The Black Dragon Post Thoughts and Discussion + how you won thread

[TakemiShinnosuke]

Isit really that hard.. share your experience here..

and you can charge the sword how ??

[Dark Mits]

You charge the same way you charge any tech; hold down the button for a few sec until your character does an animation indicating that the ability is charged.

1 out of 1 so far. Beat it after about 25mins. Non-expert pick-up group with Hero, Fighter, Bouncer and Techer. Needless to say, it's the Techer's Deband that prevented deaths. I can see Sega nerfing this.

[oratank]

carry on your weight and make friend with techer your would be fine

[TehCubey]

1 out of 1 so far. Beat it after about 25mins. Non-expert pick-up group with Hero, Fighter, Bouncer and Techer. Needless to say, it's the Techer's Deband that prevented deaths. I can see Sega nerfing this.

Was that a single attempt that took 25 minutes, or several failed ones that added up to a total of 25?

[oratank]

i took 25 minutes to kill him

[Asellus]

I've said it before on Gracia rematch, and it's even truer now, the pso community is not capable of meeting actual challenges. Fucking pathetic phasion stars, all of the stamina they could muster wouldn't help them.

Thirty million for a lobby action but their units and weapon look like trash. Thirty million for a new hairstyle so they can look good while getting butt fucked by Atrum. I ran this shit on fi/hu running LB, no techer, with less than thousand hp (qliphad units) not one fucking death. Meanwhile Hero's are getting their asses handed to them. Fuck I miss the days of MHFO.

[Zulastar]

It's booring. With techer in party incoming damage isn't a problem. Problem is lack of dps to cut off 2nd fly with meteor and 2nd common fly before burn out. And laconium sword seems to have lower effective distance than 12 ppl one.
1st attempt - 64th place with ~15 min.

[Dark Mits]

Was that a single attempt that took 25 minutes, or several failed ones that added up to a total of 25?One single attempt that took 25mins. Heck, the bgm during the trash part actually looped before we got on the 1st platform where we fight the dragon.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Kill in ~15min. All that farming makes one good at not dying.

[wahahaha]

I've said it before on Gracia rematch, and it's even truer now, the pso community is not capable of meeting actual challenges. Fucking pathetic phasion stars, all of the stamina they could muster wouldn't help them.

Thirty million for a lobby action but their units and weapon look like trash. Thirty million for a new hairstyle so they can look good while getting butt fucked by Atrum. I ran this shit on fi/hu running LB, no techer, with less than thousand hp (qliphad units) not one fucking death. Meanwhile Hero's are getting their asses handed to them. Fuck I miss the days of MHFO.

This amount of autism is astounding, just play with your team in order to avoid that kind of baddies. Or you could also solo.

I took around 27 mins in a blind run as hero, soloing with laconium sword seems to be impossible for now.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

This amount of autism is astounding, just play with your team in order to avoid that kind of baddies. Or you could also solo.

I took around 27 mins in a blind run as hero, soloing with laconium sword seems to be impossible for now.

All these stories of 25min runs is a little disturbing. I assume you guys were pugging it, in which case, it's further indication that expert requirements mean just about nothing for player ability these days and they really need to up the standards.



Thirty million for a lobby action but their units and weapon look like trash. Thirty million for a new hairstyle so they can look good while getting butt fucked by Atrum. I ran this shit on fi/hu running LB, no techer, with less than thousand hp (qliphad units) not one fucking death. Meanwhile Hero's are getting their asses handed to them. Fuck I miss the days of MHFO.

I beat him without dying. Am I allowed to spend 36mil on the latest hairstyle now?

[Saffran]

Took 3 tries, around 11 minutes on the victorius run. If I had a proper weapon, this would go faster.
I didn't even check, what is it weak to? Ice or Darkness?

[TehCubey]

I've said it before on Gracia rematch, and it's even truer now, the pso community is not capable of meeting actual challenges. Fucking pathetic phasion stars, all of the stamina they could muster wouldn't help them.

Thirty million for a lobby action but their units and weapon look like trash. Thirty million for a new hairstyle so they can look good while getting butt fucked by Atrum. I ran this shit on fi/hu running LB, no techer, with less than thousand hp (qliphad units) not one fucking death. Meanwhile Hero's are getting their asses handed to them. Fuck I miss the days of MHFO.

[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/JZ15hEP.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Took 3 tries, around 11 minutes on the victorius run. If I had a proper weapon, this would go faster.
I didn't even check, what is it weak to? Ice or Darkness?
.
Ice.

[wahahaha]

All these stories of 25min runs is a little disturbing. I assume you guys were pugging it, in which case, it's further indication that expert requirements mean just about nothing for player ability these days and they really need to up the standards.

Oh no, i was soloing it, havent pugged yet.

[ArcaneTechs]

I've said it before on Gracia rematch, and it's even truer now, the pso community is not capable of meeting actual challenges. Fucking pathetic phasion stars, all of the stamina they could muster wouldn't help them.

Thirty million for a lobby action but their units and weapon look like trash. Thirty million for a new hairstyle so they can look good while getting butt fucked by Atrum. I ran this shit on fi/hu running LB, no techer, with less than thousand hp (qliphad units) not one fucking death. Meanwhile Hero's are getting their asses handed to them. Fuck I miss the days of MHFO.
i havent even fought him yet to fill your rage but i complain about this stuff all the time but it also sounds like you were playing on non exp blocks so iunno lol gonna solo on the next run since raid dragon already ez mode

[Asellus]

I saw the fails coming, I should have been better prepared (mentally). It's just so fucked up when you see dragon wipe your party with one tail whip moments before the final phase.


i havent even fought him yet to fill your rage but i complain about this stuff all the time but it also sounds like you were playing on non exp blocks so iunno lol gonna solo on the next run since raid dragon already ez mode Ah man, I wish it was non expert. So called "experts" were getting butt fucked just minutes into the run. I ditched a lot of parties. I think pso may block my account for ditching.


[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/JZ15hEP.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX] Awe :D Thank you *cuddles*


I beat him without dying. Am I allowed to spend 36mil on the latest hairstyle now? Yes! Please do! Although 36 is slightly overpriced? Shoot for 30.


This amount of autism is astounding, just play with your team in order to avoid that kind of baddies. Or you could also solo.

I took around 27 mins in a blind run as hero, soloing with laconium sword seems to be impossible for now.I could do that, but that only ensures one Atrum run won't fail, I multi-ship so a pug is inevitable.

[ArcaneTechs]

you have a temp ban then if thats the case, i dont even quit out of bad raid EQ's anymore, i just stand around or press normals here and there if im that upset about it

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Yes! Please do! Although 36 is slightly overpriced? Shoot for 30.


Got it for 31. I wanted to talk someone down to 25-6, but there was only two left at 31 before going back to 36, so I caved :/

[Silent_Flower]

Just did my first run of the rematch and it took approx 20 minutes to beat it for rank 80 with 1 death among the MPA.

Overall, I probably can be more aggressive because I took a stamina drink and move away instead of countering but I feel it could go faster if more people used DF before the final phrase, especially when the dragon is resting.

[LordKaiser]

Well I failed the black dragon miserably and it was all my fault. I missed some dodge timings, I apologize for such a poor performance.

[Altiea]

I was wondering why Atrum was doing 80~90% of my health in damage whenever I got hit by fire... then I realized I wasn't taking Flash Tech Guard. Oops.

[LordKaiser]

I also wished the rematch was just the dragon without the mobs. They take too much time with 4...

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

I also wished the rematch was just the dragon without the mobs. They take too much time with 4...

It almost feels like the HP was scaled down for 4 man honestly.
Either that, or a good Te + 3 Hrs is all you need on either scenario.

[ashley50]

Failed 2 attempts this morning with randoms, which took 25+mins to get to the last phase of the battle.

Then got invited for a rematch earlier by a friend along with this teammates and only took 1/3 of the time I spent with strangers.

Doing this with Pugs will take a few more attempts before everyone else gets gets better at it.

[Asellus]

Atrum (https://ibb.co/cr2iMw) got wrecked. Ran this on Fi/Hu with less than 1000 HP (250 on LB). Units affixed for power, no stamina, no resistance, minimal defense, 0 deaths. Deadly circle PA is god mode.


you have a temp ban then if thats the case, i dont even quit out of bad raid EQ's anymore, i just stand around or press normals here and there if im that upset about it

Good advice. I'm trying not to ditch but it sucks knowing that the mpa will inevitably fail, your boosters drain and you'll have wasted your time (time being paramount for multi-ship players). I'm just going to start inspecting gear again. PSO2 should update its expert mode.

[Suirano]

Beat Atrum on the second attempt. That fight just doesn't feel fun and feels challenging for all the wrong reasons. The 3 death limit just feels more stressful than anything because of how a simple mistake could possibly OHKO you. In my fight, the dragon's tail and head were stuck in the wall or out of the arena for a good portion of the fight when those were his weak point.

Fornis helps with the fight tho and I have most of the dragon's moves memorized but even with that, I just don't see myself doing this rematch much. The cutscene beating it was pretty neat tho.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Ded in 11 minutes with no KOs. Got 6th, but ship 2 was oddly vacant. Wake me when pugs git gud.

[Xaelouse]

Boring. There is honestly nothing to look forward to for the next 4+ months

[ArcaneTechs]

Ded in 11 minutes with no KOs. Got 6th, but ship 2 was oddly vacant. Wake me when pugs git gud.
pso3 will come out by then

[Dark Mits]

Pick-up groups will never be "good". If you want a good (according to your standards) run, play with premade groups that you know and trust. Complaining about pugs is like complaining that the radio plays shit music.

[ArcaneTechs]

Pick-up groups will never be "good". If you want a good (according to your standards) run, play with premade groups that you know and trust. Complaining about pugs is like complaining that the radio plays shit music.
everytime without fail

[TakemiShinnosuke]

Boring. There is honestly nothing to look forward to for the next 4+ months

What so this the last item till 4months later?? So this content is to what ...keep us busy ??

[Dark Mits]

What so this the last item till 4months later?? So this content is to what ...keep us busy ??The game keeps you busy with whatever you like to do.

Have you completed every Free Field on SH/XH? Every ARKS Quest? Every Advance Quest? Expert Quest? Challenge Mode? Battle Arena? Ultimate Quest?
Have you got nearly all non-missable achievements?
Have you gotten every crafting achievement? Every gathering/fishing achievement?

The game ends when you are bored of it, not when you complete the last released content.

[Aexorcet]

Pick-up groups will never be "good". If you want a good (according to your standards) run, play with premade groups that you know and trust. Complaining about pugs is like complaining that the radio plays shit music.

Are they really that bad? I spend a lot of time trying to find these nightmare groups so EQ's (although not Dragon as of yet) don't get steamrolled while I'm half asleep. My luck has been poor.

I made my first attempt at the rematch last night with a random group. Went over the death counter the first time, although I saw the Dragon teleport a bit so I don't know if maybe it was just lagging for everyone. Retried with the same group and I think we managed around 15 minutes with maybe 1 death. It's the same thing as the normal version with a change in color and stretched out to be a little longer. I guess it's OK. The dragon can still be obnoxious with spamming attacks and jumping everywhere thought. I want EQ's that feel more like a fight than dodge trial or memory test. Deus Hunas is still my favorite EQ boss from EP 4/5. It feels the closest to a battle


The game keeps you busy with whatever you like to do.

