Challenge: I hate cheats, Who agrees?

[Aldark]

I just don't understand why people cheat. The game was made so you could beat it, cheating just makes you get bored with the game quicker and it makes you get things you don't even deserve. Anyone that uses cheats is just a loser that can't even beat a simple video game. By cheating all that your doing is depriving yourself of more fun and making it less fun for others. If you can't even beat it without cheats what can you do? It's just a game to give you the fun of having powers and fighting monsters. Why ruin it for everyone just because you can't complete a video game. Anyone that agrees with me post something proving cheatings for losers or make a new topic about it.

[Blood_Dragoon]

I don't condone cheating at games but this topic reeks of flamebait. . .

[Aldark]

I'm sorry I didn't mean it to be I just wanted to state my case.

[IceBlink]

Depends on what games you're thinking about.

Most in-built cheats are there for the programmers - they use them to advance through the game quickly to test areas and to search for bugs. More often than not, they will leave in some of the debugging codes as 'cheats' for the home userbase to play around with.

Devices which use special codes to change parts of a game in order to have advantage of, they exist for the games which don't have the built-in cheats, or that they can "enhance" a game. Note that not all cheats involve infinite energy and the like - see the Game Genie for the SNES for a example.

Why do people use them? More often than not, it's to make a game more easier or more fun to play. However, such a device would ruin the challenge of the game, so you can't have it both ways.

Some people limit themselves with cheats, using it just to get past certain areas. Some people take the easy route and use it all the way through. Some people will accept that others use it, though they want to play on challenge of the game alone. Some call for outright ban of all cheating period.

So many different views from people, correct?

So... why do people cheat?

Because they're human.

o_O (philosophy, mmmm....)

[Aldark]

I soppose your right, but I think on rare cases cheats are alright like if a person can't beat anything they set a limit to the amount they use but what I'm mostly protesting is the use of cheats on online games that make people cheat without knowing it by accepting an item or just getting things that other people work so hard for and they have it in an instant.

[IceBlink]

Well duh, of course cheating online is a big no-no. One person's view may not agree with another, and people should be considerate of others. o_O

Of course, my faith in the human race was destroyed long ago. So, it's good thing that Sega plans to ban people...

[Zeebo]

Read my signature to see what I think of cheaters=P

[Blood_Dragoon]

On 2003-03-07 19:38, IceBlink wrote:

Of course, my faith in the human race was destroyed long ago. So, it's good thing that Sega plans to ban people...



It seems like most of the problem cheaters that do so online tend to be kids around the age of 14 but that's just my outlook on it. You know, the people that don't seem to understand that the character they NOL'ed had somewhere around 1800 hours put into it or that item they stole from someone using a PK cheat was the product of someone searching for weeks just to get it legitimately. If Sega plans to start banning people for cheating at on their online games then I will support the decision as long as it is done in a way to remove those who cheat in directly harmful and destructive ways and give the others who were considerate the chance to continue legitimately.

And Aldark I know you only meant to voice your opinion on your first post and you are entitled to your opinion. Just try and play with the wording a bit so it doesn't come off as harsh. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Zeebo]

I'm sorry! What is NOL!?

[Axispoint]

NOL'ing is when a person using a cheat device on the Dreamcast versions of PSO turned your character into the NPC NOL (they could apparently turn you into other NPC's, but most stuck with using NOL...I'd dare them to change me to KIREEK http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif). Of course, there are ways to reverse a NOL (don't ya' just pull out your memory card or something like that right in the middle of the game? I can't remember).

[Aldark]

Um, I know most people use cheats at my age (14) but I and a couple of my friends are completely against it.

[Wewt]

On 2003-03-07 18:15, Aldark wrote:
I just don't understand why people cheat.
Some people just find it fun. I know it might be hard for you to understand. Some people just find it fun, that's just the way it is.



On 2003-03-07 18:15, Aldark wrote:
The game was made so you could beat it, cheating just makes you get bored with the game quicker and it makes you get things you don't even deserve.


