what I would change about PSO2

[connor_the_kid]

I say bring some points to the table. There may be some hostility attached with the bullet points, but at least he has a solid defense to the game built up. That is the point of discussion after all.

Its already been stated that what you want from the game is most likely a different game entirely. Which doesn't need to happen since the game is still doing well. Either come up with solutions of your own to the game's design or stop telling people they're "wasting their time."

well.. I'm not going to make some huge post about everything I think is wrong with the game.

but I will list some things that need to happen before this game is worth anyones time.

-tons of balancing. the balancing in this game is god awful. tons of PAs are useless, redundant , to overpowered...
-more challenging content... better AI and better hate system on monsters, enemies should be able to put pressure on ranged too...
-melee needs way more mobility options, gap closers/stinger type stuff and a double jump
-rare weapons should have unique abilities , most don't, or if they do its usually useless. incentives to collect, rather than just getting one good item and saying 'ok, I Guess I beat the game'.
-gambling and RNG needs to be less central to the game, right now THIS IS A GAMBLING GAME. thats it. rares are gambling, grinding is gambling, AC is gambling .there needs to be some content rewarded for taking down super challenging content(doesnt exist atm) and putting in a lot of time
-more interesting level designs/enemy designs. looks like the new area is pretty much floating continent with reskinned diggs and a reskinned vol dragon.

- just in general.... more focus on balancing the game. I hate that they are doing bi-monthly update maintenance and they cant do some simple tweaks to their game during those maintenances. we're waiting like 3++ months for a fury stance and zonde tweak? seriously? its like they dont even care about their non casuals at all

***tweaks to freemium****

they should give trade to everyone. I'm surprisingly fine with rares being for premium, but you should at least be able to trade meseta, costumes, items, etc with your f2p friends.

when you buy character slots they should be permanent. I paid $5 for a character slot and when I went to remade my character, it got deleted.

this is the stuff I immediately thought of, I'm posting because dare anyone think I'm trolling and I'm just making empty complaints "this game sucks!" and not listing what needs to change.

[The Walrus]

Don't really get how rares are gambling plz explain.

Other than that you pretty much want what a lot of us do in terms of changes.

[connor_the_kid]

the RNG. you're doing these mindless quests repeatedly, hoping you'll be the one to pop that red crystal and be the jackpot winner.

reality? you're going to run the same quest 1000 times and get nothing in return. so it's gambling with your time, imo... there's no guaranteed reward for playing, which is why I include it as gambling just like grinding and AC scratch

[BlankM]

well.. I'm not going to make some huge post about everything I think is wrong with the game.

but I will list some things that need to happen before this game is worth anyones time.

-tons of balancing. the balancing in this game is god awful. tons of PAs are useless, redundant , to overpowered...
-more challenging content... better AI and better hate system on monsters, enemies should be able to put pressure on ranged too...
-melee needs way more mobility options, gap closers/stinger type stuff and a double jump
-rare weapons should have unique abilities , most don't, or if they do its usually useless. incentives to collect, rather than just getting one good item and saying 'ok, I Guess I beat the game'.
-gambling and RNG needs to be less central to the game, right now THIS IS A GAMBLING GAME. thats it. rares are gambling, grinding is gambling, AC is gambling .there needs to be some content rewarded for taking down super challenging content(doesnt exist atm) and putting in a lot of time
-more interesting level designs/enemy designs. looks like the new area is pretty much floating continent with reskinned diggs and a reskinned vol dragon.

- just in general.... more focus on balancing the game. I hate that they are doing bi-monthly update maintenance and they cant do some simple tweaks to their game during those maintenances. we're waiting like 3++ months for a fury stance and zonde tweak? seriously? its like they dont even care about their non casuals at all

***tweaks to freemium****

they should give trade to everyone. I'm surprisingly fine with rares being for premium, but you should at least be able to trade meseta, costumes, items, etc with your f2p friends.

when you buy character slots they should be permanent. I paid $5 for a character slot and when I went to remade my character, it got deleted.

this is the stuff I immediately thought of, I'm posting because dare anyone think I'm trolling and I'm just making empty complaints "this game sucks!" and not listing what needs to change.

