Sega's internal conflict and what it means.

[StriderTuna]

I heard recently that A) SoJ isn't fond of the US branch due to how much better the genesis did compared to the mega drive and B) SoJ does various things to spite them, even if it backfires for everyone.

An example would be the sony scenario. I heard that Sega had a chance to work with Sony and that Sega of America was perfectly keen on the idea but SoJ refused. This proved to be a grievous error down the line.

Another much more damning thing I heard was that SoJ forces the US branch to focus advertising on the now rather maligned Sonic series and licensed games as opposed to other titles. I say this as Sonic games are made in japan... basically with the implication that Sonic games don't have as much effort put towards them just so they'd fail in the US and make SoA look bad.

Honestly a company at such a conflict with itself can't really stand up in this age.

[yoshiblue]

Almost like a little kid. I'm guessing the request to forcefully shut down NA failed? This is the first time I heard anything like this. Then again i'm just a Nintendo person ಠ_ಠ.

[StriderTuna]

Almost like a little kid. I'm guessing the request to forcefully shut down NA failed? This is the first time I heard anything like this. Then again i'm just a Nintendo person ಠ_ಠ.

Not sure what's going on now, just that this infighting was a cause of somethings and perhaps the matter of SoA being shut down may be related.

Nintendo and Sony while they might have differed from their japanese branches in some ways still work with them pretty well.

[Tyreek]

Ironic that Sega started out as an American company so I heard.

[yoshiblue]

It was started in America but moved to Japan in the early beginning. Before it became Sega I think.

[HAYABUSA-FMW-]

SEGA JP been pretty discriminatory towards all manner of Internet and anyone else playing their fighting games "If there's going to be lag, we'd rather not even put the game out", unless the recent reports are in fact true, with finally they eased up to let people play some 2+ years old now Virtua Fighter 5 Super Update. XBLAH / PSNogames though? Huge Download? and currently "This is for Australia region only!"



Press Release August 23, 2011


LONDON & SAN FRANCISCO— 23rd August 2011—SEGA® of Europe Ltd. and SEGA® of America, Inc. today announced that Virtua Fighter™ 5, the latest title in its celebrated fighting franchise, will see a grand update and expansion released as a standalone title for both Xbox LIVE® Arcade for the Xbox 360® video game and entertainment system from Microsoft.and PlayStation® Network. The new game, entitled Virtua Fighter 5 Final Showdown, will contain a full overhaul of Virtua Fighter 5’s mechanics, balance and animations, along with new game modes, new dynamic fighting arenas, a massive collection of customisable character items and two all-new characters added to the roster. Virtua Fighter 5 Final Showdown is expected to be available in Summer 2012.

...


>> http://www.sega.com/news/?n=5290


Good good, won't have to ninja it up and ask demonstratively in-person on what-why-how come not in the fighter game during this rebirth era, and bring up that nice one with the video 2010 ish there with the mimicing SFightey moves by Akira/Pai/etc.




>> LOUD WARNING <<

By JP Hypoh arcade emcee announcer and the "BLEEP" -ing of special move trademark name call outs.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rruQ24RD0No

-

So this can snowball and have them ease up hoarding the best of their own properties a bit for other regions, perhaps?

No ideas outta me for the Sonic time/budget rumor front priority over 'all other products.' Know better to speculate or get involved in that fandom, misinformation, red herrings, catching feelings, in everything past Yuji Naka's departure.

[StriderTuna]

particularly senseless still seeing how their biggest rival in 3d fighters, Namco is operating far better concerning both halves.

if not for SoJ's general ability not to suck in its own turf, I'd consider it a company likely to die/reced into obscurity just like Capcom.

[Kent]

I don't know about any current conflicts between various Sega branches, but if you want to see some crazy Sega development history, look up the story behind Sonic Xtreme for the Saturn. It's just downright painful to read.

[Zarode]

particularly senseless still seeing how their biggest rival in 3d fighters, Namco is operating far better concerning both halves.

if not for SoJ's general ability not to suck in its own turf, I'd consider it a company likely to die/reced into obscurity just like Capcom.