Have you completed every Free Field on SH/XH? Every ARKS Quest? Every Advance Quest? Expert Quest? Challenge Mode? Battle Arena? Ultimate Quest?
Have you got nearly all non-missable achievements?
Have you gotten every crafting achievement? Every gathering/fishing achievement?

The game ends when you are bored of it, not when you complete the last released content.

I don't think all content is worth doing. Free Field SH is not much different from normal at this point if you're remotely well geared. I'd like a bit more direction and a faster pace in the development of the game.

[MikonX]

I don't think all content is worth doing. Free Field SH is not much different from normal at this point if you're remotely well geared. I'd like a bit more direction and a faster pace in the development of the game.

Then perhaps this game is not for you. Plenty of other games out there.

[Aexorcet]

Then perhaps this game is not for you. Plenty of other games out there.

Why wouldn't it be? I'd think that would only be the case if I didn't like anything in the game.

[Dark Mits]

Are they really that bad? I spend a lot of time trying to find these nightmare groups so EQ's (although not Dragon as of yet) don't get steamrolled while I'm half asleep. My luck has been poor.Not always. It's a lottery. Sometimes you get lucky and get a group that plays like pros, and sometimes you get people like me, who play Healer/Buffer instead of Damage Dealer and therefore pretty much means that you are 1 active person less in the group.


I don't think all content is worth doing. Free Field SH is not much different from normal at this point if you're remotely well geared. I'd like a bit more direction and a faster pace in the development of the game.XH Free fields aren't exactly too much dependent on development time. Just slap a blanket X% hp/ Y% atk on mobs. The problem is how can they entice us to play such harder content when they can't just make everything drop 7*+

[starwind75043]

what I learned so far. the third phase(after the canon phase) I have averaged at least 2 deaths I am complete ass at dodging.

[ArcaneTechs]

The game keeps you busy with whatever you like to do.

Have you completed every Free Field on SH/XH? Every ARKS Quest? Every Advance Quest? Expert Quest? Challenge Mode? Battle Arena? Ultimate Quest?
Have you got nearly all non-missable achievements?
Have you gotten every crafting achievement? Every gathering/fishing achievement?

The game ends when you are bored of it, not when you complete the last released content.
what a joke and waste of time (especially because this is always said). especially for ppl who have been playing since CB like me, theres nothing to do in this game right now outside dailies and weeklies and i guess the LQ but no Weila arm yet so nope to that.

the game is in a big drought because of LQ and no announced content worth looking forwards to (oh boi timed gated Omega Luther). now would be a good time for a break or just login for weeklies at minimum unless youre relatively new or not bored then keep playing

[Ceresa]

Pick-up groups will never be "good". If you want a good (according to your standards) run, play with premade groups that you know and trust. Complaining about pugs is like complaining that the radio plays shit music.

The existence of expert means there is clearly some interest in cultivating a matchmaking pool for higher quality randoms. Too bad Sega is retarded and doesn't manage the requirements properly to coincide with "hard" content releases.

No one sane is actually expecting their pugs to be milranduil tier, but there's a pretty big tier of acceptable between that and some fucking dunce that whores the sword without breaking points and manages to run up all 3 deaths.

And not getting one of those dipshits is the only challenge this fight presents. The dragon itself is garbage. It's the same fight, takes half damage (only really matters for DB and compound growth) and hits maybe 10% harder. If you paid attention at all to the red dragon fights for the past month this should be routine. Of course somehow people still die on Red and then bring their trash into Black.

Would have made more sense to increase the death limit like the forest trigger quest and just let personal deaths nerf your ranking/drops into the ground.

[Moffen]

Have you completed every Free Field on SH/XH?
Literally nothing of worth from doing this

Every ARKS Quest?
Tedious and annoying,still nothing of worth from doing this

Every Advance Quest?
Again,nothing worth from doing this. Only VHAQ is ran for EXP on low level characters,SHAQ costs too many caps and revolucio weapons are garbage and outdated

Expert Quest?
Extreme quest is super easy,rewards are outdated,the newer "hard" ones have suffered from power creep and the rewards are again,garbage

Challenge Mode?
Outdated,nobody runs this outside of a tiny fringe group thats on once a week.

Battle Arena?
Unbalanced laggy mess,annoying,cant buddy up with people you actually know,you're at the mercy of RNG to decide your team which will likely be garbage.

Ultimate Quest?
Zero rare drop boost running,you have a very tiny chance of getting anything. Because of this,Ultimate Quest is dead.
OT to NT exchange system for Slave/Nemesis is cancer

Have you got nearly all non-missable achievements?
Literally nothing of worth from doing this besides your own pat on the back.

Have you gotten every crafting achievement?
Huge gigantic waste of resources. You cant craft 12* units,so theres no point. You cant craft 13*s,so theres no point. Crafting techs to the highest level is a massive money sink and you can just request someone else do your tech or PA crafts for you.

Every gathering/fishing achievement?
Another thing thats not worth doing.


The game ends when you are bored of it, not when you complete the last released content.
It ends when theres stops being worthwhile content to run.
Dragon already isnt worth running because you can get val weapons as drops from the LQ,they're now super cheap on player shop.
Doing outdated content is not and never will be fun.
This is why people request for XH and XH+ difficulties on free fields and arks quest,this is why people ask for worthwhile drops. You are wasting your time for nothing otherwise,and nobody enjoys having their time wasted.

I absolutely hate this mentality of "Oh you must 100% everything in the game before you can complain!",its a stupid argument.
The game ends when relevant content becomes obsolete and the only time its worth logging in is for time gated emergency quests.
Dragon rematch is fun,its difficult,but its not rewarding in the slightest.
If you want cubes,solo PD nets you the same,if not more,in less time,and most people have an insane abundance of those triggers due to last years badge exchange worth drying up only a few months into the year.

Prob my longest post here but w/e
//rant

[Dark Mits]

snip to save space1) Even if Sega made the requirements harder, what stops someone from surpassing those without cheating? It's not exactly hard to have a friend get it for you.

2) What guarantee do you have that someone who actually surpasses Expert requirements will actually try to perform well in EQs well and not just be semiafk while being on social media or playing something else on another monitor?

3) How exactly then can they make the dragon (or any boss) to be more of a challenge? Reduce the reaction window time for every ability to 0.1sec? Strengthen failure mechanic to "Party damage taken 1000"? Give X min limit like Gracia and set it too tight? The fallacy is that even if they did make the fight unwinnable for 95% of the playerbase, there would still be people in the 5% who'd cry that the fight is still not difficult. Also, let's not forget the outcry from "expert" players about the 80% healing debuff in some EP4 content.

4) Why exactly should us baddies be prohibited from joining hard content? How exactly are we going to be enticed to up our game if we never see the words "You failed" on our screens?

The above 4 points have been discussed to death in every single online game I've played, and I guess on forums for every online game ever created.

5) I think that the personal ranking system exists for Atrum. My run had 2 deaths, and I was 1 of them. I got B and the score card mentioned 1 incapacitation. And I agree that the ranking system for the entirety of the game should be personal and should have great impact on player rewards.


snip to save space//rantBut notice what you said: "Nothing worth". You just said that you play for reward and reward alone. And I didn't say that you have to 100%, I said "The game ends when you get bored of it". Since you do not have anything to do to improve your character, congratulations, you have completed your personal PSO2 progression. I haven't. Different players try to get different things out of their games.

[Ceresa]

1) Even if Sega made the requirements harder, what stops someone from surpassing those without cheating? It's not exactly hard to have a friend get it for you.

2) What guarantee do you have that someone who actually surpasses Expert requirements will actually try to perform well in EQs well and not just be semiafk while being on social media or playing something else on another monitor?

3) How exactly then can they make the dragon (or any boss) to be more of a challenge? Reduce the reaction window time for every ability to 0.1sec? Strengthen failure mechanic to "Party damage taken 1000"? Give X min limit like Gracia and set it too tight? The fallacy is that even if they did make the fight unwinnable for 95% of the playerbase, there would still be people in the 5% who'd cry that the fight is still not difficult. Also, let's not forget the outcry from "expert" players about the 80% healing debuff in some EP4 content.

4) Why exactly should us baddies be prohibited from joining hard content? How exactly are we going to be enticed to up our game if we never see the words "You failed" on our screens?

The above 4 points have been discussed to death in every single online game I've played, and I guess on forums for every online game ever created.

5) I think that the personal ranking system exists for Atrum. My run had 2 deaths, and I was 1 of them. I got B and the score card mentioned 1 incapacitation. And I agree that the ranking system for the entirety of the game should be personal and should have great impact on player rewards.

1. S Phaleg. S Solo PD. Even S the more recent Omnibus for a start. Phaleg and PD have largely been powercreeped but solo content exists, they can make more of it. Certainly better than collect badges in a recycled seasonal EQ to buy shitty units.

2. Just because you can't guarantee 100% doesn't mean you don't aim for 100%.

3. Have his fire pillars linger. Like Loser's tornados. Have the entire floor turn hot. Like Loser. If you're ever at a loss on how to make something harder, go steal from Loser, the best fight in the game. Anything is more interesting than literally the same fight but with a death limit out of your control.

4. Join it in non-expert XH? Harder expert reqs won't take away anyone's ability to run content.

[Dark Mits]

Snip to save spaceGood points.

1. But I remind, a player can again ask a friend to beat it for them. I am certain that in Expert player circles there is at least one player who had it unlocked by someone else, or who unlocked it for someone else.

3. But then players would complain that Sega is not creative and recycles the same fights. Why not have something creative and game changing? Why not make it so that Step/Dive/Mirage do not avoid damage entirely but instead reduces it by 50%? Why not nerf PP regen to the ground so that players have to start thinking outside of maximum dps and instead dpp and make it a very tight time trial? Why not make a boss where there is no weak element but instead healing when hit by certain elements, and switch those elements every minute during the fight? Why not make a new mechanic where players are Panicked (uncurable by Anti) and have to maneuver through a small maze of fire to get back to the boss? A mechanic where the boss has to be aggroed and moved to certain parts of the arena to become vulnerable? And hundred others that exist in other games.

Why does everything have to be about reaction reflex and reaction reflex alone?

4. I did that. That's how I beat it. And I'm by all definitions on this forum a "baddie".

[Aexorcet]

Not always. It's a lottery. Sometimes you get lucky and get a group that plays like pros, and sometimes you get people like me, who play Healer/Buffer instead of Damage Dealer and therefore pretty much means that you are 1 active person less in the group.
My question was sort of rhetorical, I have the same experience, it varies. Outright terrible groups don't seem that common though, or maybe my definition of terrible is strict.


XH Free fields aren't exactly too much dependent on development time. Just slap a blanket X% hp/ Y% atk on mobs. The problem is how can they entice us to play such harder content when they can't just make everything drop 7*+
Yeah, I'd like XH everywhere. I'd rather play for gameplay than drops, so even if nothing dropped I'd end up in XH free fields.


Why does everything have to be about reaction reflex and reaction reflex alone?
It provides more replayability. Puzzles, tricks, and gimmicks tends to get easier over time and eventually trivialized. Also, changing the game too drastically can remove the appeal that draws players in the first place. There should be more to the end game than lightning reflexes and super inflated attack and HP though, I agree there.