I agree with most your points, except the game isn't really over yet so to say people should be satisfied with just one good item doesn't take into account what the future will throw at us.

I think potentials are pretty much almost never worth the hassle, and the ones that are shouldn't be...

As it stands there isn't something difficult to do that you get rewarded for, like C-mode(Which arguably isn't too difficult.)

I don't think gambling is a big deal. There will always have to be some NPC meseta drain, otherwise people will have too much money they can handle and prices would be ridiculous for newer players. It could be done better sure. I would like something we can turn into the recycle shop for every failed grind. Even 700K for a grind reduction isn't even that bad though considering it costs 8 AC items to get...

Balance in MMO's almost always suck. If the balance doesn't suck then the game probably is boring anyways. The fact that they're doing something at all is enough for me.


anyway, You could tell me to play single-player games, but they're not offering what I necessarily want. I like the Phantasy Star series because I get to run through dungeons (a feeling that has been lost in PSO2, in my opinion), hunt rares, grab loot, kill monsters, etc. PSO2 offers that, but I feel like it's horribly done because of the randomised content, and how playing doesn't actually reward you unless the RNG likes you (eg: you don't get meseta from drops anymore at all, really, like you used to). The drop rates being so retardedly low doesn't help either.

I play online games to play with other people. I don't play them for the social aspect (by this I mean, hanging around in lobbies, chatting with people, etc.). They're a nice addition, and I do participate in said things, but I feel the main focus of an online game should, just like every game should be (unless it's designed otherwise), be the game itself. If I felt like I should be playing PSO2 for costumes, My Room, hanging around in lobbies, I probably wouldn't be playing PSO2 and finding some virtual sim game instead which is designed for exactly that.

Costumes and lobbies don't keep things fresh at all for me, as they're just skins. The problem with PSO2 is the next thing feels the same as the last. The fact that maps are randomly generated make playing desert feel just as a chore as forest or ruins. There doesn't seem to be any uniqueness about playing different maps except different drop tables, in my opinion. In the past games (side note: I wish people would stop screaming NOSTALGIA; a sequel should live up to its past games, otherwise it should just be called something different. eg: Resident Evil), playing ruins felt different to playing Forest. The ruins layouts were different to Forest, so you felt like you was playing somewhere completely different to forest, especially since maps were actually set. You felt the variety there, but in the PSO2 you don't feel it at all.

I like PSO2 to its core. It's a great game, but I feel it could really be worked on to cater to its entire playerbase. The main people are the hardcore players, who I'm sure would be willing to spend a lot of money if the content was just right for them too.

My response to Z-0's post. I agree that there was a lot more feeling of a location in the original PSO. In PSO2 you're kind of dumped in a big flat landscape with rocky terrain and the layouts don't really get much more interesting past that. But this is honestly a problem I've had since PSU.

In the original PSO you had places like Mountains, Forest, Seabed. You actually felt like you where in a location, and not just another random dungeon.

One thing I would like back from PSO are real boss rushes as well. The fact that some quests had "specific" map layouts compared to trying to do CO's with randomized maps is what made the original feel so very tailored and thought-out. And not just mindless fetch quests.

Most people probably all want these changes. But I'm not going to be too critical. I enjoy the game now and haven't paid a single cent. If the game was stagnant I would be more up-tight about these issues but its really not.

Edit: Meseta is a good flat reward along with spellstone shop equips.

[blace]

Grinding and AC scratch being luck based and can be considered gambling sure, but I don't see how rares are when you need to put in the effort to hunt something that doesn't require any real payment to obtain.

[BlankM]

Gambling with your time = actually playing the game. If you don't enjoy playing it then yeah you are gambling on that unfun time to be made worthwhile...so you can get a good equip to continue playing the game!

Welcome to MMO's lol.

[blace]

Welcome to every MMO ever.
Fixed.

[connor_the_kid]

Gambling with your time = actually playing the game. If you don't enjoy playing it then yeah you are gambling on that unfun time to be made worthwhile...so you can get a good equip to continue playing the game!

Welcome to MMO's lol.