I'd agree with your last statement, if it wasn't for MARVAL BAYBEE, Monster Hunter, and Skeet Fighter keeping them aloft anymore.

This seems to be the Japanese way of being xenophobic with anything outside of their country. It's gonna hurt them a lot if they keep it up.

[FOkyasuta]

So they still remember that? And i thought they were brain dead... *Remembers the 32X and Sega CD and shudders a bit*

[Sinue_v2]

I heard recently that A) SoJ isn't fond of the US branch due to how much better the genesis did compared to the mega drive

I don't think Sega's internal structural problems stem from a case of sour grapes over the 16-bit era. A more likely, and more recent, culprit may be the competitive atmosphere going into the development of the Dreamcast's hardware (Japan's design won), and it's eventual handling by Sega of America's president Peter Moore. There was a lot of internal struggling between SoA and SoJ over the Dreamcast's market strategies which were failing in Japan, but looked to be moderately successful in the US. Isao Okawa let Moore handle the Dreamcast in the west how he wanted, even though it ultimately failed, partially hamstringed by SoJ already talking about taking Sega in the 3rd party direction. Whether or not Sega survived depended on how well SoA did with the Dreamcast, and some rather obscene sales goals came down the pipe that Moore wasn't able to reach. So Moore made the call to cut the Dreamcast, and in the restructuring that followed his failure, Sega of Japan marginalized SoA and shifted most of their development and executive power back to Japan. Moore left Sega to take up a position at Microsoft overseeing the launch of the Xbox and Xbox 360.

As I understand it anyhow.


and B) SoJ does various things to spite them, even if it backfires for everyone.

It's more of a power play than trolling. Sega doesn't want to be a Japanese company that has more pull in America & Europe than they do in Japan.


An example would be the sony scenario. I heard that Sega had a chance to work with Sony and that Sega of America was perfectly keen on the idea but SoJ refused. This proved to be a grievous error down the line.

I think that was Nintendo. They were trying to compete with the SegaMega CD and rumors of the Saturn, so they sought out Sony to develop a CD based SNES add-on, and perhaps a new CD based console pending on that deal. Well Nintendo backed out after Sony had invested substantial amounts of capital into a prototype due to content control issues, and ended up awarding the contract to a competing line of development from Phillips (who they also backed out of a deal with). Philips was granted the right to release their hardware as the CD-i and the use of some Nintendo franchises under Nintendo's control. (like Zelda, Mah Boi!)

Sony continued with the development of the Playstation, releasing it originally with the pseudonym PSX which some oldfucks like myself still use to refer to the original Playstation. PSX was the code-name for the project Sony was building for Nintendo... so yeah... the PSX name actually was a form of sour-grapes inspired spitefulness aimed at Nintnedo.


It was started in America but moved to Japan in the early beginning. Before it became Sega I think.

They started as an American company selling and servicing arcade and midway machines to US Military bases in Japan post WWII. Sega's name is an amalgamation of it's original name Service Games.

[yoshiblue]

Thanks for the correction. Yay history!

[Sinue_v2]

Thanks for the correction. Yay history!

Speaking of history, there's a pretty good historic quote that sums up Sega's long sorted history rather aptly.

"A house divided against itself cannot stand." ~ A. Lincoln.

[StriderTuna]

I say Capcom's going to fall as with the way it's running its series into the ground, fighting games will be its main strong point and odds are the fighting game market will hit a recession again... but this time Capcom won't have the talented staff needed to make games to fall back on.

Whatever SoJ's doing, it's still bad for the whole company as having more pull in japan won't mean a thing when you're on the ropes for the 2nd or 3rd time.

As far as the dreamcast, it wasn't a bad system, it's just that Sony basically started shifting the playing field to a wider scale, which was great for them but terrible for Sega (The DC was ultimately a favorite system of hardcore players, too bad they're outnumbered by the causal jRPGers and GTA fans) Even now I'm not sure if Any Sega branch is even paying attention to modern times as opposed to the old glory days (where Sonic was in the same sentence with Mario)

[AzureBlaze]

I wonder if the Sonic Olympic Games has anything to do with it?
I heard that SOL's first games like...single-handedly pllued SOA out of the hot water by selling really really well. It's like, I had not heard that SOL sold well, but apparently it really out-did itself over here for some reason. I don't think any of Sega was reported to be expecting it to do so, either. I mean how can 1 game save the day for everyone? That seems unheard of.