DC PSO ended up with more cheaters than legits. They (cheaters) played the game longer than the legits. Go figure. As for people deserving things on a video game... Meh. Nobody deserves anything on a video game, except to be entertained.



On 2003-03-07 18:15, Aldark wrote:
Anyone that uses cheats is just a loser that can't even beat a simple video game.
Evidence? Right, I don't think you can really prove it.

Legitimate players are not always more skilled than cheaters. Remember that.

This was proven to me on the Dreamcast.

Challenge mode had players that were cheaters, and those players were just as good as those that never cheated.

Battle mode's best players were all cheater.

Leveling up. Well, it doesn't take much skill to kill an enemy with extremely low artificial intelligence.

Bear in mind that these cheaters didn't use any cheats to give themselves any advantage in any of the play modes I mentioned. However, they had cheated previously, so they will be branded cheaters. In some people's eyes: Scum.



On 2003-03-07 18:15, Aldark wrote:
Why ruin it for everyone just because you can't complete a video game.
This is the sensitive part. Where one person may cheat, it can affect a legitimate player. This is where most cheaters tend to not care about others, and they forget that this is an online game, where other people might get pissed off at the actions a cheater takes. What can be done about this? Nothing. It's a deadlock that will never be broken. All games will have cheaters. Whine about it, cry about it, smash something. There is nothing you can do but to rely on the game creators to use good anti-cheating methods.

The game we're talking about is PSO, the makers are Sonic Team. I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for them to do something.

Cheating, in general, is wrong. I have to agree with people on this. Destroying another person's character data, which they worked hundreds, or even thousands of hours on, is... not such a nice thing to do.



On 2003-03-07 18:15, Aldark wrote:
Anyone that agrees with me post something proving cheatings for losers or make a new topic about it.


Grow up.

[AlliancePaladin]

cheaters suck! BADLY! they have no skill what so ever if they have to cheat! I for one have mad skills... nuff said...

[wizkid357]

I think cheats are cool!

[Zeebo]

thank you Axispoint for the pointer=P


I think cheats are cool!

I hope you were drunk when you wrote this or else...=P j/k why!?!? though

[Aldark]

Some people just find fun in it.

Some people just find fun in hurting, embarassing, or stealing from others, but that doesn't make it right.

[Wewt]

On 2003-03-09 12:43, Aldark wrote:


Some people just find fun in it.

Some people just find fun in hurting, embarassing, or stealing from others, but that doesn't make it right.


Indeed it doesn't. But if you're getting hurt from cheating, you might have to get your priorities sorted out.

Also, there isn't much you can possibly do about it, so you should just learn to live with it.

[Sashi]

On 2003-03-09 12:43, Aldark wrote:
Some people just find fun in hurting, embarassing, or stealing from others, but that doesn't make it right.



What is popular isnt always right; What is right isnt always poplular.

[Aldark]

I'm not saying anyones being hurt by cheating, but where do you draw the line on saying if it's okay or not. Do you go just a little bit farther and start hacking things, and from there? It could just keep building up. That's how most people that do horrible things in today's world is by starting off small and when the time arises when they want or have to do something else worse they will probable just say "what's a little more going to do" and it will go on from there.

[Zeebo]

I like that quote......

[Tigger]

I don't hate the cheaters on pso, I don't hate anyone. It's silly getting offended over a bunch of binary code that cease to exist the second I hit the power button. If it bothers me that much I just turn off my console and read a book.

[Aldark]

That is a good point. The best thing about it was going to read a book. People today just don't take advantage of books and how great they are... but that's getting me a little off topic. I do think there might be some way to help some people stop cheating though.

[Zeebo]

Be rude to all cheaters make em feel like outcasts might change some peoples perspective

[Wewt]

On 2003-03-09 17:49, Aldark wrote:
I'm not saying anyones being hurt by cheating, but where do you draw the line on saying if it's okay or not. Do you go just a little bit farther and start hacking things, and from there? It could just keep building up. That's how most people that do horrible things in today's world is by starting off small and when the time arises when they want or have to do something else worse they will probable just say "what's a little more going to do" and it will go on from there.


