapon.

[FOrulz]

i can clear rooms effortlessly without taking any damage or minimal damage
You stated your force was at low lvl. I'm sure you won't be saying the same thing when you begin to play online at super hard. All I can say is, get ready for some painful 1-hit KOs.

[Lyra]

Yeah my FOmarl has had to become the master of anticipating large attacks and moving out of the way in super hard mode. Lots of things one shot me ><
Although super hard humilias I can't seem to avoid like I could in the easier modes. If I get frozen or slowed, I'm simply dead (since I generally can't heal before he follows up with the big stabby attack). Fortunately, I've farmed up the freeze and slow protect units so I'll try him again soon.

[ZetsumeiSan]

Forces are not broken.

[rickfrior]

Check your defense and think again, please.

From how I see it, Forces are a double-edged sword. You inflict lots of damage on your opponent as they inflict lots of damage on you. That's how it rolls.

Hmm, I couldn't agree more.
High risk, high return.
All you got to do is find that to your advantage.

[Macman]

It's funny how rangers have such low ATP this time around to make up for their range.
...Then a lot of monsters have innate resistance to guns later on.

[GantzDetainee]

Oh wait till you've reached Super hard where all monsters hits hard and has a lot of resistance to magic.

[Breakfast2go]

There was a time where I died during the middle of the Magical Sign PA on Super XD

[chriscox1121]

Oh wait till you've reached Super hard where all monsters hits hard and has a lot of resistance to magic.

i hope it balances out by then, because it's a no contest at the moment and i'm almost to arca plant on hard

[Z-735]

Yeah my FOmarl has had to become the master of anticipating large attacks and moving out of the way in super hard mode. Lots of things one shot me ><
Although super hard humilias I can't seem to avoid like I could in the easier modes. If I get frozen or slowed, I'm simply dead (since I generally can't heal before he follows up with the big stabby attack). Fortunately, I've farmed up the freeze and slow protect units so I'll try him again soon.

You don't need those silly units lol. Whenever Humilias starts moving, just follow him and run under his legs and behind him. Thats how I do it to avoid his ice/slow lasers

[Z-735]

Omg the resistance on magic on SH sucks DX I practically waste all my PP trying to kill everything in one room >:/

[Ice Sniper]

There is a disadvantage to that way though. Get hit once and your screwed because you get hit by the full combo. However I do it that way because im too lazy to get the units. I can make it through the whole battle without getting hit by anything. LOL I remember in normal I used to take the hits and think I was tough ^^

[Z-735]

Lol I have the units. Just don't wanna use them XD In the method that I do it I get hit by his combo once every 3 battles cause I forget to follow him lol

[pso_crash]

I wearing the units are a pretty good idea. If you get caught with a status effect, it's game over. I think it's smart to wear them on SH at least, where players get ohko'd easily

[Z-735]

I only get ko'ed easily by Octo Diablo. I hate that overgrown piece of sushi ><

[pso_crash]

haha, sorry to hear that. I don't know a lot about beating octo. Since I usually use my HUcast, I can just stand in front of him and beat his face in during the second phase.

[Ice Sniper]

Octo Diablo, really? I havent been killed by him since I tried to kill him the first time at lv 3. I don't have SH yet but on Hard Octo Diablo is really easy, Humilias on the other hand... >.>

[GantzDetainee]

i hope it balances out by then, because it's a no contest at the moment and i'm almost to arca plant on hard

I do agree with you with force being overpowered in normal and hard mode but in SH you'll hit the wall.Just imagine one missile from an Arkzein hurting alot in hard mode but in SH they OHKO you hehe and oh dont get me started with Humilias' "pew pew pew 'ack im frozen' then another pew pew pew 'oh wait im dead already' "


I only get ko'ed easily by Octo Diablo. I hate that overgrown piece of sushi ><

I feel yah,Im having a hard time killing that thing too with its "tentacle grab" and "suck and munch" attacks its really pretty nasty.