Why not make it so that Step/Dive/Mirage do not avoid damage entirely but instead reduces it by 50%?
Depending on the kind of enemy this is implemented on, this could get annoying because it's basically just telling you to stop and heal every so often. Or it's going to make you burn through automate. That would be the case if there are many wide reaching attacks that you would normally have to dodge. If there aren't those kinds of attacks then it's a game of positioning to avoid attacks, which are already encouraged by giving enemies powerful one shot attacks, status effects (freeze mostly, or actually potent versions of burn/poison), stun, etc. Unavoidable damage just doesn't sound fun. Maybe in very moderate use, but a whole fight based around it isn't something I'd want to see. My biggest wish for damage is to tone down player healing significantly so that things other than one shots become concerning.


Why not nerf PP regen to the ground so that players have to start thinking outside of maximum dps and instead dpp and make it a very tight time trial?
Just PP regen rate? Wouldn't be all that bad except that some classes's core skills would be killed (PP Convert becomes literally pointless). If it's all forms of PP regen, then there will be a lot of boring sitting around and doing nothing. I think this in the first form I described could be an OK boss mechanic, but I'm not sure about imposing it for an entire quest.


Why not make a boss where there is no weak element but instead healing when hit by certain elements, and switch those elements every minute during the fight?I don't like element weakness in this game. It mostly just comes down to color matching the enemy's weakness icon and Sega forcing you to collect a weapon an absurd amount of times. I'd rather see something like status effects of all kinds become usable on bosses and you could choose your element in order to change some aspect of the fight in your favor.



Why not make a new mechanic where players are Panicked (uncurable by Anti) and have to maneuver through a small maze of fire to get back to the boss?I don't like this one, it just replaces the combat with something less fun. I don't really like Mother's zondeel attack or Double's gates either (and it slightly bothers me that these people trying to kill you leave nice openings for you to avoid their attacks).


A mechanic where the boss has to be aggroed and moved to certain parts of the arena to become vulnerable?Having the position of the boss matter could be nice, but I imagine that this would be unpopular if it was too easy for a player to pull the boss the wrong way unintentionally or not. You could mitigate it by just giving the boss increased defense instead of invincibility.

Not trying to shoot down any of your ideas, I just like discussing this kind of thing.

[echofaith]

I am happy their new content is forcing people to stop relying in moons so much. Though ideally, solo content with death limits(to avoid doll spam) would the best imo.

[Flatflyer]

I honestly find it ironic that people both simultaneously complain that content is too easy while also complaining about expert requirements "not being enough"

You can't have both your constant party of super elite dps masters and difficult bosses without alienating the other 90% of the playerbase who havent invested months into this game, and cant actually get the gear they need to get better because of expert matching taking up all of the players who could potentially help them succeed.

if you want a "challenge" then try soloing EQ bosses, or hell, "solo" it with a normal matching party so you can atleast help others who are struggling move further on with the game.

[Aexorcet]

I honestly find it ironic that people both simultaneously complain that content is too easy while also complaining about expert requirements "not being enough"

You can't have both your constant party of super elite dps masters and difficult bosses without alienating the other 90% of the playerbase who havent invested months into this game, and cant actually get the gear they need to get better because of expert matching taking up all of the players who could potentially help them succeed.

if you want a "challenge" then try soloing EQ bosses, or hell, "solo" it with a normal matching party so you can atleast help others who are struggling move further on with the game.

My thought on it was leave the normal stuff as it is, then make the harder stuff optional. Example, the normal XH version of the quest fills CF's, drops 13/14*, etc, so no one is missing out. Then the expert version gives you a little extra CF completion, drop chance, etc. Also let them count as different quests to get around the quest run limit. Sega could also let us rerun quests over the limit without rewards for the purpose of helping other players.

[echofaith]

I honestly find it ironic that people both simultaneously complain that content is too easy while also complaining about expert requirements "not being enough"

You can't have both your constant party of super elite dps masters and difficult bosses without alienating the other 90% of the playerbase who havent invested months into this game, and cant actually get the gear they need to get better because of expert matching taking up all of the players who could potentially help them succeed.

if you want a "challenge" then try soloing EQ bosses, or hell, "solo" it with a normal matching party so you can atleast help others who are struggling move further on with the game.

I think the problem with bad players isnt much about getting the gear and resources, but about their skills, and their priorities. We been getting a lot of welfare since EP 4 thanks to CF, and even with lower end stuff like say Revo, the difference of not using a maxed ipad wont even add 4 extra mins to an EQ duration. As someone said before, giving a monkey a sword wont make it a ninja.

Then you have players who dont know how to prioritize. They have 5 slots units with rushed 150 atk and almost no HP or PP, while their weapon is just the default from CF(+0, and 20 element). Not only is bad spent meseta, but getting 1HKOed constantly more than kills any extra DPS your ATK focused units would have provided. Not saying getting KOed is bad, but if you are going to die so often and your dodging skills cant fix it, then at least try to affix something smarter.

[StreetFighter2242]

Geez, Is it really that strong?

[otakun]

They made grinding weapons easier, don't see why they don't do the same for affixing. SAF helps but not enough to get the non hardcore players out affixing their gear.

[TehCubey]

They made grinding weapons easier, don't see why they don't do the same for affixing. SAF helps but not enough to get the non hardcore players out affixing their gear.

They already did, though. A few years ago you could use only 2 (or was it 3?) fodders per affix attempt. Then it was changed to 5.

That was a while ago though. From more recent things? Extreceptors make affixing alter/flict whatever easier. X The Soul is easy to affix, powerful, and reduces the need for soul receptors. S-Affixes make it really easy to cherry pick what affixes you want, and help with upslotting as well.

Rather than adding one huge paradigm shift like the NT weapons did, Sega is making affixing easier little by little, all the time.

[Flatflyer]

I think the problem with bad players isnt much about getting the gear and resources, but about their skills, and their priorities. We been getting a lot of welfare since EP 4 thanks to CF, and even with lower end stuff like say Revo, the difference of not using a maxed ipad wont even add 4 extra mins to an EQ duration. As someone said before, giving a monkey a sword wont make it a ninja.

Then you have players who dont know how to prioritize. They have 5 slots units with rushed 150 atk and almost no HP or PP, while their weapon is just the default from CF(+0, and 20 element). Not only is bad spent meseta, but getting 1HKOed constantly more than kills any extra DPS your ATK focused units would have provided. Not saying getting KOed is bad, but if you are going to die so often and your dodging skills cant fix it, then at least try to affix something smarter.

fair points, though from the few times I've had to run normal matching recently due to getting a new or hasnt played since expert block changes friend through the game,I havent seen many issues where people are dying left and right, but moreso people just arent able to deal enough damage, while I dont think giving players easy endgame gear will make them into expert players, it'd atleast alleviate the massive difference in time spent on EQs between normal and expert slightly. (which is why val weapons are fine right now imo)

Ideally what I would like is for a much less significant difference in how normal and expert runs go down, because as it stands, normal runs are incredibly annoying to do since every single well geared, skilled player is already on expert, I'd like to see sega manage to atleast level out the difference of both modes so that normal doesnt feel like a nightmare to play.

[TehCubey]

Then you have players who dont know how to prioritize. They have 5 slots units with rushed 150 atk and almost no HP or PP, while their weapon is just the default from CF(+0, and 20 element). Not only is bad spent meseta, but getting 1HKOed constantly more than kills any extra DPS your ATK focused units would have provided. Not saying getting KOed is bad, but if you are going to die so often and your dodging skills cant fix it, then at least try to affix something smarter.

Wait wait. Let me get this straight.

You think affixing atk over HP or PP is the mark of a bad player?

You can't be serious.

[milranduil]

Wait wait. Let me get this straight.

You think affixing atk over HP or PP is the mark of a bad player?

You can't be serious.

in 2018, atk only units are pretty garbo.

[ArcaneTechs]

Wait wait. Let me get this straight.

You think affixing atk over HP or PP is the mark of a bad player?

You can't be serious.
if you cant find a mix thats above 100atk, i think youre bad because theres plenty of abilites that can give you all or one or the other.

i still blacklist people who think no atk and 300hp/15pp/Resists is somehow useful

[echofaith]

Wait wait. Let me get this straight.

You think affixing atk over HP or PP is the mark of a bad player?

You can't be serious.

You missed the point. People prioritizing ATK affixes on units(which cost more than balanced stats) while sacrificing weapon grind is a problem. Same with sacrificing any means to stay alive and keep attacking. Not a problem if you know how to play of course, but I specifically mentioned people who dont.

[GHNeko]

Wait wait. Let me get this straight.

You think affixing atk over HP or PP is the mark of a bad player?

You can't be serious.

considering that 3 out of 4 of the top DPS classes have class defining skills that benefit from high max HP in a time where the game likes to spam hitboxes (especially off screen)

not opting for HP affixes along side your attack affixes is pretty ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????

and shows that you're either being carried all the time or you're not even remotely aware of the shifting affix meta.

also affixing atk over pp on high base atk weapons hasnt been the best choice of actions in ages.

[TehCubey]

You missed the point. People prioritizing ATK affixes on units(which cost more than balanced stats) while sacrificing weapon grind is a problem. Same with sacrificing any means to stay alive and keep attacking. Not a problem if you know how to play of course, but I specifically mentioned people who dont.

I'll be honest, during all the time I've spent playing this game I've yet to encounter a player with decent or better affixes on units who seriously used an ungrinded, low element weapon. I saw leeches, but they won't contribute no matter what they're equipped with. I also saw players who don't want others to see their weapons or are trolling and equip a rubbish weapon while the MPA is still gathering, but switch to a real once once the quest begins. But someone who has 150, or even 80 atk units, but an ungrinded weapon? Never.

Maybe I'm just lucky.


in 2018, atk only units are pretty garbo.

There's a reason why I don't listen to your advice anymore.

EDIT:



and shows that you're either being carried all the time or you're not even remotely aware of the shifting affix meta.


The current affix "meta" is garbage. For years HP/tanky builds were laughed at in this game, but suddenly they became just a little more viable and people are all over them? Give me a break.

Also, do you wish to compare parses? I'm not a top player but I carry MPAs more often than I'm carried, I assure you.

[GHNeko]

For years HP/tanky builds were laughed at in this game, but suddenly they became just a little more viable and people are all over them? Give me a break.

yes

that is exactly what happened

strictly because of hero and the sweeping and significant changes hero has caused


Hero Boost is the number one reason why Noble and EleGiggle Staminia have more than doubled in price since EP5 came.

Because Hero Boost provides such a significant multi as long as you dont lose too much HP

Because Hero Boost threshold for breaking scales with your max hp

Because Late EP4 and EP5 have a pension for having massive hitboxes that are off screen and reach far beyond what their visual models suggest (looking at at you Enchanted Forest LQ)

Because Showtime NOW operates EXACTLY like Hero Time in terms of conditionals (because of Hero Boost)

Because Fi CONTINUES to receive buffs making it that much more of a godtier class that requires you maintain LB as much as possible (because Hero and Hero Boost forced buffs to basically all basic classes)



that is EXACTLY what happened.

HP affixes have become that much more valuable in a short amount of time.

and the fact that you dont seem to believe that this is the case shows that the latter of my statement was true. :wacko:

and since you claim not to be carried, that also further supports the idea that you're not privy to the affixing meta changes that have been fast and hard.

hp affixes have become way more than "just a little more viable"

they're a huge part of maintaining top DPS as hero and a larger part of maintaining top DPS as Gunner and Fighter.