Anyone know if this is true/what the story is behind it?

[Keilyn]

I don't think Sega's internal structural problems stem from a case of sour grapes over the 16-bit era. A more likely, and more recent, culprit may be the competitive atmosphere going into the development of the Dreamcast's hardware (Japan's design won), and it's eventual handling by Sega of America's president Peter Moore. There was a lot of internal struggling between SoA and SoJ over the Dreamcast's market strategies which were failing in Japan, but looked to be moderately successful in the US. Isao Okawa let Moore handle the Dreamcast in the west how he wanted, even though it ultimately failed, partially hamstringed by SoJ already talking about taking Sega in the 3rd party direction. Whether or not Sega survived depended on how well SoA did with the Dreamcast, and some rather obscene sales goals came down the pipe that Moore wasn't able to reach. So Moore made the call to cut the Dreamcast, and in the restructuring that followed his failure, Sega of Japan marginalized SoA and shifted most of their development and executive power back to Japan. Moore left Sega to take up a position at Microsoft overseeing the launch of the Xbox and Xbox 360.

As I understand it anyhow.



It's more of a power play than trolling. Sega doesn't want to be a Japanese company that has more pull in America & Europe than they do in Japan.



I think that was Nintendo. They were trying to compete with the SegaMega CD and rumors of the Saturn, so they sought out Sony to develop a CD based SNES add-on, and perhaps a new CD based console pending on that deal. Well Nintendo backed out after Sony had invested substantial amounts of capital into a prototype due to content control issues, and ended up awarding the contract to a competing line of development from Phillips (who they also backed out of a deal with). Philips was granted the right to release their hardware as the CD-i and the use of some Nintendo franchises under Nintendo's control. (like Zelda, Mah Boi!)

Sony continued with the development of the Playstation, releasing it originally with the pseudonym PSX which some oldfucks like myself still use to refer to the original Playstation. PSX was the code-name for the project Sony was building for Nintendo... so yeah... the PSX name actually was a form of sour-grapes inspired spitefulness aimed at Nintnedo.



They started as an American company selling and servicing arcade and midway machines to US Military bases in Japan post WWII. Sega's name is an amalgamation of it's original name Service Games.



Hawaii did not become a state until 1959 and even when the Rozen Merger occured, it was considered to still have more entities of the late polynesians in their own cultural influence rather than pure American Ideology.

Though an American Started it all, it was in a place that was as far away from American Culture as possible during its time.

[Xefi]

Sega of America vs. Sega of Japan. Round 1...FIGHT! who's going to win? SEGA! :cat:

but jokes aside, add in to this reason why Sega not bringing over PSP2 Infinity
& Valkyria 3 over to NA. I guess privacy & low sales aren't the only factors anymore
since they're too busy headshotting themselves. :pizza:

[StriderTuna]

Sega of America vs. Sega of Japan. Round 1...FIGHT! who's going to win? SEGA! :cat:

but jokes aside, add in to this reason why Sega not bringing over PSP2 Infinity
& Valkyria 3 over to NA. I guess privacy & low sales aren't the only factors anymore
since they're too busy headshotting themselves. :pizza:

You mean "Not SEGA!"? Whoever wins this bicker fight, Sega loses as a whole.

As for PSPo2i or VC3, one could blame the Vita for it perhaps, but no VC3 for us comes off as particularly spiteful in this light. But I do know what we'll get for sure: Yet another crummy gimicky sonic game!

[Mantiskilla]

Man I think we all should just chill out about what is or isn't going to come out over here. Listen we can't get everything and besides bickering aside or not if a particular game just doesn't sell well over here (VC2 for instance) why should they even bother giving VC3 a chance? Probably goes the same for PSP2i even though it would be nice to see it but at the end of the day it is what it is. Sorry if this might make some people mad but that's just an honest opinion of mine. The business world can be cruel even in the video game realm contrary to how some gamers don't want to believe.