[Z-735]

The first phase is easy, its the second phase that gets me >< Not the part where he sucks you up and munches on your soul, but where he whacks you with his tentacles. 2 hits of that and i'm dead DX Lol! Suck and munch. Nice one Tele XD

[Z-735]

Humilias is easy for me. He just takes awhile to kill >.> But on SH Octo Diablo hits hella hard. And his ink moves change too.

[Z-735]

AH! >< I just found the arena on SH paru DX I hate those giant monkeys! Especially on SH... But its over now, and for my hard work, I got a Divine/Power and Goth Parasol XD

[LeynasMoon]

Octo Diablo isn't too bad.

Fortunately, it can be Jellened. Which had saved my FOmarl from a few 1 hit KOs on SH. It used to hit for over 500 HP of damage, but after the Technique Jellen effect, that was dwindled down to the lower 400s. Enough to let me survive and heal if it connected a hit with it's first phase super tentacle smash attack. As well as when being grabbed and squeezed, or sucked in and munched on during the fight's second phase.

None of the bosses seem too bad, once the appropriate strategy, skill and weaponry is in place.
But I still have yet to face Humilias on Super Hard, so I might have a thing or two to learn, yet.

[Z-735]

I'll tell you this. On SH, Humilias has a HIGH RESISTANCE to techs DX Even zonde doesn't hit hard and thats his weakness TT^TT Razonde does 100's to him ):/ And my FOnewearl can survive Octo Diablo's super tentacle attack, but after she's only left with 30 hp lol

[LeynasMoon]

Ah, well that's okay, I don't rely on Attack Techs during a boss fight anyway, as a FOmarl.
Humilias is still a butt mongrel, though, I'm sure. When the time comes, I'll be using my Kouga Shuriken slicer on him.

[Z-735]

Lol. I use attack techs and physical attacks XD I use a slicer with divine/hit equipped :3

[pso_crash]

elly, Humilias only has one evasion point. You can't miss him. use that slot for more power

[Donnikun]

yeah i had an easy time with my FOmar.

that was until i hit Super Hard Mode.

Its like end of hard mode: bam boom woot we totally rock guys! FOs are so OP! then we run to guracia valley in Super Hard and all of the sudden its, omg, my attacks are missing, my magic didnt do much damage, oh crap one hit took 80% of my life, resta, resta! Look out oh crap she got one shotted being a FOnewearl!! RUN!!!! RUN!!! the hellions are gonna kill us all!! get out of here, retreat!!!!

*You have died. Would you like to return to the city? Yes No *

[Z-735]

Great way too explain it rofl

[FoMarlBorough]

yeah, i got to sh online and had to pipe back to town to restock on fluids just to clear the first room in the valley. techs dont miss, but my slicer sure did.

[rickfrior]

Hehe, I have to admit, the hostiles are much harder/smarter even when playing online, so I wouldn't call it Super Hard, I'd say Ultimate!

[Dnd]

I thought that forces where broken, as my brother cruised into super hard without breaking a sweat... then super hard comes around and finally we seem to be doing the same damage out-put in the valley (this is with 64% beast aswell) but on the dragon he still seems to kick my ass damage-wise... with deband/jellen 13, the damage (if it hits him) isnt big at all (hellion ~180, dragon ~260). Hes a fomarl if its any difference

When i play more often again, im going to make a force alt for real

[Light dragon]

donni's way of explaining it is awesome especially the FOnewearl part XD had me laughing while reading it

[ZetsumeiSan]

i hope it balances out by then, because it's a no contest at the moment and i'm almost to arca plant on hard

The game doesn't even start until you hit Super Hard mode. The same could be said for PSO about Ultimate mode.

[sylwyn]

It kinda balances out in the end because if a HU or a RA is actually able to acquire an item with high monster type adjustments and a high lv element and use either celeb, risk, or life they will be just as powerful against monsters in SH mode (If not more efficient). One has to consider enemy type resistances and in this game as well, not only is their tech resistance there is also slashing and gun resistance.