[Flaoc]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

jeez you make it so easy to realize why majority of en community should be ignored but ok sure stay stuck in ep2.. no such thing as a good balance of all 3 stats or anything

[otakun]

They already did, though. A few years ago you could use only 2 (or was it 3?) fodders per affix attempt. Then it was changed to 5.

That was a while ago though. From more recent things? Extreceptors make affixing alter/flict whatever easier. X The Soul is easy to affix, powerful, and reduces the need for soul receptors. S-Affixes make it really easy to cherry pick what affixes you want, and help with upslotting as well.

Rather than adding one huge paradigm shift like the NT weapons did, Sega is making affixing easier little by little, all the time.

Well, the problem with the examples you gave for improvements didn't help the non hardcore player and in fact made the gap worse. An overhaul MIGHT be required due to the current situation of every improvement to the system only widens the cap between the casual and top. Asking players that are meh on the idea of affixing in general is a lot harder to do when you have to explain to them to spend millions on items that has a chance to fail. Also, The S-Affix example only applies to weapons which doesn't help with unit affixing which is 3 of the 4 items involved.

[TehCubey]

yes

that is exactly what happened

strictly because of hero and the sweeping and significant changes hero has caused

Hero Boost breaks if you take 20% or more of your HP as a hit. Whether you have 1200 or 2000 HP, 20% of that is way less than what enemies in meaningful endgame content hit for. LB operates on a similar principle.

Or you can learn to evade enemy attacks and take 0% of your HP per hit instead. Everyone makes mistakes of course, but overdoing the safety wheels by gearing towards HP at the cost of atk is just being complacent and lazy.

This post was originally meant to be longer but I don't feel like ranting.

[Zephyrion]

y
Because Showtime NOW operates EXACTLY like Hero Time in terms of conditionals (because of Hero Boost)



Just nitpicking, because whatever, but all GU balance changes make them actually a lot less reliant on HP affixes
-showtime not having cooldown, and High Time building in a mere 5 seconds means that losing it is not nearly as significant as Hero boost or dying during LB
- High time keep ring pushes the threshold for HP loss to 40%, meaning anything around 1000HP requires a 400 hit to get reset.

Then about affixes, it's pretty hard to generalize, since different classes have different focuses that vary from one to the other. add the fact that some units give a shitton of HP, which would make it overkill to add some more big HP affixes (Hello Izane). Saying everybody should affix for HP regardless of their unit choices or class is as preposterous as people back in the Saiki era that wouldn't accept to see HP crafted units. Affixes are a mean to an end, and should not be something based on trends and metas, but needs. HP affixes simply rose because many people deemed them necessary for their needs.

Incidentally, all of this is not related to Atrum in the slightest, so we might want to stop veering off topic.
Kinda derped my first rematch attempts, but that was just me being too used to being allowed to be over agressive on normal dragon. The whole rematch thing is really more of a test of focus than a real challenge, but it's still fun and provides a lot of tension, so it's pretty cool !

[milranduil]

There's a reason why I don't listen to your advice anymore.

what did i do this time

[Zephyrion]

what did i do this time

Pretty sure it's only a misunderstanding. The few attack-only units that were used at some point were Kaiser, Saiki and Whitill, and they are either outdated or just lackluster so yeah, garbo. Only Rina's arm or Gruzo Rear are remotely acceptable and that's only because all the other *12 around give some sort of HP anyway so you're bound to get some in the end.

Hpwever ATK only affixes can work, again provided the HP provided by your units is enough to withstand every basic attack and that you can dodge reliably the big ones. It's actually super hard to do ATK only anyway nowadays, with a vast array of affixes that give HP or PP along the attack. I mean I never used a single Stamina Booster and there is Stamina IV on only one of my units, and I still sport a clean 1250HP. Deus Factor, Ares/Astral Soul, Omega Reverie, mutation II, Alter affixes and other just can provide the needed HP without dipping too much in your ATK or PP anyway

[echofaith]

Pretty sure it's only a misunderstanding. The few attack-only units that were used at some point were Kaiser, Saiki and Whitill, and they are either outdated or just lackluster so yeah, garbo. Only Rina's arm or Gruzo Rear are remotely acceptable and that's only because all the other *12 around give some sort of HP anyway so you're bound to get some in the end.

Hpwever ATK only affixes can work, again provided the HP provided by your units is enough to withstand every basic attack and that you can dodge reliably the big ones. It's actually super hard to do ATK only anyway nowadays, with a vast array of affixes that give HP or PP along the attack. I mean I never used a single Stamina Booster and there is Stamina IV on only one of my units, and I still sport a clean 1250HP. Deus Factor, Ares/Astral Soul, Omega Reverie, mutation II, Alter affixes and other just can provide the needed HP without dipping too much in your ATK or PP anyway

I have seen cases where people do units with Apprentice Soul + modulator combo while totally ignoring alter/flicts. This is probably a pet peeve for me, but I just cant stand seeing that considering the cost:benefit from modulator. This was before Hero too, so making global ATK sets wasnt the best idea.

[StreetFighter2242]

Is it really that Strong?

[Loveless62]

Geez, Is it really that strong?

Is it really that Strong?
You would have a higher chance of getting a response if you would clarify what you are asking about.

[Madevil]

how bad could a pug be? okay... here's what I came through

the first attempt, I've bumped into 3 little pricks don't event know how to use the laconium sword to trigger weak point, they just keep flat attacking / spawning PA without charging. when I finally got the chance to pick up the sword I actually have to DEMO it

FFS the black dragon instance is going through EXACTLY THE SAME workflow as the red version, I don't know WTF these leechers were doing

[ashley50]

The pug i was in at first attempt was doing ok, then the part to break the wing didn't happen.

Also, the KO count was already at 2/3.

Then suddenly found myself back at the lobby, along with another party member with the lead already left. XD

[Crystal_Shard]

Curious question, does a fancy cutscene involving the Laconium Sword and one's character occur regardless of who got the last hit, or does it only appear for the character that got the last hit with the Laconium Sword?

Logged on late for my very first Atrum, still managed to get a pass with only 2 MPA deaths, both from a FI/HU, but we managed to clear it after one false start. The first round, someone dropped and we failed to break the second wing in time. The restart went smoothly and we managed to keep the 4/4 MPA.

[Saagonsa]

Everyone gets the cutscene at the end, even if you're not using a sword when you kill him.

[Saffran]

Got into my second attempt, I was the party leader, died all 3 times, restarted, and died twice.
Sometimes I wonder why I bothered keeping an Elyseone.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Dragon was being a bitch last night.

During 12man regular run, he ignored a limb break stun.

During rematch, he ignored two limb break stuns, leaving us pew-pewing his head with ranged attacks to force him into final phase since we ran out of limbs to break. When he landed after the fireworks show, he didn't go into his stun animation, probably because of the limbs being missing too far in advance of that starting.

Beat him in 14minutes, but still pissed off that I seen 3 stuns get ignored in one session. Needs to be addressed.

[Zorak000]

I'm just putting Ares the soul on every unit and weapon I affix from here on out (unless I am using an Astral Soul SAF); it's 30 HP vs 10 ATK per item to me, and 120 more hp just sounds a lot more useful than 40 more attack.

anyway, I did some number crunching like almost half a year ago, and I found that even with say, a zeinesis or quilphad sword, every 60 more atk on every item (or 240 more atk from abilities) seems to roughly translate to ~5-6% more damage; even +180 atk per unit/weapon was still ~5% more damage than +120 atk

That all said; it's kind of hard for me to recommend going for unit abilities any more than Ares/Omega Reverie/Mutation II/ and the user's choice of two of the following: Shoot/Power/Tech IV, Stamina IV, Ability III, Deus Factor (yamato factor over 3 slots is almost impossible to find, and mother just got downgraded to random EQ status), and Spirita IV. if you got the money to afford stuff like Flict/Alter or Noble/Elegant abilities go right on ahead with that, I'm kinda just keeping my eye out for stuff you can do without going out of your way to get, or just for people on Klotho welfare.

Though I have started to see people popping up with 6-7 slot units that seem like they were assembled completely with Gal Gryphon drops, and while something like Gryphon/Ability III/Mutation II/Power IV/Stamina IV/Blow Resist IV/All Resist III is only giving like 80 s-atk, it still sounds pretty freakin sturdy for something they got by farming Winged Border Breaker and/or saving seasonal EQ gryphon drops

https://twitter.com/NextTimePSO2/status/950524355875885056 nothing is going to top seeing the person with the 33% element atra sword though

[Flaoc]

this might be worse just because of how element convert works AND he did not put the rod s4 on the rod.. instead opted for partizan s4 LUUL

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/251608303929393152/395703907906486284/82d96c052ec730326f097c90cbad271b.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/251608303929393152/395703931038203926/0d1d9fd021f8c19c430b901a5617cf96.png

on topic rematch is pretty easy.. but i generally bring a friend or premade so far

[StreetFighter2242]

This amount of autism is astounding, just play with your team in order to avoid that kind of baddies. Or you could also solo.

I took around 27 mins in a blind run as hero, soloing with laconium sword seems to be impossible for now.


You would have a higher chance of getting a response if you would clarify what you are asking about.

Okay.

Is the black dragon that everyone is fighting really that strong?

[wahahaha]

Okay.

Is the black dragon that everyone is fighting really that strong?
Its not. That was a solo time, pugs have around 12 min clears.

[Altiea]

Okay.

Is the black dragon that everyone is fighting really that strong?

It's literally just Erythron Dragon, but with 50% damage resistance, reduced HP, and more ATK. The "more ATK" part is the part that pugs seem to be having problems with, since that's coupled with a 3 death limit.

[Zulastar]

5 runs - 2 wins and 3 fails... too much noobs in pugs flagged expert...

If they give fine dps - they die like bithces, if they keep live - no dps in result and eventually fail.

If body keep dying it's not his teammates fault and 3 deaths is too strict condition to punish them 'cause of one tard.

[Silent_Flower]

Okay, just did 3 runs because 2 of them ended in failure. One person died 3 times within 3 minutes and all the healing he did was small increments (most likely Atra Lifesteal).

I feel it better to just leave people on the floor instead trying to moon them back up.

a) You are risking yourself trying to revive other people. If you didn't die, you may be in a terrible spot and vulnerable of getting knocked out.
b) The person getting revived can get killed again right away if the person doesn't heal. Plus, that person needs to get back into rhythm of the battle.

If the person just go back to the shuttle ship
a) The person get a full heal
b) The person can control when he gets back into battle.

Plus, most people I see getting knocked out were showing signs that they were doing badly...

One thing the rematch is making better at is dodging and countering because quiet litterally, my life depends on it :-D

[Asellus]

Stressful quest, not because I'm running LB with shit defense and shit HP, stressful because other players just plain suck.

[Kintama]

5 runs - 2 wins and 3 fails... too much noobs in pugs flagged expert...

If they give fine dps - they die like bithces, if they keep live - no dps in result and eventually fail.

If body keep dying it's not his teammates fault and 3 deaths is too strict condition to punish them 'cause of one tard.

be nice.

