Accuracy/Evasion Adjustments from buffs/debuffs?

[Joustin]

Ok, I have seen alot of posts about people's experiences about using Shifta/Zalure/Deband/Jellen following "I evade more" or "I hit more often" type statements.

I have been looking online (Apparently not well enough) for a formula and still no luck. I am suprised no one has started this thread because if there is in fact a correlation, then hit/swift mats have become more valuable; especially hit mats.

If you've read the PSZ forums here then you know about the posts I am talking about. There may be merit in those posts but the challenge is, where's the formula?

I invite anyone to join me on this endeavor, I may be looking in the wrong places (Google is letting me down for starters). We hear the experiences, so what is the mechanism? What is the formula?

[rhubarbot]

I'd love to see formulas too, but I've never found any. So I shall share my experiences, if that helps.

I've meleed with characters with ATA values ranging from 440 to the 650ish range. Roughly (this is all for SH, of course):

Shifta doesn't appear to do anything to ATA. Zalure improves accuracy substantially, but it's probably from cutting the enemies' EVP. I think level 11+ Zalure is supposed to be a 30% cut.

As a corollary, Jellen appears to cut enemies' ATA, making you harder to hit. But Deband doesn't seem to do anything to your evasion rate.

Like with PSO, heavy attacks seem to hit more often the further down you use them in a combo.

440 ATA's enough to hit about 95% of the time provided you use Zalure first. Without Zalure it hits about 50-90% of the time depending on what you're attacking. In general, the smaller and weaker the monster is, the harder it is to hit. Usannies seem to be the most evasive enemies (and, perhaps not coincidentally, the weakest).

The 510 range hits 95% of the time without Zalure. With Zalure, you can use heavy attacks even on the first hit and expect to hit the vast majority of the time.

540ish seems to be where you basically never ever miss without Zalure, unless using heavy attacks as the first hit.

580 is where you start hitting almost every time on the first hit with a heavy attack, even without Zalure.

With 640 ATA you still will miss very very very occasionally (maybe once every 300 hits or so) with a heavy attack on your first hit. But otherwise it hits everything every time. You see about the same miss rate from Bite Stamp; maybe 1 out of 300 or so hits will miss. (Bite Stamp has a particularly steep ATA penalty.)

For each of these numbers, accuracy seems to drop off very rapidly when you go even slightly lower with ATA. For example, I have a RAcast with a Riverman with hit% and a Keplar Suit, and at 570ish ATA, about 30% of my shots miss if I use heavy attack on the first hit. But if I slot in a divine/hit and get to 585, the miss rate goes WAY down to almost zero.

Hope this helps; your mileage may vary, of course. These are just my rough recollections of my experience.

[Joustin]

I'd love to see formulas too, but I've never found any. So I shall share my experiences, if that helps.

I've meleed with characters with ATA values ranging from 440 to the 650ish range. Roughly (this is all for SH, of course):

Shifta doesn't appear to do anything to ATA. Zalure improves accuracy substantially, but it's probably from cutting the enemies' EVP. I think level 11+ Zalure is supposed to be a 30% cut.

As a corollary, Jellen appears to cut enemies' ATA, making you harder to hit. But Deband doesn't seem to do anything to your evasion rate.

Like with PSO, heavy attacks seem to hit more often the further down you use them in a combo.

440 ATA's enough to hit about 95% of the time provided you use Zalure first. Without Zalure it hits about 50-90% of the time depending on what you're attacking. In general, the smaller and weaker the monster is, the harder it is to hit. Usannies seem to be the most evasive enemies (and, perhaps not coincidentally, the weakest).

The 510 range hits 95% of the time without Zalure. With Zalure, you can use heavy attacks even on the first hit and expect to hit the vast majority of the time.

540ish seems to be where you basically never ever miss without Zalure, unless using heavy attacks as the first hit.

580 is where you start hitting almost every time on the first hit with a heavy attack, even without Zalure.

With 640 ATA you still will miss very very very occasionally (maybe once every 300 hits or so) with a heavy attack on your first hit. But otherwise it hits everything every time. You see about the same miss rate from Bite Stamp; maybe 1 out of 300 or so hits will miss. (Bite Stamp has a particularly steep ATA penalty.)

For each of these numbers, accuracy seems to drop off very rapidly when you go even slightly lower with ATA. For example, I have a RAcast with a Riverman with hit% and a Keplar Suit, and at 570ish ATA, about 30% of my shots miss if I use heavy attack on the first hit. But if I slot in a divine/hit and get to 585, the miss rate goes WAY down to almost zero.

Hope this helps; your mileage may vary, of course. These are just my rough recollections of my experience.

Once again rhubarbot you grace me with with your presence! No this information is really helpful! It seems based on the your experiences that a 'Hypothesis' can be created in which Zalure/Jellen may actually 'affect' ATA/EVP whereas Shifta/Deband may not. I have too noticed (Running H Tower atm on my FoMar) that when I use shifta my hit/miss ratio in practice is the same but when I use Zalure, thats when I notice a change (IE: I get less 'miss' marks).

If a Theory can be established showing the promise that Z/J do infact cause these effects, it would bring alot of value in having a Human Ranger, since hitting and missing are combat consequences of high concern. But we're not here to talk about RaMar/l's (That is for another post).

Thanks again rhubarbot!

[leviayurashyguy]

Zalure does indeed have a passive effect of reducing EVP and Jellen also reduces ATA but this does not make RAmar's any better as its more efficient for them to sit back and shoot than it is for them to run up, debuff, run back, and shoot. also Force's debuffs are significantly better and have wider range.

Rangers don't need the ATA debuff since they are in the back, behind the tanks preferably, not getting hit nor do they need the EVP drop since they have more than enough ATA to hit. Forces on the other hand do since they have considerably lower ATA and higher EVP so they pack their own J/Z when they need it