What is a good Main/Sub combination for a FULL SUPPORT build?

[Foxhound3857]

I'm looking to play a "full support" class in PSO2, one that hangs in the rear of a group, focuses entirely on buffing, healing, and crowd control, with DPS being by far the lowest priority. I've heard that Techer is probably the best choice for this because of PPRestorate, Resta, and several different group buffs, but I wanted to get some opinions on this.

I'm not looking to be a damage dealer, I'm looking to be a healer and a buffer.

And failing that, is there any sort of "Paladin" main/sub combo, like a main/sub that can both solo with solid melee and high defense, with self heals and buffs?

[Sizustar]

http://www.pso-world.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=45

[Foxhound3857]

If you're going to give me a link, it should be to one specific guide and not a page full of them, forcing me to nitpick. =/

[Scale of Judgment]

To be honest, damage dealing is very supportive since we are now being introduced to Timers.
Most of the times people die is because it is their fault. There is also a Q and A thread somewhere in first page for this inquiry

Answer: Te is required for support as it has buffs to resta, shifta, and deband. It also has to be main class for maximized abilities such as reverser field(revives once in 90 seconds), 30 seconds per tick on shifta/deband.
Hu is good support with guard stance and taunt. It will also keep you alive for a long time.
Bo is alright with its aura support every 90 seconds or so.

for paladin class, go for TeHu.

[Foxhound3857]

To be honest, damage dealing is very supportive since we are now being introduced to Timers.
Most of the times people die is because it is their fault. There is also a Q and A thread somewhere in first page for this inquiry

Answer: Te is required for support as it has buffs to resta, shifta, and deband. It also has to be main class for maximized abilities such as reverser field(revives once in 90 seconds), 30 seconds per tick on shifta/deband.
Hu is good support with guard stance and taunt. It will also keep you alive for a long time.
Bo is alright with its aura support every 90 seconds or so.

for paladin class, go for TeHu.

So Main Techer for Resta/PPRestorate/Shifta/Deband/Revive and buffs, and then Sub Hu and...is there some sort of shield in this game? Gunslasher looks the most interesting, is that viable for Te/Hu, or do I want Wand or something?

[Sizustar]

If you're going to give me a link, it should be to one specific guide and not a page full of them, forcing me to nitpick. =/

http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714

[Foxhound3857]

Te/Hu cannot use Gunslashes?

[LonelyGaruga]

It can, it's just not recommended because it isn't useful to do so.

[Foxhound3857]

It can, it's just not recommended because it isn't useful to do so.

Why not? I could do both melee and ranged with it if I had to.

Lances don't sound like my thing, but neither do Wands.

[Stickboy]

have you ever compare wands and gunslashes at all? it doesn't sound like you have

[landman]

I'm not looking to be a damage dealer, I'm looking to be a healer and a buffer.

And failing that, is there any sort of "Paladin" main/sub combo, like a main/sub that can both solo with solid melee and high defense, with self heals and buffs?
Anything can solo, but soloing is easyer the faster you kill the enemy, less time it takes = less possibilities the enemy will hit you. And techer is provably the most underperforming class in the game when it comes to attack. And when it comes to support... sorry, but Weak Bullet beats any other kind of support in terms of usefulness.

[Z-0]

It might sound nice, but it doesn't do very much damage overall, and the best support you can offer in this game outside of TE buffs is... doing damage and Zondeel suction (plus Weak Bullet, but you shouldn't pair Weak Bullet and TE buffs because you'll be useless outside of those). To do damage as TE, you want to use Wand Smacks (its main weapon) and techniques if you have the right sub (Fi or Br).

This isn't a game where "full support" works. Feel free to do it, but don't be surprised if you feel absolutely useless after casting the first buffs, because this isn't a game where people need constant healing, and every single class can crowd control in this game. There doesn't need to be dedicated crowd controllers people for most content, and even if you are the crowd controller with Zondeel, you should be doing your own damage.

[Lostbob117]

I think this would be most useful: http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eAbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIbjJkjcAfqxJk0000006doIn0000000jdoib0000000f do000000lo00000006dBdAidsOHXGFqAsN0000007bIo000000 8doIb0000008

Going with the wonk build while being tanky. Possibly try to always keep Shifta and Deband up.

[GHNeko]

TE/BO is pretty much the most support heavy combination in the game.

TE's supportive skills. Territory Burst, Shifta Strike, Deband Tougness, Reverser Field, Rebirth Bonus, Shita Critical, Deband Cut, Resta Advance, Extend Assist, Long time Assist.

BO's supportive skills. Critical Field, Elemental PP Field, Heal Share, Heal Bonus.

Then use JB since JB has Shifta, Deband, and Zanverse built into 3 of its PAs, all of which retain the skills/craft effects from TE and in general.

So if you do Strike Gust and then the shift action to insta-cast Shifta from JB, it will have all the properties of TE's Shifta skills and crafted Shifta. Same for Gran Wave and Deband.

So TE/BO JB would probably be the most support capable class combination in the game with a heavy emphasis on supporting everyone while giving up unparalled mobility on the field making reaching people on different height levels easier, and being able to negate any PP increase demerits of Shifta and Deband through JB PAs (Gran Wave for Deband and Strike Gust for Shifta and Moment Gale for Zanverse).

And while it's not much, Elemental Weak Hit works in Tandem with ELemental Stance, allowing your damage to not be bottom of the barrel since you can switch your JB's element at your leisure/will.

[Terrence]

Well, I have to admit killing mobs is a great act of support too. But since many ARKs prefer high DPS and low HP and DEF, Resta is a good thing too (maybe better than a permanent Shifta/Deband) in UQ in particular. TEchter is awsome but the problem is you have to be supportive AND offensive at the same time to be efficient. Being all support isn't good at all in Pso2. So, I think THIS KIND (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?092bbsIkbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbsIk cUlO6dodBIbkAIkI2f4OcFGAIkfcK000000jdoIn0000000jdo ib0000000fdo000000lo00000007oIn00000000IbIo0000008 ebGB4NHnIbrAqnbsfGKfbn00008) of BOuncer/HUnter would be more interesting. I've tested it on one of my teammate and she's really happy with it. Basically, you get average attack power but you turn into a living Trimate ! ^_^ Too bad there isn't any DBs with Defensive Stance (attack power +15% during Guard Stance) already. She took a Starfrisa Ex12 Potential 3 instead to absord HP and healing us more. Well, this is just an alternative idea...

[Kondibon]

To me, the best full support is TE/RA (TE buffs +WB and grenades), but like Z-0 said, it's not much use outside of that so if there's another Te main or Ra you'd end up being redundant. I think Te/Hu with warcry is probably the most support you can get while still doing respectable personal damage.


TE/BO is pretty much the most support heavy combination in the game.

TE's supportive skills. Territory Burst, Shifta Strike, Deband Tougness, Reverser Field, Rebirth Bonus, Shita Critical, Deband Cut, Resta Advance, Extend Assist, Long time Assist.

BO's supportive skills. Critical Field, Elemental PP Field, Heal Share, Heal Bonus.

Then use JB since JB has Shifta, Deband, and Zanverse built into 3 of its PAs, all of which retain the skills/craft effects from TE and in general.

So if you do Strike Gust and then the shift action to insta-cast Shifta from JB, it will have all the properties of TE's Shifta skills and crafted Shifta. Same for Gran Wave and Deband.

So TE/BO JB would probably be the most support capable class combination in the game with a heavy emphasis on supporting everyone while giving up unparalled mobility on the field making reaching people on different height levels easier, and being able to negate any PP increase demerits of Shifta and Deband through JB PAs (Gran Wave for Deband and Strike Gust for Shifta and Moment Gale for Zanverse).

And while it's not much, Elemental Weak Hit works in Tandem with ELemental Stance, allowing your damage to not be bottom of the barrel since you can switch your JB's element at your leisure/will.Bo is honestly pretty bad for support. Critical field is only useful to niche builds and people who probably don't care about damage anyway, elemental pp field requires people to be using the targets element weakness, which not everyone is going to be doing, the techs built into the PAs aren't much better than just casting the techs. If you main techer your buffs would be lasting 3 times as long anyway, so you don't need to apply them as often.
Heal share is useless, the range is the same as non-extended resta, and you likely aren't going to be getting healed unintentionally for a lot so in situations it works you'd be better off using resta or megiverse anyway.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and reverser field is garbage. Just throwing that out there. Rebirth bonus is ok if you have a leftover point, but it works with regular moons. If people are dying enough for you to run out of moons on a regular basis you might want to find some other people to play with.

[Takatsuki]

There is no use for supportive classes in PSO2. If you don't like doing DPS, go play a different game.

[Kondibon]

There is no use for supportive classes in PSO2. If you don't like doing DPS, go play a different game.I'd argue that support has a place, but it's not something there's any reason to focus on. I really doubt people are gonna complain about you bringing shifta strike or weakbullet. Just, yaknow, not at the same time.

[Terrence]

There is no use for supportive classes in PSO2. If you don't like doing DPS, go play a different game.
Aggressive comment with no argument. Nice. Congrats. As Kondibon said, nobody is gonna be disappointed if you boost them.
Support has its place in Pso2. I play TEchter/BOuncer myself and I'm really appreciated for all my 'blessings' :

→ Powerful Shifta/Deband
→ Damage given +10% to all
→ +25% HP to all players
→ Damage received -15% to all
→ Revive with Shifta/Deband
→ Wider supportive Techs
→ Support Techs lasting longer
→ Extremely powerful Resta
→ Anti which boosts PP regen

That beeing said, I do not focus on support my party since I'm capable of dealing big damage too... Balance between attack and support is the key !

[Foxhound3857]

have you ever compare wands and gunslashes at all? it doesn't sound like you have

Can Wands do long-range attacks like Gunslashes?

I was actually thinking about just going with a Sword, since this is technically going to be a hybrid build. Melee support and heals.

[Terrence]

Wands don't have any PA. Close-range strike attacks only. You'll have to use Techs with your Wands to hit long-range.

[Foxhound3857]

Aggressive comment with no argument. Nice. Congrats. As Kondibon said, nobody is gonna be disappointed if you boost them.
Support has its place in Pso2. I play TEchter/BOuncer myself and I'm really appreciated for all my 'blessings' :

→ Powerful Shifta/Deband
→ Damage given +10% to all
→ +25% HP to all players
→ Damage received -15% to all
→ Revive with Shifta/Deband
→ Wider supportive Techs
→ Support Techs lasting longer
→ Extremely powerful Resta
→ Anti which boosts PP regen

That beeing said, I do not focus on support my party since I'm capable of dealing big damage too... Balance between attack and support is the key !

What kind of weapons can Te/Bo use? That sounds like the class combo for me. If I have to solo I'll pick a different class combo before setting out for a mission, unless this Main/Sub combo can also solo decently.

[Kondibon]

As Kondibon said,Don't you dare say anything that associates me with you even remotely. And I already went over why Te/Bo isn't that great for support, let alone personal damage.



Can Wands do long-range attacks like Gunslashes?

I was actually thinking about just going with a Sword, since this is technically going to be a hybrid build. Melee support and heals.With Techs yeah, but you'd wand Te/Fi or Te/Br for that. Sword is bad as a Te/Hu or anything with Hu as a sub really. Wands have some of the strongest normal attacks in the game though, which is why they work for the "paladin" thing. You run up to stuff zondeel, and hit things with your wand.


What kind of weapons can Te/Bo use? That sounds like the class combo for me. If I have to solo I'll pick a different class combo before setting out for a mission, unless this Main/Sub combo can also solo decently.You can literally do all the stuff he listed with Te/Hu. I can't stress enough how bad mediocre Te/Bo is for support.

On the other hand, Te/Bo IS good solo if you have Te usable jet boots. You'll kill things slower but you'll also likely die less. I wouldn't recommend it if support is what you wanna do with it though.

[Terrence]

What kind of weapons can Te/Bo use? That sounds like the class combo for me. If I have to solo I'll pick a different class combo before setting out for a mission, unless this Main/Sub combo can also solo decently.
Wands, Talis and All-Class weapons. But in my case, to get that 'balance' between attack and support, I use TEchter as MAIN Class (to get all supportive skills) and a Jet Boost, which is a BOuncer weapons, meaning I had to craft Jet Boosts it in order to use them with my TEchter if they're not All-Class. Here's my current weapons :

[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/BgmAukG.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

Don't you dare say anything that associates me with you even remotely.
Who let the dogs out ? Can't you focus on the topic and let your pathetic bitterness away for once ???

[Foxhound3857]

Don't you dare say anything that associates me with you even remotely. And I already went over why Te/Bo isn't that great for support, let alone personal damage.


With Techs yeah, but you'd wand Te/Fi or Te/Br for that. Sword is bad as a Te/Hu or anything with Hu as a sub really. Wands have some of the strongest normal attacks in the game though, which is why they work for the "paladin" thing. You run up to stuff zondeel, and hit things with your wand.

You can literally do all the stuff he listed with Te/Hu. I can't stress enough how bad mediocre Te/Bo is for support.

On the other hand, Te/Bo IS good solo if you have Te usable jet boots. You'll kill things slower but you'll also likely die less. I wouldn't recommend it if support is what you wanna do with it though.

Wait a minute though, don't most of Bouncers skills either enhance or lengthen a Techers buffs or heals? That's what I'm going for, to get the strongest, longest lasting buffs possible, and to hell with everything else, except melee damage maybe.

[Sizustar]

Wait a minute though, don't most of Bouncers skills either enhance or lengthen a Techers buffs or heals? That's what I'm going for, to get the strongest, longest lasting buffs possible, and to hell with everything else, except melee damage maybe.

Not really, Techer is the one that buff the duration and effect of Support Skills.

Bouncer doesn't bring anything to support that.

And leaving your ingame ID, which ship you're on.

Might be useful too, since alot of what people are saying is in theory, but whether you want to or not, you might want to see it in action or party with them to see if that is what you want.

[Foxhound3857]

Not really, Techer is the one that buff the duration and effect of Support Skills.

Bouncer doesn't bring anything to support that.

And leaving your ingame ID, which ship you're on.

Might be useful too, since alot of what people are saying is in theory, but whether you want to or not, you might want to see it in action or party with them to see if that is what you want.

I'm still downloading the game. 25gb will take me a full 24 hours at least on wireless DSL.

I just messed around with the calculator and came up with a prototype build.

Techer Main: 87/87

Technique up: 5
Rare Mastery Techer: 1
Mirage Escape: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Wand Gear: 1
Extend Assist: 1
Long-Time Assist: 1
PP Restorate 1: 10
Shifta Advance/Critical/Strike: 10/10/5
Deband Advance/Cut/Toughness: 10/10/5
Resta Advance: 5
Reverse Bonus: 1
Wand Lovers: 3
Wand Reactor: 1
PP Convert: 1
Territory Burst: 1
Territory PP Save: 5
Super Treatment: 1
Reverser Field: 1

Bouncer Sub: 87/87

Apt-Up: 5
Striking Up 1 and 2: 10/10
Technique Up 1: 10
Rare Mastery Bouncer: 1
Bouncer Mag: 5
Step: 1
Step Advance: 10
Elemental PP Restorate Field: 5
Critical Field: 5
Field Remain: 1
Step Attack: 1
Just Reversal: 1
J Reversal PP Gain: 5
Shifta Attack Air Boost: 5
Deband PP Restorate: 5
Heal Share: 5
Heal Bonus: 5

[LonelyGaruga]

Man, this thread exploded when I wasn't looking.

Bouncer is completely worthless as a support class. Te/Bo is no better than Te/Hu, Te/Fi, or Te/Br for support, except those latter three are all extremely potent damage dealers with other useful abilities and subclass weapons, which Bouncer does not provide. The only thing you need to look at for support is maining Techer if it's buffing other people you're after.

I'm gonna have to look at the thread again to give a more thorough reply, the sheer activity probably guarantees another page or two would be up before I even finish such a post.


Don't you dare say anything that associates me with you even remotely.

+1

[Sizustar]

I'm still downloading the game. 25gb will take me a full 24 hours at least on wireless DSL.

I just messed around with the calculator and came up with a prototype build.

Techer Main: 87/87

Technique up: 5
Rare Mastery Techer: 1
Mirage Escape: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Wand Gear: 1
Extend Assist: 1
Long-Time Assist: 1
PP Restorate 1: 10
Shifta Advance/Critical/Strike: 10/10/5
Deband Advance/Cut/Toughness: 10/10/5
Resta Advance: 5
Reverse Bonus: 1
Wand Lovers: 3
Wand Reactor: 1
PP Convert: 1
Territory Burst: 1
Territory PP Save: 5
Super Treatment: 1
Reverser Field: 1

Bouncer Sub: 87/87

Apt-Up: 5
Striking Up 1 and 2: 10/10
Technique Up 1: 10
Rare Mastery Bouncer: 1
Bouncer Mag: 5
Step: 1
Step Advance: 10
Elemental PP Restorate Field: 5
Critical Field: 5
Field Remain: 1
Step Attack: 1
Just Reversal: 1
J Reversal PP Gain: 5
Shifta Attack Air Boost: 5
Deband PP Restorate: 5
Heal Share: 5
Heal Bonus: 5

Read through this first
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714

And Bouncer really doesn't give any advanage, you might even be better off just getting FO instead, to get PP restore while charging and throwing spells.

And one more thing.

Thre are 3 attack stat ingame.

Striking Attack<Melee Damage> Range Attack<range Attack, Tech attack.

One of the reason that a sword or a gunslash won't work well for a techer, is because they depend on T-atk for it's spell and damage, so using a gunslash, you will heal for very low amount, and deal very low damage at range or melee.

[Foxhound3857]

Man, this thread exploded when I wasn't looking.

Bouncer is completely worthless as a support class. Te/Bo is no better than Te/Hu, Te/Fi, or Te/Br for support, except those latter three are all extremely potent damage dealers with other useful abilities and subclass weapons, which Bouncer does not provide. The only thing you need to look at for support is maining Techer if it's buffing other people you're after.

I'm gonna have to look at the thread again to give a more thorough reply, the sheer activity probably guarantees another page or two would be up before I even finish such a post.



+1

Well if Bouncer is useless as a Sub, I may as well pick a ranged class for a Sub so I don't have to get close to anything, unless I need to buff the group again.

I've heard something about Ranger being a decent Techer sub for Weak Bullet.