[StreetFighter2242]

It's literally just Erythron Dragon, but with 50% damage resistance, reduced HP, and more ATK. The "more ATK" part is the part that pugs seem to be having problems with, since that's coupled with a 3 death limit.

I see. So it's Sil dragon all over again eh?

[ArcaneTechs]

be nice.
being nice doesnt clear or get you drops

[Kondibon]

being nice doesnt clear or get you dropsI'd argue that being nice is more important than clears or drops.

[Dark Mits]

being nice doesnt clear or get you dropsCursing doesn't clear or get drops either.

[Aexorcet]

I feel it better to just leave people on the floor instead trying to moon them back up.

a) You are risking yourself trying to revive other people. If you didn't die, you may be in a terrible spot and vulnerable of getting knocked out.
b) The person getting revived can get killed again right away if the person doesn't heal. Plus, that person needs to get back into rhythm of the battle.

If the person just go back to the shuttle ship
a) The person get a full heal
b) The person can control when he gets back into battle.

Probably right about that. I've been nicked by a few things during Ilzonde. Some of the attacks are pretty quick. I don't think I've even tried to use a Moon yet.


Plus, most people I see getting knocked out were showing signs that they were doing badly...

It seems pretty random to me. This quest really highlights some camera and lock on issues. I hate tapping change target over and over because lock on refuses to look at the only relevant part of the dragon. Then it jumps so far that lock on breaks. I almost died during the wing flap AoE attack today because it randomly shot me a million feet in the air and I couldn't see the ground AoE markers any more. It's a good thing I had the timing for that sort of down.

After everything, the cannon section is my biggest gripe. I might stop doing the quest because of it. I had to sit through3 times this EQ session, but ended up not being able to finish the quest.

[TakemiShinnosuke]

Ok what is this crap... I died once 1/3.. so to make it fast I campship to save time...

*The joke is after you campship and go back... before you click to enter the arena you do not know what its doing ... one can only guess*

and when I came back instantly 2/3 (within a split second I died) .... cause when I re-entered the arena .. it was doing its dash run and had no re-action time -_-

its like ok I'm back .. turns around... dash run.... 2/3

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Ok what is this crap... I died once 1/3.. so to make it fast I campship to save time...

*The joke is after you campship and go back... before you click to enter the arena you do not know what its doing ... one can only guess*

and when I came back instantly 2/3 (within a split second I died) .... cause when I re-entered the arena .. it was doing its dash run and had no re-action time -_-

its like ok I'm back .. turns around... dash run.... 2/3

What are you even getting one shot by?

[TakemiShinnosuke]

This is when and where I re-entered :: the part when that blacky flies out the arena and does and a dash in ... the mid section of the fight....

all you need to do is re-enter at the wrong time and stuff can go very wrong for anyone because from the outside you cannot tell whats going on .. all you see would be numbers red and white popping...

edit: there is long way to go with this.. so yeah I will take my time

[wefwq]

Ran it twice with multi-block matchmaking, both time end up with JP players so i have a pretty damn good time.

[ArcaneTechs]

I'd argue that being nice is more important than clears or drops.
oh its okay guys, we couldnt clear it within the 30min gap in time but maybe next time! ahaha we did our best and thats what counts! even had fun!

*fast forward to one week after*

wow its getting kinda old failing this still, are people trying? i mean its fun i guess but i kinda want to clear it for once...

FUN POSITIVE OUTLOOK

[Zulastar]

Last run was really something. We were at 4 Heroes. I've done about 55% overall damage and all other 3 "Eroes" done about 45% dmg 'cause they just hold their Rising slash continuously...

We took about 18 mins and at the last minute we ran off limbs to hit ecxept head and the dragon spam all his rage at me nonstop without any gaps. So I died, but still got my 13* shit. I really wish "experts" like these other 3 to die with a brain cancer.

PS: I really don't hate PPL playng for fun but not when they flag themselves with Expert on top channel.

[Zulastar]

And now body died two times in a row right after shooting phase then left. We manage to finish of dragon with 3 PPL in 15 mins.
Why so much tards and noobs in "expert"?

[Zorak000]

oh its okay guys, we couldnt clear it within the 30min gap in time but maybe next time! ahaha we did our best and thats what counts! even had fun!

*fast forward to one week after*

wow its getting kinda old failing this still, are people trying? i mean its fun i guess but i kinda want to clear it for once...

FUN POSITIVE OUTLOOK

and how would having a negative outlook have changed that situation; realistically you still wouldn't have cleared it any more than you did while staying positive, except get on everybody's nerves and maybe even make them play worse, possibly even just out of spite


EDIT: anyway i've been going in as guard stance advance hunter; I get to use a whole lot of JG/sonic arrow, and guilty break helps me close back in on him while he's dancing all over the place. I pop over to a Wired Lance to holding current the wings in that phase, and when his head goes down after breaking stuff I try to get a volgraptor combo off on him

[Moffen]

Can the psuedo-elites here who think they're the greatest at the game and keep complaining about pubs just use PSO-Ws direct messaging option and form a little group together already lmao.

My only gripe is still the backflip x2 and stupid OP ram that tends to clip me when im nowhere near the dragon but delayed S-roll usually keeps me safe from that now.
Roll once,let JA fade(or do an attack) and roll again and he's usually still again when im done.

I do notice people getting wiped by that nasty tail swipe a lot though.

[DavidAG]

Do you guys not have teams or something? I also dislike people who hold rising slash or die 3 times in dragon rematch, but I never have troubles finding 3 other people in my team to clear dragon with no problem.
I'm sure if you're that good that you're carrying every MPA, you wouldnt have any impediment on joining an elitist team.

[HardBoiledPapa]

Well I mainly use rising slash without locking on the legs because if you lock on to it and the dragon backflips the camera goes wild and it's a lot harder to dodge attacks because of it.

[Asellus]

100% disgusted with how atrocious techers are vs Atrum. Not buffing, not healing, dying, just total dead weight. I find it's better to run Atrum with Hero's or other fighters running limit break (yup I realize how insane that sounds). Again though, deadly circle is god mode and Heros have lots of PA invincibility frames. I suppose so do techers, mirage and all, but it's just beyond me how a person with mirage can get killed.

[Moffen]

100% disgusted with how atrocious techers are vs Atrum. Not buffing, not healing, dying, just total dead weight. I find it's better to run Atrum with Hero's or other fighters running limit break (yup I realize how insane that sounds). Again though, deadly circle is god mode and Heros have lots of PA invincibility frames. I suppose so do techers, mirage and all, but it's just beyond me how a person with mirage can get killed.

I'm 100% sure you're probably one of those people complaining about Techers but never actually stays anywhere near the Techer.

Shout out to this thread for tightly packing the worst of PSO-W into one convenient space.

[Kondibon]

Shout out to this thread for tightly packing the worst of PSO-W into one convenient space.I was about to say that I haven't posted yet, but I did. And it was a shitpost too. \o/

[Zephyrion]

100% disgusted with how atrocious techers are vs Atrum. Not buffing, not healing, dying, just total dead weight. I find it's better to run Atrum with Hero's or other fighters running limit break (yup I realize how insane that sounds). Again though, deadly circle is god mode and Heros have lots of PA invincibility frames. I suppose so do techers, mirage and all, but it's just beyond me how a person with mirage can get killed.

Oooooook, so first thing, most good Techers operate on step advance because of Wand Lovers, which can be useful or a liability. In our case, any dedicated TE will have used the very generous extra points from their subclasses to get a few into step advance. That combined with Nabarta 0 and Tech C parry makes TE one of the safest classes in the game if played properly.

Second is I do love how people bitch about TE in mpas not healing/buffing/whatever when they have so much to do in the first place. Using your array of support techs takes attention away from you to direct to the others, and can make saving your own butt troublesome at times.

Third thing is that it's absolutely preposterous to judge all the TEs based on your few rematches. People not playing their classes properly is a thing. Meanwhile here, the TEs I got during rematch never gave me an occasion to complain about them, and out of the 4 rematches I did as TE I only died once, and 3 of those runs were nightmarish runs over 15 minutes.

[Moffen]

I was about to say that I haven't posted yet, but I did. And it was a shitpost too. \o/

I dont mean everyone here is bad,im just saying you can definitely spot the ones who are.
You're gr8 Kondibab dont you worry ( ´ ▽ ` )ﾉ

[Kondibon]

You're gr8 Kondibab dont you worry ( ´ ▽ ` )ﾉ
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cfgq5sCWsAMj6zp.jpg


Oooooook, so first thing, most good Techers operate on step advance because of Wand Lovers, which can be useful or a liability.
Step with wand lovers actually has more i-frames than normal step by default. I'm not even sure step adv works with it.

[Zephyrion]

Step with wand lovers actually has more i-frames than normal step by default. I'm not even sure step adv works with it.

The invul from wand step with wand lovers is equivalent to lv 1 step advance : basically lv 1 is useless, but you gain the extra invul from lv 2 onwards

[Kondibon]

basically lv 1 is uselessAs someone who used to play with no points in step adv on any class, it really isn't.

[Zephyrion]

As someone who used to play with no points in step adv on any class, it really isn't.

No no, I mean wand lovers step invul is 0.05 seconds by default, meaning that when you level step advance on your sub of choice for TE, the first point overlaps with the already existing invul, so it doesn't give you anything extra. However once you reach lv 2 and more the extra invul effectively improves the step invul from that point onwards

I guess my wording was wrong, it's not that lv1 step advance is worthless in general, just that investing one point into it when using wand lovers makes that point have no value whatsoever.

[ArcaneTechs]

Can the psuedo-elites here who think they're the greatest at the game and keep complaining about pubs just use PSO-Ws direct messaging option and form a little group together already lmao.

ran this a few times solo already and a few pugs, i havent had what the others are going through but i think the point is and will always be, get good but i forgot, people cant no matter how many times they run something or how long theyve played something.

thats PSO for ya

[Kondibon]

I guess my wording was wrong, it's not that lv1 step advance is worthless in general, just that investing one point into it when using wand lovers makes that point have no value whatsoever.Oh, I see, Yeah, that makes sense then.

[TehCubey]

100% disgusted with how atrocious techers are vs Atrum. Not buffing, not healing, dying, just total dead weight. I find it's better to run Atrum with Hero's or other fighters running limit break (yup I realize how insane that sounds). Again though, deadly circle is god mode and Heros have lots of PA invincibility frames. I suppose so do techers, mirage and all, but it's just beyond me how a person with mirage can get killed.

Okay. First off, all TEs I saw on Atrum dragon did their job fine. I saw buffs, I saw healing. So you're either extremely unlucky or running away on your own and acting like it's their job to follow you.

Secondly, for someone who likes to act like he's the last good player in the game and everyone else is shit, the few times I shared an MPA with you (all this month), your performance wasn't too hot yourself. Not bad, but definitely worse than I'd expect from someone with 200+ atk affixes.

Maybe you should approach this game with more modesty.

[Asellus]

Okay. First off, all TEs I saw on Atrum dragon did their job fine. I saw buffs, I saw healing. So you're either extremely unlucky or running away on your own and acting like it's their job to follow you.

Secondly, for someone who likes to act like he's the last good player in the game and everyone else is shit, the few times I shared an MPA with you (all this month), your performance wasn't too hot yourself. Not bad, but definitely worse than I'd expect from someone with 200+ atk affixes.

Maybe you should approach this game with more modesty.