I know but PSO2 takes it to the extreme. not only are the droprates/RNG totally ridiculous but there is nothing else to do besides to participate in this unfair RNG over and over.

in PSO2 literally every 10* is borderline impossible to get the one you want and 11* 12* forget about it lol

its just kinda sad that you very quickly find yourself without anything to do and no realistic goals in pso2

saying 'welcome to every MMO ever' is just false, pretty much every successful MMO gives the user multiple goals they can go after, multiple things they can do on their character, than just chasing items youll probably never get.

people keep making the argument that the game is casual .,.. but theres a big issue here. the combat is totally casual but then the drops are like HELL MODE. isn't that wrong?

[blace]

I know but PSO2 takes it to the extreme. not only are the droprates/RNG totally ridiculous but there is nothing else to do besides to participate in this unfair RNG over and over.

in PSO2 literally every 10* is borderline impossible to get the one you want and 11* 12* forget about it lol

its just kinda sad that you very quickly find yourself without anything to do and no realistic goals in pso2

saying 'welcome to every MMO ever' is just false, pretty much every successful MMO gives the user multiple goals they can go after, multiple things they can do on their character, than just chasing items youll probably never get.

people keep making the argument that the game is casual .,.. but theres a big disconnect here. the combat is totally casual but then the drops are like HELL MODE. isn't that wrong?
Welcome to free to play.

[connor_the_kid]

what if I pay to play and I know that a huge amount of the community also pays? through AC scratch premium etc.

should I not expect quality content because the model is F2P, even though that model has been known to produce MORE money for the developers than P2P...?

nah... thats no excuse. if it ever was one.

[BlankM]

Back in the original PSO I wanted for a long time to get a Rambling May, along with a Heavenly Punisher.

So yeah I do really miss the item variety. As it stands all that matters are numbers, where as utility and gameplay style suffer. Not much reason to collect inferior rares like PSO had.

But in the end you still zerk'd your way through everything in that game and Forces casted naked soooo...yeah.

[blace]

what if I pay to play and I know that a huge amount of the community also pays? through AC scratch premium etc.

should I not expect quality content because the model is F2P, even though that model has been known to produce MORE money for the developers than P2P...?

nah... thats no excuse. if it ever was one.
Considering the large number of other free to play games on the open market, they all follow the same guideline of being a time sink/money sink. It offers a greater profit margin as you are not obligated to put forth money into the game, but for the ease of use with certain functions locked away.

I have never played a free to play game where real goals were set, nor without the excess time needed hunt for decent gear and other equipment without any real purpose or losing its purpose with later updates.

That is how freemium works, they mostly focus on the aspects that will keep you entrenched in the game and making it feel as if it was obligatory to invest time into. The only goals in the game are the ones you set for yourself and make do with what is in the game and what isn't. The last MMO I have played had a very limited access to anything that wasn't paid content, or without the ease of having nearly everything obtainable without needing to pay for a 7 day pass to a area specifically made for paying customers.

Most often than not, cosmetic items are the only real content the game gets with large content updates being far and few. PSO2 doesn't seem to be deviating from what has already been established as successful and used by most of the free to play options available.

[connor_the_kid]

so basically "This is how it is, just deal with it"?

and I would disagree with you.

there are plenty of popular F2P games that make a big profit off their cash shops and still manage to add meaningful and challenging/interesting new content. whether you like them or not, Nexon's games like Mabinogi, Vindictus, and Maple Story would be pretty good examples.

F2P is not, NOT a pass for crappy service!

They're making more money with this model than a subscription. that's why theyre doing it. if anything , we should get more in return.

[BlankM]

Please don't mention Maplestory. That game is one of the WORST offenders of gambling. Also the gameplay is not so much challenging as it is absurd. Everything is basically just the same except they do more damage and have higher amounts of health. And the balance of the game is even worst then PSO2.

[connor_the_kid]

I just mentioned it because they regularly add new characters,areas, big balancing patches, etc. despite the payment model. Not a very good game IMO but still.

[blace]

so basically "This is how it is, just deal with it"?

and I would disagree with you.

there are plenty of popular F2P games that make a big profit off their cash shops and still manage to add meaningful and challenging/interesting new content. whether you like them or not, Nexon's games like Mabinogi, Vindictus, and Maple Story would be pretty good examples.