[Kondibon]

I should clarify that despite all the crap I'm giving Te/Bo and Te/Ra I PLAY those class combos, and I'm speaking from experience as someone who likes playing support in games. I'm not going to say don't do what you want, just make sure you understand the limits of it, and don't try to force your self on players who might not be interested your "for fun" builds. Play with like minded people (which honestly isn't too hard since serious players usually PW their parties and MPAs anyway) and you'll be fine. You can always use different classes if you want to do something more "meta", so having two be for a support build isn't gonna ruin your life.


Who let the dogs out ? Can't you focus on the topic and let your pathetic bitterness away for once ???The entire rest of my post was on topic. Just... I'm tired of that attitude you get whenever someone disagrees with you. My bad for snapping at you, but at least put SOME effort into making your self presentable when you're trying to make a point. I AGREE with you a lot of the time and I still think you're way more rude than you need to be. It just makes you (and by extension, your argument) look bad.

[Foxhound3857]

Read through this first
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714

And Bouncer really doesn't give any advanage, you might even be better off just getting FO instead, to get PP restore while charging and throwing spells.

And one more thing.

Thre are 3 attack stat ingame.

Striking Attack<Melee Damage> Range Attack<range Attack, Tech attack.

One of the reason that a sword or a gunslash won't work well for a techer, is because they depend on T-atk for it's spell and damage, so using a gunslash, you will heal for very low amount, and deal very low damage at range or melee.

So what should I do if I want decent Tech attack and survivability on support? Go Hunter as a Sub and focus on the Guard Stance line of skills and Healing Guard?

[Sizustar]

Well if Bouncer is useless as a Sub, I may as well pick a ranged class for a Sub so I don't have to get close to anything, unless I need to buff the group again.

I've heard something about Ranger being a decent Techer sub for Weak Bullet.

It's not a great sub either, because Weak bullet is just consider the strongest support skill.

It's a active skill that work for rifle type weapon, what it does, is it enable you to mark a spot on the enemy that everyone on the field to see as a weak point, if it's used on a enemy weak point, it deals even more damage.
But for most Multi play party, there are dedicated Gu/Ra, or Ra/Gu that uses Weak Bullet and other skill, such as Satalite laser to help more.

Te/Ra doesn't really work well together, because you want the main and sub class to enchance each other.

Te uses S-atk and T-atk, so a S-atk class with damage boosting skills(Fi/Br/HU) or Survive skill with some damage boost(Hu) is the best option.

Ra/GU is R-atk focues, so don't work well.

If you want to keep distance, and support, the best option might be a Te/Fo, and just throw spell, and with the Fo as a sub, you shouldn't run out of PP.

But TE isn't really meant to be played as a range class anyway, it's melee attack is the strongest ingame, not counting PA<skills>

[Foxhound3857]

It's not a great sub either, because Weak bullet is just consider the strongest support skill.

It's a active skill that work for rifle type weapon, what it does, is it enable you to mark a spot on the enemy that everyone on the field to see as a weak point, if it's used on a enemy weak point, it deals even more damage.
But for most Multi play party, there are dedicated Gu/Ra, or Ra/Gu that uses Weak Bullet and other skill, such as Satalite laser to help more.

Te/Ra doesn't really work well together, because you want the main and sub class to enchance each other.

Te uses S-atk and T-atk, so a S-atk class with damage boosting skills(Fi/Br/HU) or Survive skill with some damage boost(Hu) is the best option.

Ra/GU is R-atk focues, so don't work well.

If you want to keep distance, and support, the best option might be a Te/Fo, and just throw spell, and with the Fo as a sub, you shouldn't run out of PP.

But TE isn't really meant to be played as a range class anyway, it's melee attack is the strongest ingame, not counting PA<skills>

Does a Hunter focused on Guard Stance make for a good Techer Sub? Will Guard Stance and its skill line even work with Wands?

[qoxolg]

Zondeel+TB+craft is the only ranged tech you need as a Techer. Why walk to your enemies when you can move the enemies towards yourself?

TE/HU, TE/BR and TE/FI both give very good support and can deal a fuckton of damage in the right hands. I think the vid I amde a while back says enough: https://youtu.be/Zn8zyJ9VgW8

[Foxhound3857]

Zondeel+TB+craft is the only ranged tech you need as a Techer. Why walk to your enemies when you can move the enemies towards yourself?

TE/HU, TE/BR and TE/FI both give very good support and can deal a fuckton of damage in the right hands. I think the vid I amde a while back says enough: https://youtu.be/Zn8zyJ9VgW8

Okay, how about I focus on pure support and heals as the Techer Main, and then for the Hunter Sub I focus on survivability via Guard Stance line and Iron Will (and Healing Guard), and tanking/holding aggro via War Cry. Is that a viable build?

The Hunter skills would look like this:

HP Up 1: 3
Striking Up 1 OR Apt Up: 3
Guard: 1
Just Guard: 1
Just Counter: 1
Healing Guard: 1
Step: 1
Step Attack: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Guard Stance: 10
Guard Stance Up 1: 10
Absorption: 10
Flash Guard 1: 10
Flash Guard 2: 10
Flash Guard Tech: 10
War Cry: 10
Iron Will: 10

Assuming Mirage Escape will override Step.

[Sizustar]

Zondeel+TB+craft is the only ranged tech you need as a Techer. Why walk to your enemies when you can move the enemies towards yourself?

TE/HU, TE/BR and TE/FI both give very good support and can deal a fuckton of damage in the right hands. I think the vid I amde a while back says enough: https://youtu.be/Zn8zyJ9VgW8

Making it viewable in the forum.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zn8zyJ9VgW8"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zn8zyJ9VgW8

[Sizustar]

Okay, how about I focus on pure support and heals as the Techer Main, and then for the Hunter Sub I focus on survivability via Guard Stance line and Iron Will (and Healing Guard), and tanking/holding aggro via War Cry. Is that a viable build?

The Hunter skills would look like this:

HP Up 1: 3
Striking Up 1: 3
Guard: 1
Just Guard: 1
Just Counter: 1
Healing Guard: 1
Step: 1
Step Attack: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Guard Stance: 10
Guard Stance Up 1: 10
Absorption: 10
Flash Guard 1: 10
Flash Guard 2: 10
Flash Guard Tech: 10
War Cry: 10
Iron Will: 10

Assuming Mirage Escape will override Step.

Read through the guide link earlier
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714

It gives a really detailed explanation on what to focus on.

And this game, it's not really possible to make a tanky build that draw enemy fire.

So Guard stance isn't useful.

[Foxhound3857]

Read through the guide link earlier
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714

It gives a really detailed explanation on what to focus on.

And this game, it's not really possible to make a tanky build that draw enemy fire.

So Guard stance isn't useful.

*sigh* Well what the hell am I to do then? I'm trying to make a build that does support and either tanks or is defensively oriented, and you guys are just shooting them down like DPS is the only thing that matters and everything else is f***all...

[Z-0]

Because that is how it works. If you want to be helpful in a co-operative game, you need to do things that are helpful, and PSO2 doesn't work like the holy trinity of MMOs in that you have damage dealers, tanks and supports.

Support is secondary in this game, it's not a main focus, and tanking is almost non existant. As long as you don't get one shot, you're good.

[Kondibon]

DPS is the only thing that matters and everything else is f***all...Now you're getting it. It's a problem with the way the game is designed. There's so many ways for players to outright avoid taking damage as they get better, and healing is so plentiful that playing a defense or support focused build is an amusing gimmick at best, and a crutch at worst.
Like I said before, you can do it, and it can be fun if you aren't in a situation where your support is redundant, just don't expect it to be useful for serious gameplay.

EDIT: Trust me, it bothers me just as much, it seems to be a trend in recent semi-casual games to downplay support and tanking so they aren't REQUIRED to complete content, and thus people don't have to worry about having a specific party comp. The problem with that though, is then the only required thing left is damage (because you always need to do damage to kill the enemies). Thus maximizing raw damage becomes the focus of gameplay.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

*sigh* Well what the hell am I to do then? I'm trying to make a build that does support and either tanks or is defensively oriented, and you guys are just shooting them down like DPS is the only thing that matters and everything else is f***all...

Blame the game's design.

No one should need/expect tanks when everyone has I-frames, most have guard frames, and everyone can heal themselves.

The ideal support in this game is support that doesn't have a major opportunity cost to damage dealing. The best kind of support is just helping people kill things faster, which people have said. Everyone is relatively self-sufficient if they're somewhat decent at all.

Man have I been ninja'ed

[Foxhound3857]

Now you're getting it. It's a problem with the way the game is designed. There's so many ways for players to outright avoid taking damage as they get better, and healing is so plentiful that playing a defense or support focused build is an amusing gimmick at best, and a crutch at worst.
Like I said before, you can do it, and it can be fun if you aren't in a situation where your support is redundant, just don't expect it to be useful for serious gameplay.

Well, whatever then. I'll probably make some sort of ranged DPS for high level content, but for casual play I'm gonna stick to my guns and make the special snowflake that supports, heals, and protects the team. If it doesn't work out I'll just go to a DPS class full time.

I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.

[Sizustar]

Well, whatever then. I'll probably make some sort of ranged DPS for high level content, but for casual play I'm gonna stick to my guns and make the special snowflake that supports, heals, and protects the team. If it doesn't work out I'll just go to a DPS class full time.

I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.

Read through the guide, Fury stance is what is recomended if you go Hu.

[Kondibon]

Well, whatever then. I'll probably make some sort of ranged DPS for high level content, but for casual play I'm gonna stick to my guns and make the special snowflake that supports, heals, and protects the team. If it doesn't work out I'll just go to a DPS class full time. That's what I do, and I've been doing fine. :P


I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.It is.

EDIT: Oh right, I made a rough Te/Fo support build if you're interested. You'd mainly be using a talis, and while it's a little weaker than Fo/Te, I think it could still work for most things that aren't outright speedruns. Since you like to play at range this might interest you more than Te/Hu. If you don't might higher cost lightning techs (because honestly zondeel is the only one anyone uses), then you can just move those points into fire. No need for resta adv, your resta should be healing all but the highest hp players easily, and if not you can always use megiverse in a big fight and watch all the green numbers fly out.
http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09rAbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoib0000000fdo000000l oI2iNdsGAIkGAGKIkGA000006dBdAidrAqxGFqBIkIkfgAdA00 0009bIo0000008doIb0000008

[Terrence]

Well, whatever then. I'll probably make some sort of ranged DPS for high level content, but for casual play I'm gonna stick to my guns and make the special snowflake that supports, heals, and protects the team. If it doesn't work out I'll just go to a DPS class full time. I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.
Will the dirty elite let you do as you wish and not as they order ? That is the question... In any case, good luck with all your tests and have a nice game experience.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Well, whatever then. I'll probably make some sort of ranged DPS for high level content, but for casual play I'm gonna stick to my guns and make the special snowflake that supports, heals, and protects the team. If it doesn't work out I'll just go to a DPS class full time.

I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.

Te/Hu is a mobbing monster, and I love Te buffs.

Ra/Xx is a 'support' with weak bullet, and gravity bomb.

Bouncer does have decent applications for their support techs without cutting into their damage too bad. Just need to be a llittle creative to know about them.

You gotta loosen up your definition of support to something... MOBA status; you're expected to deal a passable amount of damage while helping others be better.

[Sizustar]

Well, whatever then. I'll probably make some sort of ranged DPS for high level content, but for casual play I'm gonna stick to my guns and make the special snowflake that supports, heals, and protects the team. If it doesn't work out I'll just go to a DPS class full time.

I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.

You can do that, but it's best to do the "for fun" build either solo with NPC, or with friends team.

Don't bring that into a MPA or EQ, or else you'll probabely be black listed at best, and put on the list and reported to Sega at worst.

[Foxhound3857]

Read through the guide, Fury stance is what is recomended if you go Hu.

Okay, I gave it a read, are the Striking Up passives worth investing in? I think I've got one possible build but I dunno how it looks in execution.

HP Up 1: 5
Striking Up 1/2/3: 10/10/10
Guard Stance/Flash Guard: 3/3 (Prereq)
Massive Hunter: 1
Automated Halfline or Iron Will: 1
JA Bonus 1: 3
Fury Stance/Critical/Combo/S1/S2: 10/10/10/5/5

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Okay, I gave it a read, are the Striking Up passives worth investing in? I think I've got one possible build but I dunno how it looks in execution.

HP Up 1: 5
Striking Up 1/2/3: 10/10/10
Guard Stance/Flash Guard: 3/3 (Prereq)
Massive Hunter: 1
Automated Halfline or Iron Will: 1
JA Bonus 1: 3
Fury Stance/Critical/Combo/S1/S2: 10/10/10/5/5

They wouldn't be the first thing I'd put points in. They have good value after you've picked up all of your options for passive multipliers/important active skills.

[LonelyGaruga]

I suppose I can TRY Te/Hu and focus on Fury Stance, but I have no idea if that's even viable.


http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714


Read through this first
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714


Read through the guide link earlier
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714

It gives a really detailed explanation on what to focus on.

I'm gonna be completely honest with you. Please read my guide. I cover everything you need to know in it. Oh you did, thank you.

And just so you know, Te/Hu can run Fury Stance and be tanky simultaneously. It's what I use for Te/Hu. But tanking isn't something you do for the sake of tanking, it's for increasing your DPS by transforming what would be a dangerous or impossible to handle situation into something that you can freely abuse super armor. The Hunter skill Massive Hunter is the centerpiece to this tactic, as it reduces all damage you take by 25% for 45 seconds (and has a cooldown of 45s after it ends) and prevents any kind of flinching. With multiple different ways to heal yourself (Resta, Megiverse, Automate Halfline), you're effectively invincible. And of course, you can still support other people while doing this.

This (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eGbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm da0fdodBIbHni2IodnINGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000j doib0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidrBqxGFnosTIkfg AdA000009bIo0000008doIb0000008) is a slightly different build from what I use, the main differences are extremely shallow (I put 1 SP into Step Advance and distributed the SP in S-ATK skills differently on a gamble about the next level cap). Probably the best starting point to use, modify it as you see fit for what you want.

[Kondibon]

Will the dirty elite let you do as you wish and not as they order ?
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mauixfg8Pm1qg8fs0o1_1348476261_cover.png

[Foxhound3857]

They wouldn't be the first thing I'd put points in. They have good value after you've picked up all of your options for passive multipliers/important active skills.

They would be after getting the full line of Fury Stance skills, Massive Hunter, and either Automated Halfline or Iron Will, whichever one would be more useful.

[Kondibon]

They would be after getting the full line of Fury Stance skills, Massive Hunter, and either Automated Halfline or Iron Will, whichever one would be more useful.I'd go for Automate, since it's more reliable. Iron Will is more for LB fighters.

[Perfect Chaos]

put on the list and reported to Sega at worst."Sega! This guy is not playing optimally; ban him!"
Do people seriously report people to Sega for this? LOL

[Foxhound3857]

I'm gonna be completely honest with you. Please read my guide. I cover everything you need to know in it. Oh you did, thank you.

And just so you know, Te/Hu can run Fury Stance and be tanky simultaneously. It's what I use for Te/Hu. But tanking isn't something you do for the sake of tanking, it's for increasing your DPS by transforming what would be a dangerous or impossible to handle situation into something that you can freely abuse super armor. The Hunter skill Massive Hunter is the centerpiece to this tactic, as it reduces all damage you take by 25% for 45 seconds (and has a cooldown of 45s after it ends) and prevents any kind of flinching. With multiple different ways to heal yourself (Resta, Megiverse, Automate Halfline), you're effectively invincible. And of course, you can still support other people while doing this.

This (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eGbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm da0fdodBIbHni2IodnINGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000j doib0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidrBqxGFnosTIkfg AdA000009bIo0000008doIb0000008) is a slightly different build from what I use, the main differences are extremely shallow (I put 1 SP into Step Advance and distributed the SP in S-ATK skills differently on a gamble about the next level cap). Probably the best starting point to use, modify it as you see fit for what you want.

I read the whole thing and am currently modifying a build tailored for me. Really good guide by the way.

I really don't see any reason to put more than 1 point in Massive Hunter though. 30 seconds should be plenty, especially as a panic button or a tool for burst DPS. Frees up 4 points which would get me to +225 S-Atk from Striking passives.

[Sizustar]

"Sega! This guy is not playing optimally; ban him!"
Do people seriously report people to Sega for this? LOL

They do~
Here is the uploader they use to "show" wicked player
http://ux.getuploader.com/pso2sarasi/

And this is one thread on 2ch dedicated to ship 2
http://awabi.2ch.sc/test/read.cgi/net/1421127891/

[Alisha]

guard stance is garbage and un needed for survivability. deband cut/toughness alone give you a lot of survivability

edit got ninja'ed during EQ.

also even though support isnt needed i was pleasantly surprised that people wanted my buffs in ultimate quests because for like a force the HP boost from deband toughness can be the difference between getting 1 shotted and 2 shotted.

[Kondibon]

I really don't see any reason to put more than 1 point in Massive Hunter though. 30 seconds should be plenty, especially as a panic button or a tool for burst DPS. Frees up 4 points which would get me to +225 S-Atk from Striking passives.Leveling it also decreases the cooldown and increases the damage reduction.

[Lostbob117]

guard stance is garbage and un needed for survivability. deband cut/toughness alone give you a lot of survivability

Or you can be pretty much undistructable

[LonelyGaruga]

I read the whole thing and am currently modifying a build tailored for me. Really good guide by the way.

I really don't see any reason to put more than 1 point in Massive Hunter though. 30 seconds should be plenty, especially as a panic button or a tool for burst DPS. Frees up 4 points which would get me to +225 S-Atk from Striking passives.

Massive Hunter is one of those skills that can be used for virtually any situation. You can use it against mobs as you Zondeel them to eliminate the possibility of getting flinched (or turn things that would certainly flinch you into attack opportunities), gain advantages in fighting bosses, and sometimes even just plain tanking a boss' hits just to attack it. Not so much a panic button, but definitely good for DPS.

1 SP in Massive Hunter grants you 30s duration, 10% damage resistance, and a 70s cooldown. 5 SP gets you 45s duration (+50%), 25% damage resistance (+150%), and a 45s cooldown (-36%). This is completely worth 4 SP, especially when compared to 4 SP in S-ATK Up skills, which will only net you, at best, 34 S-ATK. With Shifta Drink and Shifta applied, that 34 S-ATK is closer to 46 S-ATK, but that's still not even 1% more damage to wand strikes, which are only part of your damage with wand melee. For Hunter weapons, it's about 1-1.5% more damage, which isn't too bad, but overall, the damage reduction from Massive Hunter is more important for taking hits.