IDK you were tracking my performance, please share a video or two of me failing. :roll:

What's your IGN?

Techers who don't buff at times when the party gathers to attack the face is a deal breaker. Or for that matter anytime the party is brought together through the flow of gameplay. No one is running from buffs. Techers fail in this because they lack dps. And if they aren't smart enough to buff when everyone is gathered they're just dead weight. Healing isn't a problem since heros can heal themselves.

https://ibb.co/d5ngDb

IDK whether to laugh or cry. Playing with techers and hunters, :bash: goddamn. I basically solo'd this, the hunter and techer were totally dead weight.

[milranduil]

IDK you were tracking my performance, please share a video or two of me failing. :roll:

What's your IGN?

Techers who don't buff at times when the party gathers to attack the face is a deal breaker. Or for that matter anytime the party is brought together through the flow of gameplay. No one is running from buffs. Techers fail in this because they lack dps. And if they aren't smart enough to buff when everyone is gathered they're just dead weight. Healing isn't a problem since heros can heal themselves.

https://ibb.co/d5ngDb

IDK whether to laugh or cry. Playing with techers and hunters, :bash: goddamn. I basically solo'd this, the hunter and techer were totally dead weight.

it's the players, not the classes. te and hu are both fine for this.

[TheFanaticViper]

IDK whether to laugh or cry. Playing with techers and hunters, :bash: goddamn. I basically solo'd this, the hunter and techer were totally dead weight.

Someone in your party did enough damage to use his dark blast, you can't deny his contribution and declare that you "solo'd this"

[CrossOmega]

IDK whether to laugh or cry. Playing with techers and hunters, :bash: goddamn. I basically solo'd this, the hunter and techer were totally dead weight.

If you have the time to stand there and take a screenshot instead of whaling on the damned dragon, I will suspect you to be the total dead weight.

[Loveless62]

I have been busy this week so I didn't get a chance to try the rematch until Saturday morning.

I've so far played this for 5 scheduled EQs, each time as Hr. Three of the five EQ blocks ended with a successful Black Dragon kill.

In the first EQ block and in the first run, admittedly I made some mistakes with the Laconia Sword. Someone left during the cannon phase, and we got nuked by the second fireball. Somehow we only took one death. I stayed in because I thought 3/4 wouldn't be a problem (people have won this solo), but the run ended in 3 deaths and ran long. In the next run, right as soon as we arrived at the dragon, someone died immediately, a few feet from where the jump pad lands you. The EQ time ran out during the attempt, and you can guess how well that run went.

The first time I was in a winning run (in the second EQ block that I participated in), it was a smooth 12-minute run. We had one death, but it didn't seem to matter. This bolstered my confidence, but none of the other runs went so smoothly.

The other two times I was in a winning run, it came down to the last run in the EQ block. I got pretty crazy at that point, said "screw DPS and Hero Boost", and started chasing the other players with Resta whenever their health was not topped off. It's pretty painful to do so since everybody moves around so much chasing after the dragon, but I didn't see any other way to control the outcome. Each of those two attempts completed with 2 deaths. I should probably just play Te/Hu.

I am pretty sturdy with 1514 health, and I have Shine Red fire resistance and a bunch of extra defense with my Qliphad Caliber. I tend to heal up any damage I take soon after I received. Thus far, I have not died and have only procced Hero Will once. That happened only when I just gave up focusing after we already had 3 deaths . I have improved with the Laconia Sword (I tend to hog it for unsealing, and release it for DPS), but unsealing tends to drive me crazy with all of the juking, turning, and jumping across the map that the dragon does. And don't get me started with the tail. I feel I have to pray to RNGesus to have the dragon sit still for a moment.

I will probably need to pug this to continue to participate. I tend to be a lone wolf with few people active on my friends list, so I can't really stack a party that way. I could't get a party together from my team, since the team activity seemed to be really slow this weekend (someone blamed the release of Monster Hunter World, but I am not so sure). My team is new-player friendly and genuinely casual (unlike the so-called "hardcore-casual" team we seem to have plenty of, LUL), so frankly we don't tend to have the best players anyway.

I am considering not running this, but I probably will anyways, knowing how I am. But this EQ has been of the most frustrating experiences I have had with this game.

[Ahri]

My run are satisfactory, the Su/Fi is excellent to complete this one :).

my recording yesterday:

https://youtu.be/V7Kkdkx4260

[Masu]

My run are satisfactory, the Su/Fi is excellent to complete this one :).

my recording yesterday:
*snip*
GG.
Welp, first Milranduil solo LQ and now your vid...Gotta have to use a skill reset to max out 'dear master' but was lazy to do it until now.
[SPOILER-BOX]Single class skill tree reset when sega? :sleep:[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Zulastar]

In the first EQ block and in the first run, admittedly I made some mistakes with the Laconia Sword. Someone left during the cannon phase, and we got nuked by the second fireball. Somehow we only took one death. I stayed in because I thought 3/4 wouldn't be a problem (people have won this solo), but the run ended in 3 deaths and ran long.

I remember that time. It was me who left 'cause there were 2 Bravers with zero dps both + no wing break after first meteor = 100% fail and just a wasting of time.

How ideal run looks like:
[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/X7MZjLv.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/X7MZjLv.jpg)[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Flaoc]

not sure how this qualifies as 1st but ok ill take it.. must have been no one around if a pug run got 1st (and 1 guy was a hardcore leech) and wasnt even nearly as quick as a pug i once had as well

[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/NnLkoMm.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Loveless62]

I remember that time. It was me who left 'cause there were 2 Bravers with zero dps both + no wing break after first meteor = 100% fail and just a wasting of time.

How ideal run looks like:
[SPOILER-BOX]https://i.imgur.com/X7MZjLv.jpg (https://i.imgur.com/X7MZjLv.jpg)[/SPOILER-BOX]
I knew it was you ;-) I just didn't want to call you out or anything.

Like I said, I screwed up with the Laconia Sword. After I unsealed the chest, I held onto the sword hoping for a quick wing break, but the sword expired as soon as the chest broke, and sword takes a couple seconds to respawn. That's why the wing was still sealed as he flew away (better braver DPS could have helped with this of course). Oh well, live and learn.

[SteveCZ]

Like I said, I screwed up with the Laconia Sword. After I unsealed the chest, I held onto the sword hoping for a quick wing break, but the sword expired as soon as the chest broke, and sword takes a couple seconds to respawn. That's why the wing was still sealed as he flew away (better braver DPS could have helped with this of course). Oh well, live and learn.

If you're doing this in pug, remove the blue sword and wait until the dragon side-stepped at least 2 - 3 times. Never hold the sword after breaking the chest in pug, unless you have a dedicated party with precise timing where you need to hold it. Cause not only you lose DPS on your side (... unless you're weaker than the blue sword itself which is omg), you'll lose the sword by the time the chest breaks, as you've experienced.

[ZER0 DX]

I should probably just play Te/Hu.

I will probably need to pug this to continue to participate. I tend to be a lone wolf with few people active on my friends list, so I can't really stack a party that way. I could't get a party together from my team, since the team activity seemed to be really slow this weekend (someone blamed the release of Monster Hunter World, but I am not so sure). My team is new-player friendly and genuinely casual (unlike the so-called "hardcore-casual" team we seem to have plenty of, LUL), so frankly we don't tend to have the best players anyway.

I am considering not running this, but I probably will anyways, knowing how I am. But this EQ has been of the most frustrating experiences I have had with this game.

Literally in the same boat and switching to play Te / Hu for the rematch was how I solved every problem I was having with it. Sacrificing my own DPS to keep everyone topped off on buffs and heals has resulted in 0 death pug runs so far. Probably just lucky but it has made a huge difference.

[Loveless62]

I am thinking that I need to avoid B11 pugs. I am worried that B11 has become the "Carry Me" block that it used to be before multi-block matching was implemented. That is, B11 was so crowded with weaker players looking to get carried that there were very few stronger players there to actually perform the carrying. Back then, it seemed like B11 would yield weaker performing MPAs, yielding fewer runs for seasonal EQs for example.


If you're doing this in pug, remove the blue sword and wait until the dragon side-stepped at least 2 - 3 times. Never hold the sword after breaking the chest in pug, unless you have a dedicated party with precise timing where you need to hold it. Cause not only you lose DPS on your side (... unless you're weaker than the blue sword itself which is omg), you'll lose the sword by the time the chest breaks, as you've experienced.
This is pretty much how I handled the blue sword after my first run.


Literally in the same boat and switching to play Te / Hu for the rematch was how I solved every problem I was having with it. Sacrificing my own DPS to keep everyone topped off on buffs and heals has resulted in 0 death pug runs so far. Probably just lucky but it has made a huge difference.
I just need to change one of my Zeinesis Wands to Ice and give it some affixing love. Then I am willing to try this. I am a little worried that I will sometimes end up in a 4xTe run though.


My team is new-player friendly and genuinely casual (unlike the so-called "hardcore-casual" team we seem to have plenty of, LUL), so frankly we don't tend to have the best players anyway.
Now that I have thrown my team under the bus, I need to clarify and say that our team actually some very solid players. We are new-player friendly and don't have any real entrance requirements though, so some of our players are naturally going to be weaker. When we manage to have enough players online, 12-man MPAs we form aren't the strongest. But I am fine with this for most content.

[SteveCZ]

I am thinking that I need to avoid B11 pugs. I am worried that B11 has become the "Carry Me" block that it used to be before multi-block matching was implemented. That is, B11 was so crowded with weaker players looking to get carried that there were very few stronger players there to actually perform the carrying. Back then, it seemed like B11 would yield weaker performing MPAs, yielding fewer runs for seasonal EQs for example.


The funny thing is, I might agree that this might be a good idea for you. I never failed the black dragon eq until I got the premium and try B11 after a few months not ever being there cause it's always crowded. But I regretted it after I got 2 failed runs; 1 run 2 people died in total of 3 times, messed along with a Player who doesn't know how to use the blue sword but keep taking it when it spawns (he didn't use it to break the blue seals, and yes this is "expert"), the other run there was a fighter who died 3 times in a row. Of each of that failed run I move to other block and retry it when I met the same person who kept dying from the previous quest, and things are going normally.

So far I get the ranks between 30 - 58, unless I'm late when joining in (or cause people being so reluctant to activate the portal, like me :lol:). I ended up going to the block I used to be as a freemium user. At most I'd go to B12 which is quite nice.

[reaper527]

I just need to change one of my Zeinesis Wands to Ice and give it some affixing love. Then I am willing to try this. I am a little worried that I will sometimes end up in a 4xTe run though.


i wouldn't worry too much about that. i've had 1 run with a te at all in the last week, and almost every run has been 3 heroes if not 4. (granted, i'm a hero too. not shitting on them, just saying there's no diversity right now).

[Zulastar]

i wouldn't worry too much about that. i've had 1 run with a te at all in the last week, and almost every run has been 3 heroes if not 4. (granted, i'm a hero too. not shitting on them, just saying there's no diversity right now).

There's a 2 types of Heroes: 1st is a proper Heroes who maintain combos and maximise their dps as they could. 2nd just hold Rising slash button or just spam their BNS without doing antything else. Their dps really sucks.

And if there's 3 Heroes of 2nd type besides you - you'd better just leave 'cause it will take forever to complete EQ with them and time escalation leads to an increased chance of sudden deaths = EQ's failure.