I'll say it again... There is nothing you, I, or anybody else can do to stop this. Except for Sonic Team. Relying on them isn't the wisest of things to do, trust me on that.

Wait, there isn't much that can be done, duplicating items is already all over PSO.



On 2003-03-09 18:13, Zeebo wrote:
Be rude to all cheaters make em feel like outcasts might change some peoples perspective


I hope cheating affects you in a very bad way. Try not to take it too personally.

[Raist]

On 2003-03-09 18:13, Zeebo wrote:
Be rude to all cheaters make em feel like outcasts might change some peoples perspective

Unfortunatley the cheaters outnumber the legits by a shit ton, so by doing so you'd be more just making yourself an outcast. I despise cheating as much as anyone, but I realise that online we're all going to have to get along or it isn't going to be much fun. If somebody is using dupes I'd suggest just leaving, being rude would just give you a bad image.
Save your complaints about cheating for forums like this, you'll have a lot more fun online that way.

[Aldark]

I'll say it again... There is nothing you, I, or anybody else can do to stop this. Except for Sonic Team. Relying on them isn't the wisest of things to do, trust me on that.

Yes, there is something I and all of us can do. I've already convinced some of my friends that cheating is wrong and they've started convincing others of the same thing. If we could all do our part in this soon all that will be left are those who will never want to stop ,and even though I don't think it's nice to outcast someone, they will be outcasted and either they'll learn, cheats will no longer be created, or the next generation will be completely cheat free. I know I can't stop cheating in my life time, but I can bring the beginning of the end.

[Raist]

On 2003-03-09 18:52, Aldark wrote:
Yes, there is something I and all of us can do. I've already convinced some of my friends that cheating is wrong and they've started convincing others of the same thing. If we could all do our part in this soon all that will be left are those who will never want to stop ,and even though I don't think it's nice to outcast someone, they will be outcasted and either they'll learn, cheats will no longer be created, or the next generation will be completely cheat free. I know I can't stop cheating in my life time, but I can bring the beginning of the end.

A noble cause but still a lost one. I believe the majority of cheaters realise that cheating is wrong, but they have a million and a half excuses to justify their behavior. I'm not saying that you shouldn't go out and spread the word that duping is wrong, I'd encourage you to do so, just don't be too let down when you realise that most cheaters don't really care if we disaprove.

[Aldark]

I know, that's why I say I know I'll never accomplish it and none of us will in our life time but someday it could happen if we all try.

[Wewt]

Dupes will spread faster than the word that cheating is bad. Don't ask me if this is a proven fact, because it isn't. If you have any sense, you would agree with me here.

[Zeebo]

Unfortunetly UN! I do agree with you,,,,,,

[BonusKun]

Ah teh Drama...

[God-Slayer]

Yes you should realize that those hell-bent on creating dupes for their own enjoyment (myself included) Don't care what you say. Just save your breath and enjoy your game. I know you don't pay $7.95 a month to sit on a message board and whine about the cheaters. Just deal with it, it's not going away.

[Aldark]

One day the time will come at which somethings shall be changed.... just watch

[Zeebo]

The good will WIN!

[A3CypherX]

lol, whether you like it or not people are always gonna cheat. Its just a higher way of playing games. Its up to the people them selves to find out ways of getting better than others, and others better than them. Its a game, play how you want, and if you cant then change the way you play.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: A3CypherX on 2003-03-10 18:46 ]</font>

[Kemon]

Rune edit: Don't flame. Mmmkay?



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RuneLateralus on 2003-03-11 09:14 ]</font>

[Aldark]

Whether you like it or not people are always gonna cheat. Its just a higher way of playing games.

You mean a lower, more dishonest way to play, but there's always a way. Just remember, even though you may think I'm crazy, people thought the same about Galileo.

[Aldark]

Maybe it is a stupid idea but it's worth a try

[Zeebo]

I hope cheating affects you in a very bad way. Try not to take it too personally.