Though really, the biggest advantage 5 SP has over 1 SP is just simply the duration and cooldown changes. 30/100 vs 45/90 = 30% vs 50% of the time. Even just looking at the active time, boss fights tend to last longer than either duration in Emergency Quests and particularly XH/Ultimate difficulty, so having a longer duration on Massive Hunter is always a good idea.


Or you can be pretty much undistructable

Deband Cut + Deband Toughness + Automate Halfline already makes you invincible. Especially with Massive Hunter.

Invincible and not hitting like a month old baby.

Oh yeah and Guard Stance only reduces damage by striking attacks, by the way. So it's pretty much junk.

[Foxhound3857]

Okay, I think I've come up with a Te/Hu build based on the guide I read and the advice given to me in this thread. Give me your thoughts on it, it's modified a little bit to suit my preferences.

Techer Main: 87/87
Mirage Escape: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Technique Up 1: 5
Rare Mastery: 1
Extend Assist: 1
Long-Time Assist: 1
Wand Gear: 1
PP Restorate 1: 10
Wand Lovers: 10
Wand Reactor: 5
Shifta Advance/Strike/Critical: 10/5/1 (1 point still gives 5%, worth it to me)
Deband Advance/Cut/Toughness: 10/10/5
Resta Advance: 5
Territory Burst: 1
Territory PP Save: 5
Reverser Field: 1 (just so I have it as an alternative to Moons)

Hunter Sub: 87/87
Guard/Just Guard/Just Counter/Healing Guard/Step/Step Attack/Just Reversal: 1
HP Up 1: 5
Striking Up 1/2/3: 10/10/6
JA Bonus: 3
Fury Stance/Fury Critical/Fury Combo Up/Fury S Up1/2: 10/10/10/5/5
Guard Stance/Flash Guard: 3/3 (Prereq for Massive Hunter)
Massive Hunter: 5
Automated Halfline: 1

Can take points out of Striking Up in favor of Automated Halfline. Thoughts?

[LordKaiser]

This is the only thing I could think that a full support class would be...

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09BqbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm jda8dodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoib0000000fdo00000 0lo00000007odAi2sNHXcFqB8dnIk000007bIo0000008dobo4 NfqArFbs9b00008

[Sizustar]

Okay, I think I've come up with a Te/Hu build based on the guide I read and the advice given to me in this thread. Give me your thoughts on it, it's modified a little bit to suit my preferences.

Techer Main: 87/87
Mirage Escape: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Technique Up 1: 5
Rare Mastery: 1
Extend Assist: 1
Long-Time Assist: 1
Wand Gear: 1
PP Restorate 1: 10
Wand Lovers: 10
Wand Reactor: 5
Shifta Advance/Strike/Critical: 10/5/1 (1 point still gives 5%, worth it to me)
Deband Advance/Cut/Toughness: 10/10/5
Resta Advance: 5
Territory Burst: 1
Territory PP Save: 5
Reverser Field: 1 (just so I have it as an alternative to Moons)

Hunter Sub: 87/87
Guard/Just Guard/Just Counter/Healing Guard/Step/Step Attack/Just Reversal: 1
HP Up 1: 5
Striking Up 1/2/3: 10/10/6
JA Bonus: 3
Fury Stance/Fury Critical/Fury Combo Up/Fury S Up1/2: 10/10/10/5/5
Guard Stance/Flash Guard: 3/3 (Prereq for Massive Hunter)
Massive Hunter: 5
Automated Halfline: 1

Can take points out of Striking Up in favor of Automated Halfline. Thoughts?

% Skill are more useful then pure stat.
S-atk Up should be the last priority, over JA bonus and Half line

[Foxhound3857]

% Skill are more useful then pure stat.
S-atk Up should be the last priority, over JA bonus and Half line

Okay, what if I take all points out of Striking Up and max out JA Bonus 1 and 2, and Automated Halfline.

Everything else looks good if I do this? Solid build?

[LonelyGaruga]

Okay, I think I've come up with a Te/Hu build based on the guide I read and the advice given to me in this thread. Give me your thoughts on it, it's modified a little bit to suit my preferences.

Techer Main: 87/87
Mirage Escape: 1
Just Reversal: 1
Technique Up 1: 5
Rare Mastery: 1
Extend Assist: 1
Long-Time Assist: 1
Wand Gear: 1
PP Restorate 1: 10
Wand Lovers: 10
Wand Reactor: 5
Shifta Advance/Strike/Critical: 10/5/1 (1 point still gives 5%, worth it to me)
Deband Advance/Cut/Toughness: 10/10/5
Resta Advance: 5
Territory Burst: 1
Territory PP Save: 5
Reverser Field: 1 (just so I have it as an alternative to Moons)

Hunter Sub: 87/87
Guard/Just Guard/Just Counter/Healing Guard/Step/Step Attack/Just Reversal: 1
HP Up 1: 5
Striking Up 1/2/3: 10/10/6
JA Bonus: 3
Fury Stance/Fury Critical/Fury Combo Up/Fury S Up1/2: 10/10/10/5/5
Guard Stance/Flash Guard: 3/3 (Prereq for Massive Hunter)
Massive Hunter: 5
Automated Halfline: 1

Can take points out of Striking Up in favor of Automated Halfline. Thoughts?

Guess I should point out that you can post links now that your post count is over 10, so you can use this (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php) now.

Techer:

Shifta/Deband Advance: I don't really recommend going past 5 for these skills. It matches your build concept, but it doesn't really work out very well in practice. Might revisit these after reallocating other skills.

Resta Advance: Definitely don't get this. The problem with Resta Advance isn't that it's bad, but that it's redundant. Resta, by itself, heals huge amounts of HP. It can be crafted to heal almost double and uses your T-ATK stat in a manner that permits your typical high-geared Fo/Te to be able to heal over 4K HP with a single use of a charged Resta. A Te/Hu can't heal that much normally unless you stack lots of T-ATK (but that's something more up Te/Fi or Te/Br's alley), but you still can easily heal a person to full health twice over, making Resta Advance pretty redundant. As an example, if I crafted my Resta and affixed my gear properly, I would be able to heal around 606 HP * 4, which is really overkill when most people hover around 700-1100 HP. Even with Deband Toughness applied on unusually high HP players, you're overhealing people. And even if you weren't, Resta Advance would turn this into 721 * 4, which isn't that much of an improvement.

Reverser Field: Here's the thing about Reverser Field and saving Moon Atomizers. One thing a lot of people overlook is that there's a second revival item, Cosmo Atomizers. So you can actually carry 10 revival items. Which is basically inexhaustible. Reverser Field itself can only be used every fifteen minutes too, so it's basically spending 3 SP (2 in T-ATK Up 1) for an extra revival chance you should never need. You could instead put SP into Reverse Bonus, which gives people automatic Shifta/Deband (at max duration, no less) when you revive them, which is way better than Reverser Field.

For unacquired skills, 10 SP in Element Weak Hit is absolutely necessary as Te/Hu. It's 20% more damage. I also suggest getting PP Convert unless you're going to use wands exclusively, in which case you can ignore it.

Hunter:

Healing Guard: Only works if you use a Hunter weapon (since Te/Hu can't use anything else that can block), and doesn't heal for much. Don't really need it when you have better healing methods.

Striking Up: Go 6/10/10 instead of 10/10/6. Gets you more S-ATK.

JA Bonus: Max this out and grab JA Bonus 2 as well. They add more damage than anything else in the Hunter tree besides Fury Stance.

Fury Critical: Don't get this at all. It adds maybe 2% more damage, which is a bad deal for 10 SP.

Fury Combo: Just to be sure you know how this works, you can get the full 10% even with just 1 SP. The way it works is that it adds a % damage modifier that stacks to a max of 10%, with the added damage being what the skill displays. So, for example, with 2 SP, you go 2% > 4% > 6% > 8% > 10%, while with 10 SP, you just go straight to 10%. 5 SP goes 5% > 10% and gives you 5 more SP to work with, so I recommend considering it. 10 SP isn't a bad choice, just pointing out a potential alternative.

Automate Halfline: Always max this out. It's a 100% activation rate when maxed out. Unlike critical hits, which are just an increase in damage, Automate Halfline is something that actually lets you do stuff that you wouldn't otherwise be able to do, or would have to do differently. So Automate Halfline has to always be able to work, or you won't be able to rely on it. You don't strictly need Automate Halfline, but it's the best tanking skill after Massive Hunter, and is one of the only good ones, so for your stated goal of being able to take hits, maxing it out would be a good idea.

[Foxhound3857]

Could I make do with just one in Fury Combo?

I modified both trees based on your advice. How do they look now?

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eDbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIbHnIhI2lNGAqnIdJkqAI2000000doIn0000000jdoib 0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsODxGFqAsNIkjdn000 009bIo0000008doIb0000008

[LonelyGaruga]

Max S-ATK Up 3 instead of S-ATK Up 2. Gets you more S-ATK. As a general rule of thumb, X-Up skills give +100 for 3, +75 for 2, and +50 for 1. For a couple skills, both 2 and 3 are +75, like with Fighter's S-ATK Up and Gunner's R-ATK Up. This is just because they both have X-Up 1 as their prerequisite, instead of going 1 > 2 > 3 like most other skills.

I don't really recommend just 1 SP in Fury Combo because it's typical to get only a couple hits in a given JA string. If you dodge or block, you have to start building it over again. So it's basically 5 or 10.

ATK stats tend to be higher than DEF stats, so I recommend dumping a point from Deband Advance in favor of Shifta Advance. Would recommend dumping a second point from Deband Advance in favor of Super Treatment, which is a really useful support skill if anyone gets afflicted by a status effect. It lets you heal them by 50% of their HP and gives both you and anyone healed a high PP regen effect for 30s, which is pretty nifty for just 1 SP.

Think that's about it. Maybe something like this (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eDbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIbkAIkI2lNGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000jdoib 0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsoGKGFqBsNIkjdn000 009bIo0000008doIb0000008).

[Foxhound3857]

Max S-ATK Up 3 instead of S-ATK Up 2. Gets you more S-ATK. As a general rule of thumb, X-Up skills give +100 for 3, +75 for 2, and +50 for 1. For a couple skills, both 2 and 3 are +75, like with Fighter's S-ATK Up and Gunner's R-ATK Up. This is just because they both have X-Up 1 as their prerequisite, instead of going 1 > 2 > 3 like most other skills.

I don't really recommend just 1 SP in Fury Combo because it's typical to get only a couple hits in a given JA string. If you dodge or block, you have to start building it over again. So it's basically 5 or 10.

ATK stats tend to be higher than DEF stats, so I recommend dumping a point from Deband Advance in favor of Shifta Advance. Would recommend dumping a second point from Deband Advance in favor of Super Treatment, which is a really useful support skill if anyone gets afflicted by a status effect. It lets you heal them by 50% of their HP and gives both you and anyone healed a high PP regen effect for 30s, which is pretty nifty for just 1 SP.

Think that's about it.

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eDbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIbkAIkI2lNGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000jdoib 0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsoGKGFqBsNIkjdn000 009bIo0000008doIb0000008

How does that one look?

[LonelyGaruga]

Oh yeah, that's identical to what I just edited into the post. Haha.

Guess that's it for the build then. Do you have any other questions?

[Foxhound3857]

Oh yeah, that's identical to what I just edited into the post. Haha.

Guess that's it for the build then. Do you have any other questions?

Just amazed at how much fine tuning is needed to find something optimal for this game. When am I gonna find an action-based MMO that actually has a high demand for healers and support classes instead of just raw DPS?

Even Dragon Nest was questionable in that regard.

[Foxhound3857]

Actually, are there any detailed guides regarding Mag pets and which one would be ideal for a Te/Hu focused on support? That's something I need to read up on instead of just mindlessly experimenting in game and screwing myself later.

[LonelyGaruga]

You can just go pure S-ATK or T-ATK, or a mix of the two to match equipment requirements. It isn't a big deal, just keep in mind you only get 1 for free.

Since you seem to be going wands only, pure T-ATK would probably be most ideal. T-ATK pulls more weight than S-ATK does for wand melee (when attacking multiple targets at least, otherwise S-ATK is better), and most wands require T-ATK to equip, including Ares Wand, which is basically the best wand.

[Foxhound3857]

You can just go pure S-ATK or T-ATK, or a mix of the two to match equipment requirements. It isn't a big deal, just keep in mind you only get 1 for free.

So what, I just feed it and every level it gains or stat bonus it gains, I put into S-ATK?

[LonelyGaruga]

Oh, you have to feed it things to level up that particular stat. The food items also increase other stats, like weapons increase their main ATK stat as well as DEX.

For T-ATK, you can feed the mag things like talises and wands, which will increase T-ATK and DEX and reduce your T-DEF, and reduce the mag's DEX by feeding it Shiftarides or Debandrides. Those items can be purchased at the item shop, and increase T-ATK and T-DEF while reducing DEX. Between the weapons and items, the only stat that will actually increase is the T-ATK, so you can simply repeat until level 190.

For S-ATK, you can feed it gunslashes and other striking weapons, and use either Monomates or a furniture of a particular rarity (think it was 4*, dunno, I maxed mine out using Monomates) for the same effect, just swap T-ATK and T-DEF with S-ATK and S-DEF. Monomates don't influence stats as much as the furniture, so they're slower to use, but they cost less.

[Perfect Chaos]

Using 6* room items to lower DEX works the best for T-ATK mags. (And yes, 4* is best for S-ATK.)

[000111]

-snip-
It also has to be main class for maximized abilities such as reverser field(revives once in 90 seconds)
-snip-


Is Reverser Field worth it now? Did it get buffed this week or is that '90' seconds a typo?

[Perfect Chaos]

90 seconds was a typo. It's still 900 seconds of cooldown.

[BlueCast Boy]

reverser field cooldown is 900 seconds thou w and i don't think its worth the wait but at least you got a spare revive ability if you got no more moons.

[Terrence]

Bad skill indeed because of those 900 seconds but still useful to revive quickly (way quicker than a Moon Atomizer). Well, I still put 1 SP in it.
Good to save DPS-only people with laughable HP/DEF who keeps dying in mass against Anga's Mega-Megid. That's just an example you know.

[LonelyGaruga]

If people are mass dying then they're noobs, it doesn't make Reverser Field worth it. Stop playing with bad people. If they were actually competent players then low HP isn't a problem.

[Selphea]

I personally find the traditional RPG trinity a very contrived way to promote teamwork, and I hope more MMO developers find ways to move away from that.

Technically speaking though, in PSO2, because of break mechanics and class skills, every class can be "Full Support".

For example, as a Ranger, if you apply Weak Bullet to Ragne's leg then break it with a Satellite Cannon to stun it, I think that's considered support. It's not the traditional "cast Fear IV on Target" support, but it still holds the target in place and opens it up for the rest of the party to quickly do damage. Weak Bullet also has the effect of directing a party's attention to where damage needs to go. In terms of both psychological and ingame mechanical effect, it ranks pretty high up there as far as support goes - I daresay an MPA typically needs a Ranger before it needs a Techer.

Similarly, if a Fo/Te casts Zondeel to vacuum a bunch of mobs together for concentrated AoEs to hit, that's pretty big support too. And if that Fo/Te later casts Ilgrants to proc Panic on a boss, that's also pretty important support.

Even with Katana Braver, you can cast War Cry then spam Kanran to grab the attention of Goldrahdas. You can also shoot Banish Arrow and Last Nemesis on Darker towers while everyone else gets tunnel visioned on some boss that isn't even a big threat - that's also a support role.

The key is to think of "support" in the pro-active sense. Instead of trying to fix damage after it has been done, how do you prevent people from dying in the first place? There's a lot of things that the average MPA tends to overlook, and I personally find that support is best done by giving people less things to worry about. If you can Northern Hero™ one side of a pug TD1, by all means do that and people will get the idea that they only have two lanes to worry about. If you can Chain Trigger on Maggy's right knee for a break within the first few seconds, do that, then it falls down and exposes its other knee for the rest of the party to take down fast

[Foxhound3857]

Just out of curiosity, I have to ask: What's the deal with critical hits? Why are people so against anything that has to do with critical rate? Is it not a nice thing to randomly score hits that deal way higher damage?

[Selphea]

Just out of curiosity, I have to ask: What's the deal with critical hits? Why are people so against anything that has to do with critical rate? Is it not a nice thing to randomly score hits that deal way higher damage?

What's your definition of "way higher damage" though?

On average, a critical hit gains you about 50 ATK, out of maybe 2500 ATK on an endgame-geared character. And 2500 is a low estimate. Unless you're talking about Fighter main with the Critical Strike skill.

[Rehal]

Normal hits from uncrafted rare that isn't red/blue weapon already do 95~100% damage variance or something, crit makes it hit for 100% fixed so it's kinda worthless to go for crit rate in general.

[Foxhound3857]

What's your definition of "way higher damage" though?

On average, a critical hit gains you about 50 ATK, out of maybe 2500 ATK on an endgame-geared character. And 2500 is a low estimate. Unless you're talking about Fighter main with the Critical Strike skill.

My typical definition of a Critical Hit is one that deals at least double the damage of a normal attack.

[Remz69]

*haven't read the thread yet*
i never actually paid attention to how zanverse worked but couldn't you go 'support' and leech off of others' damage with it ?

i mean i don't see many zanverse, haven't seen many at all ever since it came out, so i always just assumed i was wrong about the tech doing a % of everyone's dmg

[LonelyGaruga]

My typical definition of a Critical Hit is one that deals at least double the damage of a normal attack.

Yeah, they don't do that in this game. Rehal covered it. A critical hit is just a couple % higher than your typical hit, since you normally hit for around 95-100% of your maximum damage. With crafted weapons, it's 80-100%, so criticals are a bit more valuable, but still not that great.


*haven't read the thread yet*
i never actually paid attention to how zanverse worked but couldn't you go 'support' and leech off of others' damage with it ?

i mean i don't see many zanverse, haven't seen many at all ever since it came out, so i always just assumed i was wrong about the tech doing a % of everyone's dmg

You're not wrong about it, but it's more efficient to use Zanverse and perform attacks of your own, since that adds more damage than just using Zanverse. So you basically would use it exactly the same way solo or in an MPA. Often, Zanverse still doesn't manage to do enough damage to offset its charge time, particularly for Force and Bouncer players, so it's basically relegated to something very specific support builds or Techer players use.

[Foxhound3857]

Yeah, they don't do that in this game. Rehal covered it. A critical hit is just a couple % higher than your typical hit, since you normally hit for around 95-100% of your maximum damage. With crafted weapons, it's 80-100%, so criticals are a bit more valuable, but still not that great.