[TakemiShinnosuke]

I have been trying expert macthing for the black dragon and have been losing for a bit -_-...
today I decided to turn it off and lo and behold
I won
so much for the "EXPERT CLASS"

Well I got my title and SS.. so yeah...

so whats next after this ??

[GHNeko]

I have been trying expert macthing for the black dragon and have been losing for a bit -_-...
today I decided to turn it off and lo and behold
I won
so much for the "EXPERT CLASS"

Well I got my title and SS.. so yeah...

so whats next after this ??

Expert does nothing but filter out those who cant even +35 a 13* weapon.

Considering the SPCO requirement is gone, there are a larger pool of people who aren't properly geared and skill tree'd in expert. So don't expect a significantly higher pool of people in expert mode. :wacko:

[Anduril]

Expert does nothing but filter out those who cant even +35 a 13* weapon.

Considering the SPCO requirement is gone, there are a larger pool of people who aren't properly geared and skill tree'd in expert. So don't expect a significantly higher pool of people in expert mode. :wacko:
The SPCOs were never a requirement for Expert, they were just there for unlocking lv80 (even if they were, the LQ would make completing them a trivial thing). If anything, its that the LQ has let a bunch more people level up quickly to unlock Hero, so they end up breezing through Heaven and Hell; plus you can buy a full Ray Unit set from Xie.

[Masu]

Technically not Dragon EQ but still. Someone talked about b11 pug quality decreasing some times ago on this same thread...Technically not Dragon EQ but still
[SPOILER-BOX] Granted it was a very laggy run
https://i.imgur.com/sPc2NjW.jpg
[/SPOILER-BOX]

Am far to be a top notch player and all but it's been ages I've been in this situation ... switched to multy block after this run an oh surprise it was way better :-?

[Madevil]

talking about the pugs in ch11, saw some asshole brought these to the EQ (expert room)

[SPOILER-BOX]
https://i.imgur.com/A5uenG1.jpg

this is from HU/BR
https://i.imgur.com/oZREjWF.jpg
[/SPOILER-BOX]

[GHNeko]

he was probably leveling hu sub for brhu lol

[Saffran]

haraihôshun is the one with imbedded Zanverse, right? It's better than nothing.
I can't fathom why the other weapon. This isn't a returning player, they wouldn't have Weila Boards...

[Silent_Flower]

Just finished a run that is 9:16~ for rank 2. I took a screenshot but... I had turned off hud for screenshot... So ranking info is not there... I was so excited until I saw the screenshot-.- I will never have such a smooth run again. :-(

41497 Here is the proof-less pic if anyone wants to laugh at me for failing to turn hud on for ranking...

Thou I probably the odd one out because the other 3 clearly knew what they are doing as a team of Te, Gu and Hr and I just multi-match and carry my weight (I hope).

The only thing I remember I should do if I didn't get the sword if charge PA while the sword person is charging. Thou the person who usually get the sword is me because I main using talis, so I tend to be the closest to the sword when it spawns while everyone is stays at close range.

I should vid a run and get feedback because I have no idea if I doing okay or I just trash.

[Asellus]

If you have the time to stand there and take a screenshot instead of whaling on the damned dragon, I will suspect you to be the total dead weight.

Right, because the difference between a fast run and shit run is 2 seconds. Get smart.

I've been playing dragon on three ships, three regular runs and two rematches. I see a lot of parties, I play in a lot of parties and each time there's a hunter or techer or a combination of both we get shit time.

People want to show up to Atrum with stamina overkill probably because they suck and don't want to be the fail man so instead we (the rest of the party affixed for high dps) have to suffer through 20min fucking runs.

We should have a block where only people with at least a minimum of 4k or higher offense can enter. Segregate the noobs, they can all just play and fail amongst themselves just fine, I don't need to be dragged into their party and have my time wasted. No thank you.

[Flaoc]

We should have a block where only people with at least a minimum of 4k or higher offense can enter. Segregate the noobs, they can all just play and fail amongst themselves just fine, I don't need to be dragged into their party and have my time wasted. No thank you.

well shit.... guess i cant get into specialsnowflakeland FeelsGunMan

[SPOILER-BOX]
https://i.imgur.com/6acULcn.png

https://i.imgur.com/W9NOYIz.png

https://i.imgur.com/fdNbgpL.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

ps.. affixes dont prove anything about a players skill

[Altiea]

We should have a block where only people with at least a minimum of 4k or higher offense can enter. Segregate the noobs, they can all just play and fail amongst themselves just fine, I don't need to be dragged into their party and have my time wasted. No thank you.

Didn't you say this exact same thing when Deus Rematch came out? And then a bunch of people got on your case about how bad of an idea it was?

[Electrochemist]

well shit.... guess i cant get into specialsnowflakeland FeelsGunMan

[SPOILER-BOX]
https://i.imgur.com/6acULcn.png

https://i.imgur.com/W9NOYIz.png

https://i.imgur.com/fdNbgpL.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

ps.. affixes dont prove anything about a players skill

That is one tasty affix!

Also I've seen people with amazing affixes but just don't know how to max DPS with it, or they completely don't know their class well enough.
~ I could easily affix a great unit set and wep for gunner but I wouldn't have the foggiest idea how to use it because I've never played gunner.

There are also the people (you know the ones) that put in minimal effort which I hate but if I'm going to party with randoms, quite frankly that's my own fault.

Find a dedicated team dude.

[Zephyrion]

Right, because the difference between a fast run and shit run is 2 seconds. Get smart.

I've been playing dragon on three ships, three regular runs and two rematches. I see a lot of parties, I play in a lot of parties and each time there's a hunter or techer or a combination of both we get shit time.

People want to show up to Atrum with stamina overkill probably because they suck and don't want to be the fail man so instead we (the rest of the party affixed for high dps) have to suffer through 20min fucking runs.

We should have a block where only people with at least a minimum of 4k or higher offense can enter. Segregate the noobs, they can all just play and fail amongst themselves just fine, I don't need to be dragged into their party and have my time wasted. No thank you.

About Hunter...again just a case of you getting bad Hunters, the Hunters I got all put at least decent work. HU is not bad, it's just that player were probably levelling subs or not being familiar with the class

Techer's job is to alleviate any annoyance and let you go as ham as you want on Dragon, and again, a good TE, even if it doesn't pull insane numbers (although zanverse and whacks alone should bring at least some ok contribution) does make the fight go a lot better. Super treatment is great for more sustained offense, Shifta Advance + Strike is a solid enabler, and Deband Cut + Toughness lets you be more reckless in the way you approach dragon, since it can avoid lots of potentially bad resets and/or lets you survive some bad combos. A good TE will also be good at Laconium duty, which can also potentially speed up the fight. Guess what all my fastest times and rank 1 dragons included a TE, because if all the three other players pull their weight, TE does wonders.

And yeah Expert Topic has been discussed and everybody pretty much agrees that affix doesn't mean jack shit. I've seen very good contributions from players with outdated gear, while some of the people with insane affixes on unit and weapon just have mediocre or average results. Once you got a grinded max ele *13 and a decent set of units, It's player qualities and/or class proficiency that will dictate the outcome more than anything. If SEGA were to revise Expert requirements, I hope it would be along the lines of clearing some of the hard content in the game instead. I mean I'd rather have a guy that can sub 10 solo PD with a Nox, than a Hero with Atra Sword holding Rising Slash and tanking everything till death

[final_attack]

Oh btw, how hard is the dragon's attack? Like .... how many damage increase compared to red one? Especially that fire breath. 600 -> 800, maybe? Or is it more? o.O

I personally haven't tried one .... still gonna wait until I affixed Izane Arm (gonna see how Weila Arm perform and if I managed to get one should it's good) before I try Dragon's rematch.

My internet connection also gonna be bad for next 2 weeks for maintenance, so, better not playing any online game atm :/

[Dark Mits]

Oh btw, how hard is the dragon's attack? Like .... how many damage increase compared to red one? Especially that fire breath. 600 -> 800, maybe? Or is it more? o.OAround 800 damage. That's with ~2100 in all defenses, ~14% resist in all elements and ~9% resist in striking/ranged/tech damage, TE's Deband Cut, and also having both 5% damage reduction rings equipped. So I guess the average "I only go for attack" player receives around 1200-OHKO from it.

[milranduil]

each time there's a hunter or techer or a combination of both we get shit time.

that may be your observation, but it never means that all hu or te are bad, in general or with dragon specifically. i've seen some disgusting times pulled off with hunter sword, so the damage is definitely there whether or not you believe it is.

[Aexorcet]

Oh btw, how hard is the dragon's attack? Like .... how many damage increase compared to red one? Especially that fire breath. 600 -> 800, maybe? Or is it more? o.O

I personally haven't tried one .... still gonna wait until I affixed Izane Arm (gonna see how Weila Arm perform and if I managed to get one should it's good) before I try Dragon's rematch.

My internet connection also gonna be bad for next 2 weeks for maintenance, so, better not playing any online game atm :/

I had a bit of scary experience with the fireball on my first run. I have 1044 HP as Fo/Te. I got hit and took about 1000 damage and was inflicted with burn. I missed the just reversal and I think I had 5 HP by the time I managed to Anti. I've been one shot some other times. PPC in instant one shot.

The damage in this particular fight makes keeping deband up worth it, at least for me. It also makes Deband Cut seem like a nice investment.

[final_attack]

Around 800 damage. That's with ~2100 in all defenses, ~14% resist in all elements and ~9% resist in striking/ranged/tech damage, TE's Deband Cut, and also having both 5% damage reduction rings equipped. So I guess the average "I only go for attack" player receives around 1200-OHKO from it.

Ah, I see .... I guess I'll refrain from doing it even after my internet's fixed.
Only using 30 HP ea from unit affixes + weapon (Alter) ever since day 1 Arena implementation. And my 2 set of left-over fodder from about 1 year ago only have Alter available :/

If I changed QliphArm -> IzaneArm (using same affix), I'd still have a tiny bit under 1200 (1190~ish as Hr 1200~ish as GuHu, I think) ..... with 11% S/R/T, 10% Fire, 10% HrFlashGuard. I don't think I'll have the slot for rings in unit either (since Hr's equipment is shared with Gu). Oh well ..... gonna skip it I guess :/

Thanks!

Oh right, does Dragon's fire breath got cut by FlashTechGuard? I do have spare Hu tree available, 1 with maxed FlashGuard (both) ..... maybe I can use 1 tree to get 1 FlashGuard + 1 FlashTechGuard.


I had a bit of scary experience with the fireball on my first run. I have 1044 HP as Fo/Te. I got hit and took about 1000 damage and was inflicted with burn. I missed the just reversal and I think I had 5 HP by the time I managed to Anti. I've been one shot some other times. PPC in instant one shot.

The damage in this particular fight makes keeping deband up worth it, at least for me. It also makes Deband Cut seem like a nice investment.

Ah, I guess I'll have the same case. I think I do have around that much HP as Hr .... a tiny bit more as GuHu.

[TakemiShinnosuke]

but you guys are right

I went into a fight and lost today... all of us were hero'es

I was dogding alot... and what were the rest doing.. eh just holding rising slash -_-

[Crystal_Shard]

Curious question as a TE main. Is it best for the TE to take the Laconium Sword, or should we leave it for others to use and focus on healing and keeping up Zanverse, Shifta and Deband?