It did in a different game thats why I hate cheaters...

[Balthor]

And again with the bumping of old threads!

[Zeebo]

you may think I'm crazy, people thought the same about Galileo.

galileo invented the telescope you just think cheaters are gay...

[Balthor]

On 2003-03-29 18:32, Zeebo wrote:
you may think I'm crazy, people thought the same about Galileo.

galileo invented the telescope you just think cheaters are gay...



. . .

?!

What in the hell are you talking about?

[Zeebo]

I'm commenting on what Aldark said........

NONE OF YOUR CONCERN http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

[Nero_Landale]

honostly, and without getting into this whole "you suck" "no /you/ suck" mess, I find doing the quests to get my own friggin gear much more rewarding than just punching in a string of numbers and having the strongest equipment just handed to me. I can't wait to see what I do to get the Rika Claw, that's definately on my "Must Accuire" list =3

As far as the cheaters using the NOL and related codes though, I can't just remain nutral, since my strongest charrie, Neithird, has been NOLed, SHINOed and SUEed, I've spent over 500 hours on her and she's still only level one hundred twentysomething, there's no reason for codes like that except to spoil the game for other players.

[brillyfresh]

On 2003-03-29 17:30, Zeebo wrote:

I hope cheating affects you in a very bad way. Try not to take it too personally.

It did in a different game thats why I hate cheaters...



it did in a different game with me too, maybe the first online game that got massively hacked, and that's why i DO cheat

like the old saying does "if you can't beat em, join em" ... or "fight fire with fire"

and don't even say it'll destroy the replay value ... when i think i've had enough of cheating (meaning, using dupes), then i'll go legit for a new challenge

think then i will gain your respect? oh wait, i didn't really want it anyway .... i don't think respect is a value capable of legits who hate dupers, or just hate period


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: brillyfresh on 2003-03-31 21:06 ]</font>

[Intimidacius]

Cheating in general is downright wrong in Intimidacius' opinion. However, Intimidacius has noticed that videogames are not real. They are just a ton of zeroes and ones being processed by a heartless chunk of plastic and metal. Cheating in real life is dumb, but cheating in a game(a game is for entertainment) is fine unless it affects other players directly, in which case it becomes a crime in Intimidacius' opinion. Games are games.
People cheated in capture the flag in elementary school, they'll cheat in office buildings. The difference is in a game, only the person playing loses out.
Intimidacius has to admit that he enjoys cheating in games sometimes. Intimidacius doesn't cheat to go online to cream people. He cheats for brief amusement(Using DD44 in PD64). Sometimes cheats enhance gameplay for those who have worked hard at completing the game in the first place(some, Intimidacius said SOME).
Cheating is not just confined to cheat codes and game sharks. Isn't any outside help other than the players own wits affecting the gameplay? Guides and FAQS could be considered cheating. Intimidacius doesn't consider them cheats, but it is hard to draw a line.

Intimidacius care not for beans



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Intimidacius on 2003-04-03 11:27 ]</font>

[Aldark]

And again with the bumping of old threads!

I do agree on this. If any moderators read this please start a "cheating vs. non-cheating" battle or something.


I have noticed that videogames are not real. They are just a ton of zeroes and ones being processed by a heartless chunk of plastic and metal. Cheating in real life is dumb, but cheating in a game(a game is for entertainment) is fine unless it affects other players directly, in which case it becomes a crime in my opinion.

I do partly agree with you. People who cheat on video games and it effects others are just jerks. People who cheat without effecting other isn't really that bad but just because it is a ton of zeroes and ones being processed by a heartless chunk of plastic and metal that also means it shouldn't be able to stop you from winning without cheats than. If you want to cheat in those cases I guess that's your choice but I for one would never cheat in any sort of thing. For me it's always the harder the better. I wish you would think the same.


Quote:
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On 2003-03-29 17:30, Zeebo wrote:
Quote:
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I hope cheating affects you in a very bad way. Try not to take it too personally.

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It did in a different game thats why I hate cheaters...