Wow. What a dumb way to incorporate such a mechanic.

[JaysonL]

This is the only thing I could think that a full support class would be...

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09BqbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm jda8dodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoib0000000fdo00000 0lo00000007odAi2sNHXcFqB8dnIk000007bIo0000008dobo4 NfqArFbs9b00008

Pretty much this. The only other sub that offers more support then base Techer is Ranger but at the cost being absolutely useless outside of WB and support techs. TE/X can already be considered as the PSO2 equivalent of full support, anything more is just unnecessary. It is better to choose a sub that can contribute in DPS.

I would actually say that TE/RA is the "full support" but everyone else in the MPA would need the memo telling them not to go TE or more then one more RA. A second TE or third Ra has fairly limited use to the MPA. IF this is the case and you are the only TE and one of two RA, I can see full support happening in EQs such as Magatsu as you can be constantly running around keeping buffs up, WBing when need, readying a moon behind a barrier during energy tsunamis and ect. But again, not needed nor recommended.

TE/BO should be able to do enough damage with wand smacks to not get blacklisted. However, damage is still lacking and you only provide barely more support then base Techer. Link to Skill Tree (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09BqbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm jda8dodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdofeb0000000fdo0000 00lo00000007odAi2sOGKcFdBsNIkjdnIb000007bIo0000008 ebHO4SIkqnI2bs6JkIb00008).
Skill tree is based on the one I quoted. I removed the heal related skills because a crafted Resta should be more then you'll ever need. Reverser Field is pretty much a moon every 15 minutes, I wouldn't even put it on the sub-palette but it is there for "full support". Territory PP Save is left at one because you shouldn't have problems with PP as a Techer. Bouncer is set up for you to use fully crafted Race-Hunter potential wands and do okay-ish damage without rainbow palette Ares. You'll have a weapon for most enemies. Exceptions includes all Kuronites, rappies, Bantha pair, Anothers, Calamity, humans and everything in ultimate. Basically, you lose ~16.6% damage against those mentioned and you lose ~5.8% damage against Darkers.

Only problem with TE/BO is that you will provide an insignificant amount of support over base TE. And if you go something like TE/BR, you'll pretty much match TE/BOs damage output on single target with just 5 points in Attack Advance, and you will still have weak or average stance and access to banish arrow/combat finish.

I haven't explored too much into TE myself so I am probably mistaken on a lot of stuff I mention. However, I think we all generally agree that full support doesn't work too well in PSO2 if even at all.

[Selphea]

Wow. What a dumb way to incorporate such a mechanic.

As I said, you can't think of this in typical RPG terms. You don't rely on the random number generator to decide how much damage you take or dish out. If you want to hit for double damage, aim for a weak point - there's your double damage and it would be ridiculous if Crits multiplied on top of that. If you want to mitigate damage, dodge or block.

[Kondibon]

You don't rely on the random number generator to decide how much damage you take or dish out.*Looks at rare drop rates and grind rates*
Everything suddenly makes sense...

[LonelyGaruga]

I haven't explored too much into TE myself so I am probably mistaken on a lot of stuff I mention. However, I think we all generally agree that full support doesn't work too well in PSO2 if even at all.

My biggest issue with Te/Bo (besides the fact that it's terrible compared to other class options) is that it doesn't play Techer effectively at all, it's better off being played as Bouncer with Techer main skills. The Bouncer tree has almost nothing to offer as a subclass, but lots of stuff for its own weapons, while Techer has valid and useful main class skills and can spend every single SP on things that have nothing to do with wands or even techs specifically (granted, so can Bouncer, as you just demonstrated, but you know what I mean). Something like this (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09BqbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm jda8dodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoib0000000fdo00000 0lo00000006dBdAidsNGKJ2kbIgIkjdn000009bIo0000008dB GB4NfqBI2bsbsrAfJkIb00008) is what I'd put, if I was specifically requested to make a Te/Bo skill tree for support.


*Looks at rare drop rates and grind rates*
Everything suddenly makes sense...

You don't rely on the RNG there. You beat it up and steal its wallet.

[TaigaUC]

I know I'm late to the party, but here goes:

Edit: Moved the info here (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3246521).

[Kondibon]

You don't rely on the RNG there. You beat it up and steal its wallet.
I don't think you can ever completely get rid of the rng for grinding things, so I'm not sure what you mean. The drop rate thing is really only a problem for free players, but eh it was a bad joke anyway. :???:


I know I'm late to the party, but here goes:http://i.imgur.com/x0MWvvm.gif
Only things I see that I think should be added or changed are mentioning that knuckle gear mainly increases attack speed, and talis do actually have higher t-atk than wands.

EDIT: Oh, now you're doing techs. Goodie.

[TaigaUC]

Only things I see that I think should be added or changed are mentioning that knuckle gear mainly increases attack speed, and talis do actually have higher t-atk than wands.

EDIT: Oh, now you're doing techs. Goodie.

Fixed, thanks.

I think I'll just repost it in the guides section for newbies to reference.

[Mesarthim]

It just seems contradicting from personal experience still because the only time I've had a talis weaker than a rod was if it wasn't thrown. Other than that it's accurate.

I'm just saying from personal experience every time I switched from a talis to a rod I had a slight reduction in damage, though it's nothing significant.

Unless you wrote it without talis tech in mind, then suddenly it makes sense. If so, ignore me for stupidness, I'm currently playing Rappy Slots. Programmed to mash one button, not think.

[LonelyGaruga]

I don't think you can ever completely get rid of the rng for grinding things, so I'm not sure what you mean. The drop rate thing is really only a problem for free players, but eh it was a bad joke anyway. :???:

I meant that you just keep trying until you get the result that you want, thereby "beating" the RNG.

It's not a joke anymore ;w;

[TaigaUC]

I somehow duped part of my post. Fixed now.

[LonelyGaruga]

Popular/Viable Classes:

Some quick examples to get you started:

Hu/Fi, Fi/Hu, Bo/Hu, Fi/Bo, Br/Hu, Hu/Br:
Various popular melee weapon combinations.
There are others, but they're more situational or their output tends to not be as high.

Fo/Te, Te/Fo:
Primary caster combination.

Te/Hu, Te/Br:
Melee Wand combinations. Te/Hu for survivability, Te/Br for more damage.
I think there are others, but I don't know them well.

Ra/Hu, Gu/Hu, Ra/Gu, Gu/Ra:
Ranged weapon/Twin Machine Guns combinations
Note that Ra/Gu and Gu/Ra are weaker in terms of damage output.

Ra/Br, Br/Ra:
For high risk high reward Bow damage.
But also versatile as it can use Rifle and Launcher.
Requires some skill to consistently hit weak points.
Note that Ranger main is preferred as it has better main class skills.

Hu/Fi, Hu/Br, Hu/Bo

Fi/Hu, Fi/Br, Fi/Bo

Ra/Hu, Ra/Fi, Ra/Gu(?), Ra/Br

Gu/Hu, Gu/Fi, Gu/Ra, Gu/Br

Fo/Fi, Fo/Te, Fo/Br

Te/Hu, Te/Fi, Te/Br

Br/Hu, Br/Fi, Br/Ra

Bo/Hu, Bo/Fi

Are the main viable classes I would recommend listing, with some possible additions/subtractions. Just not Te/Fo, it's just Fo/Te but worse.

[TaigaUC]

I know it's worse, but it's not super terrible.
I mean, sometimes you'll get a good Wand that you can't equip as Fo, and your Fo weapon is ass.
Situations like that.

There's also Shifta Strike and Deband Toughness if you really like those.

[LonelyGaruga]

SHAQ trade-in rods are better than all but a handful of wands (that are all XH, UQ, CQ, or a 12* DFE drop) for tech damage. Blue Rod is stronger than the majority of 10* wands, and even a few 11*s. Even awful rods are better than amazing wands for techs. Rods have tremendous T-ATK like that.

[Sizustar]

SHAQ trade-in rods are better than all but a handful of wands (that are all XH, UQ, CQ, or a 12* DFE drop) for tech damage. Blue Rod is stronger than the majority of 10* wands, and even a few 11*s. Even awful rods are better than amazing wands for techs. Rods have tremendous T-ATK like that.

Are we talking Te/FO and casting techs instead of whacking stuff?

[LonelyGaruga]

Yeah. Te/Fo with wand whacking is like, the worst. Only Te/Ra would have weaker wand melee.

[Kinujou]

I tend to run TE/RA as a support...

Clicky (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?095IbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoibIdjGBJiqxJhdx0000 0jdo000000lo00000006dBdAi2sOGKqsqBsNIkjdnIb000007b Io0000008doIb0000008)

[Foxhound3857]

I tend to run TE/RA as a support...

Clicky (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?095IbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoibIdjGBJiqxJhdx0000 0jdo000000lo00000006dBdAi2sOGKqsqBsNIkjdnIb000007b Io0000008doIb0000008)

Is that capable of any reasonable damage or healing power?

[LonelyGaruga]

No. It's not even that great as far as Te/Ra goes. Maybe something like this (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?095IbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoibIdboiocFfqxJkdxI2 00000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidIbqnGFqBsWIkfGAcA000 009bIo0000008doIb0000008). I don't touch Ranger at all so the Ranger build could probably use tweaking. Maybe swap Stun Grenade for Weak Hit Blast Bonus. Unsure of whether Gravity Bomb is worth using since you have Zondeel too.

Main use for Te/Ra (and Ra/Te) is to support others by increasing their damage, as opposed to making people bulky and stuff. So you should have good damage output to go along with it. Also really good at stuff like TAs if you have fantastic gear (more for Ra/Te).

[Terrence]

Is that capable of any reasonable damage or healing power?
This Build allows the use of rather good boosts but with a low T-ATK and no Resta Advance, Resta will be rather weak even if it's crafted and Tech power will be average. The damage may be here but it's too conditional like standing still and shooting weak points and using the weak element. It's seems like a mix of two known Builds and I don't think it's quite efficient. Well, at least it has Weak Bullet...

In any case, when 'good damage' and 'good support' are in the same sentence, TEchter/BOuncer is the best option. Long ago, SEGA had said TEchter would be the best Main/Sub Class for that. Not the best DPS of course, but an unmatched balance between attack and support. I know many of you rage about that because saying SEGA was right literally burns their mouth but it's true... If you like the Jet Boots gameplay, of course (which should be called Jet Boost).

[SPOILER-BOX]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2g4ncd09EUI[/SPOILER-BOX]

[LonelyGaruga]

You're just further cementing that Te/Bo is awful and that you don't even know how to play your own class effectively. Every spawn group would have died at least twice as fast with wands, leaving the /Bo part useless.

And why do you keep wasting time using Resta when you and your NPCs are at full health? Really amateurish.

Can't even one-shot Torbon with Gibarta...

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

/popcorn

[Kondibon]

SHAQ trade-in rods are better than all but a handful of wands (that are all XH, UQ, CQ, or a 12* DFE drop) for tech damage. Blue Rod is stronger than the majority of 10* wands, and even a few 11*s. Even awful rods are better than amazing wands for techs. Rods have tremendous T-ATK like that.As Te/Fo you'd mainly be using a talis so rods vs wands isn't important. :P


This Build allows the use of rather good boosts but with a low T-ATK and no Resta Advance, Resta will be rather weak even if it's crafted and Tech power will be average. The damage may be here but it's too conditional like standing still and shooting weak points and using the weak element. It's seems like a mix of two known Builds and I don't think it's quite efficient. Well, at least it has Weak Bullet...

In any case, when 'good damage' and 'good support' are in the same sentence, TEchter/BOuncer is the best option. Long ago, SEGA had said TEchter would be the best Main/Sub Class for that. Not the best DPS of course, but an unmatched balance between attack and support. I know many of you rage about that because saying SEGA was right literally burns their mouth but it's true... If you like the Jet Boots gameplay, of course (which should be called Jet Boost).

[SPOILER-BOX]Coast Zone (SH) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2g4ncd09EUI)[/SPOILER-BOX]I get that you like the class combo and I too find it fun. If you want the buffs of techer but don't like sitting around beating things with a stick it's perfect, but please, please, please, stop trying to make it out to be something it's not. All the good support aspects come from techer and the damage on the bouncer side is mediocre when compared to Te/Hu, Te/Fi, or even Te/Br wand whacking. Is it more engaging? Sure. But it's not providing anything that other Te combos can't already do as well or better.

[LonelyGaruga]

As Te/Fo you'd mainly be using a talis so rods vs wands isn't important. :P

But then there's no reason to use Te/Fo over Fo/Te in the example Sizustar gave!

Needless to say, +1 for the rest of the post. But why does everyone say wand melee is boring...hurts my feelings ;w;

[KatsuraJun]

In any case, when 'good damage' and 'good support' are in the same sentence, TEchter/BOuncer is the best option.

http://i.imgur.com/bb5Y7RF.png

you're going to have to tell me how you define "good damage"

[Foxhound3857]

This Build allows the use of rather good boosts but with a low T-ATK and no Resta Advance, Resta will be rather weak even if it's crafted and Tech power will be average. The damage may be here but it's too conditional like standing still and shooting weak points and using the weak element. It's seems like a mix of two known Builds and I don't think it's quite efficient. Well, at least it has Weak Bullet...

Well, I think I've got a decent Te/Ra skill selection for the Techer aspect (again, focusing on full support and completely ignoring Wands). Can you recommend good Ranger skills to complement it?

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?095IbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoib0000000fdo000000l o00000007odAidsNHXGSqBI4Ikjdn000009bIo0000008doIb0 000008

If I'm going to consider something like this, I need to know my role as a CC/debuffer via Weak Bullet and Gravity Bomb isn't going to be completely negated by other Rangers in a group. Because if that's the case, I may as well just stick with Wands and use Zondeel to gather everything into Wand explosions.

[Kondibon]

But then there's no reason to use Te/Fo over Fo/Te in the example Sizustar gave!

Needless to say, +1 for the rest of the post. But why does everyone say wand melee is boring...hurts my feelings ;w;Well the reason would be to have Te buffs but Fo gameplay. It definitely has lower personal damage for techs obviously.

I don't find Wand whacking that boring, I love the pretty explosions, it's just not all I wanna be doing.



If I'm going to consider something like this, I need to know my role as a CC/debuffer via Weak Bullet and Gravity Bomb isn't going to be completely negated by other Rangers in a group.I think I mentioned that it will be though. Like, that's one of the biggest problems with support in the game, it only takes one other person with one of your classes to make the best aspects of half of your support less important to the point where things would be better if you focused on your other class. That said, in smaller groups, like for AQs or XQs you can fill two roles at once, letting everyone else relax a bit more and focus on their own damage. That's when I usually use Te/Ra.

[KatsuraJun]

You know, just to drive the point home.

If you saw someone in your MPA with a 1* weapon, extended only to Ex1 with no element at +0, you'd consider them a total leech right?

http://i.imgur.com/1OGon4F.png

With the proper class setup, they still do more damage than Te/Bo.

So please, never say you do "good damage" again. You don't even do "decent damage."

[LonelyGaruga]

Well, I think I've got a decent Te/Ra skill selection for the Techer aspect (again, focusing on full support and completely ignoring Wands). Can you recommend good Ranger skills to complement it?

Terrence doesn't really know what he's talking about, please ignore him. Te/Ra (and Ra/Te) are supposed to be built like that, because the idea is to take the advantages of both classes and put them together. Wands cover mobbing and Ranger weapons cover bosses (and some mobbing for Launchers). One of the most vital factors to the class combination is that it is heavily dependent on the rest of your MPA being very good, as well as your own equipment being superb. Otherwise you won't be able to hit the numbers you need to pull your own weight, and you'd be better off playing another class, since instead of being good at two things you're bad at two things.

This is also a big factor as to Ra/Te being optimal for TAs. Since the enemies are weaker in TAs, you don't need to hit as high numbers, making versatility a higher priority. You still need really good gear for optimal performance, of course.

Something like this (http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?095IbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm 0jdodBIb00000000jdoIn0000000jdoibIdboiocFfqxJkdxI2 00000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidIbqnGFqBsWIkfGAcA000 009bIo0000008doIb0000008), with tweaks to the Ranger tree, should be good.


You know, just to drive the point home.

If you saw someone in your MPA with a 1* weapon, extended only to Ex1 with no element at +0, you'd consider them a total leech right?

With the proper class setup, they still do more damage than Te/Bo.

So please, never say you do "good damage" again. You don't even do "decent damage."

That's...impressive. In all the wrong ways.

[Foxhound3857]

I guess Zondeel and Wand combos it is.

[The_Brimada]

I'm probably the one weird guy that does Te/Bo with rainbow dual blades instead of jet boots, but its not like its my main class combo anyway.

[Kondibon]

I'm probably the one weird guy that does Te/Bo with rainbow dual blades instead of jet boots, but its not like its my main class combo anyway.I use DBs as Te/Bo but mainly for bosses. I just find DBs easier to use against big things.

[Sizustar]

I'm probably the one weird guy that does Te/Bo with rainbow dual blades instead of jet boots, but its not like its my main class combo anyway.

No, there are for fun class that you try and do with Friends or solo, or for making Super video.
Like the Magic Gunner (Fo/Ra, Ra/FO)
Super comboer with weak damage, etc
But they aren't what you would do for EQs, and partying with other people.

They aren't especially what you would bring to a Megatsu run, unless you want to be Blacklisted or reported to the community as a troll/leacher.

[Foxhound3857]

No, there are for fun class that you try and do with Friends or solo, or for making Super video.
Like the Magic Gunner (Fo/Ra, Ra/FO)
Super comboer with weak damage, etc
But they aren't what you would do for EQs, and partying with other people.

They aren't especially what you would bring to a Megatsu run, unless you want to be Blacklisted or reported to the community as a troll/leacher.

Do people seriously report other players not "not playing a specific build?" Wtf, how elitist can you get?

[AlphaBlob]

Do people seriously report other players not "not playing a specific build?" Wtf, how elitist can you get?
My friend got reported for being "under leveled" in a EQ. If they don't want under leveled people playing with them, then why the hell are they playing with random MPA?

[n_n]

Do people seriously report other players not "not playing a specific build?" Wtf, how elitist can you get?
If you join an efficiency Magatsu MPA (2ch, for example) with a leech setup, yes you will be "reported"/BL'd/exposed.

But I don't think it happens in normal pug... unless you're afking/leeching with a ungrinded weapon and/or low level subclass.