After playing a heavy tech force when paired with weak players on Free play if I didn't do all the damage they would drop the party... making me go through almost all my fluids, although I never use Trifluids. I would say my favorite now is my RAcaseal... even though I love my Hunewm it feels much too easy after I got some good hunter weapons for him against all types of enemies. Only class that I actually have to use items for is the Force... for everything else PP recovery lv5 is enough.

[FoMarlBorough]

The game doesn't even start until you hit Super Hard mode. .

exactly!

[rhubarbot]

Forces are not broken, but certain PAs in this game arguably are. And Magical Sign is one of them.

Other broken PAs include Bite Stamp, Over End, and Earth Bullet..... basically anything that easily nets you multiple hits with high bonuses in a wide area extending out in front of your character. When paired with high-level Celeb, these PAs all hit much harder than techs, and hit multiple times.

Techs, on the other hand..... well, nothing really compares with the DPS possible from any of the broken PAs because the vast majority of techs only hit once and don't benefit from the additional 1.5x damage that Celeb gives you. Razonde comes closest, because it charges almost instantly when you have Compress PA equipped and can hit two or more times in a very wide area for excellent damage. But in SH mode, you're very limited on which enemies you can use Razonde on. And not one of the other techs available to you is better than Magical Sign from a good wand.

And remember that Magical Sign isn't even close to being the most overpowered PA out there. This is why Hunters are arguably more overpowered than forces at the high end, since they have access to Bite Stamp and Over End.

[Breakfast2go]

yeah i had an easy time with my FOmar.

that was until i hit Super Hard Mode.

Its like end of hard mode: bam boom woot we totally rock guys! FOs are so OP! then we run to guracia valley in Super Hard and all of the sudden its, omg, my attacks are missing, my magic didnt do much damage, oh crap one hit took 80% of my life, resta, resta! Look out oh crap she got one shotted being a FOnewearl!! RUN!!!! RUN!!! the hellions are gonna kill us all!! get out of here, retreat!!!!

*You have died. Would you like to return to the city? Yes No *

EXACTLY how I felt. Your description was beautifully done :-D

[Breakfast2go]

I would say the intensity difference between hard to super is like the vice-captain to captain level in Bleach.

[cogimon1]

Forces are too strong!... thats why i roll one :)

[Barri_kid]

You are right about Normal and Hard. Forces can do a lot of damage and the slicer is really nice.

How much is a lot of damage on Super? Have a lvl 100 FOnewearl with 80 mind mats, +30 mind from units, a low rare slicer (sky view or something like that. I think its a low rare anyway) and a mag with 100 mind. I used lvl 15 Foie (powered up) on a derreo on dark shrine and I did about 150 damage. Is that a lot?

Sorry, im kinda new at PSZ so I dont know much.
I did play a lot of PSOBB though

[kirtblue]

yeah they do lots of damage but die constantly my force is level 90 and set up with 80 mind mats and pure mind mag and has died about 300 times

[sylwyn]

I used lvl 15 Foie (powered up) on a derreo on dark shrine and I did about 150 damage. Is that a lot?

I guess that would be pretty normal damage as a FOnewearl because they have no innate boost for elemental techs. My HUnewm using a 62% dark lv4 celeb foie haze hits for around 160 per hit, with shifta on against most enemies in the Dark Shrine.

Keep tech resistance in mind and that the first portion of Dark Shrine is weak to Megid, a FOnewearl's forte. Whereas the second portion is weak to Grants. Although from my experience Zonde is the most efficient tech in Dark Shrine regardless, because no monsters are fully resistant to it, hits multiple times, stuns, and multiple enemies for a fairly big area.

A Force also has access to the shifta/zalure combo which boosts damage significantly, somewhere between 50-100 boost per hit depending on how much resistance the monster had to my specific tech. If one is used to monster behavior and the roll function deband/jellen should not be bothered with.

[Efreet]

A quick question, at which level/difficulty you people found your high level tech disks?
i`ve just reached SH and i still have to find one, doing mission with only low lv buyable spell is a real pain..

[Macman]

The range of techs you can find is rather wide, I've found anywhere between level 5 to level 15 in disks in SH. Just keep at it.