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it did in a different game with me too, maybe the first online game that got massively hacked, and that's why i DO cheat

like the old saying does "if you can't beat em, join em" ... or "fight fire with fire"

Now that's not really going to work because by cheating it will help them not fight them. The more you cheat the more others may too and if your doing this because your files were hacked than what do you think your supporting the cheaters to do to others

[latimer]

Reading this thread was quite entertaining.

Before I so openly offend some of you about the content of a game I'd like to say I think alot of people like being called "cheaters" for actively participating in Trading, you might of seen the option for this in the menu.

On the subject of "cheaters":

There are those of you who don't want to trade with anyone, or accept items even if they are obviously "real". You play the game however you want, remain "pure" and keep those koodies away.

You are all ready to claim that people doing this are playing the game incorrectly, some of you even claim that they don't know how to play, others still say they don't understand why people would pay a monthly fee to cheat and ruin the experience for the rest of you ...

Lets say that somewhere along the lines, someone actually dupes something (Oh no! People actually do that?) and then trades this item to someone for items that the said, "cheater", has earned on their own. Well, seeing as the person Confirmed the trade and all of the items they exchanged for said item were earned legitimately I don't see how you can say they did not earn the item.

On the subject of "dupers":

I am suprised that you complain more about the people who use the items created by the dupers then the actual dupers themselves.

To those of you who think that dupers get their items through cheating devices ... well ... I won't even bother.

To those of you who were able to realize that in the past they did this through a software bug exploit ... good for you, to the best of my knowledge that is dead now ... I wouldn't be suprised if I was wrong though.

To those of you who didn't know that duping offline has absolutely no risk of card curruption and you were wishing that upon them, well, you know better now.

Anyway, dupers create copies of items, be it for another character, the benefiet of friends or strangers, or simply to trade for new items. They are gaining items through means other then spending several hours, if not days and weeks looking for items. Some people even do it just for storage of items to protect themselves from the FSOD (that o-so-wonderful software bug) so that they are able to carry around "rares", not to show them off, but for a functional reason, to use them.

Then of course, there are the groups that dupe for hours on end just because they know their actions in a fictional setting will annoy people in the real world.

My personal opinion:

Whining is worse then mooching which is much worse then duping. Go to Ultima Online, The Realm, The Dark Age of Camalot, Everquest, Everquest: Online Adventures, Star Wars Galaxies or countless other MMO games if you don't want to put up with the items that you don't have anything to do with.

I've spent my fair share of time treasure hunting, for much needed equipment I've earned items that would be considered half-way decent, but are still more then enough to complete the game easily with multiple characters. That is part of the game, just like trading.

If you were too lazy to read the rest of the post, here is the simple version:

People who trade and receive a duped item aren't "cheaters" as you so lovingly call them. They aren't victims either, they did what they thought was fair to get a new item. When someone joins and uses an item that you may think is duped, you don't have to be rude and try your hardest to get them killed or even leave the game. Most of the dupers I have met are far more polite then you "legits" make yourselves out to be. Its the internet, why get angry at text on a screen?

One more thing, to ya'll who paraphrase the Beatitudes and make them relate to a game ... shouldn't some Christians be getting angry at you? Wait, I'll do the same to the Torah, Kabbalah and Quran and then some people will get offended. ;D Or maybe I will just "snatch and run" with those white collars around your necks and violate them in ways unimaginable by your collective imaginations.

[DemonQueen]

ok this is my first post so hi! and lol ive been reading the form for some time now and i think all u people who r so up tight about this tiny crack in ur world where dupers cheaters and whatnot r so dam evil u gotta complain! let me tell u a little secrete that the ignorant people dont comprehend!
50% all dupers r fakes who scam for items! other 50% r real and dupe using a device which many know of! in my opinion u should all have fun! if ur legit GO U! and b happy knowing ur legit and not a cheater and u earned ur whole $$$ u played for pso lol and dupers can dupe because they have fun doing it i guess so let em b u all act like showing off is so important! dont say no cuz if ur mad at dupers y? they dont ruin the economy unless u shop in it aka ur definatly not legit, second of all if ur legit only reason 2 complain is because u feel people r gettin away with crimes since ur a saint correct? i dont expect every1 2 agree wit me or any1 im just stating my opinion lol! anywayz pso wuznt created 2 make a anti-duper race of gamers it wuz made 2 enjoy it and have fun so grab a laxitive and think hard about what u have idealised as correct! (women r so smart!) lol cept me ima dumb blonde but hey! i hope i get sum sort of message across w/o me having 2 flash the boyz! lol mwahz luv u all 4 reading this far!