[Bellion]

Yeah, for the EQs that are pretty much DPS checks for more rewards, better go for a good DPS class that is superior to a majority of other classes. These EQs usually reward most from a big crystal at the end.

In those quests that you run around killing random crap, no one really gives a damn. Unless, you are truly leeching.

[Foxhound3857]

Yeah, for the EQs that are pretty much DPS checks for more rewards, better go for a good DPS class that is superior to a majority of other classes. These EQs usually reward most from a big crystal at the end.

In those quests that you run around killing random crap, no one really gives a damn. Unless, you are truly leeching.

*sigh* Why is it such a crime in this game to play what you WANT to play as opposed to "what kills crap the fastest"?

[Kondibon]

*sigh* Why is it such a crime in this game to play what you WANT to play as opposed to "what kills crap the fastest"?Because the way group content is managed is terrible.

EQs are seriously the worst system ever for that kind of stuff.

[KazukiQZ]

^It isn't. Just don't bring the 'for fun' setup when you are going to play with somebody else, especially random people in the EQ/TA/XQ/UQ/etc.

edit: Haha ninjaed. Was referring to Foxhound :P

[Bellion]

That's just the way it is. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for playing how you want as long as it's truly not detrimental to anyone else. I personally bring what is optimal for higher rewarding EQs, especially if I'm playing with others that want the reward more too. It is due to the EQ system randomness with time limits and such, a really horrible system.

Just be wary that people really don't like certain class combinations in the higher rewarding EQs.

[Selphea]

*sigh* Why is it such a crime in this game to play what you WANT to play as opposed to "what kills crap the fastest"?

On a pug block you can go as whatever, what they're referring to are "efficiency" runs which are organized by a community on 2ch on a specific block, usually decided at random before the quest starts to prevent leechers from pre-camping the block. For the not-so-efficient blocks, people actually do go as whatever, wear unaffixed, ungrinded gear and do stupid things like sit on a machinegun turret all day as a Ranger - and take ages/wipe/fail a lot.

As far as that kind of "elitism" goes, you'll find that in every MMO really. PSO2 is a lot more forgiving in that regard because everything that people expect you to have before doing endgame content - decent gear, build with all core skills checked, can be gotten outside of it.

Compare that to other MMOs where the PUGs have ridiculous requirements like "LF1M Healer for The Dark Citadel™, must have full set of gear from The Dark Citadel™!", which they announce for hours while conveniently overlooking the fact that someone with a full set of gear would not be interested in that dungeon anymore.

Anyway, what level are you? Before 50 you can experiment and re-level quite freely. I'd say take every class you're interested in to 30 along with the first skill point quest at the very bare minimum.

[Sizustar]

Do people seriously report other players not "not playing a specific build?" Wtf, how elitist can you get?

And again
They do~
Here is the uploader they use to "show" wicked player(Leecher, R18 SA, etc)
http://ux.getuploader.com/pso2sarasi/

And this is one thread on 2ch dedicated to ship 2, there are multiple other such threads that are dedicated to specific ship, or specific players, and there are such community that "hunt" for these "wicked" players.
http://awabi.2ch.sc/test/read.cgi/net/1421127891/

[Z-0]

I don't really see it as being elitist, I see it as wanting everyone to pull their weight. If you're bringing a class combo which can do almost nothing, it will be considered as leeching when others are trying their best to pull rewards for them and everyone else.

It's like doing a raid. You would be pretty fucking pissed if people refused to heal as a healer cuz "I'm a nuke healer!", I guarantee it. Same thing as if someone refused to play healer when one was necessary cuz "my playstyle!!" It's no different here.

There are a bunch of Emergency Quests (which are 30-minute timeslotted quests which give good rewards) which people want to take advantage of by doing them quickly and not failing, and someone coming along and doing next to nothing does not do them any favours.

[Sizustar]

*sigh* Why is it such a crime in this game to play what you WANT to play as opposed to "what kills crap the fastest"?

If you want to play with other real people, they shouldn't have to be penalized for your choice in class.

Which is why I said, if you want to do a for fun job, do it with friends or alone, don't do it for specific hunting group.

Like the Megatsu group I go to, we each have specific role and job, Last night, due to Cosmic Break 2, we can't get enough people, so had to do with 4 random player, and 1 english player here, Megatsu run, our party is Support, 3Te, 1 Bo, our job is to heal, buff and zanverse on the first 4 Megatsu run, beside whacking with wands. another party is dedicated to Chain, 2 player are WB, 1 player is chain, 2 player use Bow, and 1 use the Spear PA.

For AIS run, we managed to clear it, but we also have 2 player dedicated to WB the weak point, and made clear that each team focus on a specific part of the boss, our team is the right elbow area for Phase 2, and 3.

But basicly, since it is a action MMORPG, playing with other player, you don't want have a random person using weird stuff, that would be like a FPS team match, and one person is just using the knife for no reason, beside that it's fun to him, but causing problem for the team.

[Kondibon]

As far as that kind of "elitism" goes, you'll find that in every MMO really.
I've never, in my entire life of playing online games seen people consistently and successfully go on pogroms for bad players on that scale. Black listing them is one thing, but trying to get them banned? THAT is elitism (you don't play the way I want so you shouldn't be allowed to play at all).




It's like doing a raid. You would be pretty fucking pissed if people refused to heal as a healer cuz "I'm a nuke healer!", I guarantee it. Same thing as if someone refused to play healer when one was necessary cuz "my playstyle!!" It's no different here.I understand you sentiment, and honestly I think you're pretty reasonable, but in the context of the rest of the conversation, I think telling someone they can't do something in a randomly organized group is pretty elitist. In the sense that you're excluding people from doing something they might enjoy for relatively arbitrary reasons. But I only say this because of the way group content in PSO2 works.

Like... as soon as you aren't allowed organize things personally, or to take the time to organize, I throw out all sympathy for anyone who expects people to not run the gamut of playstyle effectiveness. Like, it sucks, I know, but until it's fixed your complaints should be directed at the system. Hate the game, not the player, and all that.

I always found that picture in your sig to not be a very good analogy (as it requires directly changing the rules, which is technically impossible outside of glitches and hacking in video games).
A better one would be a group of people at a white board. Some people decide that they want to play tic-tac-toe on the white board, while some people just want to mess around and draw random stuff. Those people who just want to draw whatever are making it harder for the people who want to play tic-tac-toe to play their game, but both groups are technically allowed to be there.

If we continue the analogy with PSO2, the people also only have a limited amount of time to play on the board which results in contention between the groups. With a normal white board there would be be time to divide the board up so people know where it's ok to do what they want. Or in the best case scenario, there's entirely separate boards and people don't go to the tic-tac-toe one unless they want to play tic-tac-toe.

Now, with all that said, I DO think trying to force a snowflake Gu/Bo build self into other groups is rude. The problem is that people are just playing, and just happen to get thrown in with other people, and THAT'S more of a problem than their build.
Conversely telling people they can't play on the only white board because they aren't playing tic-tac-toe AFTER they get there, even though you and your friends are the only ones saying it, is pretty bad. This whole system forces everyone to step on everyone else's toes.

EDIT: I should also mention I'm only talking in the context of builds, not personalities. If someone acts like a jerk when you confront them about their build or playstyle, I can understand not wanting to play with them.

[KatsuraJun]

*sigh* Why is it such a crime in this game to play what you WANT to play as opposed to "what kills crap the fastest"?

I assure you you'll be singing a different tune once you're exposed to that one guy who keeps dying, spamming SA autowords, and doing absolutely nothing and wasting your EQ time.

Sure, they're "allowed" to do anything they want, but that doesn't mean anyone likes them. Just like you're allowed to run around with an Umbla stick and screaming at people to protect the towers in TD, but nobody's going to like you for it.

It's not even just about the drops, it's just about them being shameless people who clearly don't care about anyone's experience other than their own. That's what leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

I don't think it's the EQ system's fault. In fact, if not for the fact that it limits difficulty and is difficult to predict in regards to random EQs, for the most part, I like the EQ system. If you want to special snowflake, the EQ system isn't holding you back, it's your lack of friends willing to run with you.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

To piggyback off of those reasons as to why people will not like you for trying some full support with gimp damage, the passable supports would be Te/Hu, Te/Br, Ra/Br, Ra/Hu, Bo/Hu, Fi/Bo, Fo/Te. Don't think I'm forgetting anything worth noting.

[Selphea]

I don't think the reporting is a report to Sega for banning? Besides, there's no clause in the ToS to cover that. From what I gather it's a written report on 2ch? It seems like a community blacklist more than anything, and I've seen that happen before.

P.S. I do actually go into PUG TDs and PUG Maggy as Gu/Bo, at least until I gave up queueing for Maggy as non-WBer ._.

[Kondibon]

I don't think it's the EQ system's fault. In fact, if not for the fact that it limits difficulty and is difficult to predict in regards to random EQs, for the most part, I like the EQ system. If you want to special snowflake, the EQ system isn't holding you back, it's your lack of friends willing to run with you.I disagree. Even if you have a large circle of friends, the chance that enough of them are going to be on during the eq, AND want to do it, AND have time, is pretty slim. If you're trying to say that players with bad builds have less friends who would run with them, then you should know that I had players who keep talking about their bad pugs in mind, not the "for fun" players. The EQ system hurts those players more than the casual ones.

I'd hate the EQ system a lot less if there were just alternate ways to do them. Maybe teams can spend team points to trigger their own personal EQ for members of the team or something.


I don't think the reporting is a report to Sega for banning? Besides, there's no clause in the ToS to cover that. From what I gather it's a written report on 2ch? It seems like a community blacklist more than anything, and I've seen that happen before.

P.S. I do actually go into PUG TDs and PUG Maggy as Gu/Bo, at least until I gave up queueing for Maggy as non-WBer ._.If it's not, then that s fine (for a certain measure of fine, I still find the practice pretty counter productive to creating good players, but with so many english speakers I can see why they wouldn't bother. I HAVE heard of people grouping together to throw false reports en-masse to get someone banned from something, I just figured it was that on a larger scale.

[AlphaBlob]

I can understand people being pissed on XH, but on SH and under, the level range is like 30 levels and the best way to level up at this point are EQs. The people who are pissed at under leveled player on SHEQ can only blame themselves for playing in random MPA. Hell, I'd like to see how these so called "elitist" played when they were under leveled.

[KatsuraJun]

I disagree. Even if you have a large circle of friends, the chance that enough of them are going to be on during the eq, AND want to do it, AND have time, is pretty slim. If you're trying to say that players with bad builds have less friends who would run with them, then you should know that I had players who keep talking about their bad pugs in mind, not the "for fun" players. The EQ system hurts those players more than the casual ones.

I'd hate the EQ system a lot less if there were just alternate ways to do them. Maybe teams can spend team points to trigger their own personal EQ for members of the team or something.

I wasn't suggesting that at all in regards to people with bad builds having no friends, but most of the important EQs where your builds matter are scheduled a lot of the times. Most unscheduled ones are kill x for y points where nobody cares what you're running. Sure, there's the occasional unscheduled falz/TD but god forbid you have to use a proper build *sometimes*

And of course the EQ system helps casuals, that's the point of it. To find parties more easily for people that aren't part of some skilled team (aka casual players) This game is already a lot easier on people in regards to gear compared to others. People have to compromise a little, don't you think.

[milranduil]

I can understand people being pissed on XH, but on SH and under, the level range is like 30 levels and the best way to level up at this point are EQs. The people who are pissed at under leveled player on SHEQ can only blame themselves for playing in random MPA. Hell, I'd like to see how these so called "elitist" played when they were under leveled.

Those "elitist" players still take the time to make sure they have not-shit equips and still carry the MPA.

[Kondibon]

I wasn't suggesting that at all in regards to people with bad builds having no friends, but most of the important EQs where your builds matter are scheduled a lot of the times. Most unscheduled ones are kill x for y points where nobody cares what you're running. Sure, there's the occasional unscheduled falz/TD but god forbid you have to use a proper build *sometimes*Eh, fair enough. I still have stuff to say, but don't care THAT much, I'm just hope one day people on either side won't have to worry about this. I'm going to continue not doing EQs. :/

[KatsuraJun]

Eh, fair enough. I still have stuff to say, but don't care THAT much, I'm just hope one day people on either side won't have to worry about this. I'm going to continue not doing EQs. :/

I think the community is already very forgiving compared to other games. Nobody will get mad at you for running Gunner in something like TD1 even though it is suboptimal. Nobody ever asks you to play the best class combinations, just not the worst combinations. Nobody asks you to farm for months to get gear before they allow you to run Magatsu, or TD3.Compare this to other games where you can get kicked from parties simply for not playing the best class even though the others are fine. have you seen anyone rage at another person for playing Bo/Hu Jet Boots, even though it's not the best combination for boots and boots are a weak weapon? In another game, they would probably be kicked out of the party, but nobody bats an eye here.

[milranduil]

I think the community is already very forgiving compared to other games. Nobody will get mad at you for running Gunner in something like TD1 even though it is suboptimal. Nobody ever asks you to play the best class combinations, just not the worst combinations. Nobody asks you to farm for months to get gear before they allow you to run Magatsu, or TD3.Compare this to other games where you can get kicked from parties simply for not playing the best class even though the others are fine. have you seen anyone rage at another person for playing Bo/Hu Jet Boots, even though it's not the best combination for boots and boots are a weak weapon? In another game, they would probably be kicked out of the party, but nobody bats an eye here.

To piggyback off of this, I don't, personally, get mad at someone playing JB BoHu. I myself leveled JB Bo on my newman playing only TD1/2/3 post-50 since I only had a darker JB. But that's just it, I had a darker JB, I had reasonable equips. My problem is with the people who use some stupid 8* JB, not even +10 (let alone potential'd if it even has a useful one), using unaffixed saiki/hiel units. It's like... what are you doing, do you even play this game? Dailies + taco/xq will let you grind/affix for so cheap these days... you better have at the absolute minimum 60 attack on your gear. There is just no excuse for that shit anymore...

[AlphaBlob]

Those "elitist" players still take the time to make sure they have not-shit equips and still carry the MPA.
Most MPA have a 30 sec countdown, if they're on SH and see a bunch of level 50 people with terrible weapon, it's pretty obvious that run wont benefit them a lot. So when I see these guys on TD complaining all the time that they're #1 and everyone else suck, I just laugh at the fact that they're still there instead of changing block and finding a better random MPA elsewhere. Again, I can understand the elitist on XH being pissed because they can't check everyone's equip during the 30sec countdown, but on lower difficulty, it's pretty obvious when you check the nearby character's level.

[Kondibon]

I think the community is already very forgiving compared to other games. Nobody will get mad at you for running Gunner in something like TD1 even though it is suboptimal. Nobody ever asks you to play the best class combinations, just not the worst combinations. Nobody asks you to farm for months to get gear before they allow you to run Magatsu, or TD3.Compare this to other games where you can get kicked from parties simply for not playing the best class even though the others are fine. have you seen anyone rage at another person for playing Bo/Hu Jet Boots, even though it's not the best combination for boots and boots are a weak weapon? In another game, they would probably be kicked out of the party, but nobody bats an eye here.I agree, it's just really discouraging seeing things like 2ch's blacklist or the constant "This MPA sucked" comments. I just don't want to be the person that causes that kind of annoyance.

you better have at the absolute minimum 60 attack on your gear. There is just no excuse for that shit anymore...
http://i.imgur.com/9U0CYEU.gif

[KatsuraJun]

To piggyback off of this, I don't, personally, get mad at someone playing JB BoHu. I myself leveled JB Bo on my newman playing only TD1/2/3 post-50 since I only had a darker JB. But that's just it, I had a darker JB, I had reasonable equips. My problem is with the people who use some stupid 8* JB, not even +10 (let alone potential'd if it even has a useful one), using unaffixed saiki/hiel units. It's like... what are you doing, do you even play this game? Dailies + taco/xq will let you grind/affix for so cheap these days... you better have at the absolute minimum 60 attack on your gear. There is just no excuse for that shit anymore...


You know, I don't even care about gear. Just don't play some horrible nonsensical class combination and insist you are helping. look at the post I made earlier and you will understand why.


You know, just to drive the point home.

If you saw someone in your MPA with a 1* weapon, extended only to Ex1 with no element at +0, you'd consider them a total leech right?

http://i.imgur.com/1OGon4F.png

With the proper class setup, they still do more damage than Te/Bo.

So please, never say you do "good damage" again. You don't even do "decent damage."

[lnvisible]

I understand why people are so against unorthodox class combinations (I don't play any personally), but I'd much rather someone with a strange class combo that was actually doing something than someone with a decent class combo who keeps sniffing the floor every two seconds and lacks any semblence of common sense. Maybe this guy can make a support build work and still do respectable damage. And the whole if there's one person with either of these classes makes you half as effective bit is kind of off too. It depends on which eq you're doing, tower defense example would benefit from multiple techers or rangers so that they could be split between key points. It's only for eqs where everyone sticks together that things get redundant and you can always fall back to secondary support and do some damage in the meantime. That being said if you do want to go for an unusual class combination try to have at least basic gear for that level range because you'll be starting off at a disadvantage to begin with.

[Kondibon]

Maybe this guy can make a support build work and still do respectable damage. He originally wanted pure support, which just isn't practical as a main thing, we gave him a compromise with Te/Hu, and he can always level Ra (and I guess Bo) whenever he wants. Most of the current conversation started because Terrence insisted Te/Bo is the best option for a damage/support hybrid, when it's far from it.


And the whole if there's one person with either of these classes makes you half as effective bit is kind of off too. It depends on which eq you're doing, tower defense example would benefit from multiple techers or rangers so that they could be split between key points. I forgot to mention that. Thank you. :wacko:

Wasn't Te/Ra a thing in TD actually?

[Sakarisei]

Well, I play the game almost anything since SEGA has broken the game in terms of game design, or at least that thing is my opinion...

About the question of "What is a good Main/Sub combination for a FULL SUPPORT build?", my answer is this.

Unless SEGA fixs or even delete the thing that i'll tell you, WB's RA is the only support that you'll need, with the optional way of getting Jellen Shot, in the case that you really like supporting (Although maybe an obsolete skill since there exist a wand with Jellen). TE buffs are useful, yes, but since people are only worried about WBing a boss or not, to be honest, I don't recommend you playing with a support since NO ONE is worried for others. And that's an impression of every player who plays this game. That's the same way while people, incluiding me, wants tanking. NO ONE is worried for people like that, and even I play BO/HU since people talked me very well about the Bouncer Class, making even compatible with other melee weapons for more weapon variety (In the past i was HU/TE, firstly tank, and then a HU-semisupport, nowadays i play BO/HU for both weapons and some HU weapons).