F2P is not, NOT a pass for crappy service!

They're making more money with this model than a subscription. that's why theyre doing it. if anything , we should get more in return.
List a few games that offer more without following the same principles as any other.

[BlankM]

Even in principle. Past F2P games shouldn't be a good point of reference for PSO2, the sequel to one of the first big-hitters in the genre period. We just expect the sequel to be better, instead of a continued PSU and PSP2.

I am pretty satisfied with what PSO2 improved upon and brought back from the original, but theres a lot missing. I don't think a P2P model would have made a difference there.

[connor_the_kid]

List a few games that offer more without following the same principles as any other.

Sorry but I'm not gonna derail the discussion into "Yeah PSO2 is bad BUT "x" GAMES ARE JUST AS BAD!!"

I expected more from the sequel to PSO.. I gave my suggestions

I know that they are making more than enough money to make PSO2 a good game, it comes down to incompetence and/or greed, unwillingness to put any money towards PSO2 because theyre milking it like a cow, they see the players as gullible saps who will keep giving them money even if they do nothing.

[blace]

Even in principle. Past F2P games shouldn't be a good point of reference for PSO2, the sequel to one of the first big-hitters in the genre period. We just expect the sequel to be better, instead of a continued PSU and PSP2.

I am pretty satisfied with what PSO2 improved upon and brought back from the original, but theres a lot missing. I don't think a P2P model would have made a difference there.
It most likely wouldn't, but they are taking other games as an example if not improved on it. For certain, there's a lot less RMT in comparison, due to having to purchase the ability to trade. That's just one thing out of many it has done something that I feel is proper. There are goals as well since many don't seem to have any real set goals, especially the huge open world ones.


Sorry but I'm not gonna derail the discussion into "Yeah PSO2 is bad BUT "x" GAMES ARE JUST AS BAD!!"

I expected more from the sequel to PSO.. I gave my suggestions

I know that they are making more than enough money to make PSO2 a good game, it comes down to incompetence and/or greed, unwillingness to put any money towards PSO2 because theyre milking it like a cow, they see the players as gullible saps who will keep giving them money even if they do nothing.
I do agree that companies shouldn't see their fanbase and potential customers as fodder, but they do and people will buy into it because of name alone or the fanservice will do it for them.

[BlankM]

Yeah I will admit, its not like SEGA isn't just following the example of other F2P games, and making it more accessible in PSO2.

At least you aren't limited by your ID. You can technically get anything you want, specially if you get some 10* purchase passes.

I don't believe that should be the point though. You're just going to be killing things faster and still not enjoying the core game if you don't already.

[blace]

Yeah I will admit, its not like SEGA isn't just following the example of other F2P games, and making it more accessible in PSO2.

At least you aren't limited by your ID. You can technically get anything you want, specially if you get some 10* purchase passes.

I don't believe that should be the point though. You're just going to be killing things faster and still not enjoying the core game if you don't already.
I doubt they'll ever implement anything that wouldn't break what is already established. Just more rare hunting with your luck against the RNG.

Massive flaws aside, they'll most likely leave it as is, as it is drawing in a large number of players due to how it paces itself from others.

[Zyrusticae]

I know that they are making more than enough money to make PSO2 a good game, it comes down to incompetence and/or greed, unwillingness to put any money towards PSO2 because theyre milking it like a cow, they see the players as gullible saps who will keep giving them money even if they do nothing.
This is outrageously exaggerated.

They're gunning for a different target market than you. They even put out two player surveys to gauge feedback and make changes accordingly, and apparently the hardcore fanbase is far less numerous than the posts on the internet would have you believe (which is not surprising at all if you know anything at all about how forums tend to work). That does not make them incompetent, and it says that they do care about their customer satisfaction to some degree. If their feedback actually says "yeah, these guys just want more fanservice" then that's what they're going to sell. That's no one's fault but the customer base.