[Murako]

I dupe. I don't use Double Cannon that someone made for me. I dupe my own items. I couldnt care less that someone else is whining about my decisions. which are none of your concern. If you hate dupers and dupe users, go to some EU ship and lock a game. Problem solved.

[Blenjar]

On 2003-04-07 17:26, Murako wrote:
I dupe. I don't use Double Cannon that someone made for me. I dupe my own items. I couldnt care less that someone else is whining about my decisions. which are none of your concern. If you hate dupers and dupe users, go to some EU ship and lock a game. Problem solved.


Yea. Bingo.
Friends duped stuff for me when I got corrupted.
That's good dupin' joint.

[NekoHikari]

If only all dupers could somehow be eradicated and banned from existence... (especially this forum)

[LTDuran]

I LOVE PSO for gamecube
i used to love to cheat but now i cant and i wont ever again
pso taught me not to cheat, and pso is a big game and it would suck if there was cheats if you know what i mean

[LTDuran]

does this place just suck i wrotet his 2 months ago, and nobody responded???

[Setekh]

It all depends on how they are used.
I personally on PC spread rares to those in need. And I kill and beat the crap out of those who think they are "Uber-cheaters" I help the needy and beat up the stupid. Er.. not stupid, mean. Thats it.

Much like WWWW said... It can improve the game for you. For me it GOT the game... PSO PC isn't really avalable in america...

*Akward Silence*


...*Cough*
Anywho, I acutally faced-off against the creator of the hacked version I play on.

I couldn't hurt him. Though it all worked out, he couldn't kill me either.

[Pengin]

All these people who are getting so worked up about duping.... I pity you because you probably have no life outside of PSO, I know this isnt all of you but if you actually have the time to go around the internet and PSO screaming about how evil dupers are and how they should all be banned then theres a good chance I'm right about your social life. The people who say how dupers have no skills, I've only seen one duper who didnt know what he was doing the rest were pretty good. I doubt you have such mad skills considering that the only skills needed for this game is doping a 3 hit combo and pressing the right button for a tech. What you can do both!?! Your a PSO god! you can do play a game thats so simple that a trained monkey could beat it on every difficulty! I will now sacrifice myself to apease the god of legitness! <sarcasm>

[SC2]

ME

[SC2]

On 2003-03-07 18:15, Aldark wrote:
I just don't understand why people cheat. The game was made so you could beat it, cheating just makes you get bored with the game quicker and it makes you get things you don't even deserve. Anyone that uses cheats is just a loser that can't even beat a simple video game. By cheating all that your doing is depriving yourself of more fun and making it less fun for others. If you can't even beat it without cheats what can you do? It's just a game to give you the fun of having powers and fighting monsters. Why ruin it for everyone just because you can't complete a video game. Anyone that agrees with me post something proving cheatings for losers or make a new topic about it.


Very true. Why cheat when you can get the satisfaction of finding that Agito, or that crisp fresh right outta the red box Chain Sawd. I had a duped Sealed J-sword but I traded it, now I find my own stuff but i've had a bit of a unlucky streak 4, thats right 4, FOUR DAMN FLOWENS SWORDS IN A ROW!!!
Uhh yah http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif LoL.

[ophiel]

Cheating/duping is for fucking losers. I dont intend this post to be flamebait, thats just the way I feel about it.

End of story.

nathan
ophiel.
Lv. 72 fomar.
[mars army]
-lafayette division leader-
[echelon]