One of the main problem of this game is since characters in this game is self-sufficient because you're extremely powerful , there is no need, even for making some strategies for many MPAs or EQs, excepting maybe for DFs and Magatsu. But the "Zerg Strategy" is the only thing that they'll need for looting everything.

This game is not considered as a MMO because there is not a "massive part" to be considered as an MMO, and the lobby with until 100 people... lol, that thing is near the same that a chat zone of Second Life... and even other PS games had got lobbies like PSO2.

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@Sizustar:

Omg, if those posts about jp players wicking other players which play not optimally is true... to be honest, that thing makes players very aggresive. There are some newbie people which still don't know the game. If they were playing on a tournament like the ARKS GP, I can understand that attitude. Even I disagree seeing fun people in zones when that people is not ready to play in some games when the only goal is win, obviously when you're competing with other people for a prize.

But... in normal games? wtf?! especially with randoms?! To be honest, if you want optimal results, your team, and not playing randoms, should be much better than it, unless you're on a casual team which they play freely with basically no restrictions.

@LonelyGaruga:

Your post of optimal classes is good, but I would like telling you about Bo as a sub for melee classes. BO as a sub is a hard, although profitable sub, in the case that you've got a good element variety on your weapon pallete, and you prefer breaking parts ignoring the penalties of Brave Stance and Wise Stance (although there is not really a penalty unlike nova before 1.05 and pso2 ep2 before ep3), near the same that using BR as a sub for just Average Stance. Although there is some people with HU/Bo or FI/BO with just DB, that thing is not optimal because you can get 13* from C-Mode or UQs, and even it, Critical Strike and Limit Break won't be a good substitute comparing with a 13*... unless we were able to craft those weapon stars in the future.

[lnvisible]

He originally wanted pure support, which just isn't practical as a main thing, we gave him a compromise with Te/Hu, and he can always level Ra (and I guess Bo) whenever he wants. Most of the current conversation started because Terrence insisted Te/Bo is the best option for a damage/support hybrid, when it's far from it.

I forgot to mention that. Thank you. :wacko:

Wasn't Te/Ra a thing in TD actually?

I've seen them around and they worked nicely. I had a friend who tried it for a while and did well with it.

My point is in this game there's people who even if they have a decent class setup and decent equips would rather let others do all the work and just leech. Or, they just lack common sense altogether. In that regard if someone is actively trying to support and make sure they aren't sitting there being useless for the majority of an EQ that's fine with me. You can still do fine with pure support if the MPA has the people for it, and if you're good on adapting then you can find a role to fill no matter what the MPA is made of.

[KatsuraJun]

Unless SEGA fixs or even delete the thing that i'll tell you, WB's RA is the only support that you'll need, with the optional way of getting Jellen Shot, in the case that you really like supporting (Although maybe an obsolete skill since there exist a wand with Jellen). TE buffs are useful, yes, but since people are only worried about WBing a boss or not, to be honest, I don't recommend you playing with a support since NO ONE is worried for others. And that's an impression of every player who plays this game. That's the same way while people, incluiding me, wants tanking. NO ONE is worried for people like that, and even I play BO/HU since people talked me very well about the Bouncer Class, making even compatible with other melee weapons for more weapon variety (In the past i was HU/TE, firstly tank, and then a HU-semisupport, nowadays i play BO/HU for both weapons and some HU weapons).

All online PS games were self sufficient in terms of the player's ability to fight, there was never a tank/healer/dps trinity so i don't know why you were expecting one. there was never a pure tank or pure support class in PSO1 unless you counted force being really bad so why did you expect one to work in PSO2.

[LonelyGaruga]

@LonelyGaruga:

Your post of optimal classes is good, but I would like telling you about Bo as a sub for melee classes. BO as a sub is a hard, although profitable sub, in the case that you've got a good element variety on your weapon pallete, and you prefer breaking parts ignoring the penalties of Brave Stance and Wise Stance (although there is not really a penalty unlike nova before 1.05 and pso2 ep2 before ep3), near the same that using BR as a sub for just Average Stance. Although there is some people with HU/Bo or FI/BO with just DB, that thing is not optimal because you can get 13* from C-Mode or UQs, and even it, Critical Strike and Limit Break won't be a good substitute comparing with a 13*... unless we were able to craft those weapon stars in the future.

Fi/Bo is far superior to Bo/Fi regardless of what weapon you're using precisely because of Limit Break. To say otherwise vastly underestimates just how ridiculously powerful Limit Break is. Hu/Bo can use any Hunter weapon as well as Hunter equip/crafted Bouncer weapons, along with War Brave for an easy 15% extra damage. Not necessarily completely superior to Bo/Hu, but it's definitely more viable for using both Hunter and Bouncer weapons than Bo/Hu would be.

The Stances are complete trash, my basic reasoning for bringing up those /Bo classes are the advantages over Bo/Hu and Bo/Fi. I wouldn't recommend /Bo to anyone unless it was specifically with the intention of using Bouncer weapons paired with whatever the main class can do, if using those main class weapons at all. Bouncer has nothing particularly important as a main class skill and has terrible subclass compatibility.

[Foxhound3857]

I assure you you'll be singing a different tune once you're exposed to that one guy who keeps dying, spamming SA autowords, and doing absolutely nothing and wasting your EQ time.


I absolutely agree that any player running group content should be willing to put forth and effort and play to the best of their ability.

I do NOT agree that they should be forced to play a specific class or combination of classes to be allowed to participate in things like that. Class limitations can be overcome with enough skill and effort, I haven't played yet but I can guarantee you that thre isn't a single class combo in this game that is THAT HORRIBLY BAD that the player cannot overcome it with skill, knowledge, or preparation.

Inefficient, sure, but not absolutely unplayable, if the player is good enough and puts in enough effort.

That said, I've been told that Te/Hu is actually quite a viable class combo because of solid melee output, survivability, and buffs, so that's what I'm going to run.

[Z-0]

Trust me, there are class combos in this game that are horrifically bad no matter how much effort is put forth.

Optimals in this game are also far and above other things, as well. It's not just a case of something doing something mildly better, you need certain classes to do a lot of things.

[Foxhound3857]

Trust me, there are class combos in this game that are horrifically bad no matter how much effort is put forth.

That's like saying that only Storm/magneto/Cable/Sentinel are worth playing in an MvC2 tournament because they're God Tier, and everyone else is inferior. Yeah other classes might be inferior, but an exceptional player can still play them well and get good results (unless we're talking about Roll, Dan, or Servbot). The gap isn't so massive that skill cannot possibly overcome the handicap.

[KatsuraJun]

I absolutely agree that any player running group content should be willing to put forth and effort and play to the best of their ability.

I do NOT agree that they should be forced to play a specific class or combination of classes to be allowed to participate in things like that. Class limitations can be overcome with enough skill and effort, I haven't played yet but I can guarantee you that thre isn't a single class combo in this game that is THAT HORRIBLY BAD that the player cannot overcome it with skill, knowledge, or preparation.

Inefficient, sure, but not absolutely unplayable, if the player is good enough and puts in enough effort.

That said, I've been told that Te/Hu is actually quite a viable class combo because of solid melee output, survivability, and buffs, so that's what I'm going to run.

nobody is forced to play anything. to begin with, only in a handful of quests do people actually care what class combination you play, and even in them, nobody cares if you don't want to play the absolute best combinations. they just don't want you to play the absolute worst combinations, that even fully geared still performs worse than a better class combination practically going in barehanded.

every weapon has a viable class combination or combinations so there is no excuse.

and even then, you can still play them if you want. nobody can stop you. but it is just a selfish thing to do, because other people will get less rewards because you simply couldn't just play in a private group with friends who will accept it if you wanted to do your awful class combinations instead of a pub group. in the end, all that I understand for a player who does this is "only my fun matters, not the other 11 people."


That's like saying that only Storm/magneto/Cable/Sentinel are worth playing in an MvC2 tournament because they're God Tier, and everyone else is inferior. Yeah other classes might be inferior, but an exceptional player can still play them well and get good results. The gap isn't so massive that skill cannot possibly overcome the handicap.

you haven't even played this game yet, so you don't understand, but this is simply not true. most important EQs boil down to dps races to maximize the number of times you can run the quest, for more rewards. no matter how skilled you are, you cannot overcome the fact that you do less with a maxed out rare weapon than someone with an untouched common one.



again, i would hardly call most players in this game elitist. if you want to play an elitist game, try tera.

[Foxhound3857]

nobody is forced to play anything. to begin with, only in a handful of quests do people actually care what class combination you play, and even in them, nobody cares if you don't want to play the absolute best combinations. they just don't want you to play the absolute worst combinations, that even fully geared still performs worse than a better class combination practically going in barehanded.

every weapon has a viable class combination or combinations so there is no excuse.

and even then, you can still play them if you want. nobody can stop you. but it is just a selfish thing to do, because other people will get less rewards because you simply couldn't just play in a private group with friends who will accept it if you wanted to do your awful class combinations instead of a pub group. in the end, all that I understand for a player who does this is "only my fun matters, not the other 11 people."



you haven't even played this game yet, so you don't understand, but this is simply not true. most important EQs boil down to dps races to maximize the number of times you can run the quest, for more rewards. no matter how skilled you are, you cannot overcome the fact that you do less with a maxed out rare weapon than someone with an untouched common one.

Do you consider my build selfish or disrespectful to other players?

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eBbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm da0fdodBIbkAIkI2lNGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000jdo ib0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsoGKGFqBsNIkjdn0 00009bIo0000008doIb0000008

[KatsuraJun]

Do you consider my build selfish or disrespectful to other players?

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eBbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm da0fdodBIbkAIkI2lNGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000jdo ib0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsoGKGFqBsNIkjdn0 00009bIo0000008doIb0000008

no, you will never get blacklisted or hated for a build like that unless someone just has a grudge against wands/TE or something, but that is not the norm.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

That's like saying that only Storm/magneto/Cable/Sentinel are worth playing in an MvC2 tournament because they're God Tier, and everyone else is inferior. Yeah other classes might be inferior, but an exceptional player can still play them well and get good results (unless we're talking about Roll, Dan, or Servbot). The gap isn't so massive that skill cannot possibly overcome the handicap.

There's this thing called damage multipliers, and skill trees drown in them.

They tend to be tailor-made for specific sources of damage/methods of delivery.

As such, no amount of skill makes up for ~60% damage losses you can easily incur on yourself by picking a sub-optimal class combination.

[Sizustar]

Do you consider my build selfish or disrespectful to other players?

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eBbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm da0fdodBIbkAIkI2lNGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000jdo ib0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsoGKGFqBsNIkjdn0 00009bIo0000008doIb0000008

Te/Hu is a common choice for a Techer,, so what is the problem with that?

If you tried to do the Te/Bo, or going pure support in a game that isn't built for it. it doesn't work.

Going back to my earlier example, going to a specifc EQ, such as Megatsu with the intent to have fun at other expense will get you blacklisted at best, and put out for the world to see that you are a bad player at worst.

That would be like joining a competitive FPS shooting game, and declare, I will only use a knife, and it's all about skills.

[Foxhound3857]

Te/Hu is a common choice for a Techer,, so what is the problem with that?

If you tried to do the Te/Bo, or going pure support in a game that isn't built for it. it doesn't work.

Going back to my earlier example, going to a specifc EQ, such as Megatsu with the intent to have fun at other expense will get you blacklisted at best, and put out for the world to see that you are a bad player at worst.

That would be like joining a competitive FPS shooting game, and declare, I will only use a knife, and it's all about skills.

What I mean is, is this build sufficient enough to put out acceptable numbers in those very specific EQs you mentioned, a build solid enough to not get me blacklisted later?

[KatsuraJun]

i want to add that i do not even consider your build perfectly optimal, but even then i doubt the vast majority of people will care or even notice.

i know it may seem to you that people are picky about classes in this game, but the opposite is true, only the absolute worst and most useless class combinations are the ones that are outright scorned by most players. even if you are on a mediocre class with a slightly suboptimal build, it is doubtful you will ever run into trouble.


What I mean is, is this build sufficient enough to put out acceptable numbers in those very specific EQs you mentioned, a build solid enough to not get me blacklisted later?

yes, that build is perfectly capable of carrying it's own weight, and even more than that, carry other people's weight in certain EQs that are favorable to TE and wands.

[Sizustar]

What I mean is, is this build sufficient enough to put out acceptable numbers in those very specific EQs you mentioned, a build solid enough to not get me blacklisted later?

There isn't a Perfect job that does everything, each class have their own pro and con.

Go through Lonely Garuga's guide to get a idea on how to equip and skill for a Te.

And look on nicovideo and youtube for gameplay of Te.

For example, most of the holiday EQs, have player traveling a map and killing random enemyes as a MPA, in this instance, as long as you are helping killing, most people won't care if you are using a Have fun class.

But for other, such as Tower Defense 2/3, or Megatsu, in which if 1 player mess up, which can causes the whole EQ to fail, having a optimal build is usually warrented.

[Foxhound3857]

i want to add that i do not even consider your build perfectly optimal, but even then i doubt the vast majority of people will care or even notice.

i know it may seem to you that people are picky about classes in this game, but the opposite is true, only the absolute worst and most useless class combinations are the ones that are outright scorned by most players. even if you are on a mediocre class with a slightly suboptimal build, it is doubtful you will ever run into trouble.



yes, that build is perfectly capable of carrying it's own weight, and even more than that, carry other people's weight in certain EQs that are favorable to TE and wands.

I know it's not fully optimized. It's modified a little bit to suit the sort of role and playstyle I'm going for. But as long as it's able to hold its own and put out the numbers other players expect later, that's good enough for me. I can both kill stuff and play the role I want to play.

[Xaelouse]

if only BO's support stuff was actually useful in a support sense. Fields are a great idea and lets you enhance nearby attackers while you can spend time/PP on attacking too. But like the rest of the game, Sega is afraid to bring out the full potential and it's annoying.

[Sakarisei]

Fi/Bo is far superior to Bo/Fi regardless of what weapon you're using precisely because of Limit Break. To say otherwise vastly underestimates just how ridiculously powerful Limit Break is. Hu/Bo can use any Hunter weapon as well as Hunter equip/crafted Bouncer weapons, along with War Brave for an easy 15% extra damage. Not necessarily completely superior to Bo/Hu, but it's definitely more viable for using both Hunter and Bouncer weapons than Bo/Hu would be.

The Stances are complete trash, my basic reasoning for bringing up those /Bo classes are the advantages over Bo/Hu and Bo/Fi. I wouldn't recommend /Bo to anyone unless it was specifically with the intention of using Bouncer weapons paired with whatever the main class can do, if using those main class weapons at all. Bouncer has nothing particularly important as a main class skill and has terrible subclass compatibility.

Even you've got Warbrave and Limit Break, those skills are from limited time, and you won't get those effects unless you're on the best moment of using those skills. For example, if you lose the aggro while using Warbrave, where is that 15%? Or, in the case of Limit Break, where is that effect if you die after receiving a hit?

Even those skills are good options, those skill won't be better than BO/HUs or even BO/FIs with 13*, especially when latents are OP, in my best opinion. They can overcome those skills if they want, and nowadays there are some BOs with +1500-1600 s-atk with latent lvl 3.


All online PS games were self sufficient in terms of the player's ability to fight, there was never a tank/healer/dps trinity so i don't know why you were expecting one. there was never a pure tank or pure support class in PSO1 unless you counted force being really bad so why did you expect one to work in PSO2.

Because older PS games doesn't have active skills like Warcry or even Guard Stance to make those roles. In PSO1, or original PSO, although i'd played BB, those things hadn't existed from the original MMO, but at least HU could be a mob wall, a RA could be an extra attack spammer and FO could be a buffer and a good canceler hit. Of course, there is no role of tank and heal, but at least they'd got some important roles in that game, roles which shouldn't be ignored.

About being self sufficient, unless you're talking of playing offline mode in pso or one person in bb... no, i can assure you that you're not self sufficient in those games. You can't solo old pso because you really need a very good equipment, and even you've got it, i can assure you that that thing is nothing easy.

In BB, there are some japanese missions like Realms of War that you cannot do it alone, at least in online mode.

And now... why supports and tanks?

Because unless you want seeing a game which the people can break the game easily, for example when people with CT + BA/VR while farming magatsu with near all players with GU as a main or sub, a variety of roles is necessary in online games for preventing people spamming the same class and the same PA near all the day. Because this, and for other reasons, in Japan, PSO2 has got an average point of 3.75 (3.3 before ep2) if you find reviews of the game, looking for PSO2評価 in google. Seriously. Maybe the game has slightly increased the average point because the presence of some content like Yamato or Shingeki no Kyoujin. But not for a good game.

Plus... even japanese people cannot consider PSO2 as a MMO, so... you can check it when you want.

Greetings.

[Selphea]

Do you consider my build selfish or disrespectful to other players?

http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/skillcalc.php?09eBbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxImbxIm da0fdodBIbkAIkI2lNGAqnIdJkrAI2000000doIn0000000jdo ib0000000fdo000000lo00000006dBdAidsoGKGFqBsNIkjdn0 00009bIo0000008doIb0000008

I just realized something about Te/Hu when you linked that. Te/Hu has a bit of fine print that might be easily missed: You need rainbow sets. Not just one, but at least two rainbow sets of weapons. One for Wands, another for either Wired Lance or Partisan that's Techer-usable, and there's no native Techer-usable Wired Lance or Partisan with good ATK below 11*.

Why rainbow set? The 10 points in Elemental Weak Hit, which is where the bulk of Techer melee damage bonuses come from,

And why two rainbow sets? Techer is designed as a hybrid class - wands for smacking, techs for hitting things that fly high in the air or are otherwise too hyperactive to smack. Unfortunately a Techer/Hunter sacrifices Tech damage, so to avoid being completely out of options when something takes to the sky or spins right round baby, that's where the Hunter weapons come in.

Your build happens to not have the Gear skill for a Hunter weapon - that's fairly minor and I'd suggest getting the Gear skills recommended in LonelyGaruga's guide.

So I'd imagine entry-level gear for Te/Hu would be 5 Pristine Small Hammers and 5 Crafted Neiclaws. Estimated budget for grinding, affixing and crafting Techer-usability is well above 10 million. Techer is not a cheap class.