[Altiea]

Curious question as a TE main. Is it best for the TE to take the Laconium Sword, or should we leave it for others to use and focus on healing and keeping up Zanverse, Shifta and Deband?

I can't imagine Zanverse would do you much good except in stun phases. Shifta and Deband have 3 minute uptime anyway, which far outlasts Sword duration, so recasting it constantly doesn't seem to be a necessity.

[Masu]

Shifta and Deband have 3 minute uptime anyway, which far outlasts Sword duration, so recasting it constantly doesn't seem to be a necessity.
The voice of reason have spoken. Dear Te I love you all but casting shifta deband constantly (every 5 seconds!) while action is already a shitstorm of FX, camera cliping etc isn't helping ;-)

[Zulastar]

but you guys are right

I went into a fight and lost today... all of us were hero'es

I was dogding alot... and what were the rest doing.. eh just holding rising slash -_-

Had same situation right now. 2 Rising slash holders and a BNS spammer. Fight took 20 mins. Thanks God with no deaths.
And you can't tell from a first glance who they are. Gear and affixes were fine but their actions...

At the last minutes Dragons attacks got much fiercier, I've run out of mates and dodges didn't work at all. I hate when fight go past 12 minutes really. If it do I know someone of other 3 really sux.

[Masu]

but you guys are right

I went into a fight and lost today... all of us were hero'es

I was dogding alot... and what were the rest doing.. eh just holding rising slash -_-

I bet those who play this way are people which still use 2 button setup...which is sad considering Hr is optimized to be played with 3 buttons and no brain efforts to adapt contrarily to some old class (stares at Gu) :/

[TakemiShinnosuke]

Had same situation right now. 2 Rising slash holders and a BNS spammer. Fight took 20 mins. Thanks God with no deaths.
And you can't tell from a first glance who they are. Gear and affixes were fine but their actions...

At the last minutes Dragons attacks got much fiercier, I've run out of mates and dodges didn't work at all. I hate when fight go past 12 minutes really. If it do I know someone of other 3 really sux.

How do you tell who sucks lol ?? and btw some people like this kind of challenge some do not hehe

There was a category for this type of challenge .. what do you call it again ??

[Zulastar]

How do you tell who sucks lol ??
Just look at rotation and numbers that it produces. And you can easily tell about body just hold Rising slash or do full RS->RS->N3->WA or some other dps rotation.

[TakemiShinnosuke]

Thats from Zulastar..

--->>How do you tell who sucks lol ??

-->> Anyone else ??

[Dark Mits]

If you pay too much attention on other players instead of your own and the boss in order to see who sucks, then you suck.

/rant off

[Moffen]

Another round of applause for the people complaining that their rematch or main matches are taking too long because "other players are bad"
>20mins because the other players were bad

No,you're bad. Solo dragon runs are about 20mins less now and if you cant carry the hell out of that even with minor dps coming off anyone else in the group then you're part of the problem.

[Flaoc]

as much as id wanna agree.. dragons ai is much easier to handle when solo due to how he reacts to aggro but otherwise yes.. part of the problem

[Zulastar]

If you pay too much attention on other players instead of your own and the boss in order to see who sucks, then you suck.

/rant off

I can do it 'cause I squeeze out maximum of my gear, class, dps rotations and playstyle skill. I just can't do more. I need new units with new level of affixing (which costs more than 300mils per unit) for performance increase.


No,you're bad. Solo dragon runs are about 20mins less now and if you cant carry the hell out of that even with minor dps coming off anyone else in the group then you're part of the problem.
No I'm surprisely not. I posted screenshot of 5th place up there. I don't have a parser right now but last DPS check on 12ppl Deus was 26k (top was 30k and his gear just in another league). And I can counter much. Well my units are slightly outdated and I don't have 4k atk either (3500 only and PP leak) but I know how to play in comparsion of these 4k Rising slash holders.
And personally you can solo Atrum? If you not -> just shut up.

[Flaoc]

atrums easier than erythron dragon so if he can solo erythron he can solo atrum

[TehCubey]

How to tell if someone is bad?

Just use a parse. If someone's doing ~4k dps they're a leech (unless it's TE). Doesn't matter if they don't die - an empty place in the party doesn't die either and contributes about as much to the damage done, too.

[Zulastar]

Just use a parse.
Well seems I'm forced to do so, although I'm afraid of get ban for it.


an empty place in the party doesn't die either and contributes about as much to the damage done, too.
That reminds me a run when some body from Night Arks made a fail with Laconium sword, then just left after shooting phase. We're able to finish in 15 mins with only 3 ppl - 2 heroes and sumonner.

[cheeto]

Well seems I'm forced to do so, although I'm afraid of get ban for it.


That reminds me a run when some body from Night Arks made a fail with Laconium sword, then just left after shooting phase. We're able to finish in 15 mins with only 3 ppl - 2 heroes and sumonner.

Why does it have to be someone from Night Arks making it sound like the team was at fault for 1 individual you came across from it? Guilty by association!? Maybe they disconnected with a 630 and you just assume they ditched you and bring up the team name too?

[Zulastar]

Why does it have to be someone from Night Arks making it sound like the team was at fault for 1 individual you came across from it? Guilty by association!? Maybe they disconnected with a 630 and you just assume they ditched you and bring up the team name too?
No he really ditched, I saw him just running around then he left without any excuses. And guild name only single thing I remember about that guy (or girl i dunno) 'cause it's well known. I looked forward to a quick run when I inspect him, but it was disappointment in the end.

[Moffen]

And personally you can solo Atrum? If you not -> just shut up.

I just gave it a shot,my first time soloiing this boss and i timed out as he had a slither of health left (Head was down),also completely forgot to use my dark blast.
However i WILL complete this solo just to prove a damn point.

[Asellus]

Pulled this little bit from the blog...

"Nerfing Dragon Atrum. While some may have requested it, they have no plans to nerf Dragon Atrum at this time."

..and that pretty much sums up the pso2 community: Fucking. Noobs, all the stamina in the game couldn't save them.

[Zulastar]

I just gave it a shot,my first time soloiing this boss and i timed out as he had a slither of health left (Head was down),also completely forgot to use my dark blast.
However i WILL complete this solo just to prove a damn point.
I wish I have Weila with 200+ atk on it. BUT THIS SHIT DOESN'T DROP AFTER 20 HOURS OF FARMING AT CAMPAGNS!
I can do nothing with my current gear.

[Moffen]

I wish I have Weila with 200+ atk on it. BUT THIS SHIT DOESN'T DROP AFTER 20 HOURS OF FARMING AT CAMPAGNS!
I can do nothing with my current gear.

At least you can opt in for a very offensive Red Shine in its place,otherwise theres not much to replace it with.
I'm still stuck with a 130atk 15pp blue shine and a 130atk 30hp 8pp RINA arm I threw together when i first got the thing. The most updated unit I have is a 130atk 120hp 4pp Izane leg.
I am planning a 165 atk affix for both weila rear and leg but as much as it'd be easier to beat the dragon with those,i'd like to do it with my current loadout just to get my point across e-e

Honestly though,as solo the fight was much easier in general,i just didnt have the DPS to finish him off.
Its a lot less of a pain in the ass when he doesnt have agro from someone spamming hero shout behind him just for him to spin his head away.

We come to disagreements in threads kinda often i think but i genuinely hope you get lucky and at least get a weila arm from the next LQ. I had a friend farm Weila boards since release at every opportunity it popped up and they only got ONE at the very last day of the lilipa UQ campaign.

[Zulastar]

At least you can opt in for a very offensive Red Shine in its place,otherwise theres not much to replace it with.
I'm still stuck with a 130atk 15pp blue shine and a 130atk 30hp 8pp RINA arm I threw together when i first got the thing. The most updated unit I have is a 130atk 120hp 4pp Izane leg.
I have full set of Union with 90atk of each kind, 85HP, 4PP and All res 3 - it's REALLY outdated.
10-12k/ps is my maximum on Atrum.

Just for interest I watched some videos at youtube of soloing Atrum and there's no single one showed his stats to public...

[Moffen]

I have full set of Union with 90atk of each kind, 85HP, 4PP and All res 3 - it's REALLY outdated.
10-12k/ps is my maximum on Atrum.

Just for interest I watched some videos at youtube of soloing Atrum and there's no single one showed his stats to public...

Ares LUPG(TMG) and a r (GS User) have shown their stats a few times i think,they both soloed atrum and Ares does it as if its is morning meal.
Usually about 4k attack i think on tmgs,100 from stir fry,team boost,160 atk units and 14* weapon,though not sure if that accounts for the shifta from the shifta boots,didnt check.

Edit: Ares has been clearing Atrum in 15mins consistently now,and given that its a 30min raid and most 4man pugs are 11min--13min tops (Randoms),kinda shows that it is doable with lesser gear
I really need to pick up the pace aha

[Ahri]

Almost in first place :(

http://img.fenixzone.net/i/sIEu3Yx.jpeg

Note, I only play Su/Fi

[Zulastar]

I brought you some of statistics with numbers of 4 last Atrum (only without mobs) runs which I attended.
https://i.imgur.com/CXgjYzP.jpg
1st run was a typical Multiblock. Pretty average one.

2nd run we were at 3 Heroes and good geared katana Braver. First of Heroes was good geared and with a second one we were equal. 'Cause I failed 1st Hero time there it affected final numbers.

3rd run we were at 4 Heroes. 1 good geared, 1 average and 2 poor ones, one of which 80% of combat time used Laconium sword.

4rd run is really noticeable. 5th place. 3 Heroes and a Techer. Hero and Techer were at premade and had a perfect gear with Weila and 200 atk per unit. Techer gave all himself into his 9.1k. And it could be a higher place but we had a 4th Hero who was a typical Rising slash holding slacker...

Well about that good geared Hero from last run - I can believe about guys like him can easy solo Atrum. Numbers tell it all...

[millefeuille]

It was fun, but somewhat stressful. Died during the last phase on my first attempt because the game hates me. :-(

Finally figured out where best to shoot from after my 3rd attempt with BBow; it's still a hassle to re-position every time he spins, and I die a little inside when I miss the head or hit the wrong leg with Final Nemesis.

[HardBoiledPapa]

Finally got my very 1st B rank on this rematch and I'm really salty about it even though it's one of my best performance in this rematch hahahha. 1 dced during the cannon phase but continued anyway so the fight took longer than expected it's just that it only took a single mistake and a dragon that wants you dead to kill you twice(1 w/ hero will) in less than a minute.

[Zulastar]

Something happend with Atrum. He just don't fly. And if on shooting phase wings can be broken to push script forward then later he stuck like this:
https://i.imgur.com/kESQvca.jpg
Tried to start quest twice and both tries ended with this...SEGA seems screwed up again.

[wahahaha]

Something happend with Atrum. He just don't fly. And if on shooting phase wings can be broken to push script forward then later he stuck like this:
https://i.imgur.com/kESQvca.jpg
Tried to start quest twice and both tries ended with this...SEGA seems screwed up again.
Were you 3 manning the quest? Otherwise host could be lagging terrible.

[Zulastar]

Were you 3 manning the quest? Otherwise host could be lagging terrible.
4 ppl. Both runs with different hosts. And there were no lags, just broken Atrum flying script.