[Sinue_v2]

Hawaii did not become a state until 1959 and even when the Rozen Merger occured, it was considered to still have more entities of the late polynesians in their own cultural influence rather than pure American Ideology.

Though an American Started it all, it was in a place that was as far away from American Culture as possible during its time.

Yes, but I didn't feel such information was expedient to the discussion at hand, so I summarized. Besides, while Hawaii would not become a state until 1959, the Newlands Resolution of 1897 had already firmly established Hawaii as a U.S. territory similar to Guam, The Virgin Islands, and Puerto Rico. According to Article Four of the Constitution, and precedent set by Supreme Court in interpreting it, U.S. Territories belong to but are not a part of, the United States. Despite having their own provisional governments, their citizens are still considered U.S. Citizens. (Sorry birthers, Obama is still legit)

Regardless of cultural identity, Hawaii was still a U.S. property, and Ray Lemaire/Rich Stewart were still American citizens... with a company that primarily serviced U.S. Naval bases. Rosen imported many of their products to Japan, and it just wasn't until the Rosen merger that they would officially become Sega and inject themselves into the market Rosen Enterprises had already established in Japan.


Listen we can't get everything

I don't think we want everything. I don't really think the western market is... uh... "ready"... for BeatTrain Lolicon, Winning 11, or a slew of dating sims. But Valkyria Chronicles 3 and PSP2i are major titles which translate well to the western market. There's other problems with PSP piracy and lack of advertising which prevent them from doing as well as they could. Both of which could be solved with a bit of effort and innovation.

[lostinseganet]

I wonder if the Sonic Olympic Games has anything to do with it?
I heard that SOL's first games like...single-handedly pllued SOA out of the hot water by selling really really well. It's like, I had not heard that SOL sold well, but apparently it really out-did itself over here for some reason. I don't think any of Sega was reported to be expecting it to do so, either. I mean how can 1 game save the day for everyone? That seems unheard of.

Anyone know if this is true/what the story is behind it?

Final Fantasy 1, and Dead or alive 1 was the saving grace for their respective owners. In their time if they failed it would have been squares final game, and tecmo would have been dead in the water.

[Tetsaru]

Final Fantasy 1, and Dead or alive 1 was the saving grace for their respective owners. In their time if they failed it would have been squares final game, and tecmo would have been dead in the water.

I remember hearing something about FF1 being a pivotal title for Squaresoft back then... something in an interview with Nobuo Uematsu I read a while back about how he got into composing music for video games. I think back then though, the video game industry in general was suddenly taking a turn for the better, due to things like the Nintendo console, arcade machines, and Mario making an appearance to help bring the industry out of its infancy and turn it into a well-known, popular entertainment medium during the 1980's.

That aside, I'm not too familiar with all the backstory behind Sega's internal squabbles (companies tend to be secretive about that sort of stuff), but they really need to get their shit together, lest we have another PSU situation or Sonic the Hedgehog 2006 happen again... although, to an extent, stuff like Sonic Colors/Generations and having Sakai work on PSO2 has me somewhat optimistic for the future. I guess the question now is, how long will relying on nostalgia keep them going? I mean, the original Sonic games are being released on PSN/Xbox Live, despite having been ported to various collection games for various consoles... it might bring in new fans and get them familiar with the series' origins, but it won't keep other gamers interested in the long run. Eventually, they're going to have to come up with something new, and it remains to be seen how well they can deliver without spinning the old Sonic Cycle again.

[Mike]

Winning 11

I know the soccer market isn't as big in the States as it is in Japan but soccer games would still find their niche.

[Sinue_v2]

I know the soccer market isn't as big in the States as it is in Japan but soccer games would still find their niche.

Oh, my bad. I mistook Winning 11 for a horse racing sim. What was the name of that series that was big on the PS2 in Japan? I dunno... they're not very popular over here, but Japan loves them.

[Mantiskilla]

Well my younger sis (now in college) is big into the horse thing and I used to buy her Gallop Racer for the PS2 when she was younger but that game was a Tecmo game