Another thing that's easily missed is that Shifta Advance is a % of a % - it's very much a newbie trap skill in that the percentage looks impressive on paper - 125% looks amazing right? Except it's 125% of 19.7% of a character's base attack. That usually works out to 10SP spent for less than 2% more damage. It's a bit like Crit, and the game is full of skills like that so you really need to be careful.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

if only BO's support stuff was actually useful in a support sense.

Moment gale shift action includes weak suction along with zanverse with no additional pp cost iirc.

Being able to buff shifta without losing as much time/committing PP to not dealing damage yourself with strike gust is okay.

And the one thing most people still don't know about...

Uncharged megiverse+heal share.

They also bring the usual support techs of resta, anti, and zondeel, though those techs, as well as shifta/deband are all inferior to Te's, leaving very little unique/exclusive methods of support to BO over TE (pretty much efficiency-crafted uncharged megiverse + heal share healing anyone close enough without cutting into your damage as much).

I'd consider BO a support because of the above more than their fields.


Fields are a great idea and lets you enhance nearby attackers while you can spend time/PP on attacking too. But like the rest of the game, Sega is afraid to bring out the full potential and it's annoying.

This is painfully true.

[TheszNuts]

Honestly, the only way this person will learn is when he starts playing the game because as solid as something sounds on simulators and planning, doesn't mean the same when it comes to actual ingame practices.

Buffing ppl is a big example: it sounds like a solid plan to be rear lines keeping ppl buffed and healed, but field conditions change fast and spawns can literally comes from all directions at times so front lines can quickly become the rear and leaves you to defend for yourself or hope someone rescues your hide. Everything in this game boils down to will you be a contribution to the effort or a liability.

[Foxhound3857]

I just realized something about Te/Hu when you linked that. Te/Hu has a bit of fine print that might be easily missed: You need rainbow sets. Not just one, but at least two rainbow sets of weapons. One for Wands, another for either Wired Lance or Partisan that's Techer-usable, and there's no native Techer-usable Wired Lance or Partisan with good ATK below 11*.

Why rainbow set? The 10 points in Elemental Weak Hit, which is where the bulk of Techer melee damage bonuses come from,

And why two rainbow sets? Techer is designed as a hybrid class - wands for smacking, techs for hitting things that fly high in the air or are otherwise too hyperactive to smack. Unfortunately a Techer/Hunter sacrifices Tech damage, so to avoid being completely out of options when something takes to the sky or spins right round baby, that's where the Hunter weapons come in.

Your build happens to not have the Gear skill for a Hunter weapon - that's fairly minor and I'd suggest getting the Gear skills recommended in LonelyGaruga's guide.

So I'd imagine entry-level gear for Te/Hu would be 5 Pristine Small Hammers and 5 Crafted Neiclaws. Estimated budget for grinding, affixing and crafting Techer-usability is well above 10 million. Techer is not a cheap class.

Another thing that's easily missed is that Shifta Advance is a % of a % - it's very much a newbie trap skill in that the percentage looks impressive on paper - 125% looks amazing right? Except it's 125% of 19.7% of a character's base attack. That usually works out to 10SP spent for less than 2% more damage. It's a bit like Crit, and the game is full of skills like that so you really need to be careful.

Why do I need 5 different types of the same weapon? Do I need one for each element or something?

[Selphea]

Yep - check the skill Element Weak Hit.

[Foxhound3857]

Yep - check the skill Element Weak Hit.

So I have to make 5 of the same weapon for every single goddamn type of elemental damage and then change them out constantly according to whatever the current enemies are weak to?

Urgh...

[TheszNuts]

So I have to make 5 of the same weapon for every single goddamn type of elemental damage and then change them out constantly according to whatever the current enemies are weak to?

Urgh...

Under theory yes, field-wise you rarely need more than two depending on where you go.

[Selphea]

Only as a Techer ^^; Most other classes don't have to.

I feel kinda bad for bursting your bubble but I figure better now than later.

As far as Techer goes, Techer/Fighter would be more than 50% cheaper since you only need 5 wands - Fighter's damage bonuses apply to techs so your techs will hit pretty hard and you don't need a second set of weapons to cover wands.

Alternatively for a Paladin-type, Bouncer/Hunter with Jet Boots can work, since Jet Boots have the ability to switch elements at will.

[KatsuraJun]

Even you've got Warbrave and Limit Break, those skills are from limited time, and you won't get those effects unless you're on the best moment of using those skills. For example, if you lose the aggro while using Warbrave, where is that 15%? Or, in the case of Limit Break, where is that effect if you die after receiving a hit?

Even those skills are good options, those skill won't be better than BO/HUs or even BO/FIs with 13*, especially when latents are OP, in my best opinion. They can overcome those skills if they want, and nowadays there are some BOs with +1500-1600 s-atk with latent lvl 3.

The difference is virtually nothing between Fi/BO Quna and Bo/Fi Ares/Ideal vs Bosses. I'll take the option of limit breaking. Not worth mentioning Bo/Hu for damage because it trades damage for survivability, so it will naturally be less here.

http://i.imgur.com/OnED15N.png


Because older PS games doesn't have active skills like Warcry or even Guard Stance to make those roles. In PSO1, or original PSO, although i'd played BB, those things hadn't existed from the original MMO, but at least HU could be a mob wall, a RA could be an extra attack spammer and FO could be a buffer and a good canceler hit. Of course, there is no role of tank and heal, but at least they'd got some important roles in that game, roles which shouldn't be ignored.

About being self sufficient, unless you're talking of playing offline mode in pso or one person in bb... no, i can assure you that you're not self sufficient in those games. You can't solo old pso because you really need a very good equipment, and even you've got it, i can assure you that that thing is nothing easy.

In BB, there are some japanese missions like Realms of War that you cannot do it alone, at least in online mode.

that is not quite what I mean by self sufficient, you are not truly self sufficient in this game either, unless you want to show me magatsu/td solo clears.


And now... why supports and tanks?

Because unless you want seeing a game which the people can break the game easily, for example when people with CT + BA/VR while farming magatsu with near all players with GU as a main or sub, a variety of roles is necessary in online games for preventing people spamming the same class and the same PA near all the day. Because this, and for other reasons, in Japan, PSO2 has got an average point of 3.75 (3.3 before ep2) if you find reviews of the game, looking for PSO2評価 in google. Seriously. Maybe the game has slightly increased the average point because the presence of some content like Yamato or Shingeki no Kyoujin. But not for a good game.

Plus... even japanese people cannot consider PSO2 as a MMO, so... you can check it when you want.

Greetings.

you can hardly say that is the problem with class variety, the problems that arose out of those is because sega let certain multipliers stack out of control. you can add abilities that are offensive and not supportive in nature and still prevent something like that from happening. you say this like every damaging class plays in the exact same way, but they do not. Te/Hu wands is a very damaging class against mobs because of the way the explosions work, but less effective against bosses. Gu/Ra is a very damaging class against bosses but not against mobs because of their weak AoE and the way CT works. there can be variety without needing a tank/healer/dps trinity. if you want that, play another game. that has not, will not, and should not be what PS is like.

[Foxhound3857]

Only as a Techer ^^; Most other classes don't have to.

I feel kinda bad for bursting your bubble but I figure better now than later.

As far as Techer goes, Techer/Fighter would be more than 50% cheaper since you only need 5 wands - Fighter's damage bonuses apply to techs so your techs will hit pretty hard and you don't need a second set of weapons to cover wands.

Alternatively for a Paladin-type, Bouncer/Hunter with Jet Boots can work, since Jet Boots have the ability to switch elements at will.

...alright, any recommendations for the Fighter Sub skills?

[KatsuraJun]

...alright, any recommendations for the Fighter Sub skills?

don't quit the idea just yet, it is not as expensive as you think to get the bare minimum when it comes to 5/6 weapons. I say 5 or 6 because one element is completely useless as it is right now, so you do not need to worry about it.

you can get a set of mediocre wands that are every element and then gradually replace them with the best ones. even with Te/Fi, to play optimally (as in take advantage of EWH) you will need 5 wands.

[Selphea]

Try checking LonelyGaruga's Techer guide (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714), but I'd say the core skills would be Brave Stance and Brave Stance Up. For wand whacking, Striking Up 2 and 3, for Techs, Tech Arts JA and PP Slayer. Wise Stance can be a cherry on top, and then Weapon Gear skills for giggles.


don't quit the idea just yet, it is not as expensive as you think to get the bare minimum when it comes to 5/6 weapons. I say 5 or 6 because one element is completely useless as it is right now, so you do not need to worry about it.

you can get a set of mediocre wands that are every element and then gradually replace them with the best ones. even with Te/Fi, to play optimally (as in take advantage of EWH) you will need 5 wands.

The killer on Te/Hu wasn't the 5 wands - those are cheap. It's the 5 Te-usable W. Lances/Partisans. Te/Hu typically fights bosses like a Hu with techs.

[Foxhound3857]

Why didn't I just stick to Dragon Nest? It was far less complicated, I only needed 1 set of equipment, and the Cleric was VERY WELL APPRECIATED for its buffs and heals and almost a necessity for hard modes.

[Foxhound3857]

Try checking LonelyGaruga's Techer guide (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714), but I'd say the core skills would be Brave Stance and Brave Stance Up. For wand whacking, Striking Up 2 and 3, for Techs, Tech Arts JA and PP Slayer. Wise Stance can be a cherry on top, and then Weapon Gear skills for giggles.

Alright, I'll take it one step at a time. For now I'll just focus on a single wand for physical damage so I can deal with every situation.

[LonelyGaruga]

Even you've got Warbrave and Limit Break, those skills are from limited time, and you won't get those effects unless you're on the best moment of using those skills. For example, if you lose the aggro while using Warbrave, where is that 15%? Or, in the case of Limit Break, where is that effect if you die after receiving a hit?

Even those skills are good options, those skill won't be better than BO/HUs or even BO/FIs with 13*, especially when latents are OP, in my best opinion. They can overcome those skills if they want, and nowadays there are some BOs with +1500-1600 s-atk with latent lvl 3.

1) You're not supposed to get hit during Limit Break. Please give a better argument.
2) War Brave doesn't depend on aggro. All it cares about is the enemy being present. It also lasts for the same duration as War Cry's cooldown, so that 15% is active 100% of the time.
3) What are you ranting about in the second paragraph?

I remember arguing with you in the old Techer thread and your incredibly airheaded arguments there, so I'm just not going to take you as a credible person to discuss this with further. Doesn't look like anything changed about your logic or understanding of the game, so whatever.

[KatsuraJun]

Try checking LonelyGaruga's Techer guide (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226714), but I'd say the core skills would be Brave Stance and Brave Stance Up. For wand whacking, Striking Up 2 and 3, for Techs, Tech Arts JA and PP Slayer. Wise Stance can be a cherry on top, and then Weapon Gear skills for giggles.



The killer on Te/Hu wasn't the 5 wands - those are cheap. It's the 5 Te-usable W. Lances/Partisans. Te/Hu typically fights bosses like a Hu with techs.

i guess, but he could just stick with 1 bio partisan/WL until he gets more money. it's not going to be optimal in every case but if he light attributes it, it will work in the important content (Magatsu is weak to light, TD/Falzes is all darkers) and he can get the other ones at his leisure. Maybe ice or fire next for UQ, etc. It won't be that bad. again, if Te/Hu is what you want, there's ways to make it work even on a budget.

[TheszNuts]

Alright, I'll take it one step at a time. For now I'll just focus on a single wand for physical damage so I can deal with every situation.

You're already taking things a bit too far in planning at this point if you're building a compelte skill tree. Why don't you finish downloading the game and try it out before you do anything like that? You might not even like this game.

[lnvisible]

Why didn't I just stick to Dragon Nest? It was far less complicated, I only needed 1 set of equipment, and the Cleric was VERY WELL APPRECIATED for its buffs and heals and almost a necessity for hard modes.

Te/Hu is very similar to playing paladin on dragon nest. They can heal, buff stats, and still put out some solid damage. They can also debuff (somewhat) with using certain techs that have high rates of statusing on mobs. You just need to learn when to use what and you'll be a great support as Te/Hu with the added bonus of having some very solid mobbing game.

[Sakarisei]

that is not quite what I mean by self sufficient, you are not truly self sufficient in this game either, unless you want to show me magatsu/td solo clears.

Self sufficient doesn't mean "I can solo everything", although many people in PSO2 thinks that being self sufficient is the meaning of soloing everyghing. Self sufficient means you can move and react in any case, but not in the case of ignoring the other players. The main problem of any MPA / EQ is that people is exploiting the others as a wall to get the loot and leave the quest, if there is possible. Since i was on a team which many people is "self sufficient" and basically no interesting in cooperating with other teammates, i can assure that thing, or at least when many of them are in japanese mpas for loot, many loot.


you can hardly say that is the problem with class variety, the problems that arose out of those is because sega let certain multipliers stack out of control.

Only? And how about the defense and HP of those mobs? Maybe the exception is Magatsu and the first times of DFs, but basically every mob gets about 250 def or even less. I mean, 250 def is very poor for some players which can reach more than 4k of stats if they carry 13* or even more, and making powerful equip for neutralize some mobs (XH or UQs) is...


you can add abilities that are offensive and not supportive in nature and still prevent something like that from happening.

If you're talking about a game like PS Nova, well, that thing is possible. And that thing is possible because that game is a single player mode with a "fun multiplayer mode", if you want to see it. However, those games are not the same than online games, and I can assure it...


you say this like every damaging class plays in the exact same way, but they do not.

There is the same way. Even you're an AOE or a Single Target DPS, the same is the way, dealing, dealing more, more DPS.


Te/Hu wands is a very damaging class against mobs because of the way the explosions work, but less effective against bosses. Gu/Ra is a very damaging class against bosses but not against mobs because of their weak AoE and the way CT works.

Since there is a 12* Sword with basically 1100 t-atk, usable for FOs, TEs and BOs, you can use that sword and get the boss slaying with the best element for that weapon.

Gu/Ra? Get a good launcher for GU and spam the Cosmic Break for mobbing.

The only thing is, if you want to focus in one weapon, you're on your right to do it, but there are more ways to eliminate some weak points and not lack, if you don't want.


there can be variety without needing a tank/healer/dps trinity.

How can you work on variety for... 56 class combos? If you were talking about few classes, like 4 or 5, maybe that thing is possible. However, how can you do that variety with those class combos? That thing is impossible to do without that trinity. Believe me. That's not an issue of being a hater of the game design of PSO2. It's an issue that many class combos requires more than just being DPS.

Plus, this game is not made for making some special types of DPS like stun dps or status effect dps since those things doesn't work in very weak mobs, and the only important point of the game are the bosses, not the mobs.


if you want that, play another game. that has not, will not, and should not be what PS is like.

Well, for a game like that i prefer PS Nova. The same that PSO2, but a single player game and much more prepared for things like that.

[KatsuraJun]

Self sufficient doesn't mean "I can solo everything", although many people in PSO2 thinks that being self sufficient is the meaning of soloing everyghing. Self sufficient means you can move and react in any case, but not in the case of ignoring the other players. The main problem of any MPA / EQ is that people is exploiting the others as a wall to get the loot and leave the quest, if there is possible. Since i was on a team which many people is "self sufficient" and basically no interesting in cooperating with other teammates, i can assure that thing, or at least when many of them are in japanese mpas for loot, many loot.

Um, I have no idea what you're ranting about. Nobody exploits others as a wall to get loot, or at least I've experienced nothing of the sort.



Only? And how about the defense and HP of those mobs? Maybe the exception is Magatsu and the first times of DFs, but basically every mob gets about 250 def or even less. I mean, 250 def is very poor for some players which can reach more than 4k of stats if they carry 13* or even more, and making powerful equip for neutralize some mobs (XH or UQs) is...

The best I've seen from the actual loser outside of GP is duo. Cmode isn't soloable. It's not really worth talking about the rest of the quests, because they're just run around and kill x, which actually *is* a problem with the game, not whatever you're ranting about. We need more quests like TD/Magatsu/Cmode and less like Rampaging Malice/AnyHolidayEvent/etc.

Fortunately they're slowly fixing that.


There is the same way. Even you're an AOE or a Single Target DPS, the same is the way, dealing, dealing more, more DPS.

Um, yeah, but playing them is a completely different experience. That's what's called, well, variety? Sorry if you don't get it.


Gu/Ra? Get a good launcher for GU and spam the Cosmic Break for mobbing.

I suggest you don't talk about classes you obviously know nothing about. You use way more than just CB when using launchers with Gu. Like, you know, zero distance? One of the Launcher PAs that has great synergy with GU? Nah.


How can you work on variety for... 56 class combos? If you were talking about few classes, like 4 or 5, maybe that thing is possible. However, how can you do that variety with those class combos? That thing is impossible to do without that trinity. Believe me. That's not an issue of being a hater of the game design of PSO2. It's an issue that many class combos requires more than just being DPS.

Er, I'd say what limits the class variety in this game is more about how some classes just flat out don't work with each other (Take Hu/Fo or something) rather than "it just being the same thing." Br/Hu and Fi/Br play differently even though they both use katanas for example. I don't experience the same kind of safety while playing FI/BR, but I don't feel that rush when I have limit break and KC both on and am trying to spam Hatou without dying. And those are two very similar combinations, there are plenty of quirks like casting bows, hybrid JBs vs pure striking, etc that are all different and fun in their own way. We *could* get more variety if some synergies were better, like if Hu/Fo or Fo/Hu could actually be a class that not only uses Sword PAs but also techs, but that's just impossible right now given how the multipliers work. For example, Bow would have not been viable as a casting weapon if Weak Stance didn't work with techs like how fury stance doesn't. It has nothing to do with not having a tank/dps/healer trinity.


Plus, this game is not made for making some special types of DPS like stun dps or status effect dps since those things doesn't work in very weak mobs, and the only important point of the game are the bosses, not the mobs.

er, mobs are plenty important, or are you those idiots that wail on bosses while you're on an AIS in TD instead of taking care of the goldrahdas? Chase, and mobbing/crowd control is a huge factor in TD, and UQs as well. I mean zondeel is one of the best techs for a reason, and people opted to max out freeze chance builds when it didn't work in UQ.

[Sakarisei]

1) You're not supposed to get hit during Limit Break. Please give a better argument.
2) War Brave doesn't depend on aggro. All it cares about is the enemy being present. It also lasts for the same duration as War Cry's cooldown, so that 15% is active 100% of the time.
3) What are you ranting about in the second paragraph?