And they've been pouring tons of money into PSO2. The content they've been putting out attests to that (and seriously, what fucking game are you playing that gets updated as often as PSO2 does? I want to know!). Episode 2 is coming in the summer as well, which itself is the size of a major expansion from any other game. That's not negligence by any stretch of the imagination.

You want negligence, you look at games like Champions Online that have tremendous potential and are seeing it all thrown away because the money just isn't coming in, or because the management is a bunch of greedy assholes, or I don't even know what the hell the reason is but it is really goddamn depressing seeing how little attention that game gets compared to PSO2.

[UnLucky]

I hate how the system makes free players feel like shit for not paying.

Oops, I leveled up incorrectly, do I delete my character? Live with the mistake? Or pay money?

Oops, I found the wrong item, do I NPC vendor it? Do I buy a shop license to sell it to my friend for cheap and hope someone else doesn't buy it? Do we each buy premium so I can give it to him? Do we both buy premium and each trade in a separate item to buy each other's item for cheap?

So now I have the item I want, but it's only slightly better if I spend hundreds of hours and a vast fortune of in-game and real currency combined.

Alright, so I want some fun little extras. Maybe a costume, some upgrade insurance, a couple self revives, EXP/drop rate/meseta increasers, you know, standard cash shop items. Uh, where do I buy these? Most of it is in a lottery? It costs $2 for each revive? $2 for half an hour of double exp? Maybe I'll just... not, actually.

Huh, so enemies drop 1-30 MST, and items sell for 1/10 as much as you can buy them for. Finding an untekked item can often be worse than nothing at all because it costs more to identify than they're worth. Don't tell me "but it was worse before!!" because it's still bad.

[EvilMag]

It wasn't always like that. I remember how easy it was to make money in this game. Then Sega decided to be greedy scumbag trash eaters and nerf vendor prices and introduce recycle shops.

[Tenlade]

Sorry but I'm not gonna derail the discussion into "Yeah PSO2 is bad BUT "x" GAMES ARE JUST AS BAD!!"

I expected more from the sequel to PSO.. I gave my suggestions

I know that they are making more than enough money to make PSO2 a good game, it comes down to incompetence and/or greed, unwillingness to put any money towards PSO2 because theyre milking it like a cow, they see the players as gullible saps who will keep giving them money even if they do nothing.

Sega's dragging thier heels on actually updating the gameplay, because they're stretching it out as filler updates between content. This way they can still keep interest in the lulls between new stuff, but still results in the unfortunate problem of taking forever to actually fix something.

They are trying to fix and reduce the rng issue though. they've reduced risk rate and throw out 99 grinders and several risk reduces like cheap candy, devaluing them without outright making them useless. the pyrexene shop is pretty much taking luck out of stats altogether, letting you get a decent powerful rare without needing to rely on the rng. the skill update shows they are trying to balance things though yes they are terrible at it.

Leave this game and come back in a year. If psov2, bb, PSU's expansion, and psp2infinity have shown, Sega will eventually update this game and hopefully fix some of the problems, but its gonna take a loooong while before it happens.

[BlankM]

I hate how the system makes free players feel like shit for not paying.

Oops, I leveled up incorrectly, do I delete my character? Live with the mistake? Or pay money?

Oops, I found the wrong item, do I NPC vendor it? Do I buy a shop license to sell it to my friend for cheap and hope someone else doesn't buy it? Do we each buy premium so I can give it to him? Do we both buy premium and each trade in a separate item to buy each other's item for cheap?

So now I have the item I want, but it's only slightly better if I spend hundreds of hours and a vast fortune of in-game and real currency combined.

Alright, so I want some fun little extras. Maybe a costume, some upgrade insurance, a couple self revives, EXP/drop rate/meseta increasers, you know, standard cash shop items. Uh, where do I buy these? Most of it is in a lottery? It costs $2 for each revive? $2 for half an hour of double exp? Maybe I'll just... not, actually.

Huh, so enemies drop 1-30 MST, and items sell for 1/10 as much as you can buy them for. Finding an untekked item can often be worse than nothing at all because it costs more to identify than they're worth. Don't tell me "but it was worse before!!" because it's still bad.

I can't seem to tell whether you're complaining about free players getting the shaft or paying players.

That said skill tree resets are coming for free soon. Pretty happy about that, maybe I'll mess around with Hunter again.

[Alisha]

to me the idea of giving melee gap closers is like taking asprin when you keep getting headaches and not addressing what may be causing those headaches.

ask yourself why is it that we never needed gap closers in Pso PSU or phantasy star portable?

[UnLucky]

because either everything in the whole room instantly vaporized with a single tech or everyone had a Shot to do the same, but boss fights had most players largely standing still throughout

[BlankM]

Most bosses didn't really move around as much as they do in this game. Melee classes need gap closers but there will still be large incentive to run ranged-game.

Hunters were notoriously bad in PSO so yeah. This is a re-occuring problem.

[Z-0]

Hunters were godlike in PSOv2. Best class there was.

V3+ made them worse though, where it shifted to Ranger.

PSU had it changing because of constant rebalancing, lol.

[BlankM]

Ah yes PSOv2, with its amazing custom weapons...

I think the game just needs more interesting risk/reward exchanges in general. Forces blow things to bits, rangers make everyone overpowered, and hunters deal a lot of damage...when they get there.

Fighters and Gunners have some interesting mechanics but they both largely boil down to damage steroids and not really much to keep the player on their toes.

[~Aya~]

What would I change? Salon... need more accessories slots, multiple colors in hair or highlights, ability to properly free run/parkour like a bawse. (See intro/benchmark).

[Alisha]

Hunters were godlike in PSOv2. Best class there was.

V3+ made them worse though, where it shifted to Ranger.

PSU had it changing because of constant rebalancing, lol.

hunter were always great imo until infinity hit. as time goes on i think removing the chain system was a huge mistake.

[Tenlade]

What would I change? Salon... need more accessories slots, multiple colors in hair or highlights, ability to properly free run/parkour like a bawse. (See intro/benchmark).

I want to put on hat accessories without having to go to to the salon and through two loading screens.

[Gama]

ok what would i change on the game. lol this will be funny...

-fix the gfx engine! ( it is fairly better but theres allot of room for inprovement)
-bring tesselation for the high end pc gamers! i'm not one bu ill bet it would be an enjoyable feature.

-enable trades for everyone "frustrating when you want to help someone"


-bring back the all language interface that pso had, it was basic but very usefull.
-oh and also an oficial english thingi wouldnt be bad, just subtitles i like the japanese voices. "cmon the na servers are going to be a disaster anyway"

- i want photon chairs! and football lobbies "maybe team rooms?"

- being able to combine hairstyles, more than 3 acessory pieces, change eletronic voicing on casts.

-give mags a personality! cmon this would be neat!

[~Aya~]

I want to put on hat accessories without having to go to to the salon and through two loading screens.


Yes and we also need separate inventory for quest items. Come on sega.


If pokemon can do it, so can we.

[Agitated_AT]

hey OP. Just wanted to say you win. Excellent description, especially the part where there isnt rewarding in the game for passing a great challenge and instead we have rng for most content. damn this game

anyway kudos bro

[Syklo]

This has gone from a debate to request&receive.

what I'd like to see, but may not happen at all (lol):
-More interactive environments; partially submerged zones, wall jumping (in mines?), swinging (forest vines / floating cont.), etc.
-Weaken vendor nerf.
-More accessory slots
-Different arks quest varieties, e.g. MPA Sports.

[Eveningxtar]

Hmm, interesting discussion, and as for what changes I would like to see on this game, well, how bout adding more pyroxene weapon and armor so that even if the god of RNG hates you, you still have an alternative to getting decent gears.
As for balancing issue, maybe a wider guard range for hunter and definitely more mobility.

[BlankM]

Very appropriate move.

[Blackheart521]

Reaction commands (Ala Kingdom Hearts) ^^;

[Eveningxtar]

Regarding the melee weapons/class lack of mobility,would giving a function whereby if player hold their normal attack key for 1-2 sec, it will initiate an attack whereby the player will leap X distance towards a target before smashing their weapon down. What do fellow PSO2 players think?

[Daiyousei]

Very appropriate move.

And just when the topic was actually getting discussed too.