1) And if you're not able to use Limit break because that skill is extremely risky on a class combo which cannot have Iron Wil...
2) And if there is only one boss like a Magastu, DF or other single boss...
3) I don't need explaining it, especially if you don't want to believe me, although i don't need to believe in people like you :)

PD: Since I've seen the last paragraph... yeah, I remember you one of the TE whiners when on EP2 told that one equip build for TE is the only viable way (Natives species). That's why I can't consider that people like you a serious one.

[KatsuraJun]

1) And if you're not able to use Limit break because that skill is extremely risky on a class combo which cannot have Iron Wil...
2) And if there is only one boss like a Magastu, DF or other single boss...
3) I don't need explaining it, especially if you don't want to believe me, although i don't need to believe in people like you :)

PD: Since I've seen the last paragraph... yeah, I remember you one of the TE whiners when on EP2 told that one equip build for TE is the only viable way (Natives species). That's why I can't consider that people like you a serious one.

I don't even know why this discussion between you two exists, I already showed mathematically that there is no difference between Fi/Bo with Quna and Bo/Fi with Ares so you may as well go Fi/Bo for the option to LB.

[Sizustar]

1) And if you're not able to use Limit break because that skill is extremely risky on a class combo which cannot have Iron Wil...
2) And if there is only one boss like a Magastu, DF or other single boss...
3) I don't need explaining it, especially if you don't want to believe me, although i don't need to believe in people like you :)

PD: Since I've seen the last paragraph... yeah, I remember you one of the TE whiners when on EP2 told that one equip build for TE is the only viable way (Natives species). That's why I can't consider that people like you a serious one.

I think that's the point of Limit Break, it sacraficing defense for offense?

[Kondibon]

The gap isn't so massive that skill cannot possibly overcome the handicap.In the case of PSO2 it is actually, and that's where part of the problem stems from. The gap between a "minimum" spec required to complete content and an "optomized" one is HUGE, then you throw gear in and it gets even wider. Like, yeah, you can do it, I do all the time, but you'd be holding other people back, and when they wanna have time to get in multiple runs of something, forcing your self on them is bad.
That said, none of you are obligated to play with each other.

EDIT: The goal of people like Z-0 isn't just to clear the content, it's to clear it quickly and efficiently. I see nothing wrong with that, but people start clashing when their goals don't go together. If you want someone to play with, you can always add me once you get ingame. I don't do EQs, but if you want someone to just do stuff with and not have to worry about your build I'm perfect for that.

[Sakarisei]

Um, I have no idea what you're ranting about. Nobody exploits others as a wall to get loot, or at least I've experienced nothing of the sort.

You're a fortunate player, because in my case, many players were exploting me and other players. Got some people with it.


The best I've seen from the actual loser outside of GP is duo. Cmode isn't soloable. It's not really worth talking about the rest of the quests, because they're just run around and kill x, which actually *is* a problem with the game, not whatever you're ranting about. We need more quests like TD/Magatsu/Cmode and less like Rampaging Malice/AnyHolidayEvent/etc.

Fortunately they're slowly fixing that.

C-mode is a special mode, and for now, fashion in PSO2, but when C-mode is obsolete... it will be the same that the C-Mode in PSO1...


Um, yeah, but playing them is a completely different experience. That's what's called, well, variety? Sorry if you don't get it.

Some classes like BO can do AOE and single at the same time, and even it, i can experience the same thing. The only thing is


I suggest you don't talk about classes you obviously know nothing about. You use way more than just CB when using launchers with Gu. Like, you know, zero distance? One of the Launcher PAs that has great synergy with GU? Nah.

In the past, before EP2, there were guys with GU/RA using the flame visit, and the damage with their tmgs and that weapon were incredibily powerful. The only thing is people don't care about it since nowadays people are using the weapons of the class, and very few using the weapons of the class and the sub, so...

And yes, i know about what i'm talking because before getting a ban (816) on an old account, one of the things that i was doing for my old team was experience with everything and not test the "popular" builds.


Er, I'd say what limits the class variety in this game is more about how some classes just flat out don't work with each other (Take Hu/Fo or something) rather than "it just being the same thing." Br/Hu and Fi/Br play differently even though they both use katanas for example. I don't experience the same kind of safety while playing FI/BR, but I don't feel that rush when I have limit break and KC both on and am trying to spam Hatou without dying. And those are two very similar combinations, there are plenty of quirks like casting bows, hybrid JBs vs pure striking, etc that are all different and fun in their own way. We *could* get more variety if some synergies were better, like if Hu/Fo or Fo/Hu could actually be a class that not only uses Sword PAs but also techs, but that's just impossible right now given how the multipliers work. For example, Bow would have not been viable as a casting weapon if Weak Stance didn't work with techs like how fury stance doesn't. It has nothing to do with not having a tank/dps/healer trinity.

About the FO as a sub, the main problem of that sub is... FO is only made as a main class, when in PS Nova, FO has got even its own "stances" which increase the damage rate of your char if you have already an element, making fo as a viable option. That's not only in HU/FO. Try to combine FO with other class. Even BO is... well, you know.

The subclass system wasn't made to make hybrids, even Sakai was trying to sell the subclass system with the possibility to be a hybrid, although i've got a friend which is HU/FO, and he hates BO and TE because he hesitates about being true hybrids.

About the use of Limit Break in BRs or BOs, that thing requires a good weapon usable by FI, and since many people is not ready to craft a weapon for just one skill, you'll have some problems to get work with that. I won't say that FI/BR or FI/BO with just katana or dual saber won't work. However, what will you do with a class, using just a subclass weapon, when nowadays a 13* is much better than it, specially when their latents are very powerful?...


er, mobs are plenty important, or are you those idiots that wail on bosses while you're on an AIS in TD instead of taking care of the goldrahdas? Chase, and mobbing/crowd control is a huge factor in TD, and UQs as well. I mean zondeel is one of the best techs for a reason, and people opted to max out freeze chance builds when it didn't work in UQ.

Not in my case, but i've seen many people like that. And about Zondeel? Craft it with 35 shock rate, and you'll have even more fun with TE...


I think that's the point of Limit Break, it sacraficing defense for offense?

Yes, but if you don't want to die easily, that skill sometimes can be obsolete. It's powerful, but you cannot use always...

Plus, what will you do in FI/BR or FI/BO if you're forced to use the subclass weapon?...

If that guy were using the FI weapons too, i really don't mind to get it, but since many people is using that trick for just one skil...

[Sizustar]

Plus, what will you do in FI/BR or FI/BO if you're forced to use the subclass weapon?...

If that guy were using the FI weapons too, i really don't mind to get it, but since many people is using that trick for just one skil...

Erm, People do use LMB and DB as a Fi/BO.
It's one of the more popular build that people uses.
And those that uses it, are not worried about getting hit by boss, since they have already memorized most of the attack used by the boss already.

Fi/Bo
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm24383205
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm24895179

[KatsuraJun]

You're a fortunate player, because in my case, many players were exploting me and other players. Got some people with it.

You're going to have to elaborate on that


C-mode is a special mode, and for now, fashion in PSO2, but when C-mode is obsolete... it will be the same that the C-Mode in PSO1...

well, hopefully they keep updating it? that has nothing to do with self sufficiency of classes, that has to do with sega being not lazy and doesn't disprove what I said at all. Almost all relevant content can't be solo'd, so that's not what I'm talking about when I say self sufficiency.


Some classes like BO can do AOE and single at the same time, and even it, i can experience the same thing.

That was only one example (AoE vs Single target) both DBs and JBs has Aoe and Single target too, are you going to tell me you feel the exact same playing JBs and DBs? maybe you should find another game because it sure doesn't sound like you're enjoying this one then.


In the past, before EP2, there were guys with GU/RA using the flame visit, and the damage with their tmgs and that weapon were incredibily powerful. The only thing is people don't care about it since nowadays people are using the weapons of the class, and very few using the weapons of the class and the sub, so...

Um, plenty of people still use subclass weapons, what are you talking about...? In fact, in many ways it's gotten better - To play Katana optimally, you should be using wired lances, not simply katanas for example.


And yes, i know about what i'm talking because before getting a ban (816) on an old account, one of the things that i was doing for my old team was experience with everything and not test the "popular" builds.

Okay, and I have many friends that experiment with weird builds all the times. what's your point? Your personal experience means nothing.


About the FO as a sub, the main problem of that sub is... FO is only made as a main class, when in PS Nova, FO has got even its own "stances" which increase the damage rate of your char if you have already an element, making fo as a viable option. That's not only in HU/FO. Try to combine FO with other class. Even BO is... well, you know.

Well, that's my point exactly. It's not that we need Tank/healer/DPS trinity, it's that we need classes to synergize better for more variety.


The subclass system wasn't made to make hybrids, even Sakai was trying to sell the subclass system with the possibility to be a hybrid, although i've got a friend which is HU/FO, and he hates BO and TE because he hesitates about being true hybrids.

Um, okay, good for your friend...?


About the use of Limit Break in BRs or BOs, that thing requires a good weapon usable by FI, and since many people is not ready to craft a weapon for just one skill, you'll have some problems to get work with that. I won't say that FI/BR or FI/BO with just katana or dual saber won't work. However, what will you do with a class, using just a subclass weapon, when nowadays a 13* is much better than it, specially when their latents are very powerful?...

You are the one who brought up Ares and 13*s, I assumed we were talking about people with actual access to good weapons, not poor or new people. if you're going to compare the best weapon for Bo/Fi (Ares) then we're going to have to use the best weapon for Fi/Bo (Quna) as comparison. And the comparison says the damage is virtually the same, but Fi/Bo has the advantage of LB.


Yes, but if you don't want to die easily, that skill sometimes can be obsolete. It's powerful, but you cannot use always...

Plus, what will you do in FI/BR or FI/BO if you're forced to use the subclass weapon?...

If that guy were using the FI weapons too, i really don't mind to get it, but since many people is using that trick for just one skil...

If you're going to die easily because you can't dodge or time LB, yeah LB is bad. Maybe you should git gud then?

Fi/Bo is better because it's stronger and has more options. I dunno what else to say to you, the numbers don't lie.

[LonelyGaruga]

PD: Since I've seen the last paragraph... yeah, I remember you one of the TE whiners when on EP2 told that one equip build for TE is the only viable way (Natives species).

Except I and everyone else you're talking about did no such thing, but given you're such an incredible dimwit as to require it to be explained to you several times by at least three different people and still failed to grasp that, you've thoroughly demonstrated that you're simply incapable of grasping something more complex than what you just described.

Go away, neanderthal.

[Foxhound3857]

Well I've got the game fully installed, tweaked, and patched with the english translations and a proxy. But now when I try to launch it, my browser goes straight to the GameGuard page, saying that I need to reinstall the entire game.

What the hell?

[Kondibon]

Well I've got the game fully installed, tweaked, and patched with the english translations and a proxy. But now when I try to launch it, my browser goes straight to the GameGuard page, saying that I need to reinstall the entire game.

What the hell?There should be an option in the tweaker trouble shooting things to "fix gameguard errors" or something like that.

[Foxhound3857]

There should be an option in the tweaker trouble shooting things to "fix gameguard errors" or something like that.

Well I got past that, now my password is no good, and I wrote it down and triple checked it before confirming it.

*sigh*

http://global3.memecdn.com/kenan-amp-quot-whyyy-amp-quot-reaction-image-for-all-memecentarians_o_2688593.jpg

[TheszNuts]

What error number is it saying?

[Foxhound3857]

What error number is it saying?

Error number 602.

[TheszNuts]

602 means User ID is wrong, enter it in all lowercase. 603 would mean pass is wrong.

[Sizustar]

Error number 602.

Incorrect password, try logging at the official site and change it or email it to yourself.

And for future questions use this topic
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3246911&posted=1#post3246911

[Foxhound3857]

602 means User ID is wrong, enter it in all lowercase. 603 would mean pass is wrong.

Oh, that was the problem. Thanks.

Now I cannot choose Techer as a starting class? ^^;

[Sizustar]

Oh, that was the problem. Thanks.

Now I cannot choose Techer as a starting class? ^^;

Change it at the class change NPC after going ingame.

Choose Ship 2 for majority of English player, leave your id ingame, so other people can meet you ingame and help you too.

[TheszNuts]

Enter 10242580 as reference ID and select ship 2 as residing ship. You cannor use techer as starting class for the tutorial because it still runs off the original tutorial before techer was released, you can swap classes after you regain control in the lobby.

[Foxhound3857]

Enter 10242580 as reference ID and select ship 2 as residing ship. You cannor use techer as starting class for the tutorial because it still runs off the original tutorial before techer was released, you can swap classes after you regain control in the lobby.

Where is the class changer again?

And first impressions are...well, it feels like an online version of Star Ocean, to be honest. I could get used to this. And I can already see why playing a healer/full support wouldn't work, this game is just too fast paced for it.

[Kondibon]

Heyhey, What's your ID and character name? I want to add you!. o/

[Sizustar]

Where is the class changer again?

And first impressions are...well, it feels like an online version of Star Ocean, to be honest. I could get used to this. And I can already see why playing a healer/full support wouldn't work, this game is just too fast paced for it.

It's behind the elevator on the left side, the 3 NPC, the middle guy is the class changer.

You should leave your ID for people to contact you ingame.

[Foxhound3857]

It's behind the elevator on the left side, the 3 NPC, the middle guy is the class changer.

You should leave your ID for people to contact you ingame.

Okay, thanks.

My ID is Loadsamoney. I just logged off, will probably be on tomorrow, after I configure my settings for fullscreen.

Even after the Story/English/Large Files translations, there's still a LOT of japanese in game that I cannot understand at all. It's going to hamper me.

[Sizustar]

Okay, thanks.

My ID is Loadsamoney. I just logged off, will probably be on tomorrow, after I configure my settings for fullscreen.

Even after the Story/English/Large Files translations, there's still a LOT of japanese in game that I cannot understand at all. It's going to hamper me.

Those are either flavor text or picture which is too much work to translated.

All the important plot and gameplay stuff are translated.

[Foxhound3857]

I already got banned from the game. The automated email when translated said something about "using proxy" and "out of region."

Well, that was fast. Japan doesn't like North American players in their game, I guess.

[KazukiQZ]

Really? o_O

That was shocking actually.

Did you get any error code when you tried to login? And iirc, error 816 is the 'banned' code.

[Foxhound3857]

Really? o_O

That was shocking actually.

Did you get any error code when you tried to login? And iirc, error 816 is the 'banned' code.

I got that, and I got the email notifying me of the reasons for the ban, which look pretty hilarious when translated.

Oh well, it was fun for the hour or so it lasted.

[Nitro Vordex]

*sigh* Well what the hell am I to do then? I'm trying to make a build that does support and either tanks or is defensively oriented, and you guys are just shooting them down like DPS is the only thing that matters and everything else is f***all...
Now you're learning about PSO2.

[kuromechan]

I got that, and I got the email notifying me of the reasons for the ban, which look pretty hilarious when translated.

Oh well, it was fun for the hour or so it lasted.

sadly you can't just make another account and then try again since sega bans mac address which isn't changeable (Yeah changing parts can change mac address but thats considered a new PC)

[Kondibon]

Well, that sucks, I was looking forward to playing with you. :/

[Rayden]

What proxy were you using?

[The_Brimada]

I already got banned from the game. The automated email when translated said something about "using proxy" and "out of region."

Well, that was fast. Japan doesn't like North American players in their game, I guess.

Hmm how did they know you were North American though? You didn't put your real address in your account information anywhere did you?


What proxy were you using?

I'm curious about this as well.

[Korazenn]

What proxy were you using?

It is related to VPN usage, in general. Using VPNs are risky and can put you on grounds for ban by SEGA. It's a warning echoed in each thread on the issue.

SEGA has fixed most ISP blocks, so if you can see http://pso2.jp/ without going commando, it's likely you don't have/haven't had your ISP lose connection with SEGA's servers. That issue with ISPs not being able to connect with the servers is a result of their server migration after the DDoS attack last year.

[Foxhound3857]

What proxy were you using?

This one: http://pso2proxy.cyberkitsune.net/

[TheszNuts]

This one: http://pso2proxy.cyberkitsune.net/

Your location probably shouldve been a question asked much earlier, you don't need that anymore if you live in the US.

[Foxhound3857]

Your location probably shouldve been a question asked much earlier, you don't need that anymore if you live in the US.

I do, California. Wish I'd have known that.

[Sizustar]

I do, California. Wish I'd have known that.

Take a screenshot of the email, or post the text here.

It seems too quick for a banning, and a screenshot of the error message you get too.

[Z-0]

I'd like to see this e-mail, please. There's been no reports of anyone getting banned using the PSO2Proxy, since SEGA legitimately cannot tell you're playing from outside of Japan.

Using a VPN brings all the normal risks, though.
A bunch of people got banned from going from PSO2Proxy to their home connections, so sudden new users on the PSO2Proxy is very suspicious since a bunch of users who used that connection beforehand got banned.

I don't see what's so farfetch'd about it.

[Sizustar]

A bunch of people got banned from going from PSO2Proxy to their home connections, so sudden new users on the PSO2Proxy is very suspicious since a bunch of users who used that connection beforehand got banned.

I don't see what's so farfetch'd about it.

I don't remembering hearing about mass banning from using share vpn.
But I do remember saying that is a possibility, similiar to using VPN gate and using same vpn as other people.

[Z-0]

There's been a bunch of people who got 816'd after all the IP "issues" stopped, and people went back to their normal connection after using PSO2Proxy, which is what I was referring to.

It's not everyone though, no, which is what makes it very weird, just a few people.

[Sizustar]

There's been a bunch of people who got 816'd after all the IP "issues" stopped, and people went back to their normal connection after using PSO2Proxy, which is what I was referring to.

It's not everyone though, no, which is what makes it very weird, just a few people.

Did they contact Sega and see why they are 816ed?
It might not relate to the VPN.

[Sara-hime]

Managed to read all that (a day and a half *whew* ) and WOW. How tragic. :O
My heart goes out to you Foxhound. I hope you get a way to play sometime. I think you'd really like this game.
I was afraid of situations like this, hence why I slowly transitioned to using my home IP with stuff like WTFast. :(

[Kondibon]

What? When did this happen? (Not calling you a liar, legimitately asking because I never got wind of it)It happaned around the time a bunch of ISPs could connect again. I remembered seeing a few posts about it. It seemed to be caused by going from the proxy back to their normal connection though, not by using the proxy itself. Which makes it strange that he got banned when he only ever logged on via the proxy as